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[IDEA] Earning SP by actually playing the game.

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Maximum KILLDEATHRATIO Minmatar 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2008.11.25 14:55:00 - [1] Earning SP by actually playing the game. My opinions and percieved problems -CCP's pov on ingame interaction for training skills is boring and unsatisfying. CCP thinks that simply logging in and changing skills is sufficient skill training progression. -Not everyone plays eve for the same reason, and for some simply progressing IS the endgame. For this playstyle, gaining more and more isk may not be stimulating enough. These people want to experience eve, fly more ships, fly ships better, or try out the different activities that eve has to offer. -Players should be encouraged, but not required, to play eve in order to progress. And gaining more and more isk isn't necessarily considered progress. For instance i've got more isk than i'll ever need for what I can currently do in eve. Progress for me is waiting for my skills to allow me to do more or different things in eve. The only way I can achieve this is through skill training. My logging into eve and actually playing the game brings me no progress, thus the only progress that encourages me to log into eve is by skill training. -I am all for the skill queue idea, but I fear it is not enough by itself. Sure logging in simply to skill train is boring and dull, but at least it got me to log in while waiting to meet certain requirements to <fly that ship> or whatever eve activity. With a skill queue there would be NOTHING encouraging me to even login in order to progress, unless CCP made actually playing eve a means of progress. Goals -To have an additional way for players to gain skillpoints in eve by actually playing the game. Rough idea -Players accumulate Potential at a rate of 1/1440% every minute of every day until their Potential Pool is full at 100%. (at the rate of 1/1440% per minute, 1day = 100% Potential) -You can then earn SP by doing ingame actions until your Potential Pool is empty. -Maximum Potential Pool I leave out as any value you or I provide would be arbitrary, should be decided by CCP what total % of SP should be earned by playing the game compared to normal skill training. -Potential Pool is limited this way to prevent too much SP coming from playing the game. -Im keeping this the core of the idea and not including how the SP be spent as I cannot think of a slam-dunk winner way with which to spend it. The challenges listed would need to be solved by CCP. Pictures are worth a wall of text
Maximum KILLDEATHRATIO 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2008.11.25 14:56:00 - [2] Challenge: How to spend the SP -The challenge is then, how do your spend said earned SP? In the example provided that 5 SP can only be applied to those skills involved. You'd essentially need to track every source of SP earned as individual SP token objects and then spend them individually. Or you could just pick a skill and select to spend all available SP tokens. There are major flaws in SP tracking and player confusion involved in this Virtual Pool approach. It could be great if there were a simple way to manage the SP. -Another approach that would still reward the skills related to the rewarded activity would be to not pool up the earned SP, but to simply have the player select a skill in which to funnel earned SP into. Then if the reward of the activity completed allows your selected skill to be rewarded, the SP is funneled into that skill. Otherwise no SP is rewarded. -Yet another much simpler idea for SP rewarding would be to simply store all of the earned SP into a pool that the player can then spend on ANY skill. This would by far be the simplest to implement and possibly the fairest, although not quite as neato or roleplayish as imagining the character gaining SP through putting those skills to use. Challenge: Rewarding actions -The rewarded actions would need to be indisputable/unexploitable measures of accomplishment. Activating modules and going afk or something similar must not be rewarded. -Not every accomplishment may be rewardable, as I don't pretend to know of every playstyle in eve. The major ones are rewardable however. Ship combat resulting in a kill, Production resulting in a ship/module/charge, mining asteroids resulting in ore in your cargohold, finding scan results. 0.0 starbase logistical stuff I don't know so much about though, plus they are corp/alliance level so rewarding that is a can of worms. Despite the potential shortcomings of the idea, I believe that earning additional SP by actually playing the game is a good one. Please support!
LaVista Vista Conservative Shenanigans Party	Posted - 2008.11.25 15:07:00 - [3] Way to ruin the original concept of EVE. No!
Maximum KILLDEATHRATIO Minmatar 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2008.11.25 15:27:00 - [4] I just want to make it clear that this is an idea for additional sp earnings, not removal or nerfing of the current skill training system. ___________________ Yes I'm bitter. (the taste you can see!)
WishBlade Caldari Atomic Heroes Arcane Alliance	Posted - 2008.11.25 16:06:00 - [5] GB2WoW Aweseomenessness
Gone'Postal Minmatar Rage of Inferno	Posted - 2008.11.25 16:28:00 - [6] Erm.. No. Boost SISI VOTE NOW!
Captain Thunk Captain Morgan Society	Posted - 2008.11.25 16:35:00 - [7] Absolutely not. This has been one of the key features of the game since its conception. Students or other people with excess time on their hands aren't able to "powerlevel" themselves ahead at a rate not attainable by the rest of us. This should never be changed. Captain Thunk
Drake Draconis Minmatar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2008.11.25 17:00:00 - [8] Blizzard called... they want there missing WOW playerbase back. MORON!
InfamousOne Chaos Coalition Chaotic Evolution	Posted - 2008.11.25 17:13:00 - [9] LOL Drake, unfortuneately I have to agree with the nay sayers, I think this "grinding" idea would ruin EVE.
Maximum KILLDEATHRATIO Minmatar 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2008.11.25 17:15:00 - [10] Well clearly this proposal will flop so whatev~ **** it. I play daoc, gw, and eve.. and I won't deny I played wow. I like eve's skill training. Its like wow's rest xp or daoc's /freelevel. A way for casual players to invest less time into the game over a longer period of time and achieve the same results. And I like that eve is for the casual side, don't get me wrong. I wouldn't play this damn game if it weren't. Buuut eventually you ARE going to play the game a little bit, and its more fun when that time is rewarded. Even casual gamers invest time into games. Or don't tell me none of you have ever felt like you've just been logging in to skill train at times. :p Now that this has already clearly flopped, which im used to cause I suck at conveying what is in my head, I'd just like to say that what I had in mind was extremely casual. We're talking like a power-hour of gaming. The Potential Pool, like a rest XP bar that takes a day to fill up with X amount of SP. But, could take like a mission or 2 to exhausted. Or produce a spaceships (however that works), or scan out a site, or mine 1 belt. My idea wasn't to encourage **-socking, but just a little sum'in sum'in to reward people for actually playing eve now and then. Or hell, maybe the potential pool could have built up over a whole week and you could spend sunday playing and feel more rewarded for playing. Now that thats out, you guys for calling me a wowtard. Go ** yourselves that hurt my feelings! ___________________ Yes I'm bitter. (the taste you can see!)
Drake Draconis Minmatar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2008.11.25 17:26:00 - [11] Edited by: Drake Draconis on 25/11/2008 17:30:01 @ OP
Drake Draconis Minmatar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2008.11.25 17:26:00 - [12] Edited by: Drake Draconis on 25/11/2008 17:29:37 Originally by: InfamousOne LOL Drake, unfortuneately I have to agree with the nay sayers, I think this "grinding" idea would ruin EVE. o7
InfamousOne Chaos Coalition Chaotic Evolution	Posted - 2008.11.25 17:31:00 - [13] Edited by: InfamousOne on 25/11/2008 17:33:18 I used to play WoW :-) But then I found the amazingly sexy graphics of EVE and enjoyed the almost non-exsistance of millions of little kids asking me for gold every 5 minutes :-) I would like to see a skill queue and maybe another learning skill, I hate odd numbers so a new learning skill would bring it up to 12 :-) And I will be honest, sometimes I do feel like I am just loggin on to change skills, but I find myself signing on more for keeping up with my corp/alliance mates and making sure they are all doing good :-) That is enough of a reward for me ::::I know, a whole lot of sappy crap, but they are all good people :-P:::: I feel you on the posting in assmebly hall thing, I dont think I have had an idea yet that has had alot of support and/or interest :-) I will keep trying though. Cheers mate and fly safe. Edit: I am totally giving you an A+ for the graphics, I like pictures that go with ideas.
Drake Draconis Minmatar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2008.11.25 18:01:00 - [14] I have to concur..... same thing here... A: When I log on... the teamwork of working with my "incognito" corp (soon to be restarted) is thrilling.... coordinating.. working hard to finish tough missions...etc..etc... when you play solo casually... you won't last long in this game unless your motivation is driven hard by persistence. B: Posting in assembly hall and just shotgunning ideas really bugs me... and I'm starting to troll a bit too much these days but honestly... its so obvious you didn't even bother to research. So sorry if you took offense to that.... but at least bother to clean up your foul mouth and put more effort into your ideas. Even I try to come up with ideas... but most of them I delete myself because I realize that there's consequences down the line that would make the game worse off than it is. Try tackling the War-dec problem... and you'll catch on realll quick like.
Maximum KILLDEATHRATIO Minmatar 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2008.11.25 18:21:00 - [15] I drew a picture! That alone is reason enough for CCP to implement my idea by noon tomorrow afiak! But seriously I close most of the post I begin to write where im trying to be taken seriously. All ideas have potential flaws. Most ideas can be flawed in the details. Hell a good bit of the ideas that I am against have great potential if executed flawlessly. I actually did think about this one quite a bit, and recognize there are many ways it could hurt or ruin eve if the details aren't implemented well. But if done just right, people wouldn't feel they need to log in to advance, yet be pleasantly rewarded with a little extra when they do. Its all about the details, much like speed tanking. Good idea, TONS of potential failure to be too strong or too weak, but if done just right then its both balanced and still worthwhile. ___________________ Yes I'm bitter. (the taste you can see!)
Kahega Amielden Minmatar Suddenly Ninjas	Posted - 2008.11.25 21:09:00 - [16] Grinding sucks, bad. This would introduce grinding to EVE. Therefore, it's bad. Originally by: Catharacta My CNR runs on salvager tears.
Omber Zombie Gallente Frontier Technologies	Posted - 2008.11.25 21:59:00 - [17] ingame actions used to generate SP for skills directly related to that action (mining for example would boost your mining skill) - it was removed because it was being exploited. ---------------------- My Blog
Ticondrius Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2008.11.25 22:28:00 - [18] Wait, I can level up my gunnery skills by shooting asteroids for hours on end?! WIN! Go back to Ultima Online. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- PROPOSAL: Good Bug Reporting Incentives MMORPG: Many Men Online Role Playing Girls
Serenity Steele Dynamic Data Distribution Ministry of Information	Posted - 2008.11.25 23:04:00 - [19] Originally by: Omber Zombie ingame actions used to generate SP for skills directly related to that action (mining for example would boost your mining skill) - it was removed because it was being exploited. I have the same memories; The question is how was it being exploited, and is that exploit still achievable (or stoppable). Eg. Macroing MWD on/off would have worked to get MWD skill, but have CCP improved their capturing of macroers, and therefore it's not valid anymore? That should be answered before rejecting it out of hand. Rejecting it on principle is a whole other matter :) ≡v≡ Strategic Maps in Eve-Online Store \| eve-maps.com
Omber Zombie Gallente Frontier Technologies	Posted - 2008.11.25 23:27:00 - [20] i wasn't rejecting it for the exploit reason - I was just pointing out that this system used to exist in eve. As for capturing the macro on/off thing - I doubt CCP's ability to do so considering it's a fairly subtle manipulation. ---------------------- My Blog
Alty MacAlterson Alt Corporation	Posted - 2008.11.26 00:25:00 - [21] Yourself, please end it. Or your Eve account at least.
fuze Gallente Chosen Path Warp to Desktop	Posted - 2008.11.26 01:11:00 - [22] Eve already is one big grindfest.
Diamaht Nevain Avatar Union	Posted - 2008.11.26 04:25:00 - [23] Edited by: Diamaht Nevain on 26/11/2008 04:25:13 OK I'll be that guy. I like this idea so long as the bonus is kept very small. Why wouldn't actually using an object make the learning curve faster? CCP (and players) keep saying they want there to be some difference between playing and not playing, well here would be one example. =============================== Two words: Internet Spaceships
Maximum KILLDEATHRATIO Minmatar 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2008.11.26 06:19:00 - [24] Holy **** a supporter, you must be my alt. ___________________ Yes I'm bitter. (the taste you can see!)
Drake Draconis Minmatar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2008.11.26 06:28:00 - [25] /facepalm
Crossbowman	Posted - 2008.11.26 07:56:00 - [26] I'm support this! With the new system while you active and currently training example a weapon skill what you use atm (ratting, or pvp), the skill training should go a little bit faster. So you want to get BS lvl5? Set training and go out ratting, or pvp. Training wont be 30+day it will be 25.
Jareck Hunter Academy of Decadence Hereticus Aegis Communis	Posted - 2008.11.26 10:51:00 - [27] I like the Idea, if it maybe gives a Bonus like a +1 Implant or so, so nothing big. It would be good for new players, so they see a sense in theyr first weeks of playing, while skilling frigs to 5 or mining barge to 5, or so. Atm there is no big thing during this time, they can't make big money or so, they simply wait for the next skill. ------------------------------------------------- Sorry for my bad english^^ Join public Channel "Decadence" or visit www.eve-decadence.de
Nobues Gallente Oberon Incorporated Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2008.11.26 15:49:00 - [28] Originally by: Maximum KILLDEATHRATIO Edited by: Maximum KILLDEATHRATIO on 25/11/2008 15:30:56 Earning SP by actually playing the game. My opinions and percieved problems -CCP's pov on ingame interaction for training skills is boring and unsatisfying. CCP thinks that simply logging in and changing skills is sufficient skill training progression. -Not everyone plays eve for the same reason, and for some simply progressing IS the endgame. For this playstyle, gaining more and more isk may not be stimulating enough. These people want to experience eve, fly more ships, fly ships better, or try out the different activities that eve has to offer. -Players should be encouraged, but not required, to play eve in order to progress. And gaining more and more isk isn't necessarily considered progress. For instance i've got more isk than i'll ever need for what I can currently do in eve. Progress for me is waiting for my skills to allow me to do more or different things in eve. The only way I can achieve this is through skill training. My logging into eve and actually playing the game brings me no progress, thus the only progress that encourages me to log into eve is by skill training. -I am all for the skill queue idea, but I fear it is not enough by itself. Sure logging in simply to skill train is boring and dull, but at least it got me to log in while waiting to meet certain requirements to <fly that ship> or whatever eve activity. With a skill queue there would be NOTHING encouraging me to even login in order to progress, unless CCP made actually playing eve a means of progress. Goals -To have an additional way for players to gain skillpoints in eve by actually playing the game. -To not remove, nerf, or in anyway alter the current skill training system, but to introduce an additional source of SP accrual. Rough idea -Players accumulate Potential at a rate of 1/1440% every minute of every day until their Potential Pool is full at 100%. (at the rate of 1/1440% per minute, 1day = 100% Potential) -You can then earn SP by doing ingame actions until your Potential Pool is empty. -Maximum Potential Pool I leave out as any value you or I provide would be arbitrary, should be decided by CCP what total % of SP should be earned by playing the game compared to normal skill training. -Potential Pool is limited this way to prevent too much SP coming from playing the game. -Im keeping this the core of the idea and not including how the SP be spent as I cannot think of a slam-dunk winner way with which to spend it. The challenges listed would need to be solved by CCP. Pictures are worth a wall of text Stop whining and just go play wow!. Webhosting, teamspeak and Killboard for you, your corp, and your Alliance Click me for more info
Maximum KILLDEATHRATIO Minmatar 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2008.11.26 16:39:00 - [29] Your mother says hi. ___________________ Yes I'm bitter. (the taste you can see!)
Jah'Ret Khan GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.11.26 16:57:00 - [30] IDEA: GB2EQ because even the WoW players think your idea sucks. ************************** We go ZOOM-ZOOM! You go BOOM-BOOM!

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