Not going to happen. CCP says that "innocent" systems are fair game for TiDi. Translated: We can't fix it - htfu

These are not innocent. These are systems of a highly frequented travel route with 50+ pilots in space and 1000+ jumps/hour each.

TiDi is a new feature and apparently still needs some tweaking.

I would say that the OP made a good call.

thats the point of this solution ?

Petition CCP. They said it, not me.

sorry we were busy killing -A-, engre and solar alongside ncdot and pl

we are very sorry that our insignificant 1000 man battle disrupted your mining activities

was travelling from Caldari space through Gallente and TiDi just makes the game absolutely unplayable , its takes 5 minutes to jump from 1 system to another

TiDi @ 10 for at least a dozen system i went through, it takes ages to move anywhere

To fix battle lag in 0.0, people nowhere near those systems have to lag to hell as well ?? thats the point of this solution ?

we ended the battle as soon as we saw this thread, we agreed to fight at a later date as to not disrupt gorenaire's gameplay

There is nothing CCP can do about this situation right now. There is no code to allow node loading on the fly. To move the systems to different nodes they would have to take down the entire cluster. That is not an option.

Well if TiDi is supposed to solve lag problem in a system due to lots of people in it and it creates tons of lag in a dozen others systems, what kind of solution is that ?

Well if TiDi is supposed to solve lag problem in a system due to lots of people in it and it creates tons of lag in a dozen others systems, what kind of solution is that ?

It solves crashing and stuff like that. You like being unable to load grid?

Didn't used to get blackscreens from jumping in Empire when there was big battles going on in Low and Null so whats your point? Since Gorenaire was in Empire at the time and well away from the fight.

Except when 0.0 fleet fights took down the whole cluster due to someone on command channel saying " we should 'jump' to this system. " and half the fleet jumps and the rest has to jump into the system as fast as possible.

Yes, that, never took the cluster down, ever.

Well if TiDi is supposed to solve lag problem in a system due to lots of people in it and it creates tons of lag in a dozen others systems, what kind of solution is that ?

It's a bit weird 0.0 systems share nodes with empire systems. Wouldn't it make more sense to have 0.0 systems share only nodes with themselves? Because whenever one hits TiDi, the chance of other well-populated empire systems to be effected seem smaller to me, and vice versa causing more TiDi. Except perhaps some big null HQ systems, but CCP knows which ones those are.

was travelling from Caldari space through Gallente and TiDi just makes the game absolutely unplayable , its takes 5 minutes to jump from 1 system to another

TiDi @ 10 for at least a dozen system i went through, it takes ages to move anywhere

To fix battle lag in 0.0, people nowhere near those systems have to lag to hell as well ?? thats the point of this solution ?

Well if TiDi is supposed to solve lag problem in a system due to lots of people in it and it creates tons of lag in a dozen others systems, what kind of solution is that ?

TiDi does what its supposed to do very well, granted, but why on earth does it have to affect people that are in no way shape or form connected or even close to the trigger?

was travelling from Caldari space through Gallente and TiDi just makes the game absolutely unplayable , its takes 5 minutes to jump from 1 system to another

TiDi @ 10 for at least a dozen system i went through, it takes ages to move anywhere

To fix battle lag in 0.0, people nowhere near those systems have to lag to hell as well ?? thats the point of this solution ?

Didn't used to get blackscreens from jumping in Empire when there was big battles going on in Low and Null so whats your point? Since Gorenaire was in Empire at the time and well away from the fight.

If you two had paid any attention to the technical details behind how the EVE cluster works, then you would know exactly why this happened.

A good one since it lets you travel through those systems rather than show you nothing and/or just dump you to the login screen.

If CCP has thought about the natural evolution of the game in the beginning the implementation wouldn't have been so bashed together that it wouldn't take 50 man-year to fix it.

TiDi is a good system for creating an artificial fine-grained lag and to delay the moment of death for a node, but it does not reduce lag nor does it avoid bad node planning. It only indicates, visualises and manages lag. It even can lure you into thinking that it could be used to reduce lag, which it cannot do and makes it more dangerous than helpful.

TiDi is a good system for creating an artificial fine-grained lag

it does not reduce lag nor does it avoid bad node planning.

It then seems dumb to me not to anticipate spikes in systems where there is already a regular flow of players going through and while one cannot use jump drives in high-sec. These systems are bound to become bottlenecks. TiDi does not change this it seems. So what good is it?

It has absolutely nothing to do with creating "fine-grained lag", the purpose of TiDi is graceful degradation.

No. It does not create lag. It create graceful degradation of node performance in high-lag situation by altering the speed of the local world simulation to reduce the number of server calls to manageable levels.

You can only have GÇ£node planningGÇ¥ if you know what the nodes will be used for. In a dynamic environment, that's pretty much impossible, so GÇ£avoidingGÇ¥ it is just as impossible as planning it is to begin with.

That is exactly what an artificial fine-grained lag does.

It is not a real improvement but merely an early warning system.

Yes, it does exactly that. I slows your client down.

Sure, but these systems are known travel systems.

It does not GÇ£create artifical lagGÇ¥ (fine-grained or otherwise). It ensures that the lag that already exists doesn't make server calls get lost in the processing queue by slowing down how quickly they can enter that queue.

No, it's an actual improvement, and not a warning system. It ensures that high lag doesn't immediately cause people to get lost in the server processing.

GǪwhich isn't the same thing as lag. Quite the opposite. Lag means it takes longer for things to repond, or maybe ...

There's also no way to tell if one supposedly low-load system will suddenly go into high-gear because someone chooses to do something particularly spectacular there.

What causes the lag? It is too many clients sending too many request to a node. So clients are being slowed down. The lag is moved artificially onto the clients

No. It does not eliminate the problem, it stretches it out.

Does your client not take longer to respond when TiDi is active? I think it does.

But when you do know that some systems are frequently visited should this be taken into account. Do you disagree?

"I like to create posts and complain about stuff I have no clue about and couldn't be arsed to research well before wasting everyone's time.
Oh and I suck".

Quote from OP, true story.

The lag is not GÇ¥movedGÇ¥ GÇö the clients are not lagging more just because there's TiDi. They are actually most of the time responding much more quickly than before ...

GǪlike I said, an improvement, not a warning system.

Compared to how long it would take without TiDi?

For one, how do you know they aren't? For another, how will they use that information?

Yes, the clients do slow down and everything you do.

As I said, call it what you like.

No. Compared to no lag.

The question was, do you disagree? Yes or no?

GǪwhich isn't lag. It's slow-motion.

I call it a time-keeping device. It doesn't warn anyone of anything since there is nothing in it that indicates that there's any kind of problem.

GǪin other words, compared to how long it would take without TiDi. Yes, with TiDi, the client responds more quickly.

And I answered: it makes no difference in a dynamic environment.

Then, again, call it what you like.

You should read again what you wrote there.

The clients do not lag at all, with or without TiDi. As I said is it only an artificial lag, which is created on the client side. It is the node that fails to respond to the many clients.

Come on, you can do it: yes or no?

One way to solve this would be somekind of assist module for these nullsec puppies. For me this looks like they don't know how to play this game so they always need 1000+ ships to do simple stuff.

The "assist module" you refer to already exists; it's called "bring friends".

20 friends and their alts.

Slow-motion isn't lag.

Ok. Now what? There is still nothing about the TiDi meter that shows that something is going wrong.

I can and I did: it makes no difference in a dynamic environment. Your false dichotomy doesn't stop being false just because you repeat it.

The clients do not lag at all, with or without TiDi. As I said is it only an artificial lag, which is created on the client side. It is the node that fails to respond to the many clients.

Ask others and see what they say.

As I said does TiDi bear a danger. People might think they should just keep entering a system with TiDi, instead of taking notice of the warning they are being given and to avoid pushing TiDi to its limit.

There is nothing shameful about agree with me, Tippia.

I'm interested to know what concept of assist module would work when the other guys bring 1000 friends?

Well if TiDi is supposed to solve lag problem in a system due to lots of people in it and it creates tons of lag in a dozen others systems, what kind of solution is that ?

One way to solve this would be somekind of assist module for these nullsec puppies. For me this looks like they don't know how to play this game so they always need 1000+ ships to do simple stuff.

You might not realise it but huge fleet fights are fun, and they bring in new players who love the idea of warfare on that scale.

Do you have any idea what "lag" actually is?

They will say that slow-motion isn't lag.

What warning is that? All TiDi does in terms of showing stuff is say how slowly time is running.

Good thing that I don't have to worry about that, then.

Yes. I already described it above. It is when too many clients are making too many requests to a node. Your PC is not too slow, the node is.

How it isn't lag in this game if you complain about lag in Call of Duty if something similar slowness happens?

Yes. I already described it above. It is when too many clients are making too many requests to a node. Your PC is not too slow, the node is.

Typical narcissist.

Who likes to play when everything slows down?

All I want from you is a yes or a no.

How it isn't lag in this game if you complain about lag in Call of Duty if something similar slowness happens?

How it isn't lag in this game if you complain about lag in Call of Duty if something similar slowness happens?

So everything moves in slow motion in Call of Duty?

Because that usually isn't lag either, but choppy frame rate. What we're talking about is like the part at the end of CoD4, when you finally shoot ZakhaevGǪ the slow motion part. It's not very laggy.

Nope. That's not lag. Lag is a delay in response from you press a button till it does something.

I wouldn't say everything. Looks like you guys don't know what lag actually is.

Same thing, different description.

you're assuming the fight took place in nullsec - it didn't.

Same thing, different description.

But if it's only 20vs20 in reality. But yeah, works if new players don't know what alt means.

Lag in COD is when you press to fire, and it takes 150ms for it to actually fire, so the target has moved on. That's lag, because the response is lagging behind the request. TiDi is doing nothing of the sort.

So why undocking took 5 minutes yesterday? Or why I had to wait 3-5 minutes to get from system to system?

If that's not lag what it is?

When you people start to learn that network/server lag doesn't have anything to do with framerate or slowmotion.

So why undocking took 5 minutes yesterday? Or why I had to wait 3-5 minutes to get from system to system?

Same thing, different description.

However from a gameplay point of view, its a pretty poor decision for the people who have nothing to do with the reason why the node is having problem.

Of course it will improve laoding grid time etc etc for the people who are in"battle system" but why people who have the bad luck to fly by in systems who are on the same node should also suffer the consequences for something they have nothng to do with.

Its just an idea but when they do this TiDI, CCP could send some kind of "traffic warning "message telling the players, the list of systems affected by TiiDi, at least we could plan accordingly.

Come on, you can do it: yes or no?? Should CCP include information as how often systems are being visited into their planning or should they not?

So why undocking took 5 minutes yesterday? Or why I had to wait 3-5 minutes to get from system to system?

If that's not lag what it is?

It's 'time dilation'. Every system in the game is working as intended.

That was lag. But TiDi doesn't cause lag, it's there to mitigate the effects of lag. How hard can this possibly be to understand? Blaming TiDi for lag is like blaming traffic lights for traffic.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lag

So why do you keep saying that it's the same thing as TiDi's slow-motion effect?

So you agree, then, since ...

Anyone who's ever been in a big fleet fight. It's very very nice.

GǪand your false dichotomy ...

Again, I cannot agree with an idiotic opinion. You may like it, but you are not anyone.

Again, I cannot agree with an idiotic opinion. You may like it, but you are not anyone.

Same thing, different description.

Did it start undocking the second you hit undock? Yes? Then it responded in a timely fashion.

After clicking Undock I had to wait 5 minutes before my ship was outside of station before that I couldn't do anything. Well, spin my ship in hangar but that's it.

Compared to the previous alternative merely "slowed down" is incredibly much better.

Not that you care because you're just amusing yourself with your usual contrarian bullshit.

That is not the point. I am still comparing it to no lag at all. You want to compare it to before TiDi? Do it, but it is irrelevant for how TiDi works. I am not deny its usefulness. I said I see it as a work-around. You might want to reread the thread before you start spitting your hate over it.

You sir... are an idiot and let me help explain to you why you're an idiot.

Because how the lag presents itself does not matter to me.

I have no argument.

Again, I cannot agree with an idiotic opinion. You may like it, but you are not anyone.

Stop derailing the question.

That is not the point. I am still comparing it to no lag at all. You want to compare it to before TiDi? Do it, but it is irrelevant for how TiDi works. I am not deny its usefulness. I said I see it as a work-around. You might want to reread the thread before you start spitting your hate over it.

Thanks, but no thanks.

+Æf course it's a workaround. ...

But the undock process had commenced right? The UI acknowledged you had pressed the button?

That is not the point.

I am still comparing it to no lag at all.

Thank you.

Ignorance is bliss... right?

What is the alternative?

What is the alternative? Listening to insults from players who have not yet fully grasped what I am talking about and are only able to understand me after they spewed out their insults only to row back?

What is the alternative? Listening to insults from players who have not yet fully grasped what I am talking about and are only able to understand me after they spewed out their insults only to row back?

Everytime I tried to remove one storyline mission from journal I had to wait but nothing ever happened. All I got was "Soul-crushing lag" popup.

Which is reducing or eliminating the lag you're experiencing.

I agree that it can bee seen as such, but it cannot eliminate what is created by the players without the help of the players who need to see it as an early warning system and act accordingly.

You're saying "tidi causes lag", we're saying you're wrong.

Still not caused by TiDi.

I agree that it can bee seen as such, but it cannot eliminate what is created by the players without the help of the players who need to see it as an early warning system and act accordingly.

Why I get "soul-crushing lag" popup window then?

I agree that it can bee seen as such

No. I am saying that it moves the lag away from the server onto the client by creating an artificial lag on the client side.

There is not much different if TiDi slows down time or if I go blank for 5 minutes.

lag

That is not the point. I am still comparing it to no lag at all. You want to compare it to before TiDi? Do it, but it is irrelevant for how TiDi works. I am not deny its usefulness. I said I see it as a work-around. You might want to reread the thread before you start spitting your hate over it.

No. I am saying that it moves the lag away from the server onto the client by creating an artificial lag on the client side.

There is not much different if TiDi slows down time or if I go blank for 5 minutes. You will simply not get much done during that time.

Why I get "soul-crushing lag" popup window then?

No. I am saying that it moves the lag away from the server onto the client by creating an artificial lag on the client side.

There is not much different if TiDi slows down time or if I go blank for 5 minutes. You will simply not get much done during that time.

"Your request isn't as important, hold tight and make your request later."

I tried to remove it many time yesterday. It's still there.

Why I get "soul-crushing lag" popup window then?

It not only GÇ£can be seen as suchGÇ¥ GÇö it's what it actually does. What it doesn't do is act as a warning system, since it only kick in after something has happened.

It just slows the client (and server) simulations down.

GǪaside from TiDi letting you do things at close to normal responsiveness, whereas blackscreens let you do absolutely nothing at zero responsiveness, meaning TiDi lets you play the game, which is different in every way from a black screen.

Why compare it to no lag at all? That was never an option. Taking TiDi away doesn't take lag away.

But you have to remember, if TiDi wasn't kicking in you would likely not have loaded system. You would have black screened upon jump, and you'd be sitting in your chair wondering if you had crashed or not. You would likely not have been able to log back in, sometimes for hours.

But I'm sure that dozens of people have tried explaining this to you but you seem incapable of understandign that things could be worse than taking three minutes to warp from gate to gate.

There is not much different if TiDi slows down time or if I go blank for 5 minutes. You will simply not get much done during that time.

This is what a warning system does. Something happens and you get a warning.

An artificially created lag. The responses of your client become slower and slower as TiDi increases.

That's not lag.

That's not lag.

This is what a warning system does. Something happens and you get a warning.


An artificially created lag. The responses of your client become slower and slower as TiDi increases.


The difference this makes in terms of success and achievement within the game is hardly different. You can do things during a black screen, too. You can switch to a browser and post on the forum.

This is what a warning system does. Something happens and you get a warning.

An artificially created lag.

The difference this makes in terms of success and achievement within the game is hardly different.

But keep posting... it's good!

TiDi = slow motion

I want to see slow motion of my ship undocking. Gets a bit boring to watch my ship still in hangar after 7+ minutes.

That's not lag.

I want to see slow motion of my ship undocking. Gets a bit boring to watch my ship still in hangar after 7+ minutes.

Not caused by TiDi.

Lag is when your request gets lost.

How is it creating an artificial lag on the client side? Are you pressing any buttons and it isn't reacting?

So how I can undock now if TiDi isn't causing this? Do I have to change setting or what?



High latency doesn't cause lag?

TiDi is not high latency.

No, you said that lag is when server fails to respond when it doesn't know what client requested.

Lag would be if you send in the jump request and that request never gets processed.

Lag is when your request gets lost.

So how I can undock now if TiDi isn't causing this? Do I have to change setting or what?

GǪand TiDi doesn't do that. Also, if the warning comes afterwards, it's not early.

An artificially created lag.

The difference this makes in terms of success and achievement within the game is hardly different.

But keep posting... it's good!

Hey Whitehound! Why aren't you posting as Whitehound? Did you get muzzled due to your compulsive and incessant trolling again?

You as the player create requests and by interacting with the client, which sends them to the server. Lag means that you cannot send requests at a normal speed, but they are being slowed down. Either because they are being lost on the way and need to be resend, or they get queued up and their processing delayed. In the end does it slow you down.

With TiDi do you have no real lag, but you are still being slowed down. It creates the illusion of the universe slowing down, while it really only does so for the affected systems and not all of EVE. It does not slow down the node. The node itself simply cannot process requests faster (or slower) than before.

This illusion is what I call an artificial lag. It has a very similar effect to real lag. It only manages and warns players in a graceful way about the fact that the numbers of players connected to a node is increasing and the system is reaching is capacity.

You really, really don't understand what TiDi does, do you?

You as the player create requests and by interacting with the client, which sends them to the server. Lag means that you cannot send requests at a normal speed

With TiDi do you have no real lag, but you are still being slowed down.

It does not slow down the node.

It has a very similar effect to real lag.

It only manages and warns players in a graceful way

It warns from a growing lag.

The node responds more slowly. The client lets you rotate your camera only slowly, etc. Not "quite the opposite", or do you see your spaceship having an increased rate of fire? This would be quite the opposite.

This only means that it is not your success. And you are wrong to believe that TiDi lets you win a fight more often.

It warns from a growing lag.

The node responds more slowly.

This only means that it is not your success.

I got a 2 week ban for making jokes on gingers. Happens...

Why I'm still on station? 20+ minutes and waiting.

Oh, really? That's funny, the longest I've had to wait in a 10% dilated system was less than a minute. Granted, that was nullsec, but I doubt the code for moving your brain from one node to another is any different depending on security status.

Oh, really? That's funny, the longest I've had to wait in a 10% dilated system was less than a minute. Granted, that was nullsec, but I doubt the code for moving your brain from one node to another is any different depending on security status.

This is abit strange. I even click Undock every now and then just in case request got lost somewhere.

I almost forgot, on the "early warning system" nonsense...

It is not (and was never intended to be) a way to convince players to stop doing what they are doing because they are causing lag.

TiDi enables play to continue despite high lag conditions.

Quite a different thing.

No, not a different thing, only a different view.

You can ignore the warning of course and push TiDi all the way.

This is abit strange. I even click Undock every now and then just in case request got lost somewhere.

Well that wont be helping, as you're sending a new request every time you do that (and possibly? cancelling your old request)

Press it once, and go make some tea or something, mayby read a book? Heck, read about TiDi in the meantime, you might learn something

No, not a different thing, only a different view. You can ignore the warning of course and push TiDi all the way.

No, not a different thing, only a different view. You can ignore the warning of course and push TiDi all the way.

Incorrect.

No. There is no GÇ£stillGÇ¥ about it.

It slows down the simulation running on the node, yes.

It has pretty much none of the effects of lag

No. It slows down the server's simulation and syncs up the client's simulation so it does the same. It doesn't warn anyone since, on the client side, it's just a real-to-simulated-time-ratio meter. Again, it's still real lag. TiDi just removes the nasty effects of it by ensuring that the server doesn't get completely lost in that high-lag environment.

No not really.

No, no it really isn't a different view, and it really isn't a warning.

No. Your client often has to wait for a response and cannot send further requests until the server has processed the previous requests. Thus the requests send by the client are slowing down, meaning, the client is sending less requests.

Yes, you, the player, are still being slowed down regardless if you are experiencing real lag or TiDi. The node can only process so many client requests.

I am still talking of the node's ability to process requests.

If you cannot understand it this way then ask yourself if the node has gotten faster in its ability to process requests when TiDi is active.

You are free to ignore it. It still warns you about your game slowing down. If you enjoy it or find it pretty is entirely up to you. Maybe you are slow and the game has got too many buttons for you and like a slower game. Everyone is different. I see it as a warning system.

You are free to ignore it. It still warns you about your game slowing down. If you enjoy it or find it pretty is entirely up to you. Maybe you are slow and the game has got too many buttons for you and like a slower game. Everyone is different.

Wait, what? My client has to wait for a response because of TiDi? Since when?

That has nothing to do with lag. Slowing down the server-side simulation reduces lag.

No, you have to wait. TiDi slows down time.

This is what it has to do with lag.

No, you have to wait. TiDi slows down time.


This is what it has to do with lag.

Its not a warning, its a response.

was travelling from Caldari space through Gallente and TiDi just makes the game absolutely unplayable , its takes 5 minutes to jump from 1 system to another

TiDi @ 10 for at least a dozen system i went through, it takes ages to move anywhere

To fix battle lag in 0.0, people nowhere near those systems have to lag to hell as well ?? thats the point of this solution ?

Most warnings are a response.

You may wonder what a road sign for a train crossing is a response to. It is a response to people not wanting to get others killed by trains and so they put up a sign to warn you of crossing trains. It does not mean that everyone will get killed who crosses the track. You may see a no-parking sign as a punishment, but it really is a warning for you not to park there. You can try to park there for a short time and may not get a fine. Same with TiDi. It warns you about the node getting close to its limit. You are not really in control of who else enters a system and so may decide to leave it.

It is only smart to take it as a warning. You may not be part of a fight in which case you would only do others, who are fighting, a favour by leaving the system.

So the gates to a system with TiDi enabled tells me that I'm about to jump into a system which is on the same node as a system where there's a big fight going on?

So what you're saying is, a warp taking longer is "lag"?

So tidi is bad because it reduces lag.

Sort of. It is the same, but it is not identical. To get from A to B during real lag with everything taking 30 minutes to respond is the same as looking at the warp animation during TiDi for 30 minutes. It still takes 30 minutes to get from A to B.

Instead of having a real lag, caused by the node's inability to process all requests are the clients being slowed down in order to send less requests. The difference between a real lag and an artificial lag is simply a technical one where the real lag is caused by hardware limits and the artificial lag is caused by a limiting software.

No. It is better than a disconnect, but it is only a work-around and when players do not take it as a warning is it of little use. Better would be to have faster hardware.

Sort of. It is the same, but it is not identical. To get from A to B during real lag with everything taking 30 minutes to respond is the same as looking at the warp animation during TiDi for 30 minutes. It still takes 30 minutes to get from A to B.

Instead of having a real lag, caused by the node's inability to process all requests are the clients being slowed down in order to send less requests. The difference between a real lag and an artificial lag is simply a technical one where the real lag is caused by hardware limits and the artificial lag is caused by a limiting software.

No. It is better than a disconnect, but it is only a work-around and when players do not take it as a warning is it of little use. Better would be to have faster hardware.

Uhhmm fun thread....

I might have misunderstood this completely but isn't the idea behind TiDi to no slow down request resolving but slowdown the simulation.

So in essence the server uses more time to respond to request instead of recalculating the location of all ships and such things?

So all your requests are handled in time as they should. To do this it uses less time to update the simulation calculating positions, movements and events(such as missile explosions).

To do this the server simple does the simulation calculation less frequent. At normal time the server runs the simulation calculation 1 time every second I think. With TiDi it does this less and less often up to some point.

The result is that all the things you see goes slower but you requests are handled in time.

I think I said the same as most other people but maybe with a few different words, hope ti helps someone....

So the gates to a system with TiDi enabled tells me that I'm about to jump into a system which is on the same node as a system where there's a big fight going on?

OP has seen TiDi on a travel route, which at the time had 50-80 players in them. The map did not show a high count of destroyed ships for these systems but in two nearby systems.

Possibly, but I do not now all the details and have to deduct from what I see. What I see is that not all of EVE gets to see the message and so it has to be restricted to some systems. OP has seen TiDi on a travel route, which at the time had 50-80 players in them. The map did not show a high count of destroyed ships for these systems but in two nearby systems.

Well if TiDi is supposed to solve lag problem in a system due to lots of people in it and it creates tons of lag in a dozen others systems, what kind of solution is that ?

I didn't notice much in the way of TiDi, but I DID notice a good amount of lag. Namely from the client using WAY more memory than usual.

Srsly. I used to be able to run firefox, skype, and trillian in the background. Now I get hangups while loading rooms full of rats, and 1.5gb RAM usage by EVE when I alt-tab and go to task manager to see wtf is sucking all the memory.

The client got bigger with Escalation, the graphics became more resource heavy and its generally taxes the computer. I used to be able to run two accounts with a browser up and use close to full settings. Those days are over, if I have two accounts on with crayola settings spinning in station eats enough processor that pandora starts skipping and glitching.

Oh well, considering this box is a Core 2 Duo I built in like 2006.....it was a good run, its going to becomes the media file server for the house now and a bunch of boxes full of shiny new parts are on the way.