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Jukhta Mein
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:02:00 -
[1]
I was reading another thread on the purchase of ISK via GTCs (http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=649675), and a few people commented that the person in question would never appreciate the game fully because he doesn't know the true value of ISK and hence, the ships and equipment that he buys with it.
I thought about it a while and realised the same kind of thinking can be applied to players utilising multiple accounts. Before we go into that however, lets look at some common examples at how multiple accounts, or alts, are being used:
- mission-runner + salvager
- hauler/travelling ship + scout
- trader + trader (basically having an alt in another region to check out prices)
- capital ship + cyno ship
- miner + hauler
All of these examples bring about convenience to their users. On top of that they either increase the rate of flow of ISK for their users or decrease the risks undertaken in the respective activities, as compared to single-account characters who do everything in one window. Now doesn't this undermine both the value of ISK and the value of teamwork in Eve? The value of ISK is undermined because multiple-account users generally earn ISK much faster than single-account users in the same activity, not through ingenuity or innovation but through the virtue of having paid for more accounts. Now if you think that that's all fair - after all, they paid with real-life money for that advantage, didn't they - then I assume you think that there's nothing wrong with buying ISK with money.
Same goes for the value of teamwork. I got attracted to Eve initially by its promise of co-operative play. I was disappointed when I found out that you don't need a hauler to haul for you when you mine - you can create a hauler alt. You don't need a team-mate to scout for you - you can create a covert ops alt. You don't need players to help you run through missions - you can create a few alts and zap through them all by yourself, all the while salvaging by the sidelines.
At the core of things, you don't need to balance income-generation and pvp activities - you can just create an industrialist alt and let him earn isk while you pvp. This undermines both the value of ISK and teamwork.
I'm not saying that people who use multiple accounts don't understand the value of isk and teamwork. I just feel that they would appreciate both values more when they're on a single account, working with other players on their single accounts.
And yes, I do feel a certain unfairness in people using multiple accounts. It's hard to describe or qualify this feeling of unfairness, but it's a similar feeling to when someone is able to afford that carrier simply because he bought isk, as opposed to working hard for it or pooling the isk together with his friends or corpmates. ]
Comments appreciated. In particular I would like to hear the thoughts of other single-account pilots - do you think there's an unfair advantage of multiple-account pilots over you? Would you ever get another account? Why not?
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Armoured C
Gallente
Globaltech Industries
Hedonistic Imperative
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:17:00 -
[2]
i got 2 and you should 2 hence the power of 2 offer they tried
didnt read past the first line but it probably something to do with magic and elves that WOW has
dont like it go away and PS can i have your stuff and 1st post for thr first time EVER ==) 2 years and first post back :)
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Commander Hansen
UK Corp
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:22:00 -
[3]
I have 4 accounts and pay with GTC's
Hansen
Here be chocolate |
Erikel
Cosmic Odyssey
YouWhat
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:23:00 -
[4]
Well, alts aren't always paid for with real life money. I have an alt account that a I pay for with GTCs with ISK made by me. Nothing is keeping you from doing the same.
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BranBresil
Caldari
Evil Avatar Ltd.
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:26:00 -
[5]
Edited by: BranBresil on 04/12/2007 20:27:04
Kind of hate to get drawn into as irrelevant a topic as this, CCP will continue to allow multiple accounts, they have to, so the whole point is moot.
What it comes down to, is sure, people with multiple accounts have an advantage in terms of what they can get done solo, however, that doesn't make it unfair.
Everyone has equal opportunity to aquire multiple accounts therefore there is no unfairness involved. If you don't have them you have a different set of priorities and or needs, and the ones with multiple accounts shouldn't be penalized for your desires.
As for buying ISK with money, no there's nothing inherently unfair or wrong about it, it only became wrong once CCP declared it to be.
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Sergeant Spot
Black Eclipse Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:32:00 -
[6]
I've played 3 on-line games
Mankind for several years, 1999 to 2004.
(Space PvP, and you HURT when you lose stuff, but a severely flawed game with way to much hackable stuff client side. also an old game)
Eve sense 2004.
Best Player centered pvp game that includes game "depth" available.
WoW for about a year, account expired.
(PvE, although you can PvP, PvP is just "weak" compared to Eve. The PvE aspect however is VASTLY superior to Eve)
In ALL cases, you get some serious advantages to being able to log in twice (or more than twice) at the same time.
Play nice while you butcher each other.
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Asestorian
Domination.
Cult of War
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:35:00 -
[7]
As a person who's played with a single account since 2004, but only just started using a second account, I have to disagree; I never felt disadvantaged or like things were unfair because of multiple accounts, and I've known many people with 5 or more. People still need to make some kind of effort with multiple accounts that they don't with the GTCs or ISK buying. And I know for sure that, although my second account is going to make me money, I need to spend money on it too. It will also allow me to experience a part of the game, specifically industry, that I haven't really been able to try before because I was too busy trying to PvP (yes I know I stay docked in empire anyway, damn you all!).
But ultimately it's a little pointless to debate because CCP actively condones it. After all, they have offered the Power of 2 many times before.
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MOZO
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Condecinte
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:35:00 -
[8]
I have only one account and I dont want another, not because i think it would be unfair to others but just because I prefer it this way. One account, one identity.
I don't think people with two accounts have an unfair advantage and telling people how many accounts they can and can't have would be even more unfair in the free society we live in.
Unfortunately due to the nature of the game it is often essential to have more than one account. This is because even though Eve is a team game it is unreasonable to expect people to run all over the place for you hauling your stuff and setting up cynos for you or escorting you or whatever else. Hauling is not fun, being the cyno guy is not fun, having to move many many jumps when its getting late and you'd rather be in bed to do these things is even less fun.
I also do not believe they make very much more ISK with 2 accounts. I reckon I could easily pay for another account with gtc's if I wanted to.
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Kirjava
Lothian Quay Industries
Zzz
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:36:00 -
[9]
I have 2 accounts, originaly miner and hauler, it evolved over time.
Now selling the second charecter as I don't need her anymore (capship pilot/hauler).
Rate my charecters please - 2M isk for a good review for the first 3 people!! |
Hasak Rain
Amarr
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:39:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Hasak Rain on 04/12/2007 20:41:27
 Originally by: BranBresil
Edited by: BranBresil on 04/12/2007 20:27:04
Kind of hate to get drawn into as irrelevant a topic as this, CCP will continue to allow multiple accounts, they have to, so the whole point is moot.
What it comes down to, is sure, people with multiple accounts have an advantage in terms of what they can get done solo, however, that doesn't make it unfair.
Everyone has equal opportunity to aquire multiple accounts therefore there is no unfairness involved. If you don't have them you have a different set of priorities and or needs, and the ones with multiple accounts shouldn't be penalized for your desires.
As for buying ISK with money, no there's nothing inherently unfair or wrong about it, it only became wrong once CCP declared it to be.
It is sort of funny that you should bring up that there is nothing inherently wrong with buying isk because I once brought up that I did that on VN boards {for another game} and the mods jumped all over me for discussing "illegal activities." Truth is, there is nothing illeagal about it at all and some people really need to stop worrying about what others do with their money and get a life. Especially in a game like EvE which encourages such things.
That said, i understand what the OPer was getting at but the idiots such as the second poster in this thread will come in and flame him anyway. He is just asking if buying ships and things and having a second account is robbing the person doing it of their game experiance since they play the game on easymode.
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Dramaticus
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:39:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Sergeant Spot
WoW for about a year, account expired.
(The PvE aspect however is VASTLY superior to Eve)
yeah because getting 20 people together to run a dungeon every 7 days is so much more interesting than previously running complexes every 24 hours or killing rats or doing the same 20 missions over and over and over
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Matalino
Gallente
Ki Tech Industries
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:39:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Jukhta Mein
And yes, I do feel a certain unfairness in people using multiple accounts. It's hard to describe or qualify this feeling of unfairness, but it's a similar feeling to when someone is able to afford that carrier simply because he bought isk, as opposed to working hard for it or pooling the isk together with his friends or corpmates.
This game cannot be fair. Somebody has to lose for another to win. Such is life.
People will use multiple accounts if it helps them win. If/when those accounts lose their profitiablity, they will be cancelled.
There is no point whining about multiple accounts being unfair any more than whining about players who take the time to do anything else to gain an advantage.
If you think that it would give such a vast advantage to have another account then create one yourself. If list any reason for not doing so, then the cost must be too high for you.
It is the same as complaining that replacement ships are too expensive in your local region, and in the same breath saying that a trip to Jita to get a cheaper price isn't worth the hassle, and that you can make more money just paying the markup and getting back to your minng/ratting/mission running.
If it is worth it, then just do it. If it is not worth it for you, doesn't mean that it is not worth while for someone else.
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Datacore Harvesting IPO |
Kritch
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:40:00 -
[13]
If I solo mine someone comes along and empties my can either to take the ore or try and bait me into attacking them so they can get an easy kill. Is it suprising that some miners have a second account for hauling so they don't get griefed by other players when trying to mine solo?
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Dolli Dagger
Caldari
Unity of Honor
Legion of Honor
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:41:00 -
[14]
I work hard for my money so I can spend them on a second account. If you decide its not worth it to spend whatever currency you earn, that is your choice. I see no reason why fairness is an issue, as you could spend your hard earned money on a second account if you deemed it worthwhile.
Additionally, EVE is unique in its vast range of occupations, and the level of detailed specialization one can achieve within those occupations. Not only can I become a miner, but I can specialize in the processing of certain ores or advance my character to the peak of mining capabilities - acquiring the best mining ships and the highest grade equipment. But if I want to PvP there is a completely separate skill set I have to learn. As a result, if more than one specialization appeals to me, I would have to divide my character's training among a variety of specialized skills, reducing her overall effectiveness in each area.
Now if I want to have my character do a bit of everything I certainly can, but another player of the exact same skill level and of the exact same age but specialized completely in PvP combat is going to be able to toast my hybrid PvP/Miner.
While it is entirely possible to enjoy almost all of what EVE has to offer with one character, those upper reaches of perfection in a chosen occupation demand you either devote yourself entirely to it and forgo other occupations, or you can pay for a second account.
Since all players have an equal opportunity to have a second account, in that nobody is told they can't create a second account if they have the necessary funds, it becomes a personal choice.
And for me the ability to choose with such freedom is what makes EVE Online such a unique and great experience. 
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Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:42:00 -
[15]
I've got 4 accounts and i've never bought as much as a penny. Multiple accounts != ISK. Enjoying the game in multiple ways has only increased my appreciation for ISK.
Originally by: ISD Cortes
You're at liberty to use the rolling sig you had, as long as there's no chimeras covering the nether regions of voluptuous females |
Pwett
Minmatar
QUANT Corp.
QUANT Hegemony
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Posted - 2007.12.04 20:59:00 -
[16]
This argument is inherently flawed.
One Account Scenario:
Person a) is rich, he has a top of the line rig and has friend in Aris, so he has a direct line to an internet backbone.
Person b) has a couple year old connection and can only afford 1.5 mbps DSL.
Is this fair? It's all about rl money. Person A) can do more because he suffers from less lag, less desynchs, yuou name it.
Time Scenario
Person a) has 3 accounts, but he also has 2 jobs and a family, he only gets to play for an average of an hour a day.
Person b) is a student, he goes to class for 15 hours a week and spends an average of 3 hours on EVE a day.
What's unfair now?
_______________
Pwett
CEO, Founder, & Executor
<Q> QUANT Hegemony
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Anwylyd Al'Vos
Minmatar
LightSpeed Industries
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Posted - 2007.12.04 21:15:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Pwett
This argument is inherently flawed.
One Account Scenario:
Person a) is rich, he has a top of the line rig and has friend in Aris, so he has a direct line to an internet backbone.
Person b) has a couple year old connection and can only afford 1.5 mbps DSL.
Is this fair? It's all about rl money. Person A) can do more because he suffers from less lag, less desynchs, yuou name it.
Time Scenario
Person a) has 3 accounts, but he also has 2 jobs and a family, he only gets to play for an average of an hour a day.
Person b) is a student, he goes to class for 15 hours a week and spends an average of 3 hours on EVE a day.
What's unfair now?
this
life isn't fair... hasn't eve taught you that yet?
_
. - Justice, Mercy, and Faith
My soul has horizons further away than those of early mornings, deeper darkness than the night |
SiJira
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Posted - 2007.12.04 21:16:00 -
[18]
i run 82 accounts 60 of them have orders and taxes skills trained and 51 of those pvp in battleships 12 of which gank people in high sec
the remaining 22 run rigged and expanded hulks all day long in empire and 6 of those have refine skills maxed
am i cheating? i pay for 80 of them with isk
____ __ ________
_sig below_
devs and gms cant modify my sig if they tried!
_lies above_
CCP Morpheus was here 
Morpheus Fails. You need colors!! -Kaemonn
[yellow]Kaem |
Jolnas Arbiter
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Posted - 2007.12.04 21:18:00 -
[19]
Clearly having friends is overpowered!
Nerf player interaction in eve.
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Fink Angel
Caldari
The Merry Men
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Posted - 2007.12.04 21:19:00 -
[20]
I have 1,600 accounts.
800 of them are parked in Jita, and the other 800 I log in on a node that shares the same server whenever a major fleet fight starts.
It's ALL my fault.
Mwahahahahahah.
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Crumplecorn
Gallente
Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.12.04 21:23:00 -
[21]
One big difference is that with an alt you have to do the work yourself. So you still appreciate the value of ISK.
As for teamwork, unless you were planning on a 2-man corp and went for a-man-and-his-alt instead, you won't be missing out on much.
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I wish I was a three foot female doll with a watering can and heterochromatic eyes. |
Janu Hull
Caldari
Order of Z Industries
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Posted - 2007.12.04 21:33:00 -
[22]
Flexibility is the key. I fly two alts, but there's very little overlap in their skills. Just enough now that the main flies an 8 gunned Rokh and the second flies a Cormorant with four guns two T-beams and a pair of salvagers.
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Rellik B00n
Vale Heavy Industries
Molotov Coalition
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Posted - 2007.12.04 21:39:00 -
[23]
I think someone said further up the thread:
If you put all the available skills into evemon its like 900 years or something stupid to max them all out.
I <3 the range of options available with character skilling but I know from my experiences with this character that you just dont have the time to learn everything.
Also I came to eve knowing nothing about it. I think i typed "Space MMO" into google and found it, saw it had a free trial and just got going. This means my character attributes are total ****.
I like to keep Rellik as a jack of all trades, but as the rest of the saying goes this means he is master of none. Alts give me the opportunity to specialize a well built character into something Rellik cant do that benefits my game as a whole.
And the bottom line is even if you have multiple PCs and monitors to go with your multiple accounts you just try taking them all into combat at the same time :) your going to lose something.
Remixes of EvE tunes:Gallente002 remix |
Khatred
Fluffy Mungoose
Guinea Pigs
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Posted - 2007.12.04 21:57:00 -
[24]
It is unfair, yes. And I do have multiple accounts because otherwise it would be impossible for me to manufacture on a large scale. People having more time to play than others it's unfair. People buying isk either by gtcs or otherwise it's unfair. People with more friends at a time than others it's unfair. There are a lot of unfair things both in game and out of it. What makes it really unfair however is that some are labeled as unfair and some are not. But human hiporcrisy will always be amusing, sad and confusing, all at the same time.
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Niccolado Starwalker
Shadow Templars
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Posted - 2007.12.04 22:01:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Jukhta Mein
Comments appreciated. In particular I would like to hear the thoughts of other single-account pilots - do you think there's an unfair advantage of multiple-account pilots over you? Would you ever get another account? Why not?
Ofcource its unfair! But so is life!
-Its unfair that someone can afford to have one account, while other cant afford even having one!
-Its unfair that my job takes lot of time, so my time with eve is reduced!
-Its unfair advantage that someone is better then me in PvP, but you know, I can hate it, but by damn, I cant do anything else then accept it!
-Etc!
But this game have never been about fairness, have it? When I played star wars I had 5 accounts. I got Jedi while others could not. That was in the time when jedi Where unique! When jedi where special! And I used those 4 characters to support my one and true: My jedi! It was unfair too that for a while I could play for 17 hours a day!! while others dont! Then people whined, Jedi too hard to get! blah blah blah. and now SWG is dying.
I have 2 accounts in EVE. I wish I had 3, but I almost dont have time to play the two accounts I allraedy have! And that is unfair!
The fact is: Its a game! Play it as you want it, with 1, 2 or 10 accounts. Spend as much time as you want with it, because more time you put into it, more you should be rewarded!
Life aint fair! Get over it.
Sarah McTeef: You all should really try and stay on topic. Which when I last checked, was my grocery list |
Rhatar Khurin
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Posted - 2007.12.04 22:04:00 -
[26]
I fail to see how a miner with a hauler alt is in anyway unfair. Maybe you'll save 20 secs jumping into the hauler at the end of your can session, but that's about it.
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Nicho Void
Hyper-Nova
Tenth Legion
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Posted - 2007.12.04 22:13:00 -
[27]
The answer is yes.
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Kritch
Astro Dogs
Metastar Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.12.04 22:14:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Rhatar Khurin
I fail to see how a miner with a hauler alt is in anyway unfair. Maybe you'll save 20 secs jumping into the hauler at the end of your can session, but that's about it.
More likely you'll avoid you can being flipped and losing a load of ore in the process.
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Only thing more dull than mining Ice is hauling it |
Malcanis
High4Life
SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2007.12.04 22:20:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Jukhta Mein
I thought about it a while and realised the same kind of thinking can be applied to players utilising multiple accounts. Before we go into that however, lets look at some common examples at how multiple accounts, or alts, are being used:
- mission-runner + salvager
- hauler/travelling ship + scout
- trader + trader (basically having an alt in another region to check out prices)
- capital ship + cyno ship
- miner + hauler
All of these examples bring about convenience to their users. On top of that they either increase the rate of flow of ISK for their users or decrease the risks undertaken in the respective activities, as compared to single-account characters who do everything in one window. Now doesn't this undermine both the value of ISK and the value of teamwork in Eve? The value of ISK is undermined because multiple-account users generally earn ISK much faster than single-account users in the same activity, not through ingenuity or innovation but through the virtue of having paid for more accounts. Now if you think that that's all fair - after all, they paid with real-life money for that advantage, didn't they - then I assume you think that there's nothing wrong with buying ISK with money.
Same goes for the value of teamwork. I got attracted to Eve initially by its promise of co-operative play. I was disappointed when I found out that you don't need a hauler to haul for you when you mine - you can create a hauler alt. You don't need a team-mate to scout for you - you can create a covert ops alt. You don't need players to help you run through missions - you can create a few alts and zap through them all by yourself, all the while salvaging by the sidelines.
At the core of things, you don't need to balance income-generation and pvp activities - you can just create an industrialist alt and let him earn isk while you pvp. This undermines both the value of ISK and teamwork.
I'm not saying that people who use multiple accounts don't understand the value of isk and teamwork. I just feel that they would appreciate both values more when they're on a single account, working with other players on their single accounts.
And yes, I do feel a certain unfairness in people using multiple accounts. It's hard to describe or qualify this feeling of unfairness, but it's a similar feeling to when someone is able to afford that carrier simply because he bought isk, as opposed to working hard for it or pooling the isk together with his friends or corpmates. ]
Comments appreciated. In particular I would like to hear the thoughts of other single-account pilots - do you think there's an unfair advantage of multiple-account pilots over you? Would you ever get another account? Why not?
I have multiple accounts (3), but I play them. No macroing. I don't buy ISk (or sell it). I don't even use GTC. Have 3 accounts doesn't give you a triple advantage (at least not the way I use them).
Obviously I don't think it's cheating. The fact that I am able to usefully use 2 characters at once is due to the fact that I practiced at doing so. Pretty much anyone can do the same.
Does it give me an advantage? Sure, I guess. Does it give me an advantage that I just pay a little extra money for and don't need to put any effort in for? HELL, NO.
The advantage from having 2 characters is analogous the advantage someone who can play twice as much gets. Is it "fair" that someone who can play 12 hours a day can make 3x as much ISK as someone who is only on for 4? Maybe not, but the 12-hour dude has to actually play those 12 hours to get that 'unfair' advantage. In fact, running multiple accounts is the counterbalance you have vs that 12 hour a day guy. However much ISk he get, he can only accumulate ~2000SP/hr. With 3 accounts you can triple that.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Mallikan
Gallente
Spartan Hoplites
Rare Faction
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Posted - 2007.12.04 22:30:00 -
[30]
Multiple accounts = YES, OWN. Especially with two monitors. If you don't like it, sorry. 
---
lol.. I messed up.
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hydraSlav
Synergy Evolved
Daisho Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.12.04 22:33:00 -
[31]
I got 2 accounts. And yes i think it's unfair. I made the same topic when i just started and had only one account. I got the second account when the "power of 2" offer was first made. The reason for getting the second account was simple: adaption.
EvE is all about adaption. When almost everyone is running multiple accounts, you got to adapt and get one yourself or you are leaving yourself at a disadvantage. When everyone is flying ****ing nanoships, you got to adapt and set yourself up a nanoship to compete with those, else you are leaving yourself at a disadvantage.
If it was my choice, i'd make it so that you cannot run more than 1 client at a time... but then people would use multiple computers. I'd make it so that no more than 1 connection would be accepted from a single IP, but that would screw over those that have roommates/siblings playing from behind the same router.
Unfortunately, i don't see a way CCP could realistically restrict it to only 1 account per real person. And since they can't, there will always be those that take advantage of it. And since it's legal, by not taking advantage of this yourself you are not adapting and putting yourself at a disadvantage
==
Above comments are my personal views
Oveur >Local shouldn't be a tactical tool, it's for chat
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Danton Marcellus
Nebula Rasa Holdings
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Posted - 2007.12.04 22:36:00 -
[32]
Unfair possibly but fair is a made up concept much like gods.
My experience is don't do it, it takes away from the overall enjoyment, stay with the single character and make what you can out of him.
Should/would/could have, HAVE you chav!
Also Known As |
elohllird
Destructive Influence
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.12.04 22:42:00 -
[33]
no, its not unfair, stop whining
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James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates
Enuma Elish.
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Posted - 2007.12.04 22:44:00 -
[34]
Yes, it is unfair.
I do it all the time, because it is so unfair not to do so is foolish.
I think it's _marginally_ less unfair than buying/selling GTCs, because at least with an second character you have the limitation on doing multiple things at once.
However I know just how much more effective I can be doing stuff with main + alt in combat.
You also missed: POS management alt.
Station management alt.
Alliance management alt.
Pirate + support alt.
Recon ship alt or interdictor alt.
A capital ship pilots basically _needs_ a cyno alt.
But most especially the scout alt, is so unbelievably useful.
I don't like that aspect of gameplay. I know how much an advantage an alt gives me in playing EVE, especially in areas like intel gathering. I would much rather that EVE gameplay mechanics were not that way.
However they are.
I still consider it less scummy than GTC trading, but would also much rather have an EVE where it wasn't really rather cruicial to have 'alt support'.
You can get by in _most_ areas without an alt. You don't _need_ an income/industry support alt. Places where they make the most difference are for cynos and scouts, and if I'm honest why I started second account in the first place. The other 'alt' advantages are actually less vital IMO.
--
Crane needs more grid
249km locking?
GMP and TNP |
Liv Forever
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Posted - 2007.12.04 22:45:00 -
[35]
To the OP-u have been flamed a bi but i realise that u that you were interested in it's effect on ppl game experience not whether it is cheating/legal or not. This is an interesting question from a psychological/philosophical standpoint and worthy of a thoughful reply. I've benn playing eve for 2 weeks and also alrdy have 2 accounts. One will be specced PVE and the other PVP. i'm just skilling up the PVP accounts learning skills atm and not rly playing him while getting the pve account ready for big mining ships and haulers. One way i hink multi accounts is different from buying isk is that u put in the effort in-game. ISK buyers or gtc seller(same thing) use effort employed out of game to save time in game. My effort is employed in game on both accounts. Of course I have had to work an 15 minutes a week to buy the other account. However, I don't know neone in rl who plays the game. is a group of friends sitting in a room together (one scouting/ one hauling for instance) cheating. I think of my alts like my own group or even clan/guild. I don't care about the social aspect so much so i become as independent as possible by playing my character as different roles that would otherwise have to be played by different ppl. So i become my own mini corp. Does this reduc my game experienc in terms of ocial aspct-yes and im happy with that. Does it reduce my game exprience by giving me ezmode-no because ppl play in fleets/corps r doing same thing (that is nature of game).
The whole RMT issue in mmo is interesting because ppl with better computers, internet connection, location to server, more leisure time do better at mmos so there is a relationship between performance in mmo and RL financial/work situation. Not to mention that i cna never catch up to ppp, whove owned game for 4 yrs (skills wise) so specialisation is my only realistic avenue to become competitive.
I think that the more time goes on the more blurred the relationship between real world and virtual world will blur and the less of an issue RMT in form of currency buying, multi accountss, character selling etc will be. Atm blizz is at one extreme (although even they don't disallow mult accounts) and games like 2nd life entropia r other xtreme where RMT part of game. CCP has positioned EVE in the middle.Bottom line is though-Eve is a world and economy that will never be separated from the real world-we can enter eve via our computer-internet connection-CCP servers. We buy time with real money and can legally sell GTC/characters and have multi accounts. All these thing involve real world aspects and are affected by people real world standings. Insome ways this could be a positive because it will encourage people who dedicate TOO much time(subjective judgement here) to MMOs to pay more attention to rl and strike a better balance because you can only really get the most out of ur gaming expoerience if u are financially secure, physically healthy and mentally alert in RL.
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Maglorre
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Posted - 2007.12.04 22:51:00 -
[36]
Multiple accounts are a fact of life in the game. I don't think it's a problem if someone uses multiple accounts to do different things (e.g. a trade alt in empire and a 0.0 alliance PVPer).
What I'm seeing though is that it does kill teamwork. I often log in and look for something to help out with and more often than not there is nothing to help with since the others with their army of alts have got everything covered and find it easier to do all the logistics themselves rather than allowing someone else to help.
Unfortunately this leads to the situation where those doing the "work" with multiple accounts start *****ing at everyone else because they never help and leads to a bit of friction. I've seen this in a couple of corps now and I'm sure it's not unique but a rather widespread problem.
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Oku Kee'lus
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Posted - 2007.12.04 22:52:00 -
[37]
Some people have a 2nd ( and a 3rd and a 4th and a 5th et cetera ) account they play with.
Some people have RL friends they play with.
Some people have active/very active corps they play with.
... those 3 things are all basically equal. It doesn't matter if it's you or another person playing the scout/hauler/cyno "alt".
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Eizana
Amarr
Scyanis
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Posted - 2007.12.04 23:40:00 -
[38]
Yes it is unfair. The unfairness does not lie in fact that someone gets to have something for nothing. Obviously if you own 5 accounts you are playing them and paying for them in cash or ISK. What's unfair about it is that some people have more time in real life to play EVE than other people. As a result they can make more of in-game money, decrease risks for themselves, train to do certain things in game faster, and in general have obvious advantage playing EVE simply by virtue of having all this time to spend on computer games. But this is a problem with all mmos - differences in real life situation of players translate to virtual world. Game inherently isn't fair and there's really no way to make it fair. You either accept it or you stop playing mmos.
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Liv Forever
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Posted - 2007.12.05 00:19:00 -
[39]
Two issue addressed by OP and subsequent replies. Fairness and appreciation of the game.
Fairness issues have been comprehensively dealt with imo-see above.
Appreciation needs more thought.
I think of appreciation in terms of the identity of my character/s and their relationship to others and the environment. Does running multi accounts/alts stymie the formation of identity for my characters. Answer is NO (for me).
eg. I have been stealing or in high sec space on a toon. This character gets the identity of an ore thief. People see me and log on alts (oh the irony) to kill me because that character is an ore thief. I log on an alt and scout out an area in an ibis and wait for people to go off guard and start mining again. Ppl don't kill my alt because his identity is not ore thief. When ppl are off guard I log back on ore thief and rob them. This does not compromise the identity of my characters in game and does not ruin my appreciation of the game or my interaction with others.
I comes back again to the fairness aspect. Fact is I could get corp mate or friend to scout for me so it's not unfair but does take away from the social aspect a bit. However, having played games where u have to rely heavily on others to progress, I know that this game style is not for me. I want to be more independent. I will probably become a pirate which will fit my identity perfectly and provide me with the game style i want. I will have a safe alt to make money. Two characters-two identities. Each character treated in game according to his identity in game. Far from detracting from my gam appreciation it will enhance it because I will get to experience the game with two distinct identities. Of course the time that I can dedicate to each will be split. It depends on whether you see an identity in virual reality as having the same boundaries as one in RL. Irl i can have different identities (eg. at work and not at work) but ultimately the oneness of my physical being will suffer the consequences if either of my identities does something illegal/ immoral. Of course in EVE that won't happen because the identities are not connected by a physical self that is tangible to oher players. That physical self is hidden and will only suffer consequences if i break laws created irl (such as EULA or RL criminal/civil laws). So the question that underlies all judgements about fairness and appreciation concerning multiple accounts is : Should each RL person be bound to one in-game identity to maintain the integrity of the real-virtual self? If I don't then I am able to be deceitful and manipulative in cyberspace without repercussion. Like going into a chat room as two different people to deceive and manipulate someone that I'm trying to chat up or sell something to. Actions in cyberspace will always impact/affect me and others irl. My deceit in creating separate in-game identities will affect/ruin other ppls game/rl experience and possibly my own because it is impossible to completely separate RL and virual world experience. However, EVE is a game and all characters/ items are completely owned by CCP.They make the rules for their use. Multi accounting is actively encouraged by CCP with power of 2 so this deceit is a part of the game. In a chat room or on ebay it is a scam that vulnerable people may be exploited by whereas in EVE it is a part of the game which is accepted and encouraged by the developer and the majority of the playing population. Unlike real-life, games are bound by rules and rules are created by the games developers. Quite simply if it's not against the rules it's OK.
Hope that cleared it all up
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elohllird
Destructive Influence
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.12.05 00:46:00 -
[40]
ahhh wall of text,
/me dies
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DaveW
Caldari
South Park Development
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Posted - 2007.12.05 01:00:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Bardolph
Dude, when over 50% of the game is spent WAITING while my ship is in warp, WAITING for a mining laser cycle to complete, or WAITING for a rat to die after pressing F1-F8, I'm perfectly happy to have the opportunity to switch windows and play another character during these WAITING periods.
It makes the game more fun.
This is a Man that understands EVE...!!!
---------------------------------------------------
"If you can't stand the heat..., stay out of the Kitchen." |
Kurak Vand
Minmatar
Sturmgrenadier Inc
R i s e
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Posted - 2007.12.05 01:25:00 -
[42]
1 person running 2 accounts = 2x profit per person for ccp, regardless of if he pays cash or gtc, SOMEONE paid ccp $30 for that person to run 2 accounts that month. Hence, it is in ccp's interest to let people have as many accounts as they want to pay for. This is not going away. The servers will shut down before they would even consider it.
Fly somewhat less than safe |
Ulstan
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Posted - 2007.12.05 01:30:00 -
[43]
Quote:
If it was my choice, i'd make it so that you cannot run more than 1 client at a time... but then people would use multiple computers. I'd make it so that no more than 1 connection would be accepted from a single IP, but that would screw over those that have roommates/siblings playing from behind the same router.
It's impossible to prevent people from running multiple accounts, and foolish to even try to make it difficult. Leave it easy and then at least everyone is on the same footing.
Having a scout alt is almost required for low sec jumping (as all the pirates will be happy to tell you) so knocking out second accounts would make it *much* harder for people to adventure safely there. And this would reduce the number of people that go there at all.
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Error404
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Posted - 2007.12.05 01:35:00 -
[44]
If anyone has more than one account then they're sad and should go out more. I wake for work at 6am and then get home at 4pm, i'll often fall asleep cause i'm knackared and then have to go to work when i wake up. On Saturday's it'll be time to go out drinking with the lads and then the only day i really get time to play is on a Sunday. I can't see where anyone else would egt the time to play on more than one account, unless they really prefer sitting on their PC to going out and seeing the world.
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Liv Forever
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Posted - 2007.12.05 01:46:00 -
[45]
Edited by: Liv Forever on 05/12/2007 01:50:20
Edited by: Liv Forever on 05/12/2007 01:48:56
Edited by: Liv Forever on 05/12/2007 01:48:13
Edited by: Liv Forever on 05/12/2007 01:47:53
Originally by: Error404
If anyone has more than one account then they're sad and should go out more. I wake for work at 6am and then get home at 4pm, i'll often fall asleep cause i'm knackared and then have to go to work when i wake up. On Saturday's it'll be time to go out drinking with the lads and then the only day i really get time to play is on a Sunday. I can't see where anyone else would egt the time to play on more than one account, unless they really prefer sitting on their PC to going out and seeing the world.
So let me get this straight-working so hard on weekdays that u r so tired u cant do nething in the evening and just sleep. Then going out Saturday to intoxicate urself so that u can't see or think straight in most likely smoke filled environment flirting with airhead (also drunk) women talking total rubbish in the hope to get laid. Then waking up with a hangover and feeling like crap all day Sunday ready to go back and do the same again next week. This is getting a life and the real world. I elaborated the details because that is what most people mean by 'drinking with the lads' but even if ur life is not so tragic-to me being too tired to enjoy my evenings and drinking at weekends (which u clearly stated is ur life) is very sad and i feel sorry for u. Don't cast judgements about other ppls lives when ur own lifestyle appears so dull and tedious.
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Crumplecorn
Gallente
Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.12.05 01:48:00 -
[46]
Edited by: Crumplecorn on 05/12/2007 01:48:37
Life advice from someone who goes out drinking regularly.
Fail
(and probable troll)
-
I wish I was a three foot female doll with a watering can and heterochromatic eyes. |
Silly Banana
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Posted - 2007.12.05 01:50:00 -
[47]
I have 27 accounts.
Yes it is unfair, you convince CCP to give up $388 a month to make it fair for poverty stricken countries and I will gladly go back to one.
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Araxmas
The Blue Dagger Mercenery Agency
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Posted - 2007.12.05 01:55:00 -
[48]
Only recently got a second account so I can test other parts of the game without deviating Arax here. Never thought having a second account was ever unfair, maybe the scout second account was lame but never really ticked me off.
To answer the blatant troll. I go out to the SU bar regularly, go walking through the countryside near my uni regulary. Yes I must be really sad and not get out much.
--------
The Derek Quote Pyramid |
Mad Amos
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Posted - 2007.12.05 01:58:00 -
[49]
Just a comment about the life is unfair thing. Life is not unfair. Life just is. It's your perception that makes it unfair or not. If you go through life saying that life's unfair, you are playing the victim. Life is what you make it.
So is Eve. 
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Cpt Fina
Mutually Assured Distraction
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Posted - 2007.12.05 02:02:00 -
[50]
I got more than one account and I do agree that it gives me an in-game advantage that single account-users don't have. And yes, I think it is unfair and devalues some of my acomplishments in Eve. However the moral issues I have with multiple accounts isn't great enough to make me neglect the practical benefits.
GTC-trade is more unfair imo. Still not a good excuse
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Pitt Bull
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.12.05 02:03:00 -
[51]
Using 2 accounts for the same MMO...
I'm pretty sure that's: (anti-social)^2
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Shakuul
Caldari
O RLY corp
YTMND.
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Posted - 2007.12.06 01:01:00 -
[52]
Edited by: Shakuul on 06/12/2007 01:01:21
No, since anyone that really wants another account can get one (unless you're a noob you should have no problem making 280mil/month).
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Aille Pluthrak
Caldari
Racketeers
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Posted - 2007.12.06 01:14:00 -
[53]
I have three accounts and two computers. What's unfair is one of those computers can't run the new graphics that's part of the new patch. Oh well, guess I*'ll just have to suffer.
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Jacob Mei
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Posted - 2007.12.06 01:33:00 -
[54]
I play with 2 accounts, a friend of mine plays with 3, I know that I have seen someone in a backwater system mining with 5 accounts (all had the same last name).
People say this sort of thing is unfair. I say the balance comes from us having to pay an additional 15 a month or having to double our efforts to afford paying 150m-175m a month for a secondary account let alone 3-5 which can come to 45-75 a month in subscription fees or 450m-750m isk a month.
In short, while it does give us an advantage in many respects is also requires us to be willing to pay more currency either in the form of $$$ (insert your countries money sign) or ISK.
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CoRrUpTiGe
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Posted - 2007.12.06 01:40:00 -
[55]
Here is the complete answer to fairness in the universe :)
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Jacob Mei
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Posted - 2007.12.06 01:43:00 -
[56]
Originally by: CoRrUpTiGe
Here is the complete answer to fairness in the universe :)
This man speaks the truth!
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two2litres
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Posted - 2007.12.06 02:02:00 -
[57]
Edited by: two2litres on 06/12/2007 02:02:35
I dont think its unfair, i however think it makes the game that much smaller.
why?
you dont need to go out and hire someone to courier for you, you dont need to hire anyone to gaurd you whilst you mine etc.
there is a whole sub-game where you can barter for different services that is being wiped out.
proud savage of newerth - www.s2games.com - |
blake fallout
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Posted - 2007.12.06 02:05:00 -
[58]
i have had 3 accounts over 4 years only useing this one, too costly (ú15 month)
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umop 3pisdn
Minmatar
Fnck the blob.
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Posted - 2007.12.06 02:06:00 -
[59]
Lifes not fair.
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Swarmm
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Posted - 2007.12.06 02:46:00 -
[60]
I've recently activated a second account and do believe having more than one is an unfair advantage. Thats why i treat both characters completely seperate.
That said, if other players prefer to play with more than one account thats their business, as long as it doesnt effect my playing experience.
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Jukhta Mein
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Posted - 2007.12.06 05:50:00 -
[61]
Seems like most players seem to think that it's ok because of the maxim "life is unfair anyway". I won't argue with that, but I do hope you apply the same thinking when absurd, negative things crop up in life like your property agent cancelling out on you last-minute because he had a better offer, your boss firing you over a pretty newcomer girl, your girlfriend/wife leaving you for another man who is richer, you get robbed in broad daylight, your entire family being wiped out in a natural disaster etc. Life is unfair anyway, too bad some people are luckier than others.
People say that it is not really feasible to experience the game's content with just 1 character who specialises in 1 or 2 professions. This still isn't enough justification in my opinion, as you can simply create multiple characters on a single account, or multiple characters on multiple accounts, but do not allow users to run more than 1 client at any one point.
People also say that running multiple accounts being paid for in ISK requires hard work too, but you must be making a profit from having all your accounts - or you wouldnt be running them -, and this profit will undermine the profits being earned by a single-account player who earns disproportionately less when comparing the same activity engaged in. "The single-account player can always get another account to be competitive", so you say. And if he doesn't, too bad.
Well I for one find it a pity Eve has to go down this way, where multiple accounts are quite necessary to experience more content, get more convenience, be more competitive, or whatever other reasons you have multiple accounts for.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2007.12.06 05:54:00 -
[62]
Two accounts in one player's hand, or two good friends playing in the same room each on their own account.
What's the difference ?
Right... the two guys have an advantage over that one guy with two accounts, since they can dedicate their full attention to each of their characters.
Unfair, I tell you, bloody freaking unfair !
How's that for an argument ?
C|S|I|N|x. |
techzer0
IDLE GUNS
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Posted - 2007.12.06 05:58:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Akita T
Two accounts in one player's hand, or two good friends playing in the same room each on their own account.
What's the difference ?
Right... the two guys have an advantage over that one guy with two accounts, since they can dedicate their full attention to each of their characters.
Unfair, I tell you, bloody freaking unfair !
How's that for an argument ?
Well said Akita... very well said. I have two accounts, and i like it that way....
____________________
Hi. I'm not an alt :) |
Jukhta Mein
|
Posted - 2007.12.06 07:54:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Akita T
Two accounts in one player's hand, or two good friends playing in the same room each on their own account.
What's the difference ?
Right... the two guys have an advantage over that one guy with two accounts, since they can dedicate their full attention to each of their characters.
Unfair, I tell you, bloody freaking unfair !
How's that for an argument ?
We have to be sure that that really is a polished argument first. In the example you gave we are comparing total number of accounts, which is 2 versus 2. I am however more interested in comparing the effects of each player using 1 or more accounts. Which means that in your example it has to be 2 players with an account each versus another 2 players with 2 or more accounts each.
If you're trying to make a point that there are multiple instances where single-account playing is "unfair" as well, like when 2 buddies live in the same place and frequently play Eve in the same room together, thus having superior communication, then let me point out that it's made even worse when they have multiple accounts each.
In short:
1 player/1account < 1 player/2 accounts < 2 players/1 account each < 2 players/2 accounts each.
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Garia666
Amarr
T.H.U.G L.I.F.E
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Posted - 2007.12.06 07:56:00 -
[65]
Edited by: Garia666 on 06/12/2007 07:56:15
now a days you almoste cant go with out multiple account. since half the ships needs cyno`s or you need a scout to travel. an guy to pick up ur loot..
->My Vids<- |
Admiral Pelleon
Caldari
White Shadow Imperium
Burning Horizons
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Posted - 2007.12.06 07:58:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Jukhta Mein
I was reading another thread on the purchase of ISK via GTCs (http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=649675), and a few people commented that the person in question would never appreciate the game fully because he doesn't know the true value of ISK and hence, the ships and equipment that he buys with it.
I thought about it a while and realised the same kind of thinking can be applied to players utilising multiple accounts. Before we go into that however, lets look at some common examples at how multiple accounts, or alts, are being used:
- mission-runner + salvager
- hauler/travelling ship + scout
- trader + trader (basically having an alt in another region to check out prices)
- capital ship + cyno ship
- miner + hauler
All of these examples bring about convenience to their users. On top of that they either increase the rate of flow of ISK for their users or decrease the risks undertaken in the respective activities, as compared to single-account characters who do everything in one window. Now doesn't this undermine both the value of ISK and the value of teamwork in Eve? The value of ISK is undermined because multiple-account users generally earn ISK much faster than single-account users in the same activity, not through ingenuity or innovation but through the virtue of having paid for more accounts. Now if you think that that's all fair - after all, they paid with real-life money for that advantage, didn't they - then I assume you think that there's nothing wrong with buying ISK with money.
Same goes for the value of teamwork. I got attracted to Eve initially by its promise of co-operative play. I was disappointed when I found out that you don't need a hauler to haul for you when you mine - you can create a hauler alt. You don't need a team-mate to scout for you - you can create a covert ops alt. You don't need players to help you run through missions - you can create a few alts and zap through them all by yourself, all the while salvaging by the sidelines.
At the core of things, you don't need to balance income-generation and pvp activities - you can just create an industrialist alt and let him earn isk while you pvp. This undermines both the value of ISK and teamwork.
I'm not saying that people who use multiple accounts don't understand the value of isk and teamwork. I just feel that they would appreciate both values more when they're on a single account, working with other players on their single accounts.
And yes, I do feel a certain unfairness in people using multiple accounts. It's hard to describe or qualify this feeling of unfairness, but it's a similar feeling to when someone is able to afford that carrier simply because he bought isk, as opposed to working hard for it or pooling the isk together with his friends or corpmates. ]
Comments appreciated. In particular I would like to hear the thoughts of other single-account pilots - do you think there's an unfair advantage of multiple-account pilots over you? Would you ever get another account? Why not?
I have 1 account and see having more than one a hassle. I don't care about industry, mining, or carebearing. 1 account is all I need.
________
"It's a good day to die!"
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Apocryphai
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.12.06 08:01:00 -
[67]
Several points to make here.
1) I don't believe it's unfair to run multiple accounts since anyone can do this. "Unfair" is an advantage one person has that another person cannot also have. Now, with GTC's for ISK, *anyone* can pay for more than one account. If you can increase income generation with more than one account then you can use that extra income to pay for the accounts.
2) Even if CCP decided that they didn't want people to run multiple accounts, how exactly could it be stopped? Only allow 1 connection per IP - wouldn't work, multi-account users could use proxies and people sharing internet connections would be unfairly penalized.
3) What makes you think MMORPGs (any any computer game) have to (or CAN be) fair? You could argue that someone with a nice, fast computer with a shiny new graphics card has an unfair advantage over someone with a 4-year old clunker of a PC. Sorry, life isn't fair, and neither is virtual life. If you think CCP really consider total "fairness" to be a part of EVE then you clearly weren't around during the T2 lottery.
Using multiple characters in MMORPG's isn't the "easy free money" that people think it is. If you complain about it then you should actually try it first, so that you have some idea what you're talking about really.
Originally by: Victor Valka
What the skull-chick said.
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Malcanis
High4Life
SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2007.12.06 08:17:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Error404
If anyone has more than one account then they're sad and should go out more. I wake for work at 6am and then get home at 4pm, i'll often fall asleep cause i'm knackared and then have to go to work when i wake up. On Saturday's it'll be time to go out drinking with the lads and then the only day i really get time to play is on a Sunday. I can't see where anyone else would egt the time to play on more than one account, unless they really prefer sitting on their PC to going out and seeing the world.
Maybe not everyone lives the same way you do. Many don't sleep for 14 hours a day.
People who play EvE instead of watching TV, for instance?
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Andrue
Amarr
|
Posted - 2007.12.06 08:44:00 -
[69]
Originally by: umop 3pisdn
Lifes not fair.
..and then you die.
--
(Battle hardened industrialist)
[Brackley, UK]
My budgie can say "ploppy bottom". You have been warned. |
Grim Vandal
Caldari
Burn Proof
|
Posted - 2007.12.06 08:55:00 -
[70]
AGAIN the whole point is:
Should a high sec char be able to give money directly to a low sec char?
and should this be traceable and should after sometime every char be forced to join a corp?
I have nothing against multiple accounts, but I do have a problem if say a pirate finances his ships with his 1.0 empire carebear npc char in a npc corp.
On the other hand it is money for ccp and that is it what seems to count these days. sad but true
still I want that new supercomputer! so all buy some more char now pls
Greetings Grim |
xavier69
|
Posted - 2007.12.06 09:05:00 -
[71]
I went down to the bad side of town yesterday and it was totally unfair man, Two huge guys beat the ever living snot out of me, I kept screaming stop this isnÆt fair but they just kept kicking the crap out of me. I told them I was going to get the DEVS too Nerf their punches as they do too much damage and it was totally unfair I tell youà
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Ralle030583
Gallente
Mystic Lion Hearts
Sev3rance
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Posted - 2007.12.06 09:08:00 -
[72]
i have also more than one account,
but dont see why its "unfair" cause i pay for every one
Quote:
I'm not saying that people who use multiple accounts don't understand the value of isk and teamwork. I just feel that they would appreciate both values more when they're on a single account, working with other players on their single accounts.
You can belive me many many ppl with multiple accounts know how teamwork works,
there is no difference in teamwork with single player accounts or with ppl who all use 2-3 accs at same moment, its only more work and harder to handle, specially in PVP :-)
And to the unfair income... sure you can make more isk with multiple accounts but you also working for it.. you dont get ISK income for only have more accounts.. you have to play with them, like a single player with one the only difference is that you play like 2 friends who sit nearby 
You need a free Killboard?
check: http:\\www.eve-kill.net
Originally by: CCP Sharkbait
i have untrashed this bug report and i will take car |
Malcanis
High4Life
SMASH Alliance
|
Posted - 2007.12.06 09:22:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Grim Vandal
AGAIN the whole point is:
Should a high sec char be able to give money directly to a low sec char?
and should this be traceable and should after sometime every char be forced to join a corp?
I have nothing against multiple accounts, but I do have a problem if say a pirate finances his ships with his 1.0 empire carebear npc char in a npc corp.
On the other hand it is money for ccp and that is it what seems to count these days. sad but true
still I want that new supercomputer! so all buy some more char now pls
Well the pirate can do that with an alt on the same account.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Fuzion Infinity
Gallente
Club Vandersexxx
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Posted - 2007.12.06 09:29:00 -
[74]
I have one account, and I still feel that this is a ridiculous point your trying to make. If the pay for it with ISK or with real money, their still putting forth an extra effort to support both account, or however many accounts they have; not to mention the price for a second computer, or a computer that can handle multiple EVE clients at once with ease. I don't even see where your going with the buying ISK thing, completely irrelevant in my opinion. Team work? There will always be team work, the day I see one man with 100+ accounts leading a fleet operation in 0.0, I'll agree with you.
I guess my point is, You get what you pay for.
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Oh I give up, they keep nerfing my signature. :-| |
Rjaiajik Kajvoril
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Posted - 2007.12.06 09:50:00 -
[75]
To OP: The people who run multiple accounts to avoid teamwork and gain as much ISK as possible are clearly selfish people. Would you want to work with these people. Personally, I feel if they have the time and money to run two accounts let them. It bothers me very little. I'll find people to play with on EVE and often end up in groups of 3-5 people. We have fun.... those poor sods have to play with themselves, and not in a good way.
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Jukhta Mein
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Posted - 2007.12.06 14:28:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Fuzion Infinity
I have one account, and I still feel that this is a ridiculous point your trying to make. If the pay for it with ISK or with real money, their still putting forth an extra effort to support both account, or however many accounts they have; not to mention the price for a second computer, or a computer that can handle multiple EVE clients at once with ease. I don't even see where your going with the buying ISK thing, completely irrelevant in my opinion. Team work? There will always be team work, the day I see one man with 100+ accounts leading a fleet operation in 0.0, I'll agree with you.
I guess my point is, You get what you pay for.
To the above poster and the rest, I assume you have no issues with people not earning isk and just buying it via GTCs or other methods to purchase ships and equipment or POSes for whatever purposes. Such people are, after all, using their real life money anyway.
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Kirao
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Posted - 2007.12.06 14:31:00 -
[77]
Edited by: Kirao on 06/12/2007 14:31:17
>>>> The people who run multiple accounts to avoid teamwork and gain as much ISK as possible are clearly selfish people.
I run multiple accounts. Generally use two at once during CORP mining/fleet ops. That make me selfish ? Or in fact the opposite, providing at my expense, and extra body out on the battlefield to assist my small corp ?
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Jukhta Mein
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Posted - 2007.12.06 14:38:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Kirao
Edited by: Kirao on 06/12/2007 14:31:17
>>>> The people who run multiple accounts to avoid teamwork and gain as much ISK as possible are clearly selfish people.
I run multiple accounts. Generally use two at once during CORP mining/fleet ops. That make me selfish ? Or in fact the opposite, providing at my expense, and extra body out on the battlefield to assist my small corp ?
In other words, we have reached a stage where we need multiple accounts to be more competitive.
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Valrandir
Gallente
Slacker Industries
Cult of War
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Posted - 2007.12.06 14:45:00 -
[79]
Originally by: Ulstan
Much like the rest of EVE, life, the universe, and everything, it is indeed unfair.
Exactly
And this is where EvE is nice, it's not fair :)
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This has surpassed the Yarrdware specification and has been dubbed Uberware
- Oveur
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Del Narveux
Dukes of Hazard
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Posted - 2007.12.06 14:54:00 -
[80]
Well theyre definitely not fair, but theyre also not going away. One of the down sides of MMOGs is their heavy reliance on character stats to do stuff is it encourages people to game the system with multiple accounts.
As far as my personal opinions on the matter, I dont really care. I grew bored with the dumbing down of combat mechanics a while back, so aside from the occasional bomber run to .0 I just chill wit friends and occasionally kill npcs to make money so its all good. When I feel like being competitive, I hit up TF2...no dual logging there.
_________________
[SAK] Alumnus--And Proud Of It! -- aka Cpt Bogus
Is that my torped sig cloaking your base?
Originally by: Wrangler
Well, at least we have forum PvP..
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oingo
Gallente
23rd Armor
Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2007.12.06 15:15:00 -
[81]
I have 3 accounts all in the 30mill-40 mill sp range. 1 pvp, 1 capital and a jack of all trades...There is one side to this that I have not seen brouht up here...these accounts are costing me a fortune in isks to keep the books and ships they need coming in.
My game time has also been greatly reduced for RL reasons so when I do get to play it is nice to be able to spend a few hours on all accounts to make $$ than the next few times I am on I can do alliance/corp activities....
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