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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
88
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Posted - 2011.12.05 18:24:00 -
[31] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:The Implants of the people on the killmail should show up too so that when you get killed and the other guy had a slave/snake/crystal set you can blame it on that. Everyone within 10km of the destroyed ship should show up on the mail so bump ships get included also it should show the total SP of all involved parties.
Actually just include a full API of everyone in system at the time and we can assume that they were all conspiring together.
We already see the sp estimate in battleclinic.
You don't see how people fit their ships or their pods unless you kill them. It's pretty consistant.
As far as bumping ships you are desperately grasping at straws to support a bad position. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
136
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Posted - 2011.12.05 18:30:00 -
[32] - Quote
If you include fleet boosters on kill mails you're basically going to be giving out the structure of the fleet that blew you up. In a situation where you thought you were going into a 1v1 and got screwed that's vindicating for you but for a fleet engagement where you actually have a proper fleet set up so people are getting the correct bonuses a killmail like that becomes an incredibly powerful intelligence gathering tool.
As soon as you lose one ship you immidiately know who you need to shoot to remove fleet bonuses. Making killmails excessively detailed just pumps out free intel and you have no possible way of concealing it. |
Dradius Calvantia
Creative Cookie Procuring Rote Kapelle
155
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Posted - 2011.12.05 18:38:00 -
[33] - Quote
Quit being a KM ***** |
Lina Alar
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
17
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Posted - 2011.12.05 20:10:00 -
[34] - Quote
Comboduck wrote:COMPLETELY OFF TOPIC YOU NEED TO FOCUS "This is the tale of Captain Jack Sparrow..." |
Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
89
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Posted - 2011.12.05 20:18:00 -
[35] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:If you include fleet boosters on kill mails you're basically going to be giving out the structure of the fleet that blew you up. In a situation where you thought you were going into a 1v1 and got screwed that's vindicating for you but for a fleet engagement where you actually have a proper fleet set up so people are getting the correct bonuses a killmail like that becomes an incredibly powerful intelligence gathering tool.
As soon as you lose one ship you immidiately know who you need to shoot to remove fleet bonuses. Making killmails excessively detailed just pumps out free intel and you have no possible way of concealing it.
It will let you know who is off grid giving bonuses. Why should they be concealed and therefore completely immune from risk?
Loss mails obviously come at a price so it's not "free intel." Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Selinate
144
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Posted - 2011.12.05 20:20:00 -
[36] - Quote
XIRUSPHERE wrote:Sure thing, just as soon as they fix the problem of you guys not inheriting aggression session penalties and being able to dock and jump through gates while assisting people rendering logi nearly invincible on gate and station.
I thought they fixed this...?
Ahh well, i don't really use logi anyway... |
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
138
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Posted - 2011.12.05 20:26:00 -
[37] - Quote
They aren't completely immune from risk, you can find them by looking. What you're suggesting is that the game should just tell you the entire structure of the enemy fleet because a rifter got exploded. Showing who was giving a person bonuses would reveal who the squad commander, wing command and fleet booster of that fleet was the second a single killmail is generated regardless of what ship you lost.
How is it in any way appropriate to give away that kind of information to someone because they lost a ship? Getting blown up should not have that kind of benefit. |
Vertisce Soritenshi
Varion Galactic Tragedy.
230
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Posted - 2011.12.05 20:30:00 -
[38] - Quote
Comboduck wrote:XIRUSPHERE wrote:Sure thing, just as soon as they fix the problem of you guys not inheriting aggression session penalties and being able to dock and jump through gates while assisting people rendering logi nearly invincible on gate and station. COMPLETELY OFF TOPIC YOU NEED TO FOCUS
YOU NEED TO STOP YELLING!
What is a "thot"? Support our boobies!-áLINKY! |
Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
89
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Posted - 2011.12.05 20:42:00 -
[39] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:They aren't completely immune from risk, you can find them by looking. What you're suggesting is that the game should just tell you the entire structure of the enemy fleet because a rifter got exploded. Showing who was giving a person bonuses would reveal who the squad commander, wing command and fleet booster of that fleet was the second a single killmail is generated regardless of what ship you lost.
How is it in any way appropriate to give away that kind of information to someone because they lost a ship? Getting blown up should not have that kind of benefit.
The killmail of the rifter would not show the entire fleet unless the entire fleet assisted in the kill of the rifter. The killmail should give an accurate history of what happened, not an inaccurate one.
There is nothing inherently unfair about making killmails accurate. These things are really pretty obvious unless you have grown accustomed to hiding your neutral alts, in order to chest beat about inaccurate killmails.
Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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CCP Greyscale
C C P C C P Alliance
310
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Posted - 2011.12.05 20:55:00 -
[40] - Quote
Yes, they should. |
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Sadayiel
Inner Conflict
15
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Posted - 2011.12.05 21:20:00 -
[41] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Yes, they should.
So stop browsing forums and start fixing GOGOGOGOGOGO.
Lot of ppl will be grateful to you (around 99.9% of KM whores) |
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
138
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Posted - 2011.12.05 21:26:00 -
[42] - Quote
Cearain wrote:Vimsy Vortis wrote:They aren't completely immune from risk, you can find them by looking. What you're suggesting is that the game should just tell you the entire structure of the enemy fleet because a rifter got exploded. Showing who was giving a person bonuses would reveal who the squad commander, wing command and fleet booster of that fleet was the second a single killmail is generated regardless of what ship you lost.
How is it in any way appropriate to give away that kind of information to someone because they lost a ship? Getting blown up should not have that kind of benefit. The killmail of the rifter would not show the entire fleet unless the entire fleet assisted in the kill of the rifter. The killmail should give an accurate history of what happened, not an inaccurate one. There is nothing inherently unfair about making killmails accurate. These things are really pretty obvious unless you have grown accustomed to hiding your neutral alts, in order to chest beat about inaccurate killmails. Going from the fact that you apparently didn't understand what I was talking about you've never been in a fleet that had seperate squad, wing and fleet commanders or a fleet booster.
Also you can accuse me whatever you want, I have exactly one account. |
yumike
Eve of Madness
15
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Posted - 2011.12.05 21:30:00 -
[43] - Quote
Goose99 wrote:km should be removed. Problem solved.
What this guy said. |
Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
89
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Posted - 2011.12.05 21:50:00 -
[44] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:Cearain wrote:Vimsy Vortis wrote:They aren't completely immune from risk, you can find them by looking. What you're suggesting is that the game should just tell you the entire structure of the enemy fleet because a rifter got exploded. Showing who was giving a person bonuses would reveal who the squad commander, wing command and fleet booster of that fleet was the second a single killmail is generated regardless of what ship you lost.
How is it in any way appropriate to give away that kind of information to someone because they lost a ship? Getting blown up should not have that kind of benefit. The killmail of the rifter would not show the entire fleet unless the entire fleet assisted in the kill of the rifter. The killmail should give an accurate history of what happened, not an inaccurate one. There is nothing inherently unfair about making killmails accurate. These things are really pretty obvious unless you have grown accustomed to hiding your neutral alts, in order to chest beat about inaccurate killmails. Going from the fact that you apparently didn't understand what I was talking about you've never been in a fleet that had seperate squad, wing and fleet commanders or a fleet booster. Also you can accuse me whatever you want, I have exactly one account.
I have been in those fleets, and I still want killmails to be accurate. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Jarnis McPieksu
Aliastra Gallente Federation
74
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Posted - 2011.12.05 21:55:00 -
[45] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Yes, they should.
:makeitso.jpg:
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Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
138
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Posted - 2011.12.05 21:57:00 -
[46] - Quote
So when you get blown up you want everyone in space to know who your squad, wing and fleet commanders were? In the middle of a fight you want people to be able to know who to shoot so that your squad stops getting bonuses? |
Comboduck
TURN LEFT
28
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Posted - 2011.12.06 00:02:00 -
[47] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:So when you get blown up you want everyone in space to know who your squad, wing and fleet commanders were? In the middle of a fight you want people to be able to know who to shoot so that your squad stops getting bonuses?
this just doesn't make any sense at all |
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
339
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Posted - 2011.12.06 00:09:00 -
[48] - Quote
eve has killmails? a new bounty system for eve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=359105 You fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail to jump because you are cloaked |
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
140
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Posted - 2011.12.06 00:16:00 -
[49] - Quote
The hierarchical nature of fleet structures. If you get killmails telling you who was giving bonuses then as soon as you get a killmail during an engagement you know which person you have to kill to remove bonuses from at least an entire squad. |
Soma Khan
State War Academy Caldari State
10
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Posted - 2011.12.06 00:48:00 -
[50] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Yes, they should. hope that's a yes to both |
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Lord FunkyMunky
Intergalactic Syndicate Nulli Secunda
4
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Posted - 2011.12.06 01:06:00 -
[51] - Quote
i must say this needs to be a high priority, the server already knows the agression mechanics of those repping each other, so if i rep a person that gets on a km i should show on that km... this will both make logistics more popular, and also mean that logistics pilots can focus on logistics vs killmail whoring with a railgun just so that their ceo's and such know they are actually participating...
Yes this would mean logi pilots would be on almost all killmails.. but thats fine i don't fly logi, but they are the backbone of any major fleet they deserve to be shown. |
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
268
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Posted - 2011.12.06 01:17:00 -
[52] - Quote
So there will be a new breed of KM-hores with rep modules instead of weapons getting in on the kill without getting a GCC in high sec.
They'll call it "ninja killmailing".
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Soma Khan
State War Academy Caldari State
10
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Posted - 2011.12.06 01:27:00 -
[53] - Quote
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:So there will be a new breed of KM-hores with rep modules instead of weapons getting in on the kill without getting a GCC in high sec.
They'll call it "ninja killmailing".
you mean as opposed to km whores with a neut logi alt
wouldn't you say that needs fixing though? or would you rather just qq about it? |
Bubanni
SniggWaffe
39
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Posted - 2011.12.06 03:05:00 -
[54] - Quote
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:So there will be a new breed of KM-hores with rep modules instead of weapons getting in on the kill without getting a GCC in high sec.
They'll call it "ninja killmailing".
Nope... as second post said, remote repping guy should get same agression as the guy shooting... this includes GCC (which they already get you tard :))))))
Also +1 for adding logistics to killmails but add it together with the agression :) |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous
595
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Posted - 2011.12.06 03:28:00 -
[55] - Quote
I think this is a fantastic idea.
And yes, it's because I primarily fly Logi.
The fact is, while most of us who are experienced with Logi ship know when its safe to killmail ***** and when not to aggress, the point is that aggressing to get included on a killmail puts yourself and your fleet at risk. I think any existing situation that forces pilots to choose between safety for their fleet and some credit for a kill is a losing battle. Too many players go for the kill, and can screw their fleet over in the process.
Drones are risky, and really, drone bays on Logistics should be used for repair drones anyways. Adding Logistics to killmails would reduce the number of foolish moves in fleets, and ensure that Logistics pilots bring a that best supports their fleet, instead of a fit that exists just to obtain credit for being there. |
KrakizBad
Eve Defence Force Fatal Ascension
91
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Posted - 2011.12.06 03:37:00 -
[56] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:I think this is a fantastic idea.
And yes, it's because I primarily fly Logi.
The fact is, while most of us who are experienced with Logi ship know when its safe to killmail ***** and when not to aggress, the point is that aggressing to get included on a killmail puts yourself and your fleet at risk. I think any existing situation that forces pilots to choose between safety for their fleet and some credit for a kill is a losing battle. Too many players go for the kill, and can screw their fleet over in the process.
Drones are risky, and really, drone bays on Logistics should be used for repair drones anyways. Adding Logistics to killmails would reduce the number of foolish moves in fleets, and ensure that Logistics pilots bring a that best supports their fleet, instead of a fit that exists just to obtain credit for being there.
Really depends on the size of fleets you fly with. In major (300+) engagements, armor/shield drones do nothing. On the other hand, having every logi drop 5 EC-300's on opposing logi can make a huge difference.
For small engagements, a flight of 5 warriors can turn the tide as they assist interceptors wrecking opposing tackle and dealing fast DPS on gates.
It's all about using the right tool.
On the other hand I have to agree that having me show up on KM's without using a ***** gun, would mean I could add a 4th repper which would increase my effectiveness by something like 15% after cap is taken into account, so that would be good. http://dl.dropbox.com/u/39006524/DumbHiseccers.jpg |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1185
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Posted - 2011.12.06 03:49:00 -
[57] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Yes, they should.
It shouldn't because it would just be a pointless addition, solely existing to appease killboard padding mouthbreathers.
Although I suspect that anything that would fix broken empire RR mechanics would have the same effect so v0v |
KamikazeBrAzIl
Crimoria Co Vera Cruz Alliance
5
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Posted - 2011.12.06 04:12:00 -
[58] - Quote
NOPE
You should appear in your buddy's loss mail, to everyone see how you guardian were inefficient lol |
Hwong Jian
SniggWaffe
25
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Posted - 2011.12.06 04:56:00 -
[59] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:So when you get blown up you want everyone in space to know who your squad, wing and fleet commanders were? In the middle of a fight you want people to be able to know who to shoot so that your squad stops getting bonuses?
Quoting because pro-pvp'ers stop in the middle of a firefight to check lossmails. Nothing says "fighting a difficult battle" like stopping to scour killboards for real-time pvp information.
In other news, water is wet! And, idiots don't understand sarcasm! I bet you guys didn't know that. |
Jonathan Malcom
Test Alliance Please Ignore
11
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Posted - 2011.12.06 04:57:00 -
[60] - Quote
Andski wrote:CCP Greyscale wrote:Yes, they should. It shouldn't because it would just be a pointless addition, solely existing to appease killboard padding mouthbreathers. Although I suspect that anything that would fix broken empire RR mechanics would have the same effect so v0v
I disagree. I don't give two ***** about collecting killmails, but it would be nice to have some way to show fleet participation as a logi pilot. If someone can come up with a better way to accomplish that goal, fine by me. |
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