Make Gallente the fastest race without MWD, but give them the mass to keep them a bit slower than Minmatar at MWD speeds. Plates (even as they are now, although they need fixing) would have less of an effect on top speeds, and Gallente boats would be able to hold their prey once they'd caught it, and still do reasonable speed while scrammed, neuted and webbed (as they are whenever they get into blaster range).

[quote=Daedalus Arcova]19km webs and 16km scrams still leave blaster boats in the position of being raped before they get into range.

Quite. But those ranges are not the norm, and getting caught by an Arazu or a Rapier is usually game over for anyone.

So you missed the part where CCP Tallest buffed railgun tracking and damage, and uffed Javelin tracking? I guess you missed the bit where I called for a nerf to autocannon tracking and the falloff bonus from TEs too.

This post points out another message to you devs. It says:

"Gallente! A race so messed up people don't know that it already has a bonus to using Damps!""

Gallente Battleship Skill Bonus: 5% bonus to Large Hybrid Turret damage and 7.5% bonus to Large Hybrid Turret tracking speed per level.

Gallente Cruiser Skill Bonus: 5% bonus to Medium Hybrid Turret damage per level and 5% increase to MicroWarpdrive capacitor bonus per level.

You cannot make Gallente faster than mimatar, Why? because then rail guns would be the new kite weapon of choice, Also Blasters would Alwasy be able to maintain range, making them OP as well. All this would do is shift the imbalance. This also ignores all caldari ships.... Lets not forget that. Adding extra stats to ships/new hybrid only modules again ignores Caldari and does not balance hybrids instead it just mask's the problem.

The only way to fix Hybrids is to FIX hybrids. Small changes to ships can happen but they cannot encroach on mimatar. Playing with stats and ammo is the only way. Stop dreaming of all Gallente getting damp bonuses, or a dash (thus making recons worthless fyi) Every ship needs a weakness and advantage you cannot paint with a broad brush.

This conversation needs to be directed at Hybrids not the Ships. Ships are used to cater to particaular tasks and situations further giving them dedicated roles.

Blasterboat bonus in particular, Buff the bonus, so you know the Mega bonus:


yeah where is there a damping bonus there? or maybe the Thorax?


im not talking about the Fing ewar ship bonus which is nice for what target practice? damping works in a fleet not in isolation 1:1 damping boat? yeah i will sacrifice my ability to hold you down or possibly catch up with you, or be cap stable-ish? Nice one, i was refering to a bonus on the ships themselves remove the MWD / dmg bonus and turn it into a damp bonus. Just an idea, nothing more than that and it still doesnt solve the PvE issues Hybrid boats have to deal with.

, i was refering to a bonus on the ships themselves remove the MWD / dmg bonus and turn it into a damp bonus. Just an idea, nothing more than that and it still doesnt solve the PvE issues Hybrid boats have to deal with.

I still think you just want to have the comfort of controlling range and whether you want to fight or not. It's understandable though. It is quite an advantage to have.

You cannot make Gallente faster than mimatar, Why? because then rail guns would be the new kite weapon of choice, Also Blasters would Alwasy be able to maintain range, making them OP as well. All this would do is shift the imbalance. This also ignores all caldari ships.... Lets not forget that. Adding extra stats to ships/new hybrid only modules again ignores Caldari and does not balance hybrids instead it just mask's the problem.

The only way to fix Hybrids is to FIX hybrids. Small changes to ships can happen but they cannot encroach on mimatar. Playing with stats and ammo is the only way. Stop dreaming of all Gallente getting damp bonuses, or a dash (thus making recons worthless fyi) Every ship needs a weakness and advantage you cannot paint with a broad brush.

This conversation needs to be directed at Hybrids not the Ships. Ships are used to cater to particaular tasks and situations further giving them dedicated roles.

Its terrible against missiles. You would have to orbit to keep you're speed up so you're not
taking full damage, seriously crippling you're tracking.

Ok, so let's turn this around. Make Gallente the fastest. Now, all it takes is to fit railguns instead of blasters, and you've just mirrored the same problem. Same imbalance, different outcome.

My point was that kiting is pointless unless you're able to do decent damage from that range. If some future well-balanced incarnation of a Hurricane wanted to kite me in a future well-balanced iteration of a Brutix, his ****-poor kiting dps wouldn't necessarily be enough to kill me before my Hammerhead IIs kill him. But the way things are now, I probably wouldn't stand a chance.

Balance doesn't mean making Gallente the new Minmatar. It means making each races' strengths meaningful, while toning down the excesses. The reason we benchmark everything against Minmatar at the moment is because they're so hideously overpowered, in every scenario. But Gallente ships' inferior mobility to Minmatar wouldn't be so much of an issue if only 25% of the roaming ships you come across in space were of Minmatar origin, instead of the 70 or 80% it is now. For that to happen, Minmatar need bringing back into line as much as Gallente need boosting.

I want balance, not for Gallente to become the new Winmatar. Can you tell the difference?

Just fyi: to mitigate against missiles it's better going in a straight line with an AB on.

A question:

The changes that was announced on the devblog: http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=3012 Are they still in effect, meaning, will they still be implemented alongside the changes that CCP Tallest mentions in teh first page of this thread?

Or, are the changes mentioned in the devblog scrapped?

I just had a crazy idea:

Unify blasters and hybrid turrets!

Consider this carefully. Unify the turrets. Create separate ammunition for hybrid turrets. Blaster ammunition, which is close range, and rail ammunition which is long range. Blaster ammo gives the turret a huge penalty to fall-off and optimal range, but increases tracking speed and has a high ammunition damage base. Rail ammunition provides a massive bonus to optimal range and fall-off but gives a major penalty to tracking speed and has lower damage numbers. When the ammunition type, (Meaning blaster and rail ammunition), changes the turret visibly changes shape as well, (To demonstrate the change in ability.)

The five second change to loading hybrid ammunition assists this idea. This way a Rokh battleship, (For example), can snipe at long range because if they warp to you at zero you change your ammunition to blaster ammunition and use that on them.

This solves all the issues. You can use your medium damage-per-second low tracking rail-gun ammo as you approach them. When you are in range you switch to blaster ammunition in your turrets and use that on them. If you want to do this you should carry twice the amount of ammo in your cargo hold so this presents a penalty as well.

What do you think about this presentation?

Lekgoa, i understand your concerns about the limited amount of ewar fitting, as my post suggested, this was about another approach to looking at the problem, An additional midslot on blaster-boats and the damp bonus would help dictate range.

My main point of my post though was that no matter what we do, for PvE, you know the making money part to do PVPing? Hybrids are firggen useless.

Bonused damps might work on blaster boats with an extra mid, but I still think that solution is too complicated. Some nice, simple buffs to T2 ammo and Gallente mobility (speed, agility, mwd bonuses, overload bonuses, take your pick) would go a long way towards making blaster boats viable.

As for PvE...dominix. I don't care if it looks like a potato. It kicks ass. And it has a chubby little man drawn on the bottom.

FYI, the vast majority of my SP is dedicated to Gallente ships and hybrids. I only ever fly any other race through gritted teeth. I have a vested interest in Gallente and hyrids being buffed, but I want there to be balance more than I want to fly a new FOTM.

A few things, I've actually thought of this and posted it in a different thread.

First it makes hybrids hands down the most flexible weapon in the game.
So you would have to go back to 10 sec (or longer) reloads.

You would probably want to revert the cap changes. Heck probably all the changes.

The problem is you would have "the" answer for any situation anytime.
But its an interesting idea still.

I posted my thoughts in response to the hybrid rebalance in a different thread, so please refer to that: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=290102#post290102

Some other things:
- The damage difference between the 2nd and 3rd tier railguns is too small. Give the 150, 250 and 425mm rails a bit more damage, to make them a worthy step up from the 120, 200 and 350mm calibres.

A few things about ammo:
- Null ammo needs +50% for both optimal and falloff. Barrage gives a 50% falloff bonus, and Scorch gives 50% extra to range. Blasters depend on both range and falloff, so Null ought to give a 50% bonus for both, to help truly address the range issues of blasters.
- Significantly increase base damage for Antimatter, Void and Javelin. This would make blasters truly melt face at close range. Railguns would be more viable for mid-range engagements, where their counterparts are actually pulse lasers and autocannons with long-range ammo.
- Simplify the ammo types. There's too much granularity of range at present. Instead, make hybrid ammo more like projectile ammo, so different ammo types have different balances of thermal and kinetic damage, such as 20/80, 50/50 and 80/20.

A few things, I've actually thought of this and posted it in a different thread.

First it makes hybrids hands down the most flexible weapon in the game.
So you would have to go back to 10 sec (or longer) reloads.

You would probably want to revert the cap changes. Heck probably all the changes.

The problem is you would have "the" answer for any situation anytime.
But its an interesting idea still.