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Equto
Imperium Technologies
Get Off My Lawn
19
   |
Posted - 2013.05.14 22:15:00 -
[151] - Quote
What I think few people here are realizing is that an Upgrade straight to Dx11 without a Dx9 path means anyone using mac or linux could no longer play eve ( unless they want to pay for a windows license for their computer) as neither supports dx11. Also any computer that currently doesn't have a dx11 card or run xp couldn't run it. I think if you add up all of those numbers you will quickly see that its not worthwhile for CCP to upgrade to DX11 right now cold turkey. |
Mocam
EVE University
Ivy League
274
|
Posted - 2013.05.14 23:01:00 -
[152] - Quote
A bunch of odd comments here about XP and such...
DX 11? Optional I suppose and something to look forward to for those with systems that can handle it.
Hell, yesterday Metro: Last Light went live -- min system = DX 9. Far Cry 3 December 2012 -- min system = DX 9c...
Crysis 3 is one of the extremely few games released with a minimum spec of DX 11 and it's audience is a lot thinner than it could be. It never hit "top selling" bracket for games nor even came close to the sales numbers that EA was looking for from that title.
CCP might lose a lot of customers trying to be that radical and I don't see them trying to pull that on people. As an option for those of us who would like it? Sure but not as a requirement. |
Oberine Noriepa
1194
|
Posted - 2013.05.14 23:51:00 -
[153] - Quote
Mocam wrote:A bunch of odd comments here about XP and such...
DX 11? Optional I suppose and something to look forward to for those with systems that can handle it.
Hell, yesterday Metro: Last Light went live -- min system = DX 9. Far Cry 3 December 2012 -- min system = DX 9c...
Crysis 3 is one of the extremely few games released with a minimum spec of DX 11 and it's audience is a lot thinner than it could be. It never hit "top selling" bracket for games nor even came close to the sales numbers that EA was looking for from that title.
CCP might lose a lot of customers trying to be that radical and I don't see them trying to pull that on people. As an option for those of us who would like it? Sure but not as a requirement.
Pretty sure something like this being optional has always been the case, so whenever someone starts freaking out about the issue of their computer not being able to handle DX11, I can't help but roll my eyes. 
Nevyn Auscent wrote:A reminder to those talking about 'shiny graphics' & 'why should we upgrade for just shiny graphics'
CCP's tessellation Demo entailed not just a graphics visual but a change to the physics engine. Meaning we get rid of the crazy big bump hit boxes, and actually get skin collisions instead. This is a big change to the game, and a massive quality of life improvement.
Whatever physics CCP decides to implement with DX11 will only be aesthetic and client-based. I don't think rewriting the server side physics engine is high on their list of things to do. |
Denidil
Turalyon Plus
585
|
Posted - 2013.05.15 00:20:00 -
[154] - Quote
Hey James Amril-Kesh, you know so long as they don't actually use any features over DX10.1 then a DX11 client would still work on your ancient piece of trash?
Did you know that even if they enable the DX11 features that you don't use those features might be optional?
Try knowing something, about anything before ever opening your mouth again. I'm embarassed to have once be
Tedium and difficulty are not the same thing, if you don't realize this then STFU about game design. |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation
RAZOR Alliance
5061
|
Posted - 2013.05.15 00:23:00 -
[155] - Quote
Denidil wrote:Hey James Amril-Kesh, you know so long as they don't actually use any features over DX10.1 then a DX11 client would still work on your ancient piece of trash?
Did you know that even if they enable the DX11 features that you don't use those features might be optional?
So you know exactly how CCP would implement DX11, do you? You know for a fact DX11 features would be optional?
Denidil wrote:Try knowing something, about anything before ever opening your mouth again. I'm embarassed to have once be
I'm embarrassed that you were too.
-áMy (mostly boring) Youtube channel. |
Setaceous
Nexus Prima
73
|
Posted - 2013.05.15 00:30:00 -
[156] - Quote
Jada Kautsuoi wrote:Montevius Williams wrote:Ranger 1 wrote:Adela Talvanen wrote:I recall during the FF recorded coverage that in the Animation Q&A one of the devs mentioned somethig along he lines that the next expansion will be having DX 11 features.
I might have miss heard, or CCP is finally moving from DX 9 graphics. That doesn't sound right, as our Win XP users would have issues. Nothing says lack of progress like running antiquated systems. Seriously, if EVE cant feature state of the art assets becasue of Windows XP - wow I cant believe people still run XP. I mean, damn, didnt Windows stop supporting XP like 5 years ago? I ould be wrong, but If they are still supporting it, that cant be doing so for long. They say at least 38% on the internet still use XP! Unreal.
I wonder if that counts corporate use? There are roughly 12000 clients where I work that still use XP due to lazy program writing and a lack of funding to fix said lazy program writing. Our licences are actually all Win 7 with downgrade rights. |
Jadzia Idaris Devereaux
United Star Alliance
UNITED STAR FEDERATION
0
|
Posted - 2013.05.16 03:17:00 -
[157] - Quote
Equto wrote:What I think few people here are realizing is that an Upgrade straight to Dx11 without a Dx9 path means anyone using mac or linux could no longer play eve ( unless they want to pay for a windows license for their computer) as neither supports dx11. Also any computer that currently doesn't have a dx11 card or run xp couldn't run it. I think if you add up all of those numbers you will quickly see that its not worthwhile for CCP to upgrade to DX11 right now cold turkey.
Ya i said the same thing. Actually if they dropped DX support completely and went to open gl it does also support tessellation and all those little DX features that people want. Not to mention they dont screw 1/3 there player base (not sure how many actual mac and linux users there are.) out of playing the game. If they did move to full Dx 11 without a way for mac and us linux users to play id just quit subbing. Cause i sure ant paying for windows. |
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
639
|
Posted - 2013.05.16 03:35:00 -
[158] - Quote
Jadzia Idaris Devereaux wrote:Equto wrote:What I think few people here are realizing is that an Upgrade straight to Dx11 without a Dx9 path means anyone using mac or linux could no longer play eve ( unless they want to pay for a windows license for their computer) as neither supports dx11. Also any computer that currently doesn't have a dx11 card or run xp couldn't run it. I think if you add up all of those numbers you will quickly see that its not worthwhile for CCP to upgrade to DX11 right now cold turkey. Ya i said the same thing. Actually if they dropped DX support completely and went to open gl it does also support tessellation and all those little DX features that people want. Not to mention they dont screw 1/3 there player base (not sure how many actual mac and linux users there are.) out of playing the game. If they did move to full Dx 11 without a way for mac and us linux users to play id just quit subbing. Cause i sure ant paying for windows.
Again, its called "open GL" for a reason. MAC and Linux both use it.
From: Tommas De'Wins
To: Cipher Jones
Dude :) I got massives Basi hahahahahahaha |
Jarod Garamonde
Action Bastards
152
|
Posted - 2013.05.16 03:43:00 -
[159] - Quote
Trendon Evenstar wrote:Stop adding things that make large fleet fights lag thanks
Solution: small gang/solo PvP.
You're welcome :p
"you can identify eve players by looking at their cars. Since they don't drive what they can't afford to lose."-á --áBienator II |
Jadzia Idaris Devereaux
United Star Alliance
UNITED STAR FEDERATION
0
|
Posted - 2013.05.16 03:54:00 -
[160] - Quote
Cipher Jones wrote:Jadzia Idaris Devereaux wrote:Equto wrote:What I think few people here are realizing is that an Upgrade straight to Dx11 without a Dx9 path means anyone using mac or linux could no longer play eve ( unless they want to pay for a windows license for their computer) as neither supports dx11. Also any computer that currently doesn't have a dx11 card or run xp couldn't run it. I think if you add up all of those numbers you will quickly see that its not worthwhile for CCP to upgrade to DX11 right now cold turkey. Ya i said the same thing. Actually if they dropped DX support completely and went to open gl it does also support tessellation and all those little DX features that people want. Not to mention they dont screw 1/3 there player base (not sure how many actual mac and linux users there are.) out of playing the game. If they did move to full Dx 11 without a way for mac and us linux users to play id just quit subbing. Cause i sure ant paying for windows. Again, its called "open GL" for a reason. MAC and Linux both use it.
so does windows and everything else on the planet. Your saying something we already know. But We would need them to actually implement it in open gl and not sure how CCP feels about adding a new api to there client .. It can be done but not even 100 percent sure if there client supports it as there a ms partner. Meaning there fundmentaly a windows development platform |
Stan'din
UK Corp
RAZOR Alliance
130
|
Posted - 2013.05.16 13:08:00 -
[161] - Quote
Pretty much everything in this topic is going argument, counter - argument. its getting no where.
There are people who can't afford to upgrade
There are the people who won't upgrade
There are people sat on the fence about weather to upgrade
There are the people with high end rigs
eventually CCP will do the big transformation from DX9 - DX11 its inevitable, New players wan't the WOW effect when they first play a game and from a business standpoint it makes sense to bring this fresh blood into the game.
Put Simply, You are eventually going to have to upgrade your rig. It might not be today or this year. But i can say with a certain degree of certainty that it will happen not too long from now.
for those that can't afford - People on here have no right to judge your problem and i am sure a lot of us Sympathize . but its eventually going to hit you.
The ones that won't upgrade - Personally i have no sympathy for some one who doesn't want to improve things they spend hours on and love.
Fence people. its going to happen, logical steps need to be taken to future proof your rigs its simple
the last group, has not got much to worry about as they are all ready prepared. apart from being a little bit elitist ( myself included ) .
We all love EVE.
Your about as much use as a condom dispenser in the Vatican. |
Arcelian
House of Praetor
R O G U E
6
|
Posted - 2013.05.16 13:45:00 -
[162] - Quote
Zeko Rena wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:So you're fine with forcing a lot of people to pay several hundred dollars (at least) just to continue playing? But it's okay, right? Cause it's not like you have to do anything to get all the shinies you want.
I seriously doubt CCP feels the same way. You can either get a job with CCP to help them develop an optional DX 11 client, or you can shut up and wait for them to do so, or you can just shut up and deal with it. How about you shut up and deal with it and upgrade your toaster, or go back to playing Pong
Buahahaha, +1 to you sir |
Bloody Wench
347
|
Posted - 2013.05.16 14:01:00 -
[163] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Setaceous wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:I'm saying that a lot of people are unable to upgrade, and you wanting your shinies isn't enough justification to force people to spend money they may not have or simply stop playing. Indeed. Though if money for those people is seriously that tight, maybe they should reconsider their budget and stop playing anyway. MMOs subs should always come last in a budget for a responsible person. It's not in my budget at all. People seem to want to force it on me, though.
You're just being contrary for the sake of it.
Any PC over 10 years old should just die in a pall of blue smoke and the faint smell of Ozone.
Seriously for well under a grand you can have an i5K, water cooling, GTX 670's, SSDs and 16+ Gig RAM
Why drive that shitbox when you can drive something that doesn't suck?
Support a Hi Resolution Texture Pack |
Ager Agemo
Kiith Paktu
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
299
|
Posted - 2013.05.16 16:13:00 -
[164] - Quote
to those who say they can not afford a decent rig, all I have to say, is that if you have that kind of economic struggle... you shouldn't be spending time and money and eve and instead should be working more to get some more money.
I say this as someone who works on a third world country working half time and yet I make enough to build an enthusiast rig... |
Arcelian
House of Praetor
R O G U E
8
|
Posted - 2013.05.16 16:57:00 -
[165] - Quote
Bloody Wench wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:Setaceous wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:I'm saying that a lot of people are unable to upgrade, and you wanting your shinies isn't enough justification to force people to spend money they may not have or simply stop playing. Indeed. Though if money for those people is seriously that tight, maybe they should reconsider their budget and stop playing anyway. MMOs subs should always come last in a budget for a responsible person. It's not in my budget at all. People seem to want to force it on me, though. You're just being contrary for the sake of it. Any PC over 10 years old should just die in a pall of blue smoke and the faint smell of Ozone. Seriously for well under a grand you can have an i5K, water cooling, GTX 670's, SSDs and 16+ Gig RAMWhy drive that shitbox when you can drive something that doesn't suck?
Wait, what? Please tell me how you can have GTX 670's (plural), water cooling, etc. for well under a grand. I'm not saying you are lying, I would genuinely like to know, as I'm building a new rig soon. I mean, one gtx 670 is a little over $300 by itself... |
Frostys Virpio
Lame Corp Name
395
|
Posted - 2013.05.16 17:00:00 -
[166] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
So you know exactly how CCP would implement DX11, do you? You know for a fact DX11 features would be optional?
He definately don't and most likely CCP does not ahve the $$$ to run 2 different codepath for the graphic engine of the game. Game developper like blizzard (DX9 and up all supported in some fashion) and Valve (all the way down to DX8) can do it by having the game engine render differently depending on what is supported on the machine because there are ton of non essential graphic options to disable AND they have money to throw at the devs to code stuff to amke it work. The relatively small playerbase of EVE most likely can't support such huge undertaking.
As a required troll comment in such a fail thread, I should add this : "Player willing to destroy the enjoyment of the game of others by changing the rules of what is required to run the game are pretty much just another version of the players willing to destroy the enjoyment of other players by changing the rules in the game." |
Frostys Virpio
Lame Corp Name
395
|
Posted - 2013.05.16 17:06:00 -
[167] - Quote
Arcelian wrote:Bloody Wench wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:Setaceous wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:I'm saying that a lot of people are unable to upgrade, and you wanting your shinies isn't enough justification to force people to spend money they may not have or simply stop playing. Indeed. Though if money for those people is seriously that tight, maybe they should reconsider their budget and stop playing anyway. MMOs subs should always come last in a budget for a responsible person. It's not in my budget at all. People seem to want to force it on me, though. You're just being contrary for the sake of it. Any PC over 10 years old should just die in a pall of blue smoke and the faint smell of Ozone. Seriously for well under a grand you can have an i5K, water cooling, GTX 670's, SSDs and 16+ Gig RAMWhy drive that shitbox when you can drive something that doesn't suck? Wait, what? Please tell me how you can have GTX 670's (plural), water cooling, etc. for well under a grand. I'm not saying you are lying, I would genuinely like to know, as I'm building a new rig soon. I mean, one gtx 670 is a little over $300 by itself...
You skimp like mad on the quality of some parts. It potentially blow-up too... |
Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
738
|
Posted - 2013.05.16 17:16:00 -
[168] - Quote
Cipher Jones wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:Does improving visual quality require switching to a version of DirectX that a significant number of players are unable to run?
If not, then CCP isn't at the point where this is actually a serious issue.
Right now all you people are really saying is that you're upset you don't have tessellation because your ultra powerful gaming computer automatically entitles you and you want everyone who can't run DX11 to spend hundreds or thousands of dollars upgrading their machines or buying new ones just so you can have it. My 18 month old rig cost <$500 then, <$300 now. While I see and understand the point you are trying to make, you are exaggerating it.
James is a greedy guy that's why !! 
*removed inappropriate ASCII art signature* - CCP Eterne |
Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
738
|
Posted - 2013.05.16 17:34:00 -
[169] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Xen Solarus wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:So you're fine with forcing a lot of people to pay several hundred dollars (at least) just to continue playing? But it's okay, right? Cause it's not like you have to do anything to get all the shinies you want. They don't have to spend anything. They just need to update their windows verson to a modern one of their choice. They can stick with DX9 if they like, or if their systems can't handle modern graphics. At least that way, everyone else can have the choice to run on the higher graphics, rather than being held back by people living in the stoneage. The way I understood it was that games which require DirectX 11 cannot run on hardware that supports only DX9, or even DX10 for that matter, even if the operating system supports DX11 and DX11 is installed. If I'm wrong about this, please do tell me. I suppose I could "obtain" Crysis 3 to find out for myself, but I'm afraid of my laptop exploding.
The thing you need to realize if that it's not a problem of directx11 or win8, you can always run win7 on your old laptop and eventually DX9 or 10 but once the program (game whatsoever) will start requiring calculations and connections beyond an old rig overclocked under cryo capacities your PC will burn, so yeah there are volunteer hardware/software compatibility limitations which is good.
Your old thing is probably an old hardware with and possessor build around 64nano tech or+, today we're at 24 and will probably go down a bit but it's not for tomorrow, which means my all new quadricore smartphone is faster and powerful than your old PCc and could handle Eve multi client without a problem if there was an application for it.
You can put XP on a fresh new pc it will run but will never ever get the best of said hardware because of OS limitations.
Hardware these days is not as much expensive as it was in the past and the longevity will be higher since we're getting to the point of nano tech limits.
Next generation of expensive hardware is stocking and reading hardware, we already see it with SSD drives getting better and better pretty fast winch means you have to plan carefully your buy choice.
It's a nice moment to get a good rig for a couple years so go for it and start being greedy !!
*removed inappropriate ASCII art signature* - CCP Eterne |
Drachiel
Mercury LLC
22
|
Posted - 2013.05.22 08:49:00 -
[170] - Quote
Why not a cold upgrade to the latest OGL version?
It supports everything DX11 does. |
FlamesOfHeaven
Phantom Fenix
32
|
Posted - 2013.05.22 10:20:00 -
[171] - Quote
Ager Agemo wrote:to those who say they can not afford a decent rig, all I have to say, is that if you have that kind of economic struggle... you shouldn't be spending time and money and eve and instead should be working more to get some more money.
I say this as someone who works on a third world country working half time and yet I make enough to build an enthusiast rig...
QFT
I built two good rigs (one recently) and our family isnt that rich. We were actually near the bottom line of when it comes to money, but we worked our ass off and did what can to pull through that ****. Right now, we enjoying the benefits of working hard and not being a lazy teenager/adult and their "entitlement".
Any computer dated more than 9 -10 years should have support dropped asap. |
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