Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 [30] .. 32 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
634
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 00:10:00 -
[871] - Quote
Richard Aiel wrote:Andski wrote:Tanya Powers wrote: The normal progression should always be, high sec, low sec, null sec.
It's not and never was, but keep thinking that. Hate to agree with a Goon but there IS NO progression in this game, and nor should there be IF the game is the sandbox ppl pretend it is.
To expand on that, my alliance recruits straight-up newbies on trial accounts from out-of-game communities like Something Awful, gets them out to nullsec, hands them skillbooks, implants, ISK and an endless amount of free frigates, and over time we turn them into jaded bittervets. This "linear progression" is nonsense - I've seen people with their original 2003 characters who still run missions in high-sec all day. |
Richard Hammond II
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
76
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 00:17:00 -
[872] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Gizznitt Malikite wrote:First off, my corp/alliance lives in null sec, and has for as long as I've played EvE. Additionally, we have a strict ROE that prohibits Hi-sec ganking, I will never understand why people join corps and alliances that tell tell them how to play the game.
So ppl DO mine in Goons?
They hired actual clothing designers for WiS clothes "no wonder the monocle cost $80, they had to pay royalties" Screw "FiS" its called EVE CCP |
K Suri
Red Gooey Bananas
24
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 00:36:00 -
[873] - Quote
Andski wrote:To expand on that, my alliance recruits straight-up newbies on trial accounts from out-of-game communities like Something Awful, gets them out to nullsec, hands them skillbooks, implants, ISK and an endless amount of free frigates, and over time we turn them into jaded bittervets. No recruting in GD Goon!!
Besides you don't want to help them. You want them to help you. It's a numbers game ain't it?
|
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
105
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 00:56:00 -
[874] - Quote
Is the ganking over yet? I want to undock this Wreathe full of PLEX over here in Jita 4-4.
|
Richard Hammond II
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
76
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 00:59:00 -
[875] - Quote
K Suri wrote:Andski wrote:To expand on that, my alliance recruits straight-up newbies on trial accounts from out-of-game communities like Something Awful, gets them out to nullsec, hands them skillbooks, implants, ISK and an endless amount of free frigates, and over time we turn them into jaded bittervets. No recruting in GD Goon!! Besides you don't want to help them. You want them to help you. It's a numbers game ain't it?
They dont recruit from EVE see They recruit only targets from EVE. If this wasnt just the oficial channels, theyd be in trouble but as it is lol
They hired actual clothing designers for WiS clothes "no wonder the monocle cost $80, they had to pay royalties" Screw "FiS" its called EVE CCP |
Michael Holmes Holmes
Starvin' Pilots Association The Serpents Eye Alliance
10
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 01:12:00 -
[876] - Quote
This is amazing, I can't believe this thread is still alive.
So I just spent the better part of the day mining in high-sec, I loaded up a Scythe with some mining lasers and standard missle launchers (for the rats) and went to town mining in 0-7 space. I was never ganked or harassed and I even was able to feel some teamwork as I helped some unarmed miners deal with rats that came into my weapon range.
I never left the keyboard for more than a few minutes or assumed safety (I had no tank so I could haul more).
Yet I feel that according to this thread, I am somehow the death of EVE online, I apparently play the game wrong.
Look, I know the Gankers and griefers (yes you grief, don't even lie about it!) don't like the double profit they have enjoyed for so long get nerfed but I think you need to take a lesson from your own book and deal with it, adapt or else you are no better than the "high-sec carebears" that you have nurtured such a raw hatred for.
I have said it in this thread before and I will say it again, When you commit a INGAME CRIME and then get blown up by the INGAME POLICE you probably will not get rewarded by your INGAME insurance company. This is not about comparing real life insurance to EVE, this is about a obvious flaw in the mechanics of the game that was fixed after being exploited for far to long, so long in fact that everyone seems to think that it was the original intent, the dev team has spoken about this on this very thread and left nothing to the imagination.
I know that all the gankers will hide continue to hide behind the "EVE is supposed to be harsh" statement we hear over and over again, but you have to admit, complaining about losing a pretty small payout from insurance when you know that you can get rewarded in many other ways (the goons will pay you, they pay just about anyone to gank.) so please stop saying that this makes things "unfair" because EVE is not about things being fair.
Do you think that the retriever pilot you just vaporized thinks your ganking is fair? Do you think that he does not often wonder why CCP does not bulk up the retriever so it can stand a chance to escape a well planned gank?
The real issue in this thread has gotten very murky but it seems that some players think that high sec should just be a buffet for suicide gankers, they think that no area of EVE should be safe because you "should know how to fit a ship" and if you don't you get ganked. I have never been ganked and I try to take steps to prevent one if I can but I know that I am still a new player and don't have many of the skills needed to fit T2 gear nor the knowledge I need to fit every ship in the game perfectly to only prevent ganking and nothing else.
That is what you want, right? for us to only fit ships so they can repel your attacks and anything else is just wrong and not only can invite a gank but MUST invite one?
I fit ships to serve the task but since I am a new player, does that mean that I MUST get ganked?
I don't get it, you whine and complain when you lose a insurance payout that was clearly and addressed by CCP as a flaw in the game and blame it on "carebear" outcry to the devs. All the while, most of the "carebears" in this thread have told you that ganking is part of the game and that they understand it, they are only concerned about the way this will affect new players who "don't get EVE" as well as you do.
in short, Gankers, you are not CCP devs and don't know the real intent of everything in the game so don't assume that removing payouts for ganking was just some effort to please the "carebears". also, you are not the fun police in the game, just because you think the party is in null and only in PvP.
I really do like shooting rocks with lasers and building things.
but again, I am the death of EVE because I am a "carebear". |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
848
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 01:17:00 -
[877] - Quote
Richard Hammond II wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Gizznitt Malikite wrote:First off, my corp/alliance lives in null sec, and has for as long as I've played EvE. Additionally, we have a strict ROE that prohibits Hi-sec ganking, I will never understand why people join corps and alliances that tell tell them how to play the game. So ppl DO mine in Goons? Not that I know of but there's no rule against it. That would be silly.
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
848
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 01:18:00 -
[878] - Quote
K Suri wrote:Andski wrote:To expand on that, my alliance recruits straight-up newbies on trial accounts from out-of-game communities like Something Awful, gets them out to nullsec, hands them skillbooks, implants, ISK and an endless amount of free frigates, and over time we turn them into jaded bittervets. No recruting in GD Goon!! Besides you don't want to help them. You want them to help you. It's a numbers game ain't it? Haha you have no idea how good we are to our newbees.
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Red Teufel
Eternity Inc
12
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 01:34:00 -
[879] - Quote
mmmm tears |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
45
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 01:53:00 -
[880] - Quote
Michael Holmes Holmes wrote:Bunch of tripe
Wow. Way to misconstrue absolutely everything that has been said in this thread by people whose opinion differs from yours. Tunnel vision is a heck of a thing, huh? |
|
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
851
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 01:56:00 -
[881] - Quote
Michael Holmes Holmes wrote:Look, I know the Gankers and griefers (yes you grief, don't even lie about it!) I don't know why I have to keep saying this but griefing is against the ToS and if you see somebody doing it in-game they should be reported.
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Michael Holmes Holmes
Starvin' Pilots Association The Serpents Eye Alliance
11
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:12:00 -
[882] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Michael Holmes Holmes wrote:Look, I know the Gankers and griefers (yes you grief, don't even lie about it!) I don't know why I have to keep saying this but griefing is against the ToS and if you see somebody doing it in-game they should be reported.
you may not grief but you cannot deny that some indeed do. I was not pointing fingers at you. |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
851
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:16:00 -
[883] - Quote
Michael Holmes Holmes wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Michael Holmes Holmes wrote:Look, I know the Gankers and griefers (yes you grief, don't even lie about it!) I don't know why I have to keep saying this but griefing is against the ToS and if you see somebody doing it in-game they should be reported. you may not grief but you cannot deny that some indeed do. I was not pointing fingers at you. But we're not talking about that in this thread since ganking is not griefing.
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
K Suri
Red Gooey Bananas
29
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:24:00 -
[884] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:K Suri wrote:Andski wrote:To expand on that, my alliance recruits straight-up newbies on trial accounts from out-of-game communities like Something Awful, gets them out to nullsec, hands them skillbooks, implants, ISK and an endless amount of free frigates, and over time we turn them into jaded bittervets. No recruting in GD Goon!! Besides you don't want to help them. You want them to help you. It's a numbers game ain't it? Haha you have no idea how good we are to our newbees. You sure? |
Michael Holmes Holmes
Starvin' Pilots Association The Serpents Eye Alliance
11
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 02:29:00 -
[885] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Michael Holmes Holmes wrote:Ladie Harlot wrote:Michael Holmes Holmes wrote:Look, I know the Gankers and griefers (yes you grief, don't even lie about it!) I don't know why I have to keep saying this but griefing is against the ToS and if you see somebody doing it in-game they should be reported. you may not grief but you cannot deny that some indeed do. I was not pointing fingers at you. But we're not talking about that in this thread since ganking is not griefing.
Okay, and nor was that the central part of my post.
I just wanted to illuminate the fact that while you and some others will say that griefing is against the TOS and therefore not a issue, the fact that it is said OVER AND OVER that EVE is a den for griefers and that is made worse when new players have a hard time figuring out what is griefing and what is "normal gameplay".
What I think is interesting is that while the Goonswarm takes it apon themselves to "Fix EVE" and to "educate" players as to the true intent of the game, they seem to never take a stand (with all your mighty power and a fleet of "honorable space pilots") to curb players from behavior that is clearly against the TOS.
and lets be honest, the line between griefing and ganking can get pretty shady with some players.
but again, that was not the main intent or point of the post and your fixation on the subject when it is brought up makes me wonder if you are as quick to enforce it ingame as you are in the forums.
|
March rabbit
Ganse Shadow of xXDEATHXx
34
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 09:03:00 -
[886] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote: On the flip side, the insurance changes move the costs of a hulk-ganking brutix roughly from 6-10m to 25-30m. The truth is, hulk pilots not only represent the more advance players that should NOT need to be coddled, but they ALREADY HAVE OPTIONS to avoid their losses. Unlike a procurer pilot that can't really tank their ship, a hulk pilot can easily fit a mod strip miner II hulk or an ice harvester II hulk with 29k EHP (and thats without faction mods, gang bonuses, implants, logistics help, etc). This is more than enough buffer to survive a single brutix attack.
problem is: goons don't need to have brain or understand insurance system. They are paid by their owners so they can use as many brutixes as they want to kill 1(!!!) hulk.
Gizznitt Malikite wrote: Essentially, this change is helping the wrong portion of miner society.
If you shitfit your ship for missions, it gets blown up. Contrarily, if you fit it appropriately, you'll be able to survive. If you shitfit your hulk while mining, let it get blown up too, and if the fit it appropriately, they don't have much to worry about!
you are wrong here. I used to use mixed-gun and mixed-tank fittings for quite some time to run missions before i got understanding about fitting ideology. And i never lost ship in missions that time.
and again: your opinions based on idea that suicide gankers do kill for profit. While they ALWAYS say: "we do it for lulz". So whole cry and whine about insurance is missed its point. Unless these crybabies can't afford lulz.... |
Delirious Grib
Solaroids Another Really Stupid Enterprise
3
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 09:34:00 -
[887] - Quote
Sounds like a good policy! |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
882
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 09:39:00 -
[888] - Quote
Michael Holmes Holmes wrote:What I think is interesting is that while the Goonswarm takes it apon themselves to "Fix EVE" and to "educate" players as to the true intent of the game, they seem to never take a stand (with all your mighty power and a fleet of "honorable space pilots") to curb players from behavior that is clearly against the TOS. This is absolutely not true. If players are breaking the ToS they should suffer the consequences.
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Mnengli Noiliffe
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
8
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 09:55:00 -
[889] - Quote
if they didn't do this, with the new BC suicide ganking would become almost free... I'm glad they still have some of the common sense left. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
1372
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 12:43:00 -
[890] - Quote
Jojo Jackson wrote:Which one except not to undock? Tank your ship. Warp out. Use scouts. Get friends. Use intel.
Quote:Where is the anti-tool which provides BALANCE? Passive targeters Gåö High agility, cloak Cargo Scanner Gåö Orca, Cloak Volley of Meal (soon BC3) Gåö tank (because, yes, pretty much all the miners and haulers can be made secure against a Mael volley) No.
Tanya Powers wrote:You have the same fake argument every single jerk has and this single one doesn't really makes you very popular by normal people. So you think you're a victim from some kind of injustice...
This single argument right mere makes me puke irl... Good news: EVE is not real life.
The simple (virtual) reality of EVE is that you are not safe. By very design of the game, and by necessity of the way the world dynamics are set up, you are never safe. If you want to be safe, you have to either not log in or create your own safety. If you choose not to do either of those, then it is a failure on your part that has created the unsafe situation that the other party can exploit to their benefit.
When I say that victims should stop being such victims, this is exactly what I mean: they need to realise that there are indeed things they can do to drastically reduce the chances of something bad happening to them, rather than to give up, throw up their arms, and proclaim that GÇ£onoz, I was a hapless victim!GÇ¥. They were in fact highly complicit in creating the situation that led to their undoing, and there are indeed things they can do to avoid doing that. GÇöGÇöGÇö GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ GÇö Karath Piki-á |
|
Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
74
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 13:51:00 -
[891] - Quote
Scrapyard Bob wrote:Cearain wrote: Anybody know why they did this? It seems everytime someone suggested this on the forums they received an overwhelmingly negative response.
The removal of insurance for ships lost to CONCORD? The simplest explanation lies at the feet of those new glass cannon, tier 3, battlecruisers that are being introduced. Which will be able to alpha like a battleship, while costing a good bit less. It probably would have resulted in freighters getting ganked for carrying as little as 500-700M ISK worth of goods (instead of the customary 1B ISK number). Remove of insurance paid out to CONCORD losses restores that balance (mostly... everyone will have to run math once the stats get finalized).
The new BCs are new ship hulls that should be fully insured just like the battleship hull. There may be some minor decrease in the cost of the platinum insurance but not much. You would still need to buy the large guns and any mods you put on the ship.
Now how much will one of those haulers have to be carrying before they risk getting blown up? 3 billion? How much more boring can high sec transport get??
BTW I have never suicide ganked anyone I do move stuff in high sec for trade though. It seems to me that all the thought I put into how I will tank my ships and move stuff through high sec was wasted time because suicide ganking just got effectively eliminated.
Edit all the markets will be completely homogenous now because there will no longer any risk in transporting through high sec. Now people who don't think when they transport will do just as well as those who do. I hope CCP reconsiders dumbing this game down even further. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
|
Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
74
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 14:06:00 -
[892] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote: Changes that make hi-sec safer without decreasing its rewards undermine the risk-vs-reward dichotomy of EvE. ...
It does undermine the rewards of traders/haulers in high sec. Now suicide ganking will be so rare that the complete idiots will be able to do just as well at it as people who used to consider the possibility of a suicide gank. Its not like it took allot of thought to tank a transport ship but now even that tiny bit of thought is no longer required.
Now all the markets will be even more homogenous and it will be even harder to find a decent way to make money hauling stuff.
So the only people who get a buff here are the dumb who don't know any better than always putting cargo expanders on and never think to put any tank on their ship or make a couple of trips. Every time you give a buff to the dumb you make the game less interesting for those who like to some complexity and challenge. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
|
Lexmana
Imperial Stout
52
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 14:11:00 -
[893] - Quote
Cearain wrote: The new BCs are new ship hulls that should be fully insured just like the battleship hull. There may be some minor decrease in the cost of the platinum insurance but not much. You would still need to buy the large guns and any mods you put on the ship.
/../ suicide ganking just got effectively eliminated..
If you are going to suicide your BC you don't insure it and it will prob only be marginally more expensive to replace an uninsured BC than a BS with insurance. No big change.
|
Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
74
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 14:16:00 -
[894] - Quote
[quote=Michael Holmes Holmes]... I have said it in this thread before and I will say it again, When you commit a INGAME CRIME and then get blown up by the INGAME POLICE you probably will not get rewarded by your INGAME insurance company. This is not about comparing real life insurance to EVE, this is about a obvious flaw in the mechanics of the game that was fixed after being exploited for far to long, so long in fact that everyone seems to think that it was the original intent, the dev team has spoken about this on this very thread and left nothing to the imagination. [quote]
What are you talking about the insurance says you will get repaid if your ship is destroyed for any reason. There is no exploit. This is the mechanics working as intended. It is intended that stupidity in eve has a price. If you do nothing but put cargo expanders on your hauler and fill it with very valuable things expect to pay a price.
You are right to avoid the comparision to real life because no real life insurance company would ever exist in a form anything close to the one that exists in the eve universe. Its an isk faucet and it will continue to be an isk faucet after this change. No real business works that way.
Go ahead into state farm and tell them you are going to equip your car with rocket launchers and go driving around with other people who you are at war with and have their cars similarly equipped. See if they will give you insurance. Is that exploit too? Should people who are in war decs not get insurance? Should people who go gcc and lose their ship not get insurance?
Because there is no real life comparision to insurance, people who want these different things are just giving their own opinions. The only right answer is the answer that makes the game more fun. If you think the game is more fun when dumb people do just as well as those who think a bit then you will like this change.
Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
|
Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
74
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 14:24:00 -
[895] - Quote
Lexmana wrote:Cearain wrote: The new BCs are new ship hulls that should be fully insured just like the battleship hull. There may be some minor decrease in the cost of the platinum insurance but not much. You would still need to buy the large guns and any mods you put on the ship.
/../ suicide ganking just got effectively eliminated.. If you are going to suicide your BC you don't insure it and it will prob only be marginally more expensive to replace an uninsured BC than a BS with insurance. No big change.
I think you may be assuming a tier 3 bc will cost the same as a tier 2 bc. I imagine the price difference will be similar to the price difference between tier 1 bcs and tier 2 bcs.
When you look at the total cost for the 10-15 or so it would take to blow up a freighter it is a substantial nerf to something that needed a buff not a nerf.
If suicide ganking was so profitable more people would be doing it. As it is its pretty much only those who want to grief - because the potential for profit is much less than other methods in game. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
|
MatrixSkye Mk2
Republic University Minmatar Republic
55
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 14:24:00 -
[896] - Quote
Cearain wrote:Gizznitt Malikite wrote: Changes that make hi-sec safer without decreasing its rewards undermine the risk-vs-reward dichotomy of EvE. ...
It does undermine the rewards of traders/haulers in high sec. Now suicide ganking will be so rare that the complete idiots will be able to do just as well at it as people who used to consider the possibility of a suicide gank. Its not like it took allot of thought to tank a transport ship but now even that tiny bit of thought is no longer required. Now all the markets will be even more homogenous and it will be even harder to find a decent way to make money hauling stuff. So the only people who get a buff here are the dumb who don't know any better than always putting cargo expanders on and never think to put any tank on their ship or make a couple of trips. Every time you give a buff to the dumb you make the game less interesting for those who like to some complexity and challenge. Dude, seriously:
THIS CHANGE WILL NOT STOP OR IN ANY SIGNIFICANT WAY REDUCE SUICIDE GANKS.
There really is no need for this drama.
In your example above, this insurance change is a NON-ISSUE for suicide-ganks-for-profit. So you should still be able to haul stuff for decent isk. |
Ned Black
Driders
1
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 14:26:00 -
[897] - Quote
Good change... now change it so that you dont get any insurance if you self destruct either... |
Jack Dant
The Gentlemen of Low Moral Fibre
111
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 14:37:00 -
[898] - Quote
Cearain wrote:I think you may be assuming a tier 3 bc will cost the same as a tier 2 bc. I imagine the price difference will be similar to the price difference between tier 1 bcs and tier 2 bcs. A Tornado will cost a bit over 40 mil according to the Sisi bpos. A tempest/apoc costs around 35 mil after insurance. Not really a significant increase, and the volley/dps will be the same.
Quote:If suicide ganking was so profitable more people would be doing it. As it is its pretty much only those who want to grief - because the potential for profit is much less than other methods in game. In my experience, suicide ganking haulers is boring. Profit potential is huge, but in practice, you end up scanning ships for two hours before you find a reasonable target. And then the loot fairies do their thing and only 10% of the isk value drops |
Stitcher
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
71
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 15:02:00 -
[899] - Quote
So, let me get this straight.
Because the effective cost of a suicide gank has increased from about 30M per suicide ship to more like 90M per suicide ship, suddenly EVE is happy fluffy bunny sunshine land and the whining carebears have won?
Looks like suicide ganking will still be viable, you just need to hit more juicy targets in order for it to be profitable. Sounds fair to me. An in-character blog and a video: http://verinsjournal.blogspot.com http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tu1mbsgo738
|
Eternus8lux8lucis
Whack-A-Mole
4
|
Posted - 2011.11.10 15:09:00 -
[900] - Quote
Stitcher wrote:So, let me get this straight.
Because the effective cost of a suicide gank has increased from about 30M per suicide ship to more like 90M per suicide ship, suddenly EVE is happy fluffy bunny sunshine land and the whining carebears have won?
Looks like suicide ganking will still be viable, you just need to hit more juicy targets in order for it to be profitable. Sounds fair to me.
No not really to 90mil, it will if you continue to use a BS when you can just use the new Tier 3 BC instead which will decrease the costs to about 40-50mil a pop including fittings. |
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 [30] .. 32 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |