| Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
SpawnSupreme
   |
Posted - 2008.12.15 11:57:00 -
[1]
Edited by: SpawnSupreme on 15/12/2008 11:59:54
double minmitar gun ROF and reduce damage by half i think making minmitar hit more often at less damage will be more fun and apealing and make them more usefull in close range combat with gangs.
if you understand rail guns they are the hardest wepons to reload so if any type of wepon that has the slowest ROF should be rails and if you understand inertia and physics projectiles that can be launched farther naturaly do more damage
i think rails should lose ROF but gain a little more optimal range but have 3 settings setting 1 near hits real hard with a tracking penalty normal range hits normal with normal tracking and far range with low damage with big bonus to tracking. this would bring the real concept of real rail guns online with nearest reality.
i dont know if any of you understand real life combat but when life threaning danger whisk past your head as you hear a bullet whistle past you have an urge to drop head and raise un aimed wepon and supress enemy.
with this in mind you cant hide behind anythingtho it be cool if you can being on oposit side of a station and out of view should stop threat of bullets but thats not where im going.
to best put it add some flair to both wepon range classes like...
long range wepons such as beams, artilery and rails should be able to go into snipe mode were you get a bonus to damage and tracking with a large penalty to ROF.
close range wpons like the blaster, AC, pulsars should have burst option with an additional bullet per target every targetyou have aquired should take a shot with a tracking penalty. this would be like the spray and prey method of combat
i would say for every target that will be shot at will slightly reduce tracking so if you have 6 targets each target adds more penalty.
my other idea to this spreay and prey method would be make wepons under this setting be firing FOF bullets friend or foe meaning every target within optimal range of gun is blasted enemy or not hehe this ought to make things more interesting hehe.
i thing the spreay and preay method migh be a way to let a solo pilot who stumbles on a gang might find the weakest tank ship and take a poor sap with him to the grave yard hehe.
|
Kittamaru
Gallente
Democracy of Klingon Brothers
G00DFELLAS
|
Posted - 2008.12.15 12:49:00 -
[2]
Heh... I don't know why... but when I read your idea of the burst concept for short range weapons...
Death Blossom - The Last Starfighter
That comes to mind... heh... hahahaaa! Can you imagine seeing a Thorax spinning around unleashing a barrage of blaster fire like that?
|
SpawnSupreme
|
Posted - 2008.12.15 15:51:00 -
[3]
lol a whirling ***** shaped ship spitting doom at all hmmm the crazy things that go through our heads...
|
Emporors Champian
|
Posted - 2008.12.16 11:15:00 -
[4]
dont know about anyone else but more bang for my buck LOL
|
|
CCP Nozh
C C P
|
Posted - 2008.12.16 11:42:00 -
[5]
Higher ROF, more server calls, more lag.
Nozh
Game Designer
CCP Games |
|
Emporors Champian
|
Posted - 2008.12.16 12:03:00 -
[6]
lol more lag for ROF huh? well maybe we just slow all the laser and hybrid turrets down and reduse minmitar damage modifier and all wepon will do less lag.... and all will be in line with the other classes as well hehe
|
Arkadrell
|
Posted - 2008.12.16 12:04:00 -
[7]
 Originally by: CCP Nozh
Higher ROF, more server calls, more lag.
agreed! Missile ROF x2, Hybrid weapons ROF x2, Lasers RoF x2.
that way CCP will have less lag >_<' brilliant idea.
on a serious note:
lol its nice theres differncies between weapons, if diversity strengthens the game play that SHOULD be the games ONLY concern. Justifying things with lag and whatnot... jeez I hope thats a bad joke.
what artileries need is a slight damage boost, and larget ammo clips so they can compete with other weaponry systems in dps. Theres a reason theres NO one that used minmatar ships in that pvp turnement (resent one) that won (cept for odd rifters fit for little bit of ewar).
compaire all weapons dps BEFORE ship bonuses (bonuses are ment to be that, not to make ships be equal to one another, so they make the ships themselfs unique).
minmatar need a boost, RoF isnt it.
in fact, that d make things SERIOUSLY depressing with the way the small ammo clips are for them atm, if anything they need higher alpha, slower RoF and more overall sustainable dps, and a slight ammo boosting. (dont overpower them, but itd be nice if they where on pair dps wise with lasers/hybrid turrets)
|
Emporors Champian
|
Posted - 2008.12.16 12:18:00 -
[8]
well i see minmitar guns shooting so slow you can gank an artilery ship and pop it before it gets 3 volly of gun fire haha
and it does not fit current or i hope future tech.
i think the onlything that bring minmitar online with other wepons is give them locking computers where it takes even longer to lock target but once its ready to fire max damage because there is no tracking for your locked.
locking take out all the varables... minmitar guns can be uniqu in such they are slow but you know how much damage it will do before shot fired
|
Arkadrell
|
Posted - 2008.12.16 12:31:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Emporors Champian
well i see minmitar guns shooting so slow you can gank an artilery ship and pop it before it gets 3 volly of gun fire haha
and it does not fit current or i hope future tech.
I had forgotten that was the bad side of slow RoF, you miss out on a ton of damage potential if you dont get that last shot fired and chances of such are much bigger the longer the delay between shots.
but.. still... main issue, 10 shots and then you spend forever reloading.
|
Reatu Krentor
Minmatar
Duragon Pioneer Group
GoonSwarm
|
Posted - 2008.12.16 12:31:00 -
[10]
Originally by: CCP Nozh
Higher ROF, more server calls, more lag.
higher ROF? don't you mean faster ROF  as higher ROF would mean they fire slower  ?
I'd be happy with client side coolness on autocannons  (and a renaming of dual 650mm repeating artillery, 800mm repeating Artillery and 6x2500mm repeating artillery to dual 650mm repeating cannon, 800mm repeating cannon and 6x2500mm repeating cannon.)
-- stuff -- |
Skerrd
|
Posted - 2008.12.16 12:36:00 -
[11]
Originally by: SpawnSupreme
Edited by: SpawnSupreme on 15/12/2008 11:59:54
double minmitar gun ROF and reduce damage by half i think making minmitar hit more often at less damage will be more fun and apealing and make them more usefull in close range combat with gangs.
Wouldn't that basically force you to reload more often, increasing ammo consumption and reducing your dps over time?
But what do I know, my guns use infinite ammo and have no reload time.
|
Emporors Champian
|
Posted - 2008.12.16 12:53:00 -
[12]
yeah i notice minmitar guns fire every time jesus returns
caldari guns fir like machine guns but do no damage and amar guns
amarr guns are reliable as constant steady damage
if you can only use amarr guns on all ships and get same bonuses hehe then there be no complaints hehe
|
Deviana Sevidon
Gallente
Panta-Rhei
United Front Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.12.16 14:51:00 -
[13]
All fit Large Artillery for Lag-Advantage in Fleet Battles now. You heard it here first.
 |
Emporors Champian
|
Posted - 2008.12.16 15:32:00 -
[14]
agreed if minmitar guns cant fire more rapidly to be online with others then slow down other race guns and add damage bonust to be online with minmitar guns. to accomodate need for speed
|
Thenoran
Caldari
Hegemony Enterprises
HEGEM0NY
|
Posted - 2008.12.16 16:27:00 -
[15]
Originally by: CCP Nozh
Higher ROF, more server calls, more lag.
Could it be possible to fake the FX and sounds?
Make it look like you are firing a bunch of guns at a 1000RPM on your client, but only sending a single call to the server for the entire group? Or something like that...?
------------------------
Low-sec is like sailing along the coast of Somalia...
|
Emporors Champian
|
Posted - 2008.12.16 16:36:00 -
[16]
this is not possible because the visuals are incorperating movement and all movement in space is maped so if you increase the visual you increase the lag hehe but you can go opposite hehe you can speed up the wepons but skow down the visuals to reduce lag but get high kill performance hehe.
|
Arkadrell
|
Posted - 2008.12.17 10:26:00 -
[17]
I kinda like the animations the way they are, itd be odd seeing x amount more animations or the reverse too.
|
Huan CK
Gallente
Bounty Hunter - Dark Legion
|
Posted - 2008.12.17 10:43:00 -
[18]
Originally by: CCP Nozh
Higher ROF, more server calls, more lag.
lol?!
If you want to reduce bandwidth and counter an idea with such a comment, I suggest each ship gets an instant-death doomsday ;) whoever triggers his first kills off all the others on the grid. I think that's pretty much the best way to reduce bandwidth :D
Or gimme death-rays. No matter the tank, "click - boom". You can crank up the refire rate as far as you want in those cases^^.
My videos:
Watch on youtube. |
Emperors Righthand
Minmatar
Mercenary Builders Enterprises
|
Posted - 2008.12.18 02:02:00 -
[19]
i know we all dont wanna shoot slower but to be fair to minmitar guns and to satify need for speed i think a lower ROF (less shots oer minute would be better provided all the wepons get a better bonus to wepon damage.
|
Onys Cissalc
|
Posted - 2008.12.18 23:38:00 -
[20]
I remember back in the day of non-stacking weapon mods, I'd put 8x 125mm autocannons on an apoc with a full low grid of gyrostabs, giving me a sub 0.3s ROF.
I promptly received a message from a GM telling me to stop making the server box he was secretly using to lurk the forums with lag, because I was causing it to have to process way too much with every one of the 8 guns shooting at a different target.
At least, in my dream world that's what happened.
The very long ROF on artillery is because they are designed to have the greatest alpha potential ingame. Warp to a spot 150km from the center of a station, unload a 5k volley on your wartargets, warp to a different spot still 150km from it, and have your guns just finish their cycle as you arrive, allowing you to unload another 5k volley. Rinse, repeat, and you've got yourself a bunch of really annoyed station campers, and possibly some dead sub-battlecruiser targets.
|
SpawnSupreme
|
Posted - 2008.12.19 07:28:00 -
[21]
how gay to think minmitar are a race who broke free from amarr slavery and yet reducesed to nothing other than hit and run tactics.... it and run tactics should be a specific set up any race can fit not just minmitar.
the diferance between each race should be minor changes like 1 uses no cap 1 uses no ammo and 1 race alwayse hits with drones but weak wepons and 1 race alwayse hit with missiles at slightly less damage than guns who often miss.
and thier diferances should be in story lines
but the ships and wepons should not be of 1 race reducing its effectivness to stand toe to toe or hit and run.
battle tactics should be of any race can choose any tactic for the on going wars and imporvements will make aware to other races new ways.
if brother shows me gansta pistol intimidation tactics i will use it but when i grow up and join military and see it hits nothing i will learn to aim properly thus be more effective so do not make 1 race whimps and another uber in any tactic
|
Calis Kreios
|
Posted - 2008.12.19 11:30:00 -
[22]
need for speed is important.poor minmitar race i think maybe dev team dont like them so they forget to help them out each time a new nerf hits them the hardest hehe
|
Wrangler Al
|
Posted - 2008.12.19 11:55:00 -
[23]
one usefull gun function could be to fire flac ammo...
like defender missiles that can intercept incoming fire.
flac however could be dificult to implement realistically, so an easy way to do it would be to have it reduce the sig radious of the ship while it is firing flac rounds
Signature pic exceeds the size limit. ~WeatherMan |
Onys Cissalc
|
Posted - 2008.12.19 14:04:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Onys Cissalc on 19/12/2008 14:05:40
SpawnSupreme, I think you're a bit confused here.
Minmatar specialize in guerrilla warfare. They are by no means limited to it.
In the same way, Gallente dominate the toe-to-toe battlefield, caldari dominate the sniper battlefield and amarr the mid-ranged counter-attack platform.
Minmatar ships are more than capable of fitting extremely well tanking and very damaging ships; points in case a tanked up maelstrom with autocannons, a sleipnir along the same vein, a tempest, a typhoon. All these ships are more than capable of being monstrous on the battlefield.
I would advise you go play with EFT a bit and compare minmatar ships to amarr ships. You may find that there are very many places where amarr pilots are being given the metaphorical finger when it comes to their setups as minmatar have setups that very easily render them near useless.
|
Arkadrell
|
Posted - 2008.12.19 14:49:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Arkadrell on 19/12/2008 14:50:00
Originally by: Onys Cissalc
Edited by: Onys Cissalc on 19/12/2008 14:05:40
Minmatar ships are more than capable of fitting extremely well tanking and very damaging ships; points in case a tanked up maelstrom with autocannons, a sleipnir along the same vein, a tempest, a typhoon. All these ships are more than capable of being monstrous on the battlefield.
I would advise you go play with EFT a bit and compare minmatar ships to amarr ships. You may find that there are very many places where amarr pilots are being given the metaphorical finger when it comes to their setups as minmatar have setups that very easily render them near useless.
lol can you show me a eft fit ship that does more dmg, has better tank than a amarr BS?
note boths optimal ranges / falloffs, and sig radius and speeds if needed, and eHP.
Amarr are monsters compaired to what minmatar ships can pull off, from my own experiance and playing around with EFT.
ps. do you fly amarr or minmatar? because I get the feeling your either a minmatar lover or a person afraid your newly found love for amarr might get nerfed.
|
Onys Cissalc
|
Posted - 2008.12.20 00:30:00 -
[26]
Geddon:
149,321 EHP
887dps with conflagration with 14+7.5 ranges
765dps with scorch with 41+7.5 ranges
761m/s
Uses cap injector to sustain hardeners, guns and heavy neut
Faction items required to make it fit:
3x DB hardeners
1x TS EANM or equivalent
1x DB Heatsink
1x DB large cap injector
Does not fit otherwise due to CPU constraints.
Exchanging the heatsink for a RCU II and the guns which were dual heavy pulse IIs for a rack of mega modulated pulses yields the following changes to range and dps:
787 using amarr multifreq L with 15+10 ranges
709 using amarr navy xray l with 23+10 ranges
591 using amarr navy infrared L with 36+10 ranges
The geddon in this case has no web.
Typhoon:
141,459 EHP
999dps using Hail L and Inferno Rage torpedos with 2.7+10 and 18km ranges
818dps using Barrage L and Inferno Javelin torpedos with 5.4+30 and 30.4km ranges
807m/s
Has no cap injector, but has a sensor booster; has the option of fitting a medium cap injector II to prevent neuting from switching off the hardeners.
Faction items required to fit:
Centii C-type Adaptive Nano Plating or equivalent
Between these two, even tho the effective HP is less than the Geddon's, the Phoon has ever so slightly better resists against the type-of-damage it's most likely to be taking. The two would no doubt kill eachother within a few structure's difference.
One thing to note is the fact that 426dps from the Phoon is linear. That is to say, because missiles do not get hit types, there is no chance of getting more than a 1.0x damage output from them, where it is relatively safe to assume that in a BS vs BS fight, you can expect a 1.25x minimum averaged damage increase per ship where tracking is not an issue.
As for what race I play, my first character was minmatar and amarr. The character now belongs to a friend and is amarr specialised.
I am currently playing a Gallente Specialised character with some caldari (rails/blasters) mixed in now that I'm running out of sub-capital stuff to train, while an alt and demi-main is specializing in Minmatar.
I don't really get where your aggressive "I bet you're a so and so lover afraid that your race is going to get nerfed" attitude is coming from... I don't care what race is strong in what; I haven't done for the past 5 years and don't intend to start doing now.
|
Arkadrell
|
Posted - 2008.12.20 01:52:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Arkadrell on 20/12/2008 01:57:28
@Onys Cissalc
can you do a copy + paste of boths setups EFT profiles? so I can check in EFT.
I like ballance (between things), esp in a game that promotes pvp.
I like minmatar ship designs, the big shot (alpha) with low RoF so it evens out (dps wise over time) (or is supposed to).
Unlike you I dont have Amarr BS level5, ect ect ect and I cant fly every races BS+ ships equally well. I want to fly minmatar, but I cant find reason to really expect the fact of design of the ship+ weaponry. Which is a problem, im kinda a elitist so playing something I know is gimpy compaired to others is really a killer for me.
I believe all the ships should be able to do same sustained dps.
If you took their strongest ammo, and made them shoot in a simulation over 1years time or so (ingame time, computers can calculate things alot faster), they should all come out of that simulation roughly the same (granted itd be for various resistance build reflectly actual game numbers, so 1 race might be best at ei. Angle Rat resistances damage simulation, while others Rogue drones or such).
I also beleave each of the weapon systems should all have differnt ranges where they are better than one another, and optimal range is just much more important than falloff is atm with the amounts of falloff people can get. Lasers have so many ranges they beat more or less all the others at. Seems unfair.
|
Solacc
|
Posted - 2008.12.20 11:00:00 -
[28]
well i think a race like amar is very easy just put guns and blow stuff up and your sure to do well with it
but a race like minmitar with its reducesed dps due to reloading often and minmitar cant fit any set up as good as the next race but i say if your falmilliar with eve and combat then you will see minmitar are no push over but just dont be a newb in minmitar for you fail.
only the the few and proud can prevail with minmitar as any newb can put up a strong fight with amarr
|
SpawnSupreme
|
Posted - 2008.12.21 15:26:00 -
[29]
some valid points here some good post,
but after everything said thus far i still feel same!!!
if we cant speed them up for lag reasons then slow all other wepon types to even the play field.
i really need a good reason as to why minmitar wepons fire so slow hehe.
i will tell you right now it wont be logical reason so how about the actual reason dev team done so?
are they so devolved in advancments that they just came out of stone age? that is only reason bareable.
for my naval ship can fire rounds the size of a human faster than an AK 47 can fire hehe...
|
Entaran
Caldari
Navy of Xoc
Wildly Inappropriate.
|
Posted - 2008.12.21 15:28:00 -
[30]
Double ROF for half damage = Double ammo consumption.
Your idea fails. New idea please.
|
| |
|
| Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |