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Add signature radius to the overview

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Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 288	Posted - 2014.08.29 20:07:00 - [1] - Quote Currently we can view velocity on our overview. Velocity is affected by someoneGÇÖs fit and any webs applied to the target. So why isnGÇÖt signature radius a column option on the overview as well? Signature radius provides as much intel as velocity does on the overview, it would help fleet work by allowing you to see when a fleet mate is target painting something, and it would give people a visual change when they use target painters, just like their webs. Signature radius provides as much intelligence on someoneGÇÖs fit as does their velocity. From their velocity you can determine if they have armor rigs on, have a prop mod turned on, and when that prop mod is turned on, it allows you to see if they have plates on. This level of detail cannot be achieved against a shield tanked ship just from the overview. Velocity also allows you to see if they are receiving skirmish boosts, which would also be seen from the signature radius. This would help improve small gang warfare because it allows you to see when your fleet member has applied a target painter to the target, just like how velocity allows you to see when a fleet member has applied a web to the target. From a logistics point of view, it would allow you to see who is being primaried by target painters, much like you can view when someone is being primaried by webs. It would also help FCs direct their target painters when someone is painting the wrong target. It would also give a visual queue (Not just the in game graphic) for when a target painter is applied to the target. A lot of focus gets placed on webs, partially because you can physically see the ship slow down on your overview, which directly reduces their transversal velocity. By adding signature radius to the overview, it gives the players a visual indication that their module is aiding on the other side of the tracking equation. Overall the overview gives the player a lot of intelligence on how a fight is developing and gives a lot of intelligence to both sides. However the over view has an intelligence hole for signature radius which should be addressed by adding it as a column option. Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
Kell Braugh Caldari Provisions Caldari State 3	Posted - 2014.08.29 20:17:00 - [2] - Quote Size == signature radius Will need to test to see if it changes when target painted, but it is there as a column. TMYK
Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 288	Posted - 2014.08.29 20:17:00 - [3] - Quote Kell Braugh wrote: Size == signature radius Will need to test to see if it changes when target painted, but it is there as a column. TMYK Size is not the signature radius, it's the size of the model that is used in relation to bumping. Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
James Baboli Ferrous Infernum 82	Posted - 2014.08.29 20:22:00 - [4] - Quote This idea makes far too much sense to be implemented, and give way too much away about why some PVE things happen for it not to be a good idea. It also means you can figure out who in your fleet showed up in the wrong clone, etc. That crazy bag FC with the silly things on the hull that shouldn't but just did.
Kell Braugh Caldari Provisions Caldari State 3	Posted - 2014.08.29 20:26:00 - [5] - Quote Sorry, meant to write size ~= sig res, true they aren't the same, but, in practice, larger size usually denotes larger sig. Wasn't saying it was THE solution, but it is there.
Alvatore DiMarco Capricious Endeavours Ltd 2507	Posted - 2014.08.29 20:32:00 - [6] - Quote So you want to add even more information to the overview? Isn't there already a metric ton to read as it is?
Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 289	Posted - 2014.08.29 20:33:00 - [7] - Quote Kell Braugh wrote: Sorry, meant to write size ~= sig res, true they aren't the same, but, in practice, larger size usually denotes larger sig. Wasn't saying it was THE solution, but it is there. I just had a friend undock in his cynabal. Size 300+, actual sig radius was 130ish. Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
Lady Rift What Shall We Call It 65	Posted - 2014.08.29 21:55:00 - [8] - Quote Alvatore DiMarco wrote: So you want to add even more information to the overview? Isn't there already a metric ton to read as it is? You don't need to show all the things you can just choice to show what is useful information to you. I would prefer this over many of the column options we currently have.
Antillie Sa'Kan Forging Industries Silent Infinity 638	Posted - 2014.08.29 23:22:00 - [9] - Quote I guess we should show people's resist profiles on the overview as well then?
Zan Shiro Alternative Enterprises 477	Posted - 2014.08.30 00:48:00 - [10] - Quote Alvatore DiMarco wrote: So you want to add even more information to the overview? Isn't there already a metric ton to read as it is? information not really needed to boot either. We can assume whatever a say drake is shooting they are painting. A rapier in fleet...if FC the micromanaging type well he is telling the rapier exactly what to paint. Listen/read in comms and well there ya go....you know what the rapier is painting. If FC not a control freak I know in my rapiers I tell in comes what I am painting it its not obvious (i.e.. some single poor ******* in the bubble we were camping lol). Todd in the APOC has my paint.... what I would say in comms as an example. if fleet mates somehow get confused by this and shoot Yamashiro in the scorpion instead thats a my fleet mates are tards issue not the game missing a feature. CCP can't fix stupid. It should't in fact try. My above example: Todd...1 syllable, begins with a T. Yamashiro....4 syllables, begins with a Y, If my fellow fleet peeps are morons who mix this up...we deserve to lose if they shoot the wrong target.

Sobaan Tali Caldari Quick Reaction Force 350	Posted - 2014.08.30 05:59:00 - [11] - Quote Size is the approximate physical size of said ship or object, not electronic size. I'm not even sure it changes for T3s when they use differing subs (i.e., most subs change the size of the ship by a lot). I almost feel like the ship icon kind of renders the size column a little redundant. Rather than simply add sig size to overview which, as others have pointed out is already cluttered with selectable data, I'd suggest that the current size column be changed to indicate at least an estimated signature size, possibly allowing it to adjust to reflect TP/Microwarp/Microjump etc. effects. Of course, that last part can be ignored if having a constantly changing sig size column would strain the overview or add too much server load. Then again how much could it really add since numerous other columns already constantly change such as range, velocity, and angular?
Joraa Starkmanir Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 27	Posted - 2014.08.30 07:31:00 - [12] - Quote Since you people think signature radius is not needed and we have to many options for overview, care to take out transversal speed or speed? Didnt think so, so why cant missile users have signature radius there?
James Baboli Ferrous Infernum 82	Posted - 2014.08.30 08:08:00 - [13] - Quote Couple things I want to say in support: Sig radius is a stat that makes tons of sense to put on the overview as well, as how big the signature is should be pretty obvious if you are close enough to see it. Directly effects the damage of missiles, and indirectly of guns It is the (%wise) most variable stat on ships after speed. It strongly effects what you shoot in several situations in PVP (damp + ECM combos, where they break some locks and then damp your scan res) Seriously, it is the size of the signature to your sensors, why isn't it an option to view? Also, l2p transversal-fans. Angular velocity is the stat that actually matters. That crazy bag FC with the silly things on the hull that shouldn't but just did.
Quesa D00M. Northern Coalition. 28	Posted - 2014.08.30 11:28:00 - [14] - Quote My fear for this is that it would be an overburden on the servers because this is the type of thing that is not only affected by what the pilot does with his ship but what others do to it as well. So not only is this calculating the sig radius by the ship, active modules, fleet bonuses and pilot skill set but it would also have to consider hostile painters. The type of information just requires too much overhead to be put on the overview with no foreseeable equal gain. Things like traversal require few bits of information and are not modified by skills, bonuses, active modules an active EWAR each time it needs to update the overview.
Joraa Starkmanir Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 27	Posted - 2014.08.30 16:33:00 - [15] - Quote Quesa wrote: My fear for this is that it would be an overburden on the servers because this is the type of thing that is not only affected by what the pilot does with his ship but what others do to it as well. So not only is this calculating the sig radius by the ship, active modules, fleet bonuses and pilot skill set but it would also have to consider hostile painters. The type of information just requires too much overhead to be put on the overview with no foreseeable equal gain. Things like traversal require few bits of information and are not modified by skills, bonuses, active modules an active EWAR each time it needs to update the overview. Signature radius is calculated for each ship already, most likely for each hit/dmg calculation and for targeting. Transversal is more calculations as you need speed thats modified by skill, bonuses, modules (active and passive), EWAR (web anyone?) and direction. Basicly signature radius is no harder to calculate than whats already there, so the only rteason to not add is is that its not there already...
Frostys Virpio The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc 1230	Posted - 2014.08.30 16:38:00 - [16] - Quote Quesa wrote: My fear for this is that it would be an overburden on the servers because this is the type of thing that is not only affected by what the pilot does with his ship but what others do to it as well. So not only is this calculating the sig radius by the ship, active modules, fleet bonuses and pilot skill set but it would also have to consider hostile painters. The type of information just requires too much overhead to be put on the overview with no foreseeable equal gain. Things like traversal require few bits of information and are not modified by skills, bonuses, active modules an active EWAR each time it needs to update the overview. The server already has the info since the sig size determine how long it takes to get a lock...
Ghaustyl Kathix Rising Thunder 25	Posted - 2014.08.30 19:06:00 - [17] - Quote +1'd. Makes a lot of sense. You can get a lot of information about an armor-tank's fit from the overview, but you can't do the same from a shield-tank. Not to mention how useful it would be to missile boats, while turret boats already have transversal/angular velocity on overview. Quesa wrote: My fear for this is that it would be an overburden on the servers because this is the type of thing that is not only affected by what the pilot does with his ship but what others do to it as well. So not only is this calculating the sig radius by the ship, active modules, fleet bonuses and pilot skill set but it would also have to consider hostile painters. Just like ship, active (and passive!) modules, fleet bonuses, pilot skill set, prop mod and hostile stasis webs all affect the speed stat that displays on the overview.
Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 293	Posted - 2014.09.07 17:10:00 - [18] - Quote Frostys Virpio wrote: Quesa wrote: My fear for this is that it would be an overburden on the servers because this is the type of thing that is not only affected by what the pilot does with his ship but what others do to it as well. So not only is this calculating the sig radius by the ship, active modules, fleet bonuses and pilot skill set but it would also have to consider hostile painters. The type of information just requires too much overhead to be put on the overview with no foreseeable equal gain. Things like traversal require few bits of information and are not modified by skills, bonuses, active modules an active EWAR each time it needs to update the overview. The server already has the info since the sig size determine how long it takes to get a lock... Yup, so the only increase in load would be to push the information the server already has, to the clients. Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
Alvatore DiMarco Capricious Endeavours Ltd 2561	Posted - 2014.09.07 23:19:00 - [19] - Quote You're forgetting the increase in load on the pilot, reading this stuff on top of everything else they already have to read in the course of a fight, nevermind that between someone's ship type (frigate, battleship, cruiser, etc.) and velocity you should be able to reasonably approximate their sig radius. Information overload is a thing, data takes time to read and process and there's not as much time as one would like except during TiDi.
Ines Tegator Towels R Us 500	Posted - 2014.09.08 00:44:00 - [20] - Quote Alvatore DiMarco wrote: So you want to add even more information to the overview? Isn't there already a metric ton to read as it is? It's another optional column. Use it or don't, nobody will care except you, which is as it should be since it's on (or not on) your UI. If it's not there though, we can't make that choice now can we? - Mission Overhaul - Bridging the PVP / PVE Gap - -áIf the game stops teaching people to fear lowsec, maybe people will start going there?

Tabyll Altol Breaking.Bad Circle-Of-Two 17	Posted - 2014.09.08 05:21:00 - [21] - Quote +1
Tabyll Altol Breaking.Bad Circle-Of-Two 35	Posted - 2014.09.08 05:21:35 - [22] - Quote +1
Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 297	Posted - 2014.09.13 05:56:00 - [23] - Quote Alvatore DiMarco wrote: You're forgetting the increase in load on the pilot, reading this stuff on top of everything else they already have to read in the course of a fight, nevermind that between someone's ship type (frigate, battleship, cruiser, etc.) and velocity you should be able to reasonably approximate their sig radius. Information overload is a thing, data takes time to read and process and there's not as much time as one would like except during TiDi. You are correct, information overload is a thing. That being said, you have the option to filter out any information that is important at the time and what is not. You can do this by not selecting it as a column on your personal overview, or you can do it by not visually checking it as often as you check other things like range and transversal velocity (If you use turrets). Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 342	Posted - 2014.09.13 05:56:38 - [24] - Quote Alvatore DiMarco wrote: You're forgetting the increase in load on the pilot, reading this stuff on top of everything else they already have to read in the course of a fight, nevermind that between someone's ship type (frigate, battleship, cruiser, etc.) and velocity you should be able to reasonably approximate their sig radius. Information overload is a thing, data takes time to read and process and there's not as much time as one would like except during TiDi. You are correct, information overload is a thing. That being said, you have the option to filter out any information that is important at the time and what is not. You can do this by not selecting it as a column on your personal overview, or you can do it by not visually checking it as often as you check other things like range and transversal velocity (If you use turrets). Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
James Baboli Ferrous Infernum 94	Posted - 2014.09.13 06:56:00 - [25] - Quote Also information overload is also something that should be a tactic. A little bit of info overload, applied to the right player, turns an easy fight into a fair fight and a fair fight into a whelp. Your own information processing ability should be part of being "elite" rather than just the number of SP you have. That crazy bag FC with the silly things on the hull that shouldn't but just did.
James Baboli Ferrous Infernum 190	Posted - 2014.09.13 06:56:05 - [26] - Quote Also information overload is also something that should be a tactic. A little bit of info overload, applied to the right player, turns an easy fight into a fair fight and a fair fight into a whelp. Your own information processing ability should be part of being "elite" rather than just the number of SP you have. Yes, I do incursions. Find out more here Tech 3 battleships. Moar battleships
Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 311	Posted - 2014.09.30 03:16:00 - [27] - Quote Bump Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 342	Posted - 2014.09.30 03:16:04 - [28] - Quote Bump Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
Austrene Kanenald Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective 1	Posted - 2014.09.30 09:21:00 - [29] - Quote +1
Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 342	Posted - 2014.10.30 17:29:16 - [30] - Quote Bump Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.

Gaan Cathal Angry Mustellid The Periphery 20	Posted - 2014.10.30 18:08:42 - [31] - Quote James Baboli wrote: Couple things I want to say in support: Sig radius is a stat that makes tons of sense to put on the overview as well, as how big the signature is should be pretty obvious if you are close enough to see it. Directly effects the damage of missiles, and indirectly of guns It is the (%wise) most variable stat on ships after speed. It strongly effects what you shoot in several situations in PVP (damp + ECM combos, where they break some locks and then damp your scan res) Seriously, it is the size of the signature to your sensors, why isn't it an option to view? Also, l2p transversal-fans. Angular velocity is the stat that actually matters. This, right here. Also for those against...it's an optional goddamn column. What's so supa-sekrit about your sig-rad that you need to keep it hidden from other people?
Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 358	Posted - 2014.11.26 18:09:43 - [32] - Quote Bump Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
FT Diomedes The Graduates Forged of Fire 643	Posted - 2014.11.26 18:21:16 - [33] - Quote Good idea. I think it could also be nice to see what friendly effects are being applied to your locked targets. For example, if I lock six targets, it might be nice to see which one of them my fleet members already have target painted or disrupted. Yes, I know this is currently usually handled through out of game comms right now, but improving the in game tools should never stop. This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
Ix Method Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 338	Posted - 2014.11.26 19:22:34 - [34] - Quote Antillie Sa'Kan wrote: I guess we should show people's resist profiles on the overview as well then? Quite so. Isn't this really quite important information to be just giving away? Travelling at the speed of love.
FT Diomedes The Graduates Forged of Fire 643	Posted - 2014.11.26 19:28:41 - [35] - Quote Ix Method wrote: Antillie Sa'Kan wrote: I guess we should show people's resist profiles on the overview as well then? Quite so. Isn't this really quite important information to be just giving away? Your ship sensors already know the target's signature radius, just as they already know how fast it is moving. Of course they could not get resistance profile without using a ship scanner. This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
James Baboli Ferrous Infernum 298	Posted - 2014.11.26 19:50:50 - [36] - Quote Ix Method wrote: Antillie Sa'Kan wrote: I guess we should show people's resist profiles on the overview as well then? Quite so. Isn't this really quite important information to be just giving away? Signature radius? not really, and it just makes sense that you can see how big the signature is when it determines how long it takes to lock and IS THE SIZE OF THE THING TO YOUR SENSORS. Making battleships worth the warp Tech 3 battleships. Moar battleships
Ix Method Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 339	Posted - 2014.11.26 20:03:33 - [37] - Quote Well yeah but if we can step out of RP land for a moment isn't some of the viability of certain ships their versatility? Judging by speed is a best guess cause there's so many ways it can vary. 9/10 sig radius instantly lets you know Armor/Shield/Active Shield, kicking some ships hard in return for what, not accidentally loading the wrong ammo sometimes? Not sure the upside is worth losing those WTF moments tbh. Saying 'yeah but my ship is clever and knows' isn't a justification for changing anything in the game. Travelling at the speed of love.
Foxicity Red Federation RvB - RED Federation 19	Posted - 2014.11.26 20:31:04 - [38] - Quote This is a generally good idea, but I see one serious problem. There are, in essence, so few variables that affect signature radius that you could easily and immediately identify that a pilot is flying with either Skirmish boosts or Halo implants. This does not apply so easily to any other stat. There is a fudge factor in observing someone's speed, armor and shields for instance (mods, overheats, skills, implants, boosts) that keeps you from so easily identifying, for example, a Snaked or Slaved pilot. In other words, this would allow you to identify a Halo pilot very easily. From there, just... instalock and blap the pod. Guaranteed 1b kill.
Aran Hotchkiss Phoibe Enterprises 13	Posted - 2014.11.27 00:08:29 - [39] - Quote I like this idea, granted the point's been made about so few things affect your signature radius, but personally I like this because while it can be fairly evident the penalties armour tanking will do to your boat, moving and turning slower, it's a bit more difficult when shield tanking because you know "this will make me get hit harder" but... you can't really tell how much by. I feel those in the-know are aware of the subtle/not-so-subtle impact a reduced sig radius makes, and this can give them an advantage over those who're unaware. I feel adding this option would make have the effect of getting a much greater number of people familiar with sig radii beyond 'you look bigger to their guns' - me included. Maybe for some people that's a bad thing - I guess one question asked is "Is this a good/nice/whatever idea that should be implemented, or is it simply dumbing the game down for those who can't/won't read between the lines?" Anyway , +1 'specially so cause I use missiles and sig radius is..... quite relevant. Quote: n other words, this would allow you to identify a Halo pilot very easily. From there, just... instalock and blap the pod. Guaranteed 1b kill. I'd expect a halo pilot would have a better chance than most to get his pod out when his ship's going down. That and if he didn't want to lose his pod, don't fly it in the first place.
Nevyn Auscent Broke Sauce 1714	Posted - 2014.11.27 00:25:38 - [40] - Quote Ix Method wrote: Well yeah but if we can step out of RP land for a moment isn't some of the viability of certain ships their versatility? Judging by speed is a best guess cause there's so many ways it can vary. 9/10 sig radius would instantly let you know Armor/Shield/Active Shield, kicking some ships hard. Not sure the upside is worth losing those WTF moments tbh. And saying [yeah but my ship is clever and knows] isn't a justification for changing the game. Sig radius as mentioned is a thing your sensors already know and are affected by. It affects how long you take to lock a ship. And how much damage your missiles do. If angular velocity is visible which affects how much damage your guns do, Sig radius is the comparable stat for missiles. Resist profile is not something that directly affects you however, though resist profile should appear on ship scanners really. To make them actually more useful than a ganking tool. But as it does not have a direct effect on you, only an indirect effect it should not appear on the overview. This will also make it more obvious how many 'solo' PvPers are lying through their teeth and using boosting alts, which is a good thing. And to tell the difference between shield & armour fits will still require a lot of pilot knowledge, how do you tell between an armour fit and a shield fit with sig radius links after all. Since shield fits aren't all identical in how much sig bloom there is due to different rigs and fittings. So it doesn't remove player skill.

Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 398	Posted - 2015.01.22 18:45:31 - [41] - Quote Foxicity wrote: There is a fudge factor in observing someone's speed, armor and shields for instance (mods, overheats, skills, implants, boosts) that keeps you from so easily identifying, for example, a Snaked or Slaved pilot. On shield tanked and rigged ships, there is still some fudge factor there due to not knowing exactly what skill his shield rigging skill is, along with knowing what shield extender he has on. Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
Arla Sarain 249	Posted - 2015.01.22 18:58:44 - [42] - Quote When there was a thread about putting turret hit chance on the overview a lot of the replies were tears that it will allow people to directly reverse calculate (midst fight, yeah? people still cried) the sig radius and hence determine the the targets fit. That's from something as ambiguous as hit chance which depends on 2 other variables. Now there are people vouching for this which gives sig radius directly. #EVEplayerbase is toplel. I'm not against it. But won't support either. Sig radius whilst changing from ship to ship, for a particular ship doesn't change often, because there is only MWD and TPs that change it real time. All other changes occur when implants,boosters, links and titans are added. The frequency of change for these is less common. As this number stays the same for the majority of time, it WILL directly inform the opponent of the fit. A 30m sig radius slasher or a 40m sig radius slasher is the difference between active or passive fit.
Alexis Nightwish 86	Posted - 2015.01.22 21:20:22 - [43] - Quote +1 CCP only approaches a problem in one of two ways: nudge or cludge
Anhenka The Cult of Personality DARKNESS. 923	Posted - 2015.01.22 21:28:20 - [44] - Quote I see absolutely no reason whatsoever you should have access to this information that would allow you to tell with ease which type of tanking ships that can use either type is using, or if shield only ships are using an active or passive tank. I shouldn't be able to glance at my overview and go "Yup, look at that sig radius, it's definitely a shield gank thorax, not an armor heavy tackle" You do realize that shield extender and shield rigs increase sig radius right? -1
Ix Method Shadows Legion High-Sec Tomfoolery 386	Posted - 2015.01.22 21:47:11 - [45] - Quote Nevyn Auscent wrote: This will also make it more obvious how many 'solo' PvPers are lying through their teeth and using boosting alts, which is a good thing. The fact a stupid idea negates a broken system doesn't make it any less stupid. It just means off-grid links need to die. Travelling at the speed of love.
Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 399	Posted - 2015.01.22 22:05:46 - [46] - Quote Anhenka wrote: You do realize that shield extender and shield rigs increase sig radius right? And halos and skirmish boosts reduce signature radius. At which point you ask yourself, does he have skirmish boosts and halos along with being shield tanked? Or is he armor tanked? Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie Quantum Distributions 1373	Posted - 2015.01.22 22:29:28 - [47] - Quote Hopelesshobo wrote: Frostys Virpio wrote: Quesa wrote: My fear for this is that it would be an overburden on the servers because this is the type of thing that is not only affected by what the pilot does with his ship but what others do to it as well. So not only is this calculating the sig radius by the ship, active modules, fleet bonuses and pilot skill set but it would also have to consider hostile painters. The type of information just requires too much overhead to be put on the overview with no foreseeable equal gain. Things like traversal require few bits of information and are not modified by skills, bonuses, active modules an active EWAR each time it needs to update the overview. The server already has the info since the sig size determine how long it takes to get a lock... Yup, so the only increase in load would be to push the information the server already has, to the clients. Pushing this would scale at O(n^2) though. I know plenty of things in eve do, but I'd rather see better server stability than additional (admittedly useful) information on the overview. New player resources: Uni Wiki - General Info Eve Altruist - PvP Belligerent Undesirables - High Sec Pvp
Harry Saq Blueprint Haus Get Off My Lawn 12	Posted - 2015.01.22 22:44:53 - [48] - Quote Sure why not add it....though my overview is already crowded to the point of silly anyway...but it is logical that I would be able to see/detect it...
Ab'del Abu Atlantis Ascendant 205	Posted - 2015.01.22 23:34:02 - [49] - Quote I always wanted this. However, there is one thing why it might be a bad idea: it gives away some very valuable information about ship fitting (i.e. shield vs armor tank), if someone is running an mwd at decreased speed in order to pose as an AB user etc.
Lugh Crow-Slave 549	Posted - 2015.01.23 03:22:17 - [50] - Quote Anhenka wrote: I see absolutely no reason whatsoever you should have access to this information that would allow you to tell with ease which type of tanking ships that can use either type is using, or if shield only ships are using an active or passive tank. I shouldn't be able to glance at my overview and go "Yup, look at that sig radius, it's definitely a shield gank thorax, not an armor heavy tackle" You do realize that shield extender and shield rigs increase sig radius right? -1 but i should be able to tell at a glance if you are mwd or ab fit? or if you are using oversize armor or prop mods? Fuel block colors

Mario Putzo Welping and Dunking. 1114	Posted - 2015.01.23 04:07:11 - [51] - Quote Hesitant to agree. Since Bombs don't work like traditional "explosive" projectiles (missiles) having this information available would simply give a huge advantage to bombers. However if CCP were to change bombs so speed and explosion velocity were calculated as well in a similar way as missiles (lowest value first), then I think this would be a good adjustment. As it stands today all this does is paints a nice rosy picture for bombers as soon as they land on grid, and since shield ships will always have a higher sig than armor ships (assuming both run MWD or don't run MWD), this would effectively kill shield doctrines, which are already limping along, outside of fringe cases like the Ishtar (which is for reasons irrelevant to shields actually being good). No +1 from me until CCP changes how bomb damage is calculated.
afkalt Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 700	Posted - 2015.01.23 06:59:24 - [52] - Quote Lugh Crow-Slave wrote: Anhenka wrote: I see absolutely no reason whatsoever you should have access to this information that would allow you to tell with ease which type of tanking ships that can use either type is using, or if shield only ships are using an active or passive tank. I shouldn't be able to glance at my overview and go "Yup, look at that sig radius, it's definitely a shield gank thorax, not an armor heavy tackle" You do realize that shield extender and shield rigs increase sig radius right? -1 but i should be able to tell at a glance if you are mwd or ab fit? or if you are using oversize armor or prop mods? I can get all that info by pressing 'look at'.....
HiddenPorpoise Under Dark Sins of our Fathers 315	Posted - 2015.01.23 07:03:57 - [53] - Quote Lugh Crow-Slave wrote: but i should be able to tell at a glance if you are mwd or ab fit? The game shows you what they are using if you zoom in, I just checked with a duel prop. It'll also tell you if they are using active hardeners; which is to say, unless crazy mindgames are coming into play, there's a good shot you know at a glance. The only thing you'd glean from this are drugs, implants, and boosters. And even then the barrier to exact numbers before was that math on the fly is hard in combat.
Catherine Laartii State Protectorate Caldari State 464	Posted - 2015.01.23 08:16:32 - [54] - Quote Alvatore DiMarco wrote: You're forgetting the increase in load on the pilot, reading this stuff on top of everything else they already have to read in the course of a fight, nevermind that between someone's ship type (frigate, battleship, cruiser, etc.) and velocity you should be able to reasonably approximate their sig radius. Information overload is a thing, data takes time to read and process and there's not as much time as one would like except during TiDi. What you're describing is a fault of the UI, not of the data wanting to be displayed in question. We already know how information on the overview is cumbersome and it is agreed that it should be changed in some way to be easier to track (listed stats on the target ship, maybe?), so the question isn't whether to implement a good idea or not, it's how to implement a good idea to a poorly designed UI.
Amarisen Gream The ArK's Hammer ArK Alliance 61	Posted - 2015.01.23 08:37:12 - [55] - Quote Not to high-jack your day thread. A few months back I asked CCP in the little things post to give us the absolute to have our watch list players and their HP in our overview as a column. I believe CCP Kurkur (sorry for misspelling) stated it was a good idea but due to the current set up it would consume to much data. The problem CCP isn't CPU it is data thrush holds that people have. The overview should be the the place to get like 90% of are info. Even target hp, but it doesn't work that way. xoxo Amarisen Gream
Aran Hotchkiss Phoibe Enterprises 59	Posted - 2015.01.23 10:01:40 - [56] - Quote Amarisen Gream wrote: Not to high-jack your day thread. A few months back I asked CCP in the little things post to give us the absolute to have our watch list players and their HP in our overview as a column. I believe CCP Kurkur (sorry for misspelling) stated it was a good idea but due to the current set up it would consume to much data. The problem CCP isn't CPU it is data thrush holds that people have. The overview should be the the place to get like 90% of are info. Even target hp, but it doesn't work that way. I'm having trouble figuring out if you're for or against this..... your first and third paragraphs seem to support it whilst your second is against it.... Personally I like this idea - and I feel it's worth mentioning I play on a single 13" monitor where everything is competing for space, including the overview, and sig radius is something I'd make a compromise to include on my overview Shamelessly stole this line, Alternatively, QFT One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
erittainvarma Fistful of Finns Triumvirate. 33	Posted - 2015.01.23 22:00:45 - [57] - Quote -1 It gives too much info out and you have no real control about it. With speed you can always play slower than you are, with sig you can't do anything.
Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 422	Posted - 2015.02.28 03:45:45 - [58] - Quote BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie wrote: Yup, so the only increase in load would be to push the information the server already has, to the clients. Pushing this would scale at O(n^2) though. I know plenty of things in eve do, but I'd rather see better server stability than additional (admittedly useful) information on the overview.[/quote] Yes it would increase the server load, but by a minuscule amount because I would be surprised if CCP had it setup where it pushed the data out to the clients if the column wasn't active in your overview. And since the server already has the data on your sig radius, it would just have to do a check to see if you have it as an active column. If you do not have it, then the server would go back to what it normally would do, but if you had it checked then it would push the data to your client. Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
James Baboli Ferrous Infernum 518	Posted - 2015.04.16 09:26:34 - [59] - Quote Still waiting for this vital information, that I should have by the time I'm done locking a thing, to be available somehow. Talking more, Flying crazier, And drinking more Making battleships worth the warp
Ivarr Kerensky Kerensky Tactical Group 47	Posted - 2015.04.16 09:41:05 - [60] - Quote Showing actual sig radius would give far too much information on fitting, links and whatnot. So no, it shouldn't be implemented. Excellence is an attitude.

James Baboli Ferrous Infernum 518	Posted - 2015.04.16 09:50:32 - [61] - Quote Ivarr Kerensky wrote: Showing actual sig radius would give far too much information on fitting, links and whatnot. So no, it shouldn't be implemented. Why does it give away too much information, and why should giving away intel from being on grid with a thing be an issue, if that intel is how big it is to your sensors? Talking more, Flying crazier, And drinking more Making battleships worth the warp
Ivarr Kerensky Kerensky Tactical Group 47	Posted - 2015.04.16 11:35:36 - [62] - Quote James Baboli wrote: Ivarr Kerensky wrote: Showing actual sig radius would give far too much information on fitting, links and whatnot. So no, it shouldn't be implemented. Why does it give away too much information, and why should giving away intel from being on grid with a thing be an issue, if that intel is how big it is to your sensors? Your obviously biased question is then answered by yourself. It's giving away too much intel and creates yet another hilarious non-effort clown fleet "sort by sig" option. No thanks. Excellence is an attitude.
McChicken Combo HalfMayo The Happy Meal 591	Posted - 2015.04.16 12:52:44 - [63] - Quote FT Diomedes wrote: I think it could also be nice to see what friendly effects are being applied to your locked targets. For example, if I lock six targets, it might be nice to see which one of them my fleet members already have target painted or disrupted. This would be very useful for keeping things tackled. The trick we use right now is "tackle a player who's name starts with the same as yours". A bit silly. There are all our dominion Gate camps: "Its like the lowsec watercooler, just with explosions and boose" - Ralph King-Griffin
Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 446	Posted - 2015.04.16 15:09:14 - [64] - Quote Ivarr Kerensky wrote: Your obviously biased question is then answered by yourself. It's giving away too much intel and creates yet another hilarious non-effort clown fleet "sort by sig" option. No thanks. And yet there are counters to this. -Setup a few brick tanked ships with slightly more sig then the rest of your fleet (Sub option would be to target paint your own brick tanked fleet members). -Have the logis prelock the largest sigs. -Have your fleet pulse MWDs randomly to change who has the largest sig to split the incoming DPS Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
Frostys Virpio The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc 1691	Posted - 2015.04.16 15:38:13 - [65] - Quote Ivarr Kerensky wrote: James Baboli wrote: Ivarr Kerensky wrote: Showing actual sig radius would give far too much information on fitting, links and whatnot. So no, it shouldn't be implemented. Why does it give away too much information, and why should giving away intel from being on grid with a thing be an issue, if that intel is how big it is to your sensors? Your obviously biased question is then answered by yourself. It's giving away too much intel and creates yet another hilarious non-effort clown fleet "sort by sig" option. No thanks. What's wrong with sorting by sig if it was available? Chance are the majority of a fleet would be the exact same size if they have a doctrine fit since there isn't a bajillion skill level difference where you can end up with a different final sig size...
Enya Sparhawk Black Tea and Talons 48	Posted - 2015.04.16 15:51:00 - [66] - Quote -1 Sig radius helps you probe people in space. Determines if a gun can even be effectively used against you (without actually firing it). etc. If you want people to have this sort of information, then make them work for it. Fíorghrá: Grá na fírinne Déan gáire...Tiocfaidh ár lá
James Baboli Ferrous Infernum 524	Posted - 2015.04.16 15:53:15 - [67] - Quote Enya Sparhawk wrote: -1 Sig radius helps you probe people in space. sig radius also affects tracking, missile damage, lock time, etc. Gonna need to expand why you -1 the idea beyond a single (relatively niche) use of the stat we would like visible if you want to effectively contribute to the discussion. Talking more, Flying crazier, And drinking more Making battleships worth the warp
Enya Sparhawk Black Tea and Talons 48	Posted - 2015.04.16 16:02:57 - [68] - Quote Fair enough. This seems to be a touchy subject now a days. People want to have all the information that they can to use against someone but are too lazy or too stupid to actually get it themselves... Its shameful. There's no real strategy to it. Just collect info at one point and then send a mass down upon that target fitted. Game mechanics? Yes. Expected? Yes. Necessary? No. I always prefer to make cowards work for it. That way in the end, it hurts them so much more... Fíorghrá: Grá na fírinne Déan gáire...Tiocfaidh ár lá
James Baboli Ferrous Infernum 524	Posted - 2015.04.16 16:07:57 - [69] - Quote Enya Sparhawk wrote: Fair enough. This seems to be a touchy subject now a days. People want to have all the information that they can to use against someone but are too lazy or too stupid to actually get it themselves... Its shameful. There's no real strategy to it. Just collect info at one point and then send a mass down upon that target fitted. Game mechanics? Yes. Expected? Yes. Necessary? No. I always prefer to make cowards work for it. That way in the end, it hurts them so much more... So, because we want a statistic which makes huge differences in how several things perform to have an option to make visible, we're lazy and stupid and cowards? How nice of you to say that. As for strategy, this isn't a huge change, other than being able to see who has how much sig-bloat and/or halos. Talking more, Flying crazier, And drinking more Making battleships worth the warp
Ivarr Kerensky Kerensky Tactical Group 48	Posted - 2015.04.18 08:45:04 - [70] - Quote James Baboli wrote: As for strategy, this isn't a huge change, other than being able to see who has how much sig-bloat and/or halos. Yes, it is. Excellence is an attitude.

Nevyn Auscent Broke Sauce 2055	Posted - 2015.04.18 09:46:34 - [71] - Quote James Baboli wrote: sig radius also affects tracking, missile damage, lock time, etc. Gonna need to expand why you -1 the idea beyond a single (relatively niche) use of the stat we would like visible if you want to effectively contribute to the discussion. Let me see.... Velocity affects tracking & missile damage, we can see that in the overview..... In fact we can see angular velocity which is directly the tracking stat..... So.... we already have other stats that also similarly affect damage that are shown in the overview, there is no reason for sig radius to be the sacred cow..... Unless of course you are a 'solo' PvPer scared that this will show up your OGB before someone engages, since that's the main intel it will give away. Is it a significant change, totally. But it's not a sacred cow.
Ivarr Kerensky Kerensky Tactical Group 48	Posted - 2015.04.18 10:25:56 - [72] - Quote Nevyn Auscent wrote: James Baboli wrote: sig radius also affects tracking, missile damage, lock time, etc. Gonna need to expand why you -1 the idea beyond a single (relatively niche) use of the stat we would like visible if you want to effectively contribute to the discussion. Let me see.... Velocity affects tracking & missile damage, we can see that in the overview..... In fact we can see angular velocity which is directly the tracking stat..... So.... we already have other stats that also similarly affect damage that are shown in the overview, there is no reason for sig radius to be the sacred cow..... Unless of course you are a 'solo' PvPer scared that this will show up your OGB before someone engages, since that's the main intel it will give away. Is it a significant change, totally. But it's not a sacred cow. But you can also see that in space, to an extend. Sig radius is an extra, currently hidden, stat an that changes things a bit. Your pojnt on "solo" makes sense but then again, if you see an extra neutral you can expect him to be a booster and with OGB going the way of the dodo that's very much a moot point. It's just too much intel, too easily gotten that massively benefits clown blobs. Excellence is an attitude.
elitatwo Eve Minions Poopstain Removal Team 634	Posted - 2015.04.18 10:39:53 - [73] - Quote James Baboli wrote: Still waiting for this vital information, that I should have by the time I'm done locking a thing, to be available somehow. Why? All the information you need is already displayed in the center of the screen in blue letters, telling you how much damage you do or not. Instead of looking at the angular velocity, look at transversal and apply high=bad, low=good. The target speed tells you already if some boat is linked or not. If a boat goes as fast as it should, no links and if yes links are in play. For missiles the volley damage displayed on the top center screen position tells you how much % of the volley damage is applied. It goes from 0% - 1% of the volley damage - unfortunately not higher than that. 0-0.1% means bad, 0.2-1% means heavy missiles good, mmkay? Tired of low and nullsec? Join Eve Minions and experience the beauty of wormholes!
Baali Tekitsu AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse 754	Posted - 2015.04.18 11:11:51 - [74] - Quote Sig radius is one of the core defensive characteristics of a ship and gives away too much information (oversized prop? pirate implants? warfare links? pilot ship skills in some cases, shield/armor tank?) at once. Even when the ship is not moving at all or engaging in any hostile activity, as opposed to speed for example. You dont get to see shield/armor links and slave/crystal implants at first glance either. Its the same reason why shield recharge, total hp numbers, enemy repair numbers, capacitor amount and recharge rate etc are not shown. RATE LIKE SUBSCRIBE
Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 450	Posted - 2015.04.18 18:02:15 - [75] - Quote Baali Tekitsu wrote: Sig radius is one of the core defensive characteristics of a ship and gives away too much information (oversized prop? pirate implants? warfare links? pilot ship skills in some cases, shield/armor tank?) at once. Some even when the ship is not moving at all or engaging in any hostile activity, as opposed to speed for example. You dont get to see shield/armor links and slave/crystal implants at first glance either. Its the same reason why shield recharge, total hp numbers, enemy repair numbers, capacitor amount and recharge rate etc are not shown. So, are trying to say that you are going to create an excel spreadsheet that has every ship in the game in it and you can plug in the sig radius of a ship that you see in the game to see what their fit could be? Keep in mind that once this goes on the overview, people can start throwing off the intel by fitting one shield extender or a rig on to hide they have those halos in when they are just travelling around. They can also just keep the link that reduces sig radius off until the fight actually starts in which they can turn that last link back on. Even if someone was shield tanked and they had links, do they have all perfect level 5 skills on both the booster and the character they are playing (Including rig skills) along with the proper boosting ship and implant? Or are they simply flying as armor? Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
Ivarr Kerensky Kerensky Tactical Group 49	Posted - 2015.04.18 21:27:21 - [76] - Quote How nice of you to sum up part of the reason why the intel would just be "too good" if it would be introduced. So what was your initial excuse to ask for it in the first place? Excellence is an attitude.
Hopelesshobo Tactical Nuclear Penguin's 451	Posted - 2015.04.18 21:35:09 - [77] - Quote Ivarr Kerensky wrote: How nice of you to sum up part of the reason why the intel would just be "too good" if it would be introduced. So what was your initial excuse to ask for it in the first place? If you read my OP you can see why I would like to see this introduced in the game. It is not "too good" to be introduced. People are just afraid that this will be a game breaking thing to add to the game but just like velocity only lets you estimate fits, so will sig radius. There are counters to the intel of the velocity column by either not moving or moving at a slower speed, but there are also tricks you can do with your sig radius as well. Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
Ivarr Kerensky Kerensky Tactical Group 49	Posted - 2015.04.19 08:52:00 - [78] - Quote Hopelesshobo wrote: Ivarr Kerensky wrote: How nice of you to sum up part of the reason why the intel would just be "too good" if it would be introduced. So what was your initial excuse to ask for it in the first place? If you read my OP you can see why I would like to see this introduced in the game. It is not "too good" to be introduced. People are just afraid that this will be a game breaking thing to add to the game but just like velocity only lets you estimate fits, so will sig radius. There are counters to the intel of the velocity column by either not moving or moving at a slower speed, but there are also tricks you can do with your sig radius as well. That was a rhetorical question because the answer is obvious. It's too much info on stuff you can't "see", it's too useful, too handy. Excellence is an attitude.
James Baboli Ferrous Infernum 539	Posted - 2015.04.19 09:01:00 - [79] - Quote Ivarr Kerensky wrote: Hopelesshobo wrote: Ivarr Kerensky wrote: How nice of you to sum up part of the reason why the intel would just be "too good" if it would be introduced. So what was your initial excuse to ask for it in the first place? If you read my OP you can see why I would like to see this introduced in the game. It is not "too good" to be introduced. People are just afraid that this will be a game breaking thing to add to the game but just like velocity only lets you estimate fits, so will sig radius. There are counters to the intel of the velocity column by either not moving or moving at a slower speed, but there are also tricks you can do with your sig radius as well. That was a rhetorical question because the answer is obvious. It's too much info on stuff you can't "see", it's too useful, too handy. Except that sig radius is exactly about how big you "see" the thing on grid. It's something that is really, really obvious if you are willing to make an IRL comparison, with radar cross section being almost instantly available on anything like a modern combat sensor array. Talking more, Flying crazier, And drinking more Making battleships worth the warp
Ivarr Kerensky Kerensky Tactical Group 52	Posted - 2015.04.19 10:06:02 - [80] - Quote James Baboli wrote: Ivarr Kerensky wrote: Hopelesshobo wrote: Ivarr Kerensky wrote: How nice of you to sum up part of the reason why the intel would just be "too good" if it would be introduced. So what was your initial excuse to ask for it in the first place? If you read my OP you can see why I would like to see this introduced in the game. It is not "too good" to be introduced. People are just afraid that this will be a game breaking thing to add to the game but just like velocity only lets you estimate fits, so will sig radius. There are counters to the intel of the velocity column by either not moving or moving at a slower speed, but there are also tricks you can do with your sig radius as well. That was a rhetorical question because the answer is obvious. It's too much info on stuff you can't "see", it's too useful, too handy. Except that sig radius is exactly about how big you "see" the thing on grid. It's something that is really, really obvious if you are willing to make an IRL comparison, with radar cross section being almost instantly available on anything like a modern combat sensor array. No, you don't. A ship model doesn't become smaller just because someone uses Evasive links, it doesn't become bigger because you fit a shield extender. I'm not making any RL comparisons because they have no place in balancing discussions in games, especially not in this space submarine sim. Excellence is an attitude.

Mechanical Infidel Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 2	Posted - 2015.04.19 11:09:55 - [81] - Quote Adding sig to the overview gives away to much information into being able to prioritize targets in fleets. Examples being TPed targets and people with Inty 4 dying a lot quicker. I thought of a compromise with showing sig next the locked target would be a better option, but decided against it again as I wouldn't be able to trick opponents into thinking am AB only fit anymore. However skirmish linked targets would be a lot easier to avoid in cases were they improperly time activation in order to wreck you.
MidnightWyvern Night Theifs incendia equus 98	Posted - 2015.04.19 15:52:45 - [82] - Quote This is an excellent idea. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=eaUaJUhTZfw#t=148s An excellent example of why pod killmails are the best feature to be implemented in EVE Online since warping at zero.
Dark reminance Vanilla Vindi 0	Posted - 2015.06.03 07:35:20 - [83] - Quote Coming from an Incursion point of view, and fleet mechanics, instead of having sig rad as an overview option, why couldn't the fleet we're all in see our e-war icons..i.e. webs and target painters show up on the targets we (the fleet) have locked? This way the blasters dudes can see what the painters are shooting at, since it is common that the painters are on different ships. I'd rather see pics/icons like we have above our huds on the targets locked than another column of numbers. +1 anyway for the idea.
HiddenPorpoise Under Dark Sins of our Fathers 348	Posted - 2015.06.03 08:09:25 - [84] - Quote Mechanical Infidel wrote: Examples being TPed targets I hope this speaks for itself. I think the most vocal group against this are people that don't want to announce that they have links.
Felix Judge Gallente Rebels Inc. Villore Accords 22	Posted - 2015.06.04 09:52:43 - [85] - Quote Antillie Sa'Kan wrote: I guess we should show people's resist profiles on the overview as well then? The sig radius is an outside quality and can be picked up immediately by the ship sensors, just as speed or angular velocity. The resists are not, and cannot.
Lugh Crow-Slave 1111	Posted - 2015.06.04 10:28:21 - [86] - Quote Felix Judge wrote: Antillie Sa'Kan wrote: I guess we should show people's resist profiles on the overview as well then? The sig radius is an outside quality and can be picked up immediately by the ship sensors, just as speed or angular velocity. The resists are not, and cannot. its no different than knowing x-ship is platted based on how fast it is going or that its is mwd or ab fit Fuel block colors? Missiles for Caldari T3? Corp Stasis
Felix Judge Gallente Rebels Inc. Villore Accords 22	Posted - 2015.06.04 10:39:18 - [87] - Quote Lugh Crow-Slave wrote: Felix Judge wrote: Antillie Sa'Kan wrote: I guess we should show people's resist profiles on the overview as well then? The sig radius is an outside quality and can be picked up immediately by the ship sensors, just as speed or angular velocity. The resists are not, and cannot. its no different than knowing x-ship is platted based on how fast it is going or that its is mwd or ab fit There is a difference between measurement and deduction: Your ship's sensors can measure the other ship's speed. But you must deduct yourself from the ship type and that information if it is likely plated or not. What can be measured by ship sensors, should be displayable on the overview IMHO. What can only be deducted, not.
Alexis Nightwish 223	Posted - 2015.06.04 14:03:26 - [88] - Quote Honest question for both those who are either for or against this information being available: What if the sig radius only appeared if you had the target locked? CCP approaches problems in one of two ways: nudge or cludge EVE Online's "I win!" Button Fixing bombs, not the bombers
Nevyn Auscent Broke Sauce 2225	Posted - 2015.06.05 20:08:32 - [89] - Quote Felix Judge wrote: There is a difference between measurement and deduction: Your ship's sensors can measure the other ship's speed. But you must deduct yourself from the ship type and that information if it is likely plated or not. What can be measured by ship sensors, should be displayable on the overview IMHO. What can only be deducted, not. Except that Sig radius is something that should be measurable by ship sensors. Given it directly affects lock time, and is equivalent to a ships radar profile which is directly measurable by current radars. So.... Your argument actually says it should be on the overview.
Specia1 K State War Academy Caldari State 83	Posted - 2015.06.05 22:12:53 - [90] - Quote +1 Your ship sensors already have the data, you are merely asking for that data to be displayed for the pilot. RL or subs-in-space-sim, a logical function.

James Baboli Ferrous Infernum 853	Posted - 2015.06.07 23:03:37 - [91] - Quote Alexis Nightwish wrote: Honest question for both those who are either for or against this information being available: What if the sig radius only appeared if you had the target locked? It would be an additional check, which I am not against, but it does not make sense to me that sig would only appear once a target is locked. Talking more, Flying crazier, And drinking more Making battleships worth the warp
WhatYouDidThere 24th Imperial Crusade Amarr Empire 1	Posted - 2015.06.09 20:23:04 - [92] - Quote -1 You should only know I have links when you are already scrammed.
James Baboli Ferrous Infernum 853	Posted - 2015.06.09 21:10:21 - [93] - Quote WhatYouDidThere wrote: -1 You should only know I have links when you are already scrammed. Why is this such a common negative point? People will know you have links! AHHH! The terror of intel gathered from being on grid with you. Talking more, Flying crazier, And drinking more Making battleships worth the warp
Ares Desideratus GUILD OF DOOM MOOD UBER SWAG ETERNAL 260	Posted - 2015.06.10 00:18:44 - [94] - Quote Some people are saying that if you put the signature radius on the overview, then you should put things like ship resists and hit points on the overview as well but this comparison makes no sense. From my understanding signature radius should realistically be readable, it should not be invisible. Every ship has a signature radius and a signature resolution. Signature radius should be easily read by your ship's computer, it's not even close to the same thing as having a display which shows you what your enemy is fitting or how they are tanking or whatever. It's completely different. Reading an enemy ships signature radius is more similar to reading their other basic statistics like their velocity and ship type.
Baali Tekitsu AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse 783	Posted - 2015.06.10 01:27:19 - [95] - Quote Ares Desideratus wrote: -áSignature radius should be easily read by your ship's computer, it's not even close to the same thing as having a display which shows you what your enemy is fitting or how they are tanking or whatever. It's completely different. Reading an enemy ships signature radius is more similar to reading their other basic statistics like their velocity and ship type. No its not. The signature radius together with turret models tells a expert player exactly how a ship is fitted, while the enemy ship doesnt even need to move. RATE LIKE SUBSCRIBE
Khan Wrenth Hedion University Amarr Empire 166	Posted - 2015.06.10 01:31:39 - [96] - Quote Baali Tekitsu wrote: No its not. The signature radius together with turret models tells a expert player exactly how a ship is fitted, while the enemy ship doesnt even need to move. And this is a game where such expertise is supposed to be rewarded and encouraged. +1 let's get that sig rad on the overview. Let's discuss overhauling the way we get intel in EvE.
Specia1 K State War Academy Caldari State 84	Posted - 2015.06.10 01:41:45 - [97] - Quote Baali Tekitsu wrote: Ares Desideratus wrote: -áSignature radius should be easily read by your ship's computer, it's not even close to the same thing as having a display which shows you what your enemy is fitting or how they are tanking or whatever. It's completely different. Reading an enemy ships signature radius is more similar to reading their other basic statistics like their velocity and ship type. No its not. The signature radius together with turret models tells a expert player exactly how a ship is fitted, while the enemy ship doesnt even need to move. I could agree that targeting is required to gain the sig-radius information. A skilled player would know from the targeting time approximately what the sig-radius is anyway. This would also prevent gaining this information while you are cloaked (aka stealth-bombers) to facilitate your attack in advance. This is a reasonable proposition.
Ares Desideratus GUILD OF DOOM MOOD UBER SWAG ETERNAL 260	Posted - 2015.06.10 02:05:03 - [98] - Quote Baali Tekitsu wrote: Ares Desideratus wrote: -áSignature radius should be easily read by your ship's computer, it's not even close to the same thing as having a display which shows you what your enemy is fitting or how they are tanking or whatever. It's completely different. Reading an enemy ships signature radius is more similar to reading their other basic statistics like their velocity and ship type. No its not. The signature radius together with turret models tells a expert player exactly how a ship is fitted, while the enemy ship doesnt even need to move. Sure it is. You can gather separate information based on what you know about the enemy's signature radius, sure, but that doesn't mean what I said was untrue. It's also impossible to know exactly how a ship is fitted just by looking at it, even if you do know the signature radius of the ship.


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