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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Grunck	Posted - 2007.10.11 23:34:00 - [961] /signed
Flinx Evenstar Minmatar Spartan Industries Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2007.10.11 23:36:00 - [962] Originally by: Orree However...this thread isn't about any of this. It's about shabby treatment in the face of service and sacrifice. It's about the consequences of that sacrifice. It's about proof of what many of us have been saying for a very long time. Orree, stop being so bloody good at posting please I, erm, like kill things and stuff
Director Stoned Band of Developers	Posted - 2007.10.11 23:39:00 - [963] I don't get it, if Gungankllr is the bandit and Velios is Smokey and BoB represent all those stupid policemen, then who is the hot chick?
Tomcatt Amarr STK Scientific M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.10.11 23:40:00 - [964] Originally by: Director Stoned I don't get it, if Gungankllr is the bandit and Velios is Smokey and BoB represent all those stupid policemen, then who is the hot chick? Bodacious Babe
marakor Gallente Anti Lag Forum Smackers	Posted - 2007.10.11 23:46:00 - [965] Edited by: marakor on 11/10/2007 23:51:35 Originally by: Orree Originally by: marakor Originally by: Celdorae Anvil., Angels of Discord, CORE, Dark Matter Coallition, Ekliptika, Event-Horizon, Fallout Project, Insurgency, IRON, Invictus, Ka-Tet, Morsus Mihi, Mordus Angels, Mostly Harmless, Pandemic Legion, Peons of Doom, Pure, RA, Razor Alliance, Roadkill, Rule of Three, Nxt Level, Smash Alliance, Stela Polar,Synchronizerz, TCF, The Makhai, Hydra Alliance, Fate. Corp, Te-KA,Vae Victis. The Covenant Alliance, Prismatic Refraction, The Reckoning. Phoenix Allianz, The Makhai. I see a lot of names here and yes over the 5-6 months these guys may have shot a gun or two at you but lets be honest making out that for 6 months all theese guy were constantly attacking you and that you were worn down eventualy after a long and bitter war is a total fabrication. The largest fleet that came against you was when razor and buddies attacked with tri and we had about 400 ships total. You repulsed that attack and it was days if not weeks before razor and buddies came back with a better plan and tri were nowhere near bkg and razor fleets were considerably smaller than 400. You're absolutely right in that many of those entities contributed very little, if anything to the overall campaign in the North. The list major, active players is far shorter than a lot of peopel seem to want to admit. Where you're missing the boat is that is wasn't about numbers OR Triumvirate. The major difference in the success of the third offensive was that for the FIRST time, the final assault on BKG was part of a larger plan--- well-organized, well-orchestrated and far more determined than the earlier assaults on V7-M1D and BKG. Those first assaults were basically off-the-cuff, hastily prepared operations. The first attack on BKG was carried out with other objectives in mind and those objectives were actually successful from our point of view, even if the assault itself failed to secure BKG for our side. Yes...they seemingly folded to a smaller force, but the plan under which that force operated was better in every way. Couple with that the fact that it was coming after months of pretty steady pressure, and you have a situation where these guys were at a breaking point and saw very little reason to continue to be subjected to the onslaught. My guess is that if they had felt like there was any hope of reinforcement, they might have tried to stick it out. There really wasn't, so they didn't. However...this thread isn't about any of this. It's about shabby treatment in the face of service and sacrifice. It's about the consequences of that sacrifice. It's about proof of what many of us have been saying for a very long time. Nice to see a responce to my post that is actualy well written and thought out instead of the usual acusation of me being a BOB alt or other remarks and although i disagree on a few of the points i will say that you realy got your sht together for your big push. I certainly do not want you to feel that im taking anything away from your campaign as it was very well orchestrated but the fact remains that the leadership and direction that the new north coalition was led in was one that to any tactician was obviously a one way trip to destruction. But i wholeheartedly agree they fell sooner rather than later due to your excellent tactics. The opinions that i give are* the opinions of my corp although my alts opinions may differ as this is my forum smack alt.
Pyro Cat	Posted - 2007.10.11 23:48:00 - [966] (worms armageddon voice) The first of many!
Lady Gothic M. Corp M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.10.11 23:57:00 - [967] Damnit !!! I thought I was the sexy chick
zilllii Squirrel Power	Posted - 2007.10.11 23:58:00 - [968] Originally by: Kryztal Originally by: Apophis Omega Originally by: Maximillian Bayonette I always liked M.Pire, and I thought you did a great job holding us off in the north, but this turncoat deal as tarnished you. Of course the coalition will jump on this, claiming you're not turncoats and that you have "seen the light", but as you yourself have admitted here, you turned on your allies because of isk. Well done.[/quote Acctually we can pay that 6b no problem. Its principle, we will not be someones pet/renter/slave. Simple ain't it? We thought we were friends, we got slapped in the face by our friend so we decided to slap them back. To that docking rights thing. Your full of crap bob. We could dock their 24hours before and all of a sudden is disappears when you offer us rent or gtfo. You could dock there 24hours before cos the station was in eclipse hands not tinfoil, and you needed to have +ve standings with eclipse right away otherwise our POS's would have pwn'd you When we transfered the station to tinfoil the message to get you docking access back didnt hit the right people right away then all the drama happend. Nobody was forcing your hand to take a rent deal it was on the table to get you a space for your people. We did ask you to leave Delve as its BoB only and we dont rent that out to anyone. 4years on and kryztal still havent learned to use the proper quote function ever, cheeesus. gimme bigger letter count in my sig so it wont cut off everything damnit!!!!
Jeremiah Orr Aliastra	Posted - 2007.10.12 00:45:00 - [969] Damn, you sure know how to make a man rethink his retirement. Good call M.Pire and good luck to my friends in STK. Give em hell.
Amy Frost eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.10.12 01:00:00 - [970] less ppl to shoot at :( Oh well welcome to the otherside of the party o7 Originally by: t20 bree si not suppsoed to be ptu thruog a hoem crabontaion sysetm !

Mesuinu M. Corp M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.10.12 01:24:00 - [971] I have been shooting RA since: 22/09/2005 I have been shooting Goons since: 10/12/2006 I have been shooting BoB since: TBA I'm in it for the lulz. /signed ---
Apocalypse2005 Amarr Spartan Industries Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2007.10.12 01:46:00 - [972] My only concern is... Could this be a BOB ploy? Seems too ... easy
Orree Gallente Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.10.12 02:04:00 - [973] Originally by: Digicomm Ok, so let me get this straight. Cause there seems to be alot of bull** going around. <snip> Any what are you trying to do? Double 30+ pages of "bull**" in one post? Nice work. In my estimation, you succeeded. "How much easier it is to be critical than to be correct." ---Benjamin Disraeli
Clay101 Caldari M. Corp M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.10.12 02:11:00 - [974] Originally by: Apocalypse2005 My only concern is... Could this be a BOB ploy? Seems too ... easy are you effing kidding me?! Smacktalk Specialization Lvl 5
Royaldo Gallente KVA Noble Inc. Institute of Cooperative Education	Posted - 2007.10.12 02:14:00 - [975] can this go to 50 pages? what is the status atm?
Testosterone Bomb Red Ballz	Posted - 2007.10.12 02:40:00 - [976] Edited by: Testosterone Bomb on 12/10/2007 02:45:07 I have been reading this thread and I think the problem is that there was a misunderstanding on the part of both Bob and M.pire in regards to what type of relationship they had with each other. From what I read my take is this M.pire û Buddies / Family with Bob. No reason to deal with this relationship like a ledger or contract. We watch your back and you watch ours philosophy. We are going to south to join the fight and will crash in a few systems and put our fleet and capitals where you need them after all thatÆs what friends do. Bob û Landlord / Tenant relationship. Tenant gets the privilege to occupy said space under the conditions stipulated by the Landlord. Please see your contract for the specifics regarding Rent, Station Fees, Allowed Offices in both NPC and PC Stations, Hunting and Mining rights, Right of way conditions to move in and out of your contracted space. I think that the problem that most Bob tenants have is that donÆt understand that if Bob wants them on the front lines they have the right to negotiate a separate MERC contract for their time and full expenses. After all Bob wants a business relationship so itÆs only fair for them to have to pay for your time if youÆre helping them with an offensive. For those Bob Tenants that fly for Bob free, thatÆs your choice but itÆs really not the relationship you have with your landlord so not really sure why you do it. Fly Safe
Nolan Stone M. Corp M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.10.12 03:08:00 - [977] Originally by: Testosterone Bomb Edited by: Testosterone Bomb on 12/10/2007 02:45:07 I have been reading this thread and I think the problem is that there was a misunderstanding on the part of both Bob and M.pire in regards to what type of relationship they had with each other. From what I read my take is this M.pire û Buddies / Family with Bob. No reason to deal with this relationship like a ledger or contract. We watch your back and you watch ours philosophy. We are going to south to join the fight and will crash in a few systems and put our fleet and capitals where you need them after all thatÆs what friends do. Bob û Landlord / Tenant relationship. Tenant gets the privilege to occupy said space under the conditions stipulated by the Landlord. Please see your contract for the specifics regarding Rent, Station Fees, Allowed Offices in both NPC and PC Stations, Hunting and Mining rights, Right of way conditions to move in and out of your contracted space. I think that the problem that most Bob tenants have is that donÆt understand that if Bob wants them on the front lines they have the right to negotiate a separate MERC contract for their time and full expenses. After all Bob wants a business relationship so itÆs only fair for them to have to pay for your time if youÆre helping them with an offensive. For those Bob Tenants that fly for Bob free, thatÆs your choice but itÆs really not the relationship you have with your landlord so not really sure why you do it. Fly Safe I gotta tell ya. I think this guy has the most insight i've seen in this thread. --------------------- Don't tase me, Bro!
Devian 666 Sectoid Technologies	Posted - 2007.10.12 03:14:00 - [978] Originally by: Testosterone Bomb I think that the problem that most Bob tenants have is that don’t understand that if Bob wants them on the front lines they have the right to negotiate a separate MERC contract for their time and full expenses. After all Bob wants a business relationship so it’s only fair for them to have to pay for your time if you’re helping them with an offensive. I think this has identified a very specific issue. M.Pire offered to fight on their behalf in mercenary style so BoB requested M.Pire pay them for offering that service. Most mercenaries are paid by their clients, they don't pay too their clients. Perhaps this was a simple misunderstanding, perhaps MC pays BoB for the honor to fight for them and BoB expect all mercenaries to operate this way. I agree I don't have the features to be a holoreel star. Originally by: rycar Devian 666 is awesome quote this if you're down
ZenTex Interstellar eXodus R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.10.12 03:25:00 - [979] And you'd expect BoB to pay them 6 billion per corp? Nah... There's little a sledgehammer can't fix. If you can't fix it, you need a bigger sledgehammer. If it's unfixable, blame CCP. :p
Kartis Was Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2007.10.12 04:04:00 - [980] Originally by: bulabuba Look, BoB's model of empire building is that a core of elite PvPers take space by force, own it, and rent it to residents who aren't so good at taking space by force themselves. Better or worse, that's their model. (Goonswarm's model, on the other hand)is egalitarian. Any old somebody can join in because their model of empire building is based on a Mongolian horde of not-so-elites. As long as the game mechanics give these tactics some weight, they may stand a chance, but don't count on it. In February they had lots of momentum and looked to be unstoppable. Nine months later they look a lot more stoppable, and time is not on their side. Now that things have started to cool a bit, IÆd like to say that of all the posts in this thread, that one was the best. Because that, in a nutshell, is what this war has always been about. ItÆs all about the elite, hand-picked fighter versus the unwashed masses. WeÆve all read the bitter complaints from BoB and friends about goonies not bringing real ships or real skills to the fight. And probably every single member of Eve knows that if BoB has its way, no one would own 0.0 space, that it would be theirs and theirs along. And yet, how many times have you read people talking about how much they HATE the goons, a truly bitter hatred. Well, hereÆs the truth about the goons, and I write this because itÆs disturbing to hear even some m.pire people seemingly a bit shamed by the turn of events, saying, oh no, weÆre not joining the goons, honest. The fact is, the goonies represent everything that is good about this game. Unlike BoB who believe that this game should be the province of a chosen few, the goonies say to brand new pilots, donÆt waste your time slogging through profitless trading runs of robotic parts and roses, come on out here and make some real money. They say, donÆt grind Level I missions in empire where NPC pirates net, what, 3,000 isk a kill plus maybe 35K in agent reward, they say, screw that, come out to our space and have fun. Maybe you canÆt kill whatÆs out here by yourself, but sure as hell, 20 of you can. But better that that, the goons came to Eve to have fun, not inflate a e-peen based on how long theyÆd paid their monthly dues. I flew with them over a year ago in SU and the Syndicate pipe. NOTHING was as exhilarating as flying in a goonie gang. Someone report a hostile in the pipe? Within two minutes thereÆd be 50 goons on the gate ganged and ready to go. All you can fly is a Kessie? No problem. YouÆll have plenty of company, the more the merrier. They flew with no attitude at all, no expectations... and it was sheer exhilaration setting out with them. Because no one cared. Maybe youÆd warp in and get a kill, maybe youÆd warp in and get slaughtered, implants and all. AND NO ONE CARED. It was all for the fun. So for any of you out there who seem to think that the goonies are just as bad as BoB, or actually worse, guess what. YouÆre wrong. The goons are the best thing that ever happened to this game. Because in a game that is stuck with a system that rewards players based on their character age through a maddeningly slow and expensive accretion of skills, the Goonies found a way to make it fun for new pilots and old. And CCP knows that, and in the end, thatÆs all that counts. So IÆm hoping that M.Pire, far from , being a bit embarrassed for having switched sides, actually comes to realize that theyÆve made the best of all possible choices and come to love flying with the Goonies. ThereÆs a reason why people hate the New York Yankees. ThereÆs a reason why people hate Chelsea. And the reason is simple. No one likes pompous, arrogant arses. The arses might win in the end, but no one will ever really like them. Personally, IÆll take the Philadelphia Phillies, or Arsenal, or Blackburn or Fulham. And personally, I'll say, bravo M.Pire, well done!

el Bodak M. Corp M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.10.12 04:19:00 - [981] 35 pages of posts about this topic. wow Now let the truth be told now!!! I was the one in convos with BOB. I wont say the name because I still like and respect said person for the person they are, not what side they are on. From the beginning of the conversation I asked said BOB member the possiblity of MPIRE assisting or hitting a few systems with BOB/MC with MPIRE holding the systems managing poses so BOB did not have to worry about the poses and we all could continue pew pewing. The only reason I asked this was that yes MPIRE did just lose own homes up north but we wanted to be on the front lines and needed a home in which to operate out of. It was not the intention of MPIRE to show up and say please give me a home as we dont have one. It was the intention of MPIRE to come and give continued support to BOB/MC as we have done for a very long time. An idea of an offer was devised between myself and said BOB member that yes if MPIRE did come to the front lines and take said systems with or without BOBs help that in turn we would help place pos holders in other BOB systems for place holders. The next day I was told by my BOB contact that there was no way that our idea would come to play and that we would infact have to pay 6B a month for the opportunity to take said systems if we wanted to have them as our home, and also we wouldnt have a choice in where MPIRE would be placed that would be left to BOB to decide. This is where MPIRE was hit in the gut. As has been said before why in the H*** would we want to pay someone to put ourselves out on the front lines fight the fight and maybe just maybe we would get a few systems we could call home. MPIRE has done some soul searching over the last few days and we have decided we dont need to pay anybody to find a home. We will get a home again. The problem with that is its hard to find a home in 0.0 nowadays with the 2 sides. YES we have set BOB to neutral, we have not sided with the goons, MPIRE is here to set a new way in EVE and a third party that will grow strong. MPIRE will make new friends. We will get stonger, and together with many new friends we will forge a new route without either of the 2 big parties in EVE att. Hope this at least clears up some confussion and answers some questions for those that really wanted to know. Fly safe everyone and lets have soem FUN!!!!! Lazyb P.S. for all its worth I will have to say no to joining BOB at this time but thx for all the offers. I hope we can still be friends though.
Lord Alpha	Posted - 2007.10.12 04:19:00 - [982] /signed
Muro Deez GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.10.12 04:20:00 - [983] Originally by: Kartis Was text This is an excellent writeup of pretty much our entire goon philosophy, thank you.
Zigadenus M. Corp M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.10.12 04:34:00 - [984] Ha I almost forgot. Go Rockies!! ________________________________________________ Kyle > Why do you have to ask me all these complicated questions? Zerodragon > Dude, IÆm trying to save your setup from complete suckage.
Tirk Umpat Ex Coelis Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.12 04:38:00 - [985] Good luck o7
Martin VanBuren GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.10.12 04:46:00 - [986] Edited by: Martin VanBuren on 12/10/2007 04:45:58 Originally by: Muro Deez Originally by: Kartis Was text This is an excellent writeup of pretty much our entire goon philosophy, thank you. Actually I am pretty sure our stated plan is to conquer all of 0.0 and hold it hostage until CCP releases a new line of ships based, both theoretically and aesthetically, upon the Monster Truck Gravedigger.
Manu Sadi STK Scientific M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.10.12 05:10:00 - [987] I don't have to tell you things are bad. Everybody knows things are bad. It's a depression. Everybody's out of work or scared of losing their job. The dollar buys a nickel's worth; banks are going bust; shopkeepers keep a gun under the counter; punks are running wild in the streets, and there's nobody anywhere who seems to know what to do, and there's no end to it. We know the air is unfit to breathe and our food is unfit to eat. And we sit watching our TVs while some local newscaster tells us that today we had fifteen homicides and sixty-three violent crimes, as if that's the way it's supposed to be! We all know things are bad -- worse than bad -- they're crazy. It's like everything everywhere is going crazy, so we don't go out anymore. We sit in the house, and slowly the world we're living in is getting smaller, and all we say is, "Please, at least leave us alone in our own living rooms. Let me have my toaster and my TV and my steel-belted radials, and I won't say anything. Just leave us alone." Well I'm not going to leave you alone. I want you to get mad! I don't want you to protest. I don't want you to riot. I don't want you to write to your Congressman, because I wouldn't know what to tell you to write. I don't know what to do about the depression and the inflation and the Russians and the crime in the street. All I know is that first, you've got to get mad. You've gotta say, "I'm a human being! My life has value!" So, I want you to get up now. I want all of you to get up out of your chairs. I want you to get up right now and go to the window, open it, and stick your head out and yell, "I'm as mad as hell, and I'm not going to take this anymore!!"
Testosterone Bomb Red Ballz	Posted - 2007.10.12 05:18:00 - [988] Edited by: Testosterone Bomb on 12/10/2007 05:21:56 Network- I'm Mad as Hell Good film :) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dib2-HBsF08 - With French Caption - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90ELleCQvew&mode=related&search=
Josta Webisna Gallente M. Corp M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.10.12 05:24:00 - [989] This thread delivers
Testosterone Bomb Red Ballz	Posted - 2007.10.12 05:31:00 - [990] Ever think that Howard Beale was talking about BOB ? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-HjHwrIuqHs&mode=related&search=



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