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Tommy TenKreds Animal Mercantile Executive Animal.	Posted - 2007.08.11 15:10:00 - [91] Originally by: Elmicker So, that's a no? All your posturing and telling me to defend our ratters and miners is based off pure guesswork? Let me put it this way. Blue/empty local = safe to rat Neutral/red local = Form pvp gang. AFK cloaker = neutral/red in local = form pvp gang = no ratting, no mining. There are no variables in this. No "Defending your miners." Everyone is either in a PvP gang, or they are docked/in a POS. This is how conventional 0.0 operates. Not operating this way results in dozens of dead mining barges and ratting ravens, and no number of defense gangs or ratting with friends will stop that. If you want to know where I live you have to find out for yourself. Only a fool takes silence as confirmation. As for your notion of "This is how conventional 0.0 operates", that's just bs. If your conventions mean you are failing, they need to change, not the game.
Felysta Sandorn Caldari System-Lords Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2007.08.11 15:11:00 - [92] I found a more appropriate reply to the one I had before: Latest Video, Click Here!
End Yourself Core Domination Big Bang Quantum	Posted - 2007.08.11 15:19:00 - [93] Originally by: Felysta Sandorn @OP: Adapt or go play Hello Kitty Online! Lots of good suggestions in this thread allready, you just chose to ignore them and whine instead. --- Fighting for peace is like screwing for virginity.
Rawthorm Gallente The Establishment Establishment	Posted - 2007.08.11 15:20:00 - [94] Originally by: Empire marketslave Originally by: Rawthorm Edited by: Rawthorm on 11/08/2007 01:33:52 So let me get this. A hostile comes into local and cloaks. He does nothing. Its not harming you in any way. You by choice choose not to go about your daily buisness because he's here. Now CCP should change the game mechanics cos you dont have the stones or inteligence to carry on about your daily buisness while you have someone in local...why exactly? because they can goto work for 8 hours come back home eat then jump on eve see that there is a mining op/ratter and start causing havoc while that 8 hrs is going on everyone in the system has to assume that he can come back at anytime Then you should guard your mining ops...
SchirmerN Amarr WKK Inc. United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.08.11 15:39:00 - [95] Originally by: Elmicker So, that's a no? All your posturing and telling me to defend our ratters and miners is based off pure guesswork? Let me put it this way. Blue/empty local = safe to rat Neutral/red local = Form pvp gang. AFK cloaker = neutral/red in local = form pvp gang = no ratting, no mining. There are no variables in this. No "Defending your miners." Everyone is either in a PvP gang, or they are docked/in a POS. This is how conventional 0.0 operates. Not operating this way results in dozens of dead mining barges and ratting ravens, and no number of defense gangs or ratting with friends will stop that. FreeFall Securities How about getting some Securities around your own miners
Awox Advanced Logistics	Posted - 2007.08.11 15:43:00 - [96] Edited by: Awox on 11/08/2007 15:43:36 IDIOT'S GUIDE TO PVP HARDENING THEIR PVE VESSEL 1. fit a cap injector Your tank will hold up no matter how many NOS that pilgrim has. Also, you will survive against popular npc ganking platforms like ishtars/domis/myrmidons. 2. fit a smart bomb Most recons use drones heavily, deploy your drones and wait for his to come into range, then scoop yours and activate smartbomb. Instantly the aggressor has lost a majority of his DPS. 3. fit a sensor booster If you insist on NPCing when you have noone around to help you out of a jam or you are in a corp full of pansies that wont assist you if you need it, a sensor booster might give you a chance to lock a non-arazu recon with damps. You'll have a better chance to fight him off. 4. fit a heavy nosferatu (or neut) Will get interceptors off your back, and if you can lock the recon, it will get him off your back too. If you are really desperate you can NOS an NPC that will probably be close enough for you to lock if you cannot lock your attacker. 5. don't pimp it up This isn't really that important. But don't be stupid, if the enemies discover you fit really expensive implants/modules or you NPC in carriers often they will try extra hard to gank you. this will attrack more aggressors lookin' for a good score. Now that I've helped the carebears prepare for hardening their ships for fending of aggressors, wonder where the fun in afk-cloaking is? Here it is: AFK-CLOAKING ADVICE 1. Bring a second character or friend you can keep near-by in a ship with possibly logged out a lot of DPS and/or cap warfare. Commands, HACs and tier2 BCs are very well suited for this purpose. 2. get a portable gaming console Sometimes when there isn't a lot of traffic I like to play my gameboy or psp, with a small timer that ticks every 1.5 minutes reminding me to look at my screen. 3. read a book an exciting book will keep you entertained and alert, remember to get an egg timer or something to make sure you keep watch on your character(s) 4. browse the www Now, when I am too tired to play my DS, don't have a good book near-by, or am simply feeling lazy(tee-hee) I browse the WWW. My favourites include: break.com, YouTube, The Register, http://www.slashdot.org"/]slashdot[/url] and The Onion 5. take a nap if you are tired. Because be honest, why else did you train up for that cloak? - ccp <3 ISK sellers boost dictors (a bit!) remotely destroy JCs
Esk Esme Caldari High4Life	Posted - 2007.08.11 15:57:00 - [97] by the look of ppl's response i personaly think ppl have had a it with all the PVP/PVE combat mod's nerf's these mods have been just nerfed not thought about just squashed take nano's/istab/overdrive nerf as i agree the BS should not b able to fly at 6k lmfao BUT the inty /AF /Dictor /Hac other small killing machines should not IMHO b effected by such nerf they r in essence ment to b awsoem speed think b4 nerf have the nerf to said ship's I.E BS.BC. COMAND /and bigger ( in nano case ) this nos nerf WTF r u crazy we want pwnage machines man gives us somthing to fight and fight in like any pwnage machine and other pvp ship they have a time and place for use u can counter ship's nos bout orbit outside nos range pop drone's / cloaker u get a lock and and scram or insta pop he dead / nano bird u get web's he dead / sniper bubble or tckler warp to he dead the super cap ship's needed a nerf tbh no ship should b invincable or invunrable there is a way to pop every ship and should b but also the art of war/combat my friend we test our ship's in the field they all pop sooner or later but no need to nerf all the time so comon ppl give it a break
Ranar Estraad	Posted - 2007.08.11 16:22:00 - [98] I mentioned this before, and I will mention it again because I think it is a rather interesting parralel that no one seems to recognize. I am going to describe 2 scenarios, their effects and their consequences. They are both completely identical, yet one is considered fair gameplay and the other is currently being attacked and screeched at for a nerf. Situation 1 You have buisness to do in a nearby system. You fly through your stargates until you come to the last one. You look on the map and switch it to "show shps destroyed in the last hour." The system you're going to has had a dozen ships destoryed. You don't have an alt account, you don't have friends logged in to help. You don't know if those people in the system with the 12 destoryed ships are still there. Are they in a gate camp? Are they hostile? Have they left and this is just old info? You don't want to risk losing your ship and you decide that the best course of action would be to not go into the system and do your buisness. Situation 2 You have buisness to do in a nearby system. You fly through your stargates until you reach your destination. You look at the local channel. The system you're in has one other guy in local, but you can't scan him out, therefore he is cloaked You don't have an alt account, you don't have friends logged in to help. Is he actually at his computer? Is he hostile? Has he left his computer to go about his daily routines like work or errands? You don't want to risk losing your ship and you decide the best course of action would be to not stay in this system and do your buisness. In Situation 1, I have described a gate camp. In situation 2, I have described an AFK cloaker. Both situation cause the same kind of panic and stress to the player, as both of them cause some sort of unknown factor. And in both situations the only real way to prevent it is to form a gang and go through the gate camp ready for whatever is on the other side, or to form a gang and protect yourself in the AFK guy's system ready for whenever he decides to return. Now tell me, based on the logic above that both situations cause essentially the same outcome, how one is considered fair and we should live with it and "get used to it" and the other is something that you believe needs to be fixed, nerfed or otherwise taken care of so you can feel safer? I'm not quite sure I follow, becuase the solution you would offer for the gate camp seems to be an applicable solution to the cloaker: "form a gang and be ready for whatever awaits."
Tortun Nahme Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.08.11 17:26:00 - [99] because they haven't officially been told to shut up and stop whining about it yet by ccp? also someone mentioned that a afk cloaker isnt having to gang up, i propose we all afk cloak in pairs now! 2 afk cloakers to every system! Real men fly Pink. I've been living in your cassette, It's the modern equivalent, singing up to a Capulet, on a balcony in
RuleoftheBone Minmatar Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.08.11 17:44:00 - [100] Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 11/08/2007 17:52:06 Originally by: Elmicker (Speaking of which - is it just me, or are the only people who are opposed to any changes those who are not in a position of holding 0.0 territory? Its not that i've got anything against that, the likes of Veto do what they do and do it well, but how, with no experience of the situation, can they comment on it?) Check my actual corp history. Prior to Veto I lived in Omist with RNAL followed by every battle with UKC/LV from F4R2 right thru the final LV retreat from Detoroid. I have seen the best of the AFK cloakers (Burn Eden come to mind) and do you know what? Only the inattentive got jacked...or those that ignored intel channels....or those that ratted solo while ignoring local etc ad naseum. You just want more CAKE...your own little special world where nothing bad can ever happen to you and you can be free to grind ISK or mine ore without any risk at all. Get over it already and don't make false assumptions regarding other pilots experience. It's alliance pilots like you that tempt me to go to your system and sit in there with a cloaked Rifter and go walk the dog and have a nice swim KNOWING that my presence makes you nervous. But I personally don't do that...I have better things to do with my game time. This thread makes me laugh...a lot. EDIT...oh yeah...I forgot...I also lived in Fountain with UKC and flew with the excellent folks from F4T4L just before joining Veto. There...are you fully satisfied that I have more than enough experience to comment on this issue? Good. Now get back to your mining barge...not that there is anything wrong with mining of course . "Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the ** out of my way" General George Patton USA
Steel Tigeress Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2007.08.11 18:40:00 - [101] Originally by: Felysta Sandorn AFK cloaking in a system is an amazing tactic employed by many to tie up enemy resources... One way to counter such a ploy is to have a friendly Arazu pilot in system or nearby that can come to your aid at a moments notice, damp the hostile, and get you both to safety. Recons as a general rule don't have the DPS to kill someone before help can arrive. Alternatively, have some protection sat next to you if you're that worried! This is 0.0, not Hello Kitty World... There are risks, get over it! If you don't want the risk of being attacked in your system, either go and macro-mine in empire, or find a new game. Besides, you're in IAC, isn't one of your mottos 'Strength In Numbers'? It was when I used to fight you guys... Not as bad as some, but 3:2 ratios weren't uncommon. Surely you have members in the same system that can hop in combat ships and help you out? Name for me another way to negativly effect an enemies income, while AFK other than cloaking? The key words here in these arguments is "AFK" I dont thing anyone hear wants cloakers nerfed or made useless. Just for their ability to accomplish their goal while not even playing the game needs nerfed. All of the people saying all these counter measures to AFK cloakers... thats our point exactly. We are supposed to do all these things to protect miners anr ratters, from somone who may be at work or at a movie. Thats broken. Its NOT broken that they can cloak in our 0.0 systems, scout around, report intel, or engauge lone ships.
Gabriel Karade Quam Singulari M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.08.11 19:15:00 - [102] *Don't* be the only NPC'er in system - gang up, chain a belt each, and warp to each other when someone yells for help. *Don't* NPC in a crappy setup - use a PVP one if you can *Don't* leave your mining barges alone, fat and vulnerable in a belt - form up into big mining ops with some firepower on station - they can shoot the rats while the miners mine. *Don't* panic and loose your head - it's just one bloody ship for crying out loud. ---------- Video - 'War-Machine'
Steel Tigeress Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2007.08.11 19:27:00 - [103] Originally by: Gabriel Karade *Don't* be the only NPC'er in system - gang up, chain a belt each, and warp to each other when someone yells for help. *Don't* NPC in a crappy setup - use a PVP one if you can *Don't* leave your mining barges alone, fat and vulnerable in a belt - form up into big mining ops with some firepower on station - they can shoot the rats while the miners mine. *Don't* panic and loose your head - it's just one bloody ship for crying out loud. *Don't* pause (cloak) the game and go AFK in hostile territory so you can hinder your enemy while you arnt even home.
Pilok Shitfly Minmatar Soliders Of Eve The Makhai	Posted - 2007.08.11 19:45:00 - [104] Originally by: coldplasma Edited by: coldplasma on 10/08/2007 22:31:48 Originally by: Sir Heavy To become part of local, is a pirates most fierced weapon. Gotta love it when you use it on your enemy. Yeh, k, not when you want to rat in peace... It's not just about ratting in peace. If anything is wrong, I think it is being able to sit in an enemy home system and quite happily sit there all day while you run away to go shopping, watch TV, do what you gotta do, etc. And the fact that the enemy know they are there and know there is nothing they can do is only the extra kick in the balls. Removing local would be better, the cloaker would have to do something to get information about locals
Gabriel Karade Quam Singulari M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.08.11 19:45:00 - [105] Edited by: Gabriel Karade on 11/08/2007 19:46:02 Originally by: Steel Tigeress Originally by: Gabriel Karade *Don't* be the only NPC'er in system - gang up, chain a belt each, and warp to each other when someone yells for help. *Don't* NPC in a crappy setup - use a PVP one if you can *Don't* leave your mining barges alone, fat and vulnerable in a belt - form up into big mining ops with some firepower on station - they can shoot the rats while the miners mine. *Don't* panic and loose your head - it's just one bloody ship for crying out loud. *Don't* pause (cloak) the game and go AFK in hostile territory so you can hinder your enemy while you arnt even home. Cute, now lets see you prove they are afk, because I've used the old 'feign afk' trick myself to plick targets in Curse - wasn't in a cloaked ship, rather docked at an station, but the principle is the same and requires the virtue - patience And before you try to infer anything about my 0.0 experiance - I was in IAC dealing with the very same 'problem'. The only people who die are the stupid/stubborn ones who insist on not listening then 5 seconds before their pod burns yelling "ZOMG!!11 HELP MEH!!111" ---------- Video - 'War-Machine'
SiJira	Posted - 2007.08.11 19:49:00 - [106] ok the only way not to nerf perfectly balanced cloakers while simultaneously getting rid of afk people is a logout timer anything shorter than 60 minutes imho is too short to counter the macros some people will and do run all we need is eve to run with a counterpart that scans your system for 3rd party programs and you get investigated if a macro is found nerf my cloak and i will nerf your game i got enough real life cash to make the farmers multiply like bunny rabbits so dont tempt me ____ __ ________ _sig below_ devs and gms cant modify my sig if they tried!
Gabriel Karade Quam Singulari M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.08.11 19:58:00 - [107] In my experiance, any prolonged period of inactivity results in the client sitting there dumb and happy showing you a nice vista of space, when in reality the server has said 'on your bike son' and kicked you. It will continue to sit there dumb and happy until you try to move/scan/click a module/type something, at which point it 'disconnects' - though in reality you'd been long gone. ---------- Video - 'War-Machine'
Tortun Nahme Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.08.11 20:26:00 - [108] Originally by: Steel Tigeress Originally by: Felysta Sandorn AFK cloaking in a system is an amazing tactic employed by many to tie up enemy resources... One way to counter such a ploy is to have a friendly Arazu pilot in system or nearby that can come to your aid at a moments notice, damp the hostile, and get you both to safety. Recons as a general rule don't have the DPS to kill someone before help can arrive. Alternatively, have some protection sat next to you if you're that worried! This is 0.0, not Hello Kitty World... There are risks, get over it! If you don't want the risk of being attacked in your system, either go and macro-mine in empire, or find a new game. Besides, you're in IAC, isn't one of your mottos 'Strength In Numbers'? It was when I used to fight you guys... Not as bad as some, but 3:2 ratios weren't uncommon. Surely you have members in the same system that can hop in combat ships and help you out? Name for me another way to negativly effect an enemies income, while AFK other than cloaking? you asked for it training skills, building/researching, setting long qeues in an outpost before abandoning it, by NOT being a target. heck most of those we can do while logged off even! AFK has no effect on anyones profit, their fear does Real men fly Pink. I've been living in your cassette, It's the modern equivalent, singing up to a Capulet, on a balcony in
Cleric JohnPreston	Posted - 2007.08.11 20:32:00 - [109] Originally by: Steel Tigeress Originally by: Gabriel Karade *Don't* be the only NPC'er in system - gang up, chain a belt each, and warp to each other when someone yells for help. *Don't* NPC in a crappy setup - use a PVP one if you can *Don't* leave your mining barges alone, fat and vulnerable in a belt - form up into big mining ops with some firepower on station - they can shoot the rats while the miners mine. *Don't* panic and loose your head - it's just one bloody ship for crying out loud. *Don't* pause (cloak) the game and go AFK in hostile territory so you can hinder your enemy while you arnt even home. What gives you the right to dictate to anyone here how to play their game. I pay my money per month like you, if i want to AFK cloak in your system well thats just too ******* bad for you. Deal with it. Its my money and my play time.
SiJira	Posted - 2007.08.11 21:29:00 - [110] Originally by: Tortun Nahme AFK has no effect on anyones profit, their fear does t3 quote right there! ____ __ ________ _sig below_ devs and gms cant modify my sig if they tried!
Tao Han Synthetic Frontiers	Posted - 2007.08.11 22:03:00 - [111] Originally by: Steel Tigeress Quote: Seriously, fly with friends. You are in 0.0, UNSECURED SPACE. You aren't supposed to fly blissfully afk knowing you are perfectly safe. Hell, us Empire Carebears get told to fly with friends all the time, why shouldn't you? Whining about feeling unsafe and having to worry because someone might attack you when you live in 0.0 makes us Empire Carebears seem like almighty PvPers. Heh, and they call US carebears. Deal with it. Fly with friends. Watch who you smack talk and who you turn into an enemy. Now apply every argument you just made, and apply it to cloakers.... They arnt just flying blissfully in UNSECURED space. They are flying blissfully through ENEMY unsecured space AFK, knowing they are perfectly safe. I meen hell, you Empire carebears get told to fly with friends all the time... why should afk cloakers in harsh 0.0 be any different? And to the person that said use probes, and smartbombs. 2 problems.... 1) cloakers cant be probed....duh. 2) Smartbombs DONT REMOVE CLOAK...try it with a friend befor you post, it makes you look less foolish if you know of what you speak. Wait, is he AFK or is he flying around? Make up your mind please. ------
Skelator Stronghold corp Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.11 22:12:00 - [112] Edited by: Skelator on 11/08/2007 22:13:51 Edited by: Skelator on 11/08/2007 22:13:21 Look up the term "Heavy Escort"! Just using this tactic will answer your complaints about the above subject. If you are ratting then rat in a Gang so your M8's can warp to you in under 30 seconds in a emergency. Phasmatis Velox Equitatus
Bluebeard LoneStar Industries Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2007.08.11 22:22:00 - [113] We've been through this many times before and nothing has changed. People who are not docked or inside a POS shield and go AFK for an extended period, should have a chance that they'll be in their cloning station when they return. For this to remain true, then either a cloaked ship must be probeable, or the cloak has to fail in some way. An active Covert Ops pilot should be untouchable and even one that is semi-afk and justs moves safespot every 10 or 20 minutes should be safe. Somebody that leaves a ship cloaked instead of logging out, goes out to work and comes back 8 hours later shouldn't be surprised that people spend an hour or two tracking down his ship and killing him.
SiJira	Posted - 2007.08.11 22:30:00 - [114] the problem with that tracking stuff is that if it becomes bugged it might be months before it is changed and sometimes bugged stuff remains as a feature so a simple logout timer if you are away for 75 minutes should do the trick - i bet it would solve a lot of lag and help give accurate numbers of how many active people are online ____ __ ________ _sig below_ devs and gms cant modify my sig if they tried!
Steel Tigeress Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2007.08.11 22:35:00 - [115] Originally by: SiJira ok the only way not to nerf perfectly balanced cloakers while simultaneously getting rid of afk people is a logout timer anything shorter than 60 minutes imho is too short to counter the macros some people will and do run all we need is eve to run with a counterpart that scans your system for 3rd party programs and you get investigated if a macro is found nerf my cloak and i will nerf your game i got enough real life cash to make the farmers multiply like bunny rabbits so dont tempt me I agree with you right there.. Cloaks arnt broken at all. And I have never said they were. In fact in most of the threads this is debated in I always say a logoff timer would be the most simple fix. Personally I think an hour is too long, but thats for the devs to decide if its ever implimented. But even an hour would be way better than things are now.
Steel Tigeress Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2007.08.11 22:44:00 - [116] Originally by: Cleric JohnPreston Originally by: Steel Tigeress *Don't* pause (cloak) the game and go AFK in hostile territory so you can hinder your enemy while you arnt even home. What gives you the right to dictate to anyone here how to PLAY their game. I pay my money per month like you, if i want to AFK cloak in your system well thats just too ******* bad for you. Deal with it. Its my money and my play time. Bolded the important part of your poor excuse. If you are PLAYING the game, then there is no issue. If you arnt, then you are no better than a macro miner. Both accomplish things in game while not playing.
murder one Gallente Death of Virtue Axiom Empire	Posted - 2007.08.11 23:14:00 - [117] IMO anything not using a T2 (read: anything but Cov Ops, Recons or SBs) cloak should be probable. [07:13:55] doctorstupid2 > what do i train now? [07:14:05] Trista Rotnor > little boys to 2 Fleet Combat Ships
Eternus8lux8lucis Minmatar FW Inc	Posted - 2007.08.12 03:00:00 - [118] Want to stop the macro ratter? Want to make the game fun and hunting a challenge? Want to make unsecure space unsecure? Easy. Change local. The way local works atm is simply to show anyone that jumps in, its updated instantly, often before the person is actually in the system based on their screen. Why? Space is huge!! Should the guy 200aus away from the gate know that there is someone within 200aus of him? Not a chance. Blues, friendlies or those who you have standing with show up instantly. An "IFF" style beacon displays that goes out to all friendly ships in the area. Hi! Im here...ID code 2nei394 sent. Anyone else doesnt show up. Until...one of two conditions occur. You bump within range of them and "see" them on your screen and within your instanced universe. Or someone else thats friendly with you "sees" them in the same way. The ship scanner or probing would report a ship in local but not the type. So within the local screen you could have two changable options. One for players in system and one for players and ships. Yet if you warp off and you no longer are in contact with them they stay in local, but again only for a set amount of time. Same idea as the aggression timer, but could be varied by the ship type. Who reported it, distance, etc. Over a set amount of time youd still know there WAS someone there but are they STILL there? you dont know, now you gotta scout, hunt around, probe. So any AFK cloaked ship eventually wouldnt have a populated local at all. And even if they sat at a gate watching as people jumped in to get the intel it would go away over time and would be time sensitive. So youd never know if they had stayed, just run through or anything. MAcroers, ratters or miners...guess what. You either watch aroudn your ship liek a hawk, use scanner or probes to find out who or what COULD be around you. No more guy jumps in hunting a ratter and the guy instalogs, instaSS and cloaks. He wouldnt know you were there until it MIGHT be to late. No more macroing as itd mean instant death. No more afking as it wouldnt do any good. Wanna kill? Gotta hunt, gotta move, gotta leg it around. Are you alone? Youd never know. Its not space, you can now hide in space for years on end if you did it right. Or you could warp in on someone and have a very surprising encounter. Also when you see a ship, have a delay for ID. Like if youd jump into a belt youd see a ship pop up on your local, but itd take a few seconds, again based on your ship type to ID the ship. Same as locking it up takes varying times. So locking up and shooting might earn you a little blue on blue action. But would give the other party a chance based on the ship theyr flying and your flying. So the price for "catching the fly" might be blue on blue. ;) You wouldnt know. Now cloaks have a purpose. And you just fixed low sec and 0.0. And made the HUNT the main ingrediant in PvP. And made stealthy hiding a valuable asset. *********************************************** Where do we go from here? When theres no up and no down anymore...onward....ever onward into the vastnes of chaos till you find the light within.
Steel Tigeress Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2007.08.12 04:13:00 - [119] Originally by: Eternus8lux8lucis Your Idea you know I actually really like that idea, as it would cause the AFK cloakers to cease being a problem. But the other issue it doesnt help with, and thats that cloaks would still act as a pause button for anyone that can fit it, and they'ld face no risk AFK in 0.0 The one thing I would add to your idea though is: In space you have SOV in, if somone jumps into the system, they still show in local like they had been spotted. But would then fade from local after whatever time it takes. This way residents that own a system are still warned that a hostile entered, but after 5 mins or whatever they wouldnt know if the person left, logged or is prowling around.
RtoZ	Posted - 2007.08.12 04:25:00 - [120] Haven't read the thread so my apologies if I repeat anything. Anyways, imo the problem with this is not the cov ops but the mechanics of local itself. So the answer to this problem is not counter cloakers, I mean, hes sitting there cloaked, pffft big deal, it's the very mechanics of local which make this possible. There should be no obligatory player id in local in 0.0 for this and many other reasons. Make local a broadcast like thing, where you show up if you type and only for a few mins and the mechanics of afk cloaking would be irrelevant. I don't like the idea of 0.0 being the most dangerous place in EVE yet you're forced to go there with a huge bloody "I AM HERE, COME SHOOT ME" sign on you're ships bow. Dosen't make any sense to me. The same applies for map stats. There should be corp and/or alliance stats in the map, and local chat between alliance members, but the game would be more fun imo if alliances didn't have such tight control of who is in there systems and where forced to do some real recon, instead of having alts and trial accounts sitting in every important system. All of the above could be justified within the eve storyline pretty easily, and after the initial shell shock would actually make eve pretty fun in lowsec, as cat and mouse is allways fun. As it is now its not cat and mouse, its a pigeon shoot. With 20 shotguns for each pigeon.

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