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Free Trade Zone : 1V-LI2 Round

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 2 post(s)
putukas Enterprise Estonia Cult of War	Posted - 2007.03.01 06:18:00 - [61] haha, very nice... we have a new place to kill carebears, weeeee \o/ More t2 spawns, More mining ops. Join the party boys :) cool to see section XIII in action again, havent seen you guys for long time. Had good fun fighting you on V vs RA war.
Faith Black Minmatar Rolls Roids	Posted - 2007.03.01 06:31:00 - [62] Originally by: Blitter As stated Goonswarm will be opening 7-K, SP, Detorid, Tenerifis, and Omist to the FTZ as soon as possible. Our guests will have unrestricted access across 5 regions. Looks like I need to defend my ratting system in 7-k in the future. ------ No.1 reason to post with an alt: Avoiding that your main looks too silly.
Tab'Fren TBC Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.01 06:46:00 - [63] Originally by: Nathan Grey Like ISS, might last 9-12 months. I don't have any information about the long-term plans for the FTZ and I can't speak for my corp/alliance... but as long as it allows me to earn some isk to buy the ammo/ships to fuel the war and kick BoD in the junk, then it's All Good(tm). :P
fuze Gallente Chosen Path Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2007.03.01 07:10:00 - [64] Originally by: Zoltaris So, it might be a good thing that many small corporation join under the same banner, maybe something like "NAC" (Non-Aligned Corps) and might not be a real alliance as such, but just a bunch of small corps that wants to get some standings where it wouln't be possible otherwise. How about the Alliance of Freeloaders? This isn't CFS v2.0 but will cause the same havoc as it did to CFS. But yeah, I like it. Nice plan!
Vile rat GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.03.01 07:13:00 - [65] Originally by: fuze Originally by: Zoltaris So, it might be a good thing that many small corporation join under the same banner, maybe something like "NAC" (Non-Aligned Corps) and might not be a real alliance as such, but just a bunch of small corps that wants to get some standings where it wouln't be possible otherwise. How about the Alliance of Freeloaders? This isn't CFS v2.0 but will cause the same havoc as it did to CFS. But yeah, I like it. Nice plan! Be a dear and offline the rest of the POS's for us. Thanks!
Academion GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.03.01 07:51:00 - [66] Originally by: Karrimdra So what you really want, is for people to come in, start chaining the belts for you, then come in when its done even while they pay ref taxes (to keep your pos'es running), pay for production fee's (to keep your pses running) and use the market which, if you've done it right will be good and make your isk, to keep your posses running. Anyone else see a pattern here? GS in need of isk to keep their "rapetrain" going, hence pawning off their problem as a "lets be nice to everyone who could already use, and knew about our stations already, but lets recruit yet more nubs in to help keep our fragile bandwagon rolling". Or is that too cynical a view? Kudos to IAC who actually seem to have the right mindset for an FTZ (i almost typed FTW :\|). We just want our resources to be exploited to their maximum potential. Our terms are hardly unreasonable. If we were truly greedy we could simply rent out our space for several billion isk per month to slave alliances.
Ponderous Thunderstroke Minmatar Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2007.03.01 07:54:00 - [67] Nice idea. I don't know if my corp or alliance is in any position to want to take advantage of it, that's the business of the important people above my paygrade. But I think it's conceptually a great idea and I applaud the Goons for taking this chance. Depending on how well security is enforced and offenders are ejected, this should provide a strong economy boost for everyone involved. Stability and lucrative opportunities = good for business.
Swift Wind 6rasshopper Inc.	Posted - 2007.03.01 08:10:00 - [68] Originally by: Academion We just want our resources to be exploited to their maximum potential. Our terms are hardly unreasonable. If we were truly greedy we could simply rent out our space for several billion isk per month to slave alliances. But dont you see the flaw in that? The small corps that would dedicate a bunch of time and energy to support your aliance thru the FTZ will be prevented from doing so. Do you think a small, yet strong indy corp is going to risk load after load to help your markets, if they risk losing EVERY load? I iunderstand your intentions, but your only going 1/2 way. What ever the reasons (corp cap) your alienating a vast majority that would help you. I do what little i can for IAC just because of their hospilitaty, and i have paid dearly due to their ''allies'', that dosent stop us, we just run like hell till we get to IAC space. Being able to dock in 0.0 and sell goods is a great bonus to my sister indy corps, and i would think for your pilots too. Due to the corp cap limits, i fear the only way you will be successful with this is to provide a NRDS policy for the area. You cannot expect indy corps, who cannot afford to lose shipments, to even take the risk, espically when there are other safe places to go. Just My humble Opinion, and I mean no offense. :) Anywhere, Anytime.
Mitch Taylor Caldari Dark-Rising Fallen Souls	Posted - 2007.03.01 08:32:00 - [69] To be honest, what would have been cool would be to hold the space yourself. As opposed to filling it up with tenants, paying or not. BOB pioneered this one a year ago, got anything new? Dark-Rising
Thranduil Saralonde Takigama Syndicate	Posted - 2007.03.01 08:34:00 - [70] Originally by: Mitch Taylor To be honest, what would have been cool would be to hold the space yourself. As opposed to filling it up with tenants, paying or not. BOB pioneered this one a year ago, got anything new? are you sad that you wont be able to trade over there please just get a grip

Inbred Gallente Lynx Frontier Inc. Sparta Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.01 08:47:00 - [71] Edited by: Inbred on 01/03/2007 08:44:39 Originally by: Mitch Taylor BOB pioneered this one a year ago, got anything new? Actually freetrade/open space has been the way of things in the Northern regions since long before Bob even formed. iirc IRON, D2, RZR and RAWR still run open space today and their rules are very similar if not exactly the same as Goon/TCFs.
tigress Gallente Genco Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.03.01 08:47:00 - [72] Nice Goons, welcome to the fun of "open" space. :). To all people not on the +5 list of the goons, come to catch and try IAC hospitality. We don't shoot you unless you do bad things M'kay.
Crellion Art of War Cult of War	Posted - 2007.03.01 09:08:00 - [73] I endorse this product or service and add my assurances to your lack of safety. Arguably my opinions represent to an extent the opinions of my alliance and in particular circumstances give rise to a valid "casus belli" claim.
Ewa Quillam Caldari mega mining corporation Astral Wolves	Posted - 2007.03.01 09:11:00 - [74] Originally by: Karrimdra Originally by: Tetsujin Originally by: LikYum 2) Right of Refusal : If a GoonSwarm member asks you to leave a system, you are to comply. Can you claify this please, I saw an earlier document that specifically stated "If a GoonSwarm fleet member asks you to leave a system, you are to comply." Which did make some kind of sense i guess, but any old muppet seeing a good spawn/rock and wanting it every time will get old real fast imho. It was a correction of a typo. Originally the statement said "If a Goonfleet member...". Goonfleet is a corporation, Goonswarm is an alliance. The intention is to state that any member of Goonswarm has the right to ask you to leave the system/asteroid belt/whathaveyou on the grounds that they are responsible for the defense of their territories thus have the right to profit from the contents of those territories above anyone else. So what you really want, is for people to come in, start chaining the belts for you, then come in when its done even while they pay ref taxes (to keep your pos'es running), pay for production fee's (to keep your pses running) and use the market which, if you've done it right will be good and make your isk, to keep your posses running. Anyone else see a pattern here? GS in need of isk to keep their "rapetrain" going, hence pawning off their problem as a "lets be nice to everyone who could already use, and knew about our stations already, but lets recruit yet more nubs in to help keep our fragile bandwagon rolling". Or is that too cynical a view? Kudos to IAC who actually seem to have the right mindset for an FTZ (i almost typed FTW :\|). What's wrong with the concept "I scratch your back if you scratch mine (and you don't pay any rent to me)"? It looks good to me, but it could cause some "friendly fire" amongst the hosted corps, in its beginning.
Jags Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2007.03.01 09:19:00 - [75] Its an interesting concept and I wish you luck with it. TBH its been done before with LV having access for any friendly corp to trade on our markets and it worked well. So you should have no issues there at all. When it comes to ratting and mining you will have issues I can guarantee you that. The best belts will get depleted fast , especially if you have 2000+ players + friendlies gnawing on them all the time. THat IMO will cause some conflict between the parties. Anyway at the worst it gives us more targets when we come to annoy you (cheers BE for your tactics :P). Just remember that we will be back to take what was once ours...
Kam SingDu'k Singularity.	Posted - 2007.03.01 09:36:00 - [76] I bet all the bob slave corps are angry that their terms suck now hehe. How much rent was it again? smart move Goon and TCF Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed dimensions of 400x120 pixels and filesize of 24000 bytes -Taiatia (mods@ccpgames)
Mirasta Caldari Aggressive Tendencies Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.01 09:48:00 - [77] Love what you've done with the space. IMHO its a great idea and exploits the resources in the regions to there fullest. I hope it goes well and the idea takes off... and i say all this as an Ex -V- so thats gotta mean something :P Of couse, You are now reading my sig.
fuze Gallente Chosen Path Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2007.03.01 10:45:00 - [78] Originally by: Vile rat Be a dear and offline the rest of the POS's for us. Thanks! No can't do. Better ask a GM to do that for you. Being a man I still can achieve multiple sarcasms.
Merdaneth Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.03.01 11:17:00 - [79] Originally by: Amerame As of today, 1st of March, Goonswarm stations in Scalding Pass as well as Tau Ceti Federation Stations in Wicked Creek as well as economical resources in asteroid belts are open to our allies. Anyone with a standing 5 or greater in Goonswarm or Tau Ceti Federation may trade, produce, rat and mine in those regions. I'm a bit confused. Just to get this clear: does that mean you did shoot your allies and friends who entered these regions before? With friends like that I guess you don't need enemies. Not shooting friends and allies sort of goes with them being friends and allies. Currently you will not shoot friends and allies anymore, but they should leave when you ask them to. You've just decided to start being friendly to friends and allies, nothing more. 'Free Trade' has got little to do with it.
Double Stuff Failure Cascade	Posted - 2007.03.01 11:30:00 - [80] Edited by: Double Stuff on 01/03/2007 11:30:22 Originally by: Merdaneth Originally by: Amerame As of today, 1st of March, Goonswarm stations in Scalding Pass as well as Tau Ceti Federation Stations in Wicked Creek as well as economical resources in asteroid belts are open to our allies. Anyone with a standing 5 or greater in Goonswarm or Tau Ceti Federation may trade, produce, rat and mine in those regions. I'm a bit confused. Just to get this clear: does that mean you did shoot your allies and friends who entered these regions before? With friends like that I guess you don't need enemies. Not shooting friends and allies sort of goes with them being friends and allies. Currently you will not shoot friends and allies anymore, but they should leave when you ask them to. You've just decided to start being friendly to friends and allies, nothing more. 'Free Trade' has got little to do with it. You didnt read the thread did you? They never shot their allies. But prior to this Goonfleet mined/ratted/produced in Goonfleet owned space. TCF mined/ratted/produced in TCF space. There was no mixture beacuse thats it norm in eve. Space is divided by corp/alliance and usually if an outside entity is using the resources they are paying billions for it. (see BoB renting 6 systems to RISE as example) Goonfleet itself started out in Syndicate renting single belts for millions of isk. (despite being blue to the area, they had to pay for rights) Thats the social norm of eve. You pay the space owner for rights to use resources. No one except a few in the north share their systems freely for ratting/mining despite being blue. This is a formal announcement that if you are blue, you can mine/rat/trade in any station, in any system with few restrictions. Where before, blue could only rat/mine/use factory slots in their own sovern space. This sounds obvious if you're not used to 0.0 politics, but unfortunately its not how most of 0.0 is controlled. Hope this helps. edit:spelling

Fubear Vogon Heavy Industries	Posted - 2007.03.01 11:40:00 - [81] Edited by: Fubear on 01/03/2007 11:37:02 Originally by: Merdaneth I'm a bit confused. Just to get this clear: does that mean you did shoot your allies and friends who entered these regions before? With friends like that I guess you don't need enemies. Not shooting friends and allies sort of goes with them being friends and allies. Currently you will not shoot friends and allies anymore, but they should leave when you ask them to. You've just decided to start being friendly to friends and allies, nothing more. 'Free Trade' has got little to do with it. I think the idea is that allies and friends can rat and mine in the specified regions. If I were +5 with BoB for any reason would they let me mine and rat anywhere in Delve/Period Basis? Somehow I doubt it. Most alliances allow travel/docking in their regions to Allies but restrict the use of the resources in that region (rats/betls/complexes) to themselves. There are a lot of people in this thread being overly negative and pessimistic about this. I think the idea is a good one, and TCF/Goonswarm should be given kudos for giving it a shot. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work, but at least they tried which is probably more than can be said for anyone who dismisses the idea out of hand. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. I wish them good luck with their venture!
Redbad Minmatar Be Inspired Inc.	Posted - 2007.03.01 12:05:00 - [82] Now this is good thinking of the Goonies. To get a viable economy and a good supply of cheap items it is necessary to make your regions accesible towards other entities. It doesnt compromise the safety too much, but will reap benefits towards all parties and develop the area. Good initative! join us today!
Dr Slaughter ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.03.01 12:13:00 - [83] Just double checked it was March 1st not April 1st. Nice concept. Good luck with the implementation. Shame you're not doing it IAC style and a great pity you didn't state this as a goal back in 2006. pinch of salt required
Dematone Caldari Dark-Rising Fallen Souls	Posted - 2007.03.01 12:44:00 - [84] Please do not call anything a "Free Trade Zone", that is not a Free Trade Zone. Otherwise any alliance could call their space a Free Trade Zone, with the only prerequisite: you have to be in their alliance. Additionally, with the rule that any Goon Swarm member can tell everyone else to leave the system, you preserve yourself a right, that makes you some kind of dictator. Of course, if this right is only used under extreme circumstances and only on exceptions, this may be legitimate, however you should clarify this in the first place. Conclusion: "A not so Free Trade Zone" I will watch this, and see how it develops. In my opinion this can not really work, as I see a lot of issues arising - but time will tell. Good luck in trying this, anyways.
Tecam Hund Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.03.01 13:07:00 - [85] This is a big step forward compared to how most of space in EVE is managed. I hope this works out for you, and you will be able to progress further in this direction. Good luck.
Becca Manns Puppets on Steroids Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.01 13:09:00 - [86] Edited by: Becca Manns on 01/03/2007 13:07:53 This is a revolutionary step in pubbie bukkake. Well done goons, looking forward to your eve-o recruitment thread.
Le Cardinal ECP Rogues Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2007.03.01 13:15:00 - [87] Originally by: Dematone Please do not call anything a "Free Trade Zone", that is not a Free Trade Zone. Otherwise any alliance could call their space a Free Trade Zone, with the only prerequisite: you have to be in their alliance. Additionally, with the rule that any Goon Swarm member can tell everyone else to leave the system, you preserve yourself a right, that makes you some kind of dictator. Of course, if this right is only used under extreme circumstances and only on exceptions, this may be legitimate, however you should clarify this in the first place. Conclusion: "A not so Free Trade Zone" I will watch this, and see how it develops. In my opinion this can not really work, as I see a lot of issues arising - but time will tell. Good luck in trying this, anyways. Its their space. They have fought for their right to dictate that space. Dont see any harm with this. They open space for a lot of the eve population that want to try out 0.0. They make some profit on it that will benefit keeping pos's running and creating a market there. Its a win win situation for goons, and its a win win situation for the corps that wanna try this. Such FTZ corps will face the dangers as any corp face in 0.0. You cant expect Goons to babysit and escort them out of 0.0 with their valuables. There is a lot of bitter feelings in this thread Stop nagging and buy ur greencard. Hope it works for u goons
Tecam Hund Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.03.01 13:16:00 - [88] And I just thought of a question. If some alliance requested and was granted +5 standing with the Goons, but is neutral to your allies. It would mean that your allies, being NBSI, would be able to open fire on the said alliance. Will self defense be allowed, or will +5 standings be copied among all participants of this program?
BlackDog Rackh'am Minmatar Maza Nostra RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.01 13:50:00 - [89] Edited by: BlackDog Rackh''am on 01/03/2007 13:47:29 I can't see the reason for all this negativity tbh. Goons find an easy way to populate their space (easier than asking for rent): Win Goons clearly state they will not hold you by the hand. You have to learn the ropes of 0.0 yourself: Win As a result of the above two, they only have to deal with attacks presenting a danger to their sov, instead of policing a bunch of regions 24/7: Win It provides incentive for small corps to merge (so as to get standings) and head out to 0.0 : Win It provides targets for every ganksquad and bitter former resident around to go and have some fun with the above mentioned corps: Win It provides something for Goons to do in their space, chasing these ganksquads and having fights: Win It encourages people to get off their ass, go to 0.0 for free 5 minutes after they get finished with the +5 convo, make isk, get ganked, lose ships, learn PvP, be targets for others, hunt targets, populate markets and generally promotes some activity instead of the usual "reserved for the chosen few with past ties or deep pockets" model that creates immobile, stagnating and boring power blocks. It will create problems to the Goons along with the benefits of it all, but that's why it's a cool project. Things will be getting done all over the place. And if you don't like them, you can get your mates, go gank the hell out of their guests and get some fancy loot, so quit your btching already Originally by:* Eloryan Persago, Goonfleet I welcome you to the coalition of people with user access to EvE
Radeberger Caldari Tyrell Corp INTERDICTION	Posted - 2007.03.01 13:58:00 - [90] This is basically the same thing as what ascn did, by far not revolutionary, but i guess i can look at it this way, more targets for me, so yay \o/ Is this a sig? i think not



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