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Sticky:[New structures] Assembly array and research labs

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CCP Ytterbium C C P C C P Alliance 3751	Posted - 2015.03.23 11:24:00 - [1] - Quote Hello people, This thread is the place to discuss the assembly array and research laboratory concepts as announced during Fanfest and in the structure blog. They respectively focus on manufacturing and science as a whole. For more details, please refer to the the "Back into the structure" blog.

elitatwo Eve Minions Poopstain Removal Team 596	Posted - 2015.03.23 11:45:33 - [2] - Quote Would this mean the different assembly arrays would be replaced by this one? Do you plan on making this like one big space-bakery where we can make ammo, drones, modules, tech2 modules, invent and copy blueprints and research tech3 subsystem blueprints? Hell yeah! signature
Yongtau Naskingar Yongtau Naskingar Corporation 90	Posted - 2015.03.23 11:54:45 - [3] - Quote elitatwo wrote: Do you plan on making this like one big space-bakery where we can make ammo, drones, modules, tech2 modules, invent and copy blueprints and research tech3 subsystem blueprints? .. did you even read the dev blog? Research is clearly separate. Also, each manufacturing category requires a separate module, so you can only manufacture products from up to 5-ish different categories. Will there be a size limit on what you can produce based on the size of the structure? i.e. capitals only in the XL version?
xttz GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 534	Posted - 2015.03.23 12:06:49 - [4] - Quote How do you envisage production of supercapital ships working with structures that have docking capability?
Corraidhin Farsaidh Farsaidh's Freeborn 1013	Posted - 2015.03.23 12:20:41 - [5] - Quote Also will there be sec level limits on any of the assembly arrays?
Lloyd Roses 923	Posted - 2015.03.23 12:33:00 - [6] - Quote I couldn't find the hint but: Are those structures moveable? Can they be sent to a different location, can they be sent to other systems, can they be scooped and redeployed or would we have to rerig them? Also, how long is refitting going to take? How's rerigging going to work? If it's just a minute thing to switch from one production type to a completely other, that'd be a different case compared to a 2hr reconfiguration period. That just from the little guy's view who might've been interested in just building frigs, BS, drones, ammo, fuel blocks and nanite paste/structures with as few structures to sustain as possible. I GÖÑ Sleipnir
Spugg Galdon Nisroc Angels 631	Posted - 2015.03.23 12:35:48 - [7] - Quote Datacore spawning is the only thing I don't really like. Although you're doing something to remove the invulnerable passive generation of datacores, making them spawn and be scoopable isn't a way to "Farm" or "Harvest" datacores. It doesn't even feel like gameplay. I've been thinking for a long while that datacores should be "mined". The way to do this would be to fly to a spatial anomaly or some kind of object in space and activate a type of (Hi Slot) analyser module on it. You would then harvest datacores (like mining gas or ore) by actually doing an activity in space. An activity that can be interdicted and disrupted. The funny thing is that some of these spatial anomalies already exist in game. Some systems have strange spatial anomalies that cause damage when you get too close. We also have other things that could be used for datacore mining. For example: Every system in EvE has a star. These stars are all different colours. So, why shouldn't each colour of star allow for different Analysis/Research to be carried out to gather datacores (Plasma Physics and nuclear physics are examples from a star). Wormholes could produce graviton physics datacores when mined. (imagine people gathering around a WH to mine it!) There are so many possibilities all of which can be super sci-fi. There could also be a new range of ships with the specific role of gathering datacores.
Querns GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 1489	Posted - 2015.03.23 12:36:39 - [8] - Quote Would it be possible to start jobs inside the new structures, then pack up the entire structure, move it, then redeploy and finish the jobs? This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
fluffy jo Universal Exports 8	Posted - 2015.03.23 12:43:38 - [9] - Quote Love the new structure idea. Coming from a POS industry point of view. I am not looking forward to having wasted 3-4 yearsGÇÖ worth of research on the existing POS gun turrets, missiles, ecm , shield hardeners and warp / web modules and redoing it all with any new structure modules. Is it possible for CCP to think about reusing the current POS gun turrets, missiles, ecm , shield hardeners and warp / web modules as the new modules to be used in the new Structure fitting process. The material can be changed as needed. This will save refunding all the blueprints, and all the existing modules, for all the existing POS guns / missiles etc. This will also save pilots from having to buy all the new blueprints for the new structure modules and spending time researching them. I accept the fact that the existing POS tower blueprint and modules will be removed and replaced with all new structure, but to minimise the transition it would be nice to reuse as many existing POS modules as possible. Cheers
elitatwo Eve Minions Poopstain Removal Team 596	Posted - 2015.03.23 12:44:35 - [10] - Quote Spugg Galdon wrote: ...I've been thinking for a long while that datacores should be "mined". The way to do this would be to fly to a spatial anomaly or some kind of object in space and activate a type of (Hi Slot) analyser module on it. You would then harvest datacores (like mining gas or ore) by actually doing an activity in space. An activity that can be interdicted and disrupted... Well maybe but then you would bring all tech2 gear production to an artificial hold and you know you want tech2 stuff. Please consider that datacores not only come from agents anymore but drop from data or relic sites. signature

Ben Ishikela 24	Posted - 2015.03.23 12:45:36 - [11] - Quote Oh Good. Food for Thinking I will write things later for sure. The following are some Questions that i had, after i watched the stream. Q = Will i, as an owner, be able to adjust whether my structure can to be found in space easily or not? (like stations and beacons) (idea: set private / friends only / public broadcasting though system) (addition: make everything optional and look later if some options provide bad choices (like clones) and remove then if need be) Mooring seems odd in eve to me. But is kind of nessary as a replacement to removal of POS. It also fits into what i image of scifi to be. Q = Will mooring be a fittable station service? (some wont need it) more Q&I to come. Add new modules or ships that can use tactics and strategies to beat the current meta or use totaly different gameplay to do so! yay :)
Ulrik Elristan EVE University Ivy League 0	Posted - 2015.03.23 13:00:14 - [12] - Quote fluffy jo wrote: Love the new structure idea. Coming from a POS industry point of view. (wall of whine) Are you gonna psot this on EACH AND EVERY POST ? Seriously...
Gilbaron Free-Space-Ranger Nulli Secunda 1759	Posted - 2015.03.23 13:05:24 - [13] - Quote Assembly arrays: the current ME bonus is not strong enough and the TE bonus is probably a bit too strong, but not profit wise, it just makes it too easy to produce even more stuff, especially with the latest invention changes. we need a rank change, especially for t2 modules before giving out any more TE boni Research Laboratories: research speed bonus is nice. I still wonder why they don't have a material reduction for invention jobs. I also don't Data Core Spawning: ELI5 please Build your empire ! Rent Space in Feythabolis and Omist Contact me for details :)
Spugg Galdon Nisroc Angels 633	Posted - 2015.03.23 13:14:45 - [14] - Quote elitatwo wrote: Spugg Galdon wrote: ...I've been thinking for a long while that datacores should be "mined". The way to do this would be to fly to a spatial anomaly or some kind of object in space and activate a type of (Hi Slot) analyser module on it. You would then harvest datacores (like mining gas or ore) by actually doing an activity in space. An activity that can be interdicted and disrupted... Well maybe but then you would bring all tech2 gear production to an artificial hold and you know you want tech2 stuff. Please consider that datacores not only come from agents anymore but drop from data or relic sites. Those datacores you're taling about are special snowflake datacores that would still always drop from relic and data sites. Also, how would it bring anything to an artificial halt? Especially when the tools to get all the datacores you need would be available and you would be able to specifically target the cores you needed.
Corraidhin Farsaidh Farsaidh's Freeborn 1014	Posted - 2015.03.23 13:29:02 - [15] - Quote Spugg Galdon wrote: elitatwo wrote: Spugg Galdon wrote: ...I've been thinking for a long while that datacores should be "mined". The way to do this would be to fly to a spatial anomaly or some kind of object in space and activate a type of (Hi Slot) analyser module on it. You would then harvest datacores (like mining gas or ore) by actually doing an activity in space. An activity that can be interdicted and disrupted... Well maybe but then you would bring all tech2 gear production to an artificial hold and you know you want tech2 stuff. Please consider that datacores not only come from agents anymore but drop from data or relic sites. Those datacores you're taling about are special snowflake datacores that would still always drop from relic and data sites. Also, how would it bring anything to an artificial halt? Especially when the tools to get all the datacores you need would be available and you would be able to specifically target the cores you needed. Thus rendering research agents uttelry useless unless the number of datacores they provide is buffed accordingly, which would of course then crash the market!
elitatwo Eve Minions Poopstain Removal Team 596	Posted - 2015.03.23 13:37:41 - [16] - Quote Spugg Galdon wrote: ...Also, how would it bring anything to an artificial halt? Especially when the tools to get all the datacores you need would be available and you would be able to specifically target the cores you needed. No silly, if we would follow your idea of 'mining datacores' it would. signature
Querns GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 1493	Posted - 2015.03.23 13:44:46 - [17] - Quote Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote: Thus rendering research agents uttelry useless unless the number of datacores they provide is buffed accordingly, which would of course then crash the market! Rendering research agents useless is probably the goal, not a side effect. This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
ChromeStriker Out of Focus Odin's Call 859	Posted - 2015.03.23 13:48:37 - [18] - Quote What im really interested in is how close we can put these different structures together....? Can we put smaller structures closer together and make a space community thing? Can we put smaller structures close to large structures...? I would like to be able to make a hub of activity in a system... obviously without breaking things so that it gives an unfair advantage... i just dont want to be warping around a system doing stuff i can now do simply all in one place... and separating people out that are now all living together... No Worries
Spugg Galdon Nisroc Angels 633	Posted - 2015.03.23 13:50:39 - [19] - Quote Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote: Thus rendering research agents uttelry useless unless the number of datacores they provide is buffed accordingly, which would of course then crash the market! From what I read in the blog, they are planning to remove research agents. So datacores would be created from research structures. elitatwo wrote: Spugg Galdon wrote: ...Also, how would it bring anything to an artificial halt? Especially when the tools to get all the datacores you need would be available and you would be able to specifically target the cores you needed. No silly, if we would follow your idea of 'mining datacores' it would. This doesn't make any sense. Say that instead of there being asteroid belts there were "Mining Agents" who would generate ore for you completely invulnerably from outside influence (this is how most datacores are produced now) and then we removed that system and created asteroid belts where people actively mined the ores instead in specialized ships, would that produce a complete halt to the supply of minerals or would it just produce some new gameplay where people actually went out and acquired the ores in said special ships? Of course it wouldn't stop the supply of datacores. It would simply change how they were acquired requiring active gameplay instead of passive. Special snowflake datacores would still be acquired through data/relic sites (those would be [Faction] Starship Engineering and Subsytem cores etc)
Droidyk Maniacal Miners INC 76	Posted - 2015.03.23 13:52:04 - [20] - Quote Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote: [quote=Spugg Galdon][quote=elitatwo][quote=Spugg Galdon] Thus rendering research agents uttelry useless unless the number of datacores they provide is buffed accordingly, which would of course then crash the market! That is what they are trying to achieve, agents would be removed. It has been said before.

Samsara Toldya Academy of Contradictory Behaviour 265	Posted - 2015.03.23 14:20:18 - [21] - Quote As far as I understood during presentation: The new structures are something like a placeholder and their functionality will be defined by what you put into the service slots? So I place a Assembly Array and plug a Small Ship Assembly Array into a service slot to produce small ship hulls? Devblog: "One module will be required for the manufacturing of each category mentioned above." http://cdn1.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/67008/1/Structure_ISIS5-01.png Assembly Array Medium offers me 0 (zero) service slots. Fail to see why I would place a Medium Assembly Array to produce "nothing". Currently: A small control tower will enable me to online: ammunition array, small ship array, components array, equipment array - to continue what I am doing now I will have to use a large Assembly Array. I do haul compressed ore to the production POS and online the reprocessing array... as far as I understand I'd need a Reprocessing Service which will only get its full bonus when fitted to a Drilling Platform (with reprocessing rigs). And my research lab researching BPOs I don't need right now would require a Laboratory if I'm interested in getting boni. So instead of a small POS for small business I'll end up having a large Assembly Array + large Extraction Center + Large Research Center. To be honest: That sounds expensive. Hopefully it will keep new players out of manufacturing/research, less competition is appreciated. Details needed... Vulnerable to Entosis Link: Wardec needed (highsec)? "Prime-Time" (high/low/nullsec/wormhole)? Vulnerable to damage: Hitpoints? Reinforcement timers? Consume Fuel when in use: What kind of fuel? Fuelblocks are racial, those new arrays doesn't seem to be racial? Skills: A shitload of new skills needed depending on size of the structure? Weapons: No AI - goodbye holidays and weekends? Weapons: Starbase Defense Skill needed? +1 for new structures... gfx looks nice... for any discussion please provide details.
Miss Iniquitous Razing Demolitions 0	Posted - 2015.03.23 14:41:05 - [22] - Quote Hello, I manage 6 POS Moon Mining, running Reactions and manufacturing T2 Components all mixed together across the 6 POS in low sec. Will I still be able to run the same or similar operation on these structures after the change? It took me many months to acquire these moons and figure out the reaction system. Due to the above I am anxious about the transition period. I am certainly not looking forward to being told to unanchor all of this to replace with the new structures and mods only to continue my industry. Will CCP replace my anchored reaction chain structures with the new ones or will I as feared have to do this myself all over again? I definitely need more information on the transition in order to be sufficiently prepared for this. I am going to have a lot of EVE chores to do, I am not excited about this! I am excited about these changes though!! (Originally posted in Dev blog: Back Into Structure thread, I guess this thread is more appropriate)
Banko Mato Republic University Minmatar Republic 21	Posted - 2015.03.23 15:11:23 - [23] - Quote Whatever you do, please for the love of Bob, give us unified hangars of reasonable size that we can pull materials from and direct manufacturing output to across ALL industry/science lines of a structure. It is more then frustrating to deal with hopefully undersized storage space of current assembly arrays (especially ship arrays) and having to be physically present to move intermediate materials from one array to the next, even when updating jobs from a dozen jumps away.... To provide a more detailed picture: Imagine I produce small T2 ships (comp array, small ship array, advanced small ship array). Currently I build components and T1 ships in their respective arrays and then move their products over to the advanced small ship array for the final production phase. What I want is one central storage that I can subdivide as I see fit and then route the output of intermediate production steps to a location where the next step can easily access those materials. Being present is still required for getting initial stuff there or flying final products out, and that is fine and should be that way. But the hassle in between needs to go imho!
Terranid Meester Tactical Assault and Recon Unit 287	Posted - 2015.03.23 15:36:08 - [24] - Quote I prefer the idea of datacores being a buildable resource, in the vein of everything in eve that is immediately usable should be allowed to be built.
Dirk Morbho Mindstar Technology Get Off My Lawn 45	Posted - 2015.03.23 15:36:49 - [25] - Quote CCP Ytterbium wrote: Hello people, Assembly Arrays focus on manufacturing of the numerous EVE Online items, ships, modules, structures, components and etc... used in-game. Ok so let me see if I understand the basic concept. I beg of everyone to correct my assumptions where they are fubar. Srsly. Please do so! For example, Instead of anchoring a POS and a small ship assembly array to pump out a million rifters to throw at the enemy, I'll just anchor a small assembly platform? I'm going to also assume these new platform won't be defenseless. I'm also going to assume the larger platforms can have more defenses. And I'm going to assume you cannot put down a large platform and build small ships. (Is that how it works now and in the future?). Anyway... assuming all of that above, Can we have monster modular platforms' ? Say you anchor a 'monster platform' and you can add modules to it. You can put in 1 Large assembly + 1 small Or 1 Med + 1 Lab (however the math works out). This would allow people to get their smaller items made in a less risk averse settings. It'd cost them more of course, and they'd have more eggs in one basket, but there's still risk/reward ratio. idk. just something I'm spit-balling over my coffee this morning.
Corraidhin Farsaidh Farsaidh's Freeborn 1014	Posted - 2015.03.23 15:46:45 - [26] - Quote Droidyk wrote: Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote: [quote=Spugg Galdon][quote=elitatwo][quote=Spugg Galdon] Thus rendering research agents uttelry useless unless the number of datacores they provide is buffed accordingly, which would of course then crash the market! That is what they are trying to achieve, agents would be removed. It has been said before. I missed that bit :D It'll certainly achieve that goal then. I'll just have to adapt to get my datacores.
Guillome Renard Raising the Bar Of Sound Mind 95	Posted - 2015.03.23 16:15:16 - [27] - Quote I really like the directions of the new structures proposals. A lot. What I'm concerned about, in the dev-blog-as-written are two things: 1) The attack method for the medium-sized "Assembly Platform" is 'Damage'. Not damage+reinforce like other objects, but just 'damage' like the Mobile Tractor Unit. Given the investment-nature of this structure, I just don't see anything that can be killed by a small roaming gang while you're asleep and cooking a job seeing any use. I'd like to see more clarification on what 'damage' means, in this context, and what use cases you envision for this hardware. It looks like it's a sort of entry-level, small-scale - perhaps individual-scale - facility which I think there is definitely a demand for, but right now there's gangs going out looking for MTUs and ESS' to kill. ESS use is basically a joke anywhere I've ever seen it attempted, or the ESS is deployed as bait rather than for it's ostensible purpose: increasing ratting income. If I'm right about the intended using audience, consider the mobile depot as a better model than the MTU? 2) Research has no medium-sized, small/personal-scale structure. This is interesting since Research is a generally done by the few, and production done by the many. I would expect the demand for the smaller scale stuff is higher. Then again, I did most of my research in a wormhole, with mobile labs in a POS. Especially if BPOs are going to be in the line of fire, however, the meanings of 'entosis' vs 'entosis + site' are super important. Well researched BPOs are among the highest value items in the game, and putting them in jeopardy is going to be deeply chilling. (This may be why there is no small-scale research labs being planned, in fact). tl;dr - I really need to know more about the potential risk/reward balance here. http://fcftw.eve-kill.net/?a=pilot_detail&plt_id=662501
Hafwolf StarHunt Mordus Angels 4	Posted - 2015.03.23 16:17:06 - [28] - Quote Just a simple Idea on datacores. Maybe you can put a module or rig on your structure to entice certain faction data sites to be constructed in your system. The lower the sec status the more data sites are spawned. That way if you don't play or stay in system some one else has a chance to scan down the site. This also encourages more people to use the system. More research structures means more data sites spawning. It might mean that more people with center around low use systems in any sec status because they now have the opportunity to make isk.
ITTigerClawIK Galactic Rangers 471	Posted - 2015.03.23 16:21:31 - [29] - Quote so as far as 'ive heard when we want to enable a factory station to build certain items lets say ships we will have to put on the appropriate service module, when this happens are there going to be physical changes to the station for putting on this service module like a visable shipyard of appropriate size i.e a capital yard appearing on the side and the like since we can already see what someone is using various POS's for now just by looking at the structures in it and i think it would be a good idea to keep that sort of intel gathering open.
Lady Omanor The Mining and Manufacturing Corporation The Imperial Union 2	Posted - 2015.03.23 16:26:53 - [30] - Quote Could you please state, where the different sizes of Assembly Arrays and Research Laboratories can be deployed, because i think it is a little unclear in the dev blog. High-sec Low-sec Null-sec Wormhole space

Axloth Okiah Future Corps Sleeper Social Club 610	Posted - 2015.03.23 16:34:26 - [31] - Quote will different structures use different fuel? what will happen with stront? W-Space Realtor
Winter Archipelago Furtherance. 358	Posted - 2015.03.23 16:35:33 - [32] - Quote I'm still not a fan of the idea of datacores just being spawned in random containers or some such-not. As far as I know (and please correct me if I'm wrong), datacores all have corresponding science skills. Instead of simply 'spawning' them from a specific structure, a player could use their science skills to create the datacores. Set it up so that a single player can have up to five lines, and switch the Research Project Management skill from allowing +1 research agent to +1 datacore lines, and let players create the datacores themselves using the structure and their science skills, with higher science skills yielding more datacores. It could roughly follow the current agent levels (science skill at level 1 would be akin to having a level 1 agent) for output (though, it would probably need a bit of a boost, depending on how much fuel the structure cost and how much it cost to build). Planning a trip to Thera? Check out http://eve-scout.com/ for a list of the current connections. Once you've made your choice, join the channels *EVE-Scout* or *Furtherance Public* and request a scout to make sure your connection is clear!
Hafwolf StarHunt Mordus Angels 5	Posted - 2015.03.23 16:41:06 - [33] - Quote Winter Archipelago wrote: I'm still not a fan of the idea of datacores just being spawned in random containers or some such-not. As far as I know (and please correct me if I'm wrong), datacores all have corresponding science skills. Instead of simply 'spawning' them from a specific structure, a player could use their science skills to create the datacores. Set it up so that a single player can have up to five lines, and switch the Research Project Management skill from allowing +1 research agent to +1 datacore lines, and let players create the datacores themselves using the structure and their science skills, with higher science skills yielding more datacores. It could roughly follow the current agent levels (science skill at level 1 would be akin to having a level 1 agent) for output (though, it would probably need a bit of a boost, depending on how much fuel the structure cost and how much it cost to build). Really good idea.
Akrasjel Lanate Naquatech Conglomerate Naquatech Syndicate 1752	Posted - 2015.03.23 17:26:22 - [34] - Quote Querns wrote: Would it be possible to start jobs inside the new structures, then pack up the entire structure, move it, then redeploy and finish the jobs? Such thing should not be possible. Akrasjel Lanate General Director(CEO) of Naquatech Conglomerate Executor of Naquatech Syndicate Citizen of Solitude
Akrasjel Lanate Naquatech Conglomerate Naquatech Syndicate 1752	Posted - 2015.03.23 17:29:57 - [35] - Quote Quote: Research Laboratories are dedicated to blueprint research (ME, TE), blueprint copying, Tech II and Tech III blueprint invention, and datacore spawning. "Datacore spawning" would replace RP agents and the rate of spawning would be based on the skill same as for amount of RP agents. Akrasjel Lanate General Director(CEO) of Naquatech Conglomerate Executor of Naquatech Syndicate Citizen of Solitude
Rose Honey Small Holdings Inc. 2	Posted - 2015.03.23 18:30:46 - [36] - Quote How do these changes effect the skills for building small medium and so on. Are they still going to count or are they going to get boiled down into 1 skill? As it looks as if theres only 1 arrary for building instead of the Many Many(RIP Terry) there are now. Also will this mean I can build Caps in highsec outside of NPC stations? As building my own Charon pretty costly in the npc station.
Alexis Nightwish 131	Posted - 2015.03.23 18:34:38 - [37] - Quote Feedback: "one way of doing so would be to have Datacore caches spawn near the Research Laboratory that refill at various intervals. Those caches could be set to be looted by anyone, but with a specific tax set up by the structure owners." I can see this being gamed by setting the tax really high (like 100m per datacore) then refunding that tax to members, while denying 'theft' to any roaming scallywags. Questions: What will happen to reactions? With datacores being player-made, are there plans to either totally overhaul the loot tables of data sites, or just remove data sites all together (and refund SP)? Because the data site loot tables are total garbage. I don't even equip a data analyzer because they just aren't worth the time. This is K-space pirate data sites and W-space sleeper data sites. CCP only approaches a problem in one of two ways: nudge or cludge EVE Online's "I win!" Button
Anonymous Forumposter State War Academy Caldari State 201	Posted - 2015.03.23 18:39:22 - [38] - Quote Ulrik Elristan wrote: fluffy jo wrote: Love the new structure idea. Coming from a POS industry point of view. (wall of whine) Are you gonna psot this on EACH AND EVERY POST ? Seriously... Ignoring text is hard yo. Good thing you tore him a new ******* instead of simply not reading it again.
SpaceSaft Capts Deranged Cavaliers Gentlemen's.Club 140	Posted - 2015.03.23 20:29:07 - [39] - Quote I don't like the datacore spawning as it's suggested, that's like the loot spew in exploration which was bad and you removed it. I really like the idea of datacore mining, but I'm afraid that that would get out of hand pretty quickly, we'd need objects for every kind of datacore and there are a lot of different kinds of data cores. Still, this would be my prefered method. I would appreciate it if it was something people had to go out in space for and do something, not just scoop it up like the current proposal is. Think more like a mission or a site than like PI product pick up. If you want to tie the "mining" to the research labs, you could take the Kerbal Space Program approach and just collect "science" from sciency objects in space and refine that in the labs, datacore output depending on how you set up the lab. I'm not really sure how the new manufacturing changes are meant? One assembly line of a type for each module fitted to the structure? Like ammunition or ships or modules etc. Will this mean there will no longer be a "one size fits all" line? Because that could be a pain, I'm making diverse stuff, depending on the day and what sold out and it would inconvenience everyone greatly if I or my corp had to switch out modules all the time. The same really applies to the research labs as well. Will we end up with the corresponding number of labs or assembly arrays, fully fitted with one type of assembly line/research type, just because that's the only way to manage the mess? Maybe I'm reading too much into this Finally, how is ownership determined? Can they be shot and killed or taken over with the Entosis link? The UI is still bad.
handige harrie Hedion University Amarr Empire 299	Posted - 2015.03.23 21:16:03 - [40] - Quote I like the structure idea in general a whole lot and should shake up things nicely, while making use of your space a fun affair. There are however some points that have some concern and that is mainly that it's not known if Medium sized Assembly and Research structures have a reinforcement timer, or can be killed in one go. If it's the latter they will be useless. I also think that the datacore spawning in cans is kinda uninspired. It would be much better game wise to have Data Sites spawn items of different grades that you can have processed in a research structure to receive Datacores. The processing of datacores takes time and will use a new production line for your character, using the skill that is now in use by Research Agents. Creating the need for people to run Data sites and reward them appropriately (Low and Nullsec drops are more valuable by giving more datacores per Data site item dropped). Another more interactive option is to have the research structure produce datacores at semi random and place them in a cargo bay that can be hacked using a data analyzer and the mini game. Upon completion you get a percentage of the available datacores depending on the speed of the hack as defensive measures against the hack will secure datacores once the hack starts. Rigs can be used to increase the difficulty of the hacking minigame or the speed at which datacores are secured once a breach is detected. The owners of the structure can take the datacores from the cargo bay and just move them in another hangar or cargohold. You should be able to anchor structures close together for more safety and usability at least the ones that don't have any service slots. If you want to run a Small or Medium Assembly Array to build Tech 2 Drones, you should be able to just Drag and Drop the blueprint copies you made in your Research Arrays to the assembly array and start building. Baddest poster ever

Corraidhin Farsaidh Farsaidh's Freeborn 1022	Posted - 2015.03.23 21:46:37 - [41] - Quote With regards to daracores rather than mining I would prefer to see them come from research on data slates found through exploration. The datacores delivered would depend on the science skill levels utilized by the capsuleer. Research time would be affected by the level of research upgrades. This would tie datacore generation to science skills, introduce trade in the dataslates and boost dxploration as something useful would come from the data sites.
Nevyn Auscent Broke Sauce 1971	Posted - 2015.03.23 22:29:42 - [42] - Quote Manufacturing in a POS is currently an absolute crap shoot. You have to have so many different arrays and to follow market shifts you need a range of products so it gets crazy. Compare to manufacturing in an outpost or station. You can do everything. There isn't any differentiation on 'what' you can build or how many lines to a particular product. Assembly arrays should follow that principle. Not the current POS principle. If you want to encourage people to use them micromanagement simply to be able to build something is bad. So an assembly array should let you build anything right away. Services should enhance that in particular non essential ways. So ME bonuses are bad. As they become a 'we have to use that ME bonus to compete on the market' issue. Services should be things surrounding industry but not directly boosting it. Contract delivery services that allow people with contracts from a corp member to dock to deliver a contract, but not otherwise. Adding some research or admin ability to your array so you can use just one structure, time efficiency so you can do more bulk in the same time so better per hour profit (but not per item) etc. Research should be the same thing, the base structure should allow everything, and a service should not give a per unit cost benefit.
A'Tolkar Carlson's Raiders 35	Posted - 2015.03.23 22:31:50 - [43] - Quote CCP Ytterbium wrote: Hello people, We would like your feedback on the various new structure lines presented during Fanfest and on our latest structure blog. This particular thread is going to focus Assembly Arrays and Research Laboratories. Assembly Arrays focus on manufacturing of the numerous EVE Online items, ships, modules, structures, components and etc... used in-game. Research Laboratories are dedicated to blueprint research (ME, TE), blueprint copying, Tech II and Tech III blueprint invention, and datacore spawning. Would one be able to boot strap an entire null-sec presence with a fleet of Prospects, and maybe a coupple blockade runners bringing out a small (or medium) Assembly Array structure, a service module to build more structures (currently not available with POS), and a container stuffed full of blueprints?
Kenneth Skybound Skyefleet 118	Posted - 2015.03.23 22:42:00 - [44] - Quote Choices and limitations. Choices such as what types of assembly to provide. Limitations such as how many lines a single person can create at a platform (not limiting global jobs, just per person). TAXES. Can't really comment on much else, not really sure of the vision of appropriate changes and direction.
Catherine Laartii Crimson Serpent Syndicate Heiian Conglomerate 489	Posted - 2015.03.24 00:46:02 - [45] - Quote What'll happen to the Hyasyoda mobile laboratory? Will it get upgraded into one of these? What are the mat increases going to look like?
DaReaper Net 7 1861	Posted - 2015.03.24 01:50:24 - [46] - Quote One of my biggest pain points with running as pos is that you need something like 6-8 different arrays to make stuff. My hope is this new one will be able to replace them all, so you can make everything in one package. OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
Catherine Laartii Crimson Serpent Syndicate Heiian Conglomerate 490	Posted - 2015.03.24 03:52:03 - [47] - Quote DaReaper wrote: One of my biggest pain points with running as pos is that you need something like 6-8 different arrays to make stuff. My hope is this new one will be able to replace them all, so you can make everything in one package. Or at the very least, research everything in one and manufacture everything in the other one.
Max Deveron Deveron Shipyards and Technology 194	Posted - 2015.03.24 05:16:41 - [48] - Quote Spugg Galdon wrote: Datacore spawning is the only thing I don't really like. Although you're doing something to remove the invulnerable passive generation of datacores, making them spawn and be scoopable isn't a way to "Farm" or "Harvest" datacores. It doesn't even feel like gameplay. I've been thinking for a long while that datacores should be "mined". The way to do this would be to fly to a spatial anomaly or some kind of object in space and activate a type of (Hi Slot) analyser module on it. You would then harvest datacores (like mining gas or ore) by actually doing an activity in space. An activity that can be interdicted and disrupted. The funny thing is that some of these spatial anomalies already exist in game. Some systems have strange spatial anomalies that cause damage when you get too close. We also have other things that could be used for datacore mining. For example: Every system in EvE has a star. These stars are different colours. So, why shouldn't each colour of star allow for different Analysis/Research to be carried out to gather datacores (Plasma Physics and nuclear physics are examples from a star). Wormholes could produce graviton physics datacores when mined. (imagine people gathering around a WH to mine it!) There are so many possibilities all of which can be super sci-fi. There could also be a new range of ships with the specific role of gathering datacores. This would be in and of itself an entire feature gameplay For one these are DATACORES as in like hard drives filled with data....they are not mined.....they are written to by the researchers of specific categories of data.....sheesh. So allowing research characters to build them makes sense.
Spugg Galdon Nisroc Angels 638	Posted - 2015.03.24 06:06:56 - [49] - Quote Max Deveron wrote: For one these are DATACORES as in like hard drives filled with data....they are not mined.....they are written to by the researchers of specific categories of data.....sheesh. So allowing research characters to build them makes sense. But we need to get people into space doing things. I only use the term "Mining" as it is what most closely resembles the same activity. Imagine the sun produced 4 different kinds of solar anomalies that had to be scanned down with probes. A Solar Flare: Solar flares release huge ammounts of high energy particles which are tremendously hot. Activating a research module on this type of anomaly would produce High Energy Physics Datacores (you're researching high energy physics by doing an action like mining on a solar flare) Proximity to this anomalie would do AoE kinetic damage A Solar Prominance: Solar prominance is held together with massive magnetic fields. Activating a research module on this type of anomaly would produce Electromagnetic Physics Datacores. These would have EM AoE damage A Sun Spot: Sun spots would allow you to gather Nuclear Physics datacores. They would have a thermal AoE damage An Imminant CME (Coronal Mass Ejection) These would allow the gathering of Plasma Physics datacores. Thw area would produce explosive AoE damage Now, other types of research sites: Highly Unstable Wormhole (non traversable) - Kinetic and EM AoE damage Event Horizon Anomaly (centre of wormhole): Research of this would produce Quantum Physics Datacores Gravitation Anomaly (in the wormholes "rings"): Study of this would produce Graviton Physics datacores The other datacores would have other sites. All found through probes. The ship line that would do this would be the SoCT ship line. They have flat resistance profiles allowing them to spec tank easily. They are the "Teaching" faction so it fits that they would do research. What I'm suggesting is that it shouldn't be a passive production but an actual activity in space, in a ship, at extremely visually cool sites with some danger to them. Be that area of effect damage for some sites and NPC rats at others. They can also be scaled easily for system sec status. Lower sec status gives anomalies that produce more datacores per cycle of the research module.
Kenneth Feld Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion 227	Posted - 2015.03.24 07:39:24 - [50] - Quote How will jobs be handled that span the entire time of changeover i.e. research jobs that takes 2 years, or even 6 months?

Jeremiah Saken The Fall of Leviathan 237	Posted - 2015.03.24 09:02:49 - [51] - Quote Spugg Galdon wrote: What I'm suggesting is that it shouldn't be a passive production but an actual activity in space, in a ship, at extremely visually cool sites with some danger to them. Be that area of effect damage for some sites and NPC rats at others. They can also be scaled easily for system sec status. Lower sec status gives anomalies that produce more datacores per cycle of the research module. Cool idea but do you really think they would implement it? They can fix data sites loot tables for i don't know, a year now? Now, they want to implement passive activity to increase some part of industry because it will be easier and maybe more ppl will do it. All of that because of "Sandbox" keyword. Which lead us to "PvP" keyword. Which in combat version is performed by maybe 20% of all players. "...genre is a definition, the definition in itself must have boundaries, the boundaries act as barriers, and the barriers are like walls, like the walls of a prisonn++..." The Good, The Bad and The Bantam
Spugg Galdon Nisroc Angels 639	Posted - 2015.03.24 09:32:35 - [52] - Quote Jeremiah Saken wrote: Spugg Galdon wrote: What I'm suggesting is that it shouldn't be a passive production but an actual activity in space, in a ship, at extremely visually cool sites with some danger to them. Be that area of effect damage for some sites and NPC rats at others. They can also be scaled easily for system sec status. Lower sec status gives anomalies that produce more datacores per cycle of the research module. Cool idea but do you really think they would implement it? They can fix data sites loot tables for i don't know, a year now? Now, they want to implement passive activity to increase some part of industry because it will be easier and maybe more ppl will do it. All of that because of "Sandbox" keyword. Which lead us to "PvP" keyword. Which in combat version is performed by maybe 20% of all players. The idea of mining datacores actively would be fairly easy to implement (ignoring art). The concept is simply a mining type module that gathers datacores at a certain rate per cycle. That rate could easily be calculated by looking at the current rate at which you generate datacores via a research agent and transpose it into an active system (you would obviously get more datacores per hour in an active system than a passive system due to a player not being able to play for 24 hours a day 7 days a week, although some do try). Research agents could still exist as mission agents that have special rewards geared more to research and invention. They would offer missions to gather a (worthless) datacore from a dangerous place in return for cash/datacores/rewards. Data sites need to be reworked and are a problem at the moment. But maybe, just maybe, when they let us build meta modules (cause, you know, they want EVERYTHING in EvE built by players) data sites would drop meta module BPC's. Couple that with a change in how loot drops from complete modules to "parts" (which all already exist in game) and these parts would be used with a T1 module and a BPC (gained from a data site) to build a meta level module. That would be the simple way to fix data sites and boost industry and let us build meta modules. However, I imagine they want to complete tiercide for modules first.
Droidyk Maniacal Miners INC 77	Posted - 2015.03.24 09:35:22 - [53] - Quote Spugg Galdon wrote: Max Deveron wrote: For one these are DATACORES as in like hard drives filled with data....they are not mined.....they are written to by the researchers of specific categories of data.....sheesh. So allowing research characters to build them makes sense. But we need to get people into space doing things. I only use the term "Mining" as it is what most closely resembles the same activity. Imagine the sun produced 4 different kinds of solar anomalies that had to be scanned down with probes. A Solar Flare: Solar flares release huge ammounts of high energy particles which are tremendously hot. Activating a research module on this type of anomaly would produce High Energy Physics Datacores (you're researching high energy physics by doing an action like mining on a solar flare) Proximity to this anomalie would do AoE kinetic damage A Solar Prominance: Solar prominance is held together with massive magnetic fields. Activating a research module on this type of anomaly would produce Electromagnetic Physics Datacores. These would have EM AoE damage A Sun Spot: Sun spots would allow you to gather Nuclear Physics datacores. They would have a thermal AoE damage An Imminant CME (Coronal Mass Ejection) These would allow the gathering of Plasma Physics datacores. Thw area would produce explosive AoE damage Now, other types of research sites: Highly Unstable Wormhole (non traversable) - Kinetic and EM AoE damage Event Horizon Anomaly (centre of wormhole): Research of this would produce Quantum Physics Datacores Gravitation Anomaly (in the wormholes "rings"): Study of this would produce Graviton Physics datacores The other datacores would have other sites. All found through probes. The ship line that would do this would be the SoCT ship line. They have flat resistance profiles allowing them to spec tank easily. They are the "Teaching" faction so it fits that they would do research. What I'm suggesting is that it shouldn't be a passive production but an actual activity in space, in a ship, at extremely visually cool sites with some danger to them. Be that area of effect damage for some sites and NPC rats at others. They can also be scaled easily for system sec status. Lower sec status gives anomalies that produce more datacores per cycle of the research module. The datacore spawning is going to be already happening in space, and it is active thing cause they will most likely spawn only if there is activity (research, invention, copying so on) which requires attention and isk and more. And makes much more sense for datacores to come from there than anywhere else.
Spugg Galdon Nisroc Angels 639	Posted - 2015.03.24 09:48:51 - [54] - Quote Droidyk wrote: Spugg Galdon wrote: Max Deveron wrote: For one these are DATACORES as in like hard drives filled with data....they are not mined.....they are written to by the researchers of specific categories of data.....sheesh. So allowing research characters to build them makes sense. What I'm suggesting is that it shouldn't be a passive production but an actual activity in space, in a ship, at extremely visually cool sites with some danger to them. Be that area of effect damage for some sites and NPC rats at others. They can also be scaled easily for system sec status. Lower sec status gives anomalies that produce more datacores per cycle of the research module. How I see it... the datacore spawning is going to be already happening in space, and I think it's active thing cause they will most likely spawn only if there is activity inside (research, invention, copying so on) which requires attention, material, money and stuff. And makes much more sense for datacores to come from there than anywhere else in my opinion. But is it interesting gameplay? Would players who build something, which is what they would be doing in this instance, like to have their product randomly ejected from the structure and able to be stolen? It is still a passive generation with an output that can be interdicted/intercepted. People will literally camp these things and wait for the datacaore ejection. This is not "fun" gameplay. Yes, (some) people will say mining isn't fun but then again many many people do it because they enjoy that pace of gameplay.
Droidyk Maniacal Miners INC 77	Posted - 2015.03.24 09:52:34 - [55] - Quote Spugg Galdon wrote: Droidyk wrote: Spugg Galdon wrote: Max Deveron wrote: For one these are DATACORES as in like hard drives filled with data....they are not mined.....they are written to by the researchers of specific categories of data.....sheesh. So allowing research characters to build them makes sense. What I'm suggesting is that it shouldn't be a passive production but an actual activity in space, in a ship, at extremely visually cool sites with some danger to them. Be that area of effect damage for some sites and NPC rats at others. They can also be scaled easily for system sec status. Lower sec status gives anomalies that produce more datacores per cycle of the research module. How I see it... the datacore spawning is going to be already happening in space, and I think it's active thing cause they will most likely spawn only if there is activity inside (research, invention, copying so on) which requires attention, material, money and stuff. And makes much more sense for datacores to come from there than anywhere else in my opinion. But is it interesting gameplay? Would players who build something, which is what they would be doing in this instance, like to have their product randomly ejected from the structure and able to be stolen? It is still a passive generation with an output that can be interdicted/intercepted. People will literally camp these things and wait for the datacaore ejection. This is not "fun" gameplay. Yes, (some) people will say mining isn't fun but then again many many people do it because they enjoy that pace of gameplay. It can't be stolen by random players unless you enable a public access.
Jeremiah Saken The Fall of Leviathan 237	Posted - 2015.03.24 09:53:21 - [56] - Quote Droidyk wrote: How I see it... the datacore spawning is going to be already happening in space, and I think it's active thing cause they will most likely spawn only if there is activity inside (research, invention, copying so on) which requires attention, material, money and stuff. And makes much more sense for datacores to come from there than anywhere else in my opinion. So i deploy Research lab. Fuel it. Start to making datacore. After they are researched they will be deployed into space...because of reason. If i do my research i don't throw it out the window for wrestling between scientists. This remind me the ESS feature or loot explosions at exploration cans, because of pvp... "...genre is a definition, the definition in itself must have boundaries, the boundaries act as barriers, and the barriers are like walls, like the walls of a prisonn++..." The Good, The Bad and The Bantam
Banko Mato Republic University Minmatar Republic 24	Posted - 2015.03.24 10:05:19 - [57] - Quote Nevyn Auscent wrote: Manufacturing in a POS is currently an absolute crap shoot. You have to have so many different arrays and to follow market shifts you need a range of products so it gets crazy. Compare to manufacturing in an outpost or station. You can do everything. There isn't any differentiation on 'what' you can build or how many lines to a particular product. Assembly arrays should follow that principle. Not the current POS principle. If you want to encourage people to use them micromanagement simply to be able to build something is bad. So an assembly array should let you build anything right away. Services should enhance that in particular non essential ways. I would rather have it the exact opposite: NO structure is allowed to be the general "build all" that outposts are today. No matter what people want to build, they need to focus their assembly structures on that task. Or allow everything to be build in the XL version, but with a heavy decrease in TE/ME when no dedicated service is present.
Anthar Thebess 976	Posted - 2015.03.24 11:30:22 - [58] - Quote Kenneth Feld wrote: How will jobs be handled that span the entire time of changeover i.e. research jobs that takes 2 years, or even 6 months? Use NPC ... there is no better answer. Capital Remote AID Rebalance Way to solve important nullsec issue. CSM members do your work.
Spugg Galdon Nisroc Angels 639	Posted - 2015.03.24 11:54:19 - [59] - Quote Droidyk wrote: Spugg Galdon wrote: Droidyk wrote: [quote=Spugg Galdon][quote=Max Deveron] For one these are DATACORES as in like hard drives filled with data....they are not mined.....they are written to by the researchers of specific categories of data.....sheesh. So allowing research characters to build them makes sense. But is it interesting gameplay? Would players who build something, which is what they would be doing in this instance, like to have their product randomly ejected from the structure and able to be stolen? It is still a passive generation with an output that can be interdicted/intercepted. People will literally camp these things and wait for the datacaore ejection. This is not "fun" gameplay. Yes, (some) people will say mining isn't fun but then again many many people do it because they enjoy that pace of gameplay. It can't be stolen by random players unless you enable a public access as I've read it so far. I've done a quick re-read and I see that. Still, it's a bit weird that you would produce datacores and have random people fly up and take them at a "tax rate". It's still un-interesting game play. It's still passive. And it's still invulnarable to interference other than destroying the structure. I'd far prefer pilots had to get into a ship, fly into space and do an activity in space to gather a resource instead of generate it passively.
Hafwolf StarHunt Mordus Angels 5	Posted - 2015.03.24 14:01:20 - [60] - Quote This can be applied to all structures but make the modules for them instead of anchor you can do a use the current bpo for structures for slots and the whole structure. When you change make the bpo's change from the tower system to the new system so people already have bpo for all the accessories. You might be able to do something with the Tower bpo's to make them move towards the base structures.

Max Deveron Deveron Shipyards and Technology 195	Posted - 2015.03.24 14:12:19 - [61] - Quote Spugg Galdon wrote: Yes, (some) people will say mining isn't fun but then again many many people do it because they enjoy that pace of gameplay. I'd far prefer pilots had to get into a ship, fly into space and do an activity in space to gather a resource instead of generate it passively. .[/quote] You dont get it do you? Unless your looking to just make a buck on the market...the majority of this passive ability is a boon to industry corps. Industry involves a lot of moving parts, we dont have the time to go into space to look for something that we can build/research in a structure. So please quit shiptoasting. or rather yet get into the actual end game levels of serious industry before you open your hole again.
Kenneth Feld Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion 227	Posted - 2015.03.24 14:18:52 - [62] - Quote Anthar Thebess wrote: Kenneth Feld wrote: How will jobs be handled that span the entire time of changeover i.e. research jobs that takes 2 years, or even 6 months? Use NPC ... there is no better answer. Too late
Spugg Galdon Nisroc Angels 639	Posted - 2015.03.24 15:41:25 - [63] - Quote Max Deveron wrote: Spugg Galdon wrote: Yes, (some) people will say mining isn't fun but then again many many people do it because they enjoy that pace of gameplay. I'd far prefer pilots had to get into a ship, fly into space and do an activity in space to gather a resource instead of generate it passively. You dont get it do you? Unless your looking to just make a buck on the market...the majority of this passive ability is a boon to industry corps. Industry involves a lot of moving parts, we dont have the time to go into space to look for something that we can build/research in a structure. So please quit shiptoasting. or rather yet get into the actual end game levels of serious industry before you open your hole again. Resistance to change eh? I'm not trying to create a way to make a quick buck. I'm trying to explain that the ability to create an item passively without any ability to interdict said "activity" isn't very good gameplay. I will once again refer to mining ore as a prime example. Ore is required for minerals, minerals are required to build and you need a shed tonne of minerals to build with. However, ore or minerals aren't gained passively by just asking an NPC to go and get them for you. Other players go out and mine, reprocess, ship and then sell them to industrialists to build with. I am suggesting that an item shouldn't be gained from asking an NPC or a structure to just gather the resource for you safely and should be gathered by pilots doing an actual activity in space. You can then get your datacores from those pilots. Or go and get them yourself.
Mike Azariah The Scope Gallente Federation 2682	Posted - 2015.03.24 16:28:44 - [64] - Quote Field work vs lab work. Maybe have a slow progression in the labs for data cores or be 'sent' to specific places in the constellation for field research and a greatly increased return (at the cost of being active and in space) m Mike Azariah Gö¼GöÇGöÇGö¼n++ ¯\|(pâä)/¯
Corraidhin Farsaidh Farsaidh's Freeborn 1023	Posted - 2015.03.24 16:40:40 - [65] - Quote Perhaps we could hack the unidentified structures to glean scientific knowledge from them. Successful hack = random datacores in one or more of your science skills. The number of datacores would also be random and weighted towards more as you go into lower sec space. If the Drifters turn up whilst you are hacking you'd better run or have some heavy backup. Maybe have some Sleeper data site anomolies pop up too for random gathering. This allows roaming explorers some more stuff to grab but also allows those who don't roam to go havk the towers but with the risk of their location being well known and also visited by Drifters too.
Tengu Grib Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 1016	Posted - 2015.03.24 16:50:26 - [66] - Quote I would really like to see options for harassment of these structure that does not involve their capture or destruction but merely their disruption. I would love to see some way for a single ship or small gang to be annoying without being particularly threatening. Something along the lines of delaying or reducing the speed of installed jobs by accomplishing X. If the defenses are inadequate you can attack, if the defenses are more than you can handle, you can harass. In HS this would have to be during a war only of course, but in low, WH and 0.0 it should be possible more often. I'm not talking anything crippling, just irritating.
Tengu Grib Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 1016	Posted - 2015.03.24 16:51:25 - [67] - Quote Mike Azariah wrote: Field work vs lab work. Maybe have a slow progression in the labs for data cores or be 'sent' to specific places in the constellation for field research and a greatly increased return (at the cost of being active and in space) m Something like the research array spawning some sort of 'data sites' ? That would be very cool and could add some very interesting gameplay.
Tengu Grib Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 1016	Posted - 2015.03.24 17:14:27 - [68] - Quote Max Deveron wrote: Spugg Galdon wrote: Yes, (some) people will say mining isn't fun but then again many many people do it because they enjoy that pace of gameplay. I'd far prefer pilots had to get into a ship, fly into space and do an activity in space to gather a resource instead of generate it passively. . You dont get it do you? Unless your looking to just make a buck on the market...the majority of this passive ability is a boon to industry corps. Industry involves a lot of moving parts, we dont have the time to go into space to look for something that we can build/research in a structure. So please quit shiptoasting. or rather yet get into the actual end game levels of serious industry before you open your hole again. [/quote] On the other side of it Max, if it were to be some active activity, guys like you would probably just outsource it, which could produce a new area of the market. I don't really see that as a bad thing especially because it means your datacore production could be out of alliance and therefore safe(r).
Alexis Nightwish 137	Posted - 2015.03.24 18:51:50 - [69] - Quote Mike Azariah wrote: Field work vs lab work. Maybe have a slow progression in the labs for data cores or be 'sent' to specific places in the constellation for field research and a greatly increased return (at the cost of being active and in space) m Please push for more "active in space" type activities, especially for industry. Fozzie said they'd only allow something to improve a system's index if it could be disrupted by other players in space. CCP only approaches a problem in one of two ways: nudge or cludge EVE Online's "I win!" Button
ISD Dorrim Barstorlode ISD Community Communications Liaisons 4757	Posted - 2015.03.24 20:00:41 - [70] - Quote Removed a off topic post. ISD Dorrim Barstorlode Captain Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department

Jeremiah Saken The Fall of Leviathan 237	Posted - 2015.03.24 21:46:03 - [71] - Quote I watched material from fanfest about structures again, understood half of it (still better that first time). We need some clarification about datacores, how it should work, what is needed to produce them. It's starting to be speculaltion not feedback in that area. Idea to gave it to players seems good but i fear it will end like ESS. "...genre is a definition, the definition in itself must have boundaries, the boundaries act as barriers, and the barriers are like walls, like the walls of a prisonn++..." The Good, The Bad and The Bantam
Petrified Old and Petrified Syndication TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance 239	Posted - 2015.03.24 22:58:06 - [72] - Quote A unified factory (the size of the factory determines the max size of the output as opposed to dedicating each factory to a specific area such as modules or ships or ammo. Essentially a small factory would produce all modules, ammo, and up to destroyer class ships. Medium includes what small can manufacture but gets up to Battlecruiser size as well as structures larger than current mobile deployables. Large would produce Battleships and capital modules as well as larger structures and so forth to Extra large capable of producing capitals, super capitals, and XL structures. If you have specialized factory units, they might get ME and TE bonuses over the generic factory capable of manufacturing a wider variety of items. For Research, you could have the generic module capable of all types of research, but with limited or no bonuses. More specialized research modules focus on TE, or ME, or invention, or copying, but have a larger bonus to compensate.
Hairpins Blueprint CBC Interstellar Fidelas Constans 167	Posted - 2015.03.25 08:42:43 - [73] - Quote CCP Ytterbium wrote: Hello people, We would like your feedback on the various new structure lines presented during Fanfest and on our latest structure blog. This particular thread is going to focus Assembly Arrays and Research Laboratories. Assembly Arrays focus on manufacturing of the numerous EVE Online items, ships, modules, structures, components and etc... used in-game. Research Laboratories are dedicated to blueprint research (ME, TE), blueprint copying, Tech II and Tech III blueprint invention, and datacore spawning. The Big Question is, what happens when some one is burning capital bpo's in pos during the change? Some of those jobs take more that 160 day's!
Gfy Trextron Soul Takers 34	Posted - 2015.03.25 15:56:17 - [74] - Quote So for a guy or small group of guys to compete, you are taking away the ability to have 1 structure that can copy, print, invent, reprocess, and build with the proper mods at an equal efficiency to everyone else (barring 0.0 advantages) and now requiring them to have 3 structures to operate at equal efficiency. You keep saying that the structures can be adapted like a ship, do some things well and others ok. This may seem fair to you in some way, but it is not when you have to rely on a large infrastructure to operate efficiently. This only forces people to join large entities with numerous resources. This potentially goes beyond risk vs reward to unbalanced cost of production.
Oxide Ammar 196	Posted - 2015.03.25 20:59:10 - [75] - Quote Where are the "Teams" from all of this? are you going to reintroduce it again with these new structures or it got completely scratched from the to to do list ? Lady Areola Fappington: -áSolo PVP isn't dead!-á You just need to make sure you have your booster, remote rep, cyno, and emergency Falcon alts logged in and ready before you do any solo PVPing.
Nevyn Auscent Broke Sauce 1977	Posted - 2015.03.25 21:29:20 - [76] - Quote Gfy Trextron wrote: So for a guy or small group of guys to compete, you are taking away the ability to have 1 structure that can copy, print, invent, reprocess, and build with the proper mods at an equal efficiency to everyone else (barring 0.0 advantages) and now requiring them to have 3 structures to operate at equal efficiency. You keep saying that the structures can be adapted like a ship, do some things well and others ok. This may seem fair to you in some way, but it is not when you have to rely on a large infrastructure to operate efficiently. This only forces people to join large entities with numerous resources. This potentially goes beyond risk vs reward to unbalanced cost of production. Note several important things. The small group or guy probably only needs M structures. The large group will also need 3 structures but will need L or XL structures. Thus much lower capital investment. This assumes that the larger structures are simply larger and not better also. Fuel use will only apply when doing things. This means the small guy will have much lower operating costs than he currently does as he won't be burning isk during fallow times. Adaptable structures with fittings mean vastly less micromanagement, one central storage for example. Rather than driving yourself crazy moving around things and onlining & offlining things and whoops, the BPO and the resources are in different spots etc. Might there still be issues, totally, but lets wait for the actual numbers to come out before we cry about the sky falling (Especially since the unbalanced cost of production actually happened with the last industry update already)
Kenneth Feld Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion 227	Posted - 2015.03.25 22:21:28 - [77] - Quote Hairpins Blueprint wrote: CCP Ytterbium wrote: Hello people, We would like your feedback on the various new structure lines presented during Fanfest and on our latest structure blog. This particular thread is going to focus Assembly Arrays and Research Laboratories. Assembly Arrays focus on manufacturing of the numerous EVE Online items, ships, modules, structures, components and etc... used in-game. Research Laboratories are dedicated to blueprint research (ME, TE), blueprint copying, Tech II and Tech III blueprint invention, and datacore spawning. The Big Question is, what happens when some one is burning capital bpo's in pos during the change? Some of those jobs take more that 160 day's! I have asked this already in 2 different threads and been ignored...... That typically means they don't have a clue how to handle it and that you will get shafted after it comes out, like I did during Crius already. It only cost me about 25 bil though, so not too bad
Strockhov The Shire 6	Posted - 2015.03.26 02:04:56 - [78] - Quote Datacore spawning: Why spawn data cores if you can spawn the raw material needed to produce datacores. IGÇÖll start with a lore justification. A Datacore is supposed to be collection of knowledge on a topic contained in a device. The device is somehow consumed in the invention process.-á The skill of a research agent or the source of the datacore has no impact on invention success rate. The skill of the agent only impacts the rate of production. It doesnGÇÖt make sense that the knowledge is lost and need to be rediscovered every time you invent something. Any lore justification should be logically consistent with these conditions. I propose the datacore is actually some sort of organic brain or quantum computer. They are designed to control the tools & process needed for invention. Because of the speed and complexity needed during the invention process, the device burns out under the work load. To optimize the performance of the device, the designs are different for each field of science. After all, each field uses different equations and tools in the process of invention. Lastly, the devices are flawed in the sense they are not designed for retention of knowledge over time. For whatever reason information decays in the system when itGÇÖs not being used. It was a trade off for performance or build cost. Use whatever scientific excuse you like here: The quantum fields decay, synaptic potentials decay with time but the matrix of interconnects remain. So far this explanation accounts for the various types of datacores. It accounts for why the skill of the research agent doesnGÇÖt impact invention. The skill of the agent could easily explain their ability to produce units in quantity. The actual consumption is also explained. After all every tool wears out. ItGÇÖs just easier/cheaper to produce these disposable datacores than some massive device which would last. A player uses the datacore by imprinting their knowledge in the datacore at the beginning of the invention process. This is why their skills matter on the success rate. -á The creation of these datacores require some rather rare elements. The agents used to buy them off the market or through their own mega company resources. The different datacores since they vary in design could easily need different material or the same. Choose whichever flavor you like. Now your company puts up a research station. They come with your own datacore lab division or requires a module/service. They have all the tools and various experts to produce the datacores. Or you could be limited to labs which only support certain types of datacores. What they donGÇÖt have are the rare materials. You also donGÇÖt have the resources of a mega corp to acquire them. Instead they have the tools to locate them in the system or constellation. The act of scanning for the material results in them radiating energy which is detectable. For anyone with access to the research station, they show up as anomalies. For everyone else they show up as signatures. We can tune the size, frequency and location of the sites based on modules size of station or any other design factor. Maybe having OA improves it. Maybe lower sec systems have more sites since they havenGÇÖt been explored/mined out by the mega corps. A player warps to the site and harvest the material. Use what ever mechanism you like to harvest. Maybe itGÇÖs a rare gas or mineral or some salvage off an ancient wreck or GÇª Feed your station the material and they produce the datacore for you. You can use jobs slots if you want or just a straight conversion. This explanation fits the lore. The player has to be active in space. Other players can attack them or just steal the resource. Datacore production can be tuned as needed by altering the size, type or frequency of drops. It is another feature for a solar system that could be improved with activity. It gives explorers something else to harvest. The actual volume harvested can be quite small so even frigates would be a viable ship.
Hexatron Ormand Aperture Deep Space Eternal Pretorian Alliance 88	Posted - 2015.03.26 21:18:20 - [79] - Quote As those buildings are very specialized, opposed to a POS, you would most likely need severals of those. Assembly and laboratory is a good example, so far one POS is handling all of that. With the new system we would need at least one of each... or maybe even more, when the assembly arrays are specialized to few products each. So i am wondering, will it be possible to connect or "dock" several of those structures together? Cause otherwise i may have to switch from one structure to the next setting up all my jobs. Yet if i could connect all the structures into some sort of "superstructure" i would only need to go to it once. Like a modular thing, you connect as many structures together as needed, to get all the services you want or are looking for.
Sarah Eginald Git-R-Done Logistics Git-R-Done Inc 0	Posted - 2015.03.27 16:06:01 - [80] - Quote In one speech a long time ago they talked about structures being like houses that you can build to suit your needs. Instead of having different structures for assemble, research, and mining how about 1 structure of different sizes. Each size difference is the service slots that are available. Medium has 5 Service slots and restrict the amount of ships docked to say 5 Large has 10 Service slots and restrict the amount of ships docked to say 15 or 20 XL has 15 Service slots and docking can be a lot higher say over 100 for this size. As a small group of people doing mining, research, invention, and manufacturing a single structure would be easier to move and defend even if we have to change service slots. If you are set on having different structures for each type of operation can we have them linked for transportation of goods and materials. Say Johnny puts up a drilling rig, Sam puts up a research structure, I put up a assembly structure can we link them so minerals I have reprocessed in Johnny's drilling rig can be move to my assemble structure and be able to use Sam research labs to better or invent blueprint copies. Being able to link together and share structures might make space communities in all sec status. I could see a community starting in high sec as a bunch of people working together eventually growing into alliance to move to null sec as they work together.

159Pinky Under Heavy Fire Mordus Angels 19	Posted - 2015.03.27 17:38:25 - [81] - Quote I would love to have the option of a slot for ship / ammo / modules. And just use the rigs and services slots to specialize more Also what about restrictions? I assume capitals are still no go in high sec. But why not open up supercapital production to the whole of null sec rather than just in sov space?
Jennifer Maxwell Crimson Serpent Syndicate Heiian Conglomerate 254	Posted - 2015.03.30 03:16:27 - [82] - Quote Spugg Galdon wrote: Datacore spawning is the only thing I don't really like. Although you're doing something to remove the invulnerable passive generation of datacores, making them spawn and be scoopable isn't a way to "Farm" or "Harvest" datacores. It doesn't even feel like gameplay. I've been thinking for a long while that datacores should be "mined". The way to do this would be to fly to a spatial anomaly or some kind of object in space and activate a type of (Hi Slot) analyser module on it. You would then harvest datacores (like mining gas or ore) by actually doing an activity in space. An activity that can be interdicted and disrupted. The funny thing is that some of these spatial anomalies already exist in game. Some systems have strange spatial anomalies that cause damage when you get too close. We also have other things that could be used for datacore mining. For example: Every system in EvE has a star. These stars are different colours. So, why shouldn't each colour of star allow for different Analysis/Research to be carried out to gather datacores (Plasma Physics and nuclear physics are examples from a star). Wormholes could produce graviton physics datacores when mined. (imagine people gathering around a WH to mine it!) There are so many possibilities all of which can be super sci-fi. There could also be a new range of ships with the specific role of gathering datacores. This would be in and of itself an entire feature gameplay That would really expand on the "scientist" style of gameplay. Instead of just sitting in stations and researching blueprints constantly, people could get out and actively do research.
Rawketsled Generic Corp Name 151	Posted - 2015.03.30 04:03:54 - [83] - Quote From a hand-wavey lore point of view, that doesn't work with non-Physics science skills. Electronic, Mechanical, Molecular, and Nanite Engineering skills won't make sense with that.
Spugg Galdon Nisroc Angels 644	Posted - 2015.03.30 07:06:42 - [84] - Quote Rawketsled wrote: From a hand-wavey lore point of view, that doesn't work with non-Physics science skills. Electronic, Mechanical, Molecular, and Nanite Engineering skills won't make sense with that. Ancient Wreck Site: A large wreck of an ancient ship is found floating in space. > Although completely inoperable, the engine bay is exposed. Perhaps research of the mechanics of this engine system could provide some insight into rocket science. > Although completely ruined and unable to be powered back up, the ship's computer seems to be accessible. Perhaps research of this ancient technology could provide some insight into Electronic Engineering. > A small area of the ship seems to have been partially repaired. The work hasn't been completed but your sensor detect what appear to be microscopic maintenance bots. Perhaps some research of the inactive micro maintenance bots could shed some light onto Nanite Technology. ................ I can make shite like this up all day long if it's required for "lore" in order to make it fit into the game. It's not difficult and easily scalable and can even be applied to different ancient races. These sites can provide a "danger" to them by simply having the ancient ship automatically defend itself.
Xindi Kraid Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd. 912	Posted - 2015.03.30 15:49:35 - [85] - Quote They could make it so a research station could increase the rate of spawns of certain data and relic sites. maybe new types. They could even add ancient race sites specifically found (spawned) by the research structures that give more datacores of a specific type by salvaging and reverse engineering what's there. That's possibly a gameplay AND lore bonus, and I would certainly love to see more of the talocan, yan jung and takmahl as well as more of those cosmos modules
Samsara Toldya Academy of Contradictory Behaviour 280	Posted - 2015.03.31 08:47:52 - [86] - Quote CCP Ytterbium wrote: Hello people, We would like your feedback on the various new structure lines presented during Fanfest and on our latest structure blog. This particular thread is going to focus Assembly Arrays and Research Laboratories. Assembly Arrays focus on manufacturing of the numerous EVE Online items, ships, modules, structures, components and etc... used in-game. Research Laboratories are dedicated to blueprint research (ME, TE), blueprint copying, Tech II and Tech III blueprint invention, and datacore spawning. As far as I can tell no further details have been published. We have an artwork and an ISIS like tree with few details that won't work (0 service slots for medium structure with 1 service slot needed to do anything at all). What kind of feedback do you expect? Name? It's ok. Gfx? Ok. Function? Not known, not important, we want to look at things, not use them. As name and gfx are fine - you might proceed to release them.
Liafcipe9000 Critically Preposterous 34011	Posted - 2015.03.31 09:40:47 - [87] - Quote Are there any specifics for datacore spawning yet? How will players control the spawning of datacores? Critically Preposterous is recruiting! Join the fight! I am a cat.
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn Department 10 226	Posted - 2015.03.31 11:51:08 - [88] - Quote A -1 from me for the proposal to make datacores spawn from POSes as this would mean inventors would need to use a POS rather than an NPC station. It is an anti-choice decision. It also doesn't seem logical for a physical object to appear out of nowhere and makes no sense. I wasn't in favour of datacores coming from FW LP either but at least that has a basis in logic. I suggest leaving datacores where they are at present with supplies coming from R&D agents and FW LP stores. " They're gonna feel pretty stupid when they find out. "-áRick. " Find out what ? "-áAbraham. " They're screwing with the wrong people. "-áRick. Season four.-á-á ' The Walking Dead. ' .
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn Department 10 226	Posted - 2015.03.31 11:54:34 - [89] - Quote Spugg Galdon wrote: Max Deveron wrote: For one these are DATACORES as in like hard drives filled with data....they are not mined.....they are written to by the researchers of specific categories of data.....sheesh. So allowing research characters to build them makes sense. But we need to get people into space doing things. I only use the term "Mining" as it is what most closely resembles the same activity. Imagine the sun produced 4 different kinds of solar anomalies that had to be scanned down with probes. A Solar Flare: Solar flares release huge ammounts of high energy particles which are tremendously hot. Activating a research module on this type of anomaly would produce High Energy Physics Datacores (you're researching high energy physics by doing an action like mining on a solar flare) Proximity to this anomalie would do AoE kinetic damage A Solar Prominance: Solar prominance is held together with massive magnetic fields. Activating a research module on this type of anomaly would produce Electromagnetic Physics Datacores. These would have EM AoE damage A Sun Spot: Sun spots would allow you to gather Nuclear Physics datacores. They would have a thermal AoE damage An Imminant CME (Coronal Mass Ejection) These would allow the gathering of Plasma Physics datacores. Thw area would produce explosive AoE damage Now, other types of research sites: Highly Unstable Wormhole (non traversable) - Kinetic and EM AoE damage Event Horizon Anomaly (centre of wormhole): Research of this would produce Quantum Physics Datacores Gravitation Anomaly (in the wormholes "rings"): Study of this would produce Graviton Physics datacores The other datacores would have other sites. All found through probes. The ship line that would do this would be the SoCT ship line. They have flat resistance profiles allowing them to spec tank easily. They are the "Teaching" faction so it fits that they would do research. What I'm suggesting is that it shouldn't be a passive production but an actual activity in space, in a ship, at extremely visually cool sites with some danger to them. Be that area of effect damage for some sites and NPC rats at others. They can also be scaled easily for system sec status. Lower sec status gives anomalies that produce more datacores per cycle of the research module. Sounds like a 'mini-game' to me. " They're gonna feel pretty stupid when they find out. "-áRick. " Find out what ? "-áAbraham. " They're screwing with the wrong people. "-áRick. Season four.-á-á ' The Walking Dead. ' .
Webster Carr Aliastra Gallente Federation 3	Posted - 2015.03.31 18:24:56 - [90] - Quote Droidyk wrote: Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote: [quote=Spugg Galdon][quote=elitatwo][quote=Spugg Galdon] Thus rendering research agents uttelry useless unless the number of datacores they provide is buffed accordingly, which would of course then crash the market! That is what they are trying to achieve, agents would be removed. It has been said before. Why not keep both methods? It is always possible to have multiple paths to the same goal. If you want to use research agents, leave them in place, if you want to build a structure supply data cores, do it that way....

Webster Carr Aliastra Gallente Federation 3	Posted - 2015.03.31 18:32:50 - [91] - Quote Gfy Trextron wrote: So for a guy or small group of guys to compete, you are taking away the ability to have 1 structure that can copy, print, invent, reprocess, and build with the proper mods at an equal efficiency to everyone else (barring 0.0 advantages) and now requiring them to have 3 structures to operate at equal efficiency. You keep saying that the structures can be adapted like a ship, do some things well and others ok. This may seem fair to you in some way, but it is not when you have to rely on a large infrastructure to operate efficiently. This only forces people to join large entities with numerous resources. This potentially goes beyond risk vs reward to unbalanced cost of production. What if, in addition to all of the specialized types there was added a generalized structure with lesser (or no) bonuses to all roles. It could never equal the raw output of what the specialized structures could do, but it could fit and do all or most of the activities. In addition: when the transition came all of the existing POS structures could simply be transformed into the new type of general structure with similar mods in place. Web
Nevyn Auscent Broke Sauce 1990	Posted - 2015.03.31 23:09:17 - [92] - Quote Webster Carr wrote: What if, in addition to all of the specialized types there was added a generalized structure with lesser (or no) bonuses to all roles. It could never equal the raw output of what the specialized structures could do, but it could fit and do all or most of the activities. In addition: when the transition came all of the existing POS structures could simply be transformed into the new type of general structure with similar mods in place. Web If you watch the whole stream of Fanfest, they actually said that the service modules would/should be cross fittable. So you can fit a research service module into an assembly array, it just won't get the role bonus of the structure. Just like you can fit lasers onto a Rokh. But it gets no bonus to them. So we don't need a generic structure, because assuming that's accurate, and the service slots aren't overly specific (Looking at you assembly arrays where you need 20 or 30 of them to produce everything) then you can have a generic structure based on how you fit it.
Lurifax Common Sense Ltd Nulli Secunda 23	Posted - 2015.04.01 08:53:53 - [93] - Quote The passive income from the datacores is bad. We dont need passive income. Remove the agents and please no can that will give you free data cores. The data sites are bad enough as it is.
Flamespar WarRavens 1315	Posted - 2015.04.01 09:51:45 - [94] - Quote It would be good if research laboratories gave some benefits to exploration gameplay. Perhaps giving an overview of exploration sites in the system/constellation/region depending on size. Or even allowing us to detect new deep space exploration sites. It would also be cool if we could discover and sell the locations of sites via these structures. EVE Chronicle: An audio drama set in the EVE universe http://evechronicle.blogspot.com.au/ https://twitter.com/Flamespar
Spugg Galdon Nisroc Angels 646	Posted - 2015.04.01 09:53:26 - [95] - Quote Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn wrote: Spugg Galdon wrote: Max Deveron wrote: For one these are DATACORES as in like hard drives filled with data....they are not mined.....they are written to by the researchers of specific categories of data.....sheesh. So allowing research characters to build them makes sense. But we need to get people into space doing things. I only use the term "Mining" as it is what most closely resembles the same activity. Imagine the sun produced 4 different kinds of solar anomalies that had to be scanned down with probes. A Solar Flare: Solar flares release huge ammounts of high energy particles which are tremendously hot. Activating a research module on this type of anomaly would produce High Energy Physics Datacores (you're researching high energy physics by doing an action like mining on a solar flare) Proximity to this anomalie would do AoE kinetic damage A Solar Prominance: Solar prominance is held together with massive magnetic fields. Activating a research module on this type of anomaly would produce Electromagnetic Physics Datacores. These would have EM AoE damage A Sun Spot: Sun spots would allow you to gather Nuclear Physics datacores. They would have a thermal AoE damage An Imminant CME (Coronal Mass Ejection) These would allow the gathering of Plasma Physics datacores. Thw area would produce explosive AoE damage Now, other types of research sites: Highly Unstable Wormhole (non traversable) - Kinetic and EM AoE damage Event Horizon Anomaly (centre of wormhole): Research of this would produce Quantum Physics Datacores Gravitation Anomaly (in the wormholes "rings"): Study of this would produce Graviton Physics datacores The other datacores would have other sites. All found through probes. The ship line that would do this would be the SoCT ship line. They have flat resistance profiles allowing them to spec tank easily. They are the "Teaching" faction so it fits that they would do research. What I'm suggesting is that it shouldn't be a passive production but an actual activity in space, in a ship, at extremely visually cool sites with some danger to them. Be that area of effect damage for some sites and NPC rats at others. They can also be scaled easily for system sec status. Lower sec status gives anomalies that produce more datacores per cycle of the research module. Sounds like a 'mini-game' to me. That's still better than no gameplay at all.
Xindi Kraid Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd. 918	Posted - 2015.04.01 14:38:46 - [96] - Quote Lurifax wrote: The passive income from the datacores is bad. We dont need passive income. Remove the agents and please no can that will give you free data cores. The data sites are bad enough as it is. So, where would datacores come from then if you removed the old method and not add a new one? Are you proposing they only come from the LP store? Also, industry pretty much IS about passive income as far as my view of it goes. Sure mining the resources yourself is active, and you need to set jobs and market orders, but everything beyond that happens in the background whether you are there or not. Moon goo and PI are also passive. You occasionally move stuff around, but the resources are collected in the background once everything's been set up properly, and there's nothing wrong with passive income, it just shouldn't be worth as much as active income. Also if you are saying passive income is bad, then how are data sites bad when they require you to actively search for and interact with? The only real problem is they don't really give a good number of datacores.
Kate Ragnarok Pirates Blood 0	Posted - 2015.04.01 17:01:55 - [97] - Quote I think the idea of research platform being able to attract data and relic sites to a system is pretty cool. Also make a new type of site that just spawns data cores. Have a signal on the platform to attract a certain faction for the data spawns. Be able to change the signal when you want a different races data cores. If the structure is not used then the signal goes offline. This creates new opportunities for people to have structures and also for people to ninja stuff as well. This would work good with the new trade hubs. Example. Corp puts up a research structure and a trading hub. The corp does not as a rule want to do data sites they just want to mine. They put the highest buy orders at their trade hub and people scan sites and sell the data cores to the corp. This way they create jobs for new pilots and old to make isk in corp or alliance level no matter what the sec status. Also they can use the billboards to advertise the price for data cores in system for people to sell them as well.
Nevyn Auscent Broke Sauce 1991	Posted - 2015.04.01 23:28:47 - [98] - Quote Data cores totally should be produced. They are just data stores. You don't need to research new theories 50000 times to produce exactly the same T2 item every time. Once you have done it once, that's it. Then it's just using the knowledge. What someone posted earlier about datacores being cybernetic libraries that burn out after use sounds the best lore direction to go with them. So yes, lets keep the 'passive' ability (Of a structure at risk in space) to make datacores, because it actually makes sense. And lets not make it a mini game of 'hunt the datacore' because that just sounds & feels silly.
Xindi Kraid Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd. 922	Posted - 2015.04.02 06:49:38 - [99] - Quote Nevyn Auscent wrote: Data cores totally should be produced. They are just data stores. You don't need to research new theories 50000 times to produce exactly the same T2 item every time. Once you have done it once, that's it. Then it's just using the knowledge. http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/invention.jpg]http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/invention.jpg Quote: What someone posted earlier about datacores being cybernetic libraries that burn out after use sounds the best lore direction to go with them. Well the reasoning behind limited runs on BPCs as far as I am aware is DRM
Nevyn Auscent Broke Sauce 1991	Posted - 2015.04.02 11:05:00 - [100] - Quote Sure, the 'invention' might not work, but the datacore isn't the act on inventing, it's just the library you use for reference while 'inventing'.

Webster Carr Aliastra Gallente Federation 6	Posted - 2015.04.02 13:01:31 - [101] - Quote I still say keep the Research Agents as an additional source of data cores. If you think of it this way: The research agents are the PVE source of data cores (interaction with agents as you do with running missions). Then the data cores from research structures would be an alternate source. What was described at fanfest was data core spawning from the research structure would work as such: In one of the Research structure's slots you place a 'Data Collection Array'. That station would then spawn nodes (it would make the most sense to spawn hacking nodes just like data sites) that are guaranteed to produce a quantity of data cores (possibly in addition to other random drops)? The problem with the above is that WHY? Why would you invest assets into building something that someone can just come along and ninja the production from? It doesn't make sense. What would make the most sense is that it produces data cores that are stored in your personal hangar on the structure, that you swing by and collect from in a method similar to PI production. Perhaps it even could use an amount of simple P2 PI as input, differing based upon the data core desired: Mechanical Engineering uses Mechanical Parts, Electronic Engineering uses Miniature Electronics, Nanite Engineering uses well Nanites... In other words it works like industry, with the number of Data Cores Job slots being determined by your Research Project Management skill In essence you could use a NPC agent or your own Research Lab or a combination of the two to a limit of determined by your Research Project Management skill. Just like current BPO research you could either use a research lab at an NPC station or build your own... Simple and intuitive. In my opinion the sandbox is enhanced by having multiple routes to the same goal. -Web
Lienzo Amanuensis 74	Posted - 2015.04.03 17:28:01 - [102] - Quote These will not replace the functionality of stations unless there is some way to boost the sensor strength of the structures. Ideally, it would be a system effect so as to encourage players to actually defend the system rather than rely on mechanics self-contained to the structure. In addition, lowsec systems need mechanics which both allow and disallow discovery of these structures, or different structures. Incorporation of the hacking system may help to create delays and player escalations. An alternative is the requirement for attackers to have their own hostile structures operating in the system or constellation. No matter the level of mechanic protection, they will remain vulnerable to spies.
unimatrix0030 Viperfleet Inc. Official Winners Of Takeshi's Castle 158	Posted - 2015.04.04 22:00:55 - [103] - Quote https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=414184&p=3 I like the idea! In the current system you can have research and manifacturing in the same location. If those can not be done at the same place with the same or more bonuses then the number of structures in space will be quite higher . Everyone wanting datacores will also have an extra structure. Since people who want to have control of the entire manifacturing process will need to have more then 1. While it will increase risk by moving stuff, that will also increase the number of structures in space quite a bit. Maybe untill the servers are stressed. Would datacore be able to be siphoned in null, low, w-space? No local in null sec would fix everything!
Bussan Kabukicho 7	Posted - 2015.04.06 11:51:49 - [104] - Quote In general I like the new system, or at least we can say that I'm happy that they finally decided to change this part of the game, as it was pretty annoying and time consuming. But, even if the new system is quite different from the old one, looking better at it, I think it doesn't really change things THAT much... I mean, before we had a bubble with inside the tower and the modules we needed. Now we have no bubble, but just the "modules (with other modules inside...)". People that used a POS for more than just 1-2 things, will be forced to use some of the new structures at the same time, to have the same results. So it might be cool and nice for all the people that were using a pos for simple stuff, but for most of the industrialists, or corps using POSes for industry, stage, storage, wh, whatever... will just have an increased confusion and workload. I know that you can put different arrays even in a structure that is not specialized for that kind of array, but let's be honest... unless you manufacture/research /etc mostly for fun, you cannot do that. Indutry in EVE is very competitive, so industrialists cannot loose bonuses like that, and still make isks. That's why they will use multiple specialized structures. Making it a hell to handle them all. How to make things easier? more efficient? Not so sure... looks difficult... but FOR SURE having to move stuff around in different structures with ships is going to be really really annoying and time consuming... not fun at all. First of all, get rid of the 1000000000 hangars, that make things confusing. Just make one single hangar (or one single "set" of hangars, like in a station), that will be shared by ALL the arrays/services in that structure. So, for example, I won't need to move the minearls around every time I wannt manufacture something. Simply all the specialized arrays will get the materials they need from the same hangar. Or different ones... just let us set the single arrays "preferences" about where to find the bpo/bpc and the materials they will use. Based on t he single array, not the single bpo in that single array... Then, why not keep some of the basic ideas of the old pos? The structures will work stand-alone perfectly fine, and mostly will be used like that. But for people that will need more than one, let them "link" the structures somehow... in a way that will be possible to share the storage of all the structures, and avoid 10000 flights from one structure to the other just to move materials or bpo. For example there can be another structure that will be the "core" of those "space cities", that will just merge the storage of the different structures, and maybe act like a fuel tank too.... so the owner can just put all the fuel in a single place to keep online all his structures. If it feels like it's too good, for example you can have to sacrifice one slot, or one rig, to create the link to the core, that can handle only a fixed amount of links. I mean, it's nice to make people fly more, go around and whatever... but too much will just make people quit it, because not fun at all.... at least for me it's not fun to go back and forth from one structure to the other 1000 times, even if they are anchored almost at the same place.
Arctic Estidal Harbingers of Chaos Inc Gentlemen's.Club 19	Posted - 2015.04.07 14:54:27 - [105] - Quote It would be great to have these structures be able to be placed next to the Market Headquarters (XL Structure) and then connect the structures. So all blueprints, invention, manufacturing, market orders etc can be managed from the one connected structure. If I need to move my pod or ship between multiple structures continually this will be too tedious. Currently I can be in the main outpost and undertake all the activities that I need too. The structure may not have all the best bonuses but this option needs to remain available. Currently I am manufacturing and managing over 600+ sale orders, so this needs to be considered.
Rowells ANZAC ALLIANCE Fidelas Constans 2233	Posted - 2015.04.07 17:13:55 - [106] - Quote do we know if we're looking at similar bonuses to current outposts for the XL structures?
Sarah Eginald Git-R-Done Logistics Git-R-Done Inc 1	Posted - 2015.04.08 12:46:33 - [107] - Quote Arctic Estidal wrote: It would be great to have these structures be able to be placed next to the Market Headquarters (XL Structure) and then connect the structures. So all blueprints, invention, manufacturing, market orders etc can be managed from the one connected structure. If I need to move my pod or ship between multiple structures continually this will be too tedious. Currently I can be in the main outpost and undertake all the activities that I need too. The structure may not have all the best bonuses but this option needs to remain available. Currently I am manufacturing and managing over 600+ sale orders, so this needs to be considered. Here is an Idea that maybe 2 paths for an XL structure you can add on to your existing structure to make it grow. Your considering mooring ships why not do the same with structures. You can moor/anchor another structured next to the first creating a larger structure. I think for building your space empire this would make sense. This way a corp or alliance can add structures to expand there structure for their needs instead of having to buy a bigger structure.
Sarah Eginald Git-R-Done Logistics Git-R-Done Inc 1	Posted - 2015.04.08 15:18:43 - [108] - Quote I also have a question about the rigs on these structures. Are they going to be setup so a person can scoop them up without destroying the rigs or how can a person move a structure without destroying the items that are more valuable then the structure itself.
Spencer Owl Black Swan Corp Mercury Seven 22	Posted - 2015.04.10 00:06:44 - [109] - Quote My only input on this is if they aren't a single structure then make sure the two can communicate. Moving blue prints to and from a production facility/laboratory is going to be risky business if you have to do it more than you do now.
Soleil Fournier Ultimatum. The Bastion 35	Posted - 2015.04.11 01:06:20 - [110] - Quote I would like 2 different assembly arrays: Regular assembly array for most industry needs/products. Capital shipyard. All capital ships would need to be built in the capital shipyards. Think of your favorite Sci-Fi TV show/movie capital shipyard assault and model them as such. Then, perhaps, limit all capital shipyards to Sovereignty space. The major wars sparked by assaulting opponent capital shipyards would be epic, and would give sov space a unique focus in the industrial world by providing capital products to the rest of New Eden.

minumin Corellian Trading Corporation 6	Posted - 2015.04.11 08:53:25 - [111] - Quote Kenneth Feld wrote: Hairpins Blueprint wrote: CCP Ytterbium wrote: Hello people, We would like your feedback on the various new structure lines presented during Fanfest and on our latest structure blog. This particular thread is going to focus Assembly Arrays and Research Laboratories. Assembly Arrays focus on manufacturing of the numerous EVE Online items, ships, modules, structures, components and etc... used in-game. Research Laboratories are dedicated to blueprint research (ME, TE), blueprint copying, Tech II and Tech III blueprint invention, and datacore spawning. The Big Question is, what happens when some one is burning capital bpo's in pos during the change? Some of those jobs take more that 160 day's! I have asked this already in 2 different threads and been ignored...... That typically means they don't have a clue how to handle it and that you will get shafted after it comes out, like I did during Crius already. It only cost me about 25 bil though, so not too bad they should just try to implement fractional researching of bpos or pausing researching bpos, keeping the progress made for example i start now a research from me9 to me10, taking 50 days i pay 50 mil isk for this after 40 days i need to pause the research for various reasons (need to take down pos, hostile patch incoming etc) the bpo returns to my hangar , but with me 9.8 (40/50=80%) or something like that i get back 10 mil (reimbursement for research time not spent) as a downside, maybe the bpo should be locked to not allow using it for manufacturing or bpc copying till you finish researching it
Banko Mato Republic University Minmatar Republic 26	Posted - 2015.04.11 22:49:07 - [112] - Quote minumin wrote: as a downside, maybe the bpo should be locked to not allow using it for manufacturing or bpc copying till you finish researching it Or always use the rounded down ME/TE value for copying or manufacturing calculations
13kr1d1 Hedion University Amarr Empire 98	Posted - 2015.04.25 01:18:40 - [113] - Quote My research lab at POS has stopped working completely. This is great. At 5 drones of T2, the Tristan is nearly as powerful as the Algos, with a cheaper price tag, better maneuverability and speed, and smaller sig radius to avoid the lazy carebearish T3 station blapping -10s who have no life. Pick tristan for FW.
Brutalis Furia Hammer and Anvil Industries 15	Posted - 2015.04.26 01:46:43 - [114] - Quote Passive datacores? no. Any change that takes away a player activity is bad. It's as simple as that. I like the idea of creating a scientific version of ore sites. It's a way to shift the creation of these items away from passive NPC generation to active player involvement.
FT Diomedes The Graduates Get Off My Lawn 931	Posted - 2015.04.26 03:31:56 - [115] - Quote Brutalis Furia wrote: Passive datacores? no. Any change that takes away a player activity is bad. It's as simple as that. I like the idea of creating a scientific version of ore sites. It's a way to shift the creation of these items away from passive NPC generation to active player involvement. They could very easily just put more data cores into the Data Sites. Then make it harder to get them from other NPC sources. This would make the Data Sites worth doing. The Greatest Ship Ever. Credit to Shahfluffers.
Eric Raeder No Fee Too High 104	Posted - 2015.04.29 00:13:40 - [116] - Quote I see post after post referring to datacores being generated by passive research missions and how this should be removed. I am sitting here scratching my head. WTF? The number of datacores entering the economy from research agents is TINY. My understanding is that this was changed years ago, and most datacores now come from faction warfare loyalty point stores. I even checked my own research agents, which I haven't bothered talking to in over two years. I have accumulated enough research points to buy about 490 datacores from them. Worth about 50 million ISK on the current market. In two YEARS. get real, that won't even cover one day's worth of my invention jobs. Where is the discussion about the real source of datacores, faction warfare?
Justin Cody Tri-gun 263	Posted - 2015.05.12 01:26:44 - [117] - Quote CCP Ytterbium wrote: Hello people, We would like your feedback on the various new structure lines presented during Fanfest and on our latest structure blog. This particular thread is going to focus Assembly Arrays and Research Laboratories. Assembly Arrays focus on manufacturing of the numerous EVE Online items, ships, modules, structures, components and etc... used in-game. Research Laboratories are dedicated to blueprint research (ME, TE), blueprint copying, Tech II and Tech III blueprint invention, and datacore spawning. As long as they have a significant advantage over station services then it is all good. Make Drug Labs part of the Research Labs category pl0x. Also as an aside consider iterating on the whole drug meta. some nice weaksauce drugs for high sec and maybe some t2/3 drugs or faction drugs. Pirate factions should be tripping balls while fighting.
Kenneth Fritz DND Industries 0	Posted - 2015.05.16 05:31:25 - [118] - Quote Winter Archipelago wrote: I'm still not a fan of the idea of datacores just being spawned in random containers or some such-not. As far as I know (and please correct me if I'm wrong), datacores all have corresponding science skills. Instead of simply 'spawning' them from a specific structure, a player could use their science skills to create the datacores. Set it up so that a single player can have up to five lines, and switch the Research Project Management skill from allowing +1 research agent to +1 datacore lines, and let players create the datacores themselves using the structure and their science skills, with higher science skills yielding more datacores. It could roughly follow the current agent levels (science skill at level 1 would be akin to having a level 1 agent) for output (though, it would probably need a bit of a boost, depending on how much fuel the structure cost and how much it cost to build). I like this concept but perhaps take it a bit further. Use thr same basic concept but but add in thar you jeed an item. Whether its a ship, module, ammo/charge, or rig that correlates to that skill. Depending on the lvl of the object it provides the base modifier while your skill in that paricular field adds to if not further multiplies it. Thus rendering cores at the approriate rate. In this way a guy with excellent skills can use a fairly mundane object for obvious benifit while someone who did not have the the skill would have to shell out a ton of cash for an item cool enough to give them the same level of return.
Aker Krane OMEGADYNE LABS Rising Darkness 14	Posted - 2015.05.27 17:59:53 - [119] - Quote As most folks here have alluded toGÇª the fixation on data cores is not very interesting or productive. There are tons of places to get them already, and they are cheap. Their price is relatively constrained by the availability of data sites and the isk per hour price of FW LPs. As Eric Raeder points out, the player agent source of them is basically irrelevant. If CCP wants to do something interesting, have it involve the decryptors. Lets level that field the rest of the way. Let us invent and build our own decryptors with random chances of various ME, PE and Run values (all the way ME10/PE20). The better the skills, better the chances of inventing a good BPC. No more free rides for folks with low skill points. Make it so the new decryptors can be R&DGÇÖd ONLY in a Research lab. If you allow them to be researched in HS NPC stations, 99% of them will be, and only a handful of folks will build the Research platforms.
Dini Mueter Incompatible Protocol 28	Posted - 2015.06.19 13:51:35 - [120] - Quote It seems to me that this new structure idea is generally breaking up what used to be done in a single structure, into needing several different structures. As an example, right now I'm running a medium POS, out of which I use a research lab to do ME and TE research on my BPO's, a design lab to make BPC's and invent T2 BPC's, a component assembly array to build some of the T2 components on the cheap, and an equipment assembly array to build the T1 and T2 items I'm going to sell. Would it be correct to assume that when the new structures are implemented, I'll need two different structures, one for assembly and one for research? Will these need to be placed on different moons? Will they each have an upkeep/fuel cost required to run?

Senakawa Skor Bureau of Reclamation 6	Posted - 2015.06.20 00:05:35 - [121] - Quote Regarding new types of mining, such as datacores that are being discussed a lot, why not have a very different market mechanic? Datacores thematically represent stored observations of the universe for research purposes. Why does it make sense that I can transfer my consciousness but not data in a datacore? Make datacores un-stealable. They become a resource that take up no volume and can be instantly transferred between any containers you own across New Eden (like ISK). The emergent gameplay then comes from how the datacores are produced in the eve universe. A new types of observation structure when deployed in space in the right locations produces datacores for the owner over time, instantly transferred to the container of their choice anywhere in New Eden. These structures can be destroyed, but there are no loot drops. In the simplest interaction, the price of the datacores varies with the number of corresponding observation structures currently deployed, so I have an incentive to destroy the observation structures not owned by myself as that reduces supply for the datacores I produce. To enhance this competitive mechanism a bit, there are a number of possible tweaks that could apply to the production rates of each structures. This would give something akin to system cost indices with all sorts of interesting knobs that could apply. - Production reduced in systems/regions with lots of observation structures (encouraging destruction of neighboring observation structures) - Production increased in systems/regions with lots of observation structures (encouraging destruction of regional production zones and mutual protection of your own). - Certain types of datacores only being able to be produced in certain regions, allowing for groups to create monopolies over production of some datacore types. - User can select higher production rates but it makes their observation structure more visible to probing and more vulnerable to attack. - Datacore production is in long batches instead of short batches, meaning if you aren't able to protect your observation structure for at least X days, you'll get nothing at all. Similarly, make this configurable with long batches giving higher production.
Zeera Tomb-Raider Night Raven Task Force Eternal Pretorian Alliance 36	Posted - 2015.07.03 14:34:33 - [122] - Quote Spugg Galdon wrote: Datacore spawning is the only thing I don't really like. Although you're doing something to remove the invulnerable passive generation of datacores, making them spawn and be scoopable isn't a way to "Farm" or "Harvest" datacores. It doesn't even feel like gameplay. I've been thinking for a long while that datacores should be "mined". The way to do this would be to fly to a spatial anomaly or some kind of object in space and activate a type of (Hi Slot) analyser module on it. You would then harvest datacores (like mining gas or ore) by actually doing an activity in space. An activity that can be interdicted and disrupted. The funny thing is that some of these spatial anomalies already exist in game. Some systems have strange spatial anomalies that cause damage when you get too close. We also have other things that could be used for datacore mining. For example: Every system in EvE has a star. These stars are different colours. So, why shouldn't each colour of star allow for different Analysis/Research to be carried out to gather datacores (Plasma Physics and nuclear physics are examples from a star). Wormholes could produce graviton physics datacores when mined. (imagine people gathering around a WH to mine it!) There are so many possibilities all of which can be super sci-fi. There could also be a new range of ships with the specific role of gathering datacores. This would be in and of itself an entire feature gameplay Agree about the spawning of datacore.the rest not so mutch when it coms to datacore gathering that is,hear is a tred on it https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=topics&f=270.thers no reson to wait years for change to R&D missions they all redy have the tools ingame for what i suggest in this tred,shud take them less than a week to implement if they relly want to.
Zeera Tomb-Raider Night Raven Task Force Eternal Pretorian Alliance 36	Posted - 2015.07.03 14:46:56 - [123] - Quote CCP Ytterbium wrote: Hello people, We would like your feedback on the various new structure lines presented during Fanfest and on our latest structure blog. This particular thread is going to focus Assembly Arrays and Research Laboratories. Assembly Arrays focus on manufacturing of the numerous EVE Online items, ships, modules, structures, components and etc... used in-game. Research Laboratories are dedicated to blueprint research (ME, TE), blueprint copying, Tech II and Tech III blueprint invention, and datacore spawning. we dont need more structures like the current pos set up,its a nigthmare.fix the pos in to 1 command structure first, wher you install the rest of the moduls you want in to that structure. just as som Npc structures are build up you can target different moduls in the 1 linked structure
Allice AVATAR Aliastra Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2015.07.03 16:00:13 - [124] - Quote Remowing R&D agents relly,spawning system way not just remowe datacors from the game complitly then,and when your at it if you like to simplefye the game then dont be shye remowe all skills and rec for production as well no need to go step by step,will still need matrials to build,then you kan relocate the science SP so i kan be a faresom commbatt pilot to after yers of playing to,and when you do hove many million isk will you give me for all that hard work on getting standings with R&D agents on 6 toons.think i want som billions isk.grrr
Allice AVATAR Aliastra Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2015.07.03 16:28:52 - [125] - Quote Brutalis Furia wrote: Passive datacores? no. Any change that takes away a player activity is bad. It's as simple as that. I like the idea of creating a scientific version of ore sites. It's a way to shift the creation of these items away from passive NPC generation to active player involvement. I dont knowe about your production capebiletys but agree to no datacore spawning,but what you suggest is a nigthmare for serius industrialist,flying around hoping to find a site not all redy don, 10 times maybee 100 tims more time consuming and for maybee iven fare less value in time spent.basicly what you want will be for all others than a industrialist period.
Allice AVATAR Aliastra Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2015.07.03 16:48:02 - [126] - Quote Xindi Kraid wrote: Lurifax wrote: The passive income from the datacores is bad. We dont need passive income. Remove the agents and please no can that will give you free data cores. The data sites are bad enough as it is. So, where would datacores come from then if you removed the old method and not add a new one? Are you proposing they only come from the LP store? Also, industry pretty much IS about passive income as far as my view of it goes. Sure mining the resources yourself is active, and you need to set jobs and market orders, but everything beyond that happens in the background whether you are there or not. Moon goo and PI are also passive. You occasionally move stuff around, but the resources are collected in the background once everything's been set up properly, and there's nothing wrong with passive income, it just shouldn't be worth as much as active income. Also if you are saying passive income is bad, then how are data sites bad when they require you to actively search for and interact with? The only real problem is they don't really give a good number of datacores. i see you and a lott of others want us to hunt for datacors in space then we get a lott less time for mining or doing other things in game production as an industrial is time consuming as it is,what you all want is to shift the incom from the industrial player to explorer combat player,no rel industrial will sugest anything like this,i want time to do other things to.
Zeera Tomb-Raider Night Raven Task Force Eternal Pretorian Alliance 38	Posted - 2015.07.07 14:22:24 - [127] - Quote I relly like the fitting of station just as you fitt ships,but som worrys when you saye you will making more player involving and more player oriented combat for structures,no more hollydays do i need to live in the game 24/7 or klose to it to safly juse som of those new structurs,And are you relly going to remowe R&D Agents, if so will you give som compansation for all the houer in game we have spent getting standing with them,and i rely hate the ide of datacore spawning its like the mini game exploration cargo container spawning, so way go back to somthing like that,when you knowe hove mutch people wanted that remowed.ther probebly to mutch info in that link to comment on it all,think it been better to focus on what will be impemented first in stages.
Nortion Adoulin Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 4	Posted - 2015.07.09 13:55:10 - [128] - Quote DATA CORES ! You buy a expensive skill book spend time training it up while grinding standings so the agent dose not spit in your face when you try to speak to him. And you get to buy his probuct made to your specifications for your use at a discounted price. It works fine IT ANT BROKE DON'T FIX IT Go spent you time working on other things that are more important than this!
Susan Rhodan Birds of Steel Synergy of Steel 0	Posted - 2015.07.29 08:07:12 - [129] - Quote so... when is it time to deploy the new structures?
Nortion Adoulin Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 6	Posted - 2015.07.29 09:28:31 - [130] - Quote These changes are still in the planning stage so probably not until later 2016

Ulthanon Kaidos BOVRIL bOREers Mining CO-OP RAZOR Alliance 1	Posted - 2015.07.30 18:10:41 - [131] - Quote Research Labs Within the context of the goals CCP has stated for the structure overhaul, I think it is important to start by thematically differentiating what the sizes of RLs ought to do. The two sizes of Research structure lend themselves to varying lengths of deployment; Large Research Labs for transient purposes (1 day - 1 week) and Extra-large Research Labs for indefinite deployment. With this difference understood, we can now define further: LRLs are where raw data collection take place, and XLRLs are where data processing take place. Large Research Labs LRLs can be deployed most anywhere, and equipped through mods, rigs or service slots to begin generating research. Lets say this raw data that they collect takes the form of a new item, "Raw Data Files", and they correspond to the current Data Cores (Raw Data File: High Energy Physics, for example). They could also correspond to other research-based stuff such as Invention or Reactions. Regardless, these Files don't do anything on their own, however, but more on that in a bit. An LRL anchored in the middle of nowhere doesn't result in any Raw Data File production, even when equipped well. That is, 0 passive production when not near a Spacial Phenomenon (mentioned below). What is there to study in deep space? Boredom? Nah. For an LRL to be worth anything you have to anchor it near something cool and actively use it. Props to the dudes who beat me to it, since "celestial phenomina" has been talked about already, though I would alter the idea a little bit. Instead of just rolling up to, say, a Coronal Mass Ejection and studying it in your thermal-tanked Buzzard, dropping an LRL near such a celestial anom/sig would "open" the feature to study. A player could then "sit" in the LRL and use one of it's scanning arrays to "mine" the CME for Raw Data. Boom! The LRL's Raw Data File production is now awesome, since it's actually studying something. Players could chose to fit the LRL for tank/regen, to shield the LRL from the dangerous environments it would usually be deployed next to, or they could fit it for extra scanners, allowing them to risk the Lab's damage or destruction but buffings its Raw Data production rate even more. If you wanted to create synergy between the new structures, you could have these new Space Phenomina be detected by Observation Arrays. Just a thought. Players could also fly up in research scanner-fit ships and study the Phenomina once the LRL has "opened" it, though the LRL's scanners and specialized electronics would always yield the fastest generation of Raw Data. You know what, just for kicks, allow the Etana to have awesome research scaners. That should make for lulzy killmails on the subreddit. And finally, you could equip your LRL for passive, pilot-less Raw Data File production, but this would come with serious drawbacks. More in a moment. Anyhow, the LRL sits alongside this Phenomina and generates Raw Data as long as a player(s) are cycling its scanner(s), or if its fit for passive production. Raw Data Files are put into its cargo hold and are ready for delivery. Here's the catch, though: Passive Raw Data File production is way slower than actively sitting in it and cycling its scanners, AND the storage unit for Raw Data Files can be hacked open by a Data Analyzer. So if you can't be bothered to sit in your LRL, people can steal your notes. While attacking/entosising an LRL normally would warrant an alert being sent out to that structure's alliance, a CovOps hacking the LRL's Raw Data File storage would not elicit such a warning unless they failed their hack. And as with the OAs, you could devote some of your mods/rigs to anti-hacking defense... but, this capability would compete for the same slots as resist profiles, LRL weapons platforms, Raw Data production rates, etc etc. So, there's a real risk to just letting your stuff sit there, but it remains an option for the lazy (and a source of content for the eagle-eyed and enterprising). I might also support an addition that states, if the LRL is armed, those guns would not immediately auto-fire on neutral/enemy CovOps ships, though if the guns were manned at the time, the gunner could obviously taget the intruding CovOps manually. Again, we preserve the choice of afk gameplay but punish it severely since its totally lame. Extra-Large Research Labs So you've got your Raw Data Files and I didn't swing through your system and steal them, because you were good and didn't passive fit your LRL. You haul your RDFs back to your XLRL, which can now process them! XLRLs process the Raw Data Files into usable datacores, decryptors- and who knows, maybe even other cool stuff regarding the other structures. I could go on and on about all the sorts of cool stuff that Research Labs and OAs could do together, but I'll spare you my more wild flights of fancy. Back to the XLRLs. They could obviously be fit for efficiency buffs to processing your Raw Data, or bonus chances to get extra Optimized Decryptors, etc. Further upgrades could buff T2/T3 invention chances, better ME/TE/runs/copies stats on your T2/T3 BPCs Upgrades could replace the current IHub bonuses to a system's Data/Relic site spawning and actually cause these sigs to spawn in the proper system on a semi-regular basis. Alternately/additionally, an XLRL could influence all of the Data/Relic sites in a constellation, improving their loot tables. They could even increase the chances for Sleeper Sites or Covert Research Facilities in that constellation. [*] and finally, XLRLs could possibly improve the chances of Faction BPCs dropping from Escalation bosses in that system, or improve which Faction BPCs drop off of anom/sig Faction Spawns.
Nortion Adoulin Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 6	Posted - 2015.07.30 22:40:25 - [132] - Quote Well this kind of makes sense and looks a workable system although IGÇÖm not shore how it would fit in with the rest of what a lab is supposed to do as this only focuses on data core production. I would point out that this set up lends itself very well to giving the best sites and opportunities to Null sec and the big alliances that can secure interesting systems. While hi-sec gets bottom line sub standard crap so an equal opportunity is removed from the 70% of Eve players and the choice spots go to the 2% of the industry capable players in Null. CCP will probably implement it in full.
Barrogh Habalu Forever Winter Absolute Zero. 974	Posted - 2015.07.31 06:45:20 - [133] - Quote Nortion Adoulin wrote: While hi-sec gets bottom line sub standard crap so an equal opportunity is removed from the 70% of Eve players... I'm not sure what is that about. Pretty much everyone have equal opportunity to move somewhere where grass is greener. Also not sure where those numbers come from, but chances are they fail to account for people's farming/trading alts. Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
Ulthanon Kaidos BOVRIL bOREers Mining CO-OP RAZOR Alliance 3	Posted - 2015.08.01 20:39:07 - [134] - Quote Nortion Adoulin wrote: Well this kind of makes sense and looks a workable system although IGÇÖm not shore how it would fit in with the rest of what a lab is supposed to do as this only focuses on data core production. I would point out that this set up lends itself very well to giving the best sites and opportunities to Null sec and the big alliances that can secure interesting systems. Not really, who says these sorts of "Celestial Phenomina" wouldn't spawn in hisec? And this focuses on all sorts of other parts of industry, not just the new stuff- I just focused and expanded on the new things because they needed to be explained in full. These Phenomina could be transient, so that Solar Flare the "big alliances" are researching might only last a day or two. A science-based group would have to move around.
Aischa Montagne Blut-Klauen-Clan 9	Posted - 2015.08.16 22:51:55 - [135] - Quote I do not like the Datacore spawning, too. I would rather see the Datacores as rewards in NPC Missions. So you can obtain those by flying Missions or sites. (Please see my suggestion about Agent Offices too. I think those too Ideas would work nicely together) I think that gives the game more choice and activity.
Mercer Nen Summicron Holdings 8	Posted - 2015.08.18 20:22:52 - [136] - Quote CCP Ytterbium wrote: Hello people, We would like your feedback on the various new structure lines presented during Fanfest and on our latest structure blog. This particular thread is going to focus Assembly Arrays and Research Laboratories. Assembly Arrays focus on manufacturing of the numerous EVE Online items, ships, modules, structures, components and etc... used in-game. Research Laboratories are dedicated to blueprint research (ME, TE), blueprint copying, Tech II and Tech III blueprint invention, and datacore spawning. Don't really understand why the functionality of these structures has been predetermined to be so narrow. Is there really going to be no new "gameplay" associated with these? Giant photocopier in space? Really? Could we not be a little more imaginative? Thankfully my research job in real life is a lot more interesting than the science fiction version of it in EVE. Who knew playing a video game premised on thousands of years in the future would be more boring than current real life? :P In all seriousness, please take this opportunity with the addition of these new structures to also add new interesting elements to research. The current EVE definition of research is extremely blah.
Rawketsled Generic Corp Name 250	Posted - 2015.08.18 23:34:34 - [137] - Quote Mercer Nen wrote: In all seriousness, please take this opportunity with the addition of these new structures to also add new interesting elements to research. The current EVE definition of research is extremely blah. By all means actually suggest a few new interesting elements to research.
Mercer Nen Summicron Holdings 8	Posted - 2015.08.19 00:12:32 - [138] - Quote Rawketsled wrote: Mercer Nen wrote: In all seriousness, please take this opportunity with the addition of these new structures to also add new interesting elements to research. The current EVE definition of research is extremely blah. By all means actually suggest a few new interesting elements to research. It is a difficult one. Research certainly shouldn't be as passive as it currently is. At the same time also not the level of interaction as with the hacking mini-game. Duration wise, possibly somewhere closer to PI, but fun? If possible? It would also be great if it was a collaborative act where linking parallel research between players could also potentially generate interesting and profitable results. The only thing I can think of that would possibly be interesting would be similar to a tech tree in many other games. However, the individual elements (or stages) would be randomised to some degree. Linking different elements could lead to new combinations, or new elements. Some combinations would have good odds of modest results. The combinations that have lesser odds of success might be riskier to the extent that you might not get anything out of it, or you might get something considerably more valuable. What would you be researching? What would the "results" be? Better blueprints of course. But possibly researching better manufacturing tools as well? Implants? Higher risk research, if successful could leads to better quality implants with higher bonuses? Full disclosure, I have very little experience with industry in EVE, so where there are opportunities for research to have more of an interesting impact is a bit of mystery to me. However, CCP were willing to experiment with manufacturing crews (or whatever they were called), so it seems like there might be an open door for something to replace it.
Rawketsled Generic Corp Name 250	Posted - 2015.08.19 00:20:31 - [139] - Quote Your research had to result in the same outputs; T1, T2, and T3 BPCs for their respective uses, higher ME and/or TE BPOs. It's fine that you want to be able to invent an implant, but how does that invention process operate?
Marech Bhayanaka The Night Crew The Night Crew Alliance 48	Posted - 2015.08.19 02:48:23 - [140] - Quote Aischa Montagne wrote: I do not like the Datacore spawning, too. I would rather see the Datacores as rewards in NPC Missions. I'm not sure if you are suggesting new (additional) sources for data cores. The low payouts from data sites, which are often just ignored by explorers as a consequence, suggests that there are too many already. Marech.

Mercer Nen Summicron Holdings 11	Posted - 2015.08.30 18:07:33 - [141] - Quote Rawketsled wrote: It's fine that you want to be able to invent an implant, but how does that invention process operate? Here you go. How it might work.
Storm Aumer Vega Farscape 0	Posted - 2015.09.29 19:17:28 - [142] - Quote Mercer Nen wrote: Rawketsled wrote: Mercer Nen wrote: In all seriousness, please take this opportunity with the addition of these new structures to also add new interesting elements to research. The current EVE definition of research is extremely blah. By all means actually suggest a few new interesting elements to research. It is a difficult one. Research certainly shouldn't be as passive as it currently is. At the same time also not the level of interaction as with the hacking mini-game. Duration wise, possibly somewhere closer to PI, but fun? If possible? It would also be great if it was a collaborative act where linking parallel research between players could also potentially generate interesting and profitable results. The only thing I can think of that would possibly be interesting would be similar to a tech tree in many other games. However, the individual elements (or stages) would be randomised to some degree. Linking different elements could lead to new combinations, or new elements. Some combinations would have good odds of modest results. The combinations that have lesser odds of success might be riskier to the extent that you might not get anything out of it, or you might get something considerably more valuable. What would you be researching? What would the "results" be? Better blueprints of course. But possibly researching better manufacturing tools as well? Implants? Higher risk research, if successful could leads to better quality implants with higher bonuses? Full disclosure, I have very little experience with industry in EVE, so where there are opportunities for research to have more of an interesting impact is a bit of mystery to me. However, CCP were willing to experiment with manufacturing crews (or whatever they were called), so it seems like there might be an open door for something to replace it. you kant implement random value to industri,thats somthing no won in real life will want to handel,ther have to be som prediction of the out com,and making more valubal items in most casses mean the 1ns al redy in game lose value,this is a game so you kant implement invention as in real life,what you sugest is simply just adding more items to industry,and not for the industrialist.and it is al redy random output to som degre for invention and rewers engenering.
Storm Aumer Vega Farscape 0	Posted - 2015.09.29 19:30:38 - [143] - Quote Aischa Montagne wrote: I do not like the Datacore spawning, too. I would rather see the Datacores as rewards in NPC Missions. So you can obtain those by flying Missions or sites. (Please see my suggestion about Agent Offices too. I think those too Ideas would work nicely together) I think that gives the game more choice and activity. well you kan do R&D agent mission,But yes better if they upgrade those missions so they give som LP on a lvl with Distrebution missions,after all you need to train a lott more skills for lvl4 R&D than runing Distrebution mission lvl4.
Zockhandra Jewish Zeppelin Mafia 13	Posted - 2015.09.30 13:17:54 - [144] - Quote CCP Ytterbium wrote: Hello people, We would like your feedback on the various new structure lines presented during Fanfest and on our latest structure blog. This particular thread is going to focus Assembly Arrays and Research Laboratories. Assembly Arrays focus on manufacturing of the numerous EVE Online items, ships, modules, structures, components and etc... used in-game. Research Laboratories are dedicated to blueprint research (ME, TE), blueprint copying, Tech II and Tech III blueprint invention, and datacore spawning. Im confused, are these a complete replacement to the POS then? Many might argue that being able to deploy a base like this with these structures close together would be more interesting, but that also makes making industrial goods to them more dangerous. Why would players sacrifice the safety of a POS in order to go to a structure that is many times more expensive with the same result and No forcefield? I like the idea of moored ships being capturable, it adds an element of capture the flag to capital and supercapital ships should the structure be destroyed. But i see potential issues with these structures being allowed in highsec, Namely Jita. Is it wise to allow Jita's planets to have a Research/manufacturing outpost at each planet? When these get destroyed and people capture and moored ships/ resources will they get suspect status? Can the server handle 2000 people suddenly warping to planet 5 in order to loot 4 billion isk worth of invention materials or minerals? Now whilst that sitaution sounds very fun. It sounds like your changes are going to cause an aweful amount of chaos (not entirely a bad thing i might add) and a great deal of potential market upset.
Kenneth Fritz DND Industries FUBAR. 0	Posted - 2015.10.01 21:31:43 - [145] - Quote For myself, I would like to see there being more input/interaction requirements for the creation of datacores not less. The current system requires very little input from the player, the trade-off being that the process is fairly slow. So keeping in line with my own preferences I came up with an idea for how Datacore creation could be made GÇ£betterGÇ¥. Make the process similar to reverse engineering. In that you need an item upon which the research is to be conducted that is related to the field of research you wish to conduct. i.e. A frequency crystal for laser physic or blaster module for plasma physics. The itemGÇÖs quality and specificity in regards to the field of research would contribute the speed at which the research progresses. Other materials used could be the generic datacores you get from planetary interactions and well as the now obsolete R.Db.GÇÖs. These would be consumed with the creation of the target Datacore acting almost like fuel thus keeping in line with the whole modular structure fitting theyGÇÖve been discussing some of the other structures. The item that is used as the focus also has a chance to be consumed based on skills and time spent on the item. This setup would be fundamentally the same as the current but with some added components with the intent of making the player feel like there more a part of the research process. On a side note a mild random output modifier for each cycle could give the research project a bit more of an active feeling. This function would not activate every time but when it did it would not always be a good thing. An example for something good could be: GÇ£The project made great strides and has yielded some unexpected results.GÇ¥ The project this time yielded datacores for a field of research different from that of the target. The item would dictate which from which field based on which fields it can be used for. Or the more likely case would be additional units being produced this cycle. Now an example of could go bad would be the obvious less units produced. Other options would be item is consumed during the process. The chance of this happening increases the longer the same item it used without being switched out/repaired. Now if things went really bad: GÇ£The mainframe contracted a computer virus during our research and has compromised all the datacores for this stage of the research.GÇ¥ The normal amount of materials are still consumed but the cycle only produced a hand full of datacores. Who's your end of the world buddy?
Erasmus Grant High Flyers 27	Posted - 2015.10.25 08:53:15 - [146] - Quote I have started on the Caldari epic arc mission chain. I was wondering what would happen to the Hyasyoda Research Laboratory? Would it become a service mod or a unique structure?
Shadowace Evi CroGi 2	Posted - 2015.10.25 14:21:19 - [147] - Quote Do these really need to be their own structure and not just a service module? I can see capital assembly arrays being their own structure but for everything else it seems to be unnecessary.
Dreldor Local-Spike Unforgiving. 15	Posted - 2015.10.27 18:08:39 - [148] - Quote Looking at the build layout for the Citadel structures it seems that a Medium Citadel does not require components for: Station Factory Station Laboratory Station Mission Network Station Reprocessing Plant Structure Telescope Lens Structure Acceleration Coils Structure Advertisement Nexus. Does that mean that manufacturing, science, reprocessing etc are not available in a Medium Citadel?

CCP Ytterbium C C P C C P Alliance 4379	Posted - 2015.10.28 14:12:03 - [149] - Quote Removing sticky. Still want your feedback but we need room for other thread in this subforum. New pinned thread will be pointing to this one.

exiik Shardani Terpene Conglomerate 34	Posted - 2015.11.04 00:54:08 - [150] - Quote what about low sec specific structures like thukker component assembly array? remove and nerf low sec manufacturing after introducing citadels?



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