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royal killer Amarr Shadows Of The Federation	Posted - 2008.10.23 16:45:00 - [1] Well, for those that don't know this yet, here's a dev blog about the Orca, and its attributes, including a raelly cool picture of it tbh the ship looks AWSUM Linkage -------------------- ding ding! Wrangler: Hello and w ding ding! Wrangler: ...damn nanowhiners.
Tolsimir Wolfblood X.S. Industries	Posted - 2008.10.23 16:55:00 - [2] Looks sweet. Now were is my sub capitol dread and carrier at?
Zak'eni	Posted - 2008.10.23 17:00:00 - [3] This is awesome. Miniature stargate capable freighter for moving ships about, command bonuses, tractor beams. Now it just needs to be 5/5/5, 375m3 bay/125 bandwith, more PG and CPU so you can PVP in it.
CopyCatz Caldari Brewery Research Ltd Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.10.23 17:01:00 - [4] And no need to go to outer ring for the bpo :)
InsanlyEvlPerson Gallente Night-Stalkers	Posted - 2008.10.23 17:01:00 - [5] Originally by: Tolsimir Wolfblood Looks sweet. Now were is my sub capitol dread and carrier at? with 1 capitol gun/torp for the dread and maybe 3-5 fighters on the carrier? sounds wimpy. give me a mini carrier with a ship maininence bay, strong tank (marauder level maybe?), and i guess a couple fighters and i'll be happy. --------------------------------------------- I may be a bit over Zealot, but i cant help myself, its the best investment i ever made!
Bronson Hughes ADVANCED Combat and Engineering	Posted - 2008.10.23 17:07:00 - [6] I was going to ask if it's going to be jump drive capable like a Jump Freighter, but given the lack of Jump Drive Operations in the skill requirements, I'm guessing not. Either way, it looks like the Orca will be filling the gap between industrials/freighters/Rorqs very nicely. -------------------- "I am hard pressed on my right; my centre is giving way; situation excellent; I am attacking." - Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne
Tolsimir Wolfblood X.S. Industries	Posted - 2008.10.23 17:11:00 - [7] I say make a tech two tier 3 b/s. Make it have 3 weapons slots like a dread, throw on a seige mod and have fun....lol. If it sounds like i pulled it out of my a**, well i did.
Crackzilla The Shadow Order	Posted - 2008.10.23 17:19:00 - [8] So we have a new favorite way to afk mine in high sec? Put one laser per roid, wait for roids to pop or for 90k m3 of cargo space to fill. Repeat.
Zak'eni	Posted - 2008.10.23 17:19:00 - [9] Originally by: Crackzilla So we have a new favorite way to afk mine in high sec? Put one laser per roid, wait for roids to pop or for 90k m3 of cargo space to fill. Repeat. No turret slots.
Terianna Eri Amarr Scrutari	Posted - 2008.10.23 17:20:00 - [10] i have no interest in usng it for any reason ever except for the fact that it is gorgeous and i want one __________________________________ Originally by: Arthur Frayn How much to ruin all your holes, luv?
Dyaven Interstellar Mining and Research	Posted - 2008.10.23 17:43:00 - [11] While it's nice and all... will this be the end of can flipping?
Crackzilla The Shadow Order	Posted - 2008.10.23 17:52:00 - [12] Originally by: Zak'eni No turret slots. Whoops. Good catch. Originally by: Dyaven will this be the end of can flipping? Considering can flipping is a fairly silly mechanic now? Good riddance.
Karanth Gallente Eve's Brothers of Destiny FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2008.10.23 18:14:00 - [13] Looks good.
LordTiberius Ethical Dilemma	Posted - 2008.10.23 18:21:00 - [14] bleh:P
Benco97 Gallente The Star League	Posted - 2008.10.23 18:46:00 - [15] Hmm, I'm a little underwhelmed to be honest. Still, I can see it'll have it's uses. However, how about something for the little guy next time CCP? You can say "But this IS for the little guy" as much as you like but it's 1.4billion isk AT LEAST (Significantly more than that no doubt), those little two-three man corps can't afford this easily. Still, I guess you're not supposed to play EVE unless you're in an alliance. I know I shouldn't rant and this IS a job well does I guess it's just annoying to see new high-end things get added with each update which cost so much, not everyone has multi billions.
Bronson Hughes ADVANCED Combat and Engineering	Posted - 2008.10.23 18:51:00 - [16] Originally by: Crackzilla Originally by: Zak'eni No turret slots. Whoops. Good catch. No, but it does have a 50m^3 drone bay and 25m^3 of drone bandwidth, so if you absolutely must mine AFK in an Orca, you could do it with T2 mining drones.
royal killer Amarr Shadows Of The Federation	Posted - 2008.10.23 18:52:00 - [17] Originally by: Benco97 Hmm, I'm a little underwhelmed to be honest. Still, I can see it'll have it's uses. However, how about something for the little guy next time CCP? You can say "But this IS for the little guy" as much as you like but it's 1.4billion isk AT LEAST (Significantly more than that no doubt), those little two-three man corps can't afford this easily. Still, I guess you're not supposed to play EVE unless you're in an alliance. I know I shouldn't rant and this IS a job well does I guess it's just annoying to see new high-end things get added with each update which cost so much, not everyone has multi billions. I think you mean because of the bpo with it ? Tbh, I don't think they'll be buying the bpo, they'll be buying it just made, and I seriously doubt it will cost more than 600 mill (if not even less), if it goes above that, it's just stupid overpricing of greedy people.
Elaron Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2008.10.23 18:55:00 - [18] Originally by: Benco97 it's 1.4billion isk AT LEAST Why would mom'n'pop industrial shops want to buy the BPO? If it's being bought to use, then 450M - 500M is the investment required.
Benco97 Gallente The Star League	Posted - 2008.10.23 18:59:00 - [19] Originally by: Elaron Originally by: Benco97 it's 1.4billion isk AT LEAST Why would mom'n'pop industrial shops want to buy the BPO? If it's being bought to use, then 450M - 500M is the investment required. You know what, you're absolutely right, I read it completely wrong and it got a bit wonky in my head. All I can say is that today is a bit of an off day for me shrugs For some reason I thought everyone needed a BP to own one, you'd never believe I'd been here since the beginning would you? Still, I don't take back what I said, less high-end alliance aimed stuff please. Originally by: P'uck You're a DUMBASS - bold italic underline at the VERY LEAST.
InsanlyEvlPerson Gallente Night-Stalkers	Posted - 2008.10.23 19:01:00 - [20] Originally by: Benco97 Hmm, I'm a little underwhelmed to be honest. Still, I can see it'll have it's uses. However, how about something for the little guy next time CCP? You can say "But this IS for the little guy" as much as you like but it's 1.4billion isk AT LEAST (Significantly more than that no doubt), those little two-three man corps can't afford this easily. Still, I guess you're not supposed to play EVE unless you're in an alliance. I know I shouldn't rant and this IS a job well does I guess it's just annoying to see new high-end things get added with each update which cost so much, not everyone has multi billions. agreed. honestly, i could go for a hisec carrier or something of the sort, and dont say buy a domi cuz it cant fill the support role without killing its own tank like a carrier. --------------------------------------------- I may be a bit over Zealot, but i cant help myself, its the best investment i ever made!
Kunming T.H.U.G L.I.F.E White Core	Posted - 2008.10.23 19:11:00 - [21] Dispite this being slightly off topic, I strongly agree with Benco here... All new content thats being added lately is aimed for large alliances. So unless ur part of BoB, Goons or the North this content is pretty much off limits. I feel this is against the spirit of the game. Not all of us want to be part of the epic lag fest or we might enjoy being the underdog, trying to make a living out there while the big boys clash it out, but we are paying customers too and want to have a taste at new content just like everyone else.
Bronson Hughes ADVANCED Combat and Engineering	Posted - 2008.10.23 19:19:00 - [22] Originally by: InsanlyEvlPerson agreed. honestly, i could go for a hisec carrier or something of the sort, and dont say buy a domi cuz it cant fill the support role without killing its own tank like a carrier. Um, the Orca is a HiSec carrier. It's got the seperate cargo hold, corp hangar, and ship hangar like a carrier, you can refit in space at one like a carrier. It doesn't have the awesome tank, DPS, or remote reps like a carrier, but it looks like it will still be very capable given that it is essentially an overgrown industrial ship. Originally by: Kunming Dispite this being slightly off topic, I strongly agree with Benco here... All new content thats being added lately is aimed for large alliances. So unless ur part of BoB, Goons or the North this content is pretty much off limits. I feel this is against the spirit of the game. Not all of us want to be part of the epic lag fest or we might enjoy being the underdog, trying to make a living out there while the big boys clash it out, but we are paying customers too and want to have a taste at new content just like everyone else. My guess would be that the Orca, once the market settles down after its initial release, would sell for as much as a Marauder or less, and you're far less likely to spend the price of the ship in modules to pimp it out. You don't only see big alliance members flying around in Marauders do you? People will have to work hard for this ship, no doubt, but it's hardly going to be only for big alliance members.
Ensar'da Amarr Advanced Capital Ship Designs Hephaestus Rising	Posted - 2008.10.23 19:22:00 - [23] I like this ship; i love the ability to boost my booster toon even further and corperate hanger no more jet cans; though atm i don't like the 3 high and med slots; as 3 high b used for mining gang links and with 3 meds and no multiple gang link role bonus means you will need to put command processers in the meds; leving 1 med for a tank and no highs spare for tracters as it get a bonus and be helpfull; so a couple more high and med slots I think would be a good change
Dyaven Interstellar Mining and Research	Posted - 2008.10.23 19:26:00 - [24] Originally by: Ensar'da I like this ship; i love the ability to boost my booster toon even further and corperate hanger no more jet cans; though atm i don't like the 3 high and med slots; as 3 high b used for mining gang links and with 3 meds and no multiple gang link role bonus means you will need to put command processers in the meds; leving 1 med for a tank and no highs spare for tracters as it get a bonus and be helpfull; so a couple more high and med slots I think would be a good change Hi Slots: Tractors / Gang Links Med Slots: Command Processors Low Slots: Cargo Expanders? Ever heard of an armor tank?
Sani Ka THE INTERNET.	Posted - 2008.10.23 19:26:00 - [25] Edited by: Sani Ka on 23/10/2008 19:25:56 Originally by: Bronson Hughes Originally by: InsanlyEvlPerson agreed. honestly, i could go for a hisec carrier or something of the sort, and dont say buy a domi cuz it cant fill the support role without killing its own tank like a carrier. Um, the Orca is a HiSec RORQ. It's got the seperate cargo hold, corp hangar, and ship hangar like a Rorq, you can refit in space at one like a Rorq. It doesn't have the awesome tank, DPS, or remote reps like a carrier, but it looks like it will still be very capable given that it is essentially an overgrown industrial ship. Originally by: Kunming Dispite this being slightly off topic, I strongly agree with Benco here... All new content thats being added lately is aimed for large alliances. So unless ur part of BoB, Goons or the North this content is pretty much off limits. I feel this is against the spirit of the game. Not all of us want to be part of the epic lag fest or we might enjoy being the underdog, trying to make a living out there while the big boys clash it out, but we are paying customers too and want to have a taste at new content just like everyone else. My guess would be that the Orca, once the market settles down after its initial release, would sell for as much as a Marauder or less, and you're far less likely to spend the price of the ship in modules to pimp it out. You don't only see big alliance members flying around in Marauders do you? People will have to work hard for this ship, no doubt, but it's hardly going to be only for big alliance members. fixed it for ya
Ensar'da Amarr Advanced Capital Ship Designs Hephaestus Rising	Posted - 2008.10.23 19:34:00 - [26] Edited by: Ensar''da on 23/10/2008 19:36:20 It doesn't really matter IMO, if your stupid enough to get caught by wartargets while flying this (I see no reason to take this into low-sec or 0.0) then you deserve to die. Rolling Eyes True though tank would be nice; and low sec mayb not but i can see it used in 0.0 a cheap mans rorqual, plus a 400 mill base price i can see it going 600 normal; so 600 mill ship no tank i never like i hate that prospect with freighters to
Bronson Hughes ADVANCED Combat and Engineering	Posted - 2008.10.23 20:08:00 - [27] Originally by: Sani Ka fixed it for ya Fair enough, but the qualities that many people were looking for in a HiSec Carrier were the ones that Carriers and Rorqs shared so I think my point still stands. -------------------- "I am hard pressed on my right; my centre is giving way; situation excellent; I am attacking." - Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne
ZW Dewitt	Posted - 2008.10.23 20:12:00 - [28] Needs more mids.
Jonna Andromedae	Posted - 2008.10.23 20:12:00 - [29] Edited by: Jonna Andromedae on 23/10/2008 20:12:58 FINALLY WE HAVE A SHIP WICH CAN HAUL UNPACKAGED SHIPS IN HIGHSEC!!!!
Arazel Chainfire Dissolution Of Eternity Ethikos Trade Alliance	Posted - 2008.10.23 20:17:00 - [30] Originally by: Jonna Andromedae Edited by: Jonna Andromedae on 23/10/2008 20:12:58 FINALLY WE HAVE A SHIP WICH CAN HAUL UNPACKAGED SHIPS IN HIGHSEC!!!! ... you do realize that you can get that anyways by making a courier contract, right? -Arazel
Jan Javaar Minmatar SuX ltd.	Posted - 2008.10.23 20:18:00 - [31] /me changes alts training plan
Furb Killer Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2008.10.23 20:37:00 - [32] If you are in a small mining corp and you cant afford with entire corp to pay 400M, you are doing it wrong.
Zeba Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2008.10.23 21:05:00 - [33] WTF! No ore compression!? WHRRRRRRRRRY!!! Even 90k+ m3 cargobay will fill up in minutes with 3 hulks chugging away using the command bonus.. So you will still need a hauler to transfer ore to the station unless CCP thinks people are going to do the dock unload ore undock warp to belt repeat rinse you already do with a normal hauler. FFS I can get moast of the performance of the gang links from a goddamn battlecruiser for a fraction of the cost and skill reqs and guess what? It Can ****ing Mine. Orca with no ore compression = wtf is the point? inappropriate signature. ~WeatherMan
Furb Killer Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2008.10.23 21:13:00 - [34] You cant be canflipped anymore...
Ensar'da Amarr Advanced Capital Ship Designs Hephaestus Rising	Posted - 2008.10.23 21:14:00 - [35] Edited by: Ensar''da on 23/10/2008 21:14:10 full over 90km3 in minuites; boy i wish it was that fast at mining; and why is there no compression; because ccp don't want to make the roqual redundent though the ability to compress 1-2 roid types at once rather then the rorquals big ability would be nice, but once again it would get to the point of no one buying rorquals if a couple of orca's could do the same task
Brigitte Helm Minmatar Flying Fox Industries	Posted - 2008.10.23 21:32:00 - [36] Just one thought that occured to me. With a corp hanger, can a Freighter load up from it ? Hug a Carebear, Kill a pirate, squish a Rat, and tickle a dev. Make Eve fun....
Hanell Steel	Posted - 2008.10.23 21:32:00 - [37] To solve that problem just make the rorquals ore compression factor better than the orcas! make the orcas like 10X and the rorquals as it is, or some variation there of. But id also like to point out that 90k is pretty small in mining, my alts hulk pulls in over 6.5k m3 every cycle, and when you have 3-4 of em working, 90k goes pretty fast... when the corp gets together to do a mining op, it takes 2 fully decked out itty 5s running too and from station to keep up, and as you dont get/give a command bonus while in station, it kind of defeats the purpose of having the command links AND the big cargo hold.
CopyCatz Caldari Brewery Research Ltd Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.10.23 21:33:00 - [38] I've uploaded some pics from singularity: Orca 1 Orca 2 Orca 3 Orca 4 Orca 5 Shots are dark, not much light in fd. In 30 minutes I'll be flying one myself and move to a lighter system.
motomysz Militek Industries Integrity Respect Selflessness	Posted - 2008.10.23 21:45:00 - [39] God, you just can't give some people enough, can you?
Vasundhara	Posted - 2008.10.23 21:49:00 - [40] On the test server, is the blueprint seeded or can you just buy the ship to test with? What I'm interested in is if there is any indication of where the BPO will be seeded on release. I suppose even if it is known on test it could change for release but preliminary info would be useful.
Red Harvest	Posted - 2008.10.23 22:09:00 - [41] Originally by: Brigitte Helm Just one thought that occured to me. With a corp hanger, can a Freighter load up from it ? Would like to know too, anyone tested that yet? (9h to go for the pre-reqs myself)
Zeba Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2008.10.23 22:20:00 - [42] Originally by: motomysz God, you just can't give some people enough, can you? It's not about enough it's about being viable in the role for the isk spent. Think about the investment you will have to make to get to the 90k m3 mark. Three T2 cargo rigs and 2 T2 cargo expanders with the new skill at level 5 will get you the completely inadaquate said 90k m3 cargo space for about a BILLION ISK. A ship with a command bonus by its very nature should never have to dock or you waste the bonus. Basically this forces a 4 man mining op to turn into a 5 man op as you will still need the hauler to keep up with the 3 hulks especially with the command bonus. Like an earlier poster has mentioned CCP can use a less efficient ore compression rate for the orca to make it only viable for high sec mining. Bam then the normal 30k+ m3 becomes usable and I won't have to go on a holy crusade about the issue. Originally by: Brigitte Helm Just one thought that occured to me. With a corp hanger, can a Freighter load up from it ? If this is true then my argument is /null and gimme my ORCA!
Guyblin Minmatar The Idle Hands	Posted - 2008.10.23 22:26:00 - [43] I'd like to have seen 4 hi-slots on it. Just so you can mount all three mining gang link modules and a tractor beam. Other than that it looks funky, although it does almost make haulers obselete. I'd like to have seen maybe less cargo space but the ability to compress high sec ores, which haulers could then pick up from the Orca. Also, I don't think it should need Mining Barge V - after all, it isn't a mining vessel, it's more a command ship. I'd prefer to see it requiring maybe only Barge III but perhaps more Foreman/Director skills - Director I at least. After all, a noob prospector gets a few foreman skills.
Impolite Andevil The Shadow Knights Bionic Dawn	Posted - 2008.10.23 22:34:00 - [44] Originally by: Guyblin I'd like to have seen 4 hi-slots on it. Just so you can mount all three mining gang link modules and a tractor beam. Other than that it looks funky, although it does almost make haulers obselete. I'd like to have seen maybe less cargo space but the ability to compress high sec ores, which haulers could then pick up from the Orca. Also, I don't think it should need Mining Barge V - after all, it isn't a mining vessel, it's more a command ship. I'd prefer to see it requiring maybe only Barge III but perhaps more Foreman/Director skills - Director I at least. After all, a noob prospector gets a few foreman skills. This definitely does not obsolete haulers - have you looked at the speed and agility on this? Overall it looks like a very nice ship.
Guyblin Minmatar The Idle Hands	Posted - 2008.10.23 22:38:00 - [45] Yeah I guess so - and I guess they can dock with the orca too to pickup. It still would have been nice to see it get some compression ability. Not to the same level as the Rorq but a few hi-sec ore types at a slower rate would be nice. Would give the pilot something to do other than tractor in and empty cans all day
lo324	Posted - 2008.10.23 23:04:00 - [46] got a question will it have the compression capabilitys of the rorqual or is it just a gloryfied fraighter which can pick up in space??? i was under the inpression thats it could compress think this question is aimed at CCP then selves
Arte AFK	Posted - 2008.10.23 23:08:00 - [47] The range bonus isn't all that, considering the usual range of roids in a belt but I guess I'm just used to warping into a belt. The tractor beam bonus is good and all things considered I'm happy with the skill pre-requisites. I wonder what the rank of the industrial command ship skill is though. (guessing rank 6-8). I mine with an alt so it will suit my purposes just fine, but it doesn't help corp mining ops as much as perhaps hoped for and in that it could do with some tweaking. I think I was hoping for a little more cargo... not kick the backside out of it "500km3" levels, but at least 100km3 before rigs and expanders, to make it something worth using in 'non-station systems'. I can understand that it might make it overpowered considering how pretty much every system is mined to death lately though. All in all, a good template to work from.
Kristo Tomar CAPITALISTIC PIGS SYSTEM SHOCK INITIATIVE	Posted - 2008.10.24 00:21:00 - [48] You have to be kidding me that this thing needs Mining Barge V, that is just wrong for a non mining ship. I could see Capital Ships Skills and Capital Industrial Skills and Capital Command Skills. CCP must be losing their mind once again. If you are going to require me to have Mining Barge V you better give me Capital Strip Miners.
Sicardae Bad'ia	Posted - 2008.10.24 00:41:00 - [49] The ship is for miners, if your serious about mining, you have barge 5, or if your a noob, someone in your corp does, whine elsewhere, srsly
Constance Harme	Posted - 2008.10.24 00:51:00 - [50] Originally by: Kristo Tomar You have to be kidding me that this thing needs Mining Barge V, that is just wrong for a non mining ship. I could see Capital Ships Skills and Capital Industrial Skills and Capital Command Skills. CCP must be losing their mind once again. If you are going to require me to have Mining Barge V you better give me Capital Strip Miners. Carriers require Battleships V to fly and they can't fit missiles or turrets and carriers are for combat logistics, makes sense that a industrial logistics ship would require Mining Barge V if you ask me.
Kesper North Caldari Epiphyte Mining and Exploration Combined Planetary Union	Posted - 2008.10.24 00:59:00 - [51] That's a really nice looking ship, actually. I wish the combat ships looked that cool.
Tekplax	Posted - 2008.10.24 02:22:00 - [52] Edited by: Tekplax on 24/10/2008 02:22:41 ya looks great
Crackzilla The Shadow Order	Posted - 2008.10.24 02:36:00 - [53] Maybe crazy, but what about taking an Orca along on missions to salv and pick up junk? Speed isn't great but it isn't a race. Raven warps in and gets aggro, Orca jumps in, heads for the next mission gate, salv as it goes. The raven will never run out of ammo/cap charges. Might even be able to fit some logistics on the orca.
Arvald Caldari Ninjas N Pirates	Posted - 2008.10.24 02:45:00 - [54] now all i need to do is train an alt for one of these and finish training the other for black ops and ill have my own mobile 0.0 base .....hard part is going to be getting the orca out there un noticed
Ruv Kaulovesh	Posted - 2008.10.24 03:12:00 - [55] would like to see 4 high slots other than that im happy with what i see, i am curious however about the armor, shields, speed etc
Dirk Magnum Royal Hiigaran Navy	Posted - 2008.10.24 03:34:00 - [56] Originally by: motomysz God, you just can't give some people enough, can you? Sure you can. Failsafe Orca stats: Cargo capacity: a lot Skills required: less than those listed Ore compression: yes! Elimination of anyone's ability to ever can flip again: yes! So there.
Opertone Caldari SIEGE. United Legion	Posted - 2008.10.24 04:48:00 - [57] where is ore compression? do we haul the ore when the 90 000 m3 bay is full? can we have just one compression line? orca is meant to facilitate mining in places with no refinery available, i.e. systems with no stations right now orca seems to be the big tractor beam ship might come handy in mission salvaging
Opertone Caldari SIEGE. United Legion	Posted - 2008.10.24 04:55:00 - [58] Originally by: Zeba WTF! No ore compression!? WHRRRRRRRRRY!!! Even 90k+ m3 cargobay will fill up in minutes with 3 hulks chugging away using the command bonus.. So you will still need a hauler to transfer ore to the station unless CCP thinks people are going to do the dock unload ore undock warp to belt repeat rinse you already do with a normal hauler. FFS I can get moast of the performance of the gang links from a goddamn battlecruiser for a fraction of the cost and skill reqs and guess what? It Can ****ing Mine. Orca with no ore compression = wtf is the point? doubled, Orca with no compression is pointless, as long as you don't want to give it the 500 000 m3 cargo/corp hold
Opertone Caldari SIEGE. United Legion	Posted - 2008.10.24 04:59:00 - [59] how about rorqual can refine in space and Orca can compress in space? refining is on top of compression but takes substantially more time and isotopes to do the job. i am 2 jumps away from any stations, how does the Orca benefit my haulers? No how Haulers still need to make 2 jumps as often as before, or they need to setup up a temporary tower, which may take another hour before mining can occur. if Orca had just 1 compression line it would serve its role, let it burn isotopes to make it not so simplified
Remy Ishiba	Posted - 2008.10.24 05:01:00 - [60] I have nothing new to say, but this looks sweet and I'd like to reinforce some of what is being discussed. Required skills look fine to me. It's meant for mining ops, and anyone serious about mining should be a short step away from it. Even I have all the skills except the new "Industrial Command Ships". Mids and Lows look fine to me, but it would be nice to have another high slot. The way it is now, after you load up the three Mining foreman gang links you're done and that tractor beam bonus sits there, taunting you (or maybe that's just in my head...). I would think the gang links would be a much greater priority than a tractor, so I really can't see anyone equip one... unless their op has two of these ^_^. Ore Compression... I gotta' add my 2isk and say that I agree that it would be really nice to see some degree of that available on the Orca. Of course it should not be as much as a Rorqual since it is not a full capital, but this is still a pretty intense ship. The cargo bay is big, but I can totally see a small mining op still needing significant hauler support. Then again I'm pretty much a total newb...
Hannah Tralowski	Posted - 2008.10.24 05:20:00 - [61] Well I for one am looking forward to this being able to almost fly it (with the exception of the new skillbook) i'm looking forward to taking it on a mining op. No more can flipping (not that it happens very often) and the ability to keep the hulks out there with a constant supply of crystals is great. I'll be able to haul the guys hulks out to them, they can travel in shuttles to where ever we're gonna mine. I can mine also if I wanted with mining drones (although i'd have to get closer to the belt). Its also a great looking ship, I can even use it to take all my mission ships out to far off systems in one go without repacking them, or taking one at a time etc. I am a little saddened by 0 turrets but hey, its a great starting template to work from, im sure it'll need tweaking as time goes on as things always do. You know ccp might add a mini refining facility inside Anyhoo, really looking forward to the new expansionand the new ship and other content, i'll be first in the queue waving a fist full of isk to get one of these ships. Fly safe all.
PinkMonkey Dragon	Posted - 2008.10.24 05:36:00 - [62] i for one, will be getting one, even if it looks and does just what it says... what I would have prefered? ability to compress ore... because basicaly this is just a large jet can in a mining op without that... woo. AND, i coudl care less about turret slots... hulk doesnt have them, but i would like the ability for it to mount some strip miners, have the CPU bonus thing... even it it doesnt have ANY mining amount bonii (so it would mine less than even a covetor)... THAT's what i would like.. but then, i think about how badly abused THAT would be by macros... or even my own AFK ice mining.. and think it's a bad idea.. SO, i want one. and just the way it is is fine, but compression would have been great to have. mining, not so much, now that i think on it.
destiny2	Posted - 2008.10.24 06:01:00 - [63] hmm just need mineing foreman level 3 and that new skill and i can fly one :)
Delichon The First Foundation SOLAR FLEET	Posted - 2008.10.24 06:06:00 - [64] Orka would make Destroyers completely useless in their primary role - mission salvaging. Devs, now even giving Destrs a salvaging bonus won't save them, you've buried the ship class, thanks a lot! ------------------------------------------ All nerfs are meant to hurt you personally. They will be nerfing you directly next. EVE A new game every 6 months. (c) Atomos Darksun
King Rothgar	Posted - 2008.10.24 06:20:00 - [65] This is a very well designed ship I think. It looks as it should IMHO and has appropriate bonuses. As a member of a small corp part of a small high sec alliance, I can say that this ship will be pretty useful in general. Should make high-sec mining ops much simpler (haul the barges out, take care of cans...) and the bonuses to mining should be worthwhile. It's also very reasonable to skill for, basically any hulk pilot can use one with 1 extra skill. Price tag looks about right, being 1/2 frieghter cost on market roughly once things settle down. I was actually hoping for a mini-freighter which this isn't, it's more of a mini-rorq but that works too. Honestly this ship might be more useful in a small high sec corp. I look forward to testing this thing out. I would like to see a couple extra slots added to the highs for command modules (while retaining tractors) but I suppose it is fine as it is. The lack of turret slots is a good thing, the last thing we need is some uber afk mining ship. It will also make moving all my rigged ships around easier too. My corp isn't a commie one so when I buy it, it will come entirely out of my own charicter's pocket. Pretty affordable I think. Was going to buy a frieghter for my alt in the next few days but I think I'll just hold off and get this instead.
Caelum Mortuos Gallente Zero G Research and Development	Posted - 2008.10.24 06:29:00 - [66] Originally by: Delichon Orka would make Destroyers completely useless in their primary role - mission salvaging. Devs, now even giving Destrs a salvaging bonus won't save them, you've buried the ship class, thanks a lot! what? It's slower than a battleship and only has three highslots, and it's gonna cost like 400 mil. It's not going to overtake the destroyer as a salvage ship lol. Regardless of how far it can reach with it's tractor beam, you either have only two tractors and one salvager or two salvagers and one tractor, it still wont be able to compete with a faster 4/4 destroyer
Brego Tralowski Gallente Forever Night	Posted - 2008.10.24 06:35:00 - [67] I guess i'll start to build more cap components and store them. I am expecting sales to go up a bit
Jonna Andromedae	Posted - 2008.10.24 06:59:00 - [68] Originally by: Caelum Mortuos Originally by: Delichon Orka would make Destroyers completely useless in their primary role - mission salvaging. Devs, now even giving Destrs a salvaging bonus won't save them, you've buried the ship class, thanks a lot! what? It's slower than a battleship and only has three highslots, and it's gonna cost like 400 mil. It's not going to overtake the destroyer as a salvage ship lol. Regardless of how far it can reach with it's tractor beam, you either have only two tractors and one salvager or two salvagers and one tractor, it still wont be able to compete with a faster 4/4 destroyer Well I think small gangs could use Orca and destroyer with 8 salvagers. First run the mission and bookmark wrecks. Then warp to these bookmarks with Orca and destroyer. Orca grabs cans with three tractor beams and salvager eats them alive with 8 salvagers
Opertone Caldari SIEGE. United Legion	Posted - 2008.10.24 07:09:00 - [69] Orca's idea is good Mining warfare link is a nice bonus, but the tractors beams are pretty much useless, not because they don't work, but because one jet can equals 27500 m3 - it is all that your Orca can hold. It doesn't matter where you pick your Ore, unless it is compressed you still need a lot of haulers, which constitute 90% of the logistics. Orca must use Ore compression, so that it can mine in remote systems, or give 10x times compressed ores to the haulers... I see no point in glorified tractor beam ship, where any battlecruiser can do the same job
Drevar	Posted - 2008.10.24 07:42:00 - [70] Edited by: Drevar on 24/10/2008 07:44:58 I am kinda puzzled by the Survey bonus....if we aren't mining, what good will a Survey Scanner do? If it was a gang survey bonus maybe it would be okay. When fully boosted a lot of times your Strip miners will reach farther than you can survey.
Caelum Mortuos Gallente Zero G Research and Development	Posted - 2008.10.24 07:56:00 - [71] Originally by: Zeba It's not about enough it's about being viable in the role for the isk spent. Think about the investment you will have to make to get to the 90k m3 mark. Three T2 cargo rigs and 2 T2 cargo expanders with the new skill at level 5 will get you the completely inadaquate said 90k m3 cargo space for about a BILLION ISK. A ship with a command bonus by its very nature should never have to dock or you waste the bonus. Basically this forces a 4 man mining op to turn into a 5 man op as you will still need the hauler to keep up with the 3 hulks especially with the command bonus. Like an earlier poster has mentioned CCP can use a less efficient ore compression rate for the orca to make it only viable for high sec mining. Bam then the normal 30k+ m3 becomes usable and I won't have to go on a holy crusade about the issue. Actually, you can get 89k m3 with the skill at 4 and 3T1 cargo rigs for about 100mil, the skill at 5 gives you 92k m3, and going all out with T2 gives you 100k..... It sits in the belt boosting, and gathering ore together safely at a central collection point, sounds good to me, you can use it to haul if you really want, but I think its best use is to have haulers running back and forward to it. Also, it does not need compression!! All that will happen is we'll end up with hordes and hordes of orcas sitting right outside a station compressing veldspar to send to 0.0 until the cow's come home, that is not the purpose of this ship! Quote: I am kinda puzzled by the Survey bonus....if we aren't mining, what good will a Survey Scanner do? If it was a gang survey bonus maybe it would be okay. When fully boosted a lot of times your Strip miners will reach farther than you can survey. Maximum survey range on the orca is 125km, WTB 125km range strip miner It's given the bonus to the orca itself so the command ship can identify the rocks of interest, seeing as the poor bugger has to sit doing nothing in the belt, same as the rorqual iirc
Mr Kindjal Amarr Coalition of Nations Free Trade Zone.	Posted - 2008.10.24 08:33:00 - [72] if this will end the need for jet can mining, whats the point of the tractor beams bonus? the only ones which gonna fully use this ship is macro miners in high sec. proper 0.0 alliances use rorqual anyway.
Dictum Factum Gemini Sun Violent-Tendencies	Posted - 2008.10.24 08:41:00 - [73] Here is my take on the Orca. Note that the 120k m3 assumes use of the corporate hanger along with the cargo bay. In a 0.0 scenario, I would see the Rorqual sitting at a POS, compressing up a storm and providing the bonuses while the Orca would be used as the transfer ship to bring the ore from the belts to the POS (approx 120K m3 capacity). If needed, the Orca could provide one of the Links if the Rorqual could not, but I would not really see that as a primary function for the ship. For high-sec the ship would be very nice for mining in systems without stations, provided that it can align in (much!) less time than a freighter. It could provide a bonus or two while in system and be running back and forth to the next(ish) system to drop off the ore in a central location for later pickup by a freighter. It also could be used to bring all of the barges/exhumers to the mining site (only 2 intact ones, the rest repackaged) prior to the event, thus freeing up some logistical time for the participants. The duty that it will perform the most of, I am guessing, is as a mini-freighter. It has a nice sized cargo (120K-ish) and will (I hope) handle much better than a freighter so that you can un-dock and be at a gate in less than three weeks. I suppose that, in a 1.0 system, it could serve as an "Ultimate Overkill AFK Miner" with 5 tec2 mining drones as well. I still think that, unless there are more than 6 miners, it is a wasted mining slot for an op. Since it already takes (essentially) the qualifications to be in a barge/exhumer to fly it, the pilot in the Orca would be better serving the op in a barge/exhumer. That said, my alt will still be getting one as they look nice and I do see some use for it, even if not always for mining.
Zakgram Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.10.24 09:03:00 - [74] Originally by: Zak'eni Originally by: Crackzilla So we have a new favorite way to afk mine in high sec? Put one laser per roid, wait for roids to pop or for 90k m3 of cargo space to fill. Repeat. No turret slots. Drone bay & implants? Worthwhile for that couple of hours when you're looking at another client?
Akyla Bears Inc Violent-Tendencies	Posted - 2008.10.24 09:05:00 - [75] Interesting shield tank on the Orca on Singularity when I checked it btw. ~12k shield HP (with skills) 600 second recharge (with skills) That's a base 50 hp/s recharge, prolly about 75 dps tank? Now I realize that you don't really want to test this thing in combat, but its still nice to have. Do all capitals have this?
Rivqua Caldari Omega Wing R.E.P.O.	Posted - 2008.10.24 09:41:00 - [76] And a cap that can sustain a xl shield booster :) /Riv
McFly C0LDFIRE RUDE Alliance	Posted - 2008.10.24 10:25:00 - [77] Since apparently someone needs to step in here and clarify some things.... First of all, no point in mounting all three gang links (can only use one) and command processor is out due to the lack of CPU. So 1 link, (recommend the cycle reduction one). Secondly, you can't run a command link if u warp. So warping to and from the belt is a waste of the link. You can only run gang links while sitting still. Third, no freighters can't pull from it. At least not as of this afternoon when I tried on SiSi. So what we have here is a single link running, long tractor toting, jetcan. Haulers will still need to run, be to a station/pos in system or in another station. With only 5 light drones it can only supplement the hulk's own drones. (I was hoping I'd be able to drop 5 sentries with it.) Fourth, any ships smaller than a BC/Command will fit in a courier contract, so u can save those rigs. Although it'd be nice if a lot of things were changed with this ship, I can understand at least some of them on CCP's part. The guy who noted if it could compress u'd see a lot of veld being smashed down for shipment to nullsec. If it could mine on it's own (it actually can very very slowly with mining drones), u'd see it sitting in 1.0 system chewing veld. Ship maintenance array I think needs a boost, mainly because u can only stick up to two Hulk/Covetor in it, 2.6 Mackinaw/Retriever or 4 Skiff/Procurer... On manufacturing and these things being up on market you will see a major Price Gouge, as with all ships released in eve, they will need to be built first, then on that week following the patch all of these will be coming out of the cooker and going up for ridiculous isk. Why? Because demand will be enormous and supply will be minimal. Please remember the prices of the first Jump Freighters, Rorquals, Black Ops, Marauders and etc in the past.... So yes I think CCP need to rethink some of the things they've set in motion with this ship. I think the drone bw should be 125mbit. It's bigger than a Battleship and thus should be able to fit 5 heavy drones in my opinion. Sure that's the same they give the Dreads, Rorqs, and some BSes... but I think it deserves to be able to plop down 5 sentries. There's no reason a thorax should have more drone capability than this thing. Oh and BPOs will be seeded in DCM stations in empire from what CCP has said. So \o/ no death runs out to Outer Ring... (had an alt out there already....) --McFly--
Caelum Mortuos Gallente Zero G Research and Development	Posted - 2008.10.24 10:33:00 - [78] I'd agree on the ship bay, If it's supposed to be used for rigged ship transportation too, being able to transport BS, or a couple of BCs would be useful. Also kinda gutted that it can't fit a freight can, or maximum sized courier contract when max expanded. Still pretty cool tho
MenanceWhite Amarr Ministry of War	Posted - 2008.10.24 10:33:00 - [79] Edited by: MenanceWhite on 24/10/2008 10:34:03 Bohoo, orca was supposed to fill the gap between hauler and capital - HOWEVER it still has those industrial skill requirements. Which means that us non-industrial chars still will have a gap between hauler and freighter, since we're not going to spend that time training up those skills. --- Originally by: Torfi There's alot. That can be done. With.. corpses Originally by: Oveur
Ensar'da Amarr Advanced Capital Ship Designs Hephaestus Rising	Posted - 2008.10.24 11:08:00 - [80] oh mcfly First of all, no point in mounting all three gang links (can only use one) and command processor is out due to the lack of CPU. So 1 link, (recommend the cycle reduction one). Secondly, you can't run a command link if u warp. So warping to and from the belt is a waste of the link. You can only run gang links while sitting still. What u talking about; this ship though not on the bonuses atm will have the gang link reduction wich is about 50 cpu per gang link; so 150 there for all 3; 150 for command processers; to mount 3 ganglinks you will need 2; equaling 450 cpu; base is 430 so with electronics 5 your laughing and will easily be able to mount all of them with cpu to spare (Which I would like to see a can use 3 gang links role like other command ships damnation eos e.c.t). And true u can't warp with gang links ur not stationary u can move about the belt; this isn't the rorqual where u need to seige to get the bonuses. And another q any one been on test server have you looked at the bpo build and part requirements as I will be getting a bpo so want to know if any extra that i may need that I don't have interms of cap parts which this gona need to be built
Yong Qi	Posted - 2008.10.24 11:16:00 - [81] Originally by: Zeba Originally by: motomysz God, you just can't give some people enough, can you? It's not about enough it's about being viable in the role for the isk spent. Think about the investment you will have to make to get to the 90k m3 mark. Three T2 cargo rigs and 2 T2 cargo expanders with the new skill at level 5 will get you the completely inadaquate said 90k m3 cargo space for about a BILLION ISK. A ship with a command bonus by its very nature should never have to dock or you waste the bonus. Basically this forces a 4 man mining op to turn into a 5 man op as you will still need the hauler to keep up with the 3 hulks especially with the command bonus. Like an earlier poster has mentioned CCP can use a less efficient ore compression rate for the orca to make it only viable for high sec mining. Bam then the normal 30k+ m3 becomes usable and I won't have to go on a holy crusade about the issue. Originally by: Brigitte Helm Just one thought that occured to me. With a corp hanger, can a Freighter load up from it ? If this is true then my argument is /null and gimme my ORCA! I Love you. Frankly, I love seeing smart ideas like this.
Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa The Perfect Harvesting Experience	Posted - 2008.10.24 12:01:00 - [82] I have seen people posting about the lack of slots on the Orca, but the only things you need to fit are: High: mining foreman link - laser optimization mining foreman link - mining laser field enhancement tractor beam I Mid: Something... Low: Choosing between 2 Cargo exapander II's and the possibility of giving the 40k+ stucture 60% resists with a DCU II. What I miss in this ship is the limitation the Rorqual has about only carrying Indies and Barges/Exhumers in its ship hangar. And I miss the Cloning Vat Bay/Ore Compressing. They would make this more worth the 1.4 bil pricetag I noticed higher up this thread. The only problem I have with the ship is that a barge pilot needs to pilot it... and does the increased gang-boost justify 1 less barge in the field. Or is the comfort of having your ore in a safe place enough justification. ----------------------------------------------- Originally by: Paper Rock's fine, nerf Scissors
Furb Killer Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2008.10.24 12:02:00 - [83] It costs 400 million, the 1.4 billion came from someone who likes you to also buy the bpo.
Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa The Perfect Harvesting Experience	Posted - 2008.10.24 12:06:00 - [84] Originally by: Furb Killer It costs 400 million, the 1.4 billion came from someone who likes you to also buy the bpo. It is 400 mil in building cost atm, no way you can get it from the market for that price.
Lustralis	Posted - 2008.10.24 12:29:00 - [85] Originally by: Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa Originally by: Furb Killer It costs 400 million, the 1.4 billion came from someone who likes you to also buy the bpo. It is 400 mil in building cost atm, no way you can get it from the market for that price. If that's the base build price, you should see people with researched BPO's in future producing and selling for that amount. Initially of course it'll cost you 750m , but I don't expect the gouging to last long as every manufacturer will be pumping them out, such has been the high expectation generated in the indy player base.
Aurora Serenity	Posted - 2008.10.24 12:41:00 - [86] Why the hell does THIS ship has a ship maint.bay? why ?! dammit! Even a freakin' Jump freighter hasnt got one...now all those carebears can put their rigged ships in that thing and mine the whole eve galaxy (high sec) empty. Now who is putting balance to what?
Jonathon Iceflaster	Posted - 2008.10.24 13:33:00 - [87] Greetings, I am a lone miner in empire space. In general the Orca hits the spot. It has transport capability in the 100k range reducing ore pickups 70%, drones to cleanup npcs during can pickups and protection from ligher class ships in freight runs, and enough ship space to dock a filled Iteron 5 for extra cargo. With it I can move the only thing I really care about, tritanium. Now I could quibble about an extra low slot for safety, or boosting the ship bay space so that I can carry a barge and a battleship class ship. I would rank this ship as "good", that's the highest rating I've ever given an Eve ship.
Mytzso	Posted - 2008.10.24 13:34:00 - [88] When can I buy it? I like..
Dracthera	Posted - 2008.10.24 13:39:00 - [89] Originally by: MenanceWhite Edited by: MenanceWhite on 24/10/2008 10:34:03 Bohoo, orca was supposed to fill the gap between hauler and capital - HOWEVER it still has those industrial skill requirements. Which means that us non-industrial chars still will have a gap between hauler and freighter, since we're not going to spend that time training up those skills. Well, the fact that it fill a gap between two industrial ships should be a clue that it's still an industrial ship. If you have no industrial skills whatsoever right now, then you don't need an Orca in the first place, so it shouldn't be an issue.
Opertone Caldari SIEGE. United Legion	Posted - 2008.10.24 13:57:00 - [90] Edited by: Opertone on 24/10/2008 13:58:15 the guy who says that Orcas will be crunching ore at the undock point... what is the point exactly? 10 times compression? haul the ORE to null sec and refine in semi efficient outpost? no, you refine the ore to the minerals, then haul them to null sec... or you refine the ore to the minerals and convert it in auto targeting computer, the thing which compresses tritanium to 40 000:1 10 times compression only helps to haul the ore more efficiently it is by no means superior to clean minerals. 400 mill ship? wardecs? sharing bonuses in the same fleet? Tractor beam on members outside of your corporation and not in your fleet? You will be sharing the war decs and and the gang bonuses all together. Or your entire mining fleet needs to be in NPC corporations, so not a single member can be war decced, but you still can pull the cans from fleet members Do you realize what gameplay this instrument promotes? Not forming a corporation and sharing a private chat channel. Orca will not add to anything without 10x Ore compression and not mining oriented corporate hangar.
MenanceWhite Amarr Ministry of War	Posted - 2008.10.24 15:08:00 - [91] Originally by: Dracthera Well, the fact that it fill a gap between two industrial ships should be a clue that it's still an industrial ship. If you have no industrial skills whatsoever right now, then you don't need an Orca in the first place, so it shouldn't be an issue. However, disregarding the tractor bonii it's basicly a hauler that's between your normal hauler and freighter. Haulers are freighters are more "general" than "industrial" ships, since you know - anyone could have the need to move their stuff regardless if it's modules and loot, minerals, or pos fuel. My point is that almost every non-industrial char can fly haulers and alot of them can fly freighters, however we won't be able to fly this thing which is basicly there to fill the gap between hauler and freighter.
Sidus Isaacs	Posted - 2008.10.24 15:30:00 - [92] Originally by: Opertone Do you realize what gameplay this instrument promotes? Not forming a corporation and sharing a private chat channel. You are wrong. Forming a corp and keeping it safe whilemning will be the result. And any smart corp knows how to handle suvh things.
Opertone Caldari SIEGE. United Legion	Posted - 2008.10.24 18:51:00 - [93] oh, do you mean having a falcon or two? then docking up, then disbanding the corporation? or waiting the 7 day period out? how do you protect 400 mill capital ship inside a 20 man strong mining corporation? To use the ship, you need to be sitting openly in the belt... expect daily wardecs from all sorts of space pirates. And you do not want to have a PVP wing, who are bound to the carebears 24/7. The best you can is not to join a player owned corp, then if you do, you absolutely need a falcon alt. It can set the Orca free so you can dock, leave corp and quickly make a new one. Orca serves the role of glorified tractor beam ship... with 100 000 m3 total space, which means 5 hulks work for 15 minutes or roughly 6 cycles... then what? So, in fact Orca is a glorified Giant Secure Cargo Container. It doesn't help your logistics at all, it creates more hassle about protecting the Orca, you need 5 PVP players to watch it all the time.
Dr Takiyoma Traders Industrialists and Miners of EVE R.H.I.N.O.	Posted - 2008.10.24 23:56:00 - [94] Edited by: Dr Takiyoma on 24/10/2008 23:56:39 Originally by: Opertone blahs Sorry, huh?
Tasko Pal Heron Corporation	Posted - 2008.10.25 00:08:00 - [95] Edited by: Tasko Pal on 25/10/2008 00:08:33 Originally by: Opertone oh, do you mean having a falcon or two? then docking up, then disbanding the corporation? or waiting the 7 day period out? how do you protect 400 mill capital ship inside a 20 man strong mining corporation? To use the ship, you need to be sitting openly in the belt... expect daily wardecs from all sorts of space pirates. And you do not want to have a PVP wing, who are bound to the carebears 24/7. The best you can is not to join a player owned corp, then if you do, you absolutely need a falcon alt. It can set the Orca free so you can dock, leave corp and quickly make a new one. Orca serves the role of glorified tractor beam ship... with 100 000 m3 total space, which means 5 hulks work for 15 minutes or roughly 6 cycles... then what? So, in fact Orca is a glorified Giant Secure Cargo Container. It doesn't help your logistics at all, it creates more hassle about protecting the Orca, you need 5 PVP players to watch it all the time. Several things. First, the gankability of the orca is overrated in high sec. Sure, you're worth popping if you're flying with a bunch of hulks in your cargo bay. But deployed on the field? You'd have up to 130k m3 or so of ore (remember the 30k m3 in the corporate hangar). Not much point aside from bragging rights. As a war target, it's much less interesting that the 5 hulks it is supporting. Even without a single defense mod, it can passive shieldtank all high sec rats. And only idiots would fly an orca (or mine at all) during a war. Hence, there is no need to protect an orca. If someone wants to suicide gank it, then they'll probably do so even if you have falcon alts flying around. If you're really having trouble with suiciding gankers taking out your orcas, then fit a damage control II. Doubles the cost of taking out your ship. The problem of defending an orca is vastly exaggerated especially given that corp freighters autopilot in high sec all the time. Second, haul with another orca. A single orca (with a station in system) should be able to haul for a dozen or so hulks especially given the first orca gathers the ore in one place.
Opertone Caldari SIEGE. United Legion	Posted - 2008.10.25 00:53:00 - [96] it is a capital ship, which costs around 550 mill with decent fittings now it needs to be in a player Corporation... piwats see your corporation, with Orca in hi sec belt, they declare war on you, you have 24 hour period. What do you do? Hire mercenaries for 550 mill to protect the Orca? Stop mining until the war dec wears off? Leave the corporation and Join NPC corporation? Leave corporation and make a new one? Recruit 5 PVPers and request them to sit at the boring capital 24/7? Ninja mine with a falcon support? Orcas will not be left without attention, unless the pilots remain in NPC corporations
Bloody Rabbit Jita Miners	Posted - 2008.10.25 01:42:00 - [97] Sorry but few corps go around and war dec miners. You are just screaming fire Originally by: Shadarle I notice a lot of people who are very bad at playing the market tend to want CCP to step in and remove the competition from the market so they don't continue coming in last place.[/qu
Constance Harme	Posted - 2008.10.25 01:46:00 - [98] Originally by: Opertone it is a capital ship, which costs around 550 mill with decent fittings now it needs to be in a player Corporation... piwats see your corporation, with Orca in hi sec belt, they declare war on you, you have 24 hour period. What do you do? Hire mercenaries for 550 mill to protect the Orca? Stop mining until the war dec wears off? Leave the corporation and Join NPC corporation? Leave corporation and make a new one? Recruit 5 PVPers and request them to sit at the boring capital 24/7? Ninja mine with a falcon support? Orcas will not be left without attention, unless the pilots remain in NPC corporations What could they gain from attacking an Orca? Sure a few people would do it for lolz but it's not like they're going to be faction fitted and dropping millions in loot, all they would get is a survey scanner, tractor beam and some expanders.
Oetaka Omega Engineering Inc.	Posted - 2008.10.25 04:04:00 - [99] i agree about the ship needing a small amount of compression ability. as for it being a gank magnit it not as bad as being stated
Kyra Felann Gallente Noctis Fleet Technologies	Posted - 2008.10.25 04:14:00 - [100] Originally by: Bronson Hughes Originally by: InsanlyEvlPerson agreed. honestly, i could go for a hisec carrier or something of the sort, and dont say buy a domi cuz it cant fill the support role without killing its own tank like a carrier. Um, the Orca is a HiSec carrier. It's got the seperate cargo hold, corp hangar, and ship hangar like a carrier, you can refit in space at one like a carrier. It doesn't have the awesome tank, DPS, or remote reps like a carrier, but it looks like it will still be very capable given that it is essentially an overgrown industrial ship. Yeah, it's totally a carrier...except for, well, the fact that it can't carry fighters. If it can't use fighters, it's not a carrier. Carrying fighters is kind of a defining characteristic of a *carrier*.
Imaos	Posted - 2008.10.25 09:32:00 - [101] Originally by: Kyra Felann Originally by: Bronson Hughes Originally by: InsanlyEvlPerson agreed. honestly, i could go for a hisec carrier or something of the sort, and dont say buy a domi cuz it cant fill the support role without killing its own tank like a carrier. Um, the Orca is a HiSec carrier. It's got the seperate cargo hold, corp hangar, and ship hangar like a carrier, you can refit in space at one like a carrier. It doesn't have the awesome tank, DPS, or remote reps like a carrier, but it looks like it will still be very capable given that it is essentially an overgrown industrial ship. Yeah, it's totally a carrier...except for, well, the fact that it can't carry fighters. If it can't use fighters, it's not a carrier. Carrying fighters is kind of a defining characteristic of a *carrier. And we really need a ship carrying fighters in highsec NOT*. Imaos
Imaos	Posted - 2008.10.25 09:44:00 - [102] Originally by: Opertone Orca's idea is good Mining warfare link is a nice bonus, but the tractors beams are pretty much useless, not because they don't work, but because one jet can equals 27500 m3 - it is all that your Orca can hold. It doesn't matter where you pick your Ore, unless it is compressed you still need a lot of haulers, which constitute 90% of the logistics. Orca must use Ore compression, so that it can mine in remote systems, or give 10x times compressed ores to the haulers... I see no point in glorified tractor beam ship, where any battlecruiser can do the same job I just picked this post out of many. Has somebody noticed that there is 30k cargo + 30k corporate hangar? It will make it easier for the haulers. Imaos ------------------------------------------ Originally by: NoNah My friend, this is EVE, as it's a space oriented game, they couldn't have trolls. We have Caldari.
Lustralis	Posted - 2008.10.25 09:50:00 - [103] Originally by: Imaos Originally by: Opertone Orca's idea is good Mining warfare link is a nice bonus, but the tractors beams are pretty much useless, not because they don't work, but because one jet can equals 27500 m3 - it is all that your Orca can hold. It doesn't matter where you pick your Ore, unless it is compressed you still need a lot of haulers, which constitute 90% of the logistics. Orca must use Ore compression, so that it can mine in remote systems, or give 10x times compressed ores to the haulers... I see no point in glorified tractor beam ship, where any battlecruiser can do the same job I just picked this post out of many. Has somebody noticed that there is 30k cargo + 30k corporate hangar? It will make it easier for the haulers. Imaos If you max its cargo cap to 90k (at huge expense), it'll still only be able to hold 3 x jetcan worth of ore. I don't see this as being much of a benefit given that 3 trips with a hauler in the absence of the orca is much cheaper and not hugely time consuming. Also I don't think the fact it can carry 2 Hulks is any benefit whatsoever in high sec. You're generally 1 jump away from a station anywhere, so why would you go to the trouble of loading up the orca and heading to it in shuttles?! You'd be better off fielding 3 x hulks without the orca, or 2 hulks with 1 guy hauling in a traditional indy. I was excited about this ship but I'm struggling to see the point now the stats are out!
Tasko Pal Heron Corporation	Posted - 2008.10.25 10:04:00 - [104] Originally by: Opertone it is a capital ship, which costs around 550 mill with decent fittings now it needs to be in a player Corporation... piwats see your corporation, with Orca in hi sec belt, they declare war on you, you have 24 hour period. What do you do? Hire mercenaries for 550 mill to protect the Orca? Stop mining until the war dec wears off? Leave the corporation and Join NPC corporation? Leave corporation and make a new one? Recruit 5 PVPers and request them to sit at the boring capital 24/7? Ninja mine with a falcon support? Orcas will not be left without attention, unless the pilots remain in NPC corporations Get a grip. 24 hours is plenty of time to dock your orca and your hulks. Then fight or hide. Only a fool flies a fat, defenseless target in time of war.
Imaos	Posted - 2008.10.25 10:10:00 - [105] Originally by: Lustralis Originally by: Imaos Originally by: Opertone Orca's idea is good Mining warfare link is a nice bonus, but the tractors beams are pretty much useless, not because they don't work, but because one jet can equals 27500 m3 - it is all that your Orca can hold. It doesn't matter where you pick your Ore, unless it is compressed you still need a lot of haulers, which constitute 90% of the logistics. Orca must use Ore compression, so that it can mine in remote systems, or give 10x times compressed ores to the haulers... I see no point in glorified tractor beam ship, where any battlecruiser can do the same job I just picked this post out of many. Has somebody noticed that there is 30k cargo + 30k corporate hangar? It will make it easier for the haulers. Imaos If you max its cargo cap to 90k (at huge expense), it'll still only be able to hold 3 x jetcan worth of ore. I don't see this as being much of a benefit given that 3 trips with a hauler in the absence of the orca is much cheaper and not hugely time consuming. Also I don't think the fact it can carry 2 Hulks is any benefit whatsoever in high sec. You're generally 1 jump away from a station anywhere, so why would you go to the trouble of loading up the orca and heading to it in shuttles?! You'd be better off fielding 3 x hulks without the orca, or 2 hulks with 1 guy hauling in a traditional indy. I was excited about this ship but I'm struggling to see the point now the stats are out! I said corporate hangar and not ship maintenance bay. Imaos
Tasko Pal Heron Corporation	Posted - 2008.10.25 17:36:00 - [106] Edited by: Tasko Pal on 25/10/2008 17:37:51 Edited by: Tasko Pal on 25/10/2008 17:37:30 Originally by: Lustralis If you max its cargo cap to 90k (at huge expense), it'll still only be able to hold 3 x jetcan worth of ore. I don't see this as being much of a benefit given that 3 trips with a hauler in the absence of the orca is much cheaper and not hugely time consuming. Also I don't think the fact it can carry 2 Hulks is any benefit whatsoever in high sec. You're generally 1 jump away from a station anywhere, so why would you go to the trouble of loading up the orca and heading to it in shuttles?! You'd be better off fielding 3 x hulks without the orca, or 2 hulks with 1 guy hauling in a traditional indy. Several remarks here. It's cargo capacity actually maxes at 100,951 m3. With 3 t1 cargo riggings and such, which aren't very expensive for a 500 mil or so ship, you can carry 92,713 m3. The corporation hangar carries an addition 30k m3 (or maybe 40k m3, if they go ahead with a boost). That's almost 4.5 jet cans worth just for the 122k m3. If you use a second orca, you can haul more than 4 jet cans worth with every trip. One orca is worth something like 4-5 well skilled and fitted indy haulers. Whether it's worth one less hulk is up to you. Also the orca's ability to collect cans and its corp hangar simplifies transfer of ore to haulers. That saves time for your haulers who get more hauled. Third, the ability to carry two rigged hulks does simplify corp ops. Suppose one of your ten man crew, Bob has his hulk 20 jumps away by high sec. Does it make sense for Bob to fly his hulk all the way to you when you have two hulks on hand? He probably can take low sec shortcuts in his shuttle, cutting even more time off his travels. It helps the logistics and saves time for your corpmates.
Alex Ley Caldari Shadow Industrial Solutions Shadow Rock Alliance	Posted - 2008.10.25 20:55:00 - [107] Could anyone let me know the exact skills needed to fly this think? Also I agree with what a lot of people are saying about the compresion, I think it's a MUST!!! And four high slots too.
Opertone Caldari SIEGE. United Legion	Posted - 2008.10.25 21:36:00 - [108] how many orcas do we need for one mining op? one for bonus and tractor, one for hauling... sweet 1,1 bill isk to mine vedlspar belts (550 per fitted ship) they see 2 Orcas in one mining corporation, sweet, now lets wardec them as it is cheap fun and exciting (new corporations get harassed in eve very often, crime and punishment for reference) You are war decced, you hire a wing of PvPers, after 5 hours the PVP wing wants to have life with no Orcas to babysit. You may want another 5 PvPers... You realize that it takes you nowhere, you sit in station for about two days. Then your CEO ejects you from current corp and you quickly make a new one to avoid war dec and griefing. You learn to Ninja mine with Orca and no player owned corporations, you have 10 members in NPC corps, just like every macro team now has... at his point it is funny... What do the goonswarm and Red get by killing single carrier in low sec? They have fun, and they rather jump their dreadnaughts and stuff, despite the fact that it may even be unfit and contain no loot. Now freshly formed corps get decced every day, forcing their members to jump corporations to actually be able to play this game. Why won't Goonswarm be interested in paying a visit?
Dictum Factum Gemini Sun Violent-Tendencies	Posted - 2008.10.26 02:54:00 - [109] Originally by: Opertone how many orcas do we need for one mining op? one for bonus and tractor, one for hauling... sweet 1,1 bill isk to mine vedlspar belts (550 per fitted ship) they see 2 Orcas in one mining corporation, sweet, now lets wardec them as it is cheap fun and exciting (new corporations get harassed in eve very often, crime and punishment for reference) You are war decced, you hire a wing of PvPers, after 5 hours the PVP wing wants to have life with no Orcas to babysit. You may want another 5 PvPers... You realize that it takes you nowhere, you sit in station for about two days. Then your CEO ejects you from current corp and you quickly make a new one to avoid war dec and griefing. You learn to Ninja mine with Orca and no player owned corporations, you have 10 members in NPC corps, just like every macro team now has... at his point it is funny... What do the goonswarm and Red get by killing single carrier in low sec? They have fun, and they rather jump their dreadnaughts and stuff, despite the fact that it may even be unfit and contain no loot. Now freshly formed corps get decced every day, forcing their members to jump corporations to actually be able to play this game. Why won't Goonswarm be interested in paying a visit? Quoted for WTF. I know less than you think I do. Gemini Sun is Recruiting
Tasko Pal Heron Corporation	Posted - 2008.10.26 03:07:00 - [110] Originally by: Opertone how many orcas do we need for one mining op? one for bonus and tractor, one for hauling... sweet 1,1 bill isk to mine vedlspar belts (550 per fitted ship) they see 2 Orcas in one mining corporation, sweet, now lets wardec them as it is cheap fun and exciting (new corporations get harassed in eve very often, crime and punishment for reference) You are war decced, you hire a wing of PvPers, after 5 hours the PVP wing wants to have life with no Orcas to babysit. You may want another 5 PvPers... You realize that it takes you nowhere, you sit in station for about two days. Then your CEO ejects you from current corp and you quickly make a new one to avoid war dec and griefing. If you're hardcore enough that you'll mine when a wardec is ongoing, then you're hardcore enough for several orcas. Your mining gang is also your pvp gang. If you're complaining about spending a few billion in pursuit of the almighty veld roid, then you just don't get mining. Quote: Now freshly formed corps get decced every day, forcing their members to jump corporations to actually be able to play this game. Why won't Goonswarm be interested in paying a visit? Just mine in minmatar space where Allah approves. I feel like I'm holding your hand or something.
F4LC0N	Posted - 2008.10.26 09:23:00 - [111] fully expanded it should be able to haul 40 Giant Secure Container which would give it 156k m3
Krylon Rhae	Posted - 2008.10.26 09:42:00 - [112] Originally by: F4LC0N fully expanded it should be able to haul 40 Giant Secure Container which would give it 156k m3 Who on eath wants to take the time to open 40 GTC? Not me. I removed all my GTC's from my Iteron V because it slowed me down on the turn around time. Your round trip time after opening 40 cans would be horrendous.
CaptianBlack Minmatar We Brake For Nobody.	Posted - 2008.10.26 09:43:00 - [113] is it April already !!!... no ore compression !!!.. so the orca is an empire carrier, that can't do much.. = a bigger hauler than we already have.. and so many people were looking foward to this ship, o'well.. back to dropping a pos & using a freighter to haul my ore out of system
Lustralis	Posted - 2008.10.26 10:44:00 - [114] Originally by: Krylon Rhae Originally by: F4LC0N fully expanded it should be able to haul 40 Giant Secure Container which would give it 156k m3 Who on eath wants to take the time to open 40 GTC? Not me. I removed all my GTC's from my Iteron V because it slowed me down on the turn around time. Your round trip time after opening 40 cans would be horrendous. Spot on. Actually you can open the cans in your Occator or Ity V on the warp into field but it's just so "clicky" that you'll get RSI during a long op (opening cans, dragging, clicking partial transfer, going back to station, dragging and dropping, ERGH). It's so much simpler doing 1 extra trip without the added UI harassment.
Leandro Salazar Celestial Apocalypse	Posted - 2008.10.26 10:47:00 - [115] Now if the ship bay was big enough to haul rigged battleships... 550K instead of 400K and I would agree it is decent. And of course drop Mining Barge req to 4 and add something that hauler pilots need (sucks that Industrials are racial I guess...) And if you are reading this, you have arrived at the signature without noticing...
Opertone Caldari SIEGE. United Legion	Posted - 2008.10.26 11:14:00 - [116] A war has been declared on your mining corporation, your Orca is in danger you join NPC corporation, upon which war can not be declared. Your ex corporate members are all in NPC corps now, you have a private chat channel, you mine outside of player owned corporation. Orca is too attractive not get the war declaration. To avoid war declarations all people that previously could be in one corporation now have to be in NPC corps and share single intel channel. If you buy an Orca, you will be forced out of your corporation. this clarifies the point
Furb Killer Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2008.10.26 11:29:00 - [117] No it still isnt clear and it is still random stuff. Why exactly would you get wardecced with an orca (there will probably be MANY orcas out there), and wouldnt you get wardecced with 4-5 hulks which cost the same. Or one freighter which costs 2-3 times more. (and no not all freighter pilots are in npc corporations).
Caelum Mortuos Gallente Zero G Research and Development	Posted - 2008.10.26 11:35:00 - [118] Agreeing with the guy above me.. How many freighters are there in player corporations.....hundreds. How many corps get wardecced each day so your freighter can be killed? There will be some but not nearly as much as you seem to think. If people don't do it for expensive freighters, why are they going to do it for a cheaper orca? Also, seeing as we're in the ship and modules section, how's it looking for fitting up? Anybody tried polycarbs and nano yet? oh wait....
Mara Rinn Minmatar	Posted - 2008.10.27 03:39:00 - [119] Originally by: Caelum MortuosAlso, seeing as we're in the ship and modules section, how's it looking for fitting up? Anybody tried polycarbs and nano yet? oh wait....[:p Nano-nerf aside, one reason I can see for not even trying is that this ship's job is to warp to a belt, scan it, and stay put :) It only needs to move for the sake of turning to align for warp!
Cyb3r Thr3at Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2008.10.27 07:23:00 - [120] I'm personally training a new char on new account fer the Orca.. oh.. & fer anyone doin the same.. Orca 1 has been taken! :)
Imaos	Posted - 2008.10.27 08:32:00 - [121] Originally by: Opertone A war has been declared on your mining corporation, your Orca is in danger you join NPC corporation, upon which war can not be declared. Your ex corporate members are all in NPC corps now, you have a private chat channel, you mine outside of player owned corporation. Orca is too attractive not get the war declaration. To avoid war declarations all people that previously could be in one corporation now have to be in NPC corps and share single intel channel. If you buy an Orca, you will be forced out of your corporation. this clarifies the point Dont know where you get your fantasies, but that scenario is very unlikely. You wardec random mining corps and not because they have orcas. Or you just suicide on the mining barges. Imaos
Imaos	Posted - 2008.10.27 08:34:00 - [122] Originally by: CaptianBlack is it April already !!!... no ore compression !!!.. so the orca is an empire carrier, that can't do much.. = a bigger hauler than we already have.. and so many people were looking foward to this ship, o'well.. back to dropping a pos & using a freighter to haul my ore out of system Has someone tried to fill a freighter from the orca via ship maintenance bay? Imaos
Lord Fitz Project Amargosa	Posted - 2008.10.27 08:51:00 - [123] Originally by: Imaos Originally by: CaptianBlack is it April already !!!... no ore compression !!!.. so the orca is an empire carrier, that can't do much.. = a bigger hauler than we already have.. and so many people were looking foward to this ship, o'well.. back to dropping a pos & using a freighter to haul my ore out of system Has someone tried to fill a freighter from the orca via ship maintenance bay? Imaos Yes, it of course doesn't work. Freighters can only load/unload within 45km of an online POS or near an outpost /outpost upgrade egg. Originally by: CCP t0rfifrans CCP is a greedy money chewing monster
Krylon Rhae	Posted - 2008.10.27 09:19:00 - [124] Fitz... have you tried to load into an unmanned freighter parked at a POS? Just curious if you could do that instead of moving ore from the orca to a hanger then into the freighter later when its manned.
Imaos	Posted - 2008.10.27 09:52:00 - [125] Originally by: Lord Fitz Originally by: Imaos Originally by: CaptianBlack is it April already !!!... no ore compression !!!.. so the orca is an empire carrier, that can't do much.. = a bigger hauler than we already have.. and so many people were looking foward to this ship, o'well.. back to dropping a pos & using a freighter to haul my ore out of system Has someone tried to fill a freighter from the orca via ship maintenance bay? Imaos Yes, it of course doesn't work. Freighters can only load/unload within 45km of an online POS or near an outpost /outpost upgrade egg. Why 'of course'? Would be nice if the orca would allow to load an freighter. Imaos ------------------------------------------ Originally by: NoNah My friend, this is EVE, as it's a space oriented game, they couldn't have trolls. We have Caldari.
Garia666 Amarr T.H.U.G L.I.F.E White Core	Posted - 2008.10.27 10:26:00 - [126] its just nice to kill. it has no real purpouse. but mabe the cearbears under us are happyw ith it..
Imaos	Posted - 2008.10.27 14:12:00 - [127] Originally by: Garia666 its just nice to kill. it has no real purpouse. but mabe the cearbears under us are happyw ith it.. I guess it works as nice bait, too. Especially for poeple with your attitude. Imaos PS: Guess what, someone needs to produce the ships you loose in combat. ------------------------------------------ Originally by: NoNah My friend, this is EVE, as it's a space oriented game, they couldn't have trolls. We have Caldari.
Garia666 Amarr T.H.U.G L.I.F.E White Core	Posted - 2008.10.27 15:12:00 - [128] Originally by: Imaos PS: Guess what, someone needs to produce the ships you loose in combat.[/quote yeah thanks for that.. im buying :P
Xynomorphine	Posted - 2008.10.27 16:55:00 - [129] I looked at the Orca stats in the test server and the link here, nice ship but is still lacking I think (3 high, 3 mid, 2 low) should be more like (4 high, 4 mid, 2 low) the reason for this is to have some ability to at least sheild tank rats hence the 4 mid slots and the 4 high slots that is for one tractor and the 3 mining gang mods, as for the role bonus you should at least be able to run 3 mining gang mods all at once and not just the one.
Josef Amerentev Gallente E.M.P. Industries Malum Exuro	Posted - 2008.10.27 20:26:00 - [130] Add plus one gang link per lvl. make cargo size bonus add to bays ?if its possible? so you can carry more ships in it. let a freighter take from corp bay. i would agree that more mid/highs would be useful. the reason to NOT add any more low slots is that the orca could easily replace exceed a jump freighters capacity if it had more than a few low slots.
Grentana	Posted - 2008.10.30 05:20:00 - [131] Edited by: Grentana on 30/10/2008 05:24:06 Edited by: Grentana on 30/10/2008 05:23:36 Edited by: Grentana on 30/10/2008 05:20:56 Mining Barge 5 (and prereqs Mining IV and Astrogeology III) do not make sense. You are not actively mining with Orca. You are overseeing a mining operation and hauling. You are not operating a mining barge. Mining Director makes sense since you are overseeing a mining op and need the skill for the gang links anyway. Industrial, yeah it is a hauler. Right now on test you can run all the gang modules at once and that is good. It really needs 5 high slots. 3 mining links, tractor and salvager. Without salvager it does directly replace the hauler. Like most I have a tractor and salvager on hauler for mining ops to loot and salvage rats. Orca will not be fully functional without 5 high slots. With the above it is worth the 400misk. Otherwise, not really.
Imaos	Posted - 2008.10.30 07:36:00 - [132] Originally by: Grentana Edited by: Grentana on 30/10/2008 05:24:06 Edited by: Grentana on 30/10/2008 05:23:36 Edited by: Grentana on 30/10/2008 05:20:56 Mining Barge 5 (and prereqs Mining IV and Astrogeology III) do not make sense. You are not actively mining with Orca. You are overseeing a mining operation and hauling. You are not operating a mining barge. Mining Director makes sense since you are overseeing a mining op and need the skill for the gang links anyway. Industrial, yeah it is a hauler. It makes more sense than logistics for fleet command ships. There need to be some skill reqs for the ship and barge 5 is fine if you compare to other command ships. Quote: Right now on test you can run all the gang modules at once and that is good. It really needs 5 high slots. 3 mining links, tractor and salvager. Without salvager it does directly replace the hauler. Like most I have a tractor and salvager on hauler for mining ops to loot and salvage rats. Orca will not be fully functional without 5 high slots. With the above it is worth the 400misk. Otherwise, not really. There is one almost useless mining gank link -> Only 2 gangs, one tractor. And it will be worth the 400m without a salvager. Not much to salvage from high sec belt rats anyway. Imaos ------------------------------------------ Originally by: NoNah My friend, this is EVE, as it's a space oriented game, they couldn't have trolls. We have Caldari.
Lord Fitz Project Amargosa	Posted - 2008.10.30 11:39:00 - [133] Edited by: Lord Fitz on 30/10/2008 11:44:18 Originally by: Krylon Rhae Fitz... have you tried to load into an unmanned freighter parked at a POS? Just curious if you could do that instead of moving ore from the orca to a hanger then into the freighter later when its manned. You can't load stuff into a freighter without actively piloting the freighter in question. When at a POS you could transfer cargo from a piloted Orca to a Piloted Freighter directly, or you could transfer from a piloted Orca to a corp hangar array, then later transfer to a freighter. Quote: Why 'of course'? Would be nice if the orca would allow to load an freighter. Well the Orca is not new functionality, it behaves the same way as carrier corp hangars or the Rorqual corp hangar, thus since neither of those can load freighters away from a control tower, the Orca can not either. Originally by: Grentana Mining Barge 5 (and prereqs Mining IV and Astrogeology III) do not make sense. You are not actively mining with Orca. You are overseeing a mining operation and hauling. You are not operating a mining barge. Mining Director makes sense since you are overseeing a mining op and need the skill for the gang links anyway. Industrial, yeah it is a hauler. Doesn't make sense because the skill is named mining barge ? It makes just as much sense as it does for the rorqual. All is needed is a renaming of the mining barge skill to 'ORE ships' and you're done. The fact that it's an ORE ship does mean that it should require the only generic ORE ships skill there is. Quote: It really needs 5 high slots. 3 mining links, tractor and salvager. Without salvager it does directly replace the hauler. Like most I have a tractor and salvager on hauler for mining ops to loot and salvage rats. Orca will not be fully functional without 5 high slots. 4 maybe. 5 definitely not. You don't need a salvager, and you don't really need one of the mining links, so 3 is ok. You could even get away with 1 mining link, 1 tractor, 1 salvager. Or any combination. Making it a complete non-issue to fit with everything you could possibly want would make it 'unique' in Eve. It's not supposed to be a salvaging ship. If you want that functionality you have to drop something else. Quote: With the above it is worth the 400misk. Otherwise, not really. And yet it's going to sell for 600-800m initially, and I doubt you will ever pick one up for 400m unless the price of minerals drops drastically. Originally by: CCP t0rfifrans CCP is a greedy money chewing monster
Grentana	Posted - 2008.10.30 12:58:00 - [134] Edited by: Grentana on 30/10/2008 13:01:21 Originally by: Grentana Mining Barge 5 (and prereqs Mining IV and Astrogeology III) do not make sense. You are not actively mining with Orca. You are overseeing a mining operation and hauling. You are not operating a mining barge. Mining Director makes sense since you are overseeing a mining op and need the skill for the gang links anyway. Industrial, yeah it is a hauler. Originally by: Lord Fitz Edited by: Lord Fitz on 30/10/2008 11:44:18 Doesn't make sense because the skill is named mining barge ? It makes just as much sense as it does for the rorqual. All is needed is a renaming of the mining barge skill to 'ORE ships' and you're done. The fact that it's an ORE ship does mean that it should require the only generic ORE ships skill there is. Mining Barge skill does not add functionality to the ship other requiring to be flown. Renaming it is a good idea. Originally by: Grentana With the above it is worth the 400misk. Otherwise, not really. Originally by: Lord Fitz Edited by: Lord Fitz on 30/10/2008 11:44:18 And yet it's going to sell for 600-800m initially, and I doubt you will ever pick one up for 400m unless the price of minerals drops drastically. Right, good luck buying it for MSRP (Manufacturer Suggested Retail Price). Originally by: Grentana It really needs 5 high slots. 3 mining links, tractor and salvager. Without salvager it does directly replace the hauler. Like most I have a tractor and salvager on hauler for mining ops to loot and salvage rats. Orca will not be fully functional without 5 high slots. Originally by: Lord Fitz Edited by: Lord Fitz on 30/10/2008 11:44:18 4 maybe. 5 definitely not. You don't need a salvager, and you don't really need one of the mining links, so 3 is ok. You could even get away with 1 mining link, 1 tractor, 1 salvager. Or any combination. Making it a complete non-issue to fit with everything you could possibly want would make it 'unique' in Eve. It's not supposed to be a salvaging ship. If you want that functionality you have to drop something else. I loot and salvage everything everywhere. If it is not worth selling then it gets reprocessed. The hauler has the time. The Orca is going on hauler account so would like to have the maximum functionality and not lose any I already have with hauler. Since this is the junior version sacrifices will need to be made. I still want everything. Pretty please.
steveid Killed In Action	Posted - 2008.10.30 20:26:00 - [135] The trouble with any ship like this is the effect it has on widening the gap between new and old players. Any increase in production that this causes is going to be practically useless over the medium term anyway due to the increase in production having a deflatory effect on ore prices as there is no corresponding increase in demand. Whatever marginal increase in mining speed will be cut by this economic certainty dramatically. What this will mean for the unfortunates who dont have hulks and orcas will be another decrease in the amount of isk that can be produced from mining. Already there is a massive difference between the amount of isk missions and mining can produce and this will be exasperated by the orca. In the end i think it'll be a ship not used very much as the true value of any ship is that it brings more to the gang than another and I just dont see that it will.
Woo Mi	Posted - 2008.11.03 21:25:00 - [136] Ok, clueless question here How does this ship eliminate can flipping? A barge cannot move ore directly to it, right? So stuff still needs to be moved via cans, which means that with the tractor beams an alert orca pilot will only minimise the risk of can flipping. Or am I missing something crucial here?
RedSplat Suddenly Ninjas Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service	Posted - 2008.11.03 21:30:00 - [137] SN has expressed much interest in the Orca, we look forwards to meeting them.
LordGrr Husarian Loyalists	Posted - 2008.11.13 11:56:00 - [138] Edited by: LordGrr on 13/11/2008 12:03:09 I was just thinking abou total price of the ship. First you need a BPO (1bln isk) and build it or buy it from the market for approximately 700mln (ship is worth 400mln in capital parts). But then you need to buy a skill for it. In dev blog I've found that skill should costs around 50mln which is resonable price, but when I checked the market yesterday, I've found that actual skill price is around 400mln !!! this is ridiculous, another 400mln !!! the skill is not worth such amount of money! how can skill costs the same as a built ship? is it an error? or just market went crazy during those first few days? I hope that the price will go down to promised level of 50mln, otherwise the whole concept of Orca ship won't be worth the money. I understand that skill price level may be ok for Rorqual pilots but not for Orca! rgds
Caelum Mortuos Gallente Zero G Research and Development	Posted - 2008.11.13 13:45:00 - [139] Originally by: LordGrr Edited by: LordGrr on 13/11/2008 12:12:26 Edited by: LordGrr on 13/11/2008 12:03:09 I was just thinking abou total price of the ship. First you need a BPO (1bln isk) and build it or buy it from the market for approximately 700mln (ship is worth 400mln in capital parts). But then you need to buy a skill for it. In dev blog I've found that skill should costs around 50mln which is resonable price, but when I checked the market yesterday, I've found that actual skill price is around 400mln !!! this is ridiculous, another 400mln !!! the skill is not worth such amount of money! how can skill costs the same as a built ship? is it an error? or just market went crazy during those first few days? I hope that the price will go down to promised level of 50mln, otherwise the whole concept of Orca ship won't be worth the money. I understand that skill price level may be ok for capital industrial skill for Rorqual pilots but not for command industrial for Orca! rgds Where I am, the book costs 46mil. Try looking around other than Jita? jita books are always overpriced
Megan Maynard Minmatar Out of Order	Posted - 2008.11.13 14:40:00 - [140] Originally by: Opertone oh, do you mean having a falcon or two? then docking up, then disbanding the corporation? or waiting the 7 day period out? how do you protect 400 mill capital ship inside a 20 man strong mining corporation? To use the ship, you need to be sitting openly in the belt... expect daily wardecs from all sorts of space pirates. And you do not want to have a PVP wing, who are bound to the carebears 24/7. The best you can is not to join a player owned corp, then if you do, you absolutely need a falcon alt. It can set the Orca free so you can dock, leave corp and quickly make a new one. Orca serves the role of glorified tractor beam ship... with 100 000 m3 total space, which means 5 hulks work for 15 minutes or roughly 6 cycles... then what? So, in fact Orca is a glorified Giant Secure Cargo Container. It doesn't help your logistics at all, it creates more hassle about protecting the Orca, you need 5 PVP players to watch it all the time. You do realize it's a command ship...... And the haulers no longer have to bookmark cans etc, they can just warp to the orca and take stuff out of the hanger. So yeah, not losing any cans and any time makes belt stripping even easier with this thing.

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