Please CCP, for the love of god, if you want to nerf marauder's drone capabilities, nerf just the bandwidth, not the drone bays. Give us at least 75m3 dronebays. That's 2 flights of lights and 1 flight of salvagers..

Please CCP, for the love of god, if you want to nerf marauder's drone capabilities, nerf just the bandwidth, not the drone bays. Give us at least 75m3 dronebays. That's 2 flights of lights and 1 flight of salvagers..

If you use salvage drones on a marauder, you are doing it very, very wrong

If you use salvage drones on a marauder, you are doing it very, very wrong

This is my marauder super sauce,

Three tractors in the highs pulling in wrecks/loots while your salvage drones go to town and npcs are exploding left and right. By the time your done killing npcs the room is looted and salvaged. Its the only way.

i hate how light drones just dies in mission even if you try to return them right away and they are under 10km from ship. I dont see how 1 flight of small drones can be enough.

This is my marauder super sauce,

Three tractors in the highs pulling in wrecks/loots while your salvage drones go to town and npcs are exploding left and right. By the time your done killing npcs the room is looted and salvaged. Its the only way.

Please CCP, for the love of god, if you want to nerf marauder's drone capabilities, nerf just the bandwidth, not the drone bays. Give us at least 75m3 dronebays. That's 2 flights of lights and 1 flight of salvagers..

100/175 seem correct to me. You have large cargo hold, give it a large drone bay too, and 100 bandwidth for 4x sentry for great projected drone dps that is stationary next to you in Bastion mode for increased synergy without power creep (matches most faction / pirate drone bays). Otherwise the extra projection is sort of pointless.

Nerf bandwidth as you see fit but at least give us 75m3 drone bay

So far, what I can see based on the actual testing of those ships, is that the Bastion mode is good, but that the hulls were most likely nerfed a bit too much.

I agree with the drone flexibility - while I don't see them necessarily keep the TQ bandwidth, they can use moar dronebay.

Also considering reverting some of the other hull nerfs, will let you know when we have more details (we aren't going to change their role though). And sorry to say, but version 2 with web bonuses is not coming back, it just didn't fit that well with the role and Bastion mode.

So far, what I can see based on the actual testing of those ships, is that the Bastion mode is good, but that the hulls were most likely nerfed a bit too much.

I agree with the drone flexibility - while I don't see them necessarily keep the TQ bandwidth, they can use moar dronebay.

Also considering reverting some of the other hull nerfs, will let you know when we have more details (we aren't going to change their role though). And sorry to say, but version 2 with web bonuses is not coming back, it just didn't fit that well with the role and Bastion mode.

At first glance, these ships NEED web bonuses. The concept of giving them a larger drone bay so they can burn through millions of ISK of Hob II's per site is idiotic.

Great, so any testing I am organizing on Sisi for Marauders will be ignored out of hand.
At first glance, these ships NEED web bonuses. The concept of giving them a larger drone bay so they can burn through millions of ISK of Hob II's per site is idiotic.

So far, what I can see based on the actual testing of those ships, is that the Bastion mode is good, but that the hulls were most likely nerfed a bit too much.

I agree with the drone flexibility - while I don't see them necessarily keep the TQ bandwidth, they can use moar dronebay.

Also considering reverting some of the other hull nerfs, will let you know when we have more details (we aren't going to change their role though). And sorry to say, but version 2 with web bonuses is not coming back, it just didn't fit that well with the role and Bastion mode.

large drone bay is never a bad thing i dont understand why you are saying it is idiotic

What is the point of a larger bay, which just means more small drones fed to the NPC AI.
Now, if you are talking a larger bay, AND Bandwidth, so we can fit sentries, like we do now, then that is different.

I don't know about you, Dinsdale, but I find it somewhat difficult to lose a Hob II unless I'm not watching rat aggro or drone damage properly. Granted that Incursion rats hate drones somewhat more than other K-space rats, but this is why I said elsewhere that you may need to consider adding better anti-frigate capabilities to your fleet.

You're trying to shoehorn what is essentially a new ship into an old flying technique and it isn't going to work as well as you want it to.

Bring ships with medium guns. I hear the Proteus can mount a scary armor tank (for now) and has smaller guns that are better-suited to anti-frig work as well as lots and lots of well-bonused drones of its own. Fit TC IIs where your webs used to go and script them for tracking. If you must, have one or two of your Paladins fit Dual Heavy Pulse IIs instead of Mega Pulses. If you simply must use drones, then consider replacing your Hob IIs with Hammerhead IIs and restricting their use to close-range frigates where you can pull them back quickly once they start taking aggro.

I don't know about you, Dinsdale, but I find it somewhat difficult to lose a Hob II unless I'm not watching rat aggro or drone damage properly. Granted that Incursion rats hate drones somewhat more than other K-space rats, but this is why I said elsewhere that you may need to consider adding better anti-frigate capabilities to your fleet.

You're trying to shoehorn what is essentially a new ship into an old flying technique and it isn't going to work as well as you want it to.

Bring ships with medium guns. I hear the Proteus can mount a scary armor tank (for now) and has smaller guns that are better-suited to anti-frig work as well as lots and lots of well-bonused drones of its own. Fit TC IIs where your webs used to go and script them for tracking. If you must, have one or two of your Paladins fit Dual Heavy Pulse IIs instead of Mega Pulses. If you simply must use drones, then consider replacing your Hob IIs with Hammerhead IIs and restricting their use to close-range frigates where you can pull them back quickly once they start taking aggro.

So far, what I can see based on the actual testing of those ships, is that the Bastion mode is good, but that the hulls were most likely nerfed a bit too much.

I agree with the drone flexibility - while I don't see them necessarily keep the TQ bandwidth, they can use moar dronebay.

Also considering reverting some of the other hull nerfs, will let you know when we have more details (we aren't going to change their role though). And sorry to say, but version 2 with web bonuses is not coming back, it just didn't fit that well with the role and Bastion mode.

What is the point of a larger bay, which just means more small drones fed to the NPC AI.
Now, if you are talking a larger bay, AND Bandwidth, so we can fit sentries, like we do now, then that is different.

I agree with the drone flexibility - while I don't see them necessarily keep the TQ bandwidth, they can use moar dronebay.

And sorry to say, but version 2 with web bonuses is not coming back, it just didn't fit that well with the role and Bastion mode.

>Can't kill small things with his own guns without webs.

>Wants to use sentries.

What is the point of a larger bay, which just means more small drones fed to the NPC AI.
Now, if you are talking a larger bay, AND Bandwidth, so we can fit sentries, like we do now, then that is different.

Because I use webs, when bonused.

So far, what I can see based on the actual testing of those ships, is that the Bastion mode is good, but that the hulls were most likely nerfed a bit too much.

I agree with the drone flexibility - while I don't see them necessarily keep the TQ bandwidth, they can use moar dronebay.

Also considering reverting some of the other hull nerfs, will let you know when we have more details (we aren't going to change their role though). And sorry to say, but version 2 with web bonuses is not coming back, it just didn't fit that well with the role and Bastion mode.

I see where you're coming from with this,.. and with the new "structure mechanics" I'd love this as much as the next mission runner, but having said that, I can't see CCP agreeing to this, as it stands all Marauders get 75/75 at least, I can't see them buffing Drone Bandwidth when they're already doing so much to increase damage projection with the Bastion Module.


This in a nutshell,.. leave some flexibility.

With reference to the hull nerfs.
Relooking at the T2 resists to make the hulls more viable outside Bastion would be a useful thing. These hulls should not be reliant on using Bastion to be effective. The speed nerf would also be worth looking at a bit. They don't need to be the fastest attack battleships out there, but base speed equivalent to the combat battleships would be reasonable, especially given they will be stopping any time they use Bastion so need to get speed back up again afterwards.

The web bonus staying away I agree with as it makes no sense given the range projection of these ships with increased range.

Finally, addressing the tractor range would be worthwhile. Either via full removal if the tractor structure is good enough (in which case additional cargo bay is required) or increasing it.

So far, what I can see based on the actual testing of those ships, is that the Bastion mode is good, but that the hulls were most likely nerfed a bit too much.

I agree with the drone flexibility - while I don't see them necessarily keep the TQ bandwidth, they can use moar dronebay.

Also considering reverting some of the other hull nerfs, will let you know when we have more details (we aren't going to change their role though). And sorry to say, but version 2 with web bonuses is not coming back, it just didn't fit that well with the role and Bastion mode.

The extra resists in bastion is one of the best features the mode has. T2 resists would make this overpowered.

You don't need bastion, remember that the hulls come with a baked in rep bonus. In most cases you don't need to use Bastion at all. Having said that, when things don't go exactly to plan being able to Bastion down the hatches will save your bacon. The tank is already good, Bastion mode makes it borderline ridiculous...

So far, what I can see based on the actual testing of those ships, is that the Bastion mode is good, but that the hulls were most likely nerfed a bit too much.

I agree with the drone flexibility - while I don't see them necessarily keep the TQ bandwidth, they can use moar dronebay.

Also considering reverting some of the other hull nerfs, will let you know when we have more details (we aren't going to change their role though). And sorry to say, but version 2 with web bonuses is not coming back, it just didn't fit that well with the role and Bastion mode.

Nice to hear.

One thing I would like to see (and I think this may have been said by others as well) is the removal of the tractor bonuses, then bake in the extra m3 required to carry around your new tractor beam deployable structure. This means that people that use a Noctis or that are doing PvP with these ships won't have a "wasted" bonus and those that solo or don't use a Noctis still have a viable way of conducting business.

The bonus could then be made into something a little more "pleasing" to people maybe or just dropped completely.

Also considering reverting some of the other hull nerfs, will let you know when we have more details (we aren't going to change their role though). And sorry to say, but version 2 with web bonuses is not coming back, it just didn't fit that well with the role and Bastion mode.

A theoretical suggestion:

How well would the Bastion plattform fit together with, lets say 3-4 Sentry drones with a Marauder?

Enable Bastion Mode -> Launch Sentrys -> after 60s recover drones -> Jump -> repeat.

It's up to you how the Marauders become in the end; maybe you like the idea with this synergy. I am not asking for 125 m-¦ dronebandwidth, but how about 75m-¦ bandwidth and 125m-¦ capacity and for the Kronos additional 25m-¦ (cause Gallente like drones - i can't fly a Kronos anyway, only to point it out). This is 3 Sentrys and two sets of small drones for most of the ships.

Because I use webs, when bonused.

Interesting.

What might be even more unique would be to give Marauders a special cargo bay that can only carry "deploy able structures", such as the new tractor/loot array and the personal depot array (well, any of them really).

This would make them even more unique, able to operate in deep space for long periods of time efficiently, and not tread on the role of the Noctis. Perhaps even consider salvaging bonuses instead of tractor beam.

Go to an area of space, launch your personal depot somewhere in a safe, go to the anom or mission site, deploy your loot collection array, continue as normal. When done in that system pack everything up and head to the next area of interest.

I agree with the drone flexibility - while I don't see them necessarily keep the TQ bandwidth, they can use moar dronebay.

That's the point. I don't want

Well too bad, because you're getting it anyway. We don't have official stats yet but I'd bet it will be at least as good as what you have "on board" now and probably comparable to a Noctis (which would be much better than what you have now). Anything less (although possible) would be pointless for CCP to introduce.

And rest assured that although giving a "deployable" bay to the Marauders and taking away the tractor bonus actually is a good idea, it probably won't be implemented. It simply makes too much sense.

Speaking of marauders and drones, why is there no droneship marauder?
Every other weapon system has an associated marauder, except drones...

That's the point. I don't want to drop something at the end of the mission. I want to tractor/loot/salvage while doing the mission. Marauders do get a damage application bonus. Webs and TPs.

Does anyone have the stats page or any info about that deployable structure? I remember reading about it, but can't remember where. I know you can drop it and it'll tractor and loot for you, but that's about it.

No stats released yet, unfortunately.

Would you be okay with a special "deployable bay" for the structure? Wouldn't it be easier to drop it during the mission and let it do its work while you kill, reducing micromanagement (assuming it isn't shot by NPCs)? I'm honestly curious why you would prefer to manage several more modules on top of the rest of your ship instead of leaving it to an automated structure.

I suppose I can understand your concern that the auto-looter can be attacked by other players and destroyed (and probably looted) without CONCORD intervention.

Web bonuses have been removed on Marauders and will not be coming back. CCP Ytterbium has confirmed that. Only the Golem gets a TP bonus.

I, too, fit my Marauder with three tractors and a flight of salvage drones. However, I don't deploy them until NPCs are already dead. Shall I take this to mean that salvage drones don't draw any aggro?

Also posting in support of a 75m3 or 100m3 drone bay, even if the 50m3 bandwidth is kept.

I think they meant the bastion web bonuses. I haven't looked at them on sisi to know though.

Bastion never gave web bonuses. It gives optimal/falloff bonuses, and missile velocity.

The web bonuses were on the ships, removed for the first iteration, brought back for the second (at the expense of active tanking bonus), and removed on the rollback to the 1st iteration.

Again, the web bonuses will not be coming back.

The extra resists in bastion is one of the best features the mode has. T2 resists would make this overpowered.

At least bastion mode should have T2 resists.

Bastion mode gives you better than T2 resists. 30% increase on every resistance, across every tank type, without stacking penalty.

My main problems are the small drone bay and the crappy scan res.

With a moderate tank and a DCU II (yes even on armor ships) you can achieve an amazing resist profile while in Bastion.

2) make it easier to return drones to drone bay. the radial dial was good idea but having to navigate the dial to get to the return drone option is TERRIBLE. Why is that option hidden in the secondary option?!?!

Great, so any testing I am organizing on Sisi for Marauders will be ignored out of hand.
At first glance, these ships NEED web bonuses. The concept of giving them a larger drone bay so they can burn through millions of ISK of Hob II's per site is idiotic.

Bastion mode gives you better than T2 resists. 30% increase on every resistance, across every tank type, without stacking penalty.

So far, what I can see based on the actual testing of those ships, is that the Bastion mode is good, but that the hulls were most likely nerfed a bit too much.

I agree with the drone flexibility - while I don't see them necessarily keep the TQ bandwidth, they can use moar dronebay.

Also considering reverting some of the other hull nerfs, will let you know when we have more details (we aren't going to change their role though). And sorry to say, but version 2 with web bonuses is not coming back, it just didn't fit that well with the role and Bastion mode.

You mean you never set "return to dronebay" as a keybinding option? Wow.

Personally with both salvage drones existing, and the new deployable "tractor and loot all" module, I'm struggling to justify using my target slots on salvaging and tractoring myself when I can be shooting more things at once (especially with how fast long range boosted blasters are chewing through NPCs)

If the tractor bonus went tomorrow in favour of a deployable structure cargo bay, I wouldn't be upset. I'd just throw up two passive targeting modules for the extra number of target slots (already have a Drone Link in the third high for longer range on my salvagers) and carry on regardless.



So you have to pay attention in missions to maximise your efficiency, something that CCP has been pushing for the last year since they changed NPC AI to kill off the AFK domi mission runners.