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DHB WildCat BURN EDEN	Posted - 2007.11.23 01:28:00 - [1] In the old days of EVE a 40 mil sp character would go around in his Mega / Domi / Scorpion or whatever and if he came accross 4 10 mil sp characters he would kill them all. In those days you were rewarded for being an older player, spending more time and isk on skills and ships. A battleship would kill 4 cruisers. However it seems eve has now turned to numbers. What I mean by this is now a days that same Mega, would probably die to 4 cruisers. Be it from EW or speed. Yes numbers will usually win in the blob sense, but it seems that now with the upcoming patch, cruisers (T1) are on par with Battleships. This is due entirely to scripts. They make Damps, Tracking Disruptors, sensor boosters, tracking comps.... well any active mod entirely useless. Example - sniping battleship 200km out script in sensor booster for range. Interceptor begins 200km out, Battleship will not have it locked until it is within 20km, or scramble range. So what does this mean. I see This game turning into who can field the most logistic ships, nano hacs, and rooks as the power gangs of eve. All Battleships will be useless unless fit in a "Blaster" set-up with a huge Passive tank. Everything that used to be "out of the ordinary" will no longer be of use. Tactics will be thrown out of the window and it will become a slugfest of speed, blasters, and remote repping. This is how I see the game going and it does concern me a little. Everyone will be equal in the game no matter the characters age. I guess this post is more of a discuss what you think the future holds, more than anything else. I for one am concerned. However that is just one "undrunk" opinion. WildCat
Ivor Gunn No One Expects The Spanish Inquisition	Posted - 2007.11.23 01:28:00 - [2] I'd read it. But i can't. Post in a real colour and try again.
Dahak2150 Chaos Monkeys Monkey Religion	Posted - 2007.11.23 01:32:00 - [3] blinks ---------------- Originally by: "Cyberus" cause its has no sence anyway your brains is simply wont accept that anyway.
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2007.11.23 01:33:00 - [4] Edited by: Crumplecorn on 23/11/2007 01:41:14 What does the scanner say about his Irony Level? Irony or not, I love the sound of BSes going around pwning all smaller ships, but the whole players-working-together-always-outperform-soloers setup is probably better from an objective point of view. - I wish I was a three foot female doll with a watering can and heterochromatic eyes.
Danae Melios Azteca Transportation Unlimited	Posted - 2007.11.23 01:34:00 - [5] /me starts training for logistics ships Actually, my question is if you are in a sniping battleship, would you have a webber and drones to take care of an interceptor? Not having really flown battleships in pvp I've never bothered to familiarize myself with their setups, so this is an honest question. Is it possible to snipe and prepare for the point as well? Originally by: game box Conceive a new life without boundaries, where murder, plunder, betrayal, and delusions of grandeur will lead you to boundless glory or to the brink of ruin.
Ivorian	Posted - 2007.11.23 01:50:00 - [6] i am not plaing eve this long, but how many 40 mill chars where there in the "old" days? :). Like when it came out? Or 3 years after the release. Becauce this should be around when you have 40 mill SP (just guessing, no adv learning skills, no high implants). And now or than, 4 cruiser should be a fair setup against one BS. After all this is a MMORPG. Not a ipownyoubecauceiamolder game. You should need backup or support.
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong Namtz'aar k'in	Posted - 2007.11.23 01:55:00 - [7] I'm confused by your logic... If your outnumbered, then the EW nerf is a good thing. because you won't get damped to ****. you'll get damped less meaning after the patch you'll do better when fighting cruisers. Also after mentioning cruisers you bring up interceptors... why? I thought this was talking about how the nerf effects cruisers? you make some strange jumps in logic there my friend. Official fanboy of jenny< pink supporter! looking to work in the art department with CCP, 3 years and counting. http://www.digipen.edu/main/Gallery_Games_2004#Narbacular_Dropthi
Flinx Evenstar Minmatar Spartan Industries Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.11.23 01:58:00 - [8] Originally by: Crumplecorn Edited by: Crumplecorn on 23/11/2007 01:41:14 What does the scanner say about his Irony Level? Yeah mega LOL Burn Eden made their name by using damps from 150km with cloaking stabbed ravens. Remind me again DHB, how many years does it take to use a damp, a cloak , or a stab Irony overload detected [04:58:57] Azzloran > ever heard of a drake? you wont like them when they decloak on you
Metal Dude Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.11.23 02:00:00 - [9] Wow, what can I say. I agree with BE. Older players get no love from CCP at all. All they do is nerf us and all the time we spent training skills that became worthless or changed later, so that lower skill players can pawn veterans like we were noobs. This game has been going down hill for years now. POS wars are so bad that when a call for dreads goes out, people log off. Dreads are useless for combat, Carriers will soon be nerfed, Titans are a big logistic jump bridge ship now, nothing more. Dictors > super caps, mining is worthless grind, NPC farmers, macro miners, isk sellers problems all ignored by CCP. That's not even mentioning blobs and lag. I can go on and on and on. I suggest a month off. If everyone that has a problem with the game's direction would take a month off and suspend their subscription, I would bet that would get CCPs attention. It's either that or some bad publicity campaign about how the game is sucking at the moment with all the PC gamerÆs magazines, but that might get you banned. Otherwise, CCP don't care and are laughing at us all the way to the bank. The truth will set you free
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2007.11.23 02:02:00 - [10] Originally by: Metal Dude CCP don't care and are laughing at us all the way to the bank. Then they deserve our money for their acting skills. - I wish I was a three foot female doll with a watering can and heterochromatic eyes.
Karn Mithralia Minmatar Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2007.11.23 02:02:00 - [11] Edited by: Karn Mithralia on 23/11/2007 02:04:24 Yeh, why sensor-boosters and tracking-comps are getting tweaked is beyond me. Its not like snipers are incredibly over-powered as is. A quick look at the market will show you how popular these modules are in their current state. Not very. Ranged ships are a great way to bring variety to pvp, the script changes will see them used less. Thats bad for the game IMO. -----------------------------------------
DHB WildCat BURN EDEN	Posted - 2007.11.23 02:09:00 - [12] I apologise for the confusion, let me try to clear things up. Younger players in smaller ships should die to an older player in a larger ship, right? Well scripts are allowing ships like the new EW ships to be able to get to and disable fleet Battleships before they can even be locked. There is no gap anymore between older and younger players. As far as tactics - We'll take my Raven. I can right now, effectively battle 5-10 ships, depending on the gang make-up. This is because I spent near 3 years training missiles skills and EW skills to the maximum limit. Damps allow me to negate 3 ships, missiles will take out the weaker ones, and the neuts will take out the ceptors with my drones. This is no longer possible with scripts. My main point is that a 1 day old rifter pilot is now as important as a 4 year old Battleship pilot. I think that is wrong. WildCat
Tortun Nahme Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.11.23 02:14:00 - [13] your logic fails simply due to the fact that no ship should be a solopwnmobile, as stated repeatedly by the devs you can wipe out any thousand of those new pilots on by themselves, but yeah if they all come at you at once you are dead for a very good reason Originally by: Cecil Montague They should change that warning on entering low sec to: "Go read Crime and Punishment for a few days then come back."
Flinx Evenstar Minmatar Spartan Industries Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.11.23 02:14:00 - [14] Originally by: DHB WildCat There is no gap anymore between older and younger players. There never was. If you were looking at character age and thinking you could own them, then you are not as smart as I thought. After 6 months, any character is a threat. Specialisation is key to this game. I would never think that I can solo 4 BS just because they are younger than me. Thats a good thing. Adapt dude, so far you have been very good at it [04:58:57] Azzloran > ever heard of a drake? you wont like them when they decloak on you
Surfin's PlunderBunny Minmatar mUfFiN fAcToRy	Posted - 2007.11.23 02:15:00 - [15] Translation: I got pwned by a noob and now I whining on the forum Originally by: ISD Valorem The Devs have stated multiple times that they are looking at the Amarr issues. Weekly The Tick quote... "I can't lose my name! It's on all my stationary!" ~The Tick
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2007.11.23 02:18:00 - [16] Originally by: DHB WildCat Younger players in smaller ships should die to an older player in a larger ship, right? Depends on how many and how much younger. Originally by: DHB WildCat I can right now, effectively battle 5-10 ships, depending on the gang make-up. This is because I spent near 3 years training missiles skills and EW skills to the maximum limit. On this I will say what I said above, the idea of an old player wtfpwning hordes of noobs sounds good in theory, but this is a MMORPG. Pic Related - I wish I was a three foot female doll with a watering can and heterochromatic eyes.
Flinx Evenstar Minmatar Spartan Industries Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.11.23 02:20:00 - [17] Originally by: Surfin's PlunderBunny Translation: I got pwned by a noob and now I whining on the forum thats what I am thinking 2 weeks in this game, 2006/04, my first solo kill was against a 2004/02 pilot. I don't remember him whining on forum, in fact he said "well done...you got lucky" It's the same as the game has always been. You CAN die in combat [04:58:57] Azzloran > ever heard of a drake? you wont like them when they decloak on you
laotse The Flying Dutchmen Antesignani Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.23 02:20:00 - [18] dhb i think your wright the new players and there skill,s are a laugh 4 noobs killing a 4 year old player in bs is stupid but hey we old one,s dont count the new players do so get used to it eve isnt the game like 4 years ago and its a shame http://80.126.192.128:8888/tfd/uploads/1121735338/gallery_11_8_1124480365.jpg Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 kbs, ty - Cortes
DHB WildCat BURN EDEN	Posted - 2007.11.23 02:26:00 - [19] Edited by: DHB WildCat on 23/11/2007 02:28:12 Hmm well lets get this out of the way, I am not whining, and I have not been killed by any newer player. Thats the point of my post. I know you seen Burn Eden omg smack him. If you read my post I said I can and do still take on gangs outnumbered. Today we engaged 7 vs. 25 and won. Also we have a new plan so dont worry about us. You fail to see my point, so Ill try once again and if you disagree then I'll let it drop and you're right. Should a character made in 2007, be able to beat a character made in 2003? If yes then fine. Second question. Should the better tactician (age irrelivent) be able to win a fight? If yes, then sorry but with script tactics have left the window 0/ WildCat
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2007.11.23 02:29:00 - [20] Originally by: DHB WildCat Should a character made in 2003, be able to beat a character made in 2007? If yes then fine. Depends on the circumstances. That is the intention. Originally by: DHB WildCat Second question. Should the better tactician (age irrelivent) be able to win a fight? If yes, then sorry but with script tactics have left the window 0/ The better tactician should be able to adapt. - I wish I was a three foot female doll with a watering can and heterochromatic eyes.
Flinx Evenstar Minmatar Spartan Industries Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.11.23 02:35:00 - [21] Originally by: DHB WildCat Second question. Should the better tactician (age irrelivent) be able to win a fight? If yes, then sorry but with script tactics have left the window 0/ WildCat Am not smacking you because you are Burn Eden, the better tactician should always win, and that is why ebay sales of 50mil sp chars usually end up getting ravaged in belts in their dreadnaughts You are smart enough to work your way through this, and I am sure you will be around for a long time killing stuff. Not because of your SP, but because of your experience in combat. You'll be fine dude [04:58:57] Azzloran > ever heard of a drake? you wont like them when they decloak on you
DHB WildCat BURN EDEN	Posted - 2007.11.23 03:04:00 - [22] I know Ill be fine, we will and have already adapted, we are very well known for doing so. The others I am not so sure about, besides I can always press the I-WIN button.
Cygnus Zhada Amarr The Wild Hunt Pure.	Posted - 2007.11.23 03:28:00 - [23] Originally by: DHB WildCat I know Ill be fine, we will and have already adapted, we are very well known for doing so. The others I am not so sure about, besides I can always press the I-WIN button. You mean the Cyno? Welcome to EVE Online: Press 1 for Caldari, PVE Online Press 2 for Minmatar, PVP Online Press 3 for Gallente, PWN Online Press 4 for Amarr, Lulz Online
TardRusher	Posted - 2007.11.23 03:32:00 - [24] The game will continually be dumbed down to please the newer players. The thought seems to be that with every 10 old players that leave, another 15 new ones will take their place. Basically we're all f'ed.
Siigari Kitawa Gallente The Aduro Protocol The Fifth Race	Posted - 2007.11.23 03:34:00 - [25] Originally by: TardRusher The game will continually be dumbed down to please the newer players. The thought seems to be that with every 10 old players that leave, another 15 new ones will take their place. Basically we're all f'ed. You're one of the guys dumbing it down. Please leave. _________________ Burn.
xJohnnyDx Caldari	Posted - 2007.11.23 03:37:00 - [26] Hmm, forums ate my reply. New players need a reason to sign up. If every older player could beat every new player, even if they grouped up, what would the incentive be? Four ships should take out a solo ship, even if they're two classes down. PLACE SIGNATURE HERE What?! [Insert event here] happened? Quick, start a new thread on the forums! "Moot", not "mute".
Malcanis High4Life SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.23 03:38:00 - [27] Originally by: DHB WildCat I apologise for the confusion, let me try to clear things up. Younger players in smaller ships should die to an older player in a larger ship, right? Well scripts are allowing ships like the new EW ships to be able to get to and disable fleet Battleships before they can even be locked. There is no gap anymore between older and younger players. As far as tactics - We'll take my Raven. I can right now, effectively battle 5-10 ships, depending on the gang make-up. This is because I spent near 3 years training missiles skills and EW skills to the maximum limit. Damps allow me to negate 3 ships, missiles will take out the weaker ones, and the neuts will take out the ceptors with my drones. This is no longer possible with scripts. My main point is that a 1 day old rifter pilot is now as important as a 4 year old Battleship pilot. I think that is wrong. WildCat (1) Pod yourself repeatedly till you have ~850k SP (2) Get in your rifter (3) Continue to pwn as usual Sarcasm apart, lay off the hyperbole. It doesn't help your case. Reading your wh- I mean posts, anyone would think that your skills are now actually giving you negative bonuses. OH NOES MY SOLO PWNMOBILE HURTS! Sheesh. Soooo.... you're gonna have to adapt your tactics. Hey, me too. I've just started flying dictors regularly; -25% speed is gonna hurt. I cry, I faint, I emocut, but CCP are harsh and uncaring. Life is pain! ALAS! Apart from anything else, there is currently a large supply of 1-day players in rifters. Get yourself a few of them while they're cheap... No-one likes being nerfed. But no-one ever remembers the boosts when the crying threads get posted. It is NECESSARY for the game to change, for there to be continual shifts in the optimum configurations and the tactics they reward. Now if you're arguing that your pilots will be less able to take advantage of the new situation than the average EvE player, well... I don't believe you. BE have always pioneered new tactics. Everyone says Caldari ships suck for PvP: you made them work, to name but one example. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Zavernus Hamarabi Caldari High4Life SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.23 03:46:00 - [28] Just because you've put more time in the game doesnt mean that you get to kill everything. Other people play this game too and alot of them don't have the sp that you do. They're allowed to have comparable amounts of success. Sorry but, thats just the way games work. If you want to kill everyone thats been playing less than you i suggest counterstrike. Originally by: Payne Bringer ..flip teacup... wait for kettle to right teacup...gank kettle with the help of a hard hitting tr
Barbens	Posted - 2007.11.23 03:50:00 - [29] ' Yes numbers will usually win ' Exactly...carry on.. BaRbEnS
F'nog Amarr Celestial Horizon Corp. Valainaloce	Posted - 2007.11.23 05:31:00 - [30] This is the reason we give WoW (and other) players that Eve is better than their games: that new players can do something and actually beat vets. There's a reason the devs changed the way tracking worked so that 1400mms couldn't one-shot a frig orbiting at 500m. Or that they stopped torps from WTFPWNing frigs with one torp. It's called balance. As Oveur has said, no ship should be a solopwnmobile. Any time numbers defeat skill points, it's a good thing, IMO. Originally by: Karen Serasia Because some idiot decided to sell an internet connection to me and didn't think of the consequences.

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