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droneships useless in trinity

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Siigari Kitawa Gallente The Aduro Protocol The Fifth Race	Posted - 2007.12.03 06:40:00 - [151] Originally by: Khald Edited by: Khald on 29/11/2007 17:37:23 Doesnt the new system with bandwidth allow the drone boats to have multipul waves of drones. So send one wave out it gets shields chewed up pullem back send out another wave etc. Fail. You could already do that with most major droneships. The fact that they're socking drones in the butt to say "But now you can send out 5 waves of medium t2 drones at your opponent" when we all know how much drones cost isn't a very nice thing to do :( If I wanted to send wave after wave of drones at people, give me a Myrmidon with 125m3 bandwidth and a 250m3 dronebay. Then we can talk about CCP's wave technique. Think before you speak. _________________ Burn.
Lyria Skydancer Amarr Uninvited Guests Cult of War	Posted - 2007.12.03 07:31:00 - [152] Originally by: Grimpak ...and this is bad why.....? lol
LUH 3471	Posted - 2007.12.03 07:41:00 - [153] Originally by: Scathson Edited by: Scathson on 03/12/2007 06:34:30 Originally by: hydraSlav All this outrage at the thought that scooping drones regens their shields (yes, stupid concept from RP perspective... but i care more about gameplay).... ... But have you stopped for a second to think that drones are the ONLY weapon system that you can shoot and completely destroy? I can't plug the missile launchers on caldari, i can't destroy turret of any other ships. No other weapon system is targettable. None. As i've evidenced above, drones have advantages and disadvantages just like any other weapon system. But drones are still the only targettable weapon system. When they allow targetting of missile bays and turrets, then we can talk about the HP of those compared to drone's shield regen. But until drones are the only weapon system that suffers from being targettable... lay off my drones exactly - nuff said qft
Minmatar Citizen 4521577	Posted - 2007.12.03 07:52:00 - [154] Two months ago: "blah blah blah and you can destroy them so it's all balanced and well" Today: "whaah waah waah they can be destroyed waah waah waah"
Acinonyx Jubatus Minmatar International Multi-Player Consortium Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.12.03 08:23:00 - [155] I personally doubt drones are useless in trinity :/ Heck, with some of the new drone features they've gotten quite improved. Yeah it's a bummer to some you can't scoopredeploy and be all fancy free, but I won't get into that.
Darken Two Gallente Cruororis Consors Conlegium Ivy League	Posted - 2007.12.03 09:21:00 - [156] Originally by: Acinonyx Jubatus I personally doubt drones are useless in trinity :/ Heck, with some of the new drone features they've gotten quite improved. Yeah it's a bummer to some you can't scoopredeploy and be all fancy free, but I won't get into that. Seriosuly...what are these new features that everyone is harping on about? I been playing with drones on SISI for a month now and other than a couple new commands for the drones (Which are really bug fixes which were promised to us drones user years ago), I am yet to see one useful feature that would make drones stand out. Oh yea you can set them to passive now and avoid the drones aggroing entire mission rooms...YIPEE, such a friggin problem should have never existed in teh first place. Fixing a bug and then calling it a feature, won't make it so. Originally by: Blind Fear Generally, when trying to be a puppetmaster, it is considered good form not to wrap the strings around your neck and choke yourself.
Vladimir Norkoff Income Redistribution Service The Gurlstas Associates	Posted - 2007.12.03 09:34:00 - [157] The scooping nerf was necessary. Honestly scooping to regen shields was lame. I still did/do it, but it doesn't make it any less lame. So the nerf was needed. However, along with the nerf we should have gotten the "multiple waves" that were so glowingly promised in the fabulous bandwidth blog. But we didn't get the multiple waves. Instead we got more nerf. Only two ships got their drone bays increased. All the others stayed the same or even decreased. How exactly does that translate into "multiple waves"? The answer is simple... use smaller drones. As long as you have a dronebay >25m3 then you can have multiple waves! Sure, you might not be able to kill anything, but think of the flexibility you now have! You can field lots of different equally ineffective drones (unless of course you are only attacking frigates, in which case you pwn). What was needed with the scoop nerf was a larger drone bay on every ship. That allows the foretold greater flexibility. That allows the multiple waves. Because with the scoop nerf, drones will die. Alot. Which is fine, that's what drones are suppossed to do. But there needs to be reloads, without having to drop down to a lower size. Unfortunately, CCP's recent ideas of "balance" mean - beat it with the nerf stick until it's not moving, and then think about buffing it later (see ECM). Will probably be the same with Damps and Drones as well. Pretty crappy way of handling game balance imo, but hey, it's their game. Taxman IV: Rogue Agent
Lord DerekSegan	Posted - 2007.12.03 09:46:00 - [158] Originally by: Vladimir Norkoff ... Only two ships got their drone bays increased. All the others stayed the same or even decreased. How exactly does that translate into "multiple waves"? The answer is simple... use smaller drones. As long as you have a dronebay >25m3 then you can have multiple waves! Sure, you might not be able to kill anything, but think of the flexibility you now have! You can field lots of different equally ineffective drones (unless of course you are only attacking frigates, in which case you pwn). ... I almost agree with you. But the fact is that the Myrm was WAY over powered. Caldari missile ships have been borderline useless in PVP for a long time. This is just bringing you back in line and taking away your solowtfpwnmobile. Hello
Vladimir Norkoff Income Redistribution Service The Gurlstas Associates	Posted - 2007.12.03 10:02:00 - [159] Originally by: Lord DerekSegan I almost agree with you. But the fact is that the Myrm was WAY over powered. Caldari missile ships have been borderline useless in PVP for a long time. This is just bringing you back in line and taking away your solowtfpwnmobile. The Myrm was overpowered, it did need to get nerfed. Don't really care much about it. But you're a bit off base there mate. Nowhere did I ever mention the Myrm. Do you see where I mentioned it? No? Honestly where does your little rant come from? Myrm thread is that way ---> What I'm concerned about is all the semi-droneboat ships. The ones with 40-50m3 of dronebay where drones make up a good percentage of the ship's damage. This nerf screws them pretty hard. Taxman IV: Rogue Agent
Ashen Wraith	Posted - 2007.12.03 11:08:00 - [160] RIP Curse

Orestes Domini	Posted - 2007.12.03 13:33:00 - [161] Originally by: Darken Two Edited by: Darken Two on 30/11/2007 07:48:02 Well just was on SISI, seems the drone shields do recharge in the bay....but at an extremely slow rate. However, they managed to screw it up completely by making the drone interface in such a manner that you cannot see the drone's health in the bay. So you cannot tell which drones are damaged and which ones are not. Scoop drones and send out some other wave? -- i havent been on test server cause i cba to install eve 2 times.. but --- you cant tell what drone is what..they get scooped back into the bay and you can no longer see the status of shield/armor/hull.(currently) Scoop, and relaunch like im in vegas placing a bet that fresh drones will come out? Usually(currently) when i relaunch, damaged drones are deployed. Oops. If this is not the case.. no need to flog me -- just ignore. Also - to reload guns/missiles may be what 10 seconds? Micromanaging drones, further than we already do --for wave selection(if you could select)/targeting for repair/repairing/recalling from distance/fitting highslots for rep/etc/all the "workarounds".. ok.. wow also, while were whining-- lets get eves ingame browser loading the EVE site!!! or rip that junk.wtf
Temu Djinn	Posted - 2007.12.03 14:12:00 - [162] Originally by: Khald Edited by: Khald on 29/11/2007 17:37:23 Doesnt the new system with bandwidth allow the drone boats to have multipul waves of drones. So send one wave out it gets shields chewed up pullem back send out another wave etc. Yes but can you see WHICH drones are "Fresh" and which ones have damage - you can't currently which is a PITA as if I could chose which drones to send out I would lose less
Buyerr	Posted - 2007.12.03 14:17:00 - [163] i am so tired of hearing people whine about overpowered ships getting balanced.. pls FEAKING LEAVE THE GAME IF YOUR THAT UNSATISFIED!!! and contract your stuff to me first.. no better sell it all then send the isk:P
Janu Hull Caldari Order of Z Industries	Posted - 2007.12.03 14:20:00 - [164] Edited by: Janu Hull on 03/12/2007 14:22:53 Originally by: Scathson Originally by: Bryg Philomena Originally by: Jupiter Sun equip a remote repper in your highs to fix your drones and stop depending upon a soon to be dead lame mechanic. This is one of the worst suggestions, assume a myrm is in battle with even three ships, it can then only take care of 2 drones. And they will pop before you get a lock. Try this on a domi, oh wait, it doesnt have cap. I'd like to be able to shoot your guns, and watch you remote rep em. Hell, you can not lose your guns, your guns dont get targeted by sentries, and you can overload them. I'm sorry, but is there a reason to have a drone boat anymore? thank-you refute that - caldari My guns and missiles run out of ammunition. For ratting pilots, my ammunition takes up cargo space I'd just as soon use for loot and salvage. My capacity to rat continuously is an ongoing and head wracking struggle to balance carrying enough ammunition to actually fill the remainder of my hold with loot and carrying so much ammunition I'm forced to abandon valuable loot items because of space considerations.
Augeas	Posted - 2007.12.03 14:36:00 - [165] So much whining about people shooting drones. Shooting drones is only really done in 1v1s or very small gangs - the rest of the time it's better to actually shoot the droneboat instead. Hell, even in a 1v1, most of the time it's better to shoot the droneboat instead. Especially if you know that that droneboat can just replace its lost drones... If you really think droneboats are useless, try flying something like a Ferox. You'll soon be running home to your beloved Myrm crying about how stupid you've been...
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.12.03 14:37:00 - [166] Originally by: Ezekiel Sulastin Originally by: Tarminic Er...every drone ship except for the Myrmidon and Eos have been either unchanged or benefit from the nerf. In addition dedicated drone ships boost the HP of their drones, meaning that since drone shields don't instantly regenerate they'll harder to kill than the drones of non-dedicated drone ships. To claim that this is a drone ship nerf, while ignoring all the other drone improvements such as meta-level drones, improved behavior and additional control options, is lame. I think some Amarr pilots would love to tell you otherwise. Also, I think everyone knows that drone ships get a drone HP boost - isn't that a key part of play now, Tarminic? I'm about as Amarr-specialised as it gets, and I quite like the thought of my Arbitrator hulls getting to use three waves of five medium drones. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Alezia Fireblazer Perkone	Posted - 2007.12.03 14:44:00 - [167] We could put mimmatar slaves into the drone bay and they could increase the drone regeneration rate while taking up drone space.
fire 59 Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.12.03 15:11:00 - [168] Originally by: Minmatar Citizen 4521577 Two months ago: "blah blah blah and you can destroy them so it's all balanced and well" Today: "whaah waah waah they can be destroyed waah waah waah" This http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bdd74kLxgGo
Andre Coeurl Gallente TOHA Heavy Industries Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2007.12.03 18:45:00 - [169] All the talk here is useless because it involves drone users (who know how drones work, strong points and weak points and all, and know that using drones is not a "I win" button) and drone-haters (who just don't like other people to be able to have a weapon they apparently don't understand at all). This kind of discussion will invariably go on forever, against any rational drone argument there will just be the usual "lol", "adapt or die", "you just got nerfed so who cares", "you just got nerfed so hooray" and so on... The only apparently rational responses are just specious and sophistic, evidently ignoring some points and wastly boosting marginal others. This said, if the SiSi changes will go live as they are, after the patch we'll simply see the price of some ships fall, and that will be the proof that the nerf was exaggerate. If CCP will regain some perspective, they'll revert some of what they took away from drone users, in the meanwhile some ships will simply stay in hangars waiting for a better time. To be sure my Myrmidon will, while I'll fly my Brutix, or skill for Drake/Harbinger/Hurricane if I want to use a value-for-money tier 2 BC. --- --- ---
Audio Bully	Posted - 2007.12.03 18:54:00 - [170] st fu plx. Drone ships arne't useless, and you know it so stop crying and move on __________________________________________________ Great being Amarr, Minmatar, and Caldari isn't it?

Ulstan	Posted - 2007.12.03 19:03:00 - [171] Edited by: Ulstan on 03/12/2007 19:03:56 There are a lot of spoiled whiners in here. Drones are balanced around the assumption that they can be shot at and destroyed. That's the entire underlying design for the weapon system. Abusing the 'insta shield recharge' bug gave drones a virtual invulnerability, and this is an imbalance I am glad to see CCP moving to address. Complaining that your drones can be destroyed is just missing the point in a grand fashion. They're supposed to be vulnerable to destruction. Your drones will recharge at normal rates in their holds. I've heard CCP is even going to give us a badly needed update to the horrendously clunky drone interface so that we can see the status of drones in the hold.
NeoTheo Caldari Species 5618 R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.12.03 19:30:00 - [172] Originally by: Janu Hull Edited by: Janu Hull on 03/12/2007 14:22:53 Originally by: Scathson Originally by: Bryg Philomena Originally by: Jupiter Sun equip a remote repper in your highs to fix your drones and stop depending upon a soon to be dead lame mechanic. This is one of the worst suggestions, assume a myrm is in battle with even three ships, it can then only take care of 2 drones. And they will pop before you get a lock. Try this on a domi, oh wait, it doesnt have cap. I'd like to be able to shoot your guns, and watch you remote rep em. Hell, you can not lose your guns, your guns dont get targeted by sentries, and you can overload them. I'm sorry, but is there a reason to have a drone boat anymore? thank-you refute that - caldari My guns and missiles run out of ammunition. For ratting pilots, my ammunition takes up cargo space I'd just as soon use for loot and salvage. My capacity to rat continuously is an ongoing and head wracking struggle to balance carrying enough ammunition to actually fill the remainder of my hold with loot and carrying so much ammunition I'm forced to abandon valuable loot items because of space considerations. what he said, that and the fact that when was the last time you ever saw someone damp or ECM a drone? ohhh thats right, almost fekin never.
Gunner Flashman Services	Posted - 2007.12.04 11:29:00 - [173] Originally by: Inir Ishtori now with the shield recharge nerf, bandwidth nerf und people not losing lock on scooped drones(i really hope it was just a bug and it's fixed now) AND still not being able to see their health status when scooped it is too much of a hassle to fly a drone ship into a battle imo. Are you serious about the not losing lock issue when drones are scooped into drone bay? If this is true it would be very bad. *** 2007.10.06 R.I.P. Hatuk my friend.
Inir Ishtori The Guardian Agency Guardian Federation	Posted - 2007.12.04 12:08:00 - [174] Originally by: Gunner Are you serious about the not losing lock issue when drones are scooped into drone bay? If this is true it would be very bad. this was reported on SiSi multiple times about 2 weeks ago. maybe it is fixed now, maybe not - i can't test it myself.
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.12.04 13:24:00 - [175] Originally by: Andre Coeurl This said, if the SiSi changes will go live as they are, after the patch we'll simply see the price of some ships fall, and that will be the proof that the nerf was exaggerate. Or it might just be evidence that those ships were too good to start with. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Sokratesz Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.12.04 13:27:00 - [176] Cry more, seriously. WTF have you been smoking that causes our brain to malfunction to the point that you cannot understand that this is a justified change to drone mechanics, and an improvement for said droneships in many aspects. They should have done this much, much earlier. Also, post with your main. Sig removed for the third time, inappropriate content. Sig Locked. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Cortes
Saladin Minmatar Eternity INC. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.12.04 13:35:00 - [177] I am all for drone ships having to sacrifice high slots for remote reps to keep their drones repaired. However, with current mechanics, it means they would need to sacrifice a high slot or two for remote reps and about 3 med slots for sensor boosters so they don't wait forever to lock them.
KtB Elite Storm Enterprises Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.12.04 14:14:00 - [178] Edited by: KtB on 04/12/2007 14:16:02 Meh i've spoke my opinion on this subject many times. Drones can be killed easily, waves wont work... Ooo yay we can put out more drone... Oh **** i cant break a cruisers tank because im limited to how many i can use.. The problem here is "drone boats" have always been gun boats with drones attached... Really drone boats should have 1 or 2 turret slots max with maybe 3/4 max turrets for nos. Making them REAL drone boats, where you use drones as your weapon. This nerf has destroyed alot of peoples skill training thats taken a long long time. E.g. who is going to bother buying and eos over an astarte? Lets compare to two shall we? Eos Trinity - 6 low 5 med 5 high max of 3 heavy drones Astarte - 6 low 4 med 7 high max of 2 heavy drones Even though the eos has drone bonus' do you really think itll get anywhere as close to the dps or tank of the astarte with 7 turrets with bonus' and 2 heavies?? Its the same with the myrmidon and the brutix. Ccp have really messed this one up and not thought this through properly. They have nerfed drones to decrease the load on the server but gone and added ANOTHER value for the server to have to calculate. If you want to nerf drone boats dont nerf their drones, nerf their high slots. Drones can be killed easily enough as it is if youve got half a brain, now they will be worthless. I for one would like my skillpoints refunding but we know ccp wont do that meh.. Edit Also for the people who moan that the ships should be nerfed in this way and dont even fly them... STFU. If you dont fly the ship you should have no say imo, especially you caldari pilots liking the extra mid slot on the myrm for your own pleasure. We gallente pilots KNOW a few ships need to be nerfed but NOT in this way and NOT to this extent. Nerfing things only leads to more nerfing, with an endless cycle destroying the game! Prevention is better than the cure!
Khald Gallente Armaments Board	Posted - 2007.12.04 14:34:00 - [179] Edited by: Khald on 04/12/2007 14:35:38 Edited by: Khald on 04/12/2007 14:35:03 Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Originally by: Khald Edited by: Khald on 29/11/2007 17:37:23 Doesnt the new system with bandwidth allow the drone boats to have multipul waves of drones. So send one wave out it gets shields chewed up pullem back send out another wave etc. Fail. You could already do that with most major droneships. The fact that they're socking drones in the butt to say "But now you can send out 5 waves of medium t2 drones at your opponent" when we all know how much drones cost isn't a very nice thing to do :( If I wanted to send wave after wave of drones at people, give me a Myrmidon with 125m3 bandwidth and a 250m3 dronebay. Then we can talk about CCP's wave technique. Think before you speak. My question was a question I for got the question mark. If the drone bay wont support having 5 heavys in waves its because its overpowered. I had a myrmidon and high drne skills. I had problems targeting ships in PVE before my drones killed them.
Taedrin Gallente Magellan Exploration and Survey Rare Faction	Posted - 2007.12.04 14:41:00 - [180] With the coming drone nerf, I might just dust off my Myrmidon and see how the larger drone bay and bandwidth restrictions alter the dynamics...



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