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The worst game design changes in the history of Eve

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Crumplecorn Eve Cluster Explorations 181	Posted - 2012.04.19 12:31:00 - [31] - Quote Removing images from signatures. [img]http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sig.php?r=rnd[/img] Desusigs can be seen on the terribad new forums using bbcode enabling script (scroll down to my post for sig rotation)
Aqriue Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 579	Posted - 2012.04.19 17:21:00 - [32] - Quote Xorv wrote: Every CONCORD buff ever made - CONCORD is just so anti Sandbox, and every buff it receives is CCP repeating the same mistake over and exacerbating the problems it causes . No, the biggest mistake in the game was creating EVE, implementing the concept of loss and actually lossing items, then allowing people with a self entitlment issue to dictate that they have the right to nuke people into oblivion and its ok. This was so 5k subs online. Then you get CONCORD in its current form. TO REDUCE THE RANDOM ASSHATTERY that you can dictate by smashing up people in EVE...its consequences to your ability to smash up people. See, there is this thing called people and its more then just you...all players pay to play the game and if you lose it so badly the first time why would anyone continue to pay for a game they can barely play...while you pay to play the game with no consequences to yourself. Bad for business for CCP, and CONCORD only interrupts against unsanctioned acts against another player....don't want CONCORD then don't gank (cause you can still attack them regardless) or wardec them or GTFO of highsec where its the only possible to have CONCORD sticking donut confectionary covered fingers in your ass. tl;dr - CONCORD is a balance and equalizer, it never prevents or stops. One player adapts to the point they are like rampant vermin, the other player can't adapt as well. So CCP has to buff them everytime they determine by their discretion how its being abused, without offending the abusing party completely. Also, worst mistake CCP has ever done is not implementing total loss. If you can throw away a ship and it doesn't feel like a loss when you lose it to CONCORD...its not a loss to you and you don't want anyone to do anything that prevents your self entitlement of doing what you want of causing loss to the other guy (buff hulks, increase CONCORD reaction times, make HS total SAFE!). So, the best form of total loss would be in the form of skill point removal whenever your ship is destroyed; not just T3. You cause the miner to lose SP in ORE ships, you lose SP in your gank boat...but this applies as well in null/low/high where ever you can cause someone to lose SP when ever you destroy their ship without CONCORD intervention...because the SP loss would be tied to destruction of your ship. Simple and effective method to implement a feeling of soul crushing loss everyone...now time loss in the form of skill points would be the new standard and not an isk ratio (since cost is never a factor according to Tippia and no one wants a hulk that dies well with ****** bonuses to get a buff)
Serge Bastana GWA Corp 342	Posted - 2012.04.19 17:26:00 - [33] - Quote Ziranda Hakuli wrote: i see another gate camper crying. who has the buckers? I've got rickets, managed to avoid getting buckers though WoW holds your hand until end game, and gives you a cookie whether you win or lose. EVE not only takes your cookie, but laughs at you for bringing one in the first place...
Barakach R-ISK Shadow Operations. 51	Posted - 2012.04.19 17:34:00 - [34] - Quote Why do low/null sec people complain about high sec so much? If they don't like high sec, then stay out of it. Is it that hard? When I poke myself in the eye, it hurts.. STOP DOING IT!
Vertisce Soritenshi Varion Galactic Tragedy. 1544	Posted - 2012.04.19 17:42:00 - [35] - Quote To the OP... Why do you play? EvE is not about PvP.-á EvE is about the SANDBOX! - CCP!-á Open the door!!!
FloppieTheBanjoClown The Skunkworks 1327	Posted - 2012.04.19 17:46:00 - [36] - Quote Mors Sanctitatis wrote: Interdictors- Why they are bad: completely obsoletes an entire class of ships- Interceptors. Provides instant gratification w/ bubbles, invalidates/reduces need for static bubbles. Interdictors let fleets be lazy. The problem isn't that interceptors are obsolete, it's that they're underused due to a shortage of competent pilots. Mors Sanctitatis wrote: Warp to zero- Why it's bad: almost too numerous to list- radically reduces the relative size of the galaxy, removes speed differential between ship classes for traveling, removes risk, damages/reduces the effectiveness of regional markets, reduces trading viability as a profession. Why it's good: bookmarks not crashing servers, and taking away the "I have bookmarks for this gate and you don't" advantage. Mors Sanctitatis wrote: Moon goo- Why it's bad: ISK printing is bad, mmmkay? My understanding of moon goo was that it was a market good, and no new isk was generated. It's time to put an end to CCP's war on piracy. Fight your own battles and stop asking CCP to do it for you.
Crumplecorn Eve Cluster Explorations 181	Posted - 2012.04.19 17:48:00 - [37] - Quote Aqriue wrote: [quote=Xorv] No, the biggest mistake in the game was creating EVE, implementing the concept of loss and actually lossing items, then allowing people with a self entitlment issue to dictate that they have the right to nuke people into oblivion and its ok. ITT: Wanting to shoot spaceships is self entitlement, wanting immunity for your spaceships isn't. [img]http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sig.php?r=rnd[/img] Desusigs can be seen on the terribad new forums using bbcode enabling script (scroll down to my post for sig rotation)
Gogela Freeport Exploration Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance 605	Posted - 2012.04.19 17:55:00 - [38] - Quote Interdictors- *Disagree. It's a ship w/ a bubble. A small one at that... those dictors are flying coffins. It's balanced.* Jump Freighters- Agreed - Proposed fix: Remove jump drives from jump freighters, give them instead double the cargo hold of a standard freighter and maybe buff the already extensive armor and shields some more. Allow them to transport caps. Seems like a fair trade in terms of maintaining ship value for JF pilots while fixing a big logistical problem that should never have been introduced. Warp to zero- *Disagree. Two words: Regional - Bookmarks* Jump bridges- Agreed - proposed fix: remove them. Titans- Agreed - proposed fix: Turn them into Nomad Ships Moon goo- Agreed - Proposed fix: The mining moon mins in planetary rings seems like a really good idea. Gê¦Gê¦-áEvery Ship in GëíGêçGëí-áGê¦Gê¦ GëíGêçGëí-+ odd items
Kieron VonDeux 9	Posted - 2012.04.19 18:00:00 - [39] - Quote FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote: Mors Sanctitatis wrote: Warp to zero- Why it's bad: almost too numerous to list- radically reduces the relative size of the galaxy, removes speed differential between ship classes for traveling, removes risk, damages/reduces the effectiveness of regional markets, reduces trading viability as a profession. Why it's good: bookmarks not crashing servers, and taking away the "I have bookmarks for this gate and you don't" advantage. A fix would be to not allow BM creation on Grid with a Stargate and remove warp to zero. Then you would need a gangmate to spot a warp-to for insta jumps.
Andrey Wartooth GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 6	Posted - 2012.04.19 18:04:00 - [40] - Quote YuuKnow wrote: I agree with most, but not all of these points. I remember I put up a warp to zero complaint a few months ago and all the whiners came out of the wood work.... Its an entire galaxy of space..... by its supposed to be a vast and distance travel. As for moon goo. Null sec is supposed to be a lucarative place. Andrey Wartooth wrote: Are a problem, but there are less than 1000 in the game. And they are being balanced in the upcoming expansion. I wouldn't call nerfing the unholy crap out of them to the point they are a big pinata "being balanced". CCP pretty much threw up their hands saying that they don't have a clue what to do with these things... 'we'll just make them so that no one even wants to fly one...' On a side note: I think its been pretty aparent that CCP doesn't really know how most of their changes are going to play out... they just try things and sees how they go... and when they realize they're messed up they have a hard time figuring out how to fix their goofs. yk Hey, look here. It's another Titan crybaby. Maybe if you and your titan owning friends hadn't decided to go and blap that CCP subcap fleet these titan nerfs wouldn't have even happened. Don't blame CCP for your poor impulse control.
Andrey Wartooth GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 6	Posted - 2012.04.19 18:05:00 - [41] - Quote Gogela wrote: Interdictors- *Disagree. It's a ship w/ a bubble. A small one at that... those dictors are flying coffins. It's balanced.* Jump Freighters- Agreed - Proposed fix: Remove jump drives from jump freighters, give them instead double the cargo hold of a standard freighter and maybe buff the already extensive armor and shields some more. Allow them to transport caps. Seems like a fair trade in terms of maintaining ship value for JF pilots while fixing a big logistical problem that should never have been introduced. Warp to zero- *Disagree. Two words: Regional - Bookmarks* Jump bridges- Agreed - proposed fix: remove them. Titans- Agreed - proposed fix: Turn them into Nomad Ships Moon goo- Agreed - Proposed fix: The mining moon mins in planetary rings seems like a really good idea. An alliance that doesn't own systems, and likely lives in lowsec shouldn't dictate on things they know nothing about
ElQuirko Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic 579	Posted - 2012.04.19 18:09:00 - [42] - Quote Serene Repose wrote: Proper prior planning prevents poor performance. Wrong - Prior Preparation Prevents Pizz-Poor Performance. You obviously know very little about British military sayings. (P-aye-ss is a bad word, apparently.) If we distribute pictures of people, does that mean God can file copyright claims under SOPA?
Kieron VonDeux 10	Posted - 2012.04.19 18:13:00 - [43] - Quote Andrey Wartooth wrote: An alliance that doesn't own systems, and likely lives in lowsec shouldn't dictate on things they know nothing about Designing to an end user's desires may be good in software development but not in game design. That is a recepe for abuse. As well, just because someone doesn't live in null sec now doesn't mean they never have, and their opinion is just a valid as anyone elses.
Gogela Freeport Exploration Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance 605	Posted - 2012.04.19 18:14:00 - [44] - Quote Andrey Wartooth wrote: An alliance that doesn't own systems, and likely lives in lowsec shouldn't dictate on things they know nothing about There was a time I lived in null and had great fun, until certain things were introduced or nerfed and incentive to own null space was removed. Your assumption that I live in low sec is correct (I'm -10 nice deductive power). However, some goon tool posting on a goon alt certainly shouldn't be questioning my credibility. If you have something to say do so and try to justify it with some rationale. Otherwise, some tool with less than half a year of game time just appears douchy trying to assert authority over a guy w/ half a tril in ships & has been playing for over 6 years. Gê¦Gê¦-áEvery Ship in GëíGêçGëí-áGê¦Gê¦ GëíGêçGëí-+ odd items
Ranger 1 Ranger Corp 1549	Posted - 2012.04.19 18:16:00 - [45] - Quote In general I have to agree, although there are issues with each point I could argue. Since many of these issue are related to making things too easy, travel in particular, I'll make just two suggestions. 1: If warp to zero were removed, you would need to remove the ability to set a bookmark within 15km of a gate or station. 2: Jump freighters are only part of the issue. The truth is the entire concept of Jump travel needs to go. If you want to move a cap ship fleet, it should be done via conventional means. This means that logistically it is a large and time consuming proposition (one not taken lightly). It also means that your cap ships are very vulnerable on the move unless properly supported. No more hot drops, no more surprise mass invasions (at least not with Caps/Super Caps leading the way). Some would argue that this would be far too boring... I would argue that the opportunities for ambushing your enemy while they are moving their fleet would lead to far more frequent engagements. Well planned and guarded freighter convoys would be needed again for moving materials, far more conventional traffic in and out of Null (and Low for that matter). Regional trade centers assume a position of importance again, and EVE suddenly becomes a much bigger and more formidable place. When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point. Also, I can kill you with my brain.
ChYph3r Multiplex Gaming SpaceMonkey's Alliance 48	Posted - 2012.04.19 18:24:00 - [46] - Quote Mors Sanctitatis wrote: In no particular order: Interdictors- Why they are bad: completely obsoletes an entire class of ships- Interceptors. Provides instant gratification w/ bubbles, invalidates/reduces need for static bubbles. Jump Freighters- Why they are bad: ruins the entire concept of a vulnerable logistics chain. Warp to zero- Why it's bad: almost too numerous to list- radically reduces the relative size of the galaxy, removes speed differential between ship classes for traveling, removes risk, damages/reduces the effectiveness of regional markets, reduces trading viability as a profession. Jump bridges- Why they are bad: mitigates the scale of the galaxy, promotes blob warfare. Titans- Why they are bad: over 2000 of them in game, no upkeep cost, little to no risk to deploy, etc. etc. Moon goo- Why it's bad: ISK printing is bad, mmmkay? Feel free to add your own. WOW you clearly don't get it. But I can understand that coming from a DoV member.....Just sit in Decon, play station games with noobs, and quietly stfu. Jita will Burn-á 4/28/12 Angry Monkey Podast Host
Andrey Wartooth GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 6	Posted - 2012.04.19 18:24:00 - [47] - Quote Gogela wrote: Andrey Wartooth wrote: An alliance that doesn't own systems, and likely lives in lowsec shouldn't dictate on things they know nothing about However, some goon tool posting on a goon alt certainly shouldn't be questioning my credibility. Geez, I post with an alt and people tell me to post with my main. I post with my main and people still tell me to post with my main.
Gogela Freeport Exploration Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance 606	Posted - 2012.04.19 18:30:00 - [48] - Quote Andrey Wartooth wrote: Gogela wrote: Andrey Wartooth wrote: An alliance that doesn't own systems, and likely lives in lowsec shouldn't dictate on things they know nothing about However, some goon tool posting on a goon alt certainly shouldn't be questioning my credibility. Geez, I post with an alt and people tell me to post with my main. I post with my main and people still tell me to post with my main. If that is your main it doesn't change much of what I said... in fact it rather supports my argument, wouldn't you say? Gê¦Gê¦-áEvery Ship in GëíGêçGëí-áGê¦Gê¦ GëíGêçGëí-+ odd items
Ranger 1 Ranger Corp 1549	Posted - 2012.04.19 18:31:00 - [49] - Quote Having played in Null before many of these things came to be... things would be very different and frankly a lot more hard core without them (or at least with a greatly restricted version of them). Most of these things came into the game to make the players life easier. Unfortunately, they suceeded. When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point. Also, I can kill you with my brain.
Andrey Wartooth GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 6	Posted - 2012.04.19 18:36:00 - [50] - Quote Gogela wrote: Andrey Wartooth wrote: Gogela wrote: Andrey Wartooth wrote: An alliance that doesn't own systems, and likely lives in lowsec shouldn't dictate on things they know nothing about However, some goon tool posting on a goon alt certainly shouldn't be questioning my credibility. Geez, I post with an alt and people tell me to post with my main. I post with my main and people still tell me to post with my main. If that is your main it doesn't change much of what I said... in fact it rather supports my argument, wouldn't you say? Not really. Your alliance lives in another type of space separate from nullsec. It doesn't hold any space at all. I'd say that your alliance probably has a bit of a bias when it comes to making other areas of space broken.
Gogela Freeport Exploration Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance 606	Posted - 2012.04.19 18:55:00 - [51] - Quote Andrey Wartooth wrote: Gogela wrote: Andrey Wartooth wrote: Gogela wrote: Andrey Wartooth wrote: An alliance that doesn't own systems, and likely lives in lowsec shouldn't dictate on things they know nothing about However, some goon tool posting on a goon alt certainly shouldn't be questioning my credibility. Geez, I post with an alt and people tell me to post with my main. I post with my main and people still tell me to post with my main. If that is your main it doesn't change much of what I said... in fact it rather supports my argument, wouldn't you say? Not really. Your alliance lives in another type of space separate from nullsec. It doesn't hold any space at all. I'd say that your alliance probably has a bit of a bias when it comes to making other areas of space broken. Well... I will say that null space in theory is where I would like to be. I've been stewing in low sec not by choice but because I feel like I've been forced there. I've been waiting for CCP to fix null sec for a very long time... and that is how I would characterize my situation. Just waiting. What I do in low sec is kind of pathetic relative to what I did when I was in null. We used to camp gates... but not like low where now it's just 1-3 of us (which is really sufficient for piracy) but with 20-50 because people used to actually have to escort freighters through null. Imagine huge fleets flying in support of freighter runs through null! It was awesome (and actually I've seen the russians to it to this day around Uaemon going towards Drone regions - tip of the hat). Now the concept of escorts and scouts is gone. Why walk when you can teleport. There are no logistics in eve. There is only a fricking intragalactic transporter. Push button receive bacon. No risk, no need for coordination, no need to plan out null sov holdings because spacetime and distance are rendered moot by jumping. At one point holding space on the rim was really hard because getting s* to empire was a big pain in the a. Now, frack what's the difference? All space is strategically the same. Resources are pretty much conformal throughout null. Who cares if you own one section of null over another? Does it matter who your neighbors are? nope. There's a reason most of the major alliances have stopped caring and are off doing silly stuff. Look at PL. They almost look like TEST. It's because they don't care. So do I have a bias? You bet your a I do... I want to see people actually WANT null again. I want to move back to null... but not without a reason. It needs to make sense in ISK and fun gameplay terms, otherwise why do it? Hell... I'll bet the directors of YOUR OWN corp agree with me conceptually if not with my approach. Talk to them... You still haven't made any kind of substantiated argument, fyi. Gê¦Gê¦-áEvery Ship in GëíGêçGëí-áGê¦Gê¦** GëíGêçGëí-+ odd items
Herping yourDerp Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 517	Posted - 2012.04.19 19:00:00 - [52] - Quote t2 bpos faction warfare since its done wrong war decs since just griefing tools bounty hunting since done wrong moon goo incursions in general were stupid too, i'm sure sansha will invade and fail for another decade but w/e
Tobiaz Spacerats 230	Posted - 2012.04.19 19:04:00 - [53] - Quote The T2 BPO lottery, hands-down the most stupid thing so far. It should have been a combination of active research agent mission running to 'licensing', T2 BPC, and research characters reverse engineering T2 BPC from datacores and T1. Anything that reduces the differences between races and their factions. The ridiculous ease of cross-training all the races (should have been a 200& penalty), the ease of travel between space of different factions, both in speed in safety, removal of racial attributes, no incentives or penalties to make sure players initially stick to their own regions, tons of stations being in 'foreign' regions, no restrictions on pirates ship in empire, no pirate 'empire'. CCP taking almost 10 years to finally start considering to think about perhaps doing maybe something about mining itself. Making titans combat ships owned by individuals, instead of mobile stations operated by a corporation (like a pos). And with only 30m ISK per shot that turned from a 'last resort' weapons into 'just for lulz'. Jumpclones. The rot in three roots of EVE: choices must have consequences, don't fly (or implant) what you can't afford to lose, the vastness of spaces Making T3 a ship that only takes a few months to train into, at which point you can do everything all T1 and even T2 ships can do, but better. Result: everyone, their mom AND their dog is flying them. It should have been the non-capital 'endgame' ship for veterans desperately looking for places to spend SP (and no skill-loss, but all rank 10 skills or worse). Changing the Caldari functional and modular ship-design into flat bricks. Also the new Scorpion and Ibis made by the symmetry-Gestapo are just heart-breaking (though I don't like the new 'fidgety' Maller, nor the new 'clean' Minmatar style either). The renaming bullshit of the missiles and various other modules. Trying to make things more comprehensible by throwing out vast amounts of unique 'flavour' and sentiment, never once consulting the community, and then replacing it with huge generic 'names' and still forgetting half. If CCP Gnauton was replaby a bunch of monkeys it would hardly been worse. Giving the Tr3 BC ... EIGHT... high slot turrets AND the damagebonus AND enough fitting-reduction to fit all of the largest guns so they basically out-damage most battleships, make a mockery out of HACs and sent the other BC to the museum. COSMOS being a half-arsed attempt at actually engaging PvE content and then leaving it like a dog tied to a tree in the woods. Tri Vetra wrote: ECM is so incredibly stupid Not as stupid as people that can only think in one-dimensional terms of tank & gank CCP, fix the forum's image tags http://go-dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/Tobiaz/sig_complaints.gif Cleaner warbills, anti-memberpadding, no price-shielding large corps: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1141323#post1141323
Tarsus Zateki GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 493	Posted - 2012.04.19 19:06:00 - [54] - Quote Your opinion is wrong.
Teiret Hedion University Amarr Empire 0	Posted - 2012.04.19 20:53:00 - [55] - Quote In no particular order: AURUM Did I win?!
Gogela Freeport Exploration Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance 608	Posted - 2012.04.19 21:04:00 - [56] - Quote Teiret wrote: In no particular order: AURUM Did I win?! A devil's advocate counterarguement might be, if it wasn't for player rage at aurum CCP might still be ignoring spaceships. In a roundabout kinda way it might have been the best thing for the game Gê¦Gê¦-áEvery Ship in GëíGêçGëí-áGê¦Gê¦ GëíGêçGëí-+ odd items
Ghoest 333	Posted - 2012.04.19 21:05:00 - [57] - Quote 1 Jump Freighters - The whole point of EVE was supposed to be fighting over moving resources. 2 Bubbles - they make it too easy to kill transort ships at gates. Wherever You Went - Here You Are
Kieron VonDeux 10	Posted - 2012.04.19 21:35:00 - [58] - Quote Ghoest wrote: 1 Jump Freighters - The whole point of EVE was supposed to be fighting over moving resources. I have to agree that some of my most exciting times in this game were during Alliance Frieghtor moves into deep null sec back in late 06 early 07. All this Jump everything since then has really removed some of the most rewarding Pvp aspects of the game.
Lyrrashae Crushed Ambitions Reckless Ambition 283	Posted - 2012.04.19 21:36:00 - [59] - Quote I can haz ur stuffs, OP? But yes, jump-bridges need to go--just remove and re-imburse, because they're dumb. The invention of ice-hockey is proof that Canada deserves to rule the world. Eh.
JitaPriceChecker2 State War Academy Caldari State 95	Posted - 2012.04.19 22:28:00 - [60] - Quote Ranger 1 wrote: In general I have to agree, although there are issues with each point I could argue. Since many of these issue are related to making things too easy, travel in particular, I'll make just two suggestions. 1: If warp to zero were removed, you would need to remove the ability to set a bookmark within 15km of a gate or station. 2: Jump freighters are only part of the issue. The truth is the entire concept of Jump travel needs to go. If you want to move a cap ship fleet, it should be done via conventional means. This means that logistically it is a large and time consuming proposition (one not taken lightly). It also means that your cap ships are very vulnerable on the move unless properly supported. No more hot drops, no more surprise mass invasions (at least not with Caps/Super Caps leading the way). Some would argue that this would be far too boring... I would argue that the opportunities for ambushing your enemy while they are moving their fleet would lead to far more frequent engagements. Well planned and guarded freighter convoys would be needed again for moving materials, far more conventional traffic in and out of Null (and Low for that matter). Regional trade centers assume a position of importance again, and EVE suddenly becomes a much bigger and more formidable place. +11

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