Quote:

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Phobos is the personification of fear and horror in Greek mythology. He is the son of Ares and Aphrodite. He, his brother Deimos, and the goddess Enyo accompany Ares into battle, along with his father's attendants, Trembling, Panic and other abstractions.

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Quote:

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Phobos is the larger and innermost of Mars' two moons

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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Reikoku took time to lay down another outpost in the F-TE1T solarsystem.

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Originally by: Szass Tam

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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Reikoku took time to lay down another outpost in the F-TE1T solarsystem.

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Congrats on the Outpost RKK :) (Made to build the loot whoring ships i hope ?)

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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One corp from ASCN took it upon themselves to try and beat us in a pos war in that system. They have failed after wasting countless billions on fuel and pos towers.

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Originally by: Shin Ra

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I thought BOB would have surrendered by now since revelations is now upon and us ascn magically are now uber.

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Originally by: Black Katana

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Not that I'm anybody, but didn't you guys say something about how you weren't going to do any "lame ass POS wars" or something to that effect?

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Originally by: Shin Ra

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I thought BOB would have surrendered by now since revelations is now upon and us ascn magically are now uber.

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Originally by: Black Katana

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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One corp from ASCN took it upon themselves to try and beat us in a pos war in that system. They have failed after wasting countless billions on fuel and pos towers.

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Not that I'm anybody, but didn't you guys say something about how you weren't going to do any "lame ass POS wars" or something to that effect?

After bashing the crap out of ASCN for like... what, two months, doesn't that show ur lieing?

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Originally by: Shin Ra

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I thought BOB would have surrendered by now since revelations is now upon and us ascn magically are now uber.

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Originally by: Shin Ra

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I thought BOB would have surrendered by now since revelations is now upon and us ascn magically are now uber.

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Originally by: Durvaul

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Good read, respectful yet, intimidating at the same time

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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cause phobos amongst the ASCN fleet.

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Originally by: Steel Rat

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Because for all your superiority, all our station systems still say AXIOM EMPIRE in the upper left hand corner.

Originally by: DB Preacher

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This outpost is a testiment to our industrial side that continues to thrive while we wage this war.

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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Sort out your alliance and start trying in this war or you may as well pack up and go back to empire and play the game on easy mode.

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Originally by: Evelyn Exe

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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Sort out your alliance and start trying in this war or you may as well pack up and go back to empire and play the game on easy mode.

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Funy because I would have thought that joining the most powerful and organised alliance in the game where everyone has over 25m SP, is a decent fighter and a dedicated player was playing the game on easy mode as no-one can give you any kind of real challenge?

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Originally by: Evelyn Exe

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Funy because I would have thought that joining the most powerful and organised alliance in the game where everyone has over 25m SP, is a decent fighter and a dedicated player was playing the game on easy mode as no-one can give you any kind of real challenge?

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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We don't take things easy, we play this game to win.

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Originally by: killerco

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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We don't take things easy, we play this game to win.

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No offence but nobody can win eve, not even BOB

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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Edited by: DB Preacher on 29/11/2006 14:28:41

Originally by: Evelyn Exe

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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Sort out your alliance and start trying in this war or you may as well pack up and go back to empire and play the game on easy mode.

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Funy because I would have thought that joining the most powerful and organised alliance in the game where everyone has over 25m SP, is a decent fighter and a dedicated player was playing the game on easy mode as no-one can give you any kind of real challenge?

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Only people who have never been in BoB say that being in BoB is playing on easy mode.

Playing on easy mode is sitting logging in a couple of times a week to check your skills, the market, do a little bit of npcing and mining and generally taking it easy.

We don't take things easy, we play this game to win.

You can't do that by taking things easy.

BoB did not suddenly spring up into what it is today, it took alot of hard work.

We will only continue to be number 1 if that hard work continues.

Like I said in the op, ASCN needs to look at itself, each and every member and decide if they want to stand up and do what it takes to beat us.

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Originally by: Buxaroo

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(and ASCN I think hasn't killed one BoB cap ship to date in this war if I recall correctly)

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Originally by: Evelyn Exe

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...everyone has over 25m SP, is a decent fighter and a dedicated player was playing the game on easy mode ...

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Quote:

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Hmm, I agree completely that skillpoints have really little to do with pvp in eve.

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Originally by: Farham

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Quote:

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Hmm, I agree completely that skillpoints have really little to do with pvp in eve.

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No offense but that is a load of crap.

If you have a 45 man fleet (hell make it 60) whose average SP is 10 mill or under going up against a 30 man group whose average SP is 15-20+ mill those SPs make a huge difference.

The undersized but highly skilled point characters could be a fully fitted HAC/Command Ship/Tech 2 BS gang because their skill points allow them access. The larger but under skilled gang has little choice in how it fits out against such ships. Tech 1 cruisers, tech 1 under fitted BSs etc..etc.

The smaller gang could shred the larger to pieces and could do it without using much in the way of tactics at all. Just toe to toe nearly insta poping the lesser skill pointed opponents.

Skill Points don't make FCs better and yes tactics plus game mechanics understanding is important to EvE PVP but Skill Points have a significant impact on EvE PVP.

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Quote:

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Do you think 60vs60 is the most common pvp in eve?

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Originally by: Evelyn Exe

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When was the last time BoB felt any fear of defeat or a real challenge? Not in the last couple of years I bet.

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Originally by: Farham

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Quote:

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Do you think 60vs60 is the most common pvp in eve?

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In terms of this thread and it having to do with BOB and ASCN? Not most common but very common, yes.

Crucifier, how often do you skip the Vaga and go for a tech 1 fitted Stabber or Rupture to do your ganking?

I mean, since skill points don't matter, wouldn't you be just as successful in a tech 1 cruiser fighting in the same low tech ships and fittings many of your under skill point opponents engage you in?

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Originally by: Omatje

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Wasn't it Thol's turn to post something?

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Originally by: Seleene

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Client - "You smash them."
MC - "Ooooh! Good! Like to smash!"

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Originally by: Tiwaz

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here is what i want a answer to..

fug said, that at a bob meet, you guys ran around naked in a forest, somewhere in belgium.

say it aint so

tiw

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Originally by: Kathar Narka

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reply

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Originally by: Takahashi Arran

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I hesitate to reply because i know you live for 7page threads..still
DBP, let me help you understand how to make this game a better place.
When you win, you say GF, you don't smack
When you lose, you say GF, you don't smack
you don't tell them how to play because that's their business not yours. (unless their cheating in which case you petition them.) if you gank them easily, well then maybe you should have chosen a different target for a fight.
Personally, I play the game to blow stuff up, according to your alliance you play the game to win.. in neither of these cases would a post like yours be designed to do anything except **** people off, with the release of Kali i would have expected some maturity and dignity from senior pilots given the influx of new players that will doubtless follow, personally the posts by you and cyvok (although he at least has realised that no good comes from these threads) over the course of this war have given me a thoughly negative view of both of your alliances and I would never consider joining either, I'm sure many more people have found the same thing. I don't expect an apology, i expect a smacky arrogant reply (if any) complete with the obligatory 3 DPB's to show everyone your a somebody. But, hey what does my opinion count for i'm only a right?

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Originally by: Max Teranous

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Originally by: Szass Tam

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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Reikoku took time to lay down another outpost in the F-TE1T solarsystem.

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Congrats on the Outpost RKK :) (Made to build the loot whoring ships i hope ?)

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How are RKK coping with the loss of a mid slot on all their ships? After all that Salvager I mod has got to go somewhere....

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Originally by: konkord

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Originally by: Evelyn Exe

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Originally by: Kathar Narka

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reply

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Thanks for the excellent reply Kathar, very well put.

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Is it a good reply? Well written yes but i wonder why ASCN was chosen as a target (an alliance not known for its combat backbone) over say 2 more capable, smaller target such as MC and someone else.

Why? because ASCN were ripe targets. Big enough not to get grief over 'bullying' and with a combatative/industrial pilot ratio that was sympathetic to an easy fight. I would have done the same, BoB, but dont think we were the only possible target.

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Originally by: Montaire

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This whole fight I cant get the idea of a gang of seniors in high school beating the snot out of the Chess team.

ASCN was an industrial alliance. They had 80% of their member base as 0.0 industrialists, and 20% as (somewhat swaggering) PVP'ers. They built some of the most amazing marvels of this game. The regions under their care are arguable the most developed 0.0 regions in the game. But the PVP'ers got a bit of a big head because they were the "Alpha" wolves of their alliance. They were (or so they thought) wolves among sheep.

Well in rolls BoB. Its the other way around, 80% hardcore PVP and 20% industry. Sure, that 20% is VERY good, no doubts there. They get ****ed at ASCN's swagger and go knock them down a few pegs. Well they've accomplished it - Paragon Soul is theirs and it looks as if meangingfull resistance has stopped.

Well no s--t sherlock BoB is winning. Its like the varsity wrestlers vs the chess team. Thats what we call "easy mode"

(My views, not that of my alliance, corp or friends)

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Originally by: Zimi Vlasic

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This is valid as long as you add in one other component:

The chess team started bullying the book club, the bible club, and went to other schools to bully their chess team. Then they constantly bragged about how good they were at chess and bullying. The wrestling team got wind of this and said "orly??" and decided to lay down the smack.

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Originally by: Velt Lhasar

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I guess its nice to have enough time on your hands to research greek mythology and find what what Mars' moons are called. Maybe dbp's life ambition was to be the guy doing the narration on the discovery channel

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Originally by: Montaire

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This whole fight I cant get the idea of a gang of seniors in high school beating the snot out of the Chess team.

ASCN was an industrial alliance. They had 80% of their member base as 0.0 industrialists, and 20% as (somewhat swaggering) PVP'ers. They built some of the most amazing marvels of this game. The regions under their care are arguable the most developed 0.0 regions in the game. But the PVP'ers got a bit of a big head because they were the "Alpha" wolves of their alliance. They were (or so they thought) wolves among sheep.

Well in rolls BoB. Its the other way around, 80% hardcore PVP and 20% industry. Sure, that 20% is VERY good, no doubts there. They get ****ed at ASCN's swagger and go knock them down a few pegs. Well they've accomplished it - Paragon Soul is theirs and it looks as if meangingfull resistance has stopped.

Well no s--t sherlock BoB is winning. Its like the varsity wrestlers vs the chess team. Thats what we call "easy mode"

(My views, not that of my alliance, corp or friends)

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Quote:

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You do know how ASCN 'acquired' Paragon Soul right? Your chess club managed to steam roll an entire alliance out of PS in a week.

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Originally by: Jackkal

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Easy to keep a industrial side going when its all slave corps. Lettting Boob go out bully people while they stay home safe and sound. I can remeber hearing your slaves crying not long ago because they were getting attacked and boob was not earning isk.

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Originally by: Frater Perdurabo

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Bob certainly are the best as playing to win and taking it very seriously...

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Originally by: Audrea

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Originally by: Crucifier

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Hmm, I agree completely that skillpoints have really little to do with pvp in eve.

And evelyn I believe i was the one that came up with joining bob is playing eve on easy mode . It wasn't easy to build bob, but ppl who join bob now are ppl who are looking for easy life with cheap hacs and not having to do anything. A more fitting word would be WANNABES, i respect the old members but ppl who join and think they become good just by joining bob are ghay.

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I think you made a big generalization there, and wrong one as well..

It has absolutly nothing to do with cheap hacs or whatever, but it has everything to do with alliance working togehter, and people willing to take T2 ships, and even faction BS, regardless of their cost.


Most players in eve would hesitate, either because of greed, or they dont believe in the common goal.

I think this is exactly the problem of ASCN - people are too selfish. The 3,000 miner alts dont give a ****, because they would just apply to another corp in rich region, and they would be wanted as highly skilled miners anyway.

And of course there is the FCing issue everyone already mentioned many times, so no point mentioning that.


All of that said, I am impressed their alliance numbers still hold at about 4,200.

Any bets when it goes below 4k?

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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This is your final warning.

Sort out your alliance and start trying in this war or you may as well pack up and go back to empire and play the game on easy mode.

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Originally by: Omeega

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We (aAa) could do this - did this?
*/me hands the DBP paycheck with the small note - Please bbq AXE*

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Originally by: Velt Lhasar

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Quote:

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You do know how ASCN 'acquired' Paragon Soul right? Your chess club managed to steam roll an entire alliance out of PS in a week.

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does that make your d!ck feel bigger? fighting a buff chess team? rofl

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Originally by: Velt Lhasar

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Quote:

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You do know how ASCN 'acquired' Paragon Soul right? Your chess club managed to steam roll an entire alliance out of PS in a week.

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does that make your d!ck feel bigger? fighting a buff chess team? rofl

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Originally by: Crucifier

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Edited by: Crucifier on 29/11/2006 20:26:32
I believe they are joining to be "the best" without having to work for it, to kill and claim they are the best without having to worry about things other alliances do.

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Originally by: Riley Craven

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Originally by: Crucifier

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Edited by: Crucifier on 29/11/2006 20:26:32
I believe they are joining to be "the best" without having to work for it, to kill and claim they are the best without having to worry about things other alliances do.

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First and foremost, dont make comments you cant back up.

You have no knowledge about how the Bob structure works, thus you have no ability to back this statement up.

Joining Bob is hard.

You either have to have a referral (i.e. known someone in bob long enough that can vouche for your character and your ability to kick ass)

or second prove that you can kick ass by constantly fighting us.

Further once you join if you dont measure up and meet your corp responsibilities your are booted. Simple is that.

It takes work to join, and to stay. I suggest you stop commenting on this issue without further proof to back up your theory.

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Originally by: Goberth Ludwig

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**** what happens to all those people whose self esteem doesnt depend on eve then?

Oh right, I'm asking in the wrong place

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Originally by: Kcel Chim

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Originally by: konkord

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Originally by: Evelyn Exe

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Originally by: Kathar Narka

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reply

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Thanks for the excellent reply Kathar, very well put.

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Is it a good reply? Well written yes but i wonder why ASCN was chosen as a target (an alliance not known for its combat backbone) over say 2 more capable, smaller target such as MC and someone else.

Why? because ASCN were ripe targets. Big enough not to get grief over 'bullying' and with a combatative/industrial pilot ratio that was sympathetic to an easy fight. I would have done the same, BoB, but dont think we were the only possible target.

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Thats why Ascn lost all its credibility. Youre whining you get attacked by a small pvp alliance and portray yourself as some poor industrial guy who just wants to dig the rocks.

Ascn was choosen because youre a) the biggest alliance memberwise in the game b) one of the supposed to be "titans" of eve c) throw your polticial weight around like a superpower d) act like a superpower when it comes to dealing with neighbours and "lesser beeings" (Cyvok still hasnt learned from the Xetic days it seems) and e) build outposts and titans and capital ships and gloat about it and your general wealthyness in public f) because your pvp is sooo weak (sarcasm) that youre constantly warring other neighbours (RA) or go on roadtrips North if youre bored or claim that you pulled the major weight in EC against trust...

Take all those points together and think again about the poor miner bloke who is just in an industrial alliance.... Doesnt match ? Thought so.

Cyvok gets schooled a second time in the same lesson he failed with Xetic at. If you dont have the muscles dont run your mouth / attract a beating.

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Originally by: Crucifier

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You are misunderstanding . Joining bob is harder than most other alliances&corps (not that hard tho really). And sure you need to work for beeing able to stay in bob, but the "work" consists of killing and participating in pvp ops, that isn't hard. Whats hard is fighting for your alliance's survival.

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Originally by: Napolean

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"Emphasize morale and minimize brute force, for the largest army is useless if it has lost
the will to fight. The morale is to the physical
as three is to one."

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Originally by: Eridu Fallen

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Upon closer inspection, that Caldari BS doesn't even look like it got hit with the ugly stick, it looks like it *is* the ugly stick.

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Originally by: Altar Mei

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..... hope ASCN can aleast make a fight of it.

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Originally by: Rolled

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I believe it would be a very short list of alliances who could go toe to toe with BoB for 2 months and still be fighting.

All the loud mouth outsiders should think a little on that. Could your Alliance last 2 months and still hold 2 regions against BoB?

Very short list indeed.

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Originally by: Rolled

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Originally by: Altar Mei

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..... hope ASCN can aleast make a fight of it.

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I believe it would be a very short list of alliances who could go toe to toe with BoB for 2 months and still be fighting.

All the loud mouth outsiders should think a little on that. Could your Alliance last 2 months and still hold 2 regions against BoB?

Very short list indeed.

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Originally by: Red Six

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Where is Admiral Goberius now?

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Originally by: Red Six

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Honestly, at this point, it feels more like we are fighting a bunch of corps that live in the same area than an alliance. It has felt like that for a while. I personally expected a tougher fight.

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Originally by: Revelatia

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Originally by: Red Six

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Where is Admiral Goberius now?

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Goberious left us due to finally having enough of butting his head against a wall trying to get the pvp situation in ASCN changed, or at the very least improved...

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Originally by: Revelatia

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Originally by: Red Six

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Honestly, at this point, it feels more like we are fighting a bunch of corps that live in the same area than an alliance. It has felt like that for a while. I personally expected a tougher fight.

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That's because it is exactly that. I would estimate that there is perhaps a maxiumum of 200 people that actually believe the alliance is an alliance, and hold an "alliance" viewpoint, the rest..... well, ISK farmers about sums it up, plus thousands of alts.

It's going to be sad to see it go, but it looks like that's what's going to happen... though some recent internal promotions could just make it a little more of a proper fight before the end.

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Originally by: Eridu Fallen

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Upon closer inspection, that Caldari BS doesn't even look like it got hit with the ugly stick, it looks like it *is* the ugly stick.

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Originally by: Red Six

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My question was rhetorical in nature to demonstrate my point but your answer does do a good job of explaining why one of the best pvpers ASCN had, left. I hope he is having fun with The Establishment. They are a solid corp and he should do well there.

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Originally by: KSUDruid

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When I was a junior in Highschool, I was on the wrestling team. We were pretty bad-ass dudes. I remember we challenged the basketball team to a game of basketball. We won. Our basketball team really sucked though and our wrestling team were 2 time defending state champions. I'm not sure the relevance of this story, but I wanted to participate somehow in this thread.

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Originally by: CYVOK

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If you surrender now we will consider letting you guys keep Fountain.

-CYVOK-

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Originally by: pershphanie

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Originally by: KSUDruid

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When I was a junior in Highschool, I was on the wrestling team. We were pretty bad-ass dudes. I remember we challenged the basketball team to a game of basketball. We won. Our basketball team really sucked though and our wrestling team were 2 time defending state champions. I'm not sure the relevance of this story, but I wanted to participate somehow in this thread.

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It's very relevant. wrestling = fighting, wrestling team = bob, basketball = industry, basketball team = ASCN.

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Originally by: Danari

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Dear bob,

Here is my critique on you as an alliance, since you like to critique us so much.

Stop dancing and bring it like you mean it. Because this past two months, it's been 1 part pvp, 2 parts dance and 4 parts forum smack. This can't really be the best you can do, can it?

Love, Danari.

PS: Skip the oh we will jr, you just wait & see. Just. ****in. BRING IT.

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Originally by: CRYVOK

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Others, like BoB, they play the game in a meaningless fasition, concerned with nothing but winning. We care about our friends.

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Originally by: Danari

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Dear bob,

Here is my critique on you as an alliance, since you like to critique us so much.

Stop dancing and bring it like you mean it. Because this past two months, it's been 1 part pvp, 2 parts dance and 4 parts forum smack. This can't really be the best you can do, can it?

Love, Danari.

PS: Skip the oh we will jr, you just wait & see. Just. ****in. BRING IT.

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Originally by: Kcel Chim

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Originally by: konkord

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Originally by: Evelyn Exe

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Originally by: Kathar Narka

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reply

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Thanks for the excellent reply Kathar, very well put.

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Is it a good reply? Well written yes but i wonder why ASCN was chosen as a target (an alliance not known for its combat backbone) over say 2 more capable, smaller target such as MC and someone else.

Why? because ASCN were ripe targets. Big enough not to get grief over 'bullying' and with a combatative/industrial pilot ratio that was sympathetic to an easy fight. I would have done the same, BoB, but dont think we were the only possible target.

---

Thats why Ascn lost all its credibility. Youre whining you get attacked by a small pvp alliance and portray yourself as some poor industrial guy who just wants to dig the rocks.

Ascn was choosen because youre a) the biggest alliance memberwise in the game b) one of the supposed to be "titans" of eve c) throw your polticial weight around like a superpower d) act like a superpower when it comes to dealing with neighbours and "lesser beeings" (Cyvok still hasnt learned from the Xetic days it seems) and e) build outposts and titans and capital ships and gloat about it and your general wealthyness in public f) because your pvp is sooo weak (sarcasm) that youre constantly warring other neighbours (RA) or go on roadtrips North if youre bored or claim that you pulled the major weight in EC against trust...

Take all those points together and think again about the poor miner bloke who is just in an industrial alliance.... Doesnt match ? Thought so.

Cyvok gets schooled a second time in the same lesson he failed with Xetic at. If you dont have the muscles dont run your mouth / attract a beating.

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Originally by: Shin Ra

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I thought BOB would have surrendered by now since revelations is now upon and us ascn magically are now uber.

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Originally by: Moghydin

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Now, ppl who want to play on easy mode join BoB, those who prefer challenges, stay in ASCN and fight.

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Originally by: Evelyn Exe

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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Edited by: DB Preacher on 29/11/2006 14:28:41

Originally by: Evelyn Exe

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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Sort out your alliance and start trying in this war or you may as well pack up and go back to empire and play the game on easy mode.

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Funy because I would have thought that joining the most powerful and organised alliance in the game where everyone has over 25m SP, is a decent fighter and a dedicated player was playing the game on easy mode as no-one can give you any kind of real challenge?

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Only people who have never been in BoB say that being in BoB is playing on easy mode.

Playing on easy mode is sitting logging in a couple of times a week to check your skills, the market, do a little bit of npcing and mining and generally taking it easy.

We don't take things easy, we play this game to win.

You can't do that by taking things easy.

BoB did not suddenly spring up into what it is today, it took alot of hard work.

We will only continue to be number 1 if that hard work continues.

Like I said in the op, ASCN needs to look at itself, each and every member and decide if they want to stand up and do what it takes to beat us.

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For those that started bob i bet it was a real challenge, but for all the newcomers it is playing on easy/i-win mode.

Log in, follow orders, score loads of kills against less well equipped/organised opponents, log out - what is hard about that?

When was the last time BoB felt any fear of defeat or a real challenge? Not in the last couple of years I bet.

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Originally by: Seleene

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What happens to all of the bravado and "Spin This" when AZN falls?

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Originally by: Seleene

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What happens to all of the bravado and "Spin This" when AZN falls?

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Originally by: Sorja

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....

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Originally by: Rebellion

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Edited by: Rebellion on 30/11/2006 00:11:30
ASCN's achievements are not trifling, and it took a lot of hard work to get where they are. They had the largest potential, but they fell short in adapting it to war. Don't begrudge them the recognition for achieving what many can't even do by saying that they weren't good anyway.

If ASCN is as weak and easy as some of you say, then which alliance do you think BoB should be fighting? Go on and tell us who we should be fighting, and I'll make a list.

Prior to this, many were raggig on BoB for being blue with the most powerful alliance in the game (ASCN), so in the interests of providing you selfish idlers with entertainment, we fight them now. How fast the tunes change.

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Originally by: Rebellion

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Prior to this, many were raggig on BoB for being blue with the most powerful alliance in the game (ASCN)

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Originally by: Moghydin

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Strange, BoB are talking about an easy mode. I remember there was a whole thread that was called "BoB = I win button". I don't remember what exactly was written there, but, moving out with a fleet with average sp per member at 30 mill, with fully equipped T2 gear, T2 cruisers and T2 battlecruisers (and actually getting all that at build cost) can hardly be called "a hard mode". Did I mention FC's with 3 years of PvP experience?

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Originally by: Red Six

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In BoB the majority see it as an alliance. The corps and members all have their own goals but they run in parallel with the common goal being to be the best. Players that don't share these goals and work well with the rest of the alliance are removed. The BoB corps and members work together towards this goal. Again, we are not perfect, but a **** sight better than any other alliance I've been in.

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Originally by: Crucifier

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but the "work" consists of killing and participating in pvp ops, that isn't hard.

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Originally by: travelingsales

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Originally by: Red Six

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In BoB the majority see it as an alliance. The corps and members all have their own goals but they run in parallel with the common goal being to be the best. Players that don't share these goals and work well with the rest of the alliance are removed. The BoB corps and members work together towards this goal. Again, we are not perfect, but a **** sight better than any other alliance I've been in.

---

I don't really know much about the inner workings of BoB or where your members come from, but in my opinion the single smartest thing BoB does is limit itself to a very small number of corporations. It is a lot harder for corp and alliance interests to diverge when each corp makes up 25% or so of the alliance. Having fewer corporations also means you can maximize your best leaders/CEO's by having them lead more people, and you have a small-to-zero chance of having a corp CEO go AWOL or otherwise not measure up.

I also think BoB's recruiting strategy has something to do with the esprit de corps. As I said, I am hypothesizing on the inner workings of BoB, but I think it's a reasonable assumption to say that most of your recruits these days have already had fairly long Eve careers with other corps and alliances. When they decide to join BoB, they are making a conscious decision to put their past as a small-corp CEO or whatever behind them, and dedicate their Eve play to BoB. Contrast this with a lot of other corps/alliances who accept newer players with less experience; the newer player may not really know what they want out of the game yet, may not know if alliance life is for them, may not have decided whether or not to move to 0.0, etc etc. I suspect BoB simply does not have those kinds of problems, whereas they are a large issue for most of the other alliances in the game.


A parting thought: someone mentioned that the way to get into BoB is either to have friends already in the alliance, or to fight tooth and nail and ultimately earn BoB's respect. It strikes me that in the long term this recruiting strategy tends to undermine potential BoB challengers by depriving them of experienced, high-SP PVP characters. I know it's not BoB's fault that people keep saying "yes" when presented with recruiting offers, but I think you guys are not helping yourselves find the challenge you say you crave by recruiting your opponents' best players into your own ranks. Not that I wouldn't do the same thing in your position of course! But I do think it's an interesting aspect of BoB's long-term effect on the game.

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Originally by: Yazoul Samaiel

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Originally by: Crucifier

---

but the "work" consists of killing and participating in pvp ops, that isn't hard.

---

Amusing tbh. If u dont think thats hard then why Cyvok's Blogs are all consisting of pleas to try and keep his memebers off the npcs and roid and staying on the front lines to fight us ???

Killing and participating in PVP ops is hard work coz u can stay for a long time waiting for a right moment to hit ur enemy or bait them or defening a pos . PVP in eve is not just running in gheybonds stabbed to death and doing lame ganks imo

---

Originally by: Shin Ra

---

Originally by: Seleene

---

What happens to all of the bravado and "Spin This" when AZN falls?

---

The smarter, non CLS hobbits will realise that they can become BOB-ZERO (all the flavour and roids of being in BOB, but with no mining quotas). After ascn looses 250 members because of BOB-ZERO, Blacklight will star in an all new late night commercial shown on Channel 5 at 4am about how BOB-ZERO can make you loose 250 members in under 3 weeks*.

Consequently, the rest of ASCN will want to get BOB-ZERO for themselves and all that will be left are a few loyal CLS members in AZN pirating BOB-ZERO becuase it gave them a toothache.

Shin Ra

*As part of a proper diet.

---

Originally by: Blacklight

---

I think Madeye and CRYVOK have delusions of adequacy!

---

Originally by: KSUDruid

---

When I was a junior in Highschool, I was on the wrestling team. We were pretty bad-ass dudes. I remember we challenged the basketball team to a game of basketball. We won. Our basketball team really sucked though and our wrestling team were 2 time defending state champions. I'm not sure the relevance of this story, but I wanted to participate somehow in this thread.

---

Originally by: Lag Fest

---

I couldn't agree more with u, being member of BoB for more than a year i had the chance experience the bobs inner workings. And i really got to say that Band of Brothers isn't just some cool name or something it really means what it says, simply a Band of Brothers having fun playing EvE. There are no "me-ppl" in BoB, "me-ppl" very often leave by themselfs or are shown the door, everyone see themselfs as part of something bigger, kinda as a part of very well operational machine.

But regarding BoBs recruitment tactics. You mention that they only recruit the best, doesn't that make sence, you said yourself that the case in ASCN is that you guys recruit alot of new and unexperienced players, but bob doesn't have the need to recruit unexperienced ppl, they have room for the well experienced and "we" kind of ppl.

---

Originally by: Crucifier

---

Hmm, I agree completely that skillpoints have really little to do with pvp in eve.

And evelyn I believe i was the one that came up with joining bob is playing eve on easy mode . It wasn't easy to build bob, but ppl who join bob now are ppl who are looking for easy life with cheap hacs and not having to do anything. A more fitting word would be WANNABES, i respect the old members but ppl who join and think they become good just by joining bob are ghay.

---

Originally by: Hellraiza666

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Originally by: Crucifier

---

Hmm, I agree completely that skillpoints have really little to do with pvp in eve.

And evelyn I believe i was the one that came up with joining bob is playing eve on easy mode . It wasn't easy to build bob, but ppl who join bob now are ppl who are looking for easy life with cheap hacs and not having to do anything. A more fitting word would be WANNABES, i respect the old members but ppl who join and think they become good just by joining bob are ghay.

---

Dont make me have to paste the chat logs of you wanting to join BoB.

Also BoB is on FUN mode, not easy mode.

---

Originally by: Evil Thug

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Originally by: Hellraiza666

---

Originally by: Crucifier

---

Hmm, I agree completely that skillpoints have really little to do with pvp in eve.

And evelyn I believe i was the one that came up with joining bob is playing eve on easy mode . It wasn't easy to build bob, but ppl who join bob now are ppl who are looking for easy life with cheap hacs and not having to do anything. A more fitting word would be WANNABES, i respect the old members but ppl who join and think they become good just by joining bob are ghay.

---

Dont make me have to paste the chat logs of you wanting to join BoB.

Also BoB is on FUN mode, not easy mode.

---

Don`t make me post fraps of kestrel killing your taranis 1v1

---

Originally by: Hellraiza666

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Originally by: Crucifier

---

Hmm, I agree completely that skillpoints have really little to do with pvp in eve.

And evelyn I believe i was the one that came up with joining bob is playing eve on easy mode . It wasn't easy to build bob, but ppl who join bob now are ppl who are looking for easy life with cheap hacs and not having to do anything. A more fitting word would be WANNABES, i respect the old members but ppl who join and think they become good just by joining bob are ghay.

---

Dont make me have to paste the chat logs of you wanting to join BoB.

Also BoB is on FUN mode, not easy mode.

---

Originally by: Crucifier

---

Hmm, I agree completely that skillpoints have really little to do with pvp in eve.

And evelyn I believe i was the one that came up with joining bob is playing eve on easy mode . It wasn't easy to build bob, but ppl who join bob now are ppl who are looking for easy life with cheap hacs and not having to do anything. A more fitting word would be WANNABES, i respect the old members but ppl who join and think they become good just by joining bob are ghay.

---

Originally by: Kin Hanyerec

---

Originally by: Crucifier

---

Hmm, I agree completely that skillpoints have really little to do with pvp in eve.

And evelyn I believe i was the one that came up with joining bob is playing eve on easy mode . It wasn't easy to build bob, but ppl who join bob now are ppl who are looking for easy life with cheap hacs and not having to do anything. A more fitting word would be WANNABES, i respect the old members but ppl who join and think they become good just by joining bob are ghay.

---

Life in bob is not easy : we are in a permanent war situation with major ops almost every day. Taking "easy life" while others are on the front line is not well seen and will make you kicked quickly.
I'm not very active, but every time i log in i help as much as i can in every possible way. I could have bought myself a nice navy apoc with officer stuff, but i bought a dreadnaught and a carrier instead. And if cant put them on the frontline i'll let someone else use them or use my account.
I live as a part of my alliance not as an individual pilot.

The "new" ones who kept their place in BoB earned it and doesnt deserve disrespect. They probably did more than me.

---

Originally by: Crucifier

---

Originally by: Kin Hanyerec

---

Originally by: Crucifier

---

Hmm, I agree completely that skillpoints have really little to do with pvp in eve.

And evelyn I believe i was the one that came up with joining bob is playing eve on easy mode . It wasn't easy to build bob, but ppl who join bob now are ppl who are looking for easy life with cheap hacs and not having to do anything. A more fitting word would be WANNABES, i respect the old members but ppl who join and think they become good just by joining bob are ghay.

---

Life in bob is not easy : we are in a permanent war situation with major ops almost every day. Taking "easy life" while others are on the front line is not well seen and will make you kicked quickly.
I'm not very active, but every time i log in i help as much as i can in every possible way. I could have bought myself a nice navy apoc with officer stuff, but i bought a dreadnaught and a carrier instead. And if cant put them on the frontline i'll let someone else use them or use my account.
I live as a part of my alliance not as an individual pilot.

The "new" ones who kept their place in BoB earned it and doesnt deserve disrespect. They probably did more than me.

---

You think i perceive npcing and mining as easy? Thats the hardest part, pvping without worries is the easy part mate.

---

Originally by: Hellraiza666

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Originally by: Crucifier

---

Originally by: Kin Hanyerec

---

Originally by: Crucifier

---

Hmm, I agree completely that skillpoints have really little to do with pvp in eve.

And evelyn I believe i was the one that came up with joining bob is playing eve on easy mode . It wasn't easy to build bob, but ppl who join bob now are ppl who are looking for easy life with cheap hacs and not having to do anything. A more fitting word would be WANNABES, i respect the old members but ppl who join and think they become good just by joining bob are ghay.

---

Life in bob is not easy : we are in a permanent war situation with major ops almost every day. Taking "easy life" while others are on the front line is not well seen and will make you kicked quickly.
I'm not very active, but every time i log in i help as much as i can in every possible way. I could have bought myself a nice navy apoc with officer stuff, but i bought a dreadnaught and a carrier instead. And if cant put them on the frontline i'll let someone else use them or use my account.
I live as a part of my alliance not as an individual pilot.

The "new" ones who kept their place in BoB earned it and doesnt deserve disrespect. They probably did more than me.

---

You think i perceive npcing and mining as easy? Thats the hardest part, pvping without worries is the easy part mate.

---

Therefore, you pvp on easy mode, i mean with the stabs riight?

---

Originally by: travelingsales

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Edited by: travelingsales on 30/11/2006 14:28:07

Originally by: Lag Fest

---

I couldn't agree more with u, being member of BoB for more than a year i had the chance experience the bobs inner workings. And i really got to say that Band of Brothers isn't just some cool name or something it really means what it says, simply a Band of Brothers having fun playing EvE. There are no "me-ppl" in BoB, "me-ppl" very often leave by themselfs or are shown the door, everyone see themselfs as part of something bigger, kinda as a part of very well operational machine.

But regarding BoBs recruitment tactics. You mention that they only recruit the best, doesn't that make sence, you said yourself that the case in ASCN is that you guys recruit alot of new and unexperienced players, but bob doesn't have the need to recruit unexperienced ppl, they have room for the well experienced and "we" kind of ppl.

---

I can't actually speak for ASCN recruiting on the whole, and if you read my post again I did not mean to do so. I don't really know anything about the recruiting practices of ASCN to be honest.

My point was not specific to ASCN in any case. The majority of corps/alliances in the game MUST recruit less experienced players if they want to grow. There are only so many experienced players in the game at any given time, and of those, the ones you really want on your side don't change corps/alliances that often. So if you are trying to build a corp/alliance to take on BoB, you have a couple of choices:

1) Recruit nubs/medium skill players and hope they blossom with time, and further hope they stick with you once they've blossomed.

2) Compete with established alliances and freelance corps for experienced players looking for new corps. BoB being the big one of course, but others have their own draw too: MC, Est, Burn Eden, ASCN, -A-, all have a certain "brand" if you will that lets them attract a certain kind of player.

3) buy lots of high-sp alts on the auction forum.

My point was that BoB right now has a fairly self-selecting group of recruits and probably wins the competition in option #2 more than their share of the time, especially where PVP centered characters are concerned. (ASCN probably wins it for mining-centered players ) I think this is due to BoB having a good structure for PVP success, not to mention telling everyone about it all the time.

Thus, anyone who wants to fight BoB has to take their recruiting "wins" in option #2 when they can, and take their chances with option #1 the rest of the time. To tie this back in with the current conflict, I suspect the portion of characters in ASCN who "grew up" in their current ASCN corp is probably higher than the percentage of BoB players who "grew up" in BoB, although I have no actual numbers to back this up.

In the long term, the facts above lead to it being much harder to build an entity able to take on BoB than it is to simply give in and join BoB. You are pulling from a wider pool of players than your opponent, many of whom will not be up to the task, and if you falter at any point, some of the players you've been grooming become potential BoB recruits.

This is where the "BoB is Easy Mode" line of argument comes from, and I submit that anyone who is looking for the biggest challenge in Eve should fight against BoB rather than joining them. This is not to say that BoB never faces a challenge, or never fights at a disadvantage. But based on everything I know about the game, I can't get past the notion that in general players in BoB face fewer challenges and difficulties than players outside it.

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Originally by: CRYVOK

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Others, like BoB, they play the game in a meaningless fasition, concerned with nothing but winning. We care about our friends.

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Originally by: ProphetGuru

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attitude>sp

Those deluding themselves into believing BoB has no low sp char's are looking for yet another excuse for poor performance.

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Originally by: Evelyn Exe

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But an experienced and dedicated character with 25m+ SP is more use than the same person with less SP simply because they are less able to use T2 mods.

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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Edited by: DB Preacher on 29/11/2006 12:36:24

There are two main definitions of Phobos.

Primarily, from mythology, the following:

Quote:

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Phobos is the personification of fear and horror in Greek mythology. He is the son of Ares and Aphrodite. He, his brother Deimos, and the goddess Enyo accompany Ares into battle, along with his father's attendants, Trembling, Panic and other abstractions.

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After closing Paragon Soul down, BoB paused to breath for a week. We used our smaller ships and roaming gangs to cause phobos amongst the ASCN fleet.

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Originally by: Dianabolic

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Hellraiza join IRC please.

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Originally by: ProphetGuru

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attitude>sp

Those deluding themselves into believing BoB has no low sp char's are looking for yet another excuse for poor performance.

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Originally by: Dianabolic

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Hellraiza join IRC please.

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Originally by: Omeega

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i have 1.4mil SP.

fo' ****zle.

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Originally by: ProphetGuru

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Edited by: ProphetGuru on 30/11/2006 18:21:00

Originally by: Evelyn Exe

---

But an experienced and dedicated character with 25m+ SP is more use than the same person with less SP simply because they are less able to use T2 mods.

---

This is where you fail.

Look, I certainly understand the logic of your argument, don't mis-interpet me. I just see it fundamentally different.

The point is, the mindset of applying usefullness to someone in your alliance based on anything other then the attitude and personality of said person is the difference between us and you. I place my isk on 1yr old BoB chars over a 3yr old xyz char, because they have killer instinct, and know that they already outclass xyz just by being BoB.

It's part of what makes us better then you.

It's a big part of the reason you are losing, and will continue to lose your space.

edit-format

---

Originally by: Evelyn Exe

---

So which would you take, a "BoB" person with 5m SP or a "BoB" person with 30m SP?

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Originally by: Seleene

---

Originally by: Evelyn Exe

---

So which would you take, a "BoB" person with 5m SP or a "BoB" person with 30m SP?

---

Since you seem so hung up on this issue, how many skill points do you think Farjung, formerly MC and now in BoB, has?

---

Originally by: Weebear

---

Originally by: Seleene

---

Originally by: Evelyn Exe

---

So which would you take, a "BoB" person with 5m SP or a "BoB" person with 30m SP?

---

Since you seem so hung up on this issue, how many skill points do you think Farjung, formerly MC and now in BoB, has?

---

800K

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Originally by: Evelyn Exe

---

So which would you take, a "BoB" person with 5m SP or a "BoB" person with 30m SP? You would take the latter because they are more flexible and because the greater number of SP wuold tend to suggest that they would haev more experience of the game and be moer self reliant in terms of isk and isk generating ability.

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Originally by: Shin Ra

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Just to reinforce this point.

I joined BE with 800k skillpoints, currently have 26 mil and still pwn Dr Caymus any day of the week.

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Originally by: Juan Andalusian

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Originally by: Shin Ra

---

Just to reinforce this point.

I joined BE with 800k skillpoints, currently have 26 mil and still pwn Dr Caymus any day of the week.

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I'd pay good isk to watch a Dr Caymus vs Shin Ra match.

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Originally by: DB Preacher

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Edited by: DB Preacher on 01/12/2006 10:47:42

Originally by: Evelyn Exe

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So which would you take, a "BoB" person with 5m SP or a "BoB" person with 30m SP? You would take the latter because they are more flexible and because the greater number of SP wuold tend to suggest that they would haev more experience of the game and be moer self reliant in terms of isk and isk generating ability.

---

No.

We would take the guy who fits in best with our ethos.

If we were only based on sp or looked to get the best sp players then we would miss out on some of the best players in the game.

I'm sorry but you are wrong, RKK have never based recruitment on how many sp a player has got.

If that were the case then we wouldn't have laughed off some of the peeps asking to join us just because they had 30m+ sp.

SP can be trained in this game over time but there as some human skills that are simply unique.

I don't know why you are arguing this point, perhaps you are looking for more excuses for you alliances failings.

You obviously have no clue about how we hire or how we play together as an alliance and are just saying stuff randomly based on your baised opinion of our alliance.

Either way, on this point, you are completely and utterly incorrect.

dbp

---

Originally by: Moghydin

---

Facts speak for themselves, BoB is the most elitist vet oriented alliance in game. And don't try to spin that as an attempt to justify anything. For me the better the opponent the better the challenge.

---

Originally by: Moghydin

---

It seems that BoB accepts new characters into its ranks May be there are e few relatively new guys in your alliance, but those seem to be exceptions (may be RL friends of some vets). When I see BoB in local, I sometimes open the char info and look at employment history. 75% approx. I see 2004 character, sometimes it's 2003, very rare I see 2005 chars. I know those who joined BoB out of my 1-st in-game alliance. All of them are FC's or PvP corp directors, who already were vets when I was a fresh n00b. Are you trying to prove that all those guys who roam around in command ships and HACs are noobs with 5 mill sp? Or those who use T2 large guns in fleet fights joined game 2 months ago?

Facts speak for themselves, BoB is the most elitist vet oriented alliance in game. And don't try to spin that as an attempt to justify anything. For me the better the opponent the better the challenge.

---

Originally by: Seleene

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Originally by: Evelyn Exe

---

So which would you take, a "BoB" person with 5m SP or a "BoB" person with 30m SP?

---

Since you seem so hung up on this issue, how many skill points do you think Farjung, formerly MC and now in BoB, has?

---

Originally by: Waagaa Ktlehr

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Originally by: Seleene

---

Originally by: Evelyn Exe

---

So which would you take, a "BoB" person with 5m SP or a "BoB" person with 30m SP?

---

Since you seem so hung up on this issue, how many skill points do you think Farjung, formerly MC and now in BoB, has?

---

I think Farjung was still training for a Taranis when he joined FRICK? :)

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Originally by: Seleene

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Client - "You smash them."
MC - "Ooooh! Good! Like to smash!"

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Originally by: Kcel Chim

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loyalty and discipline

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Originally by: Kaleeb

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Hey DBP I remember the dev post awhile ago about corps with the most sp's etc and I think Celes were 3rd. You mention there being an alliance ranking somewhere, can you link or list them pls?

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Originally by: Evelyn Exe

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When was the last time BoB felt any fear of defeat or a real challenge? Not in the last couple of years I bet.

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Originally by: Kcel Chim

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Originally by: konkord

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Originally by: Evelyn Exe

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Originally by: Kathar Narka

---

reply

---

Thanks for the excellent reply Kathar, very well put.

---

Is it a good reply? Well written yes but i wonder why ASCN was chosen as a target (an alliance not known for its combat backbone) over say 2 more capable, smaller target such as MC and someone else.

Why? because ASCN were ripe targets. Big enough not to get grief over 'bullying' and with a combatative/industrial pilot ratio that was sympathetic to an easy fight. I would have done the same, BoB, but dont think we were the only possible target.

---

Thats why Ascn lost all its credibility. Youre whining you get attacked by a small pvp alliance and portray yourself as some poor industrial guy who just wants to dig the rocks.

Ascn was choosen because youre a) the biggest alliance memberwise in the game b) one of the supposed to be "titans" of eve c) throw your polticial weight around like a superpower d) act like a superpower when it comes to dealing with neighbours and "lesser beeings" (Cyvok still hasnt learned from the Xetic days it seems) and e) build outposts and titans and capital ships and gloat about it and your general wealthyness in public f) because your pvp is sooo weak (sarcasm) that youre constantly warring other neighbours (RA) or go on roadtrips North if youre bored or claim that you pulled the major weight in EC against trust...

Take all those points together and think again about the poor miner bloke who is just in an industrial alliance.... Doesnt match ? Thought so.

Cyvok gets schooled a second time in the same lesson he failed with Xetic at. If you dont have the muscles dont run your mouth / attract a beating.

---

Originally by: HatePeace LoveWar

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Originally by: Kcel Chim

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Originally by: konkord

---

Originally by: Evelyn Exe

---

Originally by: Kathar Narka

---

reply

---

Thanks for the excellent reply Kathar, very well put.

---

Is it a good reply? Well written yes but i wonder why ASCN was chosen as a target (an alliance not known for its combat backbone) over say 2 more capable, smaller target such as MC and someone else.

Why? because ASCN were ripe targets. Big enough not to get grief over 'bullying' and with a combatative/industrial pilot ratio that was sympathetic to an easy fight. I would have done the same, BoB, but dont think we were the only possible target.

---

Thats why Ascn lost all its credibility. Youre whining you get attacked by a small pvp alliance and portray yourself as some poor industrial guy who just wants to dig the rocks.

Ascn was choosen because youre a) the biggest alliance memberwise in the game b) one of the supposed to be "titans" of eve c) throw your polticial weight around like a superpower d) act like a superpower when it comes to dealing with neighbours and "lesser beeings" (Cyvok still hasnt learned from the Xetic days it seems) and e) build outposts and titans and capital ships and gloat about it and your general wealthyness in public f) because your pvp is sooo weak (sarcasm) that youre constantly warring other neighbours (RA) or go on roadtrips North if youre bored or claim that you pulled the major weight in EC against trust...

Take all those points together and think again about the poor miner bloke who is just in an industrial alliance.... Doesnt match ? Thought so.

Cyvok gets schooled a second time in the same lesson he failed with Xetic at. If you dont have the muscles dont run your mouth / attract a beating.

---

Reminds me of your Planetarion smack Focht! :P

<3

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Originally by: Yeggstry

---

Focht?! :D /me waves

Long time no see, had a feeling you'd pop up in here :P

---

Originally by: DB Preacher

---

Edited by: DB Preacher on 01/12/2006 10:47:42

Originally by: Evelyn Exe

---

So which would you take, a "BoB" person with 5m SP or a "BoB" person with 30m SP? You would take the latter because they are more flexible and because the greater number of SP wuold tend to suggest that they would haev more experience of the game and be moer self reliant in terms of isk and isk generating ability.

---

No.

We would take the guy who fits in best with our ethos.

If we were only based on sp or looked to get the best sp players then we would miss out on some of the best players in the game.

I'm sorry but you are wrong, RKK have never based recruitment on how many sp a player has got.

If that were the case then we wouldn't have laughed off some of the peeps asking to join us just because they had 30m+ sp.

SP can be trained in this game over time but there as some human skills that are simply unique.

I don't know why you are arguing this point, perhaps you are looking for more excuses for you alliances failings.

You obviously have no clue about how we hire or how we play together as an alliance and are just saying stuff randomly based on your baised opinion of our alliance.

Either way, on this point, you are completely and utterly incorrect.

dbp

---

Originally by: Evelyn Exe

---

Does having a high number of SP help all other things being equal? Yes.

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Originally by: Crucifier

---

Originally by: Evelyn Exe

---

Does having a high number of SP help all other things being equal? Yes.

---

You should be a teacher or something.

---

Originally by: Evelyn Exe

---

If it was the same person behind it but he had a character with 30m SP and one with 5m you would take the character with 30m SP because he is more flexible in terms of ships and mods he can use. Why is there such an issue with agreeing with this?

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Originally by: Slowboat

---

You all want to show how big and bad you are and how lousy ASCN is doing? Well do it. Show em how well you would do.

---