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Courier contracts will be expired during this downtime?

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Masia Spot	Posted - 2010.06.23 23:14:00 - [1] I will lose all collaterals???
Guilliman R Gallente PRO Space Hunters HUNTER'S BROTHERHOOD	Posted - 2010.06.23 23:15:00 - [2] You should have know this, as extended downtime was announced before. And probably yes. ___ Space for Rent, free beer for signature, preferably with colours! (no pink)
Lutz Major Austriae Est Imperare Orbi Universo	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:15:00 - [3] http://www.eveonline.com/news.asp?a=single&nid=3963&tid=1 Quote: In gratitude for your patience, we will give an extra pool of skillpoints to all accounts (paying and trial) that were active at the beginning of this downtime, on one character per account. This skillpoint pool will be appropriately sized for the downtime time frame, universal across all accounts regardless of character attributes/implants and may be applied as each player wants. This will be done through a new system in the development pipeline, currently scheduled for deployment next TuesdayÆs patching opportunity* during regularly scheduled downtime. Since it has been ôhot droppedö into the development plans, we will be providing step-by-step instructions for how to use it as soon as possible. Although I appreciate the gift, I hope that does not mean you can pay for skill points in the future :(
Gavjack Bunk	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:17:00 - [4] I'm pretty stoked right now.... -- On planets... nobody can see you macro mining...
Vak'ran	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:18:00 - [5] Quote: I hope that does not mean you can pay for skill points in the future :( This didnt occur to me, but this statement scares the bejezus out of me... ccp please put my paranoid mind at ease... Vak'Ran is your local official non-dedicated part-time advocate of reading comprehension and proliferation of intelligence on the EVE Online Forum
Fallon Windskimmer Dedicated Inactivity Trans-Stellar Industries	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:20:00 - [6] Edited by: Fallon Windskimmer on 24/06/2010 16:22:02 I picked up on this idea too. It was the first thing I thought of actually. I suppose we'll have to wait and see what is said about this new system in development... Edited to add: I should note my agreement: that paying for SP is not something I think is a good idea.
starbar	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:21:00 - [7] Holy Balls of Chribba! This does in fact set the stage for a system which allows skillpoint gains past the current maximum rate.
Julienne Poirier	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:21:00 - [8] all is forgiven ccp \o/
Obscura DelTar Amarr Dark Phoenix Supremacy	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:21:00 - [9] CCP <3
Oei Vive ut Vivas	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:21:00 - [10] Originally by: Vak'ran Quote: I hope that does not mean you can pay for skill points in the future :( This didnt occur to me, but this statement scares the bejezus out of me... ccp please put my paranoid mind at ease... :motherofgod.jpeg: Yeah, please say it aint so!

Dan O'Connor Cerberus Network Dignitas.	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:21:00 - [11] By the belts of Orion! Item DB \| Sigs
Aylara	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:22:00 - [12] I wonder if players will be able to buy skill points in the future, or transfer skill points between two or more characters... Like making your noob alt with the name and face you like, and then buy a skilled character from the bazaar and suck him dry of skillpoints for transfer.
Slade Trillgon Endless Possibilities Inc. Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:22:00 - [13] /gags self Slade :Signature Temporarily Disabled:
Ludacrys	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:22:00 - [14] >This will be done through a new system in the development pipeline I do not like the implications of this statement at all
Veilag	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:24:00 - [15] if this does mean that you can buy/trade/acquire skill points in any other way than training, that CCP have just commited in-game suicide. This would kill the game imo.
Raziphan Rebular Caldari Polished Diamond Industries	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:24:00 - [16] So far the best thing I can think of that goes along with such a statement is this. They are removing learning skills and reimbursing everyone the SP they trained into them, plus adjusting attributes so that they are not effected by said change.
zombiedeadhead Minmatar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:25:00 - [17] Oh God no
Matalino	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:25:00 - [18] Edited by: Matalino on 24/06/2010 16:26:08 It is probably just a booster that gives a 100% bonus to training for 24 hours. Likely it will be distributed the same way the shuttles were for Christmas. I doubt this means anything significant will change.
Captain Muscles Caldari Clan Farthammer	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:25:00 - [19] Originally by: Lutz Major http://www.eveonline.com/news.asp?a=single&nid=3963&tid=1 Quote: In gratitude for your patience, we will give an extra pool of skillpoints to all accounts (paying and trial) that were active at the beginning of this downtime, on one character per account. This skillpoint pool will be appropriately sized for the downtime time frame, universal across all accounts regardless of character attributes/implants and may be applied as each player wants. This will be done through a new system in the development pipeline, currently scheduled for deployment next TuesdayÆs patching opportunity* during regularly scheduled downtime. Since it has been ôhot droppedö into the development plans, we will be providing step-by-step instructions for how to use it as soon as possible. Although I appreciate the gift, I hope that does not mean you can pay for skill points in the future :( If you read CCPs announcement, they say this feature has been "hot dropped" into the dev plans. Although some part of this addition could be used to sell skillpoint in the future, I believe CCPs post is quite clear that they are adding the code in response to the extended downtime out of the goodness of their hearts. ____________________ Captain Muscles sez:
Wet Ferret	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:25:00 - [20] Originally by: Vak'ran Quote: I hope that does not mean you can pay for skill points in the future :( This didnt occur to me, but this statement scares the bejezus out of me... ccp please put my paranoid mind at ease... Maybe we'll be able to buy "lost" skill points (such as those from podding or missed training) through NPC services with ISK. You'd still be limited to your maximum potential SP, and ISK sinks are good. Oooh, guessing is fun. But for the record, I only changed my sig because I was annoying myself with the last one.

Eklykti Caldari Zion foundation Red Alliance	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:26:00 - [21] Will the same amount of SP added to accounts that lost their training due to unexpected downtime and to account that had a looong skill in queue and have those not lost anything?
Scrobes	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:26:00 - [22] I speculate that you will train generic skill points that get collected into a pool, with which you can then spend on any skill you desire. Rather than training the skills themselves. ;o Maybe it'll be defined as skill training for a category of skills like all the stuff in Science, etc. Then you use that 'Science' pool of SP to spend on Cybernetics or something. Just some totally random thoughts.
Fallon Windskimmer Dedicated Inactivity Trans-Stellar Industries	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:27:00 - [23] Originally by: Raziphan Rebular So far the best thing I can think of that goes along with such a statement is this. They are removing learning skills and reimbursing everyone the SP they trained into them, plus adjusting attributes so that they are not effected by said change. Ok, I agree that this would be perhaps the best case scenario here. Fingers crossed it is not as we are wildly speculating some way to buy SP.
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:28:00 - [24] Originally by: Captain Muscles If you read CCPs announcement, they say this feature has been "hot dropped" into the dev plans. Although some part of this addition could be used to sell skillpoint in the future, I believe CCPs post is quite clear that they are adding the code in response to the extended downtime out of the goodness of their hearts. You're an optimist i see. _____________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008 Originally by: CCP Fallout Been there. Done that. Need antibiotics.
Vossejongk Caldari Bendebeukers Green Rhino	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:29:00 - [25] Chaps to CCP for this! Dont think anybody expected this :). But its a good way to meet your "customers" :), instead of just ignoring like happened many times before ^^. Database team has my love <3 ----------------------------------------------- EVE Gate: Originally by: Simeon Tor Soon you'll be saying "Eve has a client?"
Azaeria	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:29:00 - [26] Edited by: Azaeria on 24/06/2010 16:29:26 Thank you CCP :) And meh well paying for some extra SP, why not (waiting 30 days for <insert a faction> battlecruiser V is annoying), but in order to keep the balance in the game, (if such a functionality is added), please cap it at a certain amount of SP / month. I don't want to see rich players with 150.000.000 SP chars after 2 weeks of play time...
Lasrod	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:29:00 - [27] I believe this is a step towards removing the learning skills.
Joe Starbreaker M. Corp	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:30:00 - [28] Originally by: Captain Muscles I believe CCPs post is quite clear that they are adding the code in response to the extended downtime out of the goodness of their hearts. The post is also quite clear that *they already had something in the pipeline* that allows them to distribute blocks of skillpoints. That's why people are worried. ... Join M. Corp, see the Galaxy
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:30:00 - [29] Originally by: Scrobes I speculate that you will train generic skill points that get collected into a pool, with which you can then spend on any skill you desire. Rather than training the skills themselves. ;o Maybe it'll be defined as skill training for a category of skills like all the stuff in Science, etc. Then you use that 'Science' pool of SP to spend on Cybernetics or something. Just some totally random thoughts. So, what you're saying is, CCP is stealing the Idea from an MMO which is stealing most of its Ideas from CCP. Doubt it. _____________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008 Originally by: CCP Fallout Been there. Done that. Need antibiotics.
Lucas Schuyler	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:30:00 - [30] Not that I particularly care one way or the other, selling SP sounds sketchy, but they also endorse buying and selling characters so... Who cares?

Zeke Mobius	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:30:00 - [31] All is forgiven.
Slade Trillgon Endless Possibilities Inc. Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:30:00 - [32] Originally by: Veilag if this does mean that you can buy/trade/acquire skill points in any other way than training, that CCP have just commited in-game suicide. This would kill the game imo. You can already buy skill points and isk legally Slade :Signature Temporarily Disabled:
Lutz Major Austriae Est Imperare Orbi Universo	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:32:00 - [33] Originally by: Captain Muscles If you read CCPs announcement, they say this feature has been "hot dropped" into the dev plans. Although some part of this addition could be used to sell skillpoint in the future, I believe CCPs post is quite clear that they are adding the code in response to the extended downtime out of the goodness of their hearts. Dude, that is nothing you can plan, implement, test & deploy in one day! This is a future feature and I hope it is ONLY for admins in case of reinbursements fingers crossed
Scrobes	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:32:00 - [34] Originally by: Blane Xero Originally by: Scrobes I speculate that you will train generic skill points that get collected into a pool, with which you can then spend on any skill you desire. Rather than training the skills themselves. ;o Maybe it'll be defined as skill training for a category of skills like all the stuff in Science, etc. Then you use that 'Science' pool of SP to spend on Cybernetics or something. Just some totally random thoughts. So, what you're saying is, CCP is stealing the Idea from an MMO which is stealing most of its Ideas from CCP. Doubt it. That's not what I am saying, no, because actually I don't know what you're talking about or what you're referring to. Sorry :) I wasn't implying anything, it was a genuine speculation.
Yakumo Smith Gallente No End To Infinity Fleetingly Finite	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:32:00 - [35] Skill point reallocation in t - 5 days. Simply drain the SP in all those skills you don't use and pop into a "pool". Add in a back story to it fits in eve, have a decay modifier to you lose SP doing this (to calm the masses) and then sit back and wait for 500 titan pilots to suddenly spring up. I really hope i'm wrong. I suppose this must be my sig. I'll do something cool with it eventually.
Abrazzar	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:32:00 - [36] Maybe they'll use this thing to finally get rid of the learning skills. -------- All I want is a better mankind.
Lucia Warbler Infinite Frontiers	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:33:00 - [37] Skillpoint gifter extra appreciated (especially since my skill training plan wasn't for downtime over a day long), but if you ever sell skillpoints for real life ISKies (excluding character sales), I'll fly a smartbombing Phoon into your new server room.
Zeba Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:35:00 - [38] Originally by: Lutz Major http://www.eveonline.com/news.asp?a=single&nid=3963&tid=1 Quote: This will be done through a new system in the development pipeline, currently scheduled for deployment next TuesdayÆs patching opportunity* during regularly scheduled downtime. Since it has been ôhot droppedö into the development plans, we will be providing step-by-step instructions for how to use it as soon as possible. W T F ? ! Originally by: Balsak Eve-Online, the game that is so awesome people are willing to give CCP money so that they may have the privilege to bash it.
Dawne Xi Minmatar 3D Salvage and Acquisitions	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:37:00 - [39] First thing I thought of when I read about this skill point pool was ... This is how they plan on getting rid of learning skills without making the older players upset who've trained them... Give everyone a skill point pool to spend for the learning skills you've trained in the past, when they finally get rid of them like they've been talking about for years. I seriously doubt they are about to let us buy SP's.
Captain Muscles Caldari Clan Farthammer	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:37:00 - [40] Originally by: Blane Xero Originally by: Captain Muscles If you read CCPs announcement, they say this feature has been "hot dropped" into the dev plans. Although some part of this addition could be used to sell skillpoint in the future, I believe CCPs post is quite clear that they are adding the code in response to the extended downtime out of the goodness of their hearts. You're an optimist i see. The only optimistic part of my statement is the part about CCP having goodness in their hearts . I just think that they clearly stated that they are adding something right-away to reimburse skill-points, but most of this thread seems to think that they are adding some ridiculous skill-selling feature. Originally by: Joe Starbreaker The post is also quite clear that *they already had something in the pipeline* that allows them to distribute blocks of skillpoints. That's why people are worried. Ummm what? It says this was "hot dropped" into the pipeline. The rest of it is about reimbursing us. Any further speculation would require a tinfoil hat, which I forgot at home. ____________________ Captain Muscles sez:

Nika Dekaia	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:40:00 - [41] Originally by: Raziphan Rebular So far the best thing I can think of that goes along with such a statement is this. They are removing learning skills and reimbursing everyone the SP they trained into them, plus adjusting attributes so that they are not effected by said change. Please let it be this and not the horror that buying skillpoints directly would be.
Ace2001 Caldari S E A R	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:41:00 - [42] Originally by: Zeba Originally by: Lutz Major http://www.eveonline.com/news.asp?a=single&nid=3963&tid=1 Quote: This will be done through a new system in the development pipeline, currently scheduled for deployment next TuesdayÆs patching opportunity* during regularly scheduled downtime. Since it has been ôhot droppedö into the development plans, we will be providing step-by-step instructions for how to use it as soon as possible. W T F ? ! This is the day that the EVE we all know and love died, Zeba. ;-; I'll be over here in my corner crying into a bowl of veldnuts. (The nuttiest breakfast cereal, now with real Veldspar! /bored)
Amateratsu Caldari The Pegasus Project	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:43:00 - [43] I suspect this will just be a means for ccp to compensate/reimbuse players lost sp/training time resulting from unsceduled DT's ect... possibly a prelude to removing the learning skills, tho i do hope we get the choice... as a skill collector i will not be very happy to lose my learning skills I don't believe they would be stupid enouch to sell sp for isk or rl cash as that would totally undermine and render pointless the eve skill training system. á
Derelicht	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:43:00 - [44] Originally by: Oei Originally by: Vak'ran Quote: I hope that does not mean you can pay for skill points in the future :( This didnt occur to me, but this statement scares the bejezus out of me... ccp please put my paranoid mind at ease... :motherofgod.jpeg: Yeah, please say it aint so! Why? Buying SP would be great. Unless you're a pawper.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:43:00 - [45] Edited by: Tippia on 24/06/2010 16:44:20 Originally by: Ludacrys >This will be done through a new system in the development pipeline I do not like the implications of this statement at all It means they've figured out a way to ditch learning skills. Dammit! Too slowà ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki
Virtia Mestalb	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:44:00 - [46] Remember CCP gives and takes. Not sure what the possible side effects of a skill point pool could be, but nothing from ccp is free.
Lhun Amarr Senex Legio Get Off My Lawn	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:45:00 - [47] I speculate that this is CCP's way of using my idea for eliminating the learning skills from the game. skillbook tokens.
Captain Muscles Caldari Clan Farthammer	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:48:00 - [48] Originally by: Lhun I speculate that this is CCP's way of using my idea for eliminating the learning skills from the game. skillbook tokens. I speculate that this is CCP's way of removing the 1/2 lb. Cheesy Potato Burrito from Taco Bell's menu. WTF CCP THATS NOT FAIR!!!! goes to lunch ____________________ Captain Muscles sez:
MaxxOmega Caldari Dissident Aggressors Mordus Angels	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:48:00 - [49] Allright Skill Buying... Wooooo Hooooo I got my Credit Card ready to roll, when does it start???
Zeba Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:48:00 - [50] Originally by: Tippia Edited by: Tippia on 24/06/2010 16:44:20 Originally by: Ludacrys >This will be done through a new system in the development pipeline I do not like the implications of this statement at all It means they've figured out a way to ditch learning skills. Dammit! Too slowà If this is all it ends up being then it will be ok. But with no details yet I will assume the worst. Whats that old saying? Optimists are usually dissapointed whilst pessimists can only be pleasantly suprised. Originally by: Balsak Eve-Online, the game that is so awesome people are willing to give CCP money so that they may have the privilege to bash it.

Ludacrys	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:50:00 - [51] Why all the hate for learning skills? They are completely optional you know? Just like attribute implants Nobody is forcing you to train them
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:51:00 - [52] Originally by: Zeba Originally by: Tippia Edited by: Tippia on 24/06/2010 16:44:20 Originally by: Ludacrys >This will be done through a new system in the development pipeline I do not like the implications of this statement at all It means they've figured out a way to ditch learning skills. Dammit! Too slowà If this is all it ends up being then it will be ok. But with no details yet I will assume the worst. Whats that old saying? Optimists are usually dissapointed whilst pessimists can only be pleasantly suprised. Meanwhile, the sadists are the ones having fun while the masochists pay them for the pleasure. Ohyesiwentthere. _____________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008 Originally by: CCP Fallout Been there. Done that. Need antibiotics.
Zeba Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:52:00 - [53] Originally by: Ludacrys Why all the hate for learning skills? They are completely optional you know? Just like attribute implants Nobody is forcing you to train them /me smacks ludacrys with a large wet trout Originally by: Balsak Eve-Online, the game that is so awesome people are willing to give CCP money so that they may have the privilege to bash it.
Lucia Warbler Infinite Frontiers	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:54:00 - [54] Originally by: Zeba Originally by: Ludacrys Why all the hate for learning skills? They are completely optional you know? Just like attribute implants Nobody is forcing you to train them /me smacks ludacrys with a large wet trout /seconded "Nobody is forcing you to train them", lol.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:55:00 - [55] Originally by: Ludacrys Why all the hate for learning skills? They are entirely useless meta-gameplay that serves absolutely no purpose beyond stalling new players when it comes to entering the game. ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki
Fikreta	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:55:00 - [56] Originally by: Amateratsu I don't believe they would be stupid enouch to sell sp for isk or rl cash as that would totally undermine and render pointless the eve skill training system. But we can already buy SP for isk/rl money, isn't it?
Jurai Talar	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:56:00 - [57] What if it's a system where you train a skill to level x and then you can "pull out" that skill from your brain, package it up and sell it on the market as a "trained lvl x skill."
Uhr Zylex Privateers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:57:00 - [58] Edited by: Uhr Zylex on 24/06/2010 16:57:20 Skill point reallocation ftw.
Raziphan Rebular Caldari Polished Diamond Industries	Posted - 2010.06.24 16:59:00 - [59] Originally by: Jurai Talar What if it's a system where you train a skill to level x and then you can "pull out" that skill from your brain, package it up and sell it on the market as a "trained lvl x skill." sounds ******ed.
Yuki Kulotsuki	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:01:00 - [60] On the one hand CCP is usually pretty good about giving people what they ask for with a twist that keeps eve fun and harsh. I'm very cautiously optimistic about this new feature only because of CCP's track record with this sort of thing. On the other hand they're reimbursing us SP for downtimes which is a strangely generous gesture and not in keeping with the HTFU attitude I've come to expect. Originally by: CCP Lemur THIS IS GOD: ... IF YOU HAVE ANY MORE REQUESTS I'M AVAILABLE SUNDAY FROM 10:30 TO 12:00 TO RECEIVE YOUR PRAYERS.

Lucas Schuyler	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:01:00 - [61] Originally by: Jurai Talar What if it's a system where you train a skill to level x and then you can "pull out" that skill from your brain, package it up and sell it on the market as a "trained lvl x skill." OMG let the Alt Training Farms begin. That might even be worse
Ludacrys	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:01:00 - [62] Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Ludacrys Why all the hate for learning skills? They are entirely useless meta-gameplay that serves absolutely no purpose beyond stalling new players when it comes to entering the game. isnt that exactly the same for all skills? what about attribute implants? Arent they useless meta-gameplay (whatever that means)
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:02:00 - [63] Originally by: Jurai Talar What if it's a system where you train a skill to level x and then you can "pull out" that skill from your brain, package it up and sell it on the market as a "trained lvl x skill." Pulling out never works. _____________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008 Originally by: CCP Fallout Been there. Done that. Need antibiotics.
Takseen	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:02:00 - [64] Originally by: Jurai Talar What if it's a system where you train a skill to level x and then you can "pull out" that skill from your brain, package it up and sell it on the market as a "trained lvl x skill." Yes, then the other players could buy them and "inject" them into their brains. It would be like some sort of ready made "skill book". Excellent new idea there.
Necronous	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:03:00 - [65] Originally by: Jurai Talar What if it's a system where you train a skill to level x and then you can "pull out" that skill from your brain, package it up and sell it on the market as a "trained lvl x skill." Looks like someones been playing Project Entropia / Entropia Universe / Planet Calpyso ... or whatever its current name is.
Mael Sechnaill	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:04:00 - [66] Since the Tyrannis downtime, everyone should've been prepared for this. I did put a 4 day long skill into the training queue before the server went down, and was praying that the transition will not take that long. I am pleasntly surprised by the fact that servers are online again. The extra skillpoints are welcome too. :D
Amanda Star	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:04:00 - [67] Well I feel Eve has done well over the years with the expected trip here and there but nothing major to kill the game. I think anything CCP does on a grand scale will be examined from all angles before going ahead and doing something that could end Eve in a few weeks and send players to the forums carrying tourches and pitch forks. CCP wants to make money, not kill and eat their cash cow.
Zeba Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:05:00 - [68] Originally by: Takseen Originally by: Jurai Talar What if it's a system where you train a skill to level x and then you can "pull out" that skill from your brain, package it up and sell it on the market as a "trained lvl x skill." Yes, then the other players could buy them and "inject" them into their brains. It would be like some sort of ready made "skill book". Excellent new idea there. Yeah and that won't be stupendiously abused by multiple account holders. Oh hai I've been playing for 6 months and can fly titans. Originally by: Balsak Eve-Online, the game that is so awesome people are willing to give CCP money so that they may have the privilege to bash it.
Felix Esperium Lysergic Distortions Research and Development	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:07:00 - [69] Will all the learning skill removal people be happy when they are training at a much slower rate? Or do they assume CCP will remove the skills and adjust everyone's attributes accordingly?
Ludacrys	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:09:00 - [70] i think they expect CCP will give everyone +10 on all attributes they are obviously ******ed and should start training learning skills

Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:11:00 - [71] Edited by: Tippia on 24/06/2010 17:12:13 Originally by: Felix Esperium Or do they assume CCP will remove the skills and adjust everyone's attributes accordingly? If they didn't adjust the attributes, there wouldn't be any need for the whole "pay back SP in learning skills" rigamarole, because those SP will have already paid themselves back ages agoà So yes. Originally by: Ludacrys i think they expect CCP will give everyone +10 on all attributes No. The expectation is actually around 12 or so. ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki
Jurai Talar	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:11:00 - [72] Originally by: Necronous Originally by: Jurai Talar What if it's a system where you train a skill to level x and then you can "pull out" that skill from your brain, package it up and sell it on the market as a "trained lvl x skill." Looks like someones been playing Project Entropia / Entropia Universe / Planet Calpyso ... or whatever its current name is. Actually, I've never played that game. I was just trying to think of a feasible way that CCP could implement a SP transfer system. For the record, I would not be happy with such a system. Perhaps if the bought skills decayed over time? Then, you could buy some skills to temporarily try out a new ship or use it for an occasional purpose. (gotta move all my all my stuff again, better buy Gal Industrial V)
starbar	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:11:00 - [73] Originally by: Felix Esperium Will all the learning skill removal people be happy when they are training at a much slower rate? Or do they assume CCP will remove the skills and adjust everyone's attributes accordingly? You sir, may have hit the nail on the head. Might people be willing to rid themselves of learning skills and have a lower learning speed, just to reallocate those measly 5M skillpoints? CCP wins no matter what. Instead of that plex going to time, every so often, perhaps one goes to skills now and then, eh?
Felix Esperium Lysergic Distortions Research and Development	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:13:00 - [74] Originally by: Tippia because those SP will have already paid themselves back ages agoà What if I just trained them a week ago?
Jennifer Fenring Amarr	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:15:00 - [75] I bet this is a test for the removal of learning skills and givng the peopel who already trained them a SP repay ^^ Keep up the good work CCP!
Guttripper Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:17:00 - [76] I feel people are making more of this bonus skill points than what CCP intends to release. How I read their blog, "In gratitude for your patience, we will give an extra pool of skillpoints to all accounts (paying and trial) that were active at the beginning of this downtime, on one character per account." Very similar to when CCP gave away the shuttle a few years ago, except instead of a physical aspect, the skill points will be transferred directly into your total skill points. "This skillpoint pool will be appropriately sized for the downtime time frame, universal across all accounts regardless of character attributes/implants and may be applied as each player wants." Thus most likely the points are given at a maximum rate based upon a character having the highest of high attribute points and implants +5 installed. So either a newbie or a character already maxed out - all characters for a specific amount of time; a thirty hour downtime minus the original six hour stated will be one twenty-four hour maximum addition to your total skill point total. I doubt it will be anything more than a speed bonus.
AterraX Caldari	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:17:00 - [77] Originally by: Dawne Xi First thing I thought of when I read about this skill point pool was ... This is how they plan on getting rid of learning skills without making the older players upset who've trained them... Give everyone a skill point pool to spend for the learning skills you've trained in the past, when they finally get rid of them like they've been talking about for years. I seriously doubt they are about to let us buy SP's. Remove my learning skills, and I'll be ****ing upset...not matter what "lollipop" they offer as a surrogate... ____________________________________________________________________________________________________ Fact of EVE forums: They will always come an anounomys alt-toon and question someones character...
Shinnen Caldari Association of Commonwealth Enterprises Gentlemen's Club	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:18:00 - [78] Something along the lines of skill point remap? Either that, or we're blowing this out of proportion and we'll get a 100k SP to allocate anywhere we'd like, and that's it. The gift could be a shuttle or frigate of some kind, who knows. Perhaps space "party poppers" like the snowballs?
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:20:00 - [79] Originally by: AterraX Remove my learning skills, and I'll be ***ing upset...not matter what "lollipop" they offer as a surrogate... Free SP to spend elsewhere as you see fit? No need to ever train them higher (or again, if you want to use alts)? What's there to be upset about? ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki*
Guttripper Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:31:00 - [80] Originally by: Tippia Free SP to spend elsewhere as you see fit? No need to ever train them higher (or again, if you want to use alts)? What's there to be upset about? Can I get a 1.6 million skill point speed bonus like new characters get today? When I started almost four years ago, I only had around 80,000 skill points given to me. Oh yes, all the goodies in terms of modules, ships, and skill books given to the new players running the starting missions I would like to have freely given to me too (even though I have no use for them, but still - if they can get it for free, then I want free stuff too (similar to free attribute points for doing squat)). All I got when I started was an Ibis and a kick in the ass to go into that "cold, dark, harsh universe" and make a name for myself. Or how about letting me keep my ten attribute points per stat and get ten more like everyone else is clamoring for, so I'll still be ten attribute points per stat higher than those that did not learn the Learning skills?

rowbin hod Cloak and Daggers Honourable Templum of Alcedonia	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:32:00 - [81] tl:dr I hope CCP are intriducing SPs as rewards for things ingame (with appropriate balance, of course) OMG, I hope this means what I hope it means. For ages I've been trying to think of a way that players could be rewarded in game (eg for missions) that isn't just something you can buy. Where's the incentive to go through an epic arc if you can just buy the reward by spending time doing something easier/funner. I'd thought of something like a skillbook "implant" into your head so that it can't be traded, but I think CCP is eluding to a similar thing with give SPs as rewards for something.
Daemonspirit Redhawk Tribal Trust	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:32:00 - [82] Originally by: Dawne Xi First thing I thought of when I read about this skill point pool was ... This is how they plan on getting rid of learning skills without making the older players upset who've trained them... Give everyone a skill point pool to spend for the learning skills you've trained in the past, when they finally get rid of them like they've been talking about for years. I seriously doubt they are about to let us buy SP's. I don't pray often, but right now, I'm praying hard that your right... No hope though... The instant gratification kids (read dust 514 which will have micro-transactions) will be fed their pablum... Please CCP, let it just be Learning skills and not SP purchase... OTOH - I can normally do 1 extra shift of OT / Week = 2/payperiod = approx. US $700.00/two weeks before taxes... I could cap all those "annoying" lvl V's I've been putting off... and new players would fall further behind... ôEveryone has a right to be stupid; some people just abuse the privilege.ö
Barakkus Spacelane Innovation	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:35:00 - [83] How much you want to bet they are intending on letting us unlearn some ** we mistakenly trained and have no use for with this new skillpoint distribution thingy? Originally by:** CCP Dropbear rofl edit: ah crap, dev account. Oh well, official rofl at you sir.
Marchocias Silent Ninja's	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:37:00 - [84] Originally by: Raziphan Rebular So far the best thing I can think of that goes along with such a statement is this. They are removing learning skills and reimbursing everyone the SP they trained into them, plus adjusting attributes so that they are not effected by said change. This is what I had thought - they're putting in place system that allows them to deprecate obsolete skills and reimburse players who have them. I can't see them adding pay-for-skills, just because of the overwhelmingly negative response that current players automatically have to that idea. ---- I belong to Silent Ninja (Hopefully that should cover it).
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:38:00 - [85] Originally by: Barakkus How much you want to bet they are intending on letting us unlearn some **** we mistakenly trained and have no use for with this new skillpoint distribution thingy? Very little, since such a mechanic would either have to be veeeeery limited, or it would essentially completely obsolete the whole idea of having different attributes. ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki
Jurai Talar	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:39:00 - [86] Originally by: Shinnen Something along the lines of skill point remap? I think that is the most realistic guess I've heard. Such a system would likely use a "SP Pool" which this little SP Gift would utilize. Also, if they restrict it similar to Attribute Remaps and Jump Clones (limit the number of uses per time frame) then I don't think it could be abused and most players would be happy with a little additional flexiblity.
Captain Muscles Caldari Clan Farthammer	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:40:00 - [87] This thread is where brain cells go to die. Sadly, I can't stop posting in it. Guess this is where I belong. ____________________ Captain Muscles sez:
Barakkus Spacelane Innovation	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:40:00 - [88] Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Barakkus How much you want to bet they are intending on letting us unlearn some ** we mistakenly trained and have no use for with this new skillpoint distribution thingy? Very little, since such a mechanic would either have to be veeeeery limited, or it would essentially completely obsolete the whole idea of having different attributes. I'm talking about unlearning stuff like Mining V or Scrap Metal Reprocessing etc, which I don't see how that would have anything to do with your attributes aside from the learning skills. Originally by:** CCP Dropbear rofl edit: ah crap, dev account. Oh well, official rofl at you sir.
AterraX Caldari	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:41:00 - [89] Originally by: Tippia Originally by: AterraX Remove my learning skills, and I'll be **ing upset...not matter what "lollipop" they offer as a surrogate... Free SP to spend elsewhere as you see fit? No need to ever train them higher (or again, if you want to use alts)? What's there to be upset about? What is not to be upset about? Just moving the 5.376.000 I have won't cut it. I didn't train for full speed until I had them all at L5, that would need to be factored in too...if they are planning on giving new players +10 to stats instead. And I liked that you didn't NEED to train them, but if you were serious about Eve it made sense to train the...for the long haul. Just because EvE has gotten bigger is no reason to fall down to the ADHD WoW-like minions that whine if something actually takes efferot..and can't be done in less that 24 hours. If you cave in for that idea, it's the slippery slope. What will be next? "Waaaaaaaaaaa, L4 skills take to long to train, nerf traning time..." It's won't be pretty...so again, don't expect me to be happy about a ** poor plain number SP-reallocation...keep the learning skills...it might weed out the ADHD WoW types. ____________________________________________________________________________________________________ Fact of EVE forums: They will always come an anounomys alt-toon and question someones character...
Shaydun	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:41:00 - [90] Well stop worrying about little things , truth is that ccp made an effort to help the ones who missed out on training and it shows they care , so be happy even if you didn't miss on training as you will get even more out of it since you will also get the bonus wich means profit ! tata

dexington	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:50:00 - [91] Originally by: Vak'ran Quote: I hope that does not mean you can pay for skill points in the future :( This didnt occur to me, but this statement scares the bejezus out of me... ccp please put my paranoid mind at ease... Some types of alts characters are very close to being the same as buying skill points, or atleast faster learning rate. The only difference is that alt's can't boost the learning speed of primary skills.
Epicbeardman	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:52:00 - [92] Looks like they're preparing to remove some skills from the game and refunding players that trained them with skillpoints? SCREW YOU LEARNING!
llllSeraphimllll	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:54:00 - [93] Originally by: Shaydun Well stop worrying about little things , truth is that ccp made an effort to help the ones who missed out on training and it shows they care , so be happy even if you didn't miss on training as you will get even more out of it since you will also get the bonus wich means profit ! tata ...couldnt agree more. This is probably just a way to give out some SP to the players in this instance. Anything else is just speculation, i'm sure we'll get the whole picture soon enough. personally i'm really pleased about it, i only had 30hrs of skills queued on one of my accounts and so lost some training time, while it isn't the end of the world, this is still a very nice gesture! tyvm
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.06.24 17:54:00 - [94] Originally by: AterraX I didn't train for full speed until I had them all at L5, that would need to be factored in too...if they are planning on giving new players +10 to stats instead. Factored in how? I assume you also want compound interest and ROI on the extra ISK new players get these days from the new starter missions and tutorials? Originally by: Barakkus I'm talking about unlearning stuff like Mining V or Scrap Metal Reprocessing etc, which I don't see how that would have anything to do with your attributes aside from the learning skills. It removes the point of having attributes thus: You remap to max Int/Mem. You slap in the highest possible modifiers for those two attributes. You start to "mistakenly" train forà oh, I don't knowà Neurotoxin Recovery V. 20 days later, you have 1.28M SP that, GASP!, you didn't actually want, so you redistribute them to something far more useful, such as the Cha/Wil-based Wing Command. But oh no! Since the skill is back to 0, you "accidenally" started to train Neurotoxin Recovery to V again, and 20 days later you have 1.28M SP that you redistribute into what you really wanted, which was Command Ships V (Wil/Per-based)à repeat until win. End result, no matter what skill you're after, and no matter what attributes it's based on, you'll always train at max speed because you can just collect SP in a skill based on the two attributes you've maxed out and redistribute those later. Attributes have thus lost the only purpose they have: to determine your training speed. ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki
Balsak Minmatar Friends of Bigfoot	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:03:00 - [95] Hopefully this new SP pool system they are working on is only to be used by the GMs to reimburse for skill removal such as learning skills or other skills which have no effect in game such as Black Market Trading. I really hope CCP does not allow people to just pick and choose which skills they wish to redistribute points (I honestly doubt they would allow this).
Fitz VonHeise Eye Bee Em Stellar Defense Alliance	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:04:00 - [96] Removing the Learning skills... What about people like me who spent billions on Level V learning implants to increase all my alts training skill speed? How will CCP factor in these implants?
Exordium8 Minmatar Hell's Horsemen -Mostly Harmless-	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:05:00 - [97] Originally by: CCP Shadow There are no microtransaction plans, whatsoever. Just an FYI --------------------------------- Pillage, then burn. Everything is air-droppable at least once. There is no 'overkill.' There is only 'open fire' and 'time to reload.
dexington	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:10:00 - [98] Originally by: Fitz VonHeise Removing the Learning skills... What about people like me who spent billions on Level V learning implants to increase all my alts training skill speed? How will CCP factor in these implants? Does it matter aslong as you keep learning with the same speed?
YarrMama	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:12:00 - [99] I like this. Now CCP will have a system in place to reimburse for future downtimes and crashes.
AterraX Caldari	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:14:00 - [100] Originally by: dexington Originally by: Fitz VonHeise Removing the Learning skills... What about people like me who spent billions on Level V learning implants to increase all my alts training skill speed? How will CCP factor in these implants? Does it matter aslong as you keep learning with the same speed? It does...EvE is a game where choices have pros and cons. Learning skills are just one set of many skills you don't NEED...but are nice to have...so you must make a choice. Stop dumbing EvE down, just because more and more ADHD players want it done. ____________________________________________________________________________________________________ Fact of EVE forums: They will always come an anounomys alt-toon and question someones character...

Boogie Bobby	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:14:00 - [101] Originally by: Fitz VonHeise Removing the Learning skills... What about people like me who spent billions on Level V learning implants to increase all my alts training skill speed? How will CCP factor in these implants? Why would they have to? No one's talking about removing attributes, just learning skills. This is all BS at this point too, no one knows anything. Your +5 would still give +5, nothing would change.
Nina Zypher	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:16:00 - [102] So Titan 5 will be cut down in half?
Nullity Gallente	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:18:00 - [103] I just want to post to reiterate the fact that adding in any form of microtransactions in EVE is a terrible idea. Don't even consider it, CCP.
dexington	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:25:00 - [104] Originally by: AterraX It does...EvE is a game where choices have pros and cons. Learning skills are just one set of many skills you don't NEED...but are nice to have...so you must make a choice. Stop dumbing EvE down, just because more and more ADHD players want it done. a little touchy about the learning skills are we? removing the learning skills have nothing to do with dumbing down eve, kinda sad if you found it challenge when you should train them. they are nothing more then a catalyst, and have no real impact on the game, the game would not change if they where removed.
Felix Esperium Lysergic Distortions Research and Development	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:34:00 - [105] Originally by: dexington the game would not change if they where removed. Again, you're assuming they would adjust attributes to keep skill training in line with the current rate. What if they don't? If you say that I have already received the benefit of learning faster, what if I trained them all to 5 and am not at the break-even point yet? Wouldn't I be getting screwed over?
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:36:00 - [106] Originally by: Felix Esperium Originally by: dexington the game would not change if they where removed. Again, you're assuming they would adjust attributes to keep skill training in line with the current rate. What if they don't? If you say that I have already received the benefit of learning faster, what if I trained them all to 5 and am not at the break-even point yet? Wouldn't I be getting screwed over? To the same extent as people who have trained for rockets, Assault frigates, Gallente ships/ewar, etc. CCP is fine with doing that to its players. _____________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008 Originally by: CCP Fallout Been there. Done that. Need antibiotics.
Felix Esperium Lysergic Distortions Research and Development	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:39:00 - [107] Originally by: Blane Xero To the same extent as people who have trained for rockets, Assault frigates, Gallente ships/ewar, etc. CCP is fine with doing that to its players. I assume that those will be fixed at some point in the future. Probably not soon but they aren't being removed from the game.
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:41:00 - [108] Originally by: Felix Esperium Originally by: Blane Xero To the same extent as people who have trained for rockets, Assault frigates, Gallente ships/ewar, etc. CCP is fine with doing that to its players. I assume that those will be fixed at some point in the future. Probably not soon but they aren't being removed from the game. Just like at some point in the future CCP will buff attributes to fix their massive scewup here. Course now we're both theorycrafting. Until the blog stating what the surprise is, i'll assume its as bad as Valves super awesome surprise which wasn't very awesome tbh. _____________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008 Originally by: CCP Fallout Been there. Done that. Need antibiotics.
Felix Esperium Lysergic Distortions Research and Development	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:45:00 - [109] Originally by: Blane Xero Just like at some point in the future CCP will buff attributes to fix their massive scewup here. Course now we're both theorycrafting. Until the blog stating what the surprise is, i'll assume its as bad as Valves super awesome surprise which wasn't very awesome tbh. If you go back to my first post that you quoted, I was responding to the guy saying that the game would not change in any way if this happened. If they need to fix a massive screw-up here, wouldn't that mean the game was being changed?
dexington	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:52:00 - [110] Originally by: Felix Esperium Originally by: dexington the game would not change if they where removed. Again, you're assuming they would adjust attributes to keep skill training in line with the current rate. What if they don't? If you say that I have already received the benefit of learning faster, what if I trained them all to 5 and am not at the break-even point yet? Wouldn't I be getting screwed over? No one knows know if CCP are going to remove the learning skills, but it seems most people are of the notion that learning will remain untouched until they can implement the change in a way the will be positive for both players with and without learning skills. I'm sure you can find lots of scenarios where you are getting screw by removing learning skills, but i don't think that's what CCP are looking if they really decide to remove the learning skills.

Felix Esperium Lysergic Distortions Research and Development	Posted - 2010.06.24 18:58:00 - [111] Originally by: dexington No one knows know if CCP are going to remove the learning skills, but it seems most people are of the notion that learning will remain untouched until they can implement the change in a way the will be positive for both players with and without learning skills. I'm sure you can find lots of scenarios where you are getting screw by removing learning skills, but i don't think that's what CCP are looking if they really decide to remove the learning skills. CCP should hire you for PR. I have very little faith in their ability to actually implement such a solution, but it sounds better like that.
Jennifer Fenring Amarr	Posted - 2010.06.24 19:02:00 - [112] Originally by: Fitz VonHeise Removing the Learning skills... What about people like me who spent billions on Level V learning implants to increase all my alts training skill speed? How will CCP factor in these implants? Implants will probably stay as they are, you still need to train Cyber V and buy them. You just get the SP spent on the learning skills and perhaps some ISK for the books.
Schmacos tryne	Posted - 2010.06.24 19:13:00 - [113] It's very simple; I have all learning skillz maxed and I gotz +5 implants. This gives me an advantage over other players bcoz i accumulate SP faster (yes it actually works as reward for 'learning' some skillz to the fullest). The people who wishes to see Learning skillz dissappear are people who lachs the dicipline to finnish something once and for all. There are perhaps a few exceptions ofcourse. but all in all we are talking about jealousy and nothing else. escpecialy now when all sorts of juicy charisma skills are hitting the market this kind of nagging flares up coz ppl have ignored this attribute due to it's uncoolness. I for one want's to keep my advantage over less diciplined players and wote a solid yes for learning skillz. in fact CCP you should concider the following: Add another layer of learning skillz which requieres all current learning skillz to be trained to 5 ...
Gavjack Bunk	Posted - 2010.06.24 19:14:00 - [114] Originally by: Exordium8 Originally by: CCP Shadow There are no microtransaction plans, whatsoever. Just an FYI Coming from the company that took over the ISK farming and selling cartels and started profitting from their blackmarkets, by selling in game items for real life cash, PLEX, I don't really have much faith in the spirit of the sentiment offered. They have pre-lied. -- On planets... nobody can see you macro mining...
Obyrith	Posted - 2010.06.24 19:14:00 - [115] If this is a hint that CCP plan to remove learning skills, I for one do not care whether the removal is exactly 'fair' or not - it's so long overdue that even a bad solution will just be something people whine about for a week and then will indisputably improve the game.
Felix Esperium Lysergic Distortions Research and Development	Posted - 2010.06.24 19:19:00 - [116] Originally by: Obyrith If this is a hint that CCP plan to remove learning skills, I for one do not care whether the removal is exactly 'fair' or not - it's so long overdue that even a bad solution will just be something people whine about for a week and then will indisputably improve the game. I will whine for at least as long as it took to train the skills I am getting screwed on. Also, please show how it will "indisputably" improve the game. Indisputably is a pretty big word to use on an opinion.
Allataria	Posted - 2010.06.24 19:25:00 - [117] I seriously doubt this means we can buy SP. What I think this will mean is a SP remap like our attributes where we can move SP from one skill that we dont need anymore or find useful to another skill to cut down training time. I would really like this as there are some skills I trained back when I was new to the game which I dont need now and would like to put towards the skills I am training towards now. If I trained for those SP it would only seem natural to allow me to reorganize them as how I see fit. It wouldnt break the game and it could have a yearly cooldown like the remap function now.
dexington	Posted - 2010.06.24 19:44:00 - [118] Originally by: Allataria I seriously doubt this means we can buy SP. What I think this will mean is a SP remap like our attributes where we can move SP from one skill that we dont need anymore or find useful to another skill to cut down training time. I would really like this as there are some skills I trained back when I was new to the game which I dont need now and would like to put towards the skills I am training towards now. If I trained for those SP it would only seem natural to allow me to reorganize them as how I see fit. It wouldnt break the game and it could have a yearly cooldown like the remap function now. To do that would properly require attributes to be removed, if not all training would be done with max speed all the time. If you would be able to remap skill point then training would have no consequence, you would be able to change weapons and ship as you please. Not really sure i like that idea.
democrities	Posted - 2010.06.24 19:51:00 - [119] for crying out loud people get ahold of yourselves. It never fails. I have played many many MMO games over the years and it seems they all have one thing in common, when ever the devs hint at some change in the way the game works, tons of players get on the forums and bemoan that the game will be dead, that this change will be the end of it all, etc. and you know what? In all those games I played, it never happened. The change went fine, the game went on, and the cycle began again for the next announced changed. MMOs by their nature are evolving games, constantly changing. I still say everyone is just speculating needlessly, but if these changes do happen, Eve will go on.
Adamantor	Posted - 2010.06.24 20:29:00 - [120] Originally by: AterraX Originally by: dexington Originally by: Fitz VonHeise Removing the Learning skills... What about people like me who spent billions on Level V learning implants to increase all my alts training skill speed? How will CCP factor in these implants? Does it matter aslong as you keep learning with the same speed? It does...EvE is a game where choices have pros and cons. Learning skills are just one set of many skills you don't NEED...but are nice to have...so you must make a choice. Stop dumbing EvE down, just because more and more ADHD players want it done. I agree - if indeed they're planning to remove learning skills, I think it would be a bad move. Learning skills offer choices for character development. EVE Races are already the same, your choice of race has no real impact on your character and removing learning skills would push more characters to the same level - again, removing a way for players to play the game (aka the sand box). Hopefully CCP adds more sand to the sand box, rather than removing it.

Obyrith	Posted - 2010.06.24 20:30:00 - [121] Edited by: Obyrith on 24/06/2010 20:31:31 Originally by: Felix Esperium Also, please show how it will "indisputably" improve the game. Indisputably is a pretty big word to use on an opinion. The best argument for learning skills was that they demonstrate the importance of patience to new players early on by forcing them to choose between instant gratification v.s. long term invesment. Trouble is, the skill system already does this by requiring five times as much time to train each level of a skill as the last - you either train something to level V for a bonus that doesn't mean that much or you train something else to III in 1/25 the time for an equivalent bonus. It's just not something longtime players recognise because it's so fundamental to the system. Learning skills are a redundant mechanic that serve only to hammer that point in during the first months of play. They also serve to keep newbs stuck in a couple of different ships at exactly the time when they should be experimenting with different roles, cross-training to another race's frigs, etc.
RedLion Caldari State Constructions	Posted - 2010.06.24 20:40:00 - [122] I hope we can buy skill points! I hate those pesky Charisma skills! also give: timer for time left of "you are going too fast". - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - The Gallenteans must be destroyed - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Lady Aja Caldari	Posted - 2010.06.24 20:48:00 - [123] ok guys how about thhis? One year subbed accoutn stops skilling for 4 months for what ever reason, yet still remains active ( one year sub ), this might allow a back date of untrained skill time on a active accounts, to make up for the 4 months of no training. then again. it might be cc removing learnign skills and adding +10 while reimbursing players with the sp they "lost" in some cases over 5m sp to be spread out as one sees fit. in others mere few hundred thousand sp to spread out. coz i dont think it will be a cash in a ingameplex for x amount of skill points.
Rellik B00n Lethal Death Squad	Posted - 2010.06.24 20:53:00 - [124] Originally by: Ludacrys Nobody is forcing you to train them OR ARE THEY? + LDSkill+hireLDS
Vyusoath Orillian	Posted - 2010.06.24 20:55:00 - [125] you can already buy sp, i don't know what peoplea re talking about you can buy sp for isk you can buy isk for cash. did you people not no this ?
stoicfaux	Posted - 2010.06.24 20:56:00 - [126] The learning skills aren't a choice, they're mandatory for anyone that plans on playing for more than a few weeks. To make matters worse, the accelerated training bonus means you would have to be brain dead stupid not to train as many learning skills as possible with the bonus training time. When folks tell newbies to spend the first few weeks or first month of game time training the learning skills while puttering around in the newbie frigates, it's for a good reason. For example: Here are the training times for a PvP Rifter. Using EveMon/EFT, taking into account accelerated training, relevant support skills and gunnery skills to three, it takes: * 27d 21h 16m with optimized attributes * 19d 13h 32m with optimized attributes and 3 days of learning skills (savings of 8d 7h 34m over optimized attributes) Three days of learning skills can save you eight days during your first month of play. The learning skills are not optional and they make for a spectacularly bad First Impression of Eve. ----- "Are you a sociopathic paranoid schizophrenic with accounting skills? We have the game for you! -- Eve, the game of Alts, Economics, Machiavelli, and PvP"
Ivas Tiffy	Posted - 2010.06.24 20:57:00 - [127] Originally by: Vyusoath Orillian you can already buy sp, i don't know what peoplea re talking about you can buy sp for isk you can buy isk for cash. did you people not no this ? buying sp already aye? hmm not really as you dont get to CHOOSE what skills you want/desire... youonly get to buy a poor sods toon. Go ahead and clap. Mediocrity deserves applause. Why don't we go find Pandemic Legion and clap around them!
Douglass Bryant	Posted - 2010.06.24 21:04:00 - [128] Originally by: Felix Esperium I will whine for at least as long as it took to train the skills I am getting screwed on. Also, please show how it will "indisputably" improve the game. Indisputably is a pretty big word to use on an opinion. I really fail to see how you could possibly get screwed if this was handled correctly. The time you spend training the learning skills up would end up being free skill points that you could redistribute to new skills, so there's no loss in the total number of skillpoints you have to date. Furthermore, you've already gained the advantage of training faster than players with lesser trained learning skills, so you're ahead of the curve when the playing field is leveled. Learning skills are a needless speedbump and even CCP has admitted they were a mistake.
Felix Esperium Lysergic Distortions Research and Development	Posted - 2010.06.24 21:04:00 - [129] Originally by: stoicfaux The learning skills are not optional and they make for a spectacularly bad First Impression of Eve. How are they not optional? When you start a new character is there a popup that says you must train these skills or your account will be closed? No one has a gun to anyone's head. Just because you can train for a certain ship faster or whatever does not make them mandatory in any way. Did you factor in potential implants into your equation? Are those mandatory as well?
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.06.24 21:09:00 - [130] Originally by: Felix Esperium How are they not optional? Everyone trains them. Yes, they're optional in the sense of "you can choose not to train them", but in practice, that's such a thoroughly stupid thing to do that the choice really isn't there. ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki

stoicfaux	Posted - 2010.06.24 21:28:00 - [131] Originally by: Felix Esperium How are they not optional? When you start a new character is there a popup that says you must train these skills or your account will be closed? No one has a gun to anyone's head. Just because you can train for a certain ship faster or whatever does not make them mandatory in any way. Did you factor in potential implants into your equation? Are those mandatory as well? Gee, remaps are optional. Heck, training any skill at all is optional too, as is logging in. I guess you're part of the "let's not rush into things" crowd. ----- "Are you a sociopathic paranoid schizophrenic with accounting skills? We have the game for you! -- Eve, the game of Alts, Economics, Machiavelli, and PvP"
Dagny Bronstein	Posted - 2010.06.24 21:33:00 - [132] Edited by: Dagny Bronstein on 24/06/2010 21:35:08 Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Felix Esperium How are they not optional? Everyone trains them. Yes, they're optional in the sense of "you can choose not to train them", but in practice, that's such a thoroughly stupid thing to do that the choice really isn't there. however, there is the (realistic) choice between 4/4, 5/4 and 5/5 which actually adds a layer of depth to your skill-planning - people playing with a long time horizon in mind (because they know they will stick with EVE for a few years) can choose other options as people who want the skills to fly some shiny ship right now. If you intend to spend a lot of time in 0.0, you might want to choose a different option than if you tend to stay in your +5 high-sec clone. Always thought this was a pretty neat feature of EVE - you actually have to make decisions that will hurt one way or another and mindless min-maxing does not work as such. (as you might guess, I am not a big fan of neural remaps, either)
Miilla	Posted - 2010.06.24 22:05:00 - [133] I hope I can buy skill points with PLEXs I have 50 of them. Bwaahahahhah
Viral Effect Caldari BRAINDEAD Corp	Posted - 2010.06.24 22:11:00 - [134] CCP Shadow has already stated that there are no plans to sell SP http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1341909
Felix Esperium Lysergic Distortions Research and Development	Posted - 2010.06.24 22:32:00 - [135] Edited by: Felix Esperium on 24/06/2010 22:33:02 Originally by: stoicfaux Gee, remaps are optional. Heck, training any skill at all is optional too, as is logging in. I guess you're part of the "let's not rush into things" crowd. Correct, all those things are optional. Glad we have cleared up that training anything (learning skills included) is completely optional. I haven't used a remap yet on my Achura character btw.
Borun Tal Minmatar Wacom Research	Posted - 2010.06.24 23:25:00 - [136] I neither want nor expect anything. Please do not apply to any of my paying accounts (assuming this is real and not a troll).
Lusty Wench	Posted - 2010.06.25 02:30:00 - [137] I'm anticipating that you will be able to apply an item similar to a PLEX, that will double your training speed. It will be purchasable with RL currency from CCP, and tradeable on the market. Just like PLEX. I'd like to think that said item would be stackable up to five times, for five times the training speed. That's my wish anyway.
The Cleansing	Posted - 2010.06.25 02:34:00 - [138] Having another way to buy or gain SP besides the currently stupid and limiting method of going afk or putting off for months what you or your corp needs, would encourage me to champion this game above all others. The current system is archaic and slows the pace of the game too much. I would happily pay for SP every month, no problem. At the worst case, learning skills have got to go, needless, pointless, boring, barrier to entry, waste of time, useless, not fun. See where I'm going here.
Felix Esperium Lysergic Distortions Research and Development	Posted - 2010.06.25 02:36:00 - [139] Originally by: The Cleansing At the worst case, learning skills have got to go, needless, pointless, boring, barrier to entry, waste of time, useless, not fun. See where I'm going here. You know you don't have to train them right? they are optional as we established just a few posts up the page.
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2010.06.25 02:43:00 - [140] Originally by: Felix Esperium Originally by: The Cleansing At the worst case, learning skills have got to go, needless, pointless, boring, barrier to entry, waste of time, useless, not fun. See where I'm going here. You know you don't have to train them right? they are optional as we established just a few posts up the page. Just like breathing is optional. Although it severely gimps your experience.

Felix Esperium Lysergic Distortions Research and Development	Posted - 2010.06.25 02:47:00 - [141] Originally by: Blane Xero Just like breathing is optional. Although it severely gimps your experience. No. breathing is required for life. that is not optional in my book. Am I missing sarcasm here or something?
Grog Barrel	Posted - 2010.06.25 02:59:00 - [142] Originally by: Felix Esperium Originally by: Blane Xero Just like breathing is optional. Although it severely gimps your experience. No. breathing is required for life. that is not optional in my book. Am I missing sarcasm here or something? life is optional, thus breathing is it too for beings aware of the meaning of life. But we are missing the point as everything can be optional. Everyone with over 70 IQ would NOT ignore the learning skills with the current sp system.
Hugh Munguss	Posted - 2010.06.25 03:05:00 - [143] All you wniehy bctheis hvae mtvieaotd me to mizmxiae my rnaiimeng lnreiang slkils form lveel 4 to leevl 5. Mbaye you slohud do the smae if you dno't ustrednand wrod rtigocneoin!
The Cleansing	Posted - 2010.06.25 03:10:00 - [144] Originally by: Lusty Wench I'm anticipating that you will be able to apply an item similar to a PLEX, that will double your training speed. It will be purchasable with RL currency from CCP, and tradeable on the market. Just like PLEX. I'd like to think that said item would be stackable up to five times, for five times the training speed. That's my wish anyway. That would be freaking awesome. Best idea I have ever heard on this topic.
Mr Epeen	Posted - 2010.06.25 03:32:00 - [145] For some reason it makes my teeth hurt when I see this much tin foil in one place. Weird, but true :P Mr Epeen
Empress Aurora	Posted - 2010.06.26 00:14:00 - [146] http://i50.tinypic.com/2z9dsur.jpg
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2010.06.26 00:20:00 - [147] Originally by: Felix Esperium Originally by: Blane Xero Just like breathing is optional. Although it severely gimps your experience. No. breathing is required for life. that is not optional in my book. Am I missing sarcasm here or something? You can choose not to breath in the same aspect as you can choose not to train learning skills. _____________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008 Originally by: CCP Fallout Been there. Done that. Need antibiotics.
Grarr Dexx Amarr GK inc.	Posted - 2010.06.26 00:26:00 - [148] But eventually you'll black out and your subconsciousness will take over I don't see how real life analogies work in a simulation like this.
Jeremiah Tameri Azon Consortium	Posted - 2010.06.26 00:27:00 - [149] Edited by: Jeremiah Tameri on 26/06/2010 00:26:54 Originally by: Empress Aurora http://i50.tinypic.com/2z9dsur.jpg What is this I don't even...
ThaMa Gebir Gallente SUECHTLER Inc. THE-FEDERATION	Posted - 2010.06.26 00:37:00 - [150] Edited by: ThaMa Gebir on 26/06/2010 00:45:00 Originally by: Blane Xero Originally by: Jurai Talar What if it's a system where you train a skill to level x and then you can "pull out" that skill from your brain, package it up and sell it on the market as a "trained lvl x skill." Pulling out never works. Ohhhh. Blaine you naughty naughty boy. (Love it matey ) Also this: Originally by: Jeremiah Tameri Edited by: Jeremiah Tameri on 26/06/2010 00:26:54 Originally by: Empress Aurora http://i50.tinypic.com/2z9dsur.jpg What is this I don't even... Looks like one of those test "devices" some of you may end up wanting but usually find lacking... Like the crystal ball... ---------------------------- Confirmed heaviest member of RDEX........ Hah, no more hijacks here!!!!

dexington	Posted - 2010.06.26 00:45:00 - [151] Learning skills is properly the least optional skill... If you don't like mining you avoid the mining skills, same goes for all other skills. If you don't like one aspect of the game, you don't train skills that make you better at that part of the game. Learning skills don't work that way, not matter what part of the game you enjoy, aslong as it can be improved by skills you will benefit from learning skills. Not training learning skills serves no purpose, you can't say that about many other skills in the game.
Rellik B00n Lethal Death Squad	Posted - 2010.06.26 02:01:00 - [152] Asphincter says what? + LDSkill+hireLDS


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