Originally by: Captian Conrad

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and for those who dont know about google web translator

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Originally by: Morveus

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Edited by: Morveus on 12/03/2010 11:41:43
http://www.4gamer.net/games/004/G000412/20100312052/

Chinese > English translation sucks a little

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Originally by: Taua Roqa

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i was waiting for the part where the tentacles raep her.

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Originally by: Dr Deadbolt

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I find this hilarious.

Here we have EVE a game with guys roleplaying big gonaded men fighting bravely for just causes ,fighting locals to expand their controlled territories, or fighting as pirates and bravely? imposing their will on others.

Now the end game appears to be EVE will become a game of men flouncing around in womans clothes asking if their bottoms look big.

Way to go "guys".

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Originally by: Evelgrivion

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Oh God, PhysX? Great, now everyone who owns an ATI card won't be able to VIEW the fabric worth a damn, because PhysX is a proprietary to NVidia API. It's deliberately crippled from ATI graphics cards, meaning anyone using one won't be able to see the fancy, flowing fabric. How much is Nvidia paying you guys under The Way It's Meant to Be Played to segregate your player base by graphics chip brand?

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Originally by: Evelgrivion

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Oh God, PhysX? Great, now everyone who owns an ATI card won't be able to VIEW the fabric worth a damn, because PhysX is a proprietary to NVidia API. It's deliberately crippled from ATI graphics cards, meaning anyone using one won't be able to see the fancy, flowing fabric. How much is Nvidia paying you guys under The Way It's Meant to Be Played to segregate your player base by graphics chip brand?

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Originally by: Malcanis

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Originally by: Evelgrivion

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Oh God, PhysX? Great, now everyone who owns an ATI card won't be able to VIEW the fabric worth a damn, because PhysX is a proprietary to NVidia API. It's deliberately crippled from ATI graphics cards, meaning anyone using one won't be able to see the fancy, flowing fabric. How much is Nvidia paying you guys under The Way It's Meant to Be Played to segregate your player base by graphics chip brand?

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You seem to care a lot about that fabric

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Originally by: Evelgrivion

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Oh God, PhysX? Great, now everyone who owns an ATI card won't be able to VIEW the fabric worth a damn, because PhysX is a proprietary to NVidia API.

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Originally by: Rakshasa Taisab

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Edited by: Rakshasa Taisab on 12/03/2010 15:01:20
DAMN YOU OP, YOU SAID CHINESE

So I decided to wait until an english article was release... but it turns out it's actually a Japanese article. Time wasted I could have spent reading it.

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Originally by: Ascuris Wurm

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You see, Incarna is really just a bet between 2 CCP executives as to whether they can get 200,000 guys to play with dolls. Who do you think will win?

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Quote:

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Disclaimer: All mentioned above contains my opinion and is therefore an absolute truth (for me anyway, my universe, muhahaha.....ok, done

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Originally by: sg3s

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If CCP would be nice they'd tease us with a like a 10 second clip with this stuff... Though I know why they probably don't want this to get out too soon... In development stuff can look awesome but these things are often 'too' good, they require a lot of resources and heavy PCs to run them, maybe not in this case but it comes down to not dissapointing people by setting expectations.

...

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Originally by: Ascuris Wurm

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You see, Incarna is really just a bet between 2 CCP executives as to whether they can get 200,000 guys to play with dolls. Who do you think will win?

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Originally by: Deviana Sevidon

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The 200k Internet tough guys who get their dolls are of course the winners. Next questions.

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Originally by: Hakaru Ishiwara

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Originally by: sg3s

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If CCP would be nice they'd tease us with a like a 10 second clip with this stuff... Though I know why they probably don't want this to get out too soon... In development stuff can look awesome but these things are often 'too' good, they require a lot of resources and heavy PCs to run them, maybe not in this case but it comes down to not dissapointing people by setting expectations.

...

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Wait. Do you mean something like the Dominion video where large capital and sub-capital fleets seamlessly jump into one another, fight with smooth 30fps+ action and the ship's camera zoomed in tight on various ship models?

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Originally by: CCP Incognito

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PS the "time to P*nis" is the shortest time recorded in human history. :)

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Originally by: Dr Deadbolt

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I find this hilarious.

Here we have EVE a game with guys roleplaying big gonaded men fighting bravely for just causes ,fighting locals to expand their controlled territories, or fighting as pirates and bravely? imposing their will on others.

Now the end game appears to be EVE will become a game of men flouncing around in womans clothes asking if their bottoms look big.

Way to go "guys".

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Originally by: Evelgrivion

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Oh God, PhysX? Great, now everyone who owns an ATI card won't be able to VIEW the fabric worth a damn, because PhysX is a proprietary to NVidia API. It's deliberately crippled from ATI graphics cards, meaning anyone using one won't be able to see the fancy, flowing fabric. How much is Nvidia paying you guys under The Way It's Meant to Be Played to segregate your player base by graphics chip brand?

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Originally by: Evelgrivion

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Oh God, PhysX? Great, now everyone who owns an ATI card won't be able to VIEW the fabric worth a damn, because PhysX is a proprietary to NVidia API. It's deliberately crippled from ATI graphics cards, meaning anyone using one won't be able to see the fancy, flowing fabric. How much is Nvidia paying you guys under The Way It's Meant to Be Played to segregate your player base by graphics chip brand?

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Originally by: Aloriana Jacques

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You've echoed my concerns wonderfully. After reading that article... I'm not switching my ATI out for nVIDIA just for one damn game feature. And if that's what they ask, then I've lost all faith in ccp in staying within a generation's technology, not trapping players into a niche available onto to certain hardware.

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Originally by: Professor Tarantula

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NVidia and ATI have been slugging it out for years now, and now NVidia has an awesome game engine they aren't even charging game companies to use. It's freeware, and any Windows or linux developers are welcome to use it all they want.
Simply put, ATI is in trouble.

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Originally by: brutoid

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Notice that last bit, OpenCL and DirectCompute? Thats the way to go in my opinion. Nvidia pay developers to use PhysX, the API is free to use of course, but developers need a little nudge by nvidia to segregate themselves from a huge portion of the playerbase.

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Originally by: Professor Tarantula

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Yeah, that's how NVidia do everything. Making arrangements with companies for things like a big long NVidia ad which would play at game startup was another favorite of theirs. I don't much like their rabid self promotion, but they did zig when AMD zagged by going the software route instead of continuing to play the hardware one upping game. As for OpenCL and DirectCompute, it remains to be seen if they'll truly make PhysX irrelevant like AMD claim, but i'd imagine they hope it does.

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Originally by: Evelgrivion

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Oh God, PhysX? Great, now everyone who owns an ATI card won't be able to VIEW the fabric worth a damn, because PhysX is a proprietary to NVidia API. It's deliberately crippled from ATI graphics cards, meaning anyone using one won't be able to see the fancy, flowing fabric. How much is Nvidia paying you guys under The Way It's Meant to Be Played to segregate your player base by graphics chip brand?

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Originally by: Kyra Felann

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Originally by: Evelgrivion

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Oh God, PhysX? Great, now everyone who owns an ATI card won't be able to VIEW the fabric worth a damn, because PhysX is a proprietary to NVidia API. It's deliberately crippled from ATI graphics cards, meaning anyone using one won't be able to see the fancy, flowing fabric. How much is Nvidia paying you guys under The Way It's Meant to Be Played to segregate your player base by graphics chip brand?

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So everything should be gimped just because ATI cards can't handle it? Physics acceleration will never become common unless developers start supporting it and that means some people won't be able to use it at first. Not everyone had graphics cards that could handle hardware 3D acceleration when it first started being used. Not everyone had sound cards back when games started supporting actual sound instead of beeps, either. If you don't have the proper hardware, you don't get the full experience--and that's nothing new in the computer game industry.

Oh, and NVidia cards are better anyway.

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Originally by: brutoid

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Got to take what nvidia say with quite a big pinch of salt nowadays. By the end of this year AMD' Fusion should be firmly on track and Intels Sandybridge cpu is on the horizon. Both of these techs marry the cpu and the gpu onto the same die utilising the same one socket, a dedicted gpu will not be needed for most watchable media etc in the future. Where will this leave nvidia?

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Originally by: Amerilia

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Ati cards can handle it, they just cant handle an nvidia format

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Originally by: Professor Tarantula

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I thought Fusion was all but forgotten. Didn't know they were finally thinking about releasing it, but after some googling i discovered it's due out in 2011, if that link is accurate, and you're right, will be interesting to see how Nvidia copes with it.

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Originally by: Ascuris Wurm

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You see, Incarna is really just a bet between 2 CCP executives as to whether they can get 200,000 guys to play with dolls. Who do you think will win?

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Originally by: Mr Kidd

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Edited by: Mr Kidd on 13/03/2010 03:20:46
Is it me or is the whole concept of clothing reacting to physics kind of a slap in this face?

This is a.......SPACE GAME! Where are the frickin PHYSICS? Screw the clothing! Great, I'll be able to watch my fabrics obey physical laws as they draep across a stairway but my ship bounces off a station. You incarnia supporters are un-frickin-believable!!!

dra-pe....a bad word....really?!?

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Originally by: Ascuris Wurm

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You see, Incarna is really just a bet between 2 CCP executives as to whether they can get 200,000 guys to play with dolls. Who do you think will win?

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Originally by: Mr Kidd

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Edited by: Mr Kidd on 13/03/2010 03:20:46
Is it me or is the whole concept of clothing reacting to physics kind of a slap in this face?

This is a.......SPACE GAME! Where are the frickin PHYSICS? Screw the clothing! Great, I'll be able to watch my fabrics obey physical laws as they draep across a stairway but my ship bounces off a station. You incarnia supporters are un-frickin-believable!!!

dra-pe....a bad word....really?!?

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Originally by: Kyra Felann

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Edited by: Kyra Felann on 12/03/2010 19:36:55

Originally by: Amerilia

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Ati cards can handle it, they just cant handle an nvidia format

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Yes, I'm aware. It's a newish technology and it's common for new technologies to be proprietary before they become open standards. Look at early sound cards--you had to tell the game whether you were using a Sound Blaster card or an AdLib card or a Turtle Beach card. Look at early 3D cards--3dFX cards had their own format, other cards used OpenGL and then Direct3D.

NVidia has actually made PhysX available to more people when they bought Aegeia. Before that, it was only available to people who bought those dedicated cards, which few people did because developers didn't support it because not many people had the cards. Lots of people own NVidia cards.

My point is that if developers don't start supporting the physics acceleration that is out there now, it'll be years or longer before physics acceleration starts to become common in games like graphics or sound acceleration are now. I think we can all agree that physics acceleration being common will be a good thing. Some people will be left out at first because they don't have the supported hardware. But that's nothing new.

I'm sure CCP doesn't want to exclude a portion of their players from getting the full experience, but right now it's either that or gimp it for everyone so that no one can get the full experience.

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Originally by: Professor Tarantula

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Simply put, ATI is in trouble.

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Originally by: Catheryn Martobi

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Well, the fabric rendering is going to happen client side, meaning each computer running the game will draw up everything you see and only download data for where people are, but not their clothes. This means that no one will be seeing the exact same image (for instance if you see a bug in the clothing, it's likely no one else will see it). This is fine because it's not important to gameplay, however if we were to have ship physics, the Eve cluster would have to calculate and transmit everything, not only would that significantly increase the demand on the server, but bandwidth requirements would skyrocket. because Incarna wont be integral to gameplay, they can cram as much technology as they want into it.

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Originally by: Morveus

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Edited by: Morveus on 13/03/2010 10:47:53

Originally by: Catheryn Martobi

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Well, the fabric rendering is going to happen client side, meaning each computer running the game will draw up everything you see and only download data for where people are, but not their clothes. This means that no one will be seeing the exact same image (for instance if you see a bug in the clothing, it's likely no one else will see it). This is fine because it's not important to gameplay, however if we were to have ship physics, the Eve cluster would have to calculate and transmit everything, not only would that significantly increase the demand on the server, but bandwidth requirements would skyrocket. because Incarna wont be integral to gameplay, they can cram as much technology as they want into it.

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Instead of the data sent to "bounce" the ship on the station, the server could just send a "physics reaction between ship and station" to the client. Then the client would render it. You don't have to synchronise every bit generated from the explosion (for instance) between client and server.

Play a physics-capable LAN game with two computers side by side and do something with the physics, like making something explode. You'll notice that the physics are client-side: for instance while playing Flatout 2 in LAN, I use to encounter car parts (or stuff from the environment) on the track, which other players don't see at the same place.

But I'm not against my ship bouncing on stations... I'm telling myself "the ship's computer automatically avoids collisions". And I suspect vehicules/ships in thousands of years would at least be able of this -_-

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Originally by: Catheryn Martobi

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Yes, but debris on a road you can simply drive through is not a gameplay mechanic. It's just visual fluff. If a ship collided with an asteroid, it would either be destroyed or sent on a tangent. If it wasn't destroyed, the server would have to calculate which directing it went off in and how much damage was applied based on the trajectory and speed. Not only that but collision models would have to be created. Did you know that all ships and asteroids have a perfectly shperical collision model based on their two furthest points? That is why you sometimes bump a 'roid when you didn't even come close, or if you come at a titan from the side you can't even get near it. Its a huge jump from the system we have now to having accurate collision models, damage inflicting collisions and accurate trajectory tracking. I think it would be super sweet, but the server hardware isn't there yet.

They could meet us half-way and have ships just explode when they ran into each other, but I think that might raise some concerns.

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Originally by: Catheryn Martobi

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Originally by: Mr Kidd

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Edited by: Mr Kidd on 13/03/2010 03:20:46
Is it me or is the whole concept of clothing reacting to physics kind of a slap in this face?

This is a.......SPACE GAME! Where are the frickin PHYSICS? Screw the clothing! Great, I'll be able to watch my fabrics obey physical laws as they draep across a stairway but my ship bounces off a station. You incarnia supporters are un-frickin-believable!!!

dra-pe....a bad word....really?!?

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Well, the fabric rendering is going to happen client side, meaning each computer running the game will draw up everything you see and only download data for where people are, but not their clothes. This means that no one will be seeing the exact same image (for instance if you see a bug in the clothing, it's likely no one else will see it). This is fine because it's not important to gameplay, however if we were to have ship physics, the Eve cluster would have to calculate and transmit everything, not only would that significantly increase the demand on the server, but bandwidth requirements would skyrocket. because Incarna wont be integral to gameplay, they can cram as much technology as they want into it.

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Originally by: Mr Kidd

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Why are you justifying not having more spatial physics in Eve versus justifying having second life in Eve? It doesn't have to be perfect. It doesn't have to be collision physics for every aspect of the game, and it doesn't have to be transmitted to everyone online or in a system, only those within a certain range. I understand there are technical considerations that need addressed. But that is what CCP is doing one way or the other. They're choosing to make technical considerations for a second life in Eve. In essence they're expending a great deal of time and effort, technically, to take Eve in a direction that detracts from game play as we know it in favor of game play that doesn't appear to contribute to what most players spend most of their time doing (grinding, missioning, mining, pvping, exploring) and will continue to do Eve even with walking in stations.

So, if having more spatial physics for the game play that we currently have is technically challenging and creating a walk in station environment is technically challenging, are you saying you would prefer walking in stations, what IMO amounts to fluff (i.e. not a lot of playability)? I'd rather they spend the time to rework the game for some more realism in space rather than reworking it purely for eye-candy.

If they added more spacial physics they could potentially change blob warfare by providing dynamic battlefields that currently and technically are 3 dimensional but are more suited to 2 dimensional tactics. By providing a physical landscape with some collision physics and other physics such as not being able to scan and see everything within a given range where fleets could hide behind moon's, planets, in belts, etc, much smaller fleets could potentially tackle the blobs with real, solid tactics. But hey, lets have walking in station because it's pretty. And oooooh, look at the way my fabrics glint in the lighting, flutter in the non-existent wind.

I've played a lot of games in my time and I can tell you that playability goes much further towards creating dedicated players than eye-candy does. At best eye-candy is a short term means to generate a larger player base on a small time scale. If that's the way Eve is going, and it sounds like it is, then the game is already on it's way out. Don't let the peak number of users you're seeing online these days fool you. That's being achieved without the coming eye-candy. Many decaying cycles are preceded with very positive performance characteristics. One only need look at STOL to know that eye-candy alone isn't enough to sustain a player base.

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Originally by: Cat o'Ninetails

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you guys will be kicking yourselves when i post the first annual profits from my beauty parlour lol

x

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Originally by: BearUkraine

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Hi all.

Who havent seen video from GDC: youtube

Also according to rus interview from GDC with Torfi Frans Olafsson, Producer at CCP Games, probably Incarna will not be as a winter expansion.

Proof (rus)

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Originally by: Jim Luc

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Idunno, I tend to think they probably are looking into ways of introducing a better physics engine into Eve, along with twitch-based combat frigates and stuff they've mentioned here & there.

http://www.blackprophecy.com/index.php?id=121

This is an interesting article, on the tech side of the physics thing, but as this is still un-released, I wait to see how well they can actually pull this off. Eve not only has to worry about the casual pilot or small fleet battles with 10 - 20, they also need to account for physics on the large scale, with thousands of players all in the same battle.

I really long for the day when networking power increases, and we can have hundreds of fast-paced combat frigates fighting other frigates & drones, while battleships and carriers are also on the field.

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Originally by: Razin

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Originally by: BearUkraine

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Hi all.

Who havent seen video from GDC: youtube

Also according to rus interview from GDC with Torfi Frans Olafsson, Producer at CCP Games, probably Incarna will not be as a winter expansion.

Proof (rus)

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What Torfi seems to have said is that 'player apartments' (as part of Incarna content) will not be released this year.

The interviewer did not specifically ask about Incarna release date.

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Originally by: Evelgrivion

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Oh God, PhysX? Great, now everyone who owns an ATI card won't be able to VIEW the fabric worth a damn, because PhysX is a proprietary to NVidia API. It's deliberately crippled from ATI graphics cards, meaning anyone using one won't be able to see the fancy, flowing fabric. How much is Nvidia paying you guys under The Way It's Meant to Be Played to segregate your player base by graphics chip brand?

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Originally by: Ghoest

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Edited by: Ghoest on 15/03/2010 21:23:08
I suppose its nice that they are doing something for the metrosexuals and gays but I would rather see them put some resources into fixing industry and science.

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Originally by: Kellyr

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you segregated yourself with your poor choice of gfx card and lack of pre purchase research. Everyone knows nvidia > ati.

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Originally by: Catheryn Martobi

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They could meet us half-way and have ships just explode when they ran into each other, but I think that might raise some concerns.

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