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Shakuul
Caldari
Extreme Addiction
Atrum Tempestas Foedus
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Posted - 2008.04.28 17:49:00 -
[31]
 Originally by: Grayson Sutherland
I'm considering leaving the game. The game gives too much power to those who have ben around for a long time.
Even the $15 doesn't seem worth the wait for a better fighting capability.
Any reason why I should stay?
A few ideas:
-Start with midsize or small ships...in sub one year you can become quite proficient with a battlecruiser.
-Join a better player corp...with superior numbers you can kill 5 year players
-Make lots of isk and buy a character on the forums (apparently high-SP characters are underpriced)
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Cors
It's A Trap
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Posted - 2008.04.28 17:50:00 -
[32]
Lets see.
In my first year.
- Learned to play.
- Got to lvl 4 Missions, made my first ships, ammo, mods.
- went to 0.0 for first time. Lost firt raven(3hrs) after I got it. :)
- learned to move in 0.0/low sec.
- Joined first corp. Joined Second Corp. Created first corp(Ran it for almost 2 years)
- My corp put up it's first and second POS(scary when you're new and only have 4 people in your corp)
- Put up our second POS, started 0.0 production of ammo/mods/ships.
- learned how to get through TOXIN gate camps. (Platinum Roach FTW)
- Killed my first player in pvp. His command ship vs my Ratting Raven. (WOOT A KILL!)
- My Corp joined it's second Alliance. Moved to Syndicate(Don't we all at one point in time)
- Alliance merged into another alliance. Moved to the South.
- Got handed executorship of an alliance (WTF DO I DO!!!)
- Got into a carrier. Can barely use it, but need it for logistics. Became Carrier *****.
- Fought more pvp battles in a week then I ever thought possible. 500+ kills in one week.
so... What can you do in your first year???
well. A lot. Get out there, Make friends, join corps and do what you can.
Remember. The Average age of players in this game 7-8 months old.
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baltec1
Antares Shipyards
Phalanx Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.28 17:53:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Grayson Sutherland
I'm considering leaving the game. The game gives too much power to those who have ben around for a long time.
Even the $15 doesn't seem worth the wait for a better fighting capability.
Any reason why I should stay?
I helped to take down 4 carriers and alot of battleships and support while flying a caracal with t1 fittings (LEROY is awsome). Even a rifter with t1 parts has its uses in a supercap fight.
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Antodias
North Eastern Swat
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.04.28 17:57:00 -
[34]
My character is nearly two and a half years old now.
Can I have some of this "power" you're talking about? kthx
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El'Niaga
Minmatar
Republic Military School
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Posted - 2008.04.28 18:00:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Shaar Cobalt
Originally by: El'Niaga
You can have fun but yes new players are shut out of a lot of aspects of the game.
Can you elaborate on exactly what those aspects are?
I did on one of them in the second paragraph you didn't quote.
The game is rigged against new players, which I suppose while the game is so crippled by lag might not be a bad thing. However if the game is to continue to grow and prosper after the lag issues are resolved or at least reduced by what they are working on now, then they are going to have to take steps to make the game more noob friendly in some ways.
The main problem is new players wanting to form new corporations with their friends who are also new players. There are to many griefing corps that harass these people to the point many quit. Probably the best solution might be a moratorium on declaring wars on new corporations. Perhaps a 6 month moratorium from date of creation to give them the time to build up and skill up. (The problem then is abuse by folks creating corp after corp so there would have to be some sort of mechanism to track it and limit abuse as much as possible).
Another area is noob access to 0.0. Let's face it they can't take out your sovereignty. They can't afford rent, and they don't have the skills to get in and out of space through gate camps. So many 0.0 empires say they want more folks in 0.0 but do everything they can to keep folks out which are contradictory in nature. This is not something that CCP can resolve though it is an attitude change that the players have to take.
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baltec1
Antares Shipyards
Phalanx Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.28 18:06:00 -
[36]
Originally by: El'Niaga
Originally by: Shaar Cobalt
Originally by: El'Niaga
You can have fun but yes new players are shut out of a lot of aspects of the game.
Can you elaborate on exactly what those aspects are?
I did on one of them in the second paragraph you didn't quote.
The game is rigged against new players, which I suppose while the game is so crippled by lag might not be a bad thing. However if the game is to continue to grow and prosper after the lag issues are resolved or at least reduced by what they are working on now, then they are going to have to take steps to make the game more noob friendly in some ways.
The main problem is new players wanting to form new corporations with their friends who are also new players. There are to many griefing corps that harass these people to the point many quit. Probably the best solution might be a moratorium on declaring wars on new corporations. Perhaps a 6 month moratorium from date of creation to give them the time to build up and skill up. (The problem then is abuse by folks creating corp after corp so there would have to be some sort of mechanism to track it and limit abuse as much as possible).
Another area is noob access to 0.0. Let's face it they can't take out your sovereignty. They can't afford rent, and they don't have the skills to get in and out of space through gate camps. So many 0.0 empires say they want more folks in 0.0 but do everything they can to keep folks out which are contradictory in nature. This is not something that CCP can resolve though it is an attitude change that the players have to take.
I have people in my corp who are less than 6 months old and live in 0.0, hell, one of them got onto several carrier kills and took down a HAC before he died.
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Malcanis
R.E.C.O.N.
Insurgency
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Posted - 2008.04.28 18:08:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Grayson Sutherland
I'm considering leaving the game. The game gives too much power to those who have ben around for a long time.
Even the $15 doesn't seem worth the wait for a better fighting capability.
Any reason why I should stay?
Ok you're assuming that you can only enjoy the game if you're the best - one of the elite. Not so. Discard the idea that you ought to win every or even most of your fights. As soon as you get over the idea that you're a hero, important, the centre of attention, you can start to enjoy Eve.
Make some friends, join a good corp, try stuff out. You don't need tens of millions of SP or billions of ISK (SP and ISK are nice to have, but far from essential for having fun).
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Cordran Li
Gallente
The Really Awesome Players
Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.28 18:08:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Grayson Sutherland
I'm considering leaving the game. The game gives too much power to those who have ben around for a long time.
Even the $15 doesn't seem worth the wait for a better fighting capability.
Any reason why I should stay?
Nope
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Hannobaal
Gallente
Shadow Forces Inc.
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Posted - 2008.04.28 18:11:00 -
[39]
Originally by: El'Niaga
Another area is noob access to 0.0. Let's face it they can't take out your sovereignty. They can't afford rent, and they don't have the skills to get in and out of space through gate camps.
Well, that's just simply wrong. I was ratting Serpentis battleships in Syndicate/Cloud Ring, on my own, with a tech 1 fitted blaster Thorax in my first month or so, before I even joined a corporation. I mean, I did lose a ship or two moving in and out of 0.0, but so what.
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Malcanis
R.E.C.O.N.
Insurgency
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Posted - 2008.04.28 18:14:00 -
[40]
Originally by: El'Niaga
Originally by: Shaar Cobalt
Originally by: El'Niaga
You can have fun but yes new players are shut out of a lot of aspects of the game.
Can you elaborate on exactly what those aspects are?
Another area is noob access to 0.0. Let's face it they can't take out your sovereignty. They can't afford rent, and they don't have the skills to get in and out of space through gate camps. So many 0.0 empires say they want more folks in 0.0 but do everything they can to keep folks out which are contradictory in nature. This is not something that CCP can resolve though it is an attitude change that the players have to take.
I can tell you from personal experience that this is not true. I have recruited players barely out of their trial and brought them straight in to 0.0 (NPC space is good for this because they can run missions for ISK). Yeah they died a lot, but who cares? T1 tackling frigs are essentially free. I made sure they knew how to do stuff like run through or avoid camps, use the scanner, orbit at optimal and that most of all it's far better to fight and lose than to keep a worthless T1 frigate safe and miss out on the fun.
Some didn't make it. They were the ones who clearly had a sense of entitlement, who couldn't accept that they weren't always going to win their fights, who were too selfish to work with a corp that was doing plenty for them.
Others did, and I'm proud to know them, and I'm still flying with some of them.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
papamikeforthewin
Amarr
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Posted - 2008.04.28 18:24:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Hannobaal
. I was ratting Serpentis battleships in Syndicate/Cloud Ring, on my own, with a tech 1 fitted blaster Thorax in my first month or so, before I even joined a corporation. I mean, I did lose a ship or two moving in and out of 0.0, but so what.
Anyone actually believe that this was successful?
Despite the OP claiming that being part of the old guard= win= lots more fun, I actually think its the opposite. Older players are more likely to be caught up in managerial roles in large alliances, are more likely to be minding/grinding out larger pos operations or stuck pvping in capital slugfests. They can still enjoy the other stuff dont get me wrong- but not all end game content is as fun as the noobier stuff- like your first kill, your first trip to 0.0, your first 100mil isk.
I know alot of older players who mostly play just to continue relationships formed with friends in the game than any real lust for the game anymore. Unfortunately im starting to feel that burn out too- id say it hits around 2.5- 3 yrs playing.
SO ENJOY THE NOVELTIES OF EVE BEFORE YOU GET BORED OF EM! In no time at all you will be a 3-4 account tabbing pos monkey minding bored player while sieging someone elses pos and trolling the eve-o forums- just like the rest of us...
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Jaedar Metron
I G N O T U S
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Posted - 2008.04.28 18:25:00 -
[42]
I miss how my first 6 months of the game was...
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Silver Night
Caldari
Naqam
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Posted - 2008.04.28 18:29:00 -
[43]
Originally by: papamikeforthewin
Originally by: Hannobaal
. I was ratting Serpentis battleships in Syndicate/Cloud Ring, on my own, with a tech 1 fitted blaster Thorax in my first month or so, before I even joined a corporation. I mean, I did lose a ship or two moving in and out of 0.0, but so what.
Anyone actually believe that this was successful?
If he got good advice somewhere yeah. Serps are the easiest NPCs in the game tbh. I used to ninja rat out there in an interceptor ffs.
And there are lots of ways to have fun. I usually fly a tech 1 fit thorax (cause I'm poor) It is effective, and you can be almost as effective in it as I am (after 5 years) with maybe 2 months of training.
--------------
GLS Mr. State
Caldari Patriot.
Sansha's Nation Supporter
Murderer of (his own) Frigates.
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Gimpb
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Posted - 2008.04.28 19:16:00 -
[44]
Edited by: Gimpb on 28/04/2008 19:16:49
After 4 and a half months, I can decently fly T1 up to BSs and some T2 frigs. I'm currently at the point where I'm trying to pick my cruiser 5 race but have been putting it off working up auxiliary skills.
Obviously I know people that can fit stuff better than I can, but how you fit, how you work as a group, and how well you play mean a heck of a lot more than your hull being able to take 5% more damage.
I'm able to have fun with what I can fit, and can fill a variety of roles.
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Hannobaal
Gallente
Shadow Forces Inc.
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Posted - 2008.04.28 19:37:00 -
[45]
Originally by: papamikeforthewin
Originally by: Hannobaal
. I was ratting Serpentis battleships in Syndicate/Cloud Ring, on my own, with a tech 1 fitted blaster Thorax in my first month or so, before I even joined a corporation. I mean, I did lose a ship or two moving in and out of 0.0, but so what.
Anyone actually believe that this was successful?
Why wouldn't it be? You take out the small ships first, and then orbit the battleships at close range. Since they don't use missiles. they can't hit a cruiser orbiting them with mwd off at 3-4 km. And blasters + drones are more than enough to take them apart. You do have to pick your targets carefully if you have low skills and tech 1 gear, but battleships up to 1 mil bounties are very much killable even then.
And as for getting in and out, I used to do it right before or right after down time, and I used the northern low sec pipe from Placid instead of going in through Orvolle into PF-.
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Mihaill Blackthorn
Gallente
Foundation
R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2008.04.28 19:40:00 -
[46]
You would be surpised at the number of very experienced people who make new characters to do specific things. New members to the gang have a tendency of wanting to train everything, and try many different things. They key to that first year is to pick something that you really like doing and specialize in it.
If you like to mine rock then specialize in haulers and mining barges. If you like to pvp then pick ship that will keep your interest and specialize in it. There are some good cruisers that are real good pvp ships that you may not win many fights but when combined with others are very capable. Thorax, Vexors, Ruptures, Caracals, and a real good battle cruiser that people over-look is the prophacy. The prophacy gets a really nice bonus to tanking and you can use any type of gun you desire (projectils are nice since they don't use cap).
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Lord Fitz
Antares Fleet Yards
SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.28 19:45:00 -
[47]
Originally by: El'Niaga
You can have fun but yes new players are shut out of a lot of aspects of the game.
It is almost impossible to form a new corp from scratch build it up and take any 0.0 space. It is a flaw in the game but one at this point I'm not sure how CCP could fix.
You can join some of the existing 0.0 corps/alliances though and enjoy it through them, though I admit that's not as rewarding.
It's not impossible it just takes time. Something everyone who 'can' do it spent doing. But trust me on this, you can have far far more fun as a newer player learning the game than you ever will flying capital ships and trying to hold your own 0.0 space. Rewarding, yes, somewhat, fun, alot less than it should be.
Most of what limits new players is their knowledge of the game, certainly not skillpoints, hell you can even buy a higher SP char if you're that desperate, and earning isk is best done with your brain rather than skills, it's much easier to part another player from their isk than mining/ratting. (And no I'm not talking about scamming, though I guess that is a possibility too).
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Niccolado Starwalker
Shadow Templars
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Posted - 2008.04.28 19:55:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Grayson Sutherland
I'm considering leaving the game. The game gives too much power to those who have ben around for a long time.
Even the $15 doesn't seem worth the wait for a better fighting capability.
Any reason why I should stay?
Hoestly, thats up to you to decide. Because if you cant find fun in the game now, you would not have found more fun in the game as a 5 year vet either.
The fun dont come with the ammount of SP you have. The fun dont come with the ammount of ISK you have, although being rich helps.
I started in 2005. Already then we had SP and ISK mogules. And Now I have soon been around for 3 year. and to be honest, It was in my first and second year I have had most fun so far. And from what I have read on the forums. Most of the vets also seems to think they had most fun when they where young too. Now they know "everything". Nothing is new. nothing new to explore etc.
So again. If you cant find fun after 3-6 months you might not find more fun later either. Although everything gets a little easier as soon you get into a battleship and can start getting more money.
Its your decisison. Good luck.
Originally by: Dianabolic
Your tears are absolutely divine, like a fine fine wine, rolling down your cheeks until they flow down the river of LOL |
Arouu
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Posted - 2008.04.28 19:57:00 -
[49]
Stopping impatient new players from staying in the game keeps the rifraf out.
Discuss.
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Leviathan9
Gallente
Royal Hiigaran Navy
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Posted - 2008.04.28 20:16:00 -
[50]
Theres people in my corp who do successfull solo pvp and they're 2 months old... Age means nothing in this game, thats what makes it such a great game.
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Daala Phage
Caldari
Bat Country
Aegis Militia
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Posted - 2008.04.28 20:30:00 -
[51]
I'm much less then a year and I'm enjoying the game very much.....
Does that mean I'm playing it wrong? 
"Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the Universe is that none of it has tried to contact us." - Calvin & Hobbes |
Trathen
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Posted - 2008.04.28 20:36:00 -
[52]
Once all your skills max out, you lose your braggin' rights. So better start earning them now. Chop chop.
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Hannobaal
Gallente
Shadow Forces Inc.
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Posted - 2008.04.28 20:37:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Arouu
Stopping impatient new players from staying in the game keeps the rifraf out.
Discuss.
confirm
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TheOnlyProphet
Amarr
The Silver Alliance
Ultionis Quietus
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Posted - 2008.04.28 20:45:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Grayson Sutherland
I'm considering leaving the game. The game gives too much power to those who have ben around for a long time.
Even the $15 doesn't seem worth the wait for a better fighting capability.
Any reason why I should stay?
You need to be able to appreciate the depth and complexity of EVE. If your looking to join a game and go pewpew and that's the extent of your desire to be involved in the EVE universe, then you should probably play something else.
EVE gives players the opportunity to EXSIT in that universe and you are limited to what you can do only by your imagination. Characters actually exist here.
How long have you existed in your real life?
Do you have power?
Do you have social status?
If you do, how did you get it?
You don't just wake up one day with the skills to fight the best fighters in the known universe.
Could someone please spoonfeed me my entertainment?
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Habanaro
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Posted - 2008.04.28 23:47:00 -
[55]
Time in game does not directly equal power imo, but if you equate time in game to time to make/spend isk on ships and modules while you learn wtf, then yes maybe there's a larger point here.
It takes isk to learn how not to get pwnd in combat. Training programs are one thing (my old alliance didnt really have one but I hear they help), but frankly I think you just have to get out there and pay some dues until it starts to jell. And that takes isk, sometimes a lot of it.
Which means mining (not for me), 0.0 ratting, +L4 missions, manufacturing. And to do that at 4-5 months into the game say 5mil SP level that really meant you had two accounts one to train manufacturing/run missions in hisec and feed money to your 0.0 ratting guy who's training pure combat and more powerful ships.
People without an extra source of income have longer delays until their next PVP run, especially when you want to move up from the T1 noob tackler role.
All of this would be my guess as to why there are a lot of players who choose to leave the game after about 6 months or so.
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Nozomi nrvqsr
Les chevaliers de l'ordre
Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2008.04.29 00:20:00 -
[56]
If you can't enjoy the game after a few month, you will never have fun.
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Intigo
Amarr
Art of War
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Posted - 2008.04.29 00:22:00 -
[57]
I was pirating in the game while still on my trial period with less than 200k total SPs (1/4th of what you start with now).
Seriously, quit bloody whining and get out there and try. It's not impossible.
Jeez, I'm so tired of the "I HAVE NO SPs, I CAN'T PLAY THE GAME" argument.
( Reference )
--
A-War, much love. <3 |
Norjia Blacksteel
Gallente
Blacksteel Mining and Manufacturing
Apoapsis Multiversal Consortium
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Posted - 2008.04.29 00:32:00 -
[58]
I've been in for two years. Had fun most of the time. I joined specifically to make and run a corp. I've been doing that since month 2 (had to earn the 1.5 mil to create a corp). We're making and selling battleships now, and have hundreds of millions in cashflow. Granted, that's not huge, but we don't live EVE; we play a bit casually.
Pick something, try to do it. If you like it, great. If not, either try something else, or play a different MMO. It's all about having fun in the end.
----
Norjia Blacksteel
CEO
Blacksteel Mining and Manufacturing |
sableye
principle of motion
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.04.29 00:39:00 -
[59]
I actually play my younger characters more in pvp alot more as I like small ships especially dictors and clones are cheap. why its true mymain sableye would be better in all one vrs one situations than my alts its not exactly every day you run into a true 1 vrs 1 in eve.
Join The Fight With Promo Today
View The North Star! |
ShardowRhino
Caldari
Legion 0f The Damned
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Posted - 2008.04.29 00:44:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Faife
eve really isn't about fun. it's about making sure others can't have fun. your approach is wrong.
The idea that someone else's pain and misery in eve is your fun is the reason to play eve. I can play another mmo and own noobs all day but eventually those noobs are going to recover from me owning them. In eve if you own someone you now own a peice of their time by looting their stuff. stuff=isk and isk=time and losing time sucks. They wont get that time back and will have to think about why they are grinding to recover the isk needed to replace their gear and that should make you smile.
as for being new in game, get evemon, find a corp that does what you want to do. if you want to pvp then you could always use frigates and cruisers and tackle or jam targets and let the older guys do the dps. During that time you up your skills so the next FNG can tackle/jam while you add to the dps.
if your into mining find a mining corp and they should gladly help haul your ore and refine it so you get a higher yield. if your a mission runner you can pop the smaller targets allowing the big guys to focus on BSes, you get more isk,help out,scoop loot and build standings faster so you can then help the FNG once youve moved up in the world of eve.
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