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Janu Hull
Caldari
Order of Z Industries
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Posted - 2007.05.15 14:43:00 -
[91]
 Originally by: Alrich
if anything, this game needs to get a higher death penalty. as it is now, you only lose the price of the fitting unless you use t2 ships
That's high enough, thanks. Fitting costs can be a pretty hardcore hit to the wallet, just having the ship replaced is enough to keep a bad fall from being crippling for players without a year or more of money farming under their belt.
When you're ready to take the big leap, or you have a larger corp supporting you, then you can go Tier 2 and play PvP in "hardcore" mode.
This is my sig, there are many others just like it. With me, my sig is worthless. Without (or with even) my sig, I am worthless... |
Adaris
Dark and Light inc.
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Posted - 2007.05.15 14:47:00 -
[92]
Originally by: nickycakes
i guess if spamming 1 or 2 buttons over and over for hours for 0 reward and no incentive to actually be good is your bag, then bye
yep, thats wow right there.
The only loss you get when you pvp in wow be it attacking or getting ganked is the repair bill you need to pay to get your armor fixed. And becasue wow is a farming game, everyone has the isk, eh I mean gold.
* * *
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=euZ0j7vtKEQ
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Roshan longshot
Gallente
Ordos Humanitas
FREGE Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.15 14:48:00 -
[93]
pages 1-4 skiped....
Player vs Player sucks compared to the real thing.
The real thing has the worse penalties there can ever be.
Not to mention it freaking hurts like hell when your target gets a lucky shot in!
So what does this tell us? REAL LIFE SUCKS dont leave the games....
Free-form Professions, ensure no limetations on professions. Be a trader, fighter, industialist, researcher, hunter pirate or mixture of them all.
[i]As read from the original box.
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Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2007.05.15 14:49:00 -
[94]
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 15/05/2007 14:48:12
Originally by: Roshan longshot
pages 1-4 skiped....
Player vs Player sucks compared to the real thing.
The real thing has the worse penalties there can ever be.
Not to mention it freaking hurts like hell when your target gets a lucky shot in!
So what does this tell us? REAL LIFE SUCKS dont leave the games....
Bush should have invaded BoB instead of Iraq. 
---
Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune |
Roshan longshot
Gallente
Ordos Humanitas
FREGE Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.15 14:52:00 -
[95]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 15/05/2007 14:48:12
Originally by: Roshan longshot
pages 1-4 skiped....
Player vs Player sucks compared to the real thing.
The real thing has the worse penalties there can ever be.
Not to mention it freaking hurts like hell when your target gets a lucky shot in!
So what does this tell us? REAL LIFE SUCKS dont leave the games....
Bush should have invaded BoB instead of Iraq.
Yeah and I would'nt limp today if he did!!! Sorry sucker snuck up on us.
"Volent tour spring '91. The lost children we dont need a reason.
Free-form Professions, ensure no limetations on professions. Be a trader, fighter, industialist, researcher, hunter pirate or mixture of them all.
[i]As read from the original box.
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Isyel
Minmatar
Queens of the Stone Age
Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2007.05.15 14:56:00 -
[96]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 15/05/2007 14:48:12
Originally by: Roshan longshot
pages 1-4 skiped....
Player vs Player sucks compared to the real thing.
The real thing has the worse penalties there can ever be.
Not to mention it freaking hurts like hell when your target gets a lucky shot in!
So what does this tell us? REAL LIFE SUCKS dont leave the games....
Bush should have invaded BoB instead of Iraq.
Hundreds of 1 to 2 km ships, a few 30km ships which can cause complete ruin of a planet's atmosphere in one shot. Mmmmmmm. I see why he chose the softer target. 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Originally by: Wrangler
We don't want to discriminate anyone! We want *both* anti-social *and* social players to grief each other! 
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Spoon Thumb
Khanid Aerospace Group
Khanid Provincial Authority
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Posted - 2007.05.15 14:57:00 -
[97]
The only thing I'm genuinely disappointed about in eve (aside from no branding) is that pvp skills are in selecting a setup. There is no aiming or manual flying the ship and avoiding crashing etc.
Khaldari
Research Services
KPA Recruiting! |
Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2007.05.15 14:58:00 -
[98]
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 15/05/2007 14:56:24
Originally by: Spoon Thumb
The only thing I'm genuinely disappointed about in eve (aside from no branding) is that pvp skills are in selecting a setup. There is no aiming or manual flying the ship and avoiding crashing etc.
Try playing minmatar without manual flying... bye-bye ship. 
---
Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune |
ForumPosterAlt
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Posted - 2007.05.15 14:59:00 -
[99]
I used to think the same thing.
But this last week has been the most exciting week evar if you are in the right spot.
The system i'm in regularly has 7 titans wandering around.
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Barbaro55a
Caldari
Os Lobos
Ethereal Dawn
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Posted - 2007.05.15 15:09:00 -
[100]
I can beat that, the system i inhabit has several HUGE Veldspar asteroids. Who would have thought it!
I'm RICH ! ! !
..........................................
We come in Peace, FIRE AT WILL---Blog |
Thorndin MacMorrin
Brotherhood of Acquisitions
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Posted - 2007.05.15 15:38:00 -
[101]
Edited by: Thorndin MacMorrin on 15/05/2007 15:42:22
Originally by: Mr Abbadon
wow is about how good you really are. K lvl 1 player cant beat a lvl 70 but a 35 can beat a 60 with ease. EvE is about who has the biggest wallet and best ship n skills.
There is no way a lvl 35 could touch a lvl 60 in WoW. If the 60 was all in greens and the 35 was in purples the 35 still is not going to touch a lvl 60. IÆm pretty sure I could be afk, and my pet would waste your lvl 35, even with some of the broken exploits IÆve seen in WoW mechanics. I could devastate a party of 35Æs in WoW with my 64 hunter. Cloth types would be one-shotted before they realized I was there, and big red kitty would tear up the rest.
This is a huge difference between eve and WoW, and a common misconception that IÆve seen friends bring to eve from fantasy based games. New players in eve can quickly become valuable assets to corps, both in industrial settings, pve and pvp. Skill points in eve do not equate to levels in WoW.
Ten level 10 characters in WoW could not take a level 70 character. But a gang of well low skill point players in frigates that know what they are doing can take down much larger targets if they know what they are doing.
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Araxmas
The Blue Dagger Mercenery Agency
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Posted - 2007.05.15 16:03:00 -
[102]
Originally by: Adaris
Originally by: nickycakes
i guess if spamming 1 or 2 buttons over and over for hours for 0 reward and no incentive to actually be good is your bag, then bye
yep, thats wow right there.
The only loss you get when you pvp in wow be it attacking or getting ganked is the repair bill you need to pay to get your armor fixed. And becasue wow is a farming game, everyone has the isk, eh I mean gold.
Even worse than that....you don't have a repair bill from pvp deaths 
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Robbie Rotten left me |
Beatrix Kindo
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Posted - 2007.05.15 16:23:00 -
[103]
yes wow is very easy game and pvp means nothing there..i rather play Counter strike..but Eve is not perfect it need fixes as well..for example why whe cant insure modules as well?
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Septicimia
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Posted - 2007.05.15 16:25:00 -
[104]
wow=grindfest grindfest grindfest
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Drunk Driver
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.05.15 16:26:00 -
[105]
We can stop kicking the OP now. I think he's unconscious.
But quick, somebody write "WoW sucks!" on his forehead with a permanent marker!
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Kweel Nakashyn
Minmatar
Aeden
Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2007.05.15 16:43:00 -
[106]
@Op
Wow PvP :
Figth against say 100 players. You loose ? no consequencies and who cares.
Eve PvP :
Figth against say 200 players. You loose ? Damn I'm sorry, it'll be hard for your alliance and your team in the future.
WoW is Macdonald, Eve is *** restaurants. Yes you have to wait to actually eat good food.
-----
History is made by whinners
Originally by: DB Preacher
(...) Ignore what the coalition muppets are saying on their forums (...)
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Mista Sexamalicious
Sexa Inc
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Posted - 2007.05.15 17:02:00 -
[107]
Edited by: Mista Sexamalicious on 15/05/2007 17:03:51
EVE was my first MMO/RPG/G game I'd ever played. And believe me my accounts will continue until EVE no longer exists. But the immense amount of solo killage in WoW just makes it a different type of game to me.
But 10 days ago I started the ten-day trial in WoW. Let me tell you I found it awesome to say the least.
Now the trial would only let my go up to level 20 and only max my skills to 100 and I think only 15 talent points.
So after reaching the point where questing and the like didn't really do much for my character I set out exploring everything else  .
And wouldn't you know it I ended up in a contested alliance territory. Redridge Mountains. ( on the burning legend server I think it is.)
That's when things got good. You see I chose to be an Undead Rogue. Fun times.
So I'm creeping around and what do I see. A Human Priest on a Quest. He's level 22 and I'm Level 20. So at first I think I don't stand a chance, but I learned this type of gaming from EVE. So It's Party Time!
I creep up in stealth garrote him and when into a series of sinister strikes. And wouldn't you know? He melted like butter. I was so annoyed that I couldn't loot him though. Shame.
So began my personal quest to kill as many people as I can. For the first couple of days it was great solo. I got somewhere around 10-15 kills alone. I would even take them two at a time, Sap one and kill the weakest then go kill the other.
Then I left back to Undercity to rep my gear get second set of gear and get back to my hunting.
When I got back to Redridge I find a friend. Level 22 Tauren Druid. We became the "Terror of Redridge."
We were careful not to kill the same person or ppl too many times too often. But there was never a shortage victims.Between Redridge and Duskwood.
And with two of us barely anyone got away. Because we could each take one each and kill them simultaneously.
It was a hell of an experience. And On the last day which was yesterday. I received 41 kills for 47 honor that day. A few more than my buddy because while he was AFK I was out killing.
So yesterday we threw a great big party in Redridge and we were giving away a lot of cake.
All in all, I love EVE, but I'm also falling in love with WoW. And in a few weeks when I go back to playing WoW again. It's gonna be terrible for all after I level up me character.
Not to mention I'm gonna bring my new WoW buddy over to EVE so we can terrorize here. To think that I had to go to a different game to find my Wingman.
Oh and what i found to be the most pleasant thing about it. THERE'S NO LOCAL.
________________________________________________________
Real Men don't use Local.
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Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2007.05.15 17:14:00 -
[108]
Originally by: Mista Sexamalicious
good times
I felt like that before battlegrounds. Then everybody went in there and started to grind honor. Outdoor pvp basically disappeared. And thats probably why you got some kills... I guess nobody even cares anymore if they die once or twice outdoor. They just pick up their body and go in their merry way to grind honor or fight some npc mob for items.
I dont know, I cant seem to see the point of it all.
---
Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune |
Derran
Minmatar
Khumatari Holdings
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2007.05.15 17:27:00 -
[109]
Since I've played WoW and quit about 3 times now and I am still in eve for the past 4 years now, I just have to comment since the other sides of the coin wasn't looked at at all by the OP.
Originally by: Istoledat
0.0 pvp seems like a game of waiting at gates (for hours). This to me is not really pvp it's just waiting for the other team to get bored and say F-it or they go away. If they do say f-it and come through a gate then it's a turkey shoot lag fest for a few min.
As opposed to waiting for some lower level to wander along so you can beat the crap out of him?
Originally by: Istoledat
WoW you can pvp non stop all day long with targets all over the place. NON STOP ALL DAY LONG. I have gotten over 800 kills in that game in one day. That's a lot of action.
And what level were they? And care to explain what would be the point in that? I mean, to what end does it serve? In Eve in 0.0, there is usually a purpose behind the PvP like claiming territory. WoW just resets. Someone dies and no one cares because they just came back without any loss of anything. I have enjoyed the WoW battlegrounds on occasion but without a good group, you just end up getting pounded on by overwhelming numbers plus after awhile doing the same scenario, it gets dull.
Originally by: Istoledat
The big difference is that Eve has a harsh penalty and wow has no penalty. So in the end what do we learn?
Harsh penalty = Less pvp.
Then there would be no adreline rush. In WoW, you die and then so what? I go back to grab my stuff and go on. Gee, what a thrill. Pardon me while I get more excitement listening to my grandfather talk about how things were like when he was a kid. After 4 years however, I don't find much of a rush anymore in most EVE PvP since ISK is so devalued but I find new rushes by taking on larger numbers than me or fighting in a ship that is one stage down from what I am trying to go up against. But I still miss the enjoyment out of working hard to get that first cruiser and the nail biting experience it was when we came close to losing it.
Originally by: Istoledat
My point is that this macho you must loose all your stuff for pvp is actually hindering pvp.
As opposed to the machoness of being higher level than someone in a contested area that is questing and killing them just because they can't possibly fight back? Yes, how macho. At least in most dangerous EVE locations, you can keep an eye on local and if someone suspicious looking pops in, you can get the hell out of there.
Alot of the PvP aspects you mention in Eve may soon be changing. CCP are quite aware how much different Eve PvP is and how the numbers game is so terrible in it. In other games, numbers always wins no matter what strategy. They are seeking to change that in Eve because of the consquences of losing in Eve PvP.
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Derran
Minmatar
Khumatari Holdings
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2007.05.15 17:32:00 -
[110]
Originally by: Janu Hull
Originally by: Alrich
if anything, this game needs to get a higher death penalty. as it is now, you only lose the price of the fitting unless you use t2 ships
That's high enough, thanks. Fitting costs can be a pretty hardcore hit to the wallet, just having the ship replaced is enough to keep a bad fall from being crippling for players without a year or more of money farming under their belt.
When you're ready to take the big leap, or you have a larger corp supporting you, then you can go Tier 2 and play PvP in "hardcore" mode.
Actually, that is only true if you are working alone. If your corp happens to do invention and you are set up in 0.0 with labs and such, the corp can build you replacement T2 gear for a much lower cost than market.
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Terreen Rha
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Posted - 2007.05.15 17:44:00 -
[111]
Every MMO that I've played that has PvP, with exception of EvE, is all about the CotW (Class of the week). WoW, DoAC, AO, SWG and PS it was always the same thing. However was the CoTW won in 1 vs. 1 fights. Take a look at the class population in any of these games were PvP is allowed. In WoW, for example, the highest pop classes are always the CoTW.
EvE PvP is more often then not decided by choices made before the fight, tactics and of course gear. There are no "I win", or automatic e-peen extenders in EvE. Well unless you count Titans, but it's not like just anyone can have one.
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NightmareX
Caldari
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.05.15 17:51:00 -
[112]
Edited by: NightmareX on 15/05/2007 17:49:27
Originally by: Istoledat
WoW you can pvp non stop all day long with targets all over the place. NON STOP ALL DAY LONG. I have gotten over 800 kills in that game in one day. That's a lot of action.
Yeah that's a lot of action for nothing . 5 kills in EVE have more meaning than 800 kills in WoW.
In WoW you just kill to get kills, and to get enough honour or whatever it's called to get the best items in WoW.
In EVE i'm killing to show others that i'm a really good pvper, and that we don't fear anyone, even when the enemy are like 4-5 times bigger than us.
Infinitus Odium - We Are The Bringers Of Hatred |
Pimm
Gallente
The Scope
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Posted - 2007.05.15 18:15:00 -
[113]
>Oh and what i found to be the most pleasant thing about it. THERE'S NO LOCAL.
So you missed Barrens chat compleatly? 
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Pan Crastus
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Posted - 2007.05.15 18:25:00 -
[114]
I have to agree with the OP. Everyone who claims that WoW PVP is spamming 1-2 buttons has never played WoW enough to tell. PVP in WoW is much more tactical than in EVE, EVE PVP is decided by (in order of importance):
- number and size of ships on each side
- lag
- skills
Almost all fights in EVE are completely unbalanced, there is hardly any 1v1 (if you don't count ganking ratters, which is 1v1+NPCs) and only in the rare event that opposing fleets are nearly balanced in size and lag isn't the deciding factor, only then do tactics play a major role. Tactics being the fittings people chose mostly, since F1-F8 is still what most will do.
It also saddens me that even skillpoints and skills do not matter much these days, all that matters is how many ISK people are willing to risk and how they get it (some get it from GTCs, others have inifite ISK from their T2 BPOs and some won't risk much because they have to grind for their ISK). At least in WoW most good gear has to be earned (it's BoP).
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Inir Ishtori
The Guardian Agency
Guardian Federation
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Posted - 2007.05.15 18:47:00 -
[115]
there is another quite big difference between pvp in both games which can be shown by a little example:
an eve and a wow player release their pvp videos consisting of ganking undergeared and inexpirienced newbies.
comments from wow community:
"your video ist quite lame, you killed newbies only, show better opponents next time."
eve community:
"omg, you rock, your are SOOOO COOL" and much asslicking in general. this attitude is slowly changing, though.
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Floppy Disk
Veto.
Veto Corp
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Posted - 2007.05.15 19:14:00 -
[116]
WoW PvP
1) Nothing is at stake.
No one owns anything. In EVE, you have the option to actually take and defend a region through pvp endevours. In WoW, BGs reset themselves, so really you accomplish nothing tangible by pvping other than aquiring better gear to kill more people with. No thought goes into PvP decisions. No social or diplomatic tactics are employed. There is no substance. Just pretty colors.
2) Combat is formulaic.
Class vs class is immensely different than ship vs ship. You are limited to a very small number of class-based pvp options and there are literally no tactics involved at all. Run at enemies...... attempt to pwn them...... fail or succeed, rez at graveyard, run right back. No, you don't lose anything, but you don't gain anything either except for points and shiny gear you'll throw away soon anyway.
3) No honor.
Your name and your reputation mean nothing in WoW. You are surrounded by sea of borderline functionally handicapped 11 year old keyboard mashers who constantly complain about why their faction sucks. In EVE people actually have to play the social game in order to advance their rep and the impact of their name when it is used in a public forum. In WoW this is a fruitless endevour since no one gives a crap.
I'd take an 8 hour long op or camp in my ship of choice with my best guns loaded over standing next to some smelly Orc protecting a digital flag any day. For constant, repetative, mindless PvP, please purchase and install a copy of BF2 and have a whale of a time.
Blizzard ftl.
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Araxmas
The Blue Dagger Mercenery Agency
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Posted - 2007.05.15 19:59:00 -
[117]
Originally by: Pan Crastus
Edited by: Pan Crastus on 15/05/2007 18:24:08
I have to agree with the OP. Everyone who claims that WoW PVP is spamming 1-2 buttons has never played WoW enough to tell. PVP in WoW is much more tactical than in EVE, EVE PVP is decided by (in order of importance):
- number and size of ships on each side
- lag
- skills
Almost all fights in EVE are completely unbalanced, there is hardly any 1v1 (if you don't count ganking ratters, which is 1v1+NPCs) and only in the rare event that opposing fleets are nearly balanced in size and lag isn't the deciding factor, only then do tactics play a major role. Tactics being the fittings people chose mostly, since F1-F8 is still what most will do.
It also saddens me that even skillpoints and skills do not matter much these days, all that matters is how many ISK people are willing to risk and how they get it (some get it from GTCs, others have infinite ISK from their T2 BPOs and some won't risk much because they have to grind for their ISK). At least in WoW most good gear has to be earned (it's BoP).
I've played WoW for a long time, I play two mmo's and EVE is superiour before anyone asks.
First your whining about there being no fair fights...Well sorry but real life is not like that, you don't go upto a mob of thugs and ask them to only attack you one at a time and drop their weapons as you do not have one, and WoW is never a fair fight, there is always someone with some huge gold wallet that can buy all the fancy bind on equp armour of million dollar enchants.
Next you say that good items in WoW need to be earned, that is because WoW is item dependant, you get some nice little purple leather panties that increase your agility by some god forsaken amount, while on EvE you steal them from other people, or get lucky.
Yet those 'epic' eve items will not save your ship, you can get your ass handed to you by T1 cruisers fitted with turret disruptors or other such nasties.
Quote:
"Tactics being the fittings people chose mostly, since F1-F8 is still what most will do."
Yeah and in WoW sorry but you do spam buttons, you may have a certain combination of buttons or god forbid a potion or two but frankly thats all it consists of.
In EvE the button pressing is replaced by tracking speed, ship speed, missile velocity, intertia, ECM, distuption, webbing and so on so forth. So you are correct it is the modules you choose...and in wow it is the items you choose...what is your point
It is more tacticle and more threat.
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Robbie Rotten left me |
Phoenix Britannian
Gallente
Virtue Corporation
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Posted - 2007.05.15 20:02:00 -
[118]
Originally by: Shaemell Buttleson
Why? If anything I'd have thought it would encourage to get better at PVP so your losses are less.
I played Ultima Online from the start, Mid-September 1997, Charter Edition, and I played it for 9 years. From my experience in the early years before the PvP- lands known as Trammel, and my experiences prowling between Trammel and the old PvP+ lands after that, having losses promotes 1 of 2 things in a player:
1. They seek to become the best PvPer out there, usually a solo PvPer. These people are the most dangerous to go up against because they are used to fighting against the odds or at even odds, and usually know what they are doing very well. They also usually have a sense of honor. They also don't like to waste time on those who have little to no chance of beating them, as it proves nothing to beat them.
2. They seek safety in numbers, and will only PvP if the odds are well enough in their favor, and usually run away if their target turns out to not be so easy as they first thought. These people wind up being the least skilled out there, because they have no idea how to get it done on their own, and will more than likely leave you in the dust before they try to learn how. They will attack anything that moves so long as it looks like it won't destroy them.
Group player psychology can be broken up in much the same way, with the difference in the first one being that you have a group, small or moderate in size usually, that seeks out other groups which are stronger or equal in strength to take down, and the second group, usually very large in size, always seeking prey which is weaker than itself.
- Phoenix Britannian |
loperat
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Posted - 2007.05.15 20:52:00 -
[119]
Originally by: Istoledat
0.0 pvp seems like a game of waiting at gates (for hours). This to me is not really pvp it's just waiting for the other team to get bored and say F-it or they go away. If they do say f-it and come through a gate then it's a turkey shoot lag fest for a few min.
Low sec pvp gate camps, this is about as close as this game comes real heart pounding pvp. I only hope that putting lvl 5 missions in low sec will make these areas more populated and thus perpetuating this style of play.
Empire no pvp there unless you have war decs.
WoW you can pvp non stop all day long with targets all over the place. NON STOP ALL DAY LONG. I have gotten over 800 kills in that game in one day. That's a lot of action.
The big difference is that Eve has a harsh penalty and wow has no penalty. So in the end what do we learn?
Harsh penalty = Less pvp.
Let the flaming commence
It is clear that "Harsh penalty = Less pvp". No doubt about it.
I got more than 200k kills in WOW and tbh i think "wow PVP" isnt Diablo or a fps where you spam 2 buttoms. Usually i use more than 10 skills every 1us1 fight, and i got around 40 or more hotkeys in my UI. I am sorry but EVE direct "fight style" is simple compared to WOW (you only have to activate the modules)
I enjoy wow pvp because is straight,no laggy , fun and you need teamwork and skill.
Battlegrounds are very funny and balanced; you only play against even numbers. 2us2, 3us3 , 5us5, 10us10, 15us15 or 40us40.
In the other hand i also enjoy "EVE pvp" because it is complex, but it isnt the fight style (you only have to activate the modules if the lag let you), it is the pre-battle, fittings, the logistics,the intel, the knowdledge of the whole game, the gang tactics, the unfairness. Eve territorial conquest pvp and politics make this game special. The harsh penalty adds spice and adrenaline rush.
So i get fun pvping in both games. Every game gives me a special taste of pvp. Sometimes i like drinking 50 good beers and in other ocasions i like a good cuban rum.
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P Tang
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Posted - 2007.05.15 21:11:00 -
[120]
play... on.. the.. test server?
duh?
everything cost 1isk
pod killing is a crime
there is no reward
I think the main thing is that in WoW you can jump into a whole different game that is a whole new game in it's self.
but EvE does have torniments.
maybe have more of them. I mean people have them all of the time. but make them more offical?
or like I said.
play on the test server
or play counter-strike while your skills train.
EvE is a game with potenal, and you'll have to wait for the awesomness to hit
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