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Minigin
Ganja Labs
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Posted - 2008.03.25 23:58:00 -
[451]
so on one side... we have this guy: Gouminsomething or other
Telling us that nanos work by matrix. And how overpowered they are because he has run ALL the maths he can on something he cant possibly understand.
Then we look at his killboard stats and notice "hang on... this guy has 123kill all which have been in blob warfare... and he flys nothing larger than a battle cruiser mostly."
This proposes several interesting ideas to me... could this young gentleman be attempting to gear this game more towards blob warfares aid? And if his changes are implemented... and things such as the remote shield transferring raven becomes more common and starts to fight blobs again... will he still be complaining? i think so.
The mentality that a lot of alliances including goonswarm impose almost subliminally into their members is... "hey there are lots of us... throw big groups at those small gangs out there and we will win." These people go out... get slaughtered... then complain that its not their alliances fault for being a largely unskilled untalented un-fced blob, but its the other guys fault for being better than they are.
Well guys... lets do something that i dont think is true... and for a second believe this ridiculous argument that nanos are out of line...
If nanos are really that good... why dont you guys complaining fly them...? ill tell you why... because they are genuinely hard to fly.
They cost 3-4 times more than the average bs and can not be insured. To work well you MUST have at least 3% implants which set up. Then heres the real clincher...
They dont have a respectable tank. Which means if there are more than 2 interceptors on the field(assuming the people you are fighting arnt stupid... WHICH IS A HUGE ASSUMPTION THESE DAYS)... your probably going to die.
They require a lot of micro management, you have to watch a lot more on your screen than other people do. You also have to know and gamble on other peoples setups.
Its not easy to do. You guys who have never flown it before look out your window and see an Ishtar flying outside your mega going at 4km/s and scream overpowered... but do you know the effort that goes into fitting the ship? the practice that went into being able to survive in a ship that fragile? No you arnt thinking of that... because all you have ever done is fly harbingers and geddons, which lets face it... arnt intended to work the same way as nanoships.
So what you are really calling for here is standardizing of eve... so that every ship is on even footing... which essentially eliminates tactics almost entirely... when everyone is in a drake what the hell is the point of tactics. Which means no one can pay more or train more to get an edge over a blob... the blob will ALWAYS win. ALWAYS.
and i think the fact that the stern mind running that argument is in goonswarm speaks volumes about his experience and intentions.
And lets face it... the reason people dont fly nanos is because
a)they dont know how b) they dont have the skills c) they dont have the isk
Heres a matrix of my own.
Stupid people vs. smart people more stupid less smart: -1 | 1 equal numbers: -1 | 1 larger numbers of smart people: -1 | 1
This was proven through maths... that smart people are better than stupid people... lets nerf smart people. . MINIGIN! Now bringing colour back to these forums =)
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Crackzilla
The Shadow Order SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.26 00:01:00 -
[452]
Originally by: Semkhet If nanoships get nerfed, I'm afraid that what will come afterwards will leave way less chances to a target, and I suspect that some antinano supporters might regret their former stance. Without forgetting that all this will come at the price of diminishing the already low level of dynamism involved in EvE warfare.
So now you're threatening "nerf us and we'll cap blob you"? I think nearly everyone enjoys cap ship fights.
As stated before, I'd prefer we go back to the days where the perfect gang was a mixture of ceptors and dictors and a fleet of cap ships on call. As to efficiency, the vast majority of TRI kills have been via nanos. Caps are rarely brought out and only if there isn't much risk or suitable spies in the other alliance. The battleship fights have been a blast but we rarely see them as apparently it causes too much whining in TRI corp chat that they got popped last time. I'd prefer to leave specific alliance details and threats out of this discussion however.
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Lurana Jade
State War Academy
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Posted - 2008.03.26 00:03:00 -
[453]
Coming soon to an EVE near you: nano stacking nerf, so say the Devs. Enjoy!
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Minigin
Ganja Labs
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Posted - 2008.03.26 00:11:00 -
[454]
is this where you want the game to go ccp? everyone is equal regardless of skill and isk? the only advantage is blob?
welcome to WoW. . MINIGIN! Now bringing colour back to these forums =)
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Semkhet
Spartan Industries Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.03.26 00:16:00 -
[455]
Originally by: *****zilla
Originally by: Semkhet If nanoships get nerfed, I'm afraid that what will come afterwards will leave way less chances to a target, and I suspect that some antinano supporters might regret their former stance. Without forgetting that all this will come at the price of diminishing the already low level of dynamism involved in EvE warfare.
So now you're threatening "nerf us and we'll cap blob you"? I think nearly everyone enjoys cap ship fights.
As stated before, I'd prefer we go back to the days where the perfect gang was a mixture of ceptors and dictors and a fleet of cap ships on call. As to efficiency, the vast majority of TRI kills have been via nanos. Caps are rarely brought out and only if there isn't much risk or suitable spies in the other alliance. The battleship fights have been a blast but we rarely see them as apparently it causes too much whining in TRI corp chat that they got popped last time. I'd prefer to leave specific alliance details and threats out of this discussion however.
What are you smoking ? You must be quite full of it to think that there's even the shadow of a threat in my post.
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Matrixcvd
Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.03.26 00:21:00 -
[456]
Originally by: *****zilla
These *used* to exist. You must remember the days when ceptor and frig gangs were viable. Instead they've been replaced by blobs of nano hacs.
wow,here we go bringin up the past without any clue of what it was really like. And why did friggy gangs exist and people fly them in great numbers? it didnt happen to be before the ECM nerf was it? no that had nothing to do with 5 frigs, tackling jamming and killing BS's did it? no it didnt, just exit this thread please you bring only nonsense to the table
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Matrixcvd
Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.03.26 00:23:00 -
[457]
Originally by: Call'Da Poleece What is the fastest explosion velocity attainable with skills/implants/rigs/ships? Is there any missle that can do significant damage to a ship doing 5km/s (assume massive sig radius)?
no there is not
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Goumindong
Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.26 00:27:00 -
[458]
Quote: Telling us that nanos work by matrix
No, simultaneous games are defined by a matrix which represents the choices the participants can make.
Originally by: Minigin
Then we look at his killboard stats and notice "hang on... this guy has 123kill all which have been in blob warfare... and he flys nothing larger than a battle cruiser mostly."
On battleclinic yes. But i don't post my kills on battleclinic.
Quote:
If nanos are really that good... why dont you guys complaining fly them...? ill tell you why... because they are genuinely hard to fly.
They cost 3-4 times more than the average bs and can not be insured. To work well you MUST have at least 3% implants which set up. Then heres the real clincher...
They are not genuinely hard to fly and do not cost 3-4 times the average BS. Now, they are un-insurable, but they are not the cost you think.
Nano's really are that good and we fly them pretty much all the time. I don't as much, since i don't do as much roaming, and am too poor to afford zealots[or battleships really].
Quote:
They dont have a respectable tank. Which means if there are more than 2 interceptors on the field(assuming the people you are fighting arnt stupid... WHICH IS A HUGE ASSUMPTION THESE DAYS)... your probably going to die.
Really, 2 interceptors is all it takes?
Quote:
Its not easy to do. You guys who have never flown it before look out your window and see an Ishtar flying outside your mega going at 4km/s and scream overpowered... but do you know the effort that goes into fitting the ship? the practice that went into being able to survive in a ship that fragile? No you arnt thinking of that... because all you have ever done is fly harbingers and geddons, which lets face it... arnt intended to work the same way as nanoships.
Actually the Harbinger can work surprisingly similar. Fit either for speed or web range, its quite agile and doesn't need to move much to deal DPS.
Quote:
So what you are really calling for here is standardizing of eve... so that every ship is on even footing... which essentially eliminates tactics almost entirely... when everyone is in a drake what the hell is the point of tactics. Which means no one can pay more or train more to get an edge over a blob... the blob will ALWAYS win. ALWAYS.
No, we just want tactics to work both ways where as a non-nano gang can use tactics to kill nanos.
Vote Goumindong for CSM |
Hortoken Wolfbrother
Free Lapland The Kadeshi
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Posted - 2008.03.26 00:42:00 -
[459]
Originally by: Goumindong No, we just want tactics to work both ways where as a non-nano gang can use tactics to kill nanos.
There are pleanty of tactics. Just because you fail isnt reason to change the game.
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Goumindong
Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.26 00:43:00 -
[460]
Originally by: Matrixcvd The scarecrow is a coward! He totally sucks.
First of all, no one is saying that if two ships are on grid together they must fight until all ships on one side are dead. Would a 20km web do that? [A: no, it would not]
They are saying that the only rational choice for flying a gang in 0.0 should not be nano-ships.
Vote Goumindong for CSM |
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Goumindong
Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.26 00:44:00 -
[461]
Originally by: Hortoken Wolfbrother
Originally by: Goumindong No, we just want tactics to work both ways where as a non-nano gang can use tactics to kill nanos.
There are pleanty of tactics. Just because you fail isnt reason to change the game.
You folks keep saying this and keep failing to detail just what those tactics are that don't involve flying nano ships. Then, when you do detail them, they fail to do the job as advertised unless the nano-gangs suicide into them.
Vote Goumindong for CSM |
Hortoken Wolfbrother
Free Lapland The Kadeshi
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Posted - 2008.03.26 00:50:00 -
[462]
Originally by: Goumindong
You folks keep saying this and keep failing to detail just what those tactics are that don't involve flying nano ships. Then, when you do detail them, they fail to do the job as advertised unless the nano-gangs suicide into them.
Neuts, tracking disruptors, huginns/rapiers*, ewar in general, curses, having.... intis??.
I mean, god forbid tackling ships are needed to tackle. Cant do any of these above? Guess you should learn to adapt to the game rather than adapt the game to you.
*You dont have to nano huginns/rapiers.
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Goumindong
Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.26 00:54:00 -
[463]
Originally by: Hortoken Wolfbrother
Neuts, tracking disruptors, huginns/rapiers*, ewar in general, curses, having.... intis??.
I mean, god forbid tackling ships are needed to tackle. Cant do any of these above? Guess you should learn to adapt to the game rather than adapt the game to you.
*You dont have to nano huginns/rapiers.
ewar doesn't kill nano ships. Nor do neuts, only force them to disengage. Curses, huginns, and rapiers are nano ships.
Vote Goumindong for CSM |
Minigin
Ganja Labs
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Posted - 2008.03.26 00:56:00 -
[464]
Originally by: Goumindong
Quote: Telling us that nanos work by matrix
No, simultaneous games are defined by a matrix which represents the choices the participants can make.
Originally by: Minigin
Then we look at his killboard stats and notice "hang on... this guy has 123kill all which have been in blob warfare... and he flys nothing larger than a battle cruiser mostly."
On battleclinic yes. But i don't post my kills on battleclinic.
Quote:
If nanos are really that good... why dont you guys complaining fly them...? ill tell you why... because they are genuinely hard to fly.
They cost 3-4 times more than the average bs and can not be insured. To work well you MUST have at least 3% implants which set up. Then heres the real clincher...
They are not genuinely hard to fly and do not cost 3-4 times the average BS. Now, they are un-insurable, but they are not the cost you think.
Nano's really are that good and we fly them pretty much all the time. I don't as much, since i don't do as much roaming, and am too poor to afford zealots[or battleships really].
Quote:
They dont have a respectable tank. Which means if there are more than 2 interceptors on the field(assuming the people you are fighting arnt stupid... WHICH IS A HUGE ASSUMPTION THESE DAYS)... your probably going to die.
Really, 2 interceptors is all it takes?
Quote:
Its not easy to do. You guys who have never flown it before look out your window and see an Ishtar flying outside your mega going at 4km/s and scream overpowered... but do you know the effort that goes into fitting the ship? the practice that went into being able to survive in a ship that fragile? No you arnt thinking of that... because all you have ever done is fly harbingers and geddons, which lets face it... arnt intended to work the same way as nanoships.
Actually the Harbinger can work surprisingly similar. Fit either for speed or web range, its quite agile and doesn't need to move much to deal DPS.
Quote:
So what you are really calling for here is standardizing of eve... so that every ship is on even footing... which essentially eliminates tactics almost entirely... when everyone is in a drake what the hell is the point of tactics. Which means no one can pay more or train more to get an edge over a blob... the blob will ALWAYS win. ALWAYS.
No, we just want tactics to work both ways where as a non-nano gang can use tactics to kill nanos.
you are determined to assert your stupidity here arnt you.
1. you openly admitted you dont fly nanos... so obviously you can tell me how hard they are to fly compared to other ships.
2. you then said they dont cost much. you are totally ********... my nanoishtar sets me back 3-400m excluding t2 drones that i have to replace.
3. battleclinic picks up your mails from the goonboard. As it does with all major alliances.
4. you are a terrible pvper
5. you are a terrible poster
6. you are a goon...
7. "No, we just want tactics to work both ways where as a non-nano gang can use tactics to kill nanos."
THAT IS WHAT I HAVE BEEN YELLING AT YOU TO DO!!! YET YOU SEEM INSISTENT THAT THE ONLY TACTIC YOU WANT TO USE IS BLOB WITH BATTLESHIPS NEVER USE NEUTS NEVER USE WEBS NEVER USE TACKLE AND JUST WIN!
You just proved my entire case. . MINIGIN! Now bringing colour back to these forums =)
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Hortoken Wolfbrother
Free Lapland The Kadeshi
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Posted - 2008.03.26 01:02:00 -
[465]
Edited by: Hortoken Wolfbrother on 26/03/2008 01:02:29
Originally by: Goumindong
ewar doesn't kill nano ships. Nor do neuts, only force them to disengage. Curses, huginns, and rapiers are nano ships.
Neuts kill many nano ships. Ewar makes nano ships ineffective, and DOES get them killed if you have intis. Curses huginns and rapiers are nano ships only if you choose to nano them.
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techzer0
IDLE GUNS
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Posted - 2008.03.26 01:05:00 -
[466]
Originally by: Minigin so on one side... we have this guy: Gouminsomething or other
Telling us that nanos work by matrix. And how overpowered they are because he has run ALL the maths he can on something he cant possibly understand.
Then we look at his killboard stats and notice "hang on... this guy has 123kill all which have been in blob warfare... and he flys nothing larger than a battle cruiser mostly."
This proposes several interesting ideas to me... could this young gentleman be attempting to gear this game more towards blob warfares aid? And if his changes are implemented... and things such as the remote shield transferring raven becomes more common and starts to fight blobs again... will he still be complaining? i think so.
The mentality that a lot of alliances including goonswarm impose almost subliminally into their members is... "hey there are lots of us... throw big groups at those small gangs out there and we will win." These people go out... get slaughtered... then complain that its not their alliances fault for being a largely unskilled untalented un-fced blob, but its the other guys fault for being better than they are.
Well guys... lets do something that i dont think is true... and for a second believe this ridiculous argument that nanos are out of line...
If nanos are really that good... why dont you guys complaining fly them...? ill tell you why... because they are genuinely hard to fly.
They cost 3-4 times more than the average bs and can not be insured. To work well you MUST have at least 3% implants which set up. Then heres the real clincher...
They dont have a respectable tank. Which means if there are more than 2 interceptors on the field(assuming the people you are fighting arnt stupid... WHICH IS A HUGE ASSUMPTION THESE DAYS)... your probably going to die.
They require a lot of micro management, you have to watch a lot more on your screen than other people do. You also have to know and gamble on other peoples setups.
Its not easy to do. You guys who have never flown it before look out your window and see an Ishtar flying outside your mega going at 4km/s and scream overpowered... but do you know the effort that goes into fitting the ship? the practice that went into being able to survive in a ship that fragile? No you arnt thinking of that... because all you have ever done is fly harbingers and geddons, which lets face it... arnt intended to work the same way as nanoships.
So what you are really calling for here is standardizing of eve... so that every ship is on even footing... which essentially eliminates tactics almost entirely... when everyone is in a drake what the hell is the point of tactics. Which means no one can pay more or train more to get an edge over a blob... the blob will ALWAYS win. ALWAYS.
and i think the fact that the stern mind running that argument is in goonswarm speaks volumes about his experience and intentions.
And lets face it... the reason people dont fly nanos is because
a)they dont know how b) they dont have the skills c) they dont have the isk
Heres a matrix of my own.
Stupid people vs. smart people more stupid less smart: -1 | 1 equal numbers: -1 | 1 larger numbers of smart people: -1 | 1
This was proven through maths... that smart people are better than stupid people... lets nerf smart people.
I love this guy and his green text... honestly. Now I just gotta remember his in-game channel.
------------
Originally by: CCP Mitnal It's great being a puppetmaster
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Goumindong
Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.26 01:12:00 -
[467]
Originally by: Minigin
1. you openly admitted you dont fly nanos... so obviously you can tell me how hard they are to fly compared to other ships.
2. you then said they dont cost much. you are totally ********... my nanoishtar sets me back 3-400m excluding t2 drones that i have to replace.
3. battleclinic picks up your mails from the goonboard. As it does with all major alliances.
1. This if false.
2. Then you fit your ishtar like an idiot or spend way to much than you need. Assume 10m-20m for mods, 90m for the hull, and hell, lets estimate high, 90m for polycarbs, brings you to 190-200m.
half of your supposed cost.
Now fit out, say, an abaddon, 150m hull, 80m trimarks, 30m mods puts you back 250m, 300m after insurance payed, 150m after insurance received. Puts the final cost pretty close actually, especially since i didn't factor ammo in for the Abaddon and its more expensive than drones.
3. No it doesn't. For instance, its missing my last death in a rifter, and 3 full harbingers in qy6, probably more.
Its also missing about 95 kills since it seems logs pods in the main kill section.
As for the rest of it....
Vote Goumindong for CSM |
Goumindong
Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.26 01:15:00 -
[468]
Edited by: Goumindong on 26/03/2008 01:15:03
Originally by: Hortoken Wolfbrother Edited by: Hortoken Wolfbrother on 26/03/2008 01:02:29
Originally by: Goumindong
ewar doesn't kill nano ships. Nor do neuts, only force them to disengage. Curses, huginns, and rapiers are nano ships.
Neuts kill many nano ships. Ewar makes nano ships ineffective, and DOES get them killed if you have intis. Curses huginns and rapiers are nano ships only if you choose to nano them.
So are vagabonds...
Neuts do not kill many nano ships, they force you to disengage.
Same with inties, the nano ship just burns away.
Vote Goumindong for CSM |
techzer0
IDLE GUNS
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Posted - 2008.03.26 01:22:00 -
[469]
Originally by: Goumindong Edited by: Goumindong on 26/03/2008 01:15:03
Originally by: Hortoken Wolfbrother Edited by: Hortoken Wolfbrother on 26/03/2008 01:02:29
Originally by: Goumindong
ewar doesn't kill nano ships. Nor do neuts, only force them to disengage. Curses, huginns, and rapiers are nano ships.
Neuts kill many nano ships. Ewar makes nano ships ineffective, and DOES get them killed if you have intis. Curses huginns and rapiers are nano ships only if you choose to nano them.
So are vagabonds...
Neuts do not kill many nano ships, they force you to disengage.
Same with inties, the nano ship just burns away.
I want to see you tank a vagabond. It doesn't have the cap or the pg/cpu to be anywhere near comparable to tanked HACs like the Zealot, Deimos, Muninn, Eagle, Cerb, Ishtar, or Sacrilege.
Sure you could shield tank it with it's high resists, but sacrifice any usefulness as a tackler, or you could armor tank it and only be useful fighting amarr, and you'd probably still lose to any halfway decent fit HAC. ------------
Originally by: CCP Mitnal It's great being a puppetmaster
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Minigin
Ganja Labs
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Posted - 2008.03.26 01:23:00 -
[470]
Originally by: Goumindong
Originally by: Minigin
1. you openly admitted you dont fly nanos... so obviously you can tell me how hard they are to fly compared to other ships.
2. you then said they dont cost much. you are totally ********... my nanoishtar sets me back 3-400m excluding t2 drones that i have to replace.
3. battleclinic picks up your mails from the goonboard. As it does with all major alliances.
1. This if false.
2. Then you fit your ishtar like an idiot or spend way to much than you need. Assume 10m-20m for mods, 90m for the hull, and hell, lets estimate high, 90m for polycarbs, brings you to 190-200m.
half of your supposed cost.
Now fit out, say, an abaddon, 150m hull, 80m trimarks, 30m mods puts you back 250m, 300m after insurance payed, 150m after insurance received. Puts the final cost pretty close actually, especially since i didn't factor ammo in for the Abaddon and its more expensive than drones.
3. No it doesn't. For instance, its missing my last death in a rifter, and 3 full harbingers in qy6, probably more.
Its also missing about 95 kills since it seems logs pods in the main kill section.
As for the rest of it....
its a good thing i know what im talking about so i can prove you are lying through your teeth here.
1. this is true(see how easy it is to make unsubstantiated claims)
2. 100m for the hull, 20m for the mods, 120m for the polycarbs, 120m for the implants THAT IS YOUR COOKIE CUTTER SETUP! oh look at that... isnt that number between 300 and 400m! WOW YES IT IS!
Abbadon cost: 150m for the hull(but realisricaly with insurance the hull is worth 40m). 45m for 3 trimarks... i dont know where you got 80m... 30m mods.
best part is you think the abbadons ammo costs more than drones... you buy the abbadons ammo once... and never again replace it till you die... i have to ******* pay 10m on drones ever time i want to go out pvping. You are a HUGE noob who doesnt know what he is talking about.
look at that... 1/3 the cost.
please provide me with a link to your kills and losses so i can laugh at you more. . MINIGIN! Now bringing colour back to these forums =)
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techzer0
IDLE GUNS
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Posted - 2008.03.26 01:25:00 -
[471]
Originally by: Goumindong
Now fit out, say, an abaddon, 150m hull, 80m trimarks, 30m mods puts you back 250m, 300m after insurance payed, 150m after insurance received. Puts the final cost pretty close actually, especially since i didn't factor ammo in for the Abaddon and its more expensive than drones.
Oh no, you have 200+ kills...
If you're paying full price for Abaddons, maybe you should look at your corp/alliance and ask why you're flying for them. I buy the majority of T1 ships I fly at cost and I'm definitely not in a large corp or even an alliance. ------------
Originally by: CCP Mitnal It's great being a puppetmaster
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Goumindong
Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.26 01:27:00 -
[472]
Originally by: techzer0 I want to see you tank a vagabond. It doesn't have the cap or the pg/cpu to be anywhere near comparable to tanked HACs like the Zealot, Deimos, Muninn, Eagle, Cerb, Ishtar, or Sacrilege.
Sure you could shield tank it with it's high resists, but sacrifice any usefulness as a tackler, or you could armor tank it and only be useful fighting amarr, and you'd probably still lose to any halfway decent fit HAC.
That was the point. Saying that curses, rapiers, and huginns aren't nano ships is very similar to saying that the vagabond isn't a nano ship.
Also, about a third of the ships you listed there actually tank worse than a vagabond.
Vote Goumindong for CSM |
Labienus
Aliastra
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Posted - 2008.03.26 01:28:00 -
[473]
ECCM fitted logistics ships/projected eccm. Plus remote reps on BS etc(helpful?) Interceptor, faster than a Hac..My crow goes 6kms and 9km/s with overheat, unrigged and t2 fitted. Fly at nano ship. Activate Point, Activate Web(with logsitics remote reps helping you) nano ship slows down...gets hit by guns...dies..Rinse, Repeat.
Will make your interceptors last longer, if you are smart and many logisitics have good remote rep range.
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Minigin
Ganja Labs
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Posted - 2008.03.26 01:30:00 -
[474]
Edited by: Minigin on 26/03/2008 01:31:39
Originally by: Labienus ECCM fitted logistics ships/projected eccm. Plus remote reps on BS etc(helpful?) Interceptor, faster than a Hac..My crow goes 6kms and 9km/s with overheat, unrigged and t2 fitted. Fly at nano ship. Activate Point, Activate Web(with logsitics remote reps helping you) nano ship slows down...gets hit by guns...dies..Rinse, Repeat.
Will make your interceptors last longer, if you are smart and many logisitics have good remote rep range.
OH LOOK! A CHEEP AND EFFECTIVE TACTIC THAT ISNT BLOBBING!!!! THIS MUST NOT BE DOABLE!!! I INSIST THAT NANOS ARE NERFED BECAUSE THEY ARE TOOOOOOOOOO OVERPOWERED! LULULULL!
Look at how easy it is to counter nano tactics people... dont delude yourselves that you have a tactic when going up against nanohac gangs when you just type in alliance gang x - defence op then undock and sit in a group with your friends in whatever you have left in your hanger...
THAT IS NOT A TACTIC! THAT IS WHY YOU LOSE! . MINIGIN! Now bringing colour back to these forums =)
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Ulstan
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2008.03.26 01:32:00 -
[475]
Quote: And last time I checked it was just a game you know...
I agree. Therefore, lets give nanofaggotry a good stiff nerfing to make the game a more fun place.
And I mean, who would complain about the nerfing? Afterall, it's just a game...
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Daelin Blackleaf
Naqam
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Posted - 2008.03.26 01:33:00 -
[476]
Heres the thing:
According to recent interviews (ref: Alliance Tournament extra's) nano-ships are being looked at for a nerf. CCP's solution thus far is to lump all speed affecting modules, rigs, etc under one stacking penalty bringing the days of the nano-HAC pretty much to a close.
However this solution does not addressthe related issues that could be looked into at the same time such as webs and the poor state of actual speed-tanking.
So instead of trying to justify what is almost undoubtedly going to get nerfed sooner or later would it not be more constructive to discuss the solution CCP currently plans to implement and suggest alternatives if (like myself) you don't feel theirs is the ideal solution?
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Minigin
Ganja Labs
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Posted - 2008.03.26 01:34:00 -
[477]
Originally by: Ulstan
Quote: And last time I checked it was just a game you know...
I agree. Therefore, lets give nanofaggotry a good stiff nerfing to make the game a more fun place.
And I mean, who would complain about the nerfing? Afterall, it's just a game...
if that is Caldari Provisions official stance on the matter then i suppose CCP will be forced to listen to this compelling and well thought out argument. . MINIGIN! Now bringing colour back to these forums =)
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Goumindong
Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.26 01:34:00 -
[478]
Edited by: Goumindong on 26/03/2008 01:34:09 1. Yes, you are making unsubstantiated claims...
2. You are getting ripped off for polycarbs and implants[which you don't need and are just as expensive as those for an abaddon]. Well, that or you have found a 3 rig slot ishtar that no one else has.
Originally by: Minigin
best part is you think the abbadons ammo costs more than drones... you buy the abbadons ammo once... and never again replace it till you die... i have to ******* pay 10m on drones ever time i want to go out pvping. You are a HUGE noob who doesnt know what he is talking about.
No really they do. Oh no, 10m in drones every time you go out, its about 30m for ammo on average, and if the argument is that the abaddon replaces it when it dies, then the question is how often does the Abaddon die and how often does the ishtar die?
Quote:
look at that... 1/3 the cost. - best part is... you can perma tank most ishtar damage in an abbadon. so you want ballance? nerf the abbadons tank a little... or make drones un-shootable.
I would love to see an abaddon that can perma tank anything. The guns alone use more cap than a t2 lar.
Originally by: techzer0
If you're paying full price for Abaddons, maybe you should look at your corp/alliance and ask why you're flying for them. I buy the majority of T1 ships I fly at cost and I'm definitely not in a large corp or even an alliance.
That is at cost. Full empire price is higher.
Vote Goumindong for CSM |
Goumindong
Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.26 01:38:00 -
[479]
Originally by: Labienus ECCM fitted logistics ships/projected eccm. Plus remote reps on BS etc(helpful?) Interceptor, faster than a Hac..My crow goes 6kms and 9km/s with overheat, unrigged and t2 fitted. Fly at nano ship. Activate Point, Activate Web(with logsitics remote reps helping you) nano ship slows down...gets hit by guns...dies..Rinse, Repeat.
Will make your interceptors last longer, if you are smart and many logisitics have good remote rep range.
Nano ship burns away from your mwd as it approaches. Activates guns and sets drones on you. Crow pops in 3-5 seconds. Nano ship leaves.
You get within web range, by now you are long out of battleship range, sets drones on crow, burns away, and if fitting neuts, neuts crow. Crow disengages, nano ship dictates range, crow pops, nano ship leaves.
Logistics won't keep an inty alive, volley damage will run through its entire hit point spectrum before you can rep it.
Vote Goumindong for CSM |
Minigin
Ganja Labs
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Posted - 2008.03.26 01:42:00 -
[480]
Edited by: Minigin on 26/03/2008 01:43:22
Originally by: Goumindong Edited by: Goumindong on 26/03/2008 01:34:09 1. Yes, you are making unsubstantiated claims...
2. You are getting ripped off for polycarbs and implants[which you don't need and are just as expensive as those for an abaddon]. Well, that or you have found a 3 rig slot ishtar that no one else has.
Originally by: Minigin
best part is you think the abbadons ammo costs more than drones... you buy the abbadons ammo once... and never again replace it till you die... i have to ******* pay 10m on drones ever time i want to go out pvping. You are a HUGE noob who doesnt know what he is talking about.
No really they do. Oh no, 10m in drones every time you go out, its about 30m for ammo on average, and if the argument is that the abaddon replaces it when it dies, then the question is how often does the Abaddon die and how often does the ishtar die?
Quote:
look at that... 1/3 the cost. - best part is... you can perma tank most ishtar damage in an abbadon. so you want ballance? nerf the abbadons tank a little... or make drones un-shootable.
I would love to see an abaddon that can perma tank anything. The guns alone use more cap than a t2 lar.
Originally by: techzer0
If you're paying full price for Abaddons, maybe you should look at your corp/alliance and ask why you're flying for them. I buy the majority of T1 ships I fly at cost and I'm definitely not in a large corp or even an alliance.
That is at cost. Full empire price is higher.
a non-polyed non-implanted ishtar gets under 3.2km/s do you know what that means? it can get hit pretty hard by most guns. you are barely outrunning most missles... now try and aligning out... without the polys your 4s warp time is now at 7. uh oh...
Stop claiming stupid things about a ship you have never had to fit or fly in your life.
I can fly nearly every single ship in this game... and i have! i ******* know what the fitting prices are and what has a higher chance of dieing and all that jazz.
if your not an idiot in your abbadon and cycle stuff rather than run your own cap dry... you should never die to an ishtar... but instead most morons like yourself fire all the guns and hope they kill their enemy before their cap runs out... rather than conserve tank and get help from friends.
You are clearly not a pvper... do not comment on things that do not concern you. Lets face it... when was the last time you actually sat down and asked yourself "hmmm how can i counter a nano gang"... you havnt... and its not ccps job to help you avoid having to do that. . MINIGIN! Now bringing colour back to these forums =)
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