O rly? I guess I just have to take your word for it?

Rest assured, the most experienced PvPers in the game agree with me on ECM, and I know I am right.

Where? I cant see any experienced PvPers agreeing with you. You know you are right,,, ,omg , can it be more egoistic?

in short: there is a chance based mechanish ,which isnt overused --> not op at all , has plenty of counter ,but mr "pro" pvper never uses any counter , and then looses 1 from 10 losses due to enemy ecm ship in a 2v5 or other outnumbered scenarios.
But he is so pro ,he comes to the forum to whine and qq. I can totally see the experienced PvPer part...

Our gangs make a policy of avoiding gangs with Falcons or Rooks. The idiots that use them don't seem to understand that ECM is not fun - just a method of epeen enlargement. If you want to get fun fights, roams, and engagements, don't use ECM. If you do use it, you'll get less and less fights in the area because everyone will realize what an as*hole you are, and the only "PvP" you'll get in that region will be gatecamping newbies (oh, what fun! Waiting an hour to engage a newbie tristn on a gate with your Falcon supported fleet).

I hope one day CCP comes to its senses and decide to man up and accept the mistake they made with ECM. Its not a fun form of EWAR, not dynamic, trying to counter it results in crippled fits (for example - to counter sensor camps or TDs or neuts you fit sebos or tracking enhancers or cap boosters - all of these modules actually help your ship when you don't encounter its respective EWAR. ECCM? It's still mostly useless when faced with a Falcon, and absolutely useless (unlike the other mods) when ECM is not encountered.)

ECM kills small gang fights. I hope CCP one day realizes this and changes or deletes ECM from the game.

Obviously you don't know who DHB wildcat is.

Anyways the problems with ECM:

Does it ruin small scale PvP? Yes.

Does it create an un-fun enviroment? Yes.

Is it elegant? Yes in simplicity , in function? No it ******* sucks.

Does it fit in with the rest of the game mechanics? Not really, its too random.

Is it overpowered? Irrelevant to our point.

ECM has nothing going for it. The only people that support it are ones that don't know better, haven't experienced enough of it, or simply can't win without it.

ECM causes people to lose ships without a fight, I honestly don't see how you think that is a good thing.

ECM has nothing going for it. The only people that support it are ones that don't know better, haven't experienced enough of it, or simply can't win without it.

ECM causes people to lose ships without a fight, I honestly don't see how you think that is a good thing.

I don't support this; I've been on both ends, I don't use jammers unless I'm on a jam ship which is hardly ever, and if you're going to say I don't know better you're just sidestepping any sort of discourse.

Jammers give a chance that someone can't do anything briefly, damps ensure it. That's not a good point against them.

And if 'some noob' can show up and keep you out of a fight, guess what, he can do that. He's also in a paper thin ship and probably only managed one jam, so have someone kill him or let your drones do it.

ECM is no more effective than damped or TD'd to death. In no scenario can you meaningfully fight back - flee or die is the same option everywhere - confirmation bias makes you feel ECM is somehow 'worse'

Please stop pretending its some god like I-WIN button because its not.

Your complaint about the entire mechanic is valid - moaning about it being massively overpowered is simply untrue and detracts from the value of the thread.

Simply put, we want a mechanic overhaul for ECM.

No, we do not want it.

You lost a Stabber to two Falcons. Sure, it sucks, but all losses suck. You learn from it and you seem to be doing just fine. Roll with a bigger gang or keep avoiding ECM ships.

With all the nerfs to ECM we already had are now sensor dampeners becoming the FoTM. You will run into the same problem as before and I do not want to see the game changed just so you can make the same mistake twice before you realize you were wrong all along.

Edit: Out of the 17 losses you've had, not a single one has an ECM ship in it. And you claim to have been on both sides? Heck, you've not even flown an ECM ship, yet alone die to one. This is why I say only the inexperienced argue for ECM.

See, now you're just posting emotional rants.


Just get closer vs a damp? Then just get further away from ECM
TD does affect missiles? ECM does affect FoF either.

Your 'solutions' are just as ridiculous as mine.


Keep the complaint to chance based issues around a binary effect and away from emotional rants about its power in game, is my humble advice.

When there is a frigate tackling your ship and you get ECM'd, you are basically dead in the water. When you get sensor damped you atleast have the option of killing the ships tackling or brawling you. Not everybody flies kiting long range ships that sit 20kms away from you. This is a very common occurrence.

If you've ever fought a keres you'd understand how wrong that is. On top of that damp ships don't open with range, they open with res. That freakish, endless, and evil 20 sec jam you're talking about is nothing compared to taking a cruiser's res down to 40. After that, if you're still alive lock range is at 8% and if you can lock from disruptor range at that point you're too big to hit a frig anyway.

Remember it's not possible to look at ECM without also looking at the ships - right now ECM birds NEED to stack mods up so hard, they can afford almost no tank whatsoever. That needs considered alongside any potential ECM change - that they need so many mods to be remotely consistent/threatening.
.

If 8% of your maximum lock(What happens when a damp ship decides to hate you) is greater than disruptor range (that needs a base targeting range over 200km for the record) you are clearly in something that can't hit a frigate. And at that point nothing is going to stay in your lock range long enough to actually lock.

You seem have trouble with the idea that damps can keep ships from locking and therefore fighting.

Then the jams are VERY unreliable and I don't think there's any debate about how fast they die after a couple of missed jams.

No lol, fitting a single 1600mm plate gives you like 10k more EHP and reduces your jam on a specific module from 9.9 str to 9.4 .

What are u even saying hahaha.

Also: Do you even know what a brawling is bro?

I do. Now, from the situation you just laid out, kill the tackle orbiting just out of lock range (18km) and the keres orbiting at 36(the keres is putting down a point from here as well).

I do. Now, from the situation you just laid out, kill the tackle orbiting just out of lock range (18km) and the keres orbiting at 36(the keres is putting down a point from here as well).

Try to slingshot the tackler at 18kms, he dies. \o/, you just killed something. Can't do that with ECM :), because when u get jammed everybody and their uncle will get in close to you and apply DPS because they know you can't do anything to fight back.