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        | Author | Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) | 
      
      
        |  Dread Operative
 Justified Chaos
 
 18
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.09 16:31:00 -
          [1] - Quote 
 Remove the tier rewards from FW missions. Right now you can get a ******** amount of LP by doing missions while not affecting warzone control at all. So you get more LP with less risk. Removing the tier system for missions benefit those who fight in plexs and bust bunkers and will rise the prices of the current crashed and flooded FW market, letting the PVP'ers earn more.
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        |  IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69
 Angry Mustellid
 Iron Oxide.
 
 268
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.09 16:35:00 -
          [2] - Quote 
 
 Dread Operative wrote:Remove the tier rewards from FW missions. Right now you can get a ******** amount of LP by doing missions while not affecting warzone control at all. So you get more LP with less risk. Removing the tier system for missions benefit those who fight in plexs and bust bunkers and will rise the prices of the current crashed and flooded FW market, letting the PVP'ers earn more. 
 What about the PVPers who run missions?
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        |  Dread Operative
 Justified Chaos
 
 18
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.09 17:26:00 -
          [3] - Quote 
 You still shouldn't be able to make 300k+ LP an hour, any way you look at it.
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        |  Princess Nexxala
 Quantum Cats Syndicate
 Drunk 'n' Disorderly
 
 162
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.09 20:37:00 -
          [4] - Quote 
 I agree mission should be removed from FW
 QCATs is recruiting
 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=146180
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        |  IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69
 Angry Mustellid
 Iron Oxide.
 
 268
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.09 20:45:00 -
          [5] - Quote 
 
 Dread Operative wrote:You still shouldn't be able to make 300k+ LP an hour, any way you look at it. 
 because...?
 
 
 I agree missions should be more of a conflict driver which I think is how they were intended and I hate farmers as much as anyone else but I don't think you can just say 'You shouldn't be able to make 300k LP/hr from missions'
 
 Also missions have always been far more profitable than plexing, it seems odd that this is brought up now, not 6 months ago.
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        |  X Gallentius
 Justified Chaos
 
 606
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.09 20:50:00 -
          [6] - Quote 
 
 IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69 wrote:It was brought up, but not emphasized because Missions take effort. After Inferno and before this latest patch offensive plexes didn't require any real effort.Also missions have always been far more profitable than plexing, it seems odd that this is brought up now, not 6 months ago. 
 Now that plexes take effort again, the disparity is clear for all to see.
 
 The LP multiplier for missions is rubbish. And yes, making 310k LP/hour for an activity that doesn't help the occupancy war is not right.
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        |  chatgris
 Quantum Cats Syndicate
 Drunk 'n' Disorderly
 
 236
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.09 21:13:00 -
          [7] - Quote 
 Missions have a purpose - to pay a side that has won.
 
 Make missions failable by the opposing faction in a reasonable timeframe (not I camped it for 13 hrs yay it expired).
 
 Then you could possibly adjust the payout multiplier. But at least there's a chance it can be failed instead of "oh, moving on ignoring that missions for an hour will come back when pvper is bored while I do my other missions" advantage that missioning currently has.
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        |  Cromwell Savage
 Quantum Cats Syndicate
 Drunk 'n' Disorderly
 
 89
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.09 21:18:00 -
          [8] - Quote 
 I've never had a problem with missions due to the very fact they have no impact on "sov". Still don't.
 
 
 
 It's plexes that I wish were removed from FW all together. If I wanted to play sov wars, I'd move to dull-sec....
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        |  Deen Wispa
 Justified Chaos
 
 360
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.09 21:25:00 -
          [9] - Quote 
 >>>In recognition of your successful completion of the mission 'Dead Men Tell No Tales' to aid the cause of our militia, Federal Defense Union grants you 80,694 loyalty points.
 
 
 This is too much LP. I agree with Dread; get rid of tier rewards for missions. It's mostly just farmers freeloading off of the work of those who affect WZ control.
 Gallente FW Blog http://iamsheriff.com/blog
 C'est La Eve :)
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        |  Flyingleanpocket
 Amarrian Vengeance
 
 6
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.09 21:33:00 -
          [10] - Quote 
 
 Deen Wispa wrote:>>>In recognition of your successful completion of the mission 'Dead Men Tell No Tales' to aid the cause of our militia, Federal Defense Union grants you 80,694 loyalty points.
 control.
 
 
 Holy Megathron Navy Issues Batman! App Incoming!
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        |  Destru Kaneda
 CTRL-Q
 Iron Oxide.
 
 121
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.09 21:47:00 -
          [11] - Quote 
 
 Princess Nexxala wrote:I agree mission should be removed from FW 
 What she said.
 
 Music for robots, geeks, hackers, and nerds.
 Nerdiest homepage on the internet?
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        |  X Gallentius
 Justified Chaos
 
 606
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.09 23:22:00 -
          [12] - Quote 
 Our Navy Domis will blot out the sun!
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        |  Jack Togenada
 State War Academy
 Caldari State
 
 5
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.09 23:39:00 -
          [13] - Quote 
 They're going to modify the missions once they get done with the plex changes. Missions don't really fit into the overall setup of things, but they're a lot less boring than plexing.
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        |  Sura Sadiva
 Entropic Tactical Crew
 
 27
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.10 00:56:00 -
          [14] - Quote 
 Missions can be:
 
 1. A resource for fighters. In this case makes sense to have it linked to the tier: more terrirotrial control = more resources and benefits (aka: consequences). But since loosing systems already penalize preventing the access to agents then misison (less warzone control = less resources. Consequences) could also be adjusted on a flat payout and to be not linked to tiers.
 
 
 2. Fights drivers. In this case should be totally redesigned to make them more an engagment occasion, more "risky" andd also viable/profittable with proper PvP ships, and not just in SB.
 
 
 
 
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        |  Bad Messenger
 Nasranite Watch
 Liandri Covenant
 
 289
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.10 02:15:00 -
          [15] - Quote 
 Hey , do not cry about FW missions.
 
 Those are just what players wanted. On original FW version no one did those missions, but then comes militia CSM candidates who wanted good income for FW players to make isk for pvp, and we sure made isk after several boosts.
 
 Sad thing is that no one has done any pvp after that.
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        |  Vordak Kallager
 Autocannons Anonymous
 Late Night Alliance
 
 482
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.10 03:18:00 -
          [16] - Quote 
 
 Bad Messenger wrote:Hey , do not cry about FW missions.
 Those are just what players wanted. On original FW version no one did those missions, but then comes militia CSM candidates who wanted good income for FW players to make isk for pvp, and we sure made isk after several boosts.
 
 Sad thing is that no one has done any pvp after that.
 
 No one did missions in pre-Inferno? What are you smoking?
 Sa souvraya niende misain ye.
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        |  Cearain
 Imperial Outlaws
 
 640
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.10 03:30:00 -
          [17] - Quote 
 I don't see what plexing has to do with pvp any more than missions. Both give a beacon people in the system can see. At least missions force you in a certain system. Plexing you can choose to go hide in any empty system you want.
 
 Perhaps someday plexing will be a pvp activity and then I will agree that the rewards should be adjusted.
 Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve
 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
 
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        |  Damar Rocarion
 Nasranite Watch
 Liandri Covenant
 
 178
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.10 05:34:00 -
          [18] - Quote 
 
 Vordak Kallager wrote:No one did missions in pre-Inferno? What are you smoking?  
 he is referring to "old times" when missions gave crappy lp and actual conversion ratio in lp store was pretty bad. Then came Gallente sponsored Ankh CSM and that's pretty much the moment FW started going wrong.
 
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        |  Schalac
 Apocalypse Reign
 
 123
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.10 06:32:00 -
          [19] - Quote 
 
 Damar Rocarion wrote:Vordak Kallager wrote:No one did missions in pre-Inferno? What are you smoking?  he is referring to "old times" when missions gave crappy lp and actual conversion ratio in lp store was pretty bad. Then came Gallente sponsored Ankh CSM and that's pretty much the moment FW started going wrong. You mean the moment that everyone and their mother joined Cal Mil to farm missions and then used the inflated numbers that the change brought to champion more changes because of the so called "imbalance" of "players" on the caldari side.
 
 
 Sounds a lot like the amarr for the last few months doesn't it.
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        |  IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69
 Angry Mustellid
 Iron Oxide.
 
 268
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.10 09:51:00 -
          [20] - Quote 
 
 X Gallentius wrote:The LP multiplier for missions is rubbish. And yes, making 310k LP/hour for an activity that doesn't help the occupancy war is not right. 
 Ok accepting your first few points here, but this is just silly, what if 310k LP is only worth 10m? do you still have a problem with it then? There seems to be an attitude of 'OMG big number, that must be wrong' Even though mission runners are now earning a small fraction of what was possible pre-patch.
 
 Since when did LP have to be about occupancy, it has only been a blink of the eye in FW history where they had any relation what so ever and now suddenly they are strictly tied. I'd rather LP was completely separate then the farmers don't ruin the occupancy war.
 
 
 Deen Wispa wrote:This is too much LP. It has had an negative impact on the Gallente FW store as well. Practically everything has tanked.  
 Wow. It's almost like the market is regulating the amount people earn based on the availability of LP.
 
 
 
 
 In this thread: Lots of people who base their arguments on 100k LP worth 1k /LP is different to 25k LP worth 4k/LP.
 
 And no I haven't run a mission since the update and I don't have much intention to do so.
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        |  Schalac
 Apocalypse Reign
 
 124
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.10 11:21:00 -
          [21] - Quote 
 
 IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69 wrote:Deen Wispa wrote:This is too much LP. It has had an negative impact on the Gallente FW store as well. Practically everything has tanked.  Wow. It's almost like the market is regulating the amount people earn based on the availability of LP. No, what it is, is all the '1337' PvP'ers complaining because they aren't making as much money as they were before inferno from running their missions. It is a simple case of buyers remorse. They championed change because they couldn't compete with the CALALT army in the first iteration of FW change, and they are crying again because now their LP isn't worth as much as when missions were the only way to gain LP.
 
 Here is a hint Deen, EVERYTHING has tanked and you have only your factions crying and complaining to blame.
 
 
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        |  Cearain
 Imperial Outlaws
 
 642
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.10 11:46:00 -
          [22] - Quote 
 
 Schalac wrote:Damar Rocarion wrote:Vordak Kallager wrote:No one did missions in pre-Inferno? What are you smoking?  he is referring to "old times" when missions gave crappy lp and actual conversion ratio in lp store was pretty bad. Then came Gallente sponsored Ankh CSM and that's pretty much the moment FW started going wrong. You mean the moment that everyone and their mother joined Cal Mil to farm missions and then used the inflated numbers that the change brought to champion more changes because of the so called "imbalance" of "players" on the caldari side.  Sounds a lot like the amarr for the last few months doesn't it. 
 
 I don't know about other amarr. But this amarr always prefered economic balance and the good fights it brings, over trillions of isk making the war lopsided.
 
 We could have had everything pvp, money to pvp, and balance. But CCP started out by just throwing tons of money at their new feature before making mechanics changes to increase the balance and pvp. This brought some exta pvp due to the sheer number of people farming isk in the same place. But now that the isk is drying up and most of the noobs are leaving we just have an unbalanced war with a bunch of other changes casual pvpers hate. Null style station lock outs, and soon we will have to spam the dscan button like the oc wh dwellers everytime we run a plex in a busy system.
 
 Lets face it, all our hopes that ccp would turn fw plexing into this awesome crazy pvp mechanic were completely misguided. Instead of making plexing a pvp mechanic they turned it into a more annoying form of pve.
 Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve
 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
 
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        |  Schalac
 Apocalypse Reign
 
 124
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.10 12:39:00 -
          [23] - Quote 
 
 Cearain wrote:Schalac wrote:Damar Rocarion wrote:Vordak Kallager wrote:No one did missions in pre-Inferno? What are you smoking?  he is referring to "old times" when missions gave crappy lp and actual conversion ratio in lp store was pretty bad. Then came Gallente sponsored Ankh CSM and that's pretty much the moment FW started going wrong. You mean the moment that everyone and their mother joined Cal Mil to farm missions and then used the inflated numbers that the change brought to champion more changes because of the so called "imbalance" of "players" on the caldari side.  Sounds a lot like the amarr for the last few months doesn't it. I don't know about other amarr. But this amarr always prefered economic balance and the good fights it brings, over trillions of isk making the war lopsided.  We could have had everything pvp, money to pvp, and balance. But CCP started out by just throwing tons of money at their new feature before making mechanics changes to increase the balance and pvp. This brought some exta pvp due to the sheer number of people farming isk in the same place. But now that the isk is drying up and most of the noobs are leaving we just have an unbalanced war with a bunch of other changes casual pvpers hate. Null style station lock outs, and soon we will have to spam the dscan button like the oc wh dwellers everytime we run a plex in a busy system.  Lets face it, all our hopes that ccp would turn fw plexing into this awesome crazy pvp mechanic were completely misguided. Instead of making plexing a pvp mechanic they turned it into a more annoying form of pve.  Except that the way the plex mechanic worked at the start of Inferno was the same mechanic that was around for years. All they did was added LP for completing them. How people thought that this was going to drive more PvP is beyond me. There was a thread in 2010 or 2009 about how to fix plexing and before there was even talk about getting LP for it that was like 20+ pages. Yet CCP, as always, took a look at the main complaint, the frogs saying that there is no point in plexing because it doesn't mean anything and you get nothing from it, and they were plenty vocal about it too. While all of the good ideas are tossed aside and look who is the main ones complaining again...those damned frogs. Except this time they are complaining that it is too easy to make LP.
 
 I just can't wait to see what is going to happen when DUST starts to count towards system control as well. I wonder if you will get LP that will be transferable to EVE items.
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        |  X Gallentius
 Justified Chaos
 
 607
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.10 13:59:00 -
          [24] - Quote 
 
 IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69 wrote:31 Federation Navy Comets will always be worth more than 100 million isk - to me. However, I get your point - I just don't think it applies in this case.Ok accepting your first few points here, but this is just silly, what if 310k LP is only worth 10m? do you still have a problem with it then? There seems to be an attitude of 'OMG big number, that must be wrong' Even though mission runners are now earning a small fraction of what was possible pre-patch.
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        |  Cearain
 Imperial Outlaws
 
 642
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.10 15:08:00 -
          [25] - Quote 
 While I don't blame frogs or any particular faction it is true that ccp just threw isk at fw as opposed to changing the actual plex dmechanic to make it less pve and more pvp.
 
 Some frogs like chatgris warned against that approach.
 Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve
 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
 
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        |  X Gallentius
 Justified Chaos
 
 607
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.10 16:52:00 -
          [26] - Quote 
 
 Cearain wrote:While I don't blame frogs or any particular faction it is true that ccp just threw isk at fw as opposed to changing the actual plex dmechanic to make it less pve and more pvp.
 Some frogs like chatgris warned against that approach.
 *sigh* please log in and play the game.
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        |  chatgris
 Quantum Cats Syndicate
 Drunk 'n' Disorderly
 
 236
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.10 17:38:00 -
          [27] - Quote 
 
 IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69 wrote:X Gallentius wrote:The LP multiplier for missions is rubbish. And yes, making 310k LP/hour for an activity that doesn't help the occupancy war is not right. Ok accepting your first few points here, but this is just silly, what if 310k LP is only worth 10m? do you still have a problem with it then?  
 Yes - because mission running is a purely pve activity, no way for the opposing side to fail your mission (you can reject the one pickup missions that pays crap), and it makes far far more LP than the pvp activities (plexing).
 
 It is EXACTLY because the market adjusts that this is a problem.
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        |  Cearain
 Imperial Outlaws
 
 643
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.11 14:14:00 -
          [28] - Quote 
 
 X Gallentius wrote:Cearain wrote:While I don't blame frogs or any particular faction it is true that ccp just threw isk at fw as opposed to changing the actual plex dmechanic to make it less pve and more pvp.
 Some frogs like chatgris warned against that approach.
 *sigh* please log in and play the game.  
 
 I did. Last time I roamed for about an hour in a merlin. I was willing to fight some afs, any destroyers and most navy frigates and of course other t1 frigates. No fights. A comet in a plex ran from me and I warped from a plex when and enemy altron, firetail and catalyst landed. The time before that I roamed for about an hour and got one so so fight. Another time before that I roamed for about 1.5 hours and got 1 fight.
 
 This is barely better - if at all - than pre inferno. There was a time right after inferno when I could get 3-7 fights per 2 hours. Thats pretty much no longer the case. The only thing they did to increase the fights in fw was throw allot of isk at it and thereby increase the number of people per system. Now that the isk has dried up, it's the same as ever.
 Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve
 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
 
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        |  IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69
 Angry Mustellid
 Iron Oxide.
 
 269
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.11 14:33:00 -
          [29] - Quote 
 
 chatgris wrote:Yes - because mission running is a purely pve activity, no way for the opposing side to fail your mission (you can reject the one pickup missions that pays crap), and it makes far far more LP than the pvp activities (plexing). 
 Fair enough, I always understood it as LP from kills and plexing where just to help you along with the intention of missions being an income source.
 
 I still maintain it would be better if none of it gave LP and missions were the only income source, funnily enough that was when plexing gave the best fights. At least then you could ignore people who were farming and you knew when someone was plexing they wanted a fight, now the two are far too blurred.
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        |  X Gallentius
 Justified Chaos
 
 607
 
 
       | Posted - 2012.11.11 14:39:00 -
          [30] - Quote 
 
 Cearain wrote:You must be the worst solo roamer in the history of Eve. Seriously.I did. Last time I roamed for about an hour in a merlin. I was willing to fight some afs, any destroyers and most navy frigates and of course other t1 frigates. No fights.  | 
      
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