Personal favorite is the Golem because of the consistency of killing speeds, please note I said consistency not out right speed.
For me BS are 4 vollies no matter where I am, maybe 5 for the elites. Mission partners Vargur, Paladin and Kronos can vary from a low of 3 to a high of 6 depending on which ship, which weapons, ammo they are using and which NPC we are fighting. Since I mission with friends in all 4 factions space on a consistent basis I value this consistency as it makes it easier and less confusing to transition from area to area.

On the other hand if you are going to mission primarily in just one factions space then I would agree with the others that the Vargur or Paladin are the better options. I never really liked the Kronos because of the shorter range of the weapons systems they can use, and yet that is precisely why my son likes his so much.

Addressing some of the oft stated reasons why the Golem is not a good choice.

Volley count is never an issue for targets that are closer than 80k to 85k give or take depending on bastion or not and to be honest about 80% of all NPC in mission are well within this range. At these ranges the missiles will hit target before your next cycle begins so no volley counting is required. At ranges over these then volley counting can become a thing if you care about a few extra minutes completion time, or care about a few ISK worth of extra missiles.

Micromanaging target painters, used to be a thing but that is all gone now. The Missiles Guidance Computers with precision scripts are a far better option than painters. Yes you give up a little in the signature radius side of the equation, but more than make up for it in the increased explosion velocity side and the smaller and faster the target the better they are.

Missile travel time. Can't fight that as it is simply the truth, but then it only matters to those with no patience or to those who get stressed out over an additional couple of minutes to complete a mission. Definitely a thing if you want to blitz.

Overall and based on experiences I would say choose the one you like best.
If you like missiles then go Golem.
If you like turrets then Paladin or Vargur.
If you like lasers then Paladin.
If you are like my son and prefer blasters then go Kronos.

Unless you use Polarized weapons (nad full clear/salvage/loot during mission), there's no real point in using a marauder over something like a Rattlesnake, Machariel, Nightmare, Navy Geddon/Apoc, Navy Raven, etc.

Um I hate to break this to you, but Polarize weapons on Marauders is FAIL. If you're going the class cannon route then it's best to use either ABCs or platinum insured T1 BSs.

I don't understand the vargur hype.

The point with the Marauders is that you can both do the mission and then loot and salvage at the same time

The point with the Marauders is that you can both do the mission and then loot and salvage at the same time. Sure the Machariel will probably do the missions a little faster, but if you takes into consideration that you can earn around 180-200 mill isk just in loot alone in the 5x 'Enemies Abound' level 4 missions, then the Vargur or whatever Marauders is a really good choice.

If you care about the isk in the missions, the Marauders are a good option for that. To be as effective with a Machariel, you have to use an alt on top of the Machariel that will do the looting and salvaging. So the Marauders are more like a ship that let's you do the missions with just 1 character over having to use 2 if you want to do the same with a Machariel.

I'm using a pretty well fitted Vargur myself right now doing level 4 missions (outside of a contract), and it's really good for that.

Maybe for others, but not for me. For me it was "f--- the enemy EWAR." Seriously, that's the only reason to use a marauder in the first place, is when being inconvenienced by various forms of EWAR just gets on your nerves or slows you down too much. This is a bigger problem with level 4's than 3's obviously, which is why people hail Machariel on Level 3's to be the best isk-maker around. Machariel's speed for blitzing + strength of autocannons + reduced instances of enemy EWAR to slow you down = bank.

I have hit over 200mill/h over the weekend blitzing with a machariel and cherry picking missions (around 1/3 of the total available missions) on a single character and have never ever had to use a mission pulling alt. A marauder will no longer be able to compete with a Mach since Rubicon.

I would like to see an explanation on how you are able to earn up to around 200 mill isk / h with a Machariel in a level 4 mission?

I would guess that you are just MWD'ing around to the wrecks and loots them while you kill the npcs or something?

Why? If there is one ship that can make best use of polarized weapons for missions then it's marauders.

- Can easily tank 500-1k dps with 0 resists using very few modules
- Has a large cargo hold to hold cap booster charges (for running ASBs or cap boosters)
- increased ROF of Polarized offset with reduced no of turrets/launchers
- 0 faction/bling modules required to tank any missions, reducing ganks to only ganking for tears
- 0 faction/bling modules required to get more DPS than nearly any other subcap (vindies have range issues) reducing gank to only ganking for tears.
- Omni tanks

They seem to be one of the single best ship classes in the game to run Polarized with and that goes for every one of the 4 marauders. What reasons can you give me for polarized being bad on Marauders? Am I missing something obvious?

Personally, I find that the Vargur is a good all-rounder, but you probably shouldn't discount the Paladin. Despite what diehard EFT warriors say, the lack of damage type isn't always a major problem (except vs. Angels, perhaps), and it performs quite acceptably in most mission scenarios.

Either you're very skilled at avoiding taking hits or very lucky. I just can't fathom why anyone would use Polarize weaponry on Marauders that lowers armor/shield resist to 0 across the board even if they try to fit some resist modes or use Bastion. I'm pretty sure you're the only one using these on Marauders.

Ok, so let me spell it out for you since checking the info on the vargur hull and the bastion module is a little too much for you.

Vargur hull has 7.5% shield boost amount per lv. Realistically we'd be looking at lv4 marauders 90% of the time. That's a 30%-37.5% bonus to shield boost. Now lets look at the bastion module. 100% shield boost.

Awesome so according to EFT a pith c-type XL goes from doing 726 boost on a machariel at all V to 1996.5 boost on the vargur at all V.

That means the Machariel with just the shield booster fitted gets a omni tank of 272 (huge EM hole doesnt help) vs the Vargur having a omni tank of 514. With an invul on the mach and a single amp on the vargur it goes to 388 and 671 respectively. You get even better results running ASBs (one large and one XL on the vargur with no amps gives 822 dps omni tank)

You getting the picture yet?

Math, how does it even.

And YES those tank numbers are with 0 resists on the vargur and normal resists on the Mach.

I've already check the numbers from the first time you suggested Polarize weapons on the Marauders. Once I saw the 0 resist profile across the board even after fitting resist mods + bastion, I stopped the inquiry. But to each their own I guess. Good luck avoiding getting suicided by a couple of T1 Dessies.

People think I am crazy when I state that there is no such thing as "the best" ship for level 4 missions.
This whole crazy debate about polarized weapons brings me back to this and thank you for proving my point.

People think I am crazy when I state that there is no such thing as "the best" ship for level 4 missions.

Unless you use Polarized weapons (nad full clear/salvage/loot during mission), there's no real point in using a marauder over something like a Rattlesnake, Machariel, Nightmare, Navy Geddon/Apoc, Navy Raven, etc.

Saying there is no point is quite off base. Golem has better potential damage application than a NRaven, Paladin makes a better MJD ship than either the NM or NApoc/Geddon, and even without an MJD allows for greater damage at range with the optimal bonus than the NM with the same gun damage potential.

Mach is the blitz king and the RS the DPS king, though again it comes down to the reason for choosing the ship. As a full clear pilot I'm willing to give up some speed/DPS to not have to deal with TDs/SDs/ECM on top of having greater MJD feasibility and range.

Not really. You do full clear and you use a marauder, ergo I'm right.

Unless there is some unstated qualifier to the words "no real point," no, you are not. There are situations where, yes, there is a point.

Edit: Reading fail on my part, read "nad" as "not" rather than "and" as probably intended. Feel free to disregard.

no real point = there are better ships for the same task

NM/NApoc/NGeddon aren't really better for the task than a paladin. NRaven isn't better for the task than a Golem. Most of the ships you listed don't support your point.

Well I used to use both the NM and Paladin because I thought on some missions that the NM was better. But after finally getting the hang of using the MJD properly, I'm thinking of selling my NMs. And no I don't or will I ever use Polarize weapons on my Paladins.

So blitzing is out - and it's no longer setup for thoroughly clearing missions, either. But hey, whatever...

Why would you use a Marauder for blitzing? Completely pointless use of the hull; there are far better choices.

There's zero point in utilizing Polarized weapons (and yes, I have utilized them on a number of hulls - including cruisers, T3s and Marauders). They're doable - it's just a question of whether the small gains outweigh the huge costs.

For starters, the requirements to have several damage application modules hasn't changed - because Polarized weapons just offer a faster rate of fire and more ammo capacity. On the Palladin, Marauder and Kronos this will typically be several tracking computers or tracking enhancers. On the Marauder it will not only be a pair of target painters and/or missile guidance computers but also hydraulic rigs to extend range (this is because Javelin torpedoes do about the same damage as Fury cruise missiles, with less range and application). Second, you've totally gimped your EHP and tank (two Tornadoes can now gank you), and most of your cargo will consist of Navy 400/800 Cap Boosters to feed either the ancillary x-large shield boosters or heavy capacitor boosters to run armor repairers. Third, since Bastion is now a requirement to tank even average L4s - the level of mobility through a MJD is considerably diminished. You also won't be able to 'shoot and loot' since you won't have any excess cargo capacity. And last but not least your Marauder is going to be incredibly slow because you'll have to sacrifice things like propulsion modules and warp rigs in favor of capacitor rechargers and rigs. So blitzing is out - and it's no longer setup for thoroughly clearing missions, either. But hey, whatever...