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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 8 post(s) |
Arckaon
Les chevaliers de l'ordre Goonswarm Federation
4
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Posted - 2013.06.10 11:44:00 -
[361] - Quote
lot of people crying about : i can't harverst ice naymore please do something : well their is ton of ice with nobody inside just move your body somehere else and do something
@Wh well you know if goon was in WH i'm sure you will go outside it. you don't deserve more attention lolz |
El 1974
Green Visstick High Green Rhino
85
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Posted - 2013.06.11 13:59:00 -
[362] - Quote
I recently learned that nullsec anomalies don't de- and respawn at downtime. Even worse these 'anomalies' don't seem to behave like typical anomalies that despawn after three days after being activated. I had a spreadsheet containing some numbers on pre-Odyssey production and consumption estimates and used it to gain an insight in the effects of Odyssey. With this new information I had to rework my post-Odyssey production model. The result of the not despawning of the anomalies is that you can no longer cherrypick the ice you like from anomalies in 0.0; you have to mine them out completely to get more of the good ice. This also means that it is now possible to accurately predict what miners in different areas of space will mine.
My pre-Odyssey numbers looked like this: Hisec racial ice contains 50 HW (13,3%), 300 isotopes (79,79%), 25 LO (6.65%), 1 stront (0,27%) Estimated non-hisec ice production: 31-40% HW, 5% isotopes, 50-60% LO, 3% stront Estimated universal production: 17-20% HW, 60-70% isotopes, 15-17% LO, 0,8% stront This however resulted in not all HW and especially strontium in nullsec to be consumed and being stored in hangars indefinately.
Post-Odyssey we know how these ratio's are in different area's of space: Hisec racial ice: 13,3% HW, 79,79% isotopes, 6.65% LO, 0,27% stront Lowsec: 31,65% HW, 51,78% isotopes, 15,82% LO, 0,75% stront Bad null: 31,38% HW, 35,62% Isotopes, 31,21% LO, 1,8% stront Good null: 30,02% HW, 28,99% isotopes, 38,22% LO, 2,77% stront
These numbers show that HW production will go down, but probably not enough to make it valuable. Strontium production will also go down a bit, but not enough for it to be problematic. Isotopes and LO are more interesting.
When I use the estimate that hisec produces 80% of all ice and make estimates for production in other areas, I get a perfect balance between isotope and LO production. But if we change hisec production to 70% of all ice, the entire model falls apart. If nullsec has to take over more hisec production (which contains mostly isotopes), that will result in nullsec miners mining ice to get the isotopes and all non-isotopes being overproduced. (Unless lowsec production suddenly increases significantly, which I do not expect.) It's interesting to note that the good nullsec ice anomalies contain a lower % of isotopes which in this scenario leads to a situation where they pay less isk/hr than the 'bad' ice anomalies.
So why could ice production/consumption be not exactly what CCP expects? - they could miss-guess player behaviour (wouldn't be the first time) - they could make changes that change player consumption (adding more moons that require posses to mine them, changes to ships and modules that could change use of capital ships, stimulate local production thus reducing the need for stuff to be jump-freightered in, ...) - the number of players could change
Conclusions: - removing the ability to cherrypick ice ores makes the model unstable; it depends entirely on CCP tweaking the numbers to keep the system balanced - Good nullsec systems will not pay significantly more isk/hr than bad nullsec systems, probably less |
PaladinKaos
7thATC
0
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Posted - 2013.06.12 00:33:00 -
[363] - Quote
I'm not a big fan of this change, but it is what it is. I have spent a lot of time and effort to get my skills up for Ice harvesting its one of the ways I relax while playing eve and am able to make a decent living. The main reason I ice mine is because it is easier to walk away from for a min or two when I have to take care of my children (reason why I don't go nuts mission running.) So more than likely I will be doing a lot less ice mining. Oh well to bad. |
Myfanwy Heimdal
Heimdal Freight and Manufacture Inc
271
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Posted - 2013.06.13 18:16:00 -
[364] - Quote
Red DragonZA wrote:Two days into this and mostly Im like... I like the changes..... BUT.... The new ice mining system sucks for me. I work fulltime had 5 accounts, now 4 ..... I can't wait around Sigga all night for a ice belt to spawn. Ice mining was my anti-stress routine at night. I'm yet to smell an ice spawn in Sigga. Im now forced to scale down my eve playing to 3 accounts thanks to this. I can't maintain two posses anymore so Im pulling down my Wormhole pos.... not happy.... I am a wormholer. PS.. I still go dizzy jumping gates... love it!!!
You know, I am much the same. Been away from the game for a while (Real Life's issues with a decreasining number of clanmates and all that) and decided to train up on Ice Mining.
Ended up, like yourself, in Sigga and wondered where the Ice had all gone. Again like yourself I'm a casual player and will be for the forseeable future and find the same problems as yourself.
Oh well, I will give it a go. Perhaps tomorrow or the day after.
Hwyl Myfanwy |
Felicity Love
STARKRAFT Joint Venture Conglomerate
674
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Posted - 2013.06.14 21:28:00 -
[365] - Quote
... waits for CCP to tweak ice anoms down yet another 20% to bolster crashing prices and incite the much expected "ICE WARS"...
Proud Beta Tester for "Bumping Uglies for Dummies" |
Aveneer Walker
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.06.14 23:04:00 -
[366] - Quote
been sitting in a ice system for 6hrs waiting for the magical respawn? Did something get broke? 7hrs and no respawn of ice field in Arveyil, scanned down all contacts. whats wrong here? |
Regan Rotineque
Rl'yeh Interstellar Ltd. Mildly Sober
111
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Posted - 2013.06.15 04:51:00 -
[367] - Quote
I had 2 ppl tell me it was over 4 hrs today
Perhaps submit petition
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SHINA ANGELIE
Hildarian war corporation
0
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Posted - 2013.06.15 10:04:00 -
[368] - Quote
I can understand why they change the ice. But i see that an anomaly only resist about 30 min and you need to wait 4hours for the next.
CCP should increase the ice in the filed, the ice harvester duration and decrease the time between ice anomaly respawn. I am not looking for a eternal ice field, but a system where my toons can live from ice. |
Myfanwy Heimdal
Heimdal Freight and Manufacture Inc
271
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Posted - 2013.06.15 17:21:00 -
[369] - Quote
energypills wrote:Null Exchange wrote:To all the solo miners and their whining... this is a MMO. It can be, but is not intended to be played solo. The best rewards are for those who cooperate with other players. Adapt or find something else to do.
Also - If your POS relied on you mining the fuel to keep it running, you were doing it wrong. All economic equations of the money making venture you were doing should have included the market cost of the fuel before deciding to start the activity. The extra money made by mining it yourself should have been seen as that, extra profit. Do you REALLY think that this game is NOT intended to be played solo just because it is MMO? MMO means Multi Player. That means there are multiple players - that does not mean a player isn't meant to played solo. Don't go making stuff up - you don't know what you are talking about. I am not whining but in actuality whining will get you pretty far in this world.
Exactly. Multi-player means just that; there's otther plays to interact with. It doesn't mean that one has to work with them.
As a miner one interacts with the other pilots by means of the markets and, to some extent, competition for the ores.
What MMO doesn't mean, or shouldn't mean, is that one player has to invest in a fleet of pilots to make it a Multiple Mini-Me Organised game to get things done. Nor should it demand that one has to work alongside other players.
There's a lot of players out here, not all but a fair number, whose real-life constraints mean that they can't sit down for hours at an end every evening and play Eve. With the current system these players are excluded from Ice mining.
No problem, there's always rocks to pound on an ad-hoc basis until I, at least, can spend a day in pvp which is also an example of interaction within an MMO. So, really, your point is sadly misguided.
Regards
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Trilanttia
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
1
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Posted - 2013.06.15 17:48:00 -
[370] - Quote
I found an ice mining location. Not too hard to find. Had to warp into a few systems before finding the locale. So far it does not seem to be too onerous to mine. Can't complain. |
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pmchem
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
524
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Posted - 2013.06.16 23:15:00 -
[371] - Quote
Seems like there's a glut of ice and plenty of stockpiles. Prices are not rising and basically no icefields in low/null are used. @pmchem on twitter || GARPA || Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal |
Dave Stark
3179
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Posted - 2013.06.17 10:17:00 -
[372] - Quote
pmchem wrote:Seems like there's a glut of ice and plenty of stockpiles.
that's probably because people like me were mining ice for about a month or more before odyssey and haven't sold a single unit of it yet. |
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CCP Fozzie
C C P C C P Alliance
6479
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Posted - 2013.06.18 15:19:00 -
[373] - Quote
Hey guys we have an update and bugfix to announce.
The systems of Feshur, Anath and Pemsahin low-sec Aridia were not properly given ice anoms in Odyssey, because of a bug caused by their low truesec. These systems are the three lowest truesec ice belts in lowsec, and are in a range that actually gets rounded down to 0.0 for most calculations.
When fixing this defect we decided that the uniquely low truesec in these systems makes them ideal for some unique flavor, so they will have the distinction of being the only low-sec systems to contain the "Weak Nullsec" Ice Anoms.
The fix should be deployed shortly. Game Designer | Team Five-0 https://twitter.com/CCP_Fozzie |
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Morwen Lagann
Tyrathlion Interstellar
679
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Posted - 2013.06.18 15:20:00 -
[374] - Quote
... Nice. Awesome idea! Morwen Lagann Director, Tyrathlion Interstellar |
Ripard Teg
Stimulus Rote Kapelle
683
|
Posted - 2013.06.18 15:25:00 -
[375] - Quote
I endorse this plan. Makes doubly good sense because Aridia is so isolated. Jester's Trek: wherein I ramble about EVE Online, gaming, and from time to time... life. |
Bjurn Akely
Knights of Nii The 20 Minuters
5
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Posted - 2013.06.18 15:47:00 -
[376] - Quote
/me stocks up on torps and heads off. |
mynnna
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1278
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Posted - 2013.06.18 15:59:00 -
[377] - Quote
This should represent a 2% increase in lowsec mining volume... from .5% to .51%
(It's a neat idea though, I approve) Member of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal |
Dramaticus
Goonswarm Federation
396
|
Posted - 2013.06.18 16:14:00 -
[378] - Quote
Where? bring back images |
Onslaughtor
True Slave Foundations Shaktipat Revelators
52
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Posted - 2013.06.18 21:47:00 -
[379] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:Hey guys we have an update and bugfix to announce.
The systems of Feshur, Anath and Pemsahin low-sec Aridia were not properly given ice anoms in Odyssey, because of a bug caused by their low truesec. These systems are the three lowest truesec ice belts in lowsec, and are in a range that actually gets rounded down to 0.0 for most calculations.
When fixing this defect we decided that the uniquely low truesec in these systems makes them ideal for some unique flavor, so they will have the distinction of being the only low-sec systems to contain the "Weak Nullsec" Ice Anoms.
The fix should be deployed shortly.
There is also the system of Cumemare that had nullsec ice that was removed in the expansion. |
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CCP Fozzie
C C P C C P Alliance
6490
|
Posted - 2013.06.19 01:00:00 -
[380] - Quote
Onslaughtor wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:Hey guys we have an update and bugfix to announce.
The systems of Feshur, Anath and Pemsahin low-sec Aridia were not properly given ice anoms in Odyssey, because of a bug caused by their low truesec. These systems are the three lowest truesec ice belts in lowsec, and are in a range that actually gets rounded down to 0.0 for most calculations.
When fixing this defect we decided that the uniquely low truesec in these systems makes them ideal for some unique flavor, so they will have the distinction of being the only low-sec systems to contain the "Weak Nullsec" Ice Anoms.
The fix should be deployed shortly. There is also the system of Cumemare that had nullsec ice that was removed in the expansion.
Most of the 0.1 systems went from 0.0 to lowsec ice and this was by design for Odyssey. Cumemare shouldn't have encountered the same bug and should have ice anoms spawning now, I'll double check when I get to work tomorrow. Game Designer | Team Five-0 https://twitter.com/CCP_Fozzie |
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Glwe
Glwe Corporation
3
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Posted - 2013.06.19 08:18:00 -
[381] - Quote
To compress 1 ore anomaly need 3 hour of work of a rorqual, but to compress one ice anomaly need 12 hours , may be to reduce manufacturing time of the blueprints for ice from 1 minute to 25 seconds? |
Unforgiven Storm
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
430
|
Posted - 2013.06.22 22:02:00 -
[382] - Quote
I have some questions:
how are the numbers for ice mining out of high sec?
0.0 / low sec ice mining went up, down, is the same?
Ice consumption in Eve went up, down, is the same?
What I preview happened (people cut on ice consumption and 0.0 numbers are the same) or CCP plan worked (people are starting to mine ice in 0.0 and replacing high sec)? Test 1, 2, 3... |
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CCP Fozzie
C C P C C P Alliance
6532
|
Posted - 2013.06.23 21:06:00 -
[383] - Quote
Unforgiven Storm wrote:I have some questions:
how are the numbers for ice mining out of high sec?
0.0 / low sec ice mining went up, down, is the same?
Ice consumption in Eve went up, down, is the same?
What I preview happened (people cut on ice consumption and 0.0 numbers are the same) or CCP plan worked (people are starting to mine ice in 0.0 and replacing high sec)?
I won't give anything close to exact numbers because those would be incredibly valuable for price predictions but I can talk a bit about the way we're looking at these metrics, how we feel about them at this early stage.
Overall we're happy with what we're seeing so far, but it's far too early to tell what the total impact of the Odyssey changes will be long-term. We're still near the start of an extended period of transition where the markets adjust to the new realities and player behavior adapts to find the optimal methods of profit making in the new ice landscape. Honestly these kinds of transition periods can take years and I probably won't feel comfortable saying "mission accomplished" until we've been able to observe the effects for at least a year. Our key goals during this period are to ensure that any price and supply shocks are manageable and that the overall market and gameplay effects are pointing in the right direction. On both counts we're quite happy right now.
Ice mining volume in high sec is obviously significantly lower right now than it was in the big rush immediately before Odyssey, but it's also above where it was a year ago, which places it well within our target range for this period.
Volume in lowsec and nullsec are both up (although they are still well below high sec of course) and the combination of increased ice volume and growing ore volume has given last week the record for the most mining ever done in lowsec.
Consumption of ice products is very healthy, and there was actually more control towers online last Friday than there was at Odyssey's launch.
So overall we're still extremely early in the process of evaluating the changes caused by Odyssey's ice rebalance, but nothing we're seeing so far gives us any reason to doubt our grand plan. Game Designer | Team Five-0 https://twitter.com/CCP_Fozzie |
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Praerian
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
72
|
Posted - 2013.06.23 22:35:00 -
[384] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:Unforgiven Storm wrote:I have some questions:
how are the numbers for ice mining out of high sec?
0.0 / low sec ice mining went up, down, is the same?
Ice consumption in Eve went up, down, is the same?
What I preview happened (people cut on ice consumption and 0.0 numbers are the same) or CCP plan worked (people are starting to mine ice in 0.0 and replacing high sec)? I won't give anything close to exact numbers because those would be incredibly valuable for price predictions but I can talk a bit about the way we're looking at these metrics, how we feel about them at this early stage. Overall we're happy with what we're seeing so far, but it's far too early to tell what the total impact of the Odyssey changes will be long-term. We're still near the start of an extended period of transition where the markets adjust to the new realities and player behavior adapts to find the optimal methods of profit making in the new ice landscape. Honestly these kinds of transition periods can take years and I probably won't feel comfortable saying "mission accomplished" until we've been able to observe the effects for at least a year. Our key goals during this period are to ensure that any price and supply shocks are manageable and that the overall market and gameplay effects are pointing in the right direction. On both counts we're quite happy right now. Ice mining volume in high sec is obviously significantly lower right now than it was in the big rush immediately before Odyssey, but it's also above where it was a year ago, which places it well within our target range for this period. Volume in lowsec and nullsec are both up (although they are still well below high sec of course) and the combination of increased ice volume and growing ore volume has given last week the record for the most mining ever done in lowsec. Consumption of ice products is very healthy, and there was actually more control towers online last Friday than there was at Odyssey's launch. So overall we're still extremely early in the process of evaluating the changes caused by Odyssey's ice rebalance, but nothing we're seeing so far gives us any reason to doubt our grand plan.
Of course there are more towers you added more moons ;)
However you made it alot harder for ice miners to cope with the increased rate by not altering rorq compression for 0.0.
I also like how you made it easier to gank miners in hidden belts, thanks :)
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Sir Marksalot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
512
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Posted - 2013.06.30 17:21:00 -
[385] - Quote
Praerian wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:Unforgiven Storm wrote:I have some questions:
how are the numbers for ice mining out of high sec?
0.0 / low sec ice mining went up, down, is the same?
Ice consumption in Eve went up, down, is the same?
What I preview happened (people cut on ice consumption and 0.0 numbers are the same) or CCP plan worked (people are starting to mine ice in 0.0 and replacing high sec)? I won't give anything close to exact numbers because those would be incredibly valuable for price predictions but I can talk a bit about the way we're looking at these metrics, how we feel about them at this early stage. Overall we're happy with what we're seeing so far, but it's far too early to tell what the total impact of the Odyssey changes will be long-term. We're still near the start of an extended period of transition where the markets adjust to the new realities and player behavior adapts to find the optimal methods of profit making in the new ice landscape. Honestly these kinds of transition periods can take years and I probably won't feel comfortable saying "mission accomplished" until we've been able to observe the effects for at least a year. Our key goals during this period are to ensure that any price and supply shocks are manageable and that the overall market and gameplay effects are pointing in the right direction. On both counts we're quite happy right now. Ice mining volume in high sec is obviously significantly lower right now than it was in the big rush immediately before Odyssey, but it's also above where it was a year ago, which places it well within our target range for this period. Volume in lowsec and nullsec are both up (although they are still well below high sec of course) and the combination of increased ice volume and growing ore volume has given last week the record for the most mining ever done in lowsec. Consumption of ice products is very healthy, and there was actually more control towers online last Friday than there was at Odyssey's launch. So overall we're still extremely early in the process of evaluating the changes caused by Odyssey's ice rebalance, but nothing we're seeing so far gives us any reason to doubt our grand plan. Of course there are more towers you added more moons ;) However you made it alot harder for ice miners to cope with the increased rate by not altering rorq compression for 0.0. I also like how you made it easier to gank miners in hidden belts, thanks :)
Rorqual compression has always been pretty horrible. Now it's just laughable rather than useless. |
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn
Department 10
29
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Posted - 2013.07.08 13:23:00 -
[386] - Quote
Regarding the four hour respawn time for ice anomalies there does seem to be the occasional comment saying this isn't working but I have checked the timings a few times and it is spot on.
Regarding clearance time per ice anomaly it does vary greatly depending on area and racial type. I imagine Caldari high sec is probably the fastest cleared given that Caldari towers are most popular for the extra CPU in high sec. But I regularly see anomalies lasting over two hours and its not uncommon to see them lasting well over three hours.
Regarding supplies of ice products and prices we will have to wait until all the pre-Odyssey stockpiles are all consumed. Once that happens I think you will see price rises and shortages in Caldari ice for high sec research towers. This will probably result in people having to switch to other racial types of towers to a degree. |
Bohoba
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
45
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Posted - 2013.07.10 03:59:00 -
[387] - Quote
I just came back june 30th to check things out and this Ice change ..... well I for one am not liking it I am lucky to get 1 load of ice before the belt is depleted and they only lasting about 10 min in the 12 systems I hunt ice in. haaha my ice mining ships name was changed to Blue ice Hunter :) I can see this is going to boil over soon.
Oh why not just do it to the ore too ??
might as well just make it a none profession and refund all the mining skill points :).....just had to put that in here
got to love this game to live through all this :) for 9+ years
humm |
Cpt Dealman
Colossus Technologies Project Wildfire
7
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Posted - 2013.07.16 20:59:00 -
[388] - Quote
I wholeheartedly agree with Bohoba, ice mining is one of the things I have specifically skilled for and it used to be the thing I enjoyed to do the most in EVE Online. Now it's one of the most tedious and annoying things I know of.
I finally decided to come back to EVE Online, but after having seen what they did to what I enjoyed the most, I'll most likely be gone for months again...
Really the only reason I see that was done was in hopes to "balance" the market or make Ice less common, but to me the prices haven't changed even the slightest, at least not for Blue Ice which I am mining.
I am entirely against this change, it's the least useful and utmost silly change I've ever seen in EVE Online History. |
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
739
|
Posted - 2013.07.17 02:06:00 -
[389] - Quote
Cpt Dealman wrote:I wholeheartedly agree with Bohoba, ice mining is one of the things I have specifically skilled for and it used to be the thing I enjoyed to do the most in EVE Online. Now it's one of the most tedious and annoying things I know of.
I finally decided to come back to EVE Online, but after having seen what they did to what I enjoyed the most, I'll most likely be gone for months again...
Really the only reason I see that was done was in hopes to "balance" the market or make Ice less common, but to me the prices haven't changed even the slightest, at least not for Blue Ice which I am mining.
I am entirely against this change, it's the least useful and utmost silly change I've ever seen in EVE Online History. No, actually the removal of gravametric sites was more useless and silly.... |
El 1974
Green Visstick High Green Rhino
90
|
Posted - 2013.07.21 07:19:00 -
[390] - Quote
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn wrote:Regarding the four hour respawn time for ice anomalies there does seem to be the occasional comment saying this isn't working but I have checked the timings a few times and it is spot on. It however works differently around downtime.
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn wrote:If there is an ice anomaly in a system before DT with ice still left in it then the same anomaly will still exist after DT. If a system usually has an ice anomaly but it has been totally cleared before DT then the four hour rule is ignored and a ice anomaly will spawn immediately after DT with the full 2500 units. |
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