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Eisprinzessin	Posted - 2007.10.01 11:11:00 - [61] i have tested a fitting for my alt char that is mostly tech 1 for skill reason that works really nice 8x 1200mm scout optical tracking computer, 3xhardener mission specific, 1x x-large c5l schield booster and heavy electrochemical cap booster with 800 2x power diagnostic 3x gyros only one rig so far a projektile tracking rig the tracking computer has a lot more tracking bonus than the enhancers and even the rig has 15% instead of 10. i did my first test in pirate slaoughter lvl4 and did not need a single booster charge and around 2600 rounds of fusion ammo. i have choosen the 1200mm guns for better tracking and double ammo space ( they fit 20 round of emp l instead of 10) they have the same fallof and only slightly less optimal when using emp. the dps is around 6% less than 1400mm but i think for ammo and tracking reason the 1200mm are better in missions.
Mudkest MetaForge Ekliptika	Posted - 2007.10.01 13:20:00 - [62] this is what I use for lvl4 8 1200mm arty scouts I think xl booster II, boost amp II, 3 hardners(usualy 1 inv and 2 specific) 1 painter 3 gyros 2 tracking enhancher rigs, 1 shield EM, 2 proj rigs(tihnk 1 fallof and 1 optimal) drones, 5 med 5 light(mission specific), 2 med and 1 light armor rep drone. the painter helps a lot in killing things(either frigates up to 80-90km away, cruisers tha are orbeting further out and also helps drones to kill frigates) armor rep drones are there to repair drones that have taken damage. seeing drone change in next patch where drones wont get shield recharged when scooping I think I'll bring 2 light armor and 3 light shield drones instead. for the rigs, I have proj rigging at 2, awu and shield upgrades4 and engineering 5. can also change one of the proj rigs for current router(+max grid), get some named shield stuffies, 3% cpu reduction for turrets implant, proj rigging, awu, shield upgrades 4 adn you should be able to fit full rack of 1400's II but will be very tight fit both cpu and grid ;) ----- GIEV custom ship paint jobs! I want my hello-kitty-kessie!
Garat Mant Minmatar Moons of Pluto	Posted - 2007.10.01 17:37:00 - [63] Edited by: Garat Mant on 01/10/2007 17:38:16 This is a "Low Skill" PvE fitting that still manages to cost an arm and a leg: Highs: 8 x 1200mm Artillery Cannon I with Phased Plasma L Mids: X-Large C5-L Emergency Shield Overload 'Copasetic' Particle Field Acceleration 3 x Rat-specific hardeners Large F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction Lows: 2 x Counterbalanced Weapon Mounts 2 x F-aQ Phase Code Tracking Subroutines Emergency Damage Control Drones: Ogre 1 x 2, Valkyrie II x 3 Warrior II x 4 (for frigates) Rigs: 2 x Semiconductor Memory Cell 1 x Projectile Metastasis Adjuster Which with my terrible skills gives me 302dp/s. Now, is it worth it to drop a hardener for a tracking computer or target painter? What about the rigs? (remember, no t2 stuff!) -G -- CEO, Moons Of Pluto industrial corporation. Contact us in game for ice/rock mining contracts and manufacturing.
Mr Noah x13	Posted - 2007.10.01 17:59:00 - [64] Edited by: Mr Noah on 01/10/2007 17:59:05 High: 8x 1400mm TII Mid: 1x Large shield booster TII 2x Shield booster amps TII 3x TII hardners Low: 3x Gyro TII 2x Cap Flux TII Rigs: 3x CCC TI DPS: 711 with faction EMP Shield boosted per sec: 651 DPS This setup is cap stable with my skills.
Mudkest MetaForge Ekliptika	Posted - 2007.10.02 17:41:00 - [65] Originally by: Garat Mant Edited by: Garat Mant on 01/10/2007 17:38:16 This is a "Low Skill" PvE fitting that still manages to cost an arm and a leg: <snip> Now, is it worth it to drop a hardener for a tracking computer or target painter? What about the rigs? (remember, no t2 stuff!) -G leave the hardners, drop the extender for tp or tc. if you want buffer then fit a cap recharger, will let you run shield booster longer wich helps more. Or cap battery, dont know if cap rechargers and rigs are stacking and if battery will help mroe in that case. rigs, shield EM resist rig are nice to plug that hole(like exp rigs are for armor tankers). Also, if you see a t2 fitting setup you can always replace those things with named stuff if you dont have skills(or fitting due to skills) for t2. Forgot to mention damage control in my setup post. realy nice module, shield resists on lowslot item(and added hull in case things go really terrebly wrong) usualy fit one in those missions where theres lots of incomming damage. usualy reaplace a tracking enhancher and keep 3 gyros though. Specialy if you fit a tracking comp ----- GIEV custom ship paint jobs! I want my hello-kitty-kessie!
Ciaphias	Posted - 2007.10.09 14:36:00 - [66] I love the maelstrom simply because of its amazing tank I sometimes need a ship that can deal Max Damage and Tank Max damage. ie. Sitting on a gate shooting some1 with gates and them hitting you. I use 8x 800mm Scout 1x Domination x large shield booster 1x Domination Shield booster amplifier 1x Em hardener II 1x Capacitor booster II 2x invulnerability Field II 2x Gyro tech II 3x PDS II Rigs 2x Shield Resitance rigs (i think i have 1 EM, 1 thermal) 1x Capacito control This Ship can tank like a absolute Muther ******. With the Faction gear and my BS level i think it reps approximatly 1300-1400 every 4 seconds. BTW like i said this is for a specific job. No Speed or Tackling gear.
Tidas Andrommeda Dudes In Crazy Killing Ships	Posted - 2007.10.09 14:45:00 - [67] Edited by: Tidas Andrommeda on 09/10/2007 14:54:53 As per the rigs, a Core Defense Capacitor Safe guard will do you much better cap wise than a CCC (just because the insane amount of cap a SB drains) My setup (vs sansha/blood so probably the hardest to shield tank) 8x 1200mm Prototype seiges 1x XL SB II 2x EM hardner II 2x Therm hardner II 1x Heavy Electrochemical cap booster (with 800s) 2x Gyro II 2x Tracking enh II 1x PDS II Drones: 7x Hammerhead II 6x Hobgoblin II Rigs: 2x Core Defense Cap Safe guard 1x Projectile ROF mod Edit: apparently F E G is a bad word?
Dinslan Minmatar	Posted - 2007.10.09 16:01:00 - [68] Originally by: Tidas Andrommeda As per the rigs, a Core Defense Capacitor Safe guard will do you much better cap wise than a CCC (just because the insane amount of cap a SB drains) Isn't that only true if you use a Cap booster rather than your Cap recharge rate as main source of Capacitor energy. Otherwise you are talking about a 10% decrease in usage versus a 17% increase in capacitor regen.
Tidas Andrommeda Dudes In Crazy Killing Ships	Posted - 2007.10.10 17:20:00 - [69] Originally by: Dinslan Originally by: Tidas Andrommeda As per the rigs, a Core Defense Capacitor Safe guard will do you much better cap wise than a CCC (just because the insane amount of cap a SB drains) Isn't that only true if you use a Cap booster rather than your Cap recharge rate as main source of Capacitor energy. Otherwise you are talking about a 10% decrease in usage versus a 17% increase in capacitor regen. As odd as it seems, no. The -10% x2 of the CDCS will give you better regen than a CCC. I did an EFT experiment and with nothing except an XL shield boost and the 4 hardeners on (aka the only cap drawing things on the entire setup), the ship could last 2min 45s running everything as opposed to 2min 27s with the CCCs. This may not seem like much, so another example: Using the setup above and the "all level V" skillset on EFT, I came up with these differences in cap usage (aka cap regen available - cap used) 2x CCC = 4.5 cap/s 2x CDCS = 9.7 cap/s Seeing as a booster is pretty much the only way to sustain a tank like this (unless you're using a less cap intensive setup eg. resistance amps vs hardeners or more capacitor mods vs damage mods)the higher "leftover" regen given by the 2x CDCS will mean that you use less booster charges and thus will be able to survive longer without warping out. This fit was tested against Sansha blockade and only had to warp out once. (I was dumb and forgot to turn my SB on and my shield got real low, which meant I had to run the SB for an extended period to get it to safe levels, thus eating up cap charges). All in all this is a good missioning setup for those who want to stay true to Minmatar heritage. (If you want a real missioning setup...use the Abaddon for Sansha/Blood and a Raven for anything else as those two are the true PvE pwnmobiles) As was stated earlier...without giving up damage/shield mods there is no real way to get your natural regen high enough to forgo the cap boosters (aka taking a gun away for nos, or a hardener for a cap recharger.) Also, lets not forget that the 15% of the CCC is being applied to an approximate 22 cap/s while the 10% of the CDCS is being applied to an approximate 72 cap/s. Effective boost to cap regen: 0.15 * 22 cap/s =~ 3.3 cap/s extra for one 0.10 * 72 cap/s =~ 7.2 cap/s extra for one If you're using a shield booster, this is about the only way to go no matter what your source of cap is.
Kelbesque Crystalis Minmatar	Posted - 2007.10.12 17:27:00 - [70] It seems that with this ship, you can either go with a pera tank with a LSBII, or go with an injected tank with a XL SBII, with little to no hope of being cap stable perma running the XL (withotu uber faction mods and gimping other aspects). Which ends up being better? Currently my shield skills are not top notch. Should I even both before I can use a XL SBII?
Tidas Andrommeda Dudes In Crazy Killing Ships	Posted - 2007.10.14 00:34:00 - [71] Originally by: Kelbesque Crystalis It seems that with this ship, you can either go with a pera tank with a LSBII, or go with an injected tank with a XL SBII, with little to no hope of being cap stable perma running the XL (withotu uber faction mods and gimping other aspects). Which ends up being better? Currently my shield skills are not top notch. Should I even both before I can use a XL SBII? Oh no. I used to tank L4s in a raven with a named XL SB before I could use T2. T2 isn't really necessary, it just makes everything a whole lot easier :P. However, I would reccommend staying away from the harder L4s (extraveganzas, blockade, pirate invasion, etc.) until you get a pretty much full t2 setup (not including guns). In some harder L4s, that jump from named -> T2 can really make all the difference in survival time. As for Permatank with a large SB, for the harder missions before I start popping the higher DPS ships I have to practically perma run my XL SB II : /. Summary: :: L4s are possible without T2 setups :: Stay away from the harder ones (especially EM shooting NPCs) until you get your skills up :: Permatanks aren't important in missions. Mainly being able to survive just long enough for you to pop those first 1-3 BS is a more important ability. (at this point DPS drops considerably and tanking should be much easier) Drop me an Eve-mail in game or private chat me and I'll be happy to help you out anytime I'm on :P THIS IS NOT A SIGNATURE! (Everyone's doing it...so I thought I might as well join in)
Merodda Minmatar Black Lotus Heavy Industries	Posted - 2007.10.14 23:42:00 - [72] I mission run a fair bit. Min Fleet level 4's generally, so you can guess the opponents. My Maelstrom is usually set up like this: High = 8 x 1400mm T2 (ammo varies) Medium = 1 x X-Large T2 shield booster, 2 x Invulnerability T2, 1 x Targeting Comp T2, 1 x Sensor Booster T2, 1 x Lif afterburner. Low = 1 x PDS 2, 2 x Gyro 2, 1 (named) Warp Core stabilizer, 1 x (Named ) Overdrive Rigs = 3 x Cap Rate increase T1 I know what you are thinking ... Why the WCS? <shrug> Everyone has an off day. On some occasions missions just don't go your way and the single WCS will mean the difference between a pod and a ship. And it's the only reason I have a Sensor booster. The overdrive is probably the most useful of all of these. With it I have a base speed that equals, or beats, most cruiser faction ship speeds (without AB or MWD) and can even compare to some of the frigates. Couple in the AB and I can maintain range or reduce closure rate by a considerable margin. And due to the Cap rigs I can keep the afterburner going indefinately. I rarely have to turn on my shield booster. The few times I do I generally only have to leave it run for 2-3 cycles, then I can turn it off again and not have to worry until the next area. I will not say this is the best out there, but it's a solid build that will let you survive just about any lvl 4 mission solo.
Slide	Posted - 2007.10.17 11:41:00 - [73] Hey Merodda, You say you are using tech 2 artil. and the ammo varies. i thought tech 2 guns had 2 sorts of ammo (long range and cap/speed eating short range) you swap between that or do you use regular ammo in the tech 2's and if so why, the scout version looks as a excact copy to me but cost less grid...or do i miss something?
Kelbesque Crystalis Minmatar	Posted - 2007.10.17 17:24:00 - [74] Originally by: Slide Hey Merodda, You say you are using tech 2 artil. and the ammo varies. i thought tech 2 guns had 2 sorts of ammo (long range and cap/speed eating short range) you swap between that or do you use regular ammo in the tech 2's and if so why, the scout version looks as a exact copy to me but cost less grid...or do i miss something? I missed this too for awhile: the large T2 artillery get a 2% damage boost per skill level of Large Artillery Spec. So at max skills, a T2 gun will do 10% more dmg than a 'scout', and use roughly 10% more grid. Note that AWU5 reduces grid usage of guns by 10%... coincidence, I think not. Also T2 guns also generally cost less than the scouts.
Kelbesque Crystalis Minmatar	Posted - 2007.10.17 17:51:00 - [75] Originally by: Tidas Andrommeda Originally by: Dinslan Originally by: Tidas Andrommeda As per the rigs, a Core Defense Capacitor Safe guard will do you much better cap wise than a CCC (just because the insane amount of cap a SB drains) Isn't that only true if you use a Cap booster rather than your Cap recharge rate as main source of Capacitor energy. Otherwise you are talking about a 10% decrease in usage versus a 17% increase in capacitor regen. As odd as it seems, no. The -10% x2 of the CDCS will give you better regen than a CCC. I did an EFT experiment and with nothing except an XL shield boost and the 4 hardeners on (aka the only cap drawing things on the entire setup), the ship could last 2min 45s running everything as opposed to 2min 27s with the CCCs. This may not seem like much, so another example: Using the setup above and the "all level V" skillset on EFT, I came up with these differences in cap usage (aka cap regen available - cap used) 2x CCC = 4.5 cap/s 2x CDCS = 9.7 cap/s Seeing as a booster is pretty much the only way to sustain a tank like this (unless you're using a less cap intensive setup eg. resistance amps vs hardeners or more capacitor mods vs damage mods)the higher "leftover" regen given by the 2x CDCS will mean that you use less booster charges and thus will be able to survive longer without warping out. This fit was tested against Sansha blockade and only had to warp out once. (I was dumb and forgot to turn my SB on and my shield got real low, which meant I had to run the SB for an extended period to get it to safe levels, thus eating up cap charges). All in all this is a good missioning setup for those who want to stay true to Minmatar heritage. (If you want a real missioning setup...use the Abaddon for Sansha/Blood and a Raven for anything else as those two are the true PvE pwnmobiles) As was stated earlier...without giving up damage/shield mods there is no real way to get your natural regen high enough to forgo the cap boosters (aka taking a gun away for nos, or a hardener for a cap recharger.) Also, lets not forget that the 15% of the CCC is being applied to an approximate 22 cap/s while the 10% of the CDCS is being applied to an approximate 72 cap/s. Effective boost to cap regen: 0.15 * 22 cap/s =~ 3.3 cap/s extra for one 0.10 * 72 cap/s =~ 7.2 cap/s extra for one If you're using a shield booster, this is about the only way to go no matter what your source of cap is. I had a long discussion w/ a corp mate last night on CCC's and CDC's. While I agree with your logic, and that the source of your cap does not matter per say. However, it relies on running your booster 100% of the time to realize the full gains, whereas your cap is always charging (although not at peak regen). If you only run the booster 25% of the time, you only realize 25% of the gains from a CDC. Not to mention that hards, AB's and other gear that you may be running other than your XLSB (which might be off) get no benefit. Not saying there isnt any merit in the CDC's, just that it is not cut and dry. I do realize that with a cap booster, you can effectively run a XLSBII permanently, but I doubt you need to given the number of people here that mission without them. You certainly don't want to use more charges than you have to.
Tidas Andrommeda Dudes In Crazy Killing Ships	Posted - 2007.10.17 18:47:00 - [76] Edited by: Tidas Andrommeda on 17/10/2007 18:48:11 Originally by: Kelbesque Crystalis Originally by: Tidas Andrommeda Originally by: Dinslan Originally by: Tidas Andrommeda blah blah stuff and stuff more blah blah stuff and stuff more and more blah blah stuff and stuff I had a long discussion w/ a corp mate last night on CCC's and CDC's. While I agree with your logic, and that the source of your cap does not matter per say. However, it relies on running your booster 100% of the time to realize the full gains, whereas your cap is always charging (although not at peak regen). If you only run the booster 25% of the time, you only realize 25% of the gains from a CDC. Not to mention that hards, AB's and other gear that you may be running other than your XLSB (which might be off) get no benefit. Not saying there isnt any merit in the CDC's, just that it is not cut and dry. I do realize that with a cap booster, you can effectively run a XLSBII permanently, but I doubt you need to given the number of people here that mission without them. You certainly don't want to use more charges than you have to. The only thing is that the CDC will help more with the "sniper" setups that don't rely on ABs etc where the only cap drain is the booster. It helps alot more at the beginning of a mission where you're getting hammered by everything and then some when you're SB actually does a lot of work. I agree that if you're using it for PvP or for smaller missions (aka NOT Pirate Invasion, Blockade, Extraveganzas, etc) that the CCC will help you way more. But for extended engagements, in a setup like mine where you rely solely on the pure power of the Artillery and the beast-like tanking ability of the Maelstrom, a CDC will help you survive past the heavier stuff for longer than the CCC will. And as far as cap boosters go, if you fiddle around with them for a bit and learn how to manage your cap effectivly (I fly Amarr from time to time, so I know what its like to have to micromanage your cap ), things like cap boosters can become an invaluable module in your high cap usage setup. Summary again cause I think I started making no sense : / - CCC > CDC for short/low DPS engagements; otherwise go CDC - You should make friends with cap boosters. If you use them right and learn how to tell the difference between a "good capacitor heavy" setup and a "I have to permarun my booster" setup you shouldn't have to use more than 10 charges (about 10-20k isk; if you're not making that much in your missions, you're doing something wrong)
Kelbesque Crystalis Minmatar	Posted - 2007.10.17 20:03:00 - [77] I agree when you need 100% booster utilization (such as the beginning of a tough mission and you are getting hammered), CDC all the way. I have one on my Mael. But I also have a CCC. Still undecided on the 3rd slot as I need more field experience.
Draghkar Minmatar	Posted - 2007.10.17 20:13:00 - [78] x8 800mm t2 ac's x1 t2 xl sb x1 t2 boost amp x2 t2 cap rechargers x2 t2 invuln x3 t2 gyro x2 t2 pdu 0.0 ratting it works fine, for missions i swap both cap rechargers for a Cap injector and t2 em.
Garat Mant Minmatar Moons of Pluto	Posted - 2007.10.23 15:00:00 - [79] Originally by: Mudkest leave the hardners, drop the extender for tp or tc. if you want buffer then fit a cap recharger, will let you run shield booster longer wich helps more. Or cap battery, dont know if cap rechargers and rigs are stacking and if battery will help mroe in that case. rigs, shield EM resist rig are nice to plug that hole(like exp rigs are for armor tankers). Also, if you see a t2 fitting setup you can always replace those things with named stuff if you dont have skills(or fitting due to skills) for t2. Forgot to mention damage control in my setup post. realy nice module, shield resists on lowslot item(and added hull in case things go really terrebly wrong) usualy fit one in those missions where theres lots of incomming damage. usualy reaplace a tracking enhancher and keep 3 gyros though. Specialy if you fit a tracking comp Yep. I discovered a lot of this after running a few level 4s for the first time. I have about 2 weeks worth of secondary gunnery skills to go but then I'll have them all at level 4 which will help a lot. I went with 3 CDC rigs, which drops the XL booster cap usage from 400 to 290ish - it makes a hell of a difference. For the mids I dropped the extender and went for XL C5-L booster, Heavy Electrochemical cap booster and 3 or 4 active hardeners. I haven't yet run rat-specific damage with 4 hardeners vs 3 hardeners + boost amplifier. I want to see if autocannons will work for level 4 missions, but at that point I'm using an afterburner as well, which is even more cap draining badness I guess at that point I'd have to drop the 2 Counterbalanced gyros and 2 Fourier tracking comps for cap power relays or PDUs. I love my arty's, but getting dropped in the middle of a group of rats is nasty to say the least. -G -- CEO, Moons Of Pluto industrial corporation. Recruiting mature players!
Kebbel	Posted - 2007.10.30 14:37:00 - [80] lvl 4 missions high 8x t2 1400mm Artillery med 1x AB LiF Fueled I Booster Rockets 2x t2 rat specific hardeners 1x t2 inv field 1x t2 Tracking Computer 1x t2 Large Shield Booster low 1x t2 PDS 3x Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer (LP shop the best!) 1x t2 Signal Amplifier rigs 3x CCC 100 km fight distance for fast frigs - 5x t2 light/medium drones no rewarp p.s. need some perfect skill for fitting
Johncrab Minmatar Typo Corp	Posted - 2007.10.30 15:33:00 - [81] Edited by: Johncrab on 30/10/2007 15:33:57 HIGH-SLOTS : ~~~~~~~~~~~~ 8x800mm Repeating Artillery II [60xBarrage L] MED-SLOTS : ~~~~~~~~~~~~ X-Large Shield Booster II Shield Boost Amplifier II 2xInvulnerability Field II Cap Recharger II Heavy Capacitor Booster II [5xCap Booster 800] LOW-SLOTS : ~~~~~~~~~~~~ 3xGyrostabilizer II 2xTracking Enhancer II RIG-SLOTS : ~~~~~~~~~~~~ 2xAnti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer I Don't even bother switching hardeners between mishs. Just go in, kill everything on sight and go out. Warp in point can be a problem if you get full agro but just start killing stuff and the dps will decrease fast.
Garat Mant Minmatar Moons of Pluto	Posted - 2007.10.30 17:15:00 - [82] Switched to dual 650mm scout autocannons with a 100MN Afterburner II for some missions: 8 x Dual 650mm "Scout" repeating artillery. (usually phased plasma) or 8 x 1200mm "Gallium" howitzers XL C5-L shield booster 3 x rat specific active hardeners 1 x 100MN Afterburner II or another hardener or a boost amplifier 1 x Heavy electrochemical cap booster with 200s or 400s 1 x T2 suitcase (Damage Control II) 3 x Counterbalanced Weapon Mounts 1 x Fourier Transform I tracking program 3 x Core Defence Capacitor Sa*uard 5 x Medium shield/armour repair bots for group missions 5 x Hammerhead, Valkyrie or Vespa IIs depending on damage requirements. Artillery does 320ish dps out to at least 60km. Autocannons do 470ish dps out to 24km. Drones add another 110ish dps with my poor skills. I've found the Maelstrom is definitely a gang ship. I can solo most level 4s in it, but they take forever. I usually stop and salvage each room in a deadspace mission because I know the wrecks will disappear before I'm done. The autocannon setup chews through most BSs very quickly, but you will get beat up fast if you can't manage aggro. The Maelstrom is certainly no Typhoon, I've found it difficult to catch some boss style BSs while managing my cap. I really want to love this Maelstrom, I really do. But its low speed and relatively low cap seem to cripple it. It rules with a little support though... -- CEO**, Moons Of Pluto industrial corporation. Recruiting mature players!
Fingalickin Minmatar ORB enterprises	Posted - 2007.11.08 15:05:00 - [83] Edited by: Fingalickin on 08/11/2007 15:06:25 May be repeating but my setup - flame as apropriate: Highs 5 x 1200mm II's 3 x Siege ML 'Arbalest' (May replace 1 Siege with Hvy NOS II when skills up) Mids XL Shiled Booster II, Shield Boost Amp II, Sig Boost Amp II, 1 x Invul II 2 x passive hardners (Mission specific) Lows 2 x Track enhance II, 2 x Gyro II 1 spare slot trying out Overdrive Injector II (Speed taken to 173m/s) or Inertial Stabiliser II Rigs Capacitor control x 3 Once Weapon upgrades to lvl 5 may be able to add PDU II to low instead of overdrive ?? Any comments? Pawns Lvl 3's. yet to try it out on lvl 4's "Veterans aren't worth catching, practice pratice practice and one day you may BEAT them!"
Kelbesque Crystalis Minmatar Eve University	Posted - 2007.11.08 18:18:00 - [84] Originally by: Fingalickin Edited by: Fingalickin on 08/11/2007 15:06:25 May be repeating but my setup - flame as apropriate: Highs 5 x 1200mm II's 3 x Siege ML 'Arbalest' (May replace 1 Siege with Hvy NOS II when skills up) Mids XL Shiled Booster II, Shield Boost Amp II, Sig Boost Amp II, 1 x Invul II 2 x passive hardners (Mission specific) Lows 2 x Track enhance II, 2 x Gyro II 1 spare slot trying out Overdrive Injector II (Speed taken to 173m/s) or Inertial Stabiliser II Rigs Capacitor control x 3 Once Weapon upgrades to lvl 5 may be able to add PDU II to low instead of overdrive ?? Any comments? Pawns Lvl 3's. yet to try it out on lvl 4's Passive hards are alot worse than active hards. The cap they use is greatly offset by the extra damage they reduce. Boost amps and Invuln are generally weaker than additional active hards, unless you need to omni tank. The boost amp because you need to boost by an additional 50% to archive the same results as reducing your dmg by 33%. The Invuln field is weaker than an active hard because while it provides resists on more than 1 type, stacking nerf will bite you in the tail. If you only need to tank 2 damage types, 2x primary and 1x secondary (76.6% primary, 55% secondary) will give you better resists than 1x invuln and 2x passives (52.5% to both). The cap usage is negligible next to a XLSBII. I personally opt to use an after burner, swapping out your overdrive with another gyro. I can hit 350m/s and can out run any level 4 BS. I also go for 8x 1200mm as the missile launchers dont get the RoF bonus.
Fingalickin Minmatar ORB enterprises	Posted - 2007.11.12 14:05:00 - [85] Originally by: Kelbesque Crystalis Originally by: Fingalickin Edited by: Fingalickin on 08/11/2007 15:06:25 May be repeating but my setup - flame as apropriate: Highs 5 x 1200mm II's 3 x Siege ML 'Arbalest' (May replace 1 Siege with Hvy NOS II when skills up) Mids XL Shiled Booster II, Shield Boost Amp II, Sig Boost Amp II, 1 x Invul II 2 x passive hardners (Mission specific) Lows 2 x Track enhance II, 2 x Gyro II 1 spare slot trying out Overdrive Injector II (Speed taken to 173m/s) or Inertial Stabiliser II Rigs Capacitor control x 3 Once Weapon upgrades to lvl 5 may be able to add PDU II to low instead of overdrive ?? Any comments? Pawns Lvl 3's. yet to try it out on lvl 4's Passive hards are alot worse than active hards. The cap they use is greatly offset by the extra damage they reduce. Boost amps and Invuln are generally weaker than additional active hards, unless you need to omni tank. The boost amp because you need to boost by an additional 50% to archive the same results as reducing your dmg by 33%. The Invuln field is weaker than an active hard because while it provides resists on more than 1 type, stacking nerf will bite you in the tail. If you only need to tank 2 damage types, 2x primary and 1x secondary (76.6% primary, 55% secondary) will give you better resists than 1x invuln and 2x passives (52.5% to both). The cap usage is negligible next to a XLSBII. I personally opt to use an after burner, swapping out your overdrive with another gyro. I can hit 350m/s and can out run any level 4 BS. I also go for 8x 1200mm as the missile launchers dont get the RoF bonus. So even with Shield compensation skills maxed, the active hardners are better than Invul + Passive hardners? I'll certainly have to re-think my setup in that case. Until i get drone skills a lot higher, can't depend on them to take out small fast fry (Frigs etc) so will prob still hang on to those couple of Sieg ML's for the moment. Must admit that having trained the shield compensation skills, I've not even looked at the active harnders - again another massive re-think. Thanks for the advice. "Veterans aren't worth catching, practice pratice practice and one day you may BEAT them!"
Kelbesque Crystalis Minmatar Eve University	Posted - 2007.11.12 23:24:00 - [86] Originally by: Fingalickin So even with Shield compensation skills maxed, the active hardners are better than Invul + Passive hardners? I'll certainly have to re-think my setup in that case. Until i get drone skills a lot higher, can't depend on them to take out small fast fry (Frigs etc) so will prob still hang on to those couple of Sieg ML's for the moment. Must admit that having trained the shield compensation skills, I've not even looked at the active harnders - again another massive re-think. Thanks for the advice. Max compensation skills (level 5) with a T2 passive hard gives less resists than a T1 active hard (46.875% vs 50%). The difference between those and T2 active hards is obviously much different. This also assumes you have a lvl5 in all the passive amps you use. There are obviously some cap benefits to passives, but shield comp skills aren't as useful as the armor ones since there is no passive omni tank module like the EANM for shield tanking. Get those drone skills up! Torps/cruises are not the best tool for taking out frigs anyway. I've never had a problem taking down frigs with medium drones once I got drone interfacing up to 3. Granted, my meds kill frigs and spider drones SLOWER than they kill destroyers and at the same speed as they kill cruisers.... but I am too lazy to swap them out.
Guillame Herschel Gallente Cheers Restaurant and Bar Coalition Of Empires	Posted - 2007.11.13 01:05:00 - [87] Edited by: Guillame Herschel on 13/11/2007 01:09:13 My Maelstrom tank is powered by 2x CCC, 1x Semiconductor Memory Cell, and 1x Cap Flux Coil II. I use the XL-SB II and Boost Amp II. Sometimes I drop the 100mn AB II and a hardener to fit sensor boosters (e.g. for The Blockade). I can fit 8 1200 Scouts and T2 hardeners, or 8 1200 II and Dread Guristas hardeners (on account of CPU). Both fits use 3x Gyro II. Kind of a toss-up which is better and/or cheaper. But I run missions in two different areas, so I have one of each. Tracking just isn't an issue for missions where you can easily fly a parallel course and reduce tracking to near zero. I smack BC and cruisers from point blank range, no problem. Long range missions are even easier, since a NPC flying towards you has no transversal. You can sit there like a lump^H^H^H^HRaven and splatter them as they head in. -- Guile can always trump hardware --
Fingalickin Minmatar ORB enterprises	Posted - 2007.11.13 12:36:00 - [88] Revised fit, thx to the advice here: High Still 5 x 1200mm II, 1 Diminishing power drain thingy, 2 x 'Arbalest' Siege ML Mid Cap Recharger II, Invul II, 2x Active Hardners, 1 x Boost Amp II 1 x Large SB II (CPU Issues until weapon upgrades lvl 5 on Thursday 15th) May intend swapping Invul II for another Active Hardner II depending on Mission Low 2 x Gyro II 2 x Track enhance II 1 x PDU II Total Capacitor 7958 with a recharge time of 402 Seconds XL-SB II boost amount was 1200 per cycle (With amp and skills) not sure what large will give me as only just got this fitted out last night and may all change once can fit XL back on. Yet to test it out to see how long Cap lasts, will see this evening. Hopefully difference between XL-SB II and Large SB II won't be that great as hopefully resists will reduce damage to even it out or make it better - fingers crossed. Thanks for all the advice here - I'd never have thought of active hardners at all until mentioned here. "Veterans aren't worth catching, practice pratice practice and one day you may BEAT them!"
Garat Mant Minmatar Moons of Pluto	Posted - 2007.11.13 14:01:00 - [89] Originally by: Fingalickin Low 2 x Gyro II 2 x Track enhance II 1 x PDU II Try testing it out with 3 x gyro II and 1 x damage control II (the t2 suitcase isn't stacking nerfed with other shield resists, afaik) I'd also be interested to hear just how well the large booster works vs the XL; with that cap I'm assuming you can permarun it. Also, try fitting a full rack of arty in the hi-slots. The siege launchers won't work well with a sniper fit in the upcoming update due to the torpedo changes. I rescind my former assertion - Maelstroms do in fact rule ;-) -- CEO, Moons Of Pluto industrial corporation. Recruiting mature players!
Newbie Ned Real Nice And Laidback Corporation	Posted - 2007.11.13 20:08:00 - [90] I am a reasonably experienced player (jack of all trades, definitely master of none) with plenty of SPs (>40 mil) and want to start doing lvl 4 kill missions - something I haven't done before. I fly minmatar so am assuming the Maelstrom is the best BS for missions - I have used a Tempest quite a bit, never tried a Mael. From my experience and reading here, I am thinking of this fitting: Hi: 8 x 1200 IIs Mid: 1 x XL domi shield boost (I came across it in my travels) 1 x SBA II 3 x rat specific active hardeners 1 x something else Lo: 2 x gyro II 1 x PDS II 1 x DC II 1 x something else Tech II med drones - maybe a webber ? Would lights be better for those nasty frigs? Rigs:ccc, cdcs(?) My specific questions are: In the mids I could have: AB - help maintain range so helps tank and gank, not to mention time to gates sensor boost type thingy - better gank against some/most targets Cap booster - better tank. What is the general concensus? In the los I could have: PDS - improves cap and shield so good for tank gyro - gank but having 3 starts to have an appreciable stacking penalty Overdrive - help with speed issue Tracking enhancer - help gank but is it really necessary if you manually minimise transversal? Again, what do you think? Lastly and perhaps most importantly, will I have a problem with any lvl 4s with this setup (all relevant skills at least lvl 4, mostly 5)?

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