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What's the interest of the new low-sec systems ?

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PriceScout	Posted - 2005.08.20 17:55:00 - [1] A couple of hours ago I was checking the map for podding zones (a reflex since the last changes to eve map). I switched on "Show Escape pod destroyed in the last 24" and instead of usually seeing big red spots at the entrance of the 0.0 areas, these big red spots were right in the middle of the Empire zone in <0.5 SL system. Koumonen (0.4) : 37 pod kill (Bleak - Heimatar) Tannolen (0.3) : 39 pod kill (The Citadel - Verge Vendor) Siseide (0.3) : 27 pod kill (Heimatar - Everyshore) Meanwhile, the entrances to 0.0 area were often under 20. What's the interest of all this ? Giving some fun to two cents pirates ? Usually you have a couple of BSs doing a rampage whenever a ship enter the system. The only effect is to make the trade route longer, spoiling Hauleurs/traders'game experience. These players are shooting at everything, it is not even a question of easy money making. I even heard a player complaining because he got podded in a shuttle and lost his implants. I know that it is legit but to me it looks more like griefing than gaming. There is no challenge in such gaming, just the pleasure of spoiling other's time. When will CCP manage to transform the 0.0 areas into a real challenge ?! Instead of having thousands of players fighting in 0.0, you only have huge empty areas and thousands of what I call griefers shooting carebears in Empire. What's the point of putting these low sec systems between Empire regions ? I thought CCP's aim was to bring more people in 0.0. You failed with Exodus and still failing.
Majin Buu	Posted - 2005.08.20 18:05:00 - [2] empire wars???? 5 ATUK
Syrec	Posted - 2005.08.20 18:06:00 - [3] Lots of empire pirates simply aren't tuff enough to roll with the big boys in 0.0. Unless you have X amount of skills, certain ships, mods etc, it usually isn't advised that you try to pirate in 0.0 because you will meet people in 0.0 with good ships. In empire once your flag is off the carebears can't shoot you. The empire rules provide a blanket of security for newb-rats. It can also be very profitable. Since they aren't losing as many ships as they would in 0.0, they can make off with some nice loot.
Deja Thoris	Posted - 2005.08.20 18:07:00 - [4] I had a corp mate lose a ship to one of the same camps. She was in an mwd'ing interceptor so the campers are well prepared. (So don't see me as entirely unsymathetic) Perhaps the "traders and haulers" could - Band together and go and bust the camp - Check the map themselves and gasp avoid the area - Travel on instas or in tougher ships I can justify everything with a reason and counter arguement. It gets old. Podded in a shuttle? Well the camper just got an offer for implants from his agent. He's creating a market. It's been said a million times. You accept the risk when you ignore that pop up warning. Adapt or avoid. Dont whine.
Deja Thoris	Posted - 2005.08.20 18:10:00 - [5] Originally by: Syrec Lots of empire pirates simply aren't tuff enough to roll with the big boys in 0.0. Unless you have X amount of skills, certain ships, mods etc, it usually isn't advised that you try to pirate in 0.0 because you will meet people in 0.0 with good ships. In empire once your flag is off the carebears can't shoot you. The empire rules provide a blanket of security for newb-rats. It can also be very profitable. Since they aren't losing as many ships as they would in 0.0, they can make off with some nice loot. Tundragon are one of the corps operating a gatecamp today. They normally operate in 0.0 - They are pretty skilled PvP'rs so your whole schpiel up there is just your hopes and dreams and not fact
Ikvar	Posted - 2005.08.20 18:21:00 - [6] Originally by: Syrec Lots of empire pirates simply aren't tuff enough to roll with the big boys in 0.0. When you go under -5.0, everywhere is 0.0
X'orena	Posted - 2005.08.20 18:54:00 - [7] The best agents are in low sec space. Which means, transports loaded with agent loot and BS's fitted with agent loot.
Viceroy	Posted - 2005.08.20 19:25:00 - [8] How about doing something about it instead of crying your heart out on the forums? You have all the advantages from a game-mechanics point of view, yet you're still whining that it's unfair. What is unfair exactly? The fact that pirates utilize more of their brain cells? Quit moaning about "griefers!" and "ruined gaming experience!" (:~~~[river]~~((() and mount some sort of counter-attack. It's not that hard to kill a -5 sec status guy who has sentries pounding on him, or a sniper at 150km range who has nothing but damage mods and tracking computers equipped. Don't blame the system for your own incompetance, and if you can't handle it, move back to 0.5+ where's it's nice and safe. __________________________ Finite Horizon Your end is our beginning.
Andrue	Posted - 2005.08.20 19:29:00 - [9] Edited by: Andrue on 20/08/2005 19:31:06 Yeah this could put people off Eve. I (a char of mine anyway) have lost two haulers and one clone to these jerks. They tried to take down that char's Maller last time but didn't have the right setup. That char didn't even have plates fitted but he got away. Although it is within game rules and game mechanics I think CCP need to look into this. A little risk is one thing but getting ganked at a gate in half a second is another. One thing that can put most people off Eve is feeling trapped in a station or system. Take away the freedom to travel and Eve is a horrible experience. It's all well and good to say people should fight back but a lot of people don't want to. With the recent map changes you can really shaft someone's enjoyment of the game with a gate gank. -- (Battle hardened miner) [Brackley, UK] WARNING:This post may contain large doses of reality.
Tairos Hakonnus	Posted - 2005.08.20 19:41:00 - [10] I WAS GANKED I AM SAD (<3 Vice) ---------------------------- http://spla.sh/bp/bp_files/main.htm
Avon	Posted - 2005.08.20 22:38:00 - [11] Originally by: Andrue It's all well and good to say people should fight back but a lot of people don't want to. That's fine, but it is at that point that they lose the right to complain. ______________________________________________ Pay or pray..er..prey..yeah, pray you aren't prey. Er, just pay.
Marcus Aurelius	Posted - 2005.08.20 22:46:00 - [12] The need to compete, and thus the need to fight back, should never be removed or made insubstantial. However, it would be nice to see more ways to 'fight back' then just fitting guns and shooting them. I could imagine how Eve would look quite differently if economic warfare would become a reasonable tool of competition as well for example.
Joshua Foiritain	Posted - 2005.08.20 22:52:00 - [13] Edited by: Joshua Foiritain on 20/08/2005 22:53:09 I like hunting down pirates, these new chokepoints are great as its no longer hard to find one PS: Take the long +0.5 route around. ------------------ [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
sableye	Posted - 2005.08.20 22:59:00 - [14] ok I don' like pirates but they are the only thing that makes low security actually low secuirty, I've hadmany a good tangle with a pirate. If they are camping somewhere you move get your corp todo something about it or join with allies, in my corp if its a major incedent we will join with friends and go clear them. when the autopilot was broken it used to send you through one 0.4 space when traveling from amaar to gallente space, anyway a corp member got nailed but we took some fighters to that system and they logged, now logging may not the greatest of fights but it means you won, we ke[pt that system clear that night, but I did pod that poor pirate later that week as they were in my home system of renyn in a pod with -5 :) (talk about luck).
Xelios	Posted - 2005.08.20 23:00:00 - [15] Pirates mostly, BS either sniping beyond sentry range or warping in/out while tanking them. And we don't ONLY have griefers in empire, there's TONS of fighting going on in 0.0. Pirating in empire is a perfectly legit activity, 3 systems have a lot of pirate activity and you're whining that they should be in 0.0 instead? Maybe you should spend some time in 0.0 and see how many people are actually out here already before declaring Exodus a failure because a few pirates in low sec empire are playing a perfectly legit (and advertised) career. ____________________________________________________________________
Xander XacXorien	Posted - 2005.08.20 23:24:00 - [16] It is too easy to grief Eve players - especially newbies - this is wrong. The Corporation system is too restrictive and again allows too much exploitation of players. Would be nice to introduce co-operatives as well as Corps IMHO. Fleet combat is very poor. A group of ships should not be able to concentrate their fire power on one spot - there should be some account made of where guns are mounted and the line of fire - u should not be able to shoot through other ships, asteroids, debris, space stations, planets, moons,,, you know - the solid stuff. Corporation members end up being nothing more than bums on seats in a fleet battle. Little or no skill is required - it's purely a matter of numbers.
Marie D'Artois	Posted - 2005.08.20 23:34:00 - [17] Nine BSes with support ships is hard to avoid and too tough for a small corp to take out. One ship lost isn't the end of the world, though. I know my friend is looking to return the favor. Marie D'Artois Legal Counsellor Team JAVELIN
Kar Brogan	Posted - 2005.08.20 23:37:00 - [18] Want to utalise lowesec and the advantages it entails? (low rent, ok ore, ok rats, mission reward increase) well you have to be ready to fight for it. My corp has lost a number of ships to pirates 'shrug' it happens. Note, however, that your average gate camping battleship is NOT setup for pvp but rather for a shoot 'n' scoot.A number of camping battleships in our area of operation have been driven off by cruisers and frigates no less. Figure out what is sustainable Pvp for your financial situation (ie what ship can you afford to loose 1 of every day) and throw them into combat.You will be suprised
Grant Smith	Posted - 2005.08.20 23:48:00 - [19] It does seem ironic when people get killed in lowsec yet complain about it when it happens. If you aren't prepared to lose your ship/pod then don't put it in a compramising position. I've had hatemail off people, some have even tried to get me to buy them a new ship. I have no sympathy for the whiners. If you can't afford to lose it - don;t fly it. You know the drill.
nitr0s	Posted - 2005.08.21 00:53:00 - [20] Same thread, differen day I find it amuzing though taht a BOB guy would complain. Maybe he could look at the scum he flies with that camps these systmes (hello bnc).
Brisi	Posted - 2005.08.21 01:26:00 - [21] Originally by: Syrec Lots of empire pirates simply aren't tuff enough to roll with the big boys in 0.0. Unless you have X amount of skills, certain ships, mods etc, it usually isn't advised that you try to pirate in 0.0 because you will meet people in 0.0 with good ships. In empire once your flag is off the carebears can't shoot you. The empire rules provide a blanket of security for newb-rats. It can also be very profitable. Since they aren't losing as many ships as they would in 0.0, they can make off with some nice loot. "Aren't 'tuff' (read: tough) enough to roll with the big boys in 0.0? I have to say that this is bull****. Firstly, it doesn't take a very long time gate camping, untill you reach -5.0 or below, and at this point, empire is actually more dangerous than 0.0. Second, whenever I go on an op to some 0.0 space, we can never get a fair fight. It might look like our fleet of 3-4 BS's plus support, is about to engage a similar fleet, however, the moment we engage, 20 more ships appear from the other gate. This happens all the time, how's this for 'fair' PvP? At this point 'X amount of skill' is completely redundant. Also, yes, you can make quite a profit from camping gates in empire. However, it's also very easy to lose ships, I don't think the difference from a 0.0 gatecamp, and an empire one is all that different. Except in empire, you have all the different merc corps looking for action (KIA, Battle Angels, I'm looking in your direction ) which is all good, but from the campers view, much more of a risk.
Jebidus Skari	Posted - 2005.08.21 01:35:00 - [22] Originally by: Syrec Lots of empire pirates simply aren't tuff enough to roll with the big boys in 0.0. Unless you have X amount of skills, certain ships, mods etc, it usually isn't advised that you try to pirate in 0.0 because you will meet people in 0.0 with good ships.
Elrathias mkII	Posted - 2005.08.21 01:44:00 - [23] dammit i cant find the m0o iwin button hack program screenshot. anyone got a linky?
voodoo	Posted - 2005.08.21 01:49:00 - [24] lol i went through one of these "gatecamps" in empire. I happened to be moving a BS around. Really wasn't too concerned with the pirating problem in empire, Im normally in 0.0 or in the station lounge. I merrily jumped into the 1st of 3, .3 systems, to reach my destination. Yup there they are. These empire pk'ers everyone so despises. My overview says these are some friendly dudes and have yet to make it to our red list. Plus theres these two sentry guns surely they wouldnt bother me at a gate. Once the first one fired I began to laugh as the sentry gun begins to fire. The the other ships begin to fire as well. Not at me but the remote armor repairers were feeding this guy armor. My laughter inside began to leave. I was in aw at there masterful attempt to destroy my newly produced megathron in such a fashion. At that point an uergent message came in from my destination system.... It read " Dinner time 5 min. Hurry home " Oh well enough playtime with these nasty but fun to point at pk'ers. I simply engauged the last of my 7 warp core stabs and went home for a nice dinner follwed by space sex with aliens. moral of the story Don't be late for dinner I wasn't The Blue Pills Make Me Happy
Allen Deckard	Posted - 2005.08.21 02:41:00 - [25] Originally by: Viceroy How about doing something about it instead of crying your heart out on the forums? You have all the advantages from a game-mechanics point of view, yet you're still whining that it's unfair. What is unfair exactly? The fact that pirates utilize more of their brain cells? Quit moaning about "griefers!" and "ruined gaming experience!" (:~~~[river]~~((() and mount some sort of counter-attack. It's not that hard to kill a -5 sec status guy who has sentries pounding on him, or a sniper at 150km range who has nothing but damage mods and tracking computers equipped. Don't blame the system for your own incompetance, and if you can't handle it, move back to 0.5+ where's it's nice and safe. Just currious but where do you see the advantage of game mechanics? If you don't want to ruin your sec status you have to wait for the pirate to agress and if you out number or out power the pirates they simply wont agress. This gives the advantage to the pirate if you ask me.
Deja Thoris	Posted - 2005.08.21 03:17:00 - [26] Originally by: Allen Deckard Originally by: Viceroy How about doing something about it instead of crying your heart out on the forums? You have all the advantages from a game-mechanics point of view, yet you're still whining that it's unfair. What is unfair exactly? The fact that pirates utilize more of their brain cells? Quit moaning about "griefers!" and "ruined gaming experience!" (:~~~[river]~~((() and mount some sort of counter-attack. It's not that hard to kill a -5 sec status guy who has sentries pounding on him, or a sniper at 150km range who has nothing but damage mods and tracking computers equipped. Don't blame the system for your own incompetance, and if you can't handle it, move back to 0.5+ where's it's nice and safe. Just currious but where do you see the advantage of game mechanics? If you don't want to ruin your sec status you have to wait for the pirate to agress and if you out number or out power the pirates they simply wont agress. This gives the advantage to the pirate if you ask me. They are -10. You can shoot them anytime and any place. You have been in the game long enough to know this.
PriceScout	Posted - 2005.08.21 06:19:00 - [27] 1/ I'm not saying that it is unfair to be killed in low-sec. I'm just saying that going from one region to another is now so long that it transformed low-sec systems into new highways. If someone get podded because he mined/hunted/missionned in 0.4, that's part of the game. 2/ For gamers focused on trading and industry (and they also have the right to play the game, PVPers don't own Eve) it is very easy to avoid these systems so the only result is to longer the hauling times. Therefore spoiling the game experience. 3/ There is no glory in podding industrial in 0.4. That's why I'm talking about griefing. Pirates in 0.4 are just 2 cents PVPers. So stop walking on the moral high ground and call others whinners. Should I count the number of times pirates whinned on this forum ? 4/ It seems quite easy to recover from a security loss. You just have to spend some time killing npc pirates (and btw keep on earning money with bounties). Maybe CCP should make it harder to recover security points and therefore having "professionnal pirates" having -5>-10 security status instead of -1.
Deja Thoris	Posted - 2005.08.21 06:41:00 - [28] Originally by: PriceScout 1/ I'm not saying that it is unfair to be killed in low-sec. I'm just saying that going from one region to another is now so long that it transformed low-sec systems into new highways. If someone get podded because he mined/hunted/missionned in 0.4, that's part of the game. 2/ For gamers focused on trading and industry (and they also have the right to play the game, PVPers don't own Eve) it is very easy to avoid these systems so the only result is to longer the hauling times. Therefore spoiling the game experience. 3/ There is no glory in podding industrial in 0.4. That's why I'm talking about griefing. Pirates in 0.4 are just 2 cents PVPers. So stop walking on the moral high ground and call others whinners. Should I count the number of times pirates whinned on this forum ? 4/ It seems quite easy to recover from a security loss. You just have to spend some time killing npc pirates (and btw keep on earning money with bounties). Maybe CCP should make it harder to recover security points and therefore having "professionnal pirates" having -5>-10 security status instead of -1. Everybodies trips got longer. It's hard to recover sec status. Do the maths. It's harder post patch too. Really, do the maths. Don't just spout off about it.
DigitalCommunist	Posted - 2005.08.21 07:05:00 - [29] Originally by: PriceScout 1/ I'm not saying that it is unfair to be killed in low-sec. I'm just saying that going from one region to another is now so long that it transformed low-sec systems into new highways. If someone get podded because he mined/hunted/missionned in 0.4, that's part of the game. Uh, its ok to kill someone in lowsec when they mine hunt or mission but not when they travel? Well damn I didn't know about this rule! And here I was playing for years not realizing its not part of the game to do such things, boy do I feel silly! Quote: 2/ For gamers focused on trading and industry (and they also have the right to play the game, PVPers don't own Eve) it is very easy to avoid these systems so the only result is to longer the hauling times. Therefore spoiling the game experience. Hmm. Higher risk, higher reward... lower risk, lower reward.. You know whose game experience this would ruin? Carebears! Quote: 3/ There is no glory in podding industrial in 0.4. That's why I'm talking about griefing. Pirates in 0.4 are just 2 cents PVPers. So stop walking on the moral high ground and call others whinners. Should I count the number of times pirates whinned on this forum ? Oh sweet, more useful insight. Podding haulers in 0.4 has no glory, but in 0.0 its perfectly ok. Catching people off guard loaded with goodies is a perfect example of grief play. All low sec pirates can't pvp. Aaannd..pirates are walking a high ground because of this! Wow. Quote: 4/ It seems quite easy to recover from a security loss. You just have to spend some time killing npc pirates (and btw keep on earning money with bounties). Maybe CCP should make it harder to recover security points and therefore having "professionnal pirates" having -5>-10 security status instead of -1. 1. Try it, or don't pretend you know what you're talking about. 2. Nice contradiction, your "two cent pvpers" who ruin there sec status in one day are also the professionals. On behalf of the Non-aligned Pirates of Syndicate (NAPS), I bring you the following message: NWO is good. It affects us all equally. You will learn to like it, and like it you will. And.. one day, you will forget there ever existed a time when all of eve was 5 jumps within Yulai. That is all. _____________________________________ Perpetually driven, your end is our beginning.
PriceScout	Posted - 2005.08.21 07:30:00 - [30] I suppose killing carebears is your favorite activity, Digital commie ? Quote: Uh, its ok to kill someone in lowsec when they mine hunt or mission but not when they travel? First it is a good thing to learn how to read. That is useful to answer someone else's post. Quote: Hmm. Higher risk, higher reward... What is the higher reward for TRAVELLING in 0.4 ? Quote: Catching people off guard loaded with goodies is a perfect example of grief play. All low sec pirates can't pvp Complete non-sense. Read what you write. Quote: 2. Nice contradiction, your "two cent pvpers" who ruin there sec status in one day are also the professionals. I put the word professionnal between quotes, since you seem to don't know what's the meaning of quotes in a sentence, I'm gonna rewrite my sentence with less irony : they are professionnal pirates in the sense they chose piracy as their main activity. I can understand that you don't like me criticizing your main (and probably) only activity in Eve. But please, if you want to debate bring some real points in the debate. Concerning the NAPS quote, good for them but I still don't agree with their point of view.
Chargon	Posted - 2005.08.21 07:58:00 - [31] Edited by: Chargon on 21/08/2005 07:59:51 Mounting attacks with empire rats is pointless. Everytime We doit they either hide in there stations or log.Empire Pirates and Pirate Corps are nothing more then noob *****s they cant fight anyone with skill. Chances are they couldnt fight there way out of a wet paper bag. So to say mount a attack is meaningless they always go crawl under a rock. While a few do stay and fight the majority are greifers. the only way I see things could be fixed is give the sentury guns better range. 180km is a decent range. Other then that Our so called Carbears can just flyaround the Dangerouse systems. Just to make 1 thing clear though roughly 73% of the eve pop are carebears without them Chances are you would have no eve. Count your blessings and show some respect for the carebears.
Marcus Aurelius	Posted - 2005.08.21 09:01:00 - [32] Originally by: PriceScout 1/ I'm not saying that it is unfair to be killed in low-sec. I'm just saying that going from one region to another is now so long that it transformed low-sec systems into new highways. If someone get podded because he mined/hunted/missionned in 0.4, that's part of the game. Any kill is part of the game if there was a reason for it. To be more exact, any kill or other method of competition is the objective of the game. Quote: 2/ For gamers focused on trading and industry (and they also have the right to play the game, PVPers don't own Eve) it is very easy to avoid these systems so the only result is to longer the hauling times. Therefore spoiling the game experience. That's one big mistake you make here, as do so many others that come to play Eve without knowing what the game is about. Eve was made with a different chalenge in mind. Things like direct competition, corporation warfare, competing for resources and general unsafety are 100% essential to the philosophy behind Eve. In Eve, there are only coporation members. There is no such thing as 'gamers focusing on one thing only'. Eve's main objective is having fun while operating as a group in a competitive environment. You cannot come to play Eve and expect your experience to be 'instanced' as in free of detrimental influence by other players. That influence is the whole idea behind Eve as a competitive game. If being influenced is ruining your game experience you should re-assess your eve subscription or try and see if broadening your activities wouldn't actually make Eve more fun rather then less. Quote: 3/ There is no glory in podding industrial in 0.4. That's why I'm talking about griefing. Pirates in 0.4 are just 2 cents PVPers. So stop walking on the moral high ground and call others whinners. Should I count the number of times pirates whinned on this forum ? Ok, glory is subjective, but I agree there's no glory in killing shuttles in 0.4 whatsoever. Griefing is another matter altogether however. You see, agression is a tool. Glory is only one of the many reasons for you to use it. Most pirates do it for the fun and isk. That's totally acceptable within the Eve framework, and indeed part of what makes the game fun. Someone able to deal with that now ahs the advantage of getting to fly a shorter route, great stuff isn't it ? Quote: 4/ It seems quite easy to recover from a security loss. You just have to spend some time killing npc pirates (and btw keep on earning money with bounties). Maybe CCP should make it harder to recover security points and therefore having "professionnal pirates" having -5>-10 security status instead of -1. You forget one thing. Most '0.4, warp core stabilising griefers' have their base in empire, NOT 0.0. That means that their ability to go chain high end pirate NPC's for the sec gain is very limited, and not without danger at all seeing how the places that consistenly spawn high end stuff are in alliance territory. Alliances aren't likely to like empire space pirates much either. Security status is quite hard to regain now, and that system works as well as it could at this time. All in all, you are looking at gameplay in a more traditional perspective in which gamers have some right to playing how they want to. Eve knows no such thing. Eve is about interaction, and interaction is not just happy singalongs or cooperative play. It's competition as well, if not more so.
Lord Artemis	Posted - 2005.08.21 09:15:00 - [33] Edited by: Lord Artemis on 21/08/2005 09:16:24 If you would actually attempt to DO something about it instead of whining here you would feel loads better. Pirates are here to stay, I LOVE the fact that they are -5 you can kill them over and over and noone will help them except other pirates in their corp. All that mining and trading and your doing what? stroking your wallet. Get a 6-10 carebears together, build some damn ships and attack them. Not one day or one time but hunt the hunters. They love the action too. They kill you cuz you let them kill you thats all. I'm the farthest thing from a pirate and I'm not defending them but boy-howdy do actions speak better than words and damn it feels good sincerely, Lord Artemis ___________________________ Aegis Militia Conclave official representative
Trooper B99	Posted - 2005.08.21 09:21:00 - [34] Yeah, you know where the pirate camps are, they'll be in the fast, dangerous low sec routes between the empires. Vecamia, tannolen etc etc etc. Go the longer high sec route and you are safe. . . unless you're at war of/c The MC routinely have dealings with the pirates in the low sec camp systems because we of course like the fastest route to our targets. Sometimes we loose a couple intys, but when we do go for them, we do get kills, it's not hard even against multiple BS as long as you're set-up. Don't complain, use the tools at your disposal. Avoid. Avoid the pirates by going hi-sec. Kill. Bring in forces and kill them instead. Remove. Force them off of the gates and into stations and SS. Wirykomi Team Racer - COLOSSUS Championships Year 106
Deja Thoris	Posted - 2005.08.21 10:06:00 - [35] Originally by: Chargon Edited by: Chargon on 21/08/2005 07:59:51 Mounting attacks with empire rats is pointless. Everytime We doit they either hide in there stations or log.Empire Pirates and Pirate Corps are nothing more then noob ***s they cant fight anyone with skill. Chances are they couldnt fight there way out of a wet paper bag. So to say mount a attack is meaningless they always go crawl under a rock. While a few do stay and fight the majority are greifers. the only way I see things could be fixed is give the sentury guns better range. 180km is a decent range. Other then that Our so called Carbears can just flyaround the Dangerouse systems. Just to make 1 thing clear though roughly 73% of the eve pop are carebears without them Chances are you would have no eve. Count your blessings and show some respect for the carebears. 90% of stats are bull**. What does a 2 day old alt attack the pirate in? An impairor? Or arent you proud of your main?
Viceroy	Posted - 2005.08.21 10:15:00 - [36] Quote: 2/ For gamers focused on trading and industry (and they also have the right to play the game, PVPers don't own Eve) it is very easy to avoid these systems so the only result is to longer the hauling times. Therefore spoiling the game experience. You really don't understand the concept behind EVE do you? Longer hauling times = Less risk - Less reward Shorter hauling times = More risk - More reward I'd offer you a tech2 tissue for your ruined gaming experience, but you're whining that your "gaming experience" (lol) was ruined because you made a decision to take a risk and discarded the safer alternatives because they take more time. I suggest that you quit EVE and go back to a more simple game where the difference between PvP and everything else is marked with a thick red line for poor little players that might have their "gaming experience ruined" () and the whole game revolves around grinding and grinding your way up the ladder so you can grind some more. __________________________ Finite Horizon Your end is our beginning.
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.21 22:35:00 - [37] LOL you guys are absolutly ridiculous! "Gather 6-10 of your carebear friends and fight back" Umm.. here maybe a news flash to you but not everyone has spent their time training fighting skills! "Stay out of low security sectors" Fine! But lets have a compromise here.. you want to camp 0.4 sector gates fine. But if you do then lets have some police response if you stay over a certain amount of time. And not just a pittiful response but one that is equivelent to the threat. Am I a carebear? In your eyes since I don't play this game to blast the helpless newbies or other players then yes I am a carebear. This game has no thrill for me as Macro-using, no skill playing, jerks feel that camping gates and being general morons think it is fun to be social deviants.
Snaieke	Posted - 2005.08.21 23:01:00 - [38] So let me get this straight. You whine about pirates ruining your gaming experience because YOU fly into lowsec space, even though the risks are totally known. No one makes you fly into these systems, you do it because of the possible reward of doing so. Now to the issue of pirates ruining your gaming experience. Ever thought that perhaps you could be ruining a pirates gaming experience, which, tbh, it is quite easy to do so. Then there is the issue of more lowsec systems being added. Well, ever thought that these ystems have been added because they are profitable, because going into them means you can reap the reward, and because the old lowsec areas were rather crowded. This then again goes back to the risks of lowsec. You all know the risks, you all know what goes on in lowsec, yet you still choose to fly into lowsec, then ***** that you get killed My names Blind Lemon Jefferson, 'nd I 'dun plucked out muh eyes fuh Jesus
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.21 23:33:00 - [39] Originally by: Snaieke Then there is the issue of more lowsec systems being added. Well, ever thought that these ystems have been added because they are profitable, because going into them means you can reap the reward, and because the old lowsec areas were rather crowded. Crowded? BS!!! You get 6 guys in a sector camping the only two gates and that sector is crowded? So for the enjoyment of 6 people you make the sector unusable for the 100's of other players who may want to use it.
Wendat Huron	Posted - 2005.08.21 23:42:00 - [40] What happened to .4 and below anyways, where's the jaspet?
Nafri	Posted - 2005.08.21 23:54:00 - [41] you can always convo us and pay us to pass and no, most of our guys have between 20-35mio SP, so we are decently skilled for sure Your bla bla hit bla bla for bla bla damage. Wanna have some bubu now?
Lord Artemis	Posted - 2005.08.21 23:57:00 - [42] "Umm.. here maybe a news flash to you but not everyone has spent their time training fighting skills!" I'll bet you were hoping this was gonna put the nail in the coffin for your argument, however, The game (if not at war) has given you 0.5 ^, Stay there and only there and you will be safe. No ebil <yarr> The rest of the game is a bunch of areas consisting of higher rewards and higher risk. Leaving hi-sec = your choice! not training any combat skills in a combat game <snicker> hang on.... <snort>... ok I'm back sorry <ahem> again = your choice! Don't be ***ed at everyone else in the game because you screwed up. Each of us has the same game and the same access to resources etc. Unfortunately for some the game will make you think for yourself. I'm sorry you got the short end of the stick there and I realize your vastly outmatched there. Kick your dad in the nuts, its his fault anyway. Initiate a new system with rubber padding on all ships and objects, replace weapons with bubble blowers and two buttons "STOP" and "GO"* ___________________________ Aegis Militia Conclave official representative
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.21 23:58:00 - [43] Originally by: Nafri you can always convo us and pay us to pass and no, most of our guys have between 20-35mio SP, so we are decently skilled for sure LOL!!! Last 0.4 sector I entered (for an level 1 agent mission) I got jumped at the gate. They did not even ask for anything just started blasting. Convo to pay and pass indeed! You have maybe 30sec before they start blasting away.
Lord Artemis	Posted - 2005.08.22 00:01:00 - [44] Those of you that want instant gratification and an easy boring mundane game. Leave now it is your only hope. More chaos, bigger losses, bigger gains, more pirates, and more fun is all that remains down the road. I love it. ___________________________ Aegis Militia Conclave official representative
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 00:01:00 - [45] Originally by: Lord Artemis Leaving hi-sec = your choice! not training any combat skills in a combat game <snicker> hang on.... <snort>... ok I'm back sorry <ahem> again = your choice! LOL see that is your problem! You think this is only a combat game! Last time I checked there were three available career paths when you created a character. Combat, Trader, and Miner (Scientist died long ago)
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 00:06:00 - [46] Edited by: Xtci on 22/08/2005 00:06:31 Originally by: Lord Artemis Those of you that want instant gratification and an easy boring mundane game. Leave now it is your only hope. Yup that is exactly what EVE has become for the miner/trader. Why because they are forced to mine in high security sectors with little risk. Because to move out of those sectors into the low security sector is like throwing a unarmed cat into a room full of rabid dogs.
Lord Artemis	Posted - 2005.08.22 00:11:00 - [47] Originally by: Xtci Originally by: Lord Artemis Leaving hi-sec = your choice! not training any combat skills in a combat game <snicker> hang on.... <snort>... ok I'm back sorry <ahem> again = your choice! LOL see that is your problem! You think this is only a combat game! Last time I checked there were three available career paths when you created a character. Combat, Trader, and Miner (Scientist died long ago) If any of these can be done in a station only for the entire time online in eve I would agree. Your only avoiding the real complaint you have and the source of your whining. You shoot NPC's all the time, in belts, gates, missions, etc. Hmm your not complaining about them, cuz their dumb and easy (fair fight). Now you want to complain because your getting outwitted and outsmarted? God forbid you actually learn lessons along the way and get better. Whats a game with no loss? Oh your not saying no loss are you, just when you don't feel like fighting and want to be left alone. Thats another problem. Too many people in your game messing with you. Ever play a game and be a pro the first time with no practice or learning? Ever have to work for anything? Ever think? ___________________________ Aegis Militia Conclave official representative
DigitalCommunist	Posted - 2005.08.22 00:26:00 - [48] Originally by: PriceScout I suppose killing carebears is your favorite activity, Digital commie ? Yep! Right after clubbing baby seals and making bomb threats! Quote: First it is a good thing to learn how to read. That is useful to answer someone else's post. Articulation is good too, because I'm simply quoting you. Unless of course thats what you meant and you have no point to make? Yeah. Quote: What is the higher reward for TRAVELLING in 0.4 ? It takes less time than going a high-sec route. Time is money. Quote: Quote: Catching people off guard loaded with goodies is a perfect example of grief play. All low sec pirates can't pvp Complete non-sense. Read what you write. I agree, it is nonsense! Its also a paraphrasing of your own statements. Quote: blah blah blah All this effort spent hammering your keyboard, when you could I don't know.. do something about it? _____________________________________ Perpetually driven, your end is our beginning.
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 00:28:00 - [49] Originally by: Lord Artemis Now you want to complain because your getting outwitted and outsmarted? LOL yeah it takes alot of smarts to sit and camp a gate with a Battleship!! 6 against 1 yeah takes real wits there. What you *****s are doing doesn't take wits or smarts. Your just being griefing a-holes because you think its fun. You want to use your wits and smarts? Try fighting more of your looser gate camping friends in the 0.0 sectors. Then you can see how much machismo you really have. Fight someone on equal terms with you. Or do you not have the smarts to do that? But then again if you did that people would know that you really have no skills and are not as smart as you want your buddies to think you are huh! Get a life!
Kerby Lane	Posted - 2005.08.22 00:29:00 - [50] Pirates in empire has no risk ? WTF are you talking about guys ? They are sitting at gate with -5 status and you dont even have to shoot to gank sentry tanker - just use heavy tank + all nosferatus\neutrs in high and warp distruptors in med. Sentrys will do the job. Snipers - 1 covert ops and one ( insert any close range damager) and they wasted. I doubt any of the "no risk for empire pirates" type of whiners had actually tried to be pirate or to resist pirates.
Lord Artemis	Posted - 2005.08.22 00:29:00 - [51] digi & vice, We normally don't agree on things but I believe we are all gonna have a good laugh on a future post by this guy. "OMFG, war dec'ing a non-pvp corp wtf?" It's funny he thinks he has it bad now. ___________________________ Aegis Militia Conclave official representative
Lord Artemis	Posted - 2005.08.22 00:33:00 - [52] Originally by: Xtci Originally by: Lord Artemis Now you want to complain because your getting outwitted and outsmarted? LOL yeah it takes alot of smarts to sit and camp a gate with a Battleship!! 6 against 1 yeah takes real wits there. What you *****s are doing doesn't take wits or smarts. Your just being griefing a-holes because you think its fun. You want to use your wits and smarts? Try fighting more of your looser gate camping friends in the 0.0 sectors. Then you can see how much machismo you really have. Fight someone on equal terms with you. Or do you not have the smarts to do that? But then again if you did that people would know that you really have no skills and are not as smart as you want your buddies to think you are huh! Get a life! You've never been to 0.0 so don't act like you have a good reference or point to make there. Pirates in empire would be jobless and yes have to quit pirating if people like you would wise up, but Noooo, you gotta keep going back and getting killed. Thanks to people like you there will never be a shortage of kills for pirates. I am not a pirate, never have been, I do however understand them and have learned something from experience, your just not there yet. <pats your lil head> ___________________________ Aegis Militia Conclave official representative
Kerby Lane	Posted - 2005.08.22 00:35:00 - [53] Originally by: Xtci Originally by: Lord Artemis Now you want to complain because your getting outwitted and outsmarted? LOL yeah it takes alot of smarts to sit and camp a gate with a Battleship!! 6 against 1 yeah takes real wits there. What you *****s are doing doesn't take wits or smarts. Your just being griefing a-holes because you think its fun. You want to use your wits and smarts? Try fighting more of your looser gate camping friends in the 0.0 sectors. Then you can see how much machismo you really have. Fight someone on equal terms with you. Or do you not have the smarts to do that? But then again if you did that people would know that you really have no skills and are not as smart as you want your buddies to think you are huh! Get a life! I sell good clues, want some ? 1. In most aliance 0.0 pirates will be outblobbed 3 to one in matter of minutes. Also pirates do it for isk so whats the point to move in 0.0 if money are in empire ? Full hauler of ark had no value in 0.0 anyway and not too many agent runners CN Ravens flying around. 2. They organise a camp with couple of mates and wtfpwn people like you. They make an effort and paly as a team. Why cant you do the same ? If you cant that mean they outsmarted you.
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 00:40:00 - [54] Originally by: Lord Artemis You've never been to 0.0 so don't act like you have a good reference or point to make there. Are you so sure? In fact I have been to 0.0 space several times but that was prior to gate camping, no skill, hacks like you joined the game. And those morons who are gate camping could not kill me now even if they wanted too.
Kerby Lane	Posted - 2005.08.22 00:42:00 - [55] Chargon: Quote: Mounting attacks with empire rats is pointless. Everytime We doit they either hide in there stations or log.Empire Pirates and Pirate Corps are nothing more then noob *****s they cant fight anyone with skill. no. Typical alt bs without any facts. Many of pirate corps are not noobs in any sense and empire pirates do fight. Come to Sniggs - they will.
Lord Artemis	Posted - 2005.08.22 00:48:00 - [56] Originally by: Xtci Originally by: Lord Artemis You've never been to 0.0 so don't act like you have a good reference or point to make there. Are you so sure? In fact I have been to 0.0 space several times but that was prior to gate camping, no skill, hacks like you joined the game. And those morons who are gate camping could not kill me now even if they wanted too. In bold: no wonder your getting owned you can't even get things straight in your head much less in game. Now your changing your tune, now the could not kill you if they wanted to? just before your **ed because they are killing you? Chose a side stick with it, choose your *** and complaint and stick with it. Don't come in here now and act all uber. (hundreds of millions of sperm and YOU were the quickest?) ___________________________ Aegis Militia Conclave official representative
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 00:54:00 - [57] Originally by: Lord Artemis In bold: no wonder your getting owned you can't even get things straight in your head much less in game. LOL You are so sure of your facts? You have no clue who I am yet you have the balls to think that I am some newbie. Quote: Now your changing your tune, now the could not kill you if they wanted to? just before your **ed because they are killing you? No I am complaining that these gate camping hacks are making sectors unplayable for the 100's of other players out there. Quote: Chose a side stick with it, choose your * and complaint and stick with it. Don't come in here now and act all uber. Never said I was "uber" just said I have the skills to keep these gate camping hacks from killing me. Quote:** (hundreds of millions of sperm and YOU were the quickest?) Look in the mirror! Aren't you glad your parents didn't use a rubber! Didn't I see your face on the poster for birth control?
Lord Artemis	Posted - 2005.08.22 00:58:00 - [58] Another look at risk vs. reward: Risks: going into a battle of wits unarmed not being able to adapt to changes in an enviroment letting everyone else do the work for you Rewards: lessons learned adapting thinking putting in effort where do you fit? ___________________________ Aegis Militia Conclave official representative
Lord Artemis	Posted - 2005.08.22 01:03:00 - [59] "Look in the mirror! Aren't you glad your parents didn't use a rubber!"-well... yea, duh! - I rest my case, your problem is acting without thinking. Nothing can save you now. This is my main, come get me. p.s. using the word "hack" does not add any validity to your argument. ___________________________ Aegis Militia Conclave official representative
Nafri	Posted - 2005.08.22 01:11:00 - [60] you can contact any of our campers with a conversation but after all, passing wont be cheap either Your bla bla hit bla bla for bla bla damage. Wanna have some bubu now?
Krulla	Posted - 2005.08.22 01:12:00 - [61] People like Xtci make reading these boards funny. Thank you Xtci. Respect the Domi. Or else.
Krulla	Posted - 2005.08.22 01:13:00 - [62] Originally by: Xtci Originally by: Lord Artemis p.s. using the word "hack" does not add any validity to your argument. And attacking someones intelligence or parentage because they don't agree with you does nothing for your argument! I belive you are the one attacking people for their intelligence and parentage becouse they dont agree with you? Sure haven't seen anyone else do it in this thread. Respect the Domi. Or else.
RedlegSA	Posted - 2005.08.22 01:18:00 - [63] You guys complaining just need to find friendlier pirates. My Pirates have the highest rated customer service - providing ship destruction in less than one minute, advanced escape prevention, and award winning banter after the job is complete. Its just part of the game. I decided to risk the travel through .3 knowing that might happen. I just have to go arround or counter somehow. I wouldent change it. Thanks for not podding me Kranival of Death
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 01:25:00 - [64] Edited by: Xtci on 22/08/2005 01:25:18 stupid double post
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 01:25:00 - [65] Edited by: Xtci on 22/08/2005 01:26:08 Originally by: Krulla I belive you are the one attacking people for their intelligence and parentage becouse they dont agree with you? Sure haven't seen anyone else do it in this thread. Originally by: Lord Artemis Kick your dad in the nuts, its his fault anyway. Hmm sounds like an attack on my parentage. Originally by: Lord Artemis Now you want to complain because your getting outwitted and outsmarted? Hmm is he talking about my intelligence? maybe? maybe not. Originally by: Lord Artemis <pats your lil head> Now he is clearly attacking my intelligence. until I was attacked directly I was making comments and attacking those folk who camp gates in general. No one directly. Lord Artemis made this personal not me.
Toots Magoo	Posted - 2005.08.22 01:41:00 - [66] Originally by: Xtci Edited by: Xtci on 22/08/2005 01:25:18 stupid double post This guy is funny, I only wish you would put as much effort in your game as you do your foruming. I have traveled thru most of eve for over a year now. I have yet to be podded or lost a ship. I am the queen of the carebears, and the only difference between you and me is that I asked around about low sec and how to avoid it before I got myself into trouble. Your also not very consistent on your stance in the matter, you complained about pirates killing others, but you are very emotional for someone who "claims" that you can avoid them. hee hee For the record I am distancing myself and letting everyone know that these two whiners are the minority, the rest of us have learned from mistakes or close calls.
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 01:51:00 - [67] Edited by: Xtci on 22/08/2005 01:51:50 Originally by: Toots Magoo This guy is funny, I only wish you would put as much effort in your game as you do your foruming. Actually I do. Quote: I have yet to be podded or lost a ship. I have only lost one ship in my EVE career and that was real early on when I was exploring 0.0 space. Quote: I am the queen of the carebears, and the only difference between you and me is that I asked around about low sec and how to avoid it before I got myself into trouble. And you think I do not? Quote: Your also not very consistent on your stance in the matter, you complained about pirates killing others, but you are very emotional for someone who "claims" that you can avoid them. hee hee I am consistant in my stance. I can avoid them and do whenever I have to. I complain because it is this kind of action that I so openly hate. I complained when MOO was camping newbie areas in the beginning even tho I was not effected. Just because you are not effected directly does not mean that you have no right to complain about something you find unjust.
Lord Artemis	Posted - 2005.08.22 01:57:00 - [68] You had your chance to be sensible, I'm a reactionary. You start it I finish it. You would have had better luck offering advice to the noober that posted in the first place, instead you chose to join in the whining band wagon. Hiding behind and alt only proves what kind of person you are. As to your accusation about attacking your intelligence? I did, you surely deserved it, and your come back line... thank you for reinforcing my point. Your suggestion in the beginning is to have the game take care of the pirates for you. What else you want? A white flag hi slot mod? ___________________________ Aegis Militia Conclave official representative
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 02:09:00 - [69] Originally by: Lord Artemis Hiding behind and alt only proves what kind of person you are. LOL Hide behind an Alt? How do you know that this is not my main character? You seem to think you know alot about me. Please quit making assumptions about me. You need to come to grips with the fact that not everyone enjoys playing this game to kill other players! And because we don't does not make our concerns any more less valid than yours. Quote: Your suggestion in the beginning is to have the game take care of the pirates for you. What else you want? A white flag hi slot mod? Please reread my suggestion! I stated: Originally by: Xtci you want to camp 0.4 sector gates fine. But if you do then lets have some police response if you stay over a certain amount of time. And not just a pittiful response but one that is equivelent to the threat. You want risk vs reward! So do I! Presently there is no or very little risk for gate camping, regardless of what you may think. I know you will come back with the argument that we could always go get a group of carebear friends together and try to break the camp. Then I will respond that unlike you we did not spend our time training combat skills. Then you will state that is our fault. yadda yadda yadda Sound familiar?
Lord Artemis	Posted - 2005.08.22 02:18:00 - [70] Your wrong to assume (the side your choosing to defend) that "hey, I'm just passing thru." deserves special treatment. You don't have to live or stay for a long time in a bad neighborhood to get shot. And if you want to survive low sec you have to at least train defenses. You can't go 100% non combat and expect to fly through low sec. These kind generally only train enough combat to fight NPC's in missions and when a real player and a real challenge is in their face they curl up in a ball and cry. Pirates weed out the weak and the strong survive. If you are weak you will die. ___________________________ Aegis Militia Conclave official representative
Lord Artemis	Posted - 2005.08.22 02:23:00 - [71] This is your main, this is your alt, this is your 2nd account. Doesn't mean squat unless you can back it up. Your entire reply batch has put you into 2 categories. 1) your truly a noob and you will learn eventually 2) your not a noob and will never learn either way it does not matter as long as you keep jumping around and changing your words and going in circles. at least i have stood my ground on my feelings. ___________________________ Aegis Militia Conclave official representative
Kerby Lane	Posted - 2005.08.22 02:25:00 - [72] Originally by: Xtci You want risk vs reward! So do I! Presently there is no or very little risk for gate camping, regardless of what you may think. I know you will come back with the argument that we could always go get a group of carebear friends together and try to break the camp. Then I will respond that unlike you we did not spend our time training combat skills. Then you will state that is our fault. yadda yadda yadda Sound familiar? How do you know if you have never pve let alone pvp ? You dont have any standings ( assuming you are the main that means no pve) and you lost only one ship for the whole life - that means you have never pvp. So I doubt you have any experience and expertise so you`ll be better speaking about something else.
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 02:28:00 - [73] Originally by: Lord Artemis Your wrong to assume (the side your choosing to defend) that "hey, I'm just passing thru." deserves special treatment. Who said they deserve "special treatment". I think they should get equal treatment. As a combat player you get rewards for killing NPC's or players in the form of equipment you can use. But these players are taking the easy way out. Low risk for high reward.
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 02:33:00 - [74] Originally by: Kerby Lane How do you know if you have never pve let alone pvp ? You dont have any standings ( assuming you are the main that means no pve) and you lost only one ship for the whole life - that means you have never pvp. So I doubt you have any experience and expertise so you`ll be better speaking about something else.[/quote LOL this is exactly why I post with this character. Do I have experience with PvE? Yes lots. Do I have experience with PvP? Again yes lots. What does that have to do with the issue we are discussing here? And seeing as how your character was created on 2004.07.09 what makes you some kind of expert? See I can use the ingame tools too.
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 02:38:00 - [75] Originally by: Lord Artemis This is your main, this is your alt, this is your 2nd account. Doesn't mean squat unless you can back it up. Your entire reply batch has put you into 2 categories. 1) your truly a noob and you will learn eventually 2) your not a noob and will never learn either way it does not matter as long as you keep jumping around and changing your words and going in circles. at least i have stood my ground on my feelings. And what lesson is it you think I should learn? That unless I join the ranks of the combat fighter I have no purpose in playing this game? I can not truely be having fun mining or trading? I have not jumped around about my feelings on this matter. Gate camping is wrong and should be fixed. People who do so are not "skilled" (in my eyes) they are just looking for the easy loot. Police presence in 0.4 and lower sectors should be increased to deal with gate campers with a delay proportionate to the security rating of the system. But said presence should be sufficent to handle the threat.
Tenacha Khan	Posted - 2005.08.22 02:51:00 - [76] Take a look at this link here if you think there is no risk in pirating. Well thats Zarquon who is a bit crazier than most. First loss for me in the TeddyDragon empire tour was on my first nite in empire sniping Aunenen. Roving guns jump in warp on top of meh and kahboom, went by in secs. 2005.08.16 01:17:00 Victim: Tenacha Khan Alliance: Unknown Corporation: TunDraGon Destroyed Type: Megathron Solar System: Aunenen System Security Level: 0.4 Involved parties: Name: LEXER (laid the final blow) Security Status: 1.4 Alliance: Unknown Corporation: Roving Guns Inc. Ship Type: Raven Weapon Type: Mjolnir Torpedo I Name: Bas4x4 Security Status: 3.9 Alliance: Unknown Corporation: Roving Guns Inc. Ship Type: Cerberus Weapon Type: Unknown Name: lunghammer Security Status: 3.7 Alliance: Unknown Corporation: Roving Guns Inc. Ship Type: Dominix Weapon Type: Unknown Name: Fafhrd Security Status: 0.7 Alliance: Unknown Corporation: Roving Guns Inc. Ship Type: Kestrel Weapon Type: Unknown Name: Redd Dogg Security Status: 5.0 Alliance: Unknown Corporation: Roving Guns Inc. Ship Type: Crow Weapon Type: Unknown Name: Kalixa Hihro Security Status: 0.2 Alliance: Unknown Corporation: Roving Guns Inc. Ship Type: Maulus Weapon Type: Unknown And yay for lag 2005.08.16 01:18:00 Victim: Tenacha Khan Alliance: Unknown Corporation: TunDraGon Destroyed Type: Capsule Solar System: Aunenen System Security Level: 0.4 Involved parties: Name: lunghammer (laid the final blow) Security Status: 3.7 Alliance: Unknown Corporation: Roving Guns Inc. Ship Type: Dominix Weapon Type: 425mm Railgun I Name: Bas4x4 Security Status: 3.9 Alliance: Unknown Corporation: Roving Guns Inc. Ship Type: Cerberus Weapon Type: Unknown Or tanking at gate with Torpedo2k, i was tanking sentrys and a nossing hac with a af buddy get up close, we cant hit and he keeps me scrambled till sentrys own me 2005.08.19 02:36:00 Victim: Tenacha Khan Alliance: Unknown Corporation: TunDraGon Destroyed Type: Megathron Solar System: Tannolen System Security Level: 0.3 Involved parties: Name: Caldari State Name: Spilner (laid the final blow) Security Status: 0.8 Alliance: Unknown Corporation: Genesis Knights Ship Type: Harpy Weapon Type: 125mm Railgun II Name: Yeux Gris Security Status: -0.5 Alliance: Unknown Corporation: Four Horsemen Ship Type: Sacrilege Weapon Type: Unknown Name: CONCORD So ya still think there is no risk in pirating??? And thats just in the space of a damm week
Lord Artemis	Posted - 2005.08.22 03:08:00 - [77] "People who do so are not "skilled" (in my eyes) they are just looking for the easy loot." Again you want the game to protect you. Next you'll want a "911" module to call in concord to destroy anyone that attacks you. Ok, I'll play along. What is your goal in eve? Your road makes you rich but not powerful. As soon as you have a nice chunk of isk and assets, your gonna get war-dec'd, then what? Hire mercenaries? They will cost you money too. If you can't take care of yourself and are unwilling to learn you will be destined to hate this game. Keep running your mouth, you know you won't post with your main character because you know saying what you say will invite all the pirates you tweaked off to stomp a mud hole in your backside. I have proven I stand by my words by posting with my main and reaping the consequences of my statements. ___________________________ Aegis Militia Conclave official representative
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 03:09:00 - [78] Originally by: Tenacha Khan So ya still think there is no risk in pirating??? And thats just in the space of a damm week Wow in a week you managed to get 2 Megathrons destroyed. Over 200million isk just in ships and the post you linked to the guy lost what 6 ships. You must really think that miners make lots and lots of isk. You get no sympathy from me. Yeah it looks like the pirates life is a cash cow. So just how many ships do you own? For the record nonmegacorporation miners and traders are not cash cows. We for the most part are poor as dirt. I end up saving up just enough to by the next BP I want so that I can sell the output for less than I would get for the minerals but hey I find that fun because I get to make stuff. If you were to destroy my ship it could take me weeks to get back to the point I was prior to your actions. But hey you don't care because gate camping is fun for you.
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 03:11:00 - [79] Originally by: Lord Artemis Ok, I'll play along. What is your goal in eve? My goals in EVE? Simple I want to have fun. For me this means getting to build new stuff.
Kerby Lane	Posted - 2005.08.22 03:16:00 - [80] Edited by: Kerby Lane on 22/08/2005 03:17:07 Ok. I suggest you do decide who are you: 1. Uber pvp er 2. Carebear. Basically you tell opposite facts every answer so I dont have any reason to beleive you. here some quotes: quote from previous answer: Quote: I have only lost one ship in my EVE career and that was real early on when I was exploring 0.0 space. Quote: X: I am the queen of the carebears, ... XtcI: And you think I do not?" Answer to me: Originally by: Xtci Do I have experience with PvP? Again yes lots. What does that have to do with the issue we are discussing here?
Mysticaa	Posted - 2005.08.22 03:23:00 - [81] Originally by: Kerby Lane Edited by: Kerby Lane on 22/08/2005 03:17:07 Ok. I suggest you do decide who are you: 1. Uber pvp er 2. Carebear. Basically you tell opposite facts every answer so I dont have any reason to beleive you. here some quotes: quote from previous answer: Quote: I have only lost one ship in my EVE career and that was real early on when I was exploring 0.0 space. Quote: X: I am the queen of the carebears, ... XtcI: And you think I do not?" So I don't see the contradiction here? I lost one ship in 0.0 space while I was exploring roid belts. I got jumped while in my Velator and it got easily destroyed by the npc pirates of the system. Quote: Answer to me: Originally by: Xtci Do I have experience with PvP? Again yes lots. What does that have to do with the issue we are discussing here? Having experience with PvP does not equate to losing ships. And again I never said I was an uber pvper. I have enough skill to keep myself from being killed by a pvper if I am in that situation. And just so Lord DoDo will get off my back here is my main.
Kerby Lane	Posted - 2005.08.22 03:27:00 - [82] So basically your pvp experience were running from pvp`ers ? I have experience with production and trade then as I buy stuff from market. I also professional miner as I saw miners in belts and even escorted them sometimes.
Kerby Lane	Posted - 2005.08.22 03:32:00 - [83] ROFLMAO Quote: LOL Hide behind an Alt? How do you know that this is not my main character? You seem to think you know alot about me. Please quit making assumptions about me. Originally by: Mysticaa And just so Lord DoDo will get off my back here is my main.
Mysticaa	Posted - 2005.08.22 03:35:00 - [84] Edited by: Mysticaa on 22/08/2005 03:35:33 Originally by: Kerby Lane So basically your pvp experience were running from pvp`ers ? Your assumptions are faulty again. Again you associate having ships destroyed with pvp experience. And if you have not had ships destroyed then your pvp experience must be just in running away. My pvp experience is like it is because the bozos who challenged me were flying in inferior ships and/or had no skills. My grandmother could have beat them.
Lord Artemis	Posted - 2005.08.22 03:37:00 - [85] "I am the queen of the carebears, ..." I think thats Toots Magoo I don't remember him saying it. What advantage do pirates really have? They , thru choice, decided to train combat and are enjoying themselves. They can not fly anything you cannot. (minus what skills you didn't choose to train) They sit at a distance from the gate. You too can fly out to those distances. Bottom line is you enjoy the stuff you do. It's ok by the rules, no problem. Pirates enjoy the stuff they do. It's ok by the rules, no problem. I enjoy what I do. It's ok by the rules, no problem. Your flaw in logic is that pirates are ruining non-combatants game. That's one sided. Ever think that maybe your ruining their game? No your not, why? because they know that you won't do anything about it except here. There has to be balance. Your not asking or promoting balance your asking for favoritism. What is low-sec w/o risk? You can't put a timer on camping either. Pirates (this is why I could never do it) sit there for hours and hours sometimes trying to get a kill. And they have repercussions to their actions. Many times we have gone thru a low sec system. Waited at a gate for stragglers. And wham a pirate jumps in. We blow him & his pod up. Why? cuz he's ebil and he has accepted the risk of being so. Come complain when your in hi-sec and get ganked. Otherwise leave low-sec alone. The name alone should be enough reason for you to understand its purpose. There is also several ways around low-sec. Yes they are longer, but you can travel (not at war) afk for the whole trip and come back when your done. Don't hate those you can't outwit or beat. Don't whine if you have a better solution other than the game doing it for you. Don't try to change the greatest aspect of this game. ___________________________ Aegis Militia Conclave official representative
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 03:39:00 - [86] Originally by: Kerby Lane ROFLMAO Quote: LOL Hide behind an Alt? How do you know that this is not my main character? You seem to think you know alot about me. Please quit making assumptions about me. Originally by: Mysticaa And just so Lord DoDo will get off my back here is my main. I'm glad you find this funny but since when does a person have to post with one character or another. This character is the character I post of the forums I play another ingame. I play another entirely on Monday and Wednesday. So what character is my main the one I play Saturday and Sunday? The one I play on Monday and Wednesday? or the one I post with? But you guys are not happy unless I post the one I have the most SP with are you.
Tenacha Khan	Posted - 2005.08.22 03:41:00 - [87] Originally by: Xtci Originally by: Tenacha Khan So ya still think there is no risk in pirating??? And thats just in the space of a damm week Wow in a week you managed to get 2 Megathrons destroyed. Over 200million isk just in ships and the post you linked to the guy lost what 6 ships. You must really think that miners make lots and lots of isk. You get no sympathy from me. Yeah it looks like the pirates life is a cash cow. So just how many ships do you own? For the record nonmegacorporation miners and traders are not cash cows. We for the most part are poor as dirt. I end up saving up just enough to by the next BP I want so that I can sell the output for less than I would get for the minerals but hey I find that fun because I get to make stuff. If you were to destroy my ship it could take me weeks to get back to the point I was prior to your actions. But hey you don't care because gate camping is fun for you. You said there was no risk in pirating, Im telling you there is Risk V reward ... ya know what that means? I take risks to get better rewards. So ofcourse I can replace a battleship. But your ships dont get destroyed, thats why you make no isk, as your not getting rewarded for taking risks. Look at the likes of Jericho faction who were mostly indy hauler traders (before castor patch), they used to haul through pirate blocades and warzones in venal/pureblind to make isk. They made a tonne of cash in their risky business. YaY for riskVreward But you wouldnt understand that cause you seem to take as little risk as possible while spending ur time trying to belittle the people that do.
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 03:54:00 - [88] Originally by: Lord Artemis Bottom line is you enjoy the stuff you do. It's ok by the rules, no problem. Pirates enjoy the stuff they do. It's ok by the rules, no problem. I enjoy what I do. It's ok by the rules, no problem. Your flaw in logic is that pirates are ruining non-combatants game. That's one sided. Ever think that maybe your ruining their game? No your not, why? because they know that you won't do anything about it except here. LOL Talk about faulty logic. Just because they won't (or maybe can not) do anything about it does not make what they are doing right. And just because our present rules does not outlaw it does not mean that it is right either. Quote: There has to be balance. Your not asking or promoting balance your asking for favoritism. What is low-sec w/o risk? You can't put a timer on camping either. Pirates (this is why I could never do it) sit there for hours and hours sometimes trying to get a kill. And they have repercussions to their actions. Many times we have gone thru a low sec system. Waited at a gate for stragglers. And wham a pirate jumps in. We blow him & his pod up. Why? cuz he's ebil and he has accepted the risk of being so. I am asking for balance here. You say he may be sitting there for hours and hours waiting for something to kill. Then he/she should move to a sector that is more populated. What he is truely doing is sitting there waiting for the easy kill hoping for the big payout. And why can we not put a timer on camping? Many games have. They have seen that people who camp are not playing the game as it was intended and have discuraged it. What I am asking for will not discourage players if they are truely there to have fun. You camp the gate with 3 BS for an hour (arbitrary time here) and a force of concord BS equal in number (and skill)come to chase you off. You defeat the police then fine you get to keep your camp for the next amount of time, however the next force that comes will be slightly larger. For every action there should be an equal reaction. Same with the carebear miners. They kill off the smuglers in a 0.5 sector then the next time they come they will have more backup until they force the miners to leave the belt. Quote: Come complain when your in hi-sec and get ganked. Otherwise leave low-sec alone. The name alone should be enough reason for you to understand its purpose. There is also several ways around low-sec. Yes they are longer, but you can travel (not at war) afk for the whole trip and come back when your done. Don't hate those you can't outwit or beat. Don't whine if you have a better solution other than the game doing it for you. Don't try to change the greatest aspect of this game. Greatest aspect of the game? what beating up on the helpless?
Hans Rex	Posted - 2005.08.22 04:04:00 - [89] Its all good. Hard to call it griefing if its within the game mechanics. Gate camping is just another challange. The game is huge. Its easy to play any style in EVE. I suppose if people wanted, they could band together and clear the gates. Much in the same fashion as the blues VS reds in UO.
Tenacha Khan	Posted - 2005.08.22 04:09:00 - [90] Originally by: Xtci Originally by: Tenacha Khan But you wouldnt understand that cause you seem to take as little risk as possible while spending ur time trying to belittle the people that do. I have no problem with people who take high risk getting high reward but that is not what we are talking about. We are talking about people camping gates and killing the defensless because they can get the huge isk. Low risk for high reward. Ill just point it out to you that loosing our ships is the risk, and as I already posted loss mails, you can see this happens. Honestly, I didnt make up the lossmail
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 04:12:00 - [91] Originally by: Hans Rex Hard to call it griefing if its within the game mechanics. Just because its within the game mechanics does not mean its not griefing. If I were to camp the newbie spawn point and blast every newbie that enters the game I would be griefing. Although the game mechanics allows me to do it. (Assuming I can get away from CONCORD )
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 04:18:00 - [92] Originally by: Tenacha Khan Originally by: Xtci Originally by: Tenacha Khan But you wouldnt understand that cause you seem to take as little risk as possible while spending ur time trying to belittle the people that do. I have no problem with people who take high risk getting high reward but that is not what we are talking about. We are talking about people camping gates and killing the defensless because they can get the huge isk. Low risk for high reward. Ill just point it out to you that loosing our ships is the risk, and as I already posted loss mails, you can see this happens. Honestly, I didnt make up the lossmail So you are telling me that the risk involved in gate camping is equivelent to the reward you get for doing it? I find that very hard to believe. How often do you wonder if your ship will be destroyed entering a 0.4 system? Once you get there how much risk is there that your ship will be destroyed? How many ships will you be able to destroy before a force can be assembled to chase you from the system? How much isk will you have earned for very little threat (those indies are not a big threat)?
Tenacha Khan	Posted - 2005.08.22 04:19:00 - [93] And at the moment Im talking about the risk in the actual camping. And as we have to move around to get better spots, having a big sign saying "shoot me" on overview kinda complicates things. I cant look at the map and say HA there is a bounty hunter blocade in tannolen, better not go there. But any1 else can see the big red dot on map shouting "pirates do be here", people who dont see it deserve to be killed, noobs who are to new to understand the map loose nothing anyway. And then there is the people who see the dot and go anyway, because they feel they will get more in return if they successfully get through. So as you can see the non-pirates can calculate their risk and see if its worthwhile, because they know the risk and they know their reward. A pirate can get to -10 and make nothing from it and jump into any system and get ganked by a 20man bounty hunting squad. So you dont seem to know anything about the risks pirates take and the dangers pirates compete with.
Xtci	Posted - 2005.08.22 04:28:00 - [94] Originally by: Tenacha Khan But any1 else can see the big red dot on map shouting "pirates do be here", people who dont see it deserve to be killed, Agreed Quote: noobs who are to new to understand the map loose nothing anyway. Don't agree with that. They may loose everything they worked so hard for, and worse of all they may loose heart and quit the game. Quote: And then there is the people who see the dot and go anyway, because they feel they will get more in return if they successfully get through. And then there is the group who have to go there for some retarded level 1 mission. With very little reward :p Quote: So as you can see the non-pirates can calculate their risk and see if its worthwhile, because they know the risk and they know their reward. A pirate can get to -10 and make nothing from it and jump into any system and get ganked by a 20man bounty hunting squad. But if they are "skilled" shouldn't that not be an issue? :p
Tenacha Khan	Posted - 2005.08.22 04:46:00 - [95] Quote: Quote: noobs who are to new to understand the map loose nothing anyway. Don't agree with that. They may loose everything they worked so hard for, and worse of all they may loose heart and quit the game This can be true, but i believe ap is set to "safest route" by default when you first play, the really nooby people im on about is the ones who have jumped from a spawning point and manually gone to 0.4 and below. In my experience with chatting to these people they dont know enough to care, but that really depends on personality. Quote: Quote: And then there is the people who see the dot and go anyway, because they feel they will get more in return if they successfully get through. And then there is the group who have to go there for some retarded level 1 mission. With very little reward :p They have the option to decline the mission after seeing where they have to go, if they feel their standing is worth the risk, then in their eyes the reward must be higher than the risk. Quote: Quote: So as you can see the non-pirates can calculate their risk and see if its worthwhile, because they know the risk and they know their reward. A pirate can get to -10 and make nothing from it and jump into any system and get ganked by a 20man bounty hunting squad. But if they are "skilled" shouldn't that not be an issue? :p Skilled at what? There are a certain ammount of skill points you need to camp Skill at setting up their ship for best performance Skill at picking a spot if sniping to have lowest transvers (torp does not have this skill)while being as close as possible to gate, the least chance of some1 gettin on top of you. I dont see how any of those skills helps you beat off 20 people, even if those 20 people are in bs for the first time. Skill at pvp has nothing to do with pirating, like the way skill at pvp has nothing to do with evading pirates. You said earlier that I dont care cause I enjoy gate camping, well i enjoy some of the convos with people, chatting to friends on ts and the fact that i will be out of empire in a week. Im doing this for two things Getting my ss back to -10 after getting it up to merc in empire (bad idea) cause i feel all pirates should be -10 and felt a fraud with me being able to hop in and out of empire To make isk so I can play out in 0.0 with new toys (that makes me sound like a child, but i suppose you need to have some level of immaturity to play a video game)
Lifewire	Posted - 2005.08.22 04:53:00 - [96] After 2 years of nerfing piracy and nearly all pirate corps vanishing from EVE, CCP decided to bring piracy back into game. A handfull of pirates stayed and waited. Others joined alliances and now come back to pirate. And now you come along and cry. What do you expect? CCP removing us pirates again? Sentry range 500 km? Concord in 0.1? Where should we be nerfed??? Get it! Piracy in low sec is risky! Try to shoot a ship at a gate just to feel the sentry heat! You never did? Noob! Try it! You will see what it means to pirate! Snipecamp a gate - just do it. You will get killed within 30 minutes if you dont know how to defend your tech II fitted sniper against a covert ops and a HAC. That¦s all what is needed to sink a sniper BS. You never did it? N00b! But you jump into a 0.4 system that has 200 kills last hour and 40 podkills last hour? You have no scout? You have no stabs? You have no escort? And you haul 100 mil ISK cargo? You think EVE is disneyland? Bah, end yourself Try a TDG spawn or the TDG complexes in Pure Blind, Syndicate or empire.
Nira Li	Posted - 2005.08.22 07:40:00 - [97] word You Will Cry My Name Dies Irae Dies Illa Solvet Cosmos In Favilla Vocamus Te Aeshma-Diva
dailyhazard	Posted - 2005.08.22 07:47:00 - [98] pfft.........carebears, i dont think they notice that not everyone finds mining interesting, also sounds like they think every pirate is a gate camper, i personally never have sat on a gate, i just jump around if i see something i kill it. Also yes being below -5 is dangerous, all you need is something fast to lock you down and for something else to warp in and your pretty ****ed in a bs. If you dont like it, then dont enter low security space its LOW security thus is more dangerous than HIGH security surely its logical; no? so yes, anyone that moans about pirate please go back to jita and mine veld thxplsbye. ;] ------------------------------------------------
Lord Artemis	Posted - 2005.08.22 08:21:00 - [99] For those to lazy to do any research into avoiding pirates! ___________________________ Aegis Militia Conclave official representative
babyblue	Posted - 2005.08.22 08:27:00 - [100] To answer the original post, the reason these places are camped rather than 0.0 is because the alliances in general have such a firm grip on their 0.0 space that a pirate camp would soon be broken up. Pirates camp 0.4 into 0.5 because they can. However, it is somewhat ironic that 0.1 - 0.4 space is actually more dangerous because of this than 0.0 space. I suppose thats just how the game has evolved. Having said that, the rewards in, say, a 0.1 system in terms of NPC loot have from my experience become greater than those in 0.0. I mean a month or so ago I was getting great loot from some cruiser spawns (rare implants, faction mods) in 0.1 - whereas on Sunday I chained a Seraphim spawn in 0.0 and got crappy loot every time. Okay, good bounty but you get the point.
Nafri	Posted - 2005.08.22 09:47:00 - [101] Originally by: Lifewire After 2 years of nerfing piracy and nearly all pirate corps vanishing from EVE, CCP decided to bring piracy back into game. A handfull of pirates stayed and waited. Others joined alliances and now come back to pirate. And now you come along and cry. What do you expect? CCP removing us pirates again? Sentry range 500 km? Concord in 0.1? Where should we be nerfed??? Get it! Piracy in low sec is risky! Try to shoot a ship at a gate just to feel the sentry heat! You never did? Noob! Try it! You will see what it means to pirate! Snipecamp a gate - just do it. You will get killed within 30 minutes if you dont know how to defend your tech II fitted sniper against a covert ops and a HAC. That¦s all what is needed to sink a sniper BS. You never did it? N00b! But you jump into a 0.4 system that has 200 kills last hour and 40 podkills last hour? You have no scout? You have no stabs? You have no escort? And you haul 100 mil ISK cargo? You think EVE is disneyland? Bah, end yourself No, we end himself Your bla bla hit bla bla for bla bla damage. Wanna have some bubu now?
Andrue	Posted - 2005.08.22 09:59:00 - [102] Originally by: Avon Originally by: Andrue It's all well and good to say people should fight back but a lot of people don't want to. That's fine, but it is at that point that they lose the right to complain. I don't agree. Everyone has the right to complain it's just how they go about it. tbh I'm not really complaining, I'm a billionaire and tbh a little heart pounding run to a gate is fun but for some people it could destroy the game. If the combat were more lengthy or you were held to ransom I'd have absolutely no complaint but what actually happens is that you come out of warp and in two seconds your hauler is dead. I think the WCS issues needs to be looked at along with some kind of contract system for ransoming. The pirate needs to be reasonably assured of being able to stop ships and the victim reasonably assured that when they pay up the pirate won't just gank them anyway. -- (Battle hardened miner) [Brackley, UK] WARNING:This post may contain large doses of reality.
Andrue	Posted - 2005.08.22 10:06:00 - [103] Originally by: Xtci Edited by: Xtci on 22/08/2005 00:06:31 Originally by: Lord Artemis Those of you that want instant gratification and an easy boring mundane game. Leave now it is your only hope. Yup that is exactly what EVE has become for the miner/trader. Why because they are forced to mine in high security sectors with little risk. Because to move out of those sectors into the low security sector is like throwing a unarmed cat into a room full of rabid dogs. It's not got that bad yet from what I can see. My only complaint is the instant ganking. As I wrote in another reply, I'd just like to see some kind of mutual time out. A chance to get by the gate or at least enough time for the overview to show the names of the characters doing the ganking. -- (Battle hardened miner) [Brackley, UK] WARNING:This post may contain large doses of reality.
FireFoxx80	Posted - 2005.08.22 10:35:00 - [104] I think the point is a good number of players want to play this game solo despite all CCP's intentions, these people pay their ú10/m like the rest of us. It is all very good to say 'tool up', 'skill up' and 'get in a gang'. But more often than not by the time players have got a gang of a few other people and managed to get back to the scene of the crime, the criminal has already left. Even if they do track the guy down, he'll be sitting 100km+ off of the gate in his optimal, picking off the merry bunch of do-gooders until they get close enough to attempt to warp scramble him. Imagine their surprise when the target simply warps off with their low-slots full of stabs. But yes, this is a game where there is a low-risk path and a high-risk path. Sometimes, despite all your best intentions, you will end up walking the latter of the two. Possibly one of the 23 # ex: P-TMC \| USAC
GoGo Yubari	Posted - 2005.08.22 10:48:00 - [105] gives Xtci a hug
sonofollo	Posted - 2005.08.22 10:49:00 - [106] well those solo players soon learn to acquire cloakers - warp stabs and grab a alt scount to scout ahead and therefore they can become quite a bit safer when travelling around low sec Either that or join a low sec corp they quite often require PVP but ensure protection a greater time - oh and avoid aridia unless prepared its pirate central for low sec
Marcus Aurelius	Posted - 2005.08.22 11:09:00 - [107] Edited by: Marcus Aurelius on 22/08/2005 11:11:28 Originally by: FireFoxx80 I think the point is a good number of players want to play this game solo despite all CCP's intentions, these people pay their ú10/m like the rest of us. Which means ** all. I could want to play this game with every experience instanced and all the ships turned blue for me as much as I want, but CCP is not going to oblige no matter wether I pay em 10 quid a month or not. If you subscribe to Eve, you accept the game for what it is. It is a mixed game giving you unparalelled freedom of choice, but at the price of being heavily geared towards competition and player interaction in groups. That means that you can't play eve like its an instance, people will influence you in ways you do not appreciate. Big *** deal ! That was the whole friggin idea to begin with. A ghame that hinges on player driven content can never ever allow total safety anywhere. It will always need to hinge on competition so that players get pitted against eachother and create content for eachother in doing so. So no, your monthly subscription entitles you to one thing only: to play the game CCP decides to give you. Don't like it, toss the ** off and finally stop whining.
Marcus Aurelius	Posted - 2005.08.22 11:10:00 - [108] Edited by: Marcus Aurelius on 22/08/2005 11:10:37 Btw Ollo, what happened to you main char eh ? son-of-ollo is kind of a giveaway you know. Especially the way you post.
Tenacha Khan	Posted - 2005.08.22 17:10:00 - [109] Originally by: babyblue To answer the original post, the reason these places are camped rather than 0.0 is because the alliances in general have such a firm grip on their 0.0 space that a pirate camp would soon be broken up. Pirates camp 0.4 into 0.5 because they can. However, it is somewhat ironic that 0.1 - 0.4 space is actually more dangerous because of this than 0.0 space. I suppose thats just how the game has evolved. Having said that, the rewards in, say, a 0.1 system in terms of NPC loot have from my experience become greater than those in 0.0. I mean a month or so ago I was getting great loot from some cruiser spawns (rare implants, faction mods) in 0.1 - whereas on Sunday I chained a Seraphim spawn in 0.0 and got crappy loot every time. Okay, good bounty but you get the point. Its easier to kill people in 0.0 compared to empire space, its easier to pirate in 0.0 than empire space. But its impossible (or damm near) to play the role of a pirate there because people dont care about loosing ships because that is the reason why they are there in the first place. Empire space is meant for piracey thats why you get sec hits.
OffBeaT	Posted - 2005.08.22 17:33:00 - [110] Edited by: OffBeaT on 22/08/2005 17:34:16 i somtimes dont understand some gammers. i have never been locked out of any system that i wont too inter, unless i had no insta's & even then i always can work my way in. no corp/alliance/pirate click tells offbeat where and when i can hangout. OffBeaT just tells them too eat torps & if i cant beat them i sneek through & around them real well.. ps.. if you let these people back you down or rob you then you chouse too do nothing about it then dont come crying too ccp too make things over safe for you. you ruin your own gamming expeirants by not standing up for yourselfs in eve rather then just being a victom 99% of the time. your gona lose ships anyway in eve rather you like it or not so you mightest well lose them fighting rather then not.
FireFoxx80	Posted - 2005.08.22 18:05:00 - [111] Originally by: Marcus Aurelius Edited by: Marcus Aurelius on 22/08/2005 11:11:28 Originally by: FireFoxx80 I think the point is a good number of players want to play this game solo despite all CCP's intentions, these people pay their ú10/m like the rest of us. Which means **** all. snip sigh Did you bother reading my post? Or only get as far as the first sentence then decicde to jump feet-first into a reply? Seriously. I would like an answer on that one. Think about it. My point, for those low of IQ, was that people pay the ú10/m to fly around empire, hold hands, pick flowers, whatever they do. Just as much as people pay ú10/m to sit on a gate, shooting whoever passes. Not forgetting the people who pay ú10/m to fly around 0.0, making their own game. Now, back to this first group. I was not saying the game should be changed for them, or whatever you were the <insert *> on about. I was saying that, despite all calls to adapt and hunt down the killers, they may not want to. These people have to accept the risk of low-sec space. However, for the ones who do stand-up and fight. There is often very little chance for them to turn the tables, which is an indirect point of the original post, if you bothered to read it. By the time that low-combat-skilled players have either amassed a gang, or gotten the bottle to hunt down the gate camper; the camper in question has gone. The original poster was saying that there is very little risk involved in sitting 150km off of a gate in low-sec, picking off passing ships at leisure, then grabbing whatever loot is dropped. He is questioning why these areas of low-sec exist, where people can snipe lone ships, often small ships piloted by harmless players. My point was reinforcing this, by stating that gate campers in low-sec have little risk compared to those camping 0.0 systems. As although it promotes a 'risk', it promotes one where the risk is unbalanced. As a suggestion to the OP, keep these low-sec bands between empires. But make the act of griefing (that is the low-risk sniping we so often see) more punishable, perhaps with a greater sentry gun response. Besides, anyone who has flown a 0.0 gate camp will agree that there are very few sniper setups used; pilots preferring to use a tackler gang instead. Now, I suggest you refrain from making further posts in this topic, because you are clearly incapable of constructing a counter-point without resorting to sounding like a complete retard. Possibly one of the 23 # ex: P-TMC \| USAC

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