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Treelox
Amarr
Market Jihadist Revolutionary Party
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Posted - 2008.12.06 06:47:00 -
[61]
 Originally by: Bloody Rabbit
Originally by: Mr Horizontal
As with everything in EVE, it all comes down to one simple factor: EVE is now overcrowded with too many people fighting over too few resources. I have said before and will say again. EVE needs a lot more space to solve most if not all the problems it has right now - in my estimation at least 8 new regions in Empire, Lowsec and 0.0 need to be introduced.
How it's done I don't particular care, but an example I'd say would be to make a lot of the existing lowsec regions like Aridia, Black Rise etc into Empire space (with the story that 'The Empires have finishing colonising these border areas') and make what is now Empire-fringe 0.0 like Vale, Providence etc into lowsec and add the regions on the outer areas of 0.0. However that will mean a lot of uprooting of existing infrastructures in those lowsec areas - so however they do it, there will be issues, but nevertheless, the key point is: MOAR SPACE.
Without killing too many players the High sec could take over the 0.4 systems and turn them into 0.5 systems. This won't displace moon mining towers and it would add more high sec. The story line would be simply, the empire groups are fearful of attack while they are at war and so have expanded their borders to protect themselves.
This would solve the whole 0.4 high sec or low sec problem and get more space to the Carebears.
I got to say on the whole I like this, it defintetly solves the "lameness" that is 0.4 space, stuck with all of the drawbacks of low sec and high sec and none of their benifits.
The only people who would complain are those that have established certain 0.4s as their cap ship depot/hub.
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Wadaya
Caldari
Trailerpark Industries
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Posted - 2008.12.06 07:26:00 -
[62]
Empires and Civilizations spread. Frontiers do not. Some of the low sec systems could be absorbed into High Sec Empire space, this would be an awesome goal for Factional Warfare.
In time and in wars, empires spread out or get taken over by a rival empire(s). Only in some kind of mass apocalypse would wars be fought and empire/civilations shrink. Someone will always come in and fill the vacuum of the previous owner.
See Mongols, Romans, Greeks as classic examples of fallen empires.
Wad
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Broegitte Bardot
BINFORD
Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2008.12.06 08:10:00 -
[63]
i dont mind the market at work
but! there's a few... oddities that could be looked at;
1) spodumain... 'nuff said ^^
2) the benefits of nullsec in respect to mining start off rather late or... low when looking at true-sec. the first 0.0 ores usually require belts in the -0.45 area (with a few exceptions here and there ofc -.-). the gap between +0.5 and -0.5 could do with some incentives.
probably easiest would be to change the "named ore" levels: * concentrated veldspar only in <0.4, but yielding twice as much. gradually but completely replacing plain veldspar until
* dense veldspar only in <-0.1, but yielding thrice as much as plain veldspar. gradually but completely replacing the concentrated veldspar.
* -1.0 would have all the best named ores and nothing but. high ores shouldnt evolve that rapidly; they can keep their +5%/+10% variants
// just as an example, tweak numbers to your liking
3) hauler spawns. trit haulers are cute, trit haulers are useful, trit haulers are necessary. but let's face it - they aren't exactly earth shatterig anywhere outside NPC regions. i wouldnt be too surprised if someone told me -A-'s cap fleet was built entirely out of stain haulers.
now... i don't mind them having the huge ones, but again there's a huge gap that could best be closed by (dramatically) increasing spawn chances on the lower end of the spectrum. at least make me reconsider farming this ~4mil-total-bounty-and-building-battleships-out-of-its-loot spawn -.-
stuff like that *shrug*
aka Roemy Schneider
(probably lacking game time again) |
Carniflex
Caldari
StarHunt
Fallout Project
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Posted - 2008.12.06 12:04:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Tasko Pal
Thing is, how easy is it to turn that trit into spaceships? I imagine the places with large scale capital ship production don't have cheap trit. At a premium of 2 isk per trit, to grab say 30 million trit on a ship would be around 60 mil isk per trip. If you're carrying something more exciting like passive targeters, you can multiply that by a factor of 5. Sounds interesting so I wonder what the problem is. Probably the trit is at a station without manufacture and it's not worth the risk to move the trit to a station with manufacture (or a decent bid price).
There is reason why some outposts out in 0.0 have rather pimped tech 1 module production times thru upgrades. However compression has been nerfed few times so it's not as profitable business. It works in opposite direction also - ie compressed low ends from hi sec down to 0.0 capital production yards.
It's almost silly amounts of low ends that are dropped by the hauler spawns. I have seen 2x 35 mil trit to drop in one system a day (altho it's somewhat unusual - or not, depends how well is the system utilized, average rate was around 1 hauler spawn per 8h of farming back when I was 0.0 resident on regular basis).
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Ricdic
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.12.06 12:25:00 -
[65]
There is no trit problem
/end |
Treelox
Amarr
Market Jihadist Revolutionary Party
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Posted - 2008.12.06 13:00:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Ricdic
There is no trit problem
/end
In my OP I did not say there was a trit problem.
What I asked in my OP, if you read it, was what do you think CCP would do to appease the forum whinage if they decied to listen to it? If such whinage becomes loud enough.
/begin :P
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Ricdic
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.12.06 13:26:00 -
[67]
In your subject you said "Trit Problem?"
I answered 
I didn't read past the subject line tbh |
Treelox
Amarr
Market Jihadist Revolutionary Party
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Posted - 2008.12.06 13:34:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Ricdic
In your subject you said "Trit Problem?"
I answered
I didn't read past the subject line tbh
just as long as your willing to admit that you post before you think, Im ok with your above responses.
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Ricdic
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.12.06 14:03:00 -
[69]
I thought about the subject line and I posted. I just didn't read the post content as I knew my answer without doing so. Regardless of what your OP post says I am still of the same opinion, there is no problem. |
Treelox
Amarr
Market Jihadist Revolutionary Party
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Posted - 2008.12.06 14:08:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Ricdic
I thought about the subject line and I posted. I just didn't read the post content as I knew my answer without doing so. Regardless of what your OP post says I am still of the same opinion, there is no problem.
/sigh
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Carniflex
Caldari
StarHunt
Fallout Project
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Posted - 2008.12.06 14:40:00 -
[71]
Originally by: Treelox
Originally by: Ricdic
I thought about the subject line and I posted. I just didn't read the post content as I knew my answer without doing so. Regardless of what your OP post says I am still of the same opinion, there is no problem.
/sigh
He is right - there is no trit problem so no need to get depressed. Regardless of Ricdic not being interested in speculation what might CCP do if they would decide to intervene in currently well working market.
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Tsual
Minmatar
Iikhelahii khulemah'lal
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Posted - 2008.12.06 15:41:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Carniflex
Originally by: Treelox
Originally by: Ricdic
I thought about the subject line and I posted. I just didn't read the post content as I knew my answer without doing so. Regardless of what your OP post says I am still of the same opinion, there is no problem.
/sigh
He is right - there is no trit problem so no need to get depressed. Regardless of Ricdic not being interested in speculation what might CCP do if they would decide to intervene in currently well working market.
Looking if it drives carebears into null?
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Treelox
Amarr
Market Jihadist Revolutionary Party
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Posted - 2008.12.06 15:42:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Tsual
Looking if it drives carebears into null?
...that will be the day
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Jacque Custeau
Knights of the Minmatar Republic
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Posted - 2008.12.06 16:53:00 -
[74]
Speaking as a ship manufacturer I won't say the trit prices are annoying as the high ends are coming down in price at the same time, and I pass on the cost to customers. My issue is the volatility. I put up a buy order at night and find that it is no longer competitive in the morning (not talking about the usual 0.01 isk jostling).
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GateScout
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Posted - 2008.12.06 17:14:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Treelox
What do you think CCP "might" do to alievate the trit price/supply problem.
Who says it's a problem? I think this is an excellent situation.
I think CCP should crack down on macros and force Trit prices above 5.0 isk/unit.
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GateScout
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Posted - 2008.12.06 17:21:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Treelox
In my OP I did not say there was a trit problem.
If that was your intent, I sincerely believe you need to work on your writing skills.
Originally by: Treelox
"What do you think CCP "might" do to alievate the trit price/supply problem."
For most literate English speakers you have stated there is a problem with trit price and supply.
Trying to morph this into a forum whine issue is disingenuous at best...or you simply have a very difficult expressing your true thoughts in written form.
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Tasko Pal
Heron Corporation
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Posted - 2008.12.06 19:35:00 -
[77]
Edited by: Tasko Pal on 06/12/2008 19:35:56
Looky! Jita trit now down to spread of 3.93 bid, 3.95 ask. Yesterday's volume was 19.5 billion in the Forge, beats the last one year high by 2 billion trit. I wouldn't be surprised if this thread has sparked a long term drop in trit prices. In any case, I'm starting to think the CCP choice will be "Do nothing" because the problem is fixing itself.
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Rho'varo
Minmatar
Diversified Operational Services
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Posted - 2008.12.06 19:39:00 -
[78]
Originally by: GateScout
Originally by: Treelox
"What do you think CCP "might" do to alleviate the trit price/supply problem."
For most literate English speakers you have stated there is a problem with trit price and supply.
Trying to morph this into a forum whine issue is disingenuous at best... or you simply have a very difficult [sic] expressing your true thoughts in written form.
Please read also the sentence that immediately follows your quotation. (Literate readers of any language are probably aware that words should be read in their context.) It says "I myself don't really see this as a problem". This should help you understand the OP's position better. To be fair, you did do better than Ricdic (i.e., you read beyond the subject line before posting), but still you don't appear to have grasped the entirety of what Treelox wrote.
What it looked like was intended was an hypothetical discussion about an issue that Treelox said he personally doesn't think is a problem. This is worth discussing in case CCP identifies it as a "problem" (even if most of us don't consider the issue truly problematic).
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Treelox
Amarr
Market Jihadist Revolutionary Party
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Posted - 2008.12.06 20:06:00 -
[79]
^^ I am glad someone got where I was coming from ^^
Thank You
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Originally by: Tasko Pal
Looky! Jita trit now down to spread of 3.93 bid, 3.95 ask. Yesterday's volume was 19.5 billion in the Forge, beats the last one year high by 2 billion trit. I wouldn't be surprised if this thread has sparked a long term drop in trit prices. In any case, I'm starting to think the CCP choice will be "Do nothing" because the problem is fixing itself.
Lol I hope my thread alone didnt manipulate the market, cause if it did I wasnt in position to profit off it this weekend.
Seriously though intresting on the volume traded yesterday. Should be fun to see what happens the rest of the month, especially as Orca demand tapers and Orca BPO's that have been researched start to come out of labs ( IF the percieved Orca spike is a major contributor).
Very possibly CCP will do nothing, but if you had asked two years ago, most people would of said the same thing about CCP doing something about the trit cap imposed by NPC shuttle sales. Always helps to think outside the box on potentials, cause you never know what them sneaky folks at CCP HQ are going to do next.
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Tsual
Minmatar
Iikhelahii khulemah'lal
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Posted - 2008.12.06 21:12:00 -
[80]
Originally by: Treelox
Lol I hope my thread alone didnt manipulate the market, cause if it did I wasnt in position to profit off it this weekend.
As casual miner on the other hand I did.
Has anyone cared to watch metropolis market spike out today? Could have sworn I've seen that behaviour before on similar occassions. *shrugs*
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Tasko Pal
Heron Corporation
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Posted - 2008.12.07 00:10:00 -
[81]
Originally by: Tsual
Originally by: Treelox
Lol I hope my thread alone didnt manipulate the market, cause if it did I wasnt in position to profit off it this weekend.
As casual miner on the other hand I did.
Has anyone cared to watch metropolis market spike out today? Could have sworn I've seen that behaviour before on similar occassions. *shrugs*
Could you describe the behavior a bit more accurately? Or smirk a little as you say, "you shoulda been there." 
Looking at it, I imagine that there was some cheap trit somewhere in empire. Yesterday, it got hauled to Jita.
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Kazzac Elentria
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Posted - 2008.12.07 00:31:00 -
[82]
Essence experienced the similar trends.
No worries Treelox, your thread and mine have absolutely no bearing on the market.  |
Tasko Pal
Heron Corporation
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Posted - 2008.12.07 07:21:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Kazzac Elentria
Essence experienced the similar trends.
No worries Treelox, your thread and mine have absolutely no bearing on the market.
Well, aside from the testimonials. Just looked at Heimatar (since I was there). Unbroken swing up in daily average trit price. Volume was kind of mediocre on 05/12/2008 too.
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GateScout
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Posted - 2008.12.07 07:30:00 -
[84]
Edited by: GateScout on 07/12/2008 07:31:16
Originally by: Rho'varo
Please read also the sentence that immediately follows your quotation.
I most certainly did...and hence my post.
Originally by: Rho'varo
It says "I myself don't really see this as a problem"
Take your own advice. You didn't quote the whole sentence:
"While I myself dont really see this as a problem, if things keep trending they way they are."
He is referring to the downward movement of high end mineral prices ("things").
My original comment still applies. There is no problem regardless of what high end mineral prices do.
Originally by: Rho'varo
This is worth discussing in case CCP identifies it as a "problem" (even if most of us don't consider the issue truly problematic).
So we're discussing something that isn't a problem now and most people don't see it as a problem, and only may become a problem for Treelox if something else happens. lol. Have fun with that.
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Treelox
Amarr
Market Jihadist Revolutionary Party
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Posted - 2008.12.07 08:09:00 -
[85]
Originally by: GateScout
So we're discussing something that isn't a problem now and most people don't see it as a problem, and only may become a problem for Treelox if something else happens. lol. Have fun with that.
it is not a problem for me, but you and i both know that the huddled and unwashed masses, who dont "get" the game the way most of us here in MD do, might very well start to cry and moan soon about this.
Look at moon minerals, there was no problem with high end moon poo availability, and yet CCP appeased the masses by introducing Alchemy. At least there was/is no problem with high end moon poo in my perception.
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Frenden Dax
Dax Acquisitions
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Posted - 2008.12.07 08:29:00 -
[86]
The mob's whining about not enough having trit? Then let them eat cake!
If CCP does anything they will probably just up the spawn rate/amount of Veld in highsec. That's assuming they're stupid; one would hope that they'd let a free market economy play out. In my opinion what I see happening is mineral demand = higher prices = mining Veldspar becomes *gasp!* more lucrative. Ergo more people mine Veld and the price of trit goes back down as supply starts to overtop demand.
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Dominiks Handelsheld
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Posted - 2008.12.07 09:32:00 -
[87]
It's not a problem at all. If CCP wants to to do something they will probably increase the amount of Veld in Empire(what i doubt and hope they wont do it).
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Rho'varo
Minmatar
Diversified Operational Services
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Posted - 2008.12.07 11:07:00 -
[88]
Originally by: GateScout
So we're discussing something that isn't a problem now and most people don't see it as a problem, and only may become a problem for Treelox if something else happens.
I think you're getting it now; I'm glad my comments were able to help help you understand. Hypothetical discussions are indeed part of the fun.
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Mr Horizontal
Gallente
KIA Corp
KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2008.12.07 11:36:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Treelox
Originally by: Bloody Rabbit
Originally by: Mr Horizontal
As with everything in EVE, it all comes down to one simple factor: EVE is now overcrowded with too many people fighting over too few resources. I have said before and will say again. EVE needs a lot more space to solve most if not all the problems it has right now - in my estimation at least 8 new regions in Empire, Lowsec and 0.0 need to be introduced.
How it's done I don't particular care, but an example I'd say would be to make a lot of the existing lowsec regions like Aridia, Black Rise etc into Empire space (with the story that 'The Empires have finishing colonising these border areas') and make what is now Empire-fringe 0.0 like Vale, Providence etc into lowsec and add the regions on the outer areas of 0.0. However that will mean a lot of uprooting of existing infrastructures in those lowsec areas - so however they do it, there will be issues, but nevertheless, the key point is: MOAR SPACE.
Without killing too many players the High sec could take over the 0.4 systems and turn them into 0.5 systems. This won't displace moon mining towers and it would add more high sec. The story line would be simply, the empire groups are fearful of attack while they are at war and so have expanded their borders to protect themselves.
This would solve the whole 0.4 high sec or low sec problem and get more space to the Carebears.
I got to say on the whole I like this, it defintetly solves the "lameness" that is 0.4 space, stuck with all of the drawbacks of low sec and high sec and none of their benifits.
The only people who would complain are those that have established certain 0.4s as their cap ship depot/hub.
0.4 systems in Empire - for example systems like Aunenen and such like - are 'cyno pockets'. This allows capital ship staging and jumping across empire. You do need to have certain systems dotted all over empire to be able to jump around and across Empire space in capitals, so I'd advise to leave them be as they are, otherwise it'd force trespassing into other alliance space. With capital jumping I think there should be a risk in place, like there is in lowsec. Having an un-cynojammed Empire system would be something that is perma-abused, therefore I'd strongly not advise that!
0.4 systems in the 'lowsec concentric circle' around empire however should either be made 0.5 or 0.3 space though, I agree :)
Chairman | www.eve-bank.net |
SencneS
Amarr
Rebellion Against big Irreversible Dinks
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Posted - 2008.12.08 06:57:00 -
[90]
I think the biggest problem EVE has when it comes to a very large population is... Too much of everything everywhere..
It's too easy to go from Amarr space to Gallentee
It's too easy to train for another Races ships and weapons
The same minerals go to make up everything and those minerals are available everywhere.
As an Amarr I should be able to make Amarrian things considerably faster then a Caldari or Gal.
As an Amarr I shouldn't be able to make other races items without a skill.
It was like CCP said, "We want to make everything available to everyone at all times, all skills, all ships, all mods, everything."
And put bluntly that's is stupid.
As an Amarr toon it should take me 5 times longer to learn another empires ship or weapons systems.
In Amarr space Amarr stuff should be incredibly easy to come by the material needed to make the ship/mod/ammo etc. However you can't mine the materials to make anything Cal/Gal/Min. Yeah let some thing be common in all empires but there should be something like "Amarrite" only minable in Amarr space, and is required to make anything Amarrian in origin. Calarsite, Galentium, Minmartium etc.
Remove about 80% of all links. As an empire your local infrastructure should be as EVE is now. Inter empire joins should be reduced and reduced a lot.
The problem is everyone can do everything, and that's exactly what happens everyone does everything. If you reduced the options available to people, sure you'd have the same effect as right now where people are fighting over single resources. The only difference is, I'll be sitting in Gallenatee space manufacturing and selling Amarr stuff.
It's in a humans nature to copy others, only when they are unable top duplicate what they want is when they seek an alternative. Given that EVE allows you to do everything EVE seeks out the single best option. Why do you think most use Ravens to run missions, because it's the best option. Making Ravens the most popular, Take away peoples ability to learn a Raven in a reasonable amount of time as another race and they'll find their races best Mission running option.
Amarr for Life |
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