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Get 1500 DPS out of your Megathron - and turn some heads

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Titan Pilot Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2009.07.06 11:20:00 - [31] Nice post and interesting approach. I must admit when I saw no web I was a bit surprised but if it works then props to you. Pay no attention to the negative replies attacking your credibility. This is the right place for discussing this fit. I hope you pop that can flipper. If I was online I would come for his pod and take the sec hit. Cheers.
fkingfurious	Posted - 2009.07.06 11:22:00 - [32] No MWD !?!?!?!?1 Are you ****ing serious? Anyone with even the tiniest amount of intelligence (apparently not you) knows that getting close to a Megathron is really really dumb, so everyone is gonna use their MWD (cos everyone except you will have one fitted) to try and keep distance. They'll probably be a bit confused to start with about why your Mega is flapping about at 400m/s like some kind of insane, drunk, beached elephant seal and then the penny will drop. After the guffaws subside your fail ship will get crushed by absolutely anything that can hit outside 15 or so KM. Pro-tip: Thats anything that isnt you.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.07.06 11:23:00 - [33] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa That's solid. Considering the size of my charge is 400m and he is only about 160, that means that I was doing 160/400, or 40% of my maximum theoretical damage. I've got a nasty feeling that you don't understand tracking...
Siigari Kitawa Gallente The Aduro Protocol	Posted - 2009.07.06 11:37:00 - [34] Edited by: Siigari Kitawa on 06/07/2009 11:38:37 Originally by: Gypsio III Originally by: Siigari Kitawa That's solid. Considering the size of my charge is 400m and he is only about 160, that means that I was doing 160/400, or 40% of my maximum theoretical damage. I've got a nasty feeling that you don't understand tracking... I've got a nasty feeling you're wrong... If you are sitting still and your target is moving, if your gun tracks at 0.1 rad/sec and your target is moving at a speed that is 0.1 rad/s or slower, your gun can track the target. If the radial speed of the target is higher than you then the gun cannot keep up and will not hit the target. When you and your target are both moving, transversal velocity is taken into account. Transversal is just a measurement of movement against you. If you are moving parallel to a target at the same speed, your transversal velocity is 0. If you are moving perpendicular to your target, your transversal velocity becomes higher than closer your target comes to you along a perpendicular approach. \| \| \| \|<--------O low transversal \| \|<---X high transversal \| \| V As for signature, your weapon has a signature depending on the size of the weapon. If the signature of the weapon is larger than the signature of the target, there is a chance you will miss. Think of signature as surface area or volume occupying a space. There is more surface area with a larger signature, and less with a small signature. If my gun is 400m and the target is 100m, I have a 1 in 4 chance of landing a "good" hit on my target. As the shot approaches the outside of the signature (from 100 to 400) I will begin to do less damage. 5(4(3(2(1 o ) ) ) ) The 5 is always going to be a miss. The 4 is a grazing shot, doing little damage but still registering a hit at 25%. The 3 has 50% of the shot hitting the target, the 2 has 75%, the 1 is a dead on blow at 100%. Consider it like this: target: 200m "o" ( ( o ) ) my gun: 400m "O" ( ( o( )( )( ( O ) ) ) ) That shot would be a 50% hit, as 50% of the shot is affecting the surface area of the target. The entire concept behind my idea involves hitting the target more often, by signature or tracking. The TD is an idea that worked really well on my Dominix because I could fit two. Now I am attempting to adapt my idea to encompass a variety of targets. It's a work in progress, but I hope to be seeing it put to work soon. www.siigarikitawa.com ò www.quafeultra.com ò Buy a GTC
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2009.07.06 11:47:00 - [35] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa If you are moving perpendicular to your target, your transversal velocity becomes higher than closer your target comes to you along a perpendicular approach. when you are in perpendicular motion the transversial velocity is ALWAYS the other ships velocity. the angular velocity (aka what your guns use) will increase as they get closer or decrease as they get farther away.
Furb Killer Gallente	Posted - 2009.07.06 11:47:00 - [36] A BS can do full damage on a cruiser actually. Signature radius only affects tracking of turret based ships, not max dps.
Sera Ryskin	Posted - 2009.07.06 11:48:00 - [37] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa I've got a nasty feeling you're wrong... I've got a nasty feeling he's right, you *don't* understand tracking. Your tracking speed is NOT an on/off line where below it you do full damage, and above it you do zero. At transversal = tracking speed, you do some partial percentage of your full dps (IIRC, it's 50%, but don't quote me on that), with a falloff-like curve above and below that point (so you start to take a small damage reduction at any non-zero transversal, and you can do a tiny bit of dps even well above your tracking speed). The ratio of gun sig radius to target sig radius then acts as a multiplier on the damage reduction from transversal, the higher the target's sig relative to the gun sig, the less damage reduction you get (and the reverse, lower target sig radius = more damage reduction at the same transversal). Note that it's a multiplier, so, for example, if transversal is zero, no matter what the target's signature is, it takes full damage (the classic example of insta-popping an interceptor with a battleship). ========== Merin is currently enjoying a 14 day vacation from the forums. Until she returns, you've got me to entertain you!
Murtific Caldari Ore Mongers BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2009.07.06 11:49:00 - [38] My apoc will pwn ur mega with less DPS xD
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.07.06 11:51:00 - [39] Your tracking explanation is almost incomprehensible, but it seems that you're suggesting that a turret of sig res 400 m can never do full damage against a target with sig radius 160 m, because damage is reduced by sig radius/turret res, hence 160/400. But tracking doesn't work like that.
Sturmwolke Genyosha Legion	Posted - 2009.07.06 12:18:00 - [40] Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton Originally by: Sturmwolke Edited by: Sturmwolke on 06/07/2009 10:59:20 No web? on a Mega? Now one would think a web would lower transversal even more, never mind the tracking. you did notice the comparable tracking to medium blasters right? and if they can hit you, then you can hit them back, tracking goes both ways remember So what will happen if the Brutix was to also slap 2 Metastasis rigs and its pilot also gobbles up a std Drop booster, and then let's just say doubled-webbed the Mega during engagement?
Vrabac Zawa's Fan Club	Posted - 2009.07.06 12:24:00 - [41] Originally by: Sera Ryskin Err, why exactly was the Thorax orbiting at 2500m instead of 500m? Try running your test again, with a Thorax pilot who knows what he's doing. And what is your plan for when you get tackled by an inty at 25km, and he calls in his friend in an Armageddon at 45km? You know, since you don't have a MWD. Fitting a mega with specific purpose to kill a thorax is just as silly as asking "what if" and then quote a hopeless situation where mega dies no matter what.
RedSplat Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.07.06 12:26:00 - [42] People really need to stop relying on EFT much and actually get some experience Originally by: CCP Mitnal I don't sleep. I am always here. Watching. Waiting. Originally by: CCP Mitnal it does get progressively longer.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.07.06 12:29:00 - [43] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa 0.12697 is Neutron Blaster Cannon on steroids. That's better than the 0.125 tracking that a Brutix has with Heavy Neutron Blasters, and almost as good as the 0.1375 tracking it would have with Ion Blasters. Dunno if it's worth the extra cash but could be worth looking into if you want to add that extra punch. Yeah, you don't understand tracking. Even if both NBC and HNB both have the same tracking "numbers", the HNB tracks 3.2 times better than the NBC.
Rastigan Caldari Ars ex Discordia GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.07.06 12:36:00 - [44] Originally by: Sera Ryskin Err, why exactly was the Thorax orbiting at 2500m instead of 500m? Try running your test again, with a Thorax pilot who knows what he's doing. I've never had too much luck orbiting a BS at 500m with a cruiser, 2500m seemed like I got hit less just due to orbiting speed/bumping reasons.
Inaki Jouzu	Posted - 2009.07.06 12:37:00 - [45] The discussion is moot because by the time you have burned to the target the amarr players will have already killed the target...this is why most megas I see in gangs use 350mm rails and sentry drones instead of blasters these days. There are very few situations where pure point blank DPS will win against medium range turrets outside of theoretical 1v1's on Sisi.
Lubomir Penev Dark Nexxus	Posted - 2009.07.06 12:48:00 - [46] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Tracking w/ Standard Drop: 0.12093 (!) [...] Okay. Here it is... and I have to say this is pretty nuts. For starters, if you are in a Brutix with 7 Heavy Neutron Blasters, your tracking is 0.125. That means that you are throwing battleship DPS at a cruiser and HITTING IT -- even while in orbit with your afterburner on. Hint for the innumerate : the gun signature resolution acts as a modifier to tracking... 400m for the Mega, 125m for the Brutix, guess who tracks better... -- 081014 : emoragequit, char transfered to a friend, 090317 : back to original owner blog
Lubomir Penev Dark Nexxus	Posted - 2009.07.06 12:55:00 - [47] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa That's solid. Considering the size of my charge is 400m and he is only about 160, that means that I was doing 160/400, or 40% of my maximum theoretical damage. If I was doing say, 100%, those shots (in theory) would be registering for around 2300. LOL missed that... you are the absolute dumbest waste of DNA to ever have graced those forums, you make Pteranodon look smart. Hint : http://wiki.eve-id.net/Tracking Please understand it before you ever post again, enroll in high school if you have to. Sig resolution of guns is only ever used in the tracking formula to calculate hit probabilities, if the hit lands damage is then calculated from ammunition, damage mod and hit quality... -- 081014 : emoragequit, char transfered to a friend, 090317 : back to original owner blog
Hatsumi Kobayashi Caldari Corporation 12345 Minor Threat.	Posted - 2009.07.06 13:01:00 - [48] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa That's solid. Considering the size of my charge is 400m and he is only about 160, that means that I was doing 160/400, or 40% of my maximum theoretical damage. If I was doing say, 100%, those shots (in theory) would be registering for around 2300. Turrets be missiles ITT. ______
Traderboz SlaveMart	Posted - 2009.07.06 13:14:00 - [49] This thread entertains. Dude posts a Mega setup with OMGDPS in EFT and boasts it can kill a Thorax. After looking at his setup, I'm not convinced he could kill a well-flown Thorax, or anything else for that matter that didn't start at point-blank range. He then goes on to explain tracking in a very long, poorly written post, only to discover he doesn't understand how tracking works to begin with. I also like the pricy implants he's using to get his EFT DPS, but I guess those are viable if you only fly in low sec.
Enden Assulu Caldari Blood Money Inc.	Posted - 2009.07.06 13:20:00 - [50] I like these threads, were Siigari posts some trash, Merin then comes in and there are lols. Click the image!
fivetide humidyear Gallente The Avalon Foundation	Posted - 2009.07.06 13:43:00 - [51] useful thread siigari looking like a muppet (again) and some useful posts pointing out where he went wrong and how tracking actually works in eve. i'm surprised you haven't added more faction to your setup in the OP though.
Myra2007 Shafrak Industries	Posted - 2009.07.06 13:47:00 - [52] It probably has been mentioned a few times by now but i will spell it out because it's fun: OWNED . -- Originally by: Jasper Dark I agree! Lets go back into caves and lick rocks!
kyrv	Posted - 2009.07.06 13:51:00 - [53] Afterburner works well on some ships doesn't need to be mwd unlike megathron a typhoon it has low sig which you want to keep and keep a fast orbit maintaining cap for long periods if your not needing to correct mistakes with a mwd (and create many more) i.e your unapart from fleet low sec ganking then its pretty obvious
Shinnen Caldari Northern Intelligence	Posted - 2009.07.06 14:27:00 - [54] Edited by: Shinnen on 06/07/2009 14:31:54 As for the heavy neut argument, when you're shooting with your mega you're going to have only 3 cap draining things: 1. Damage Control II - negligible 2. Warp Scram - also somewhat negligible (if you're out of cap this is the least of your worries. 3. Your guns. All this can easily be kept running under 1 or 2 heavy neuts with a t2 heavy injector. This is the setup I use to great success. [Megathron, neutron gank passive] Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I True Sansha Adaptive Nano Plating Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Damage Control II Quad LiF Fueled I Booster Rockets Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800 Sensor Booster II, Scan Resolution Warp Disruptor II (scram if need be) Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L [empty high slot] Trimark Armor Pump I Trimark Armor Pump I Trimark Armor Pump I Ogre II x5 1100 EFT DPS with my skills. ~111000 EFT EHP with my skills Again, my initial point; is 400 extra DPS worth it for more susceptibility to neuts, slower speed and less EHP? Not for me. EDIT: Also, no EFT-warrior implants required, this is a 100% tried and tested ship.
NeoTheo Dark Materials	Posted - 2009.07.06 16:09:00 - [55] Usually i want to punch merin in the face, but right now, he is 100% right, no MWD = BAD. no web = BAD. (and this has nothing to do with tracking, mainly range). secondly, given your running a AB, why the cap booster? you should be able to gank something in the time it takes to capout, except against neut-setups. if you were gonna go with your comedy setup, id have to say, AB / web / Point / TD (if you really had to put one of these one). ether way, dont try to fix this setup, just swap if for a better one. cause even with the above setup modifications, your setup is still terribad. Dark Materials
Mag's the united Negative Ten.	Posted - 2009.07.06 16:37:00 - [56] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa derp derp...... You really have no clue. Regards Mag's
Psiri	Posted - 2009.07.06 17:04:00 - [57] Mai gawd look at dem EFT numbers go wen we be gimpin 'n pimpin' our megaszz
Omarvelous Destry's Lounge Important Internet Spaceship League	Posted - 2009.07.06 18:48:00 - [58] Originally by: Inaki Jouzu The discussion is moot because by the time you have burned to the target the amarr players will have already killed the target...this is why most megas I see in gangs use 350mm rails and sentry drones instead of blasters these days. There are very few situations where pure point blank DPS will win against medium range turrets outside of theoretical 1v1's on Sisi. Call me crazy but I use null ammo at gates - works good enough. I leave rails for sniping. Also LOL @ OP fit. I won't lol at the lack of tracking knowledge - because the old tracking guide on this site was terrible at explaining it, and I made that mistake (albeit not facepalming in the forums quite as bad as what happened here). MWD + Point + Cap injector + Armor Tank + Blasters - thats how a Mega is fit. An afterburner getting you an AMAZING ~277-300ish m/s is lol - only to get worse when you're webbed. Closing even 10KM will take you close to a minute. If they're >20km from you add a minute of 0 dps you're doing with that fit. If you want ZOMG dps - fit a full rack of neutrons on a Hyp and slap on 3 mag stabs. Ignore the rep bonus because you'll never have the grid for a large rep with that setup. That setup would run circles around this poor OP - and its not a great setup... Important Internet Spaceship League Wants You
Emily Poast The Whipping Post	Posted - 2009.07.06 19:21:00 - [59] Originally by: Rastigan Originally by: Sera Ryskin Err, why exactly was the Thorax orbiting at 2500m instead of 500m? Try running your test again, with a Thorax pilot who knows what he's doing. I've never had too much luck orbiting a BS at 500m with a cruiser, 2500m seemed like I got hit less just due to orbiting speed/bumping reasons. I havent done the math, but recently it seems cruiser-sized Neutron Blasters dont hit for great damage orbiting at 500. In fact, they have real trouble. As this poster says, it needs to be a bit further out.
Ephemeron Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.07.06 19:59:00 - [60] overloading 7x large t2 guns is a very bad idea. It's good for the alpha strike, but not for actual dps

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