If you want to discuss ship balance please open a thread on the balance between ships. In this thread we are discussing the relationship between Heavy Missiles and Turrets.

If you want to discuss ship balance please open a thread on the balance between ships. In this thread we are discussing the relationship between Heavy Missiles and Turrets.

It's like Fozzie said, you balance the weapon THEN the ships. All I hear from the "HML are fine" guys is "Because of Drake".


Post some fits, or I'm sorry I'm with Mario that you're flat out trolling in the face of overwhelming evidence.

No one seems to be mentioning that missiles are immune to tracking disruptors which are devastating to turrets.

From everything I've seen heavies start with a TD nerf built in and you're stuck building it back up to some degree of normal application.

No one seems to be mentioning that missiles are immune to tracking disruptors which are devastating to turrets.

Then we'll go back in circles about how missiles don't use cap, can select damage type, can't be countered by angular, don't require any manual input and are too easy to fit and because of all that shouldn't work even close to on par to turrets.

Then we'll go back in circles about how missiles don't use cap, can select damage type, can't be countered by angular, don't require any manual input and are too easy to fit and because of all that shouldn't work even close to on par to turrets. You're never going to "win" (and by that I mean convince anyone who matters that Drake/Tengu should get a straight buff). Again, that's not me trying to be annoying, it's just me being a realist.

Just as the Drake and Tengu held back a Caldari buff for so long it's the same here again. Any concept of an idea will HAVE to be a complete package encompassing an understanding and solution for the possible & obvious issues that come from buffing HML. If you don't nothing is going to happen.


I bet they have this circle jerk discussion the whole time at CCP, and it's just as fruitless as here.

Which is totally balanced if you're still living in fear of Drakes.

p.s.: your obsession with fits is hilarious, especially so as tons of fits have been posted already but always changing the conditions to suit one's agenda. Also because making a fleet fit is so fcking easy it shouldn't even be questioned. Yes HML apply less dps because they're a non-effort, non-cap using, non-ewar countered, damage type selectable weapon system. Yes they should get a buff but no the Drake isn't allowed to gain from it, nor the Tengu.

perhaps that should be the thing the fix instead of tweaking damage output and application/projection values, just say'n.

Well missiles would most likely be a mix of kinetic and explosive damage. If they were hypothetically to get damage locked completely then that would be the two I'd give them. Which gives you only drones and projectiles as the selectable damage weapons and missiles could be modified in other more useful ways.

Don't even start with drones. Ive mostly ignored them for the sake of everyones sanity in this thread. Don't even check what a bonused drone boat can do with light drones compared to a HM ship. It will probably make you cry....it made me cry.

Actually you cry now too.

http://imgur.com/ia8gJdV

Blue Heavy
Red Medium
Green Light

and if you can see it down there in the bottom corner

Teal HMs.

Well missiles would most likely be a mix of kinetic and explosive damage. If they were hypothetically to get damage locked completely then that would be the two I'd give them. Which gives you only drones and projectiles as the selectable damage weapons and missiles could be modified in other more useful ways.

Now it's obvious you're just grasping at straws. Under no logical circumstances would anyone think of sending mediums or heavies that far out, at all... ever. Also, since EFT can't emulate drone behaviour it'll just assume max damage so the whole drone graph is nonsense to begin with.

Yeah, fck the Amarr missile ships, right?

Now it's obvious you're just grasping at straws. Under no logical circumstances would anyone think of sending mediums or heavies that far out, at all... ever. Also, since EFT can't emulate drone behaviour it'll just assume max damage so the whole drone graph is nonsense to begin with.

Why wouldn't I just bonus them for missile damage? I'm not seeing your problem.

No it's posted as a clear "woe is me, look at how bad missiles have it, LOOK AT IT!!!1!!1!oneoneleven". So we can just stop this whole **** thread because it leads to nothing, especially not because folks refuse to be realistic and just try to whine so loud hoping someone will fall for it.

The more you try the itrollu.jpg the more obvious it becomes for everyone about how you're not to be taken serious in anything at all. So please, keep at it. And with that, I'll leave this thread alone because the only thing that happens here is circle jerking using flawed logic and (not so) hidden agendas. Good luck with that.

Because in that case Amarr missile ships for pve in amarr space would not be able to both tank EM (T2 resists are explosive/kin) as deal EM.

The more you try the itrollu.jpg the more obvious it becomes for everyone about how you're not to be taken serious in anything at all. So please, keep at it. And with that, I'll leave this thread alone because the only thing that happens here is circle jerking using flawed logic and (not so) hidden agendas. Good luck with that.

The more you try the itrollu.jpg the more obvious it becomes for everyone about how you're not to be taken serious in anything at all. So please, STOP it.
I found this too applicable to pass up
Edit: I pity the thread/bridge you move to next.

Im sure you have numbers to support your claims tho.


(Deleted a bunch of **** because honestly its not worth the effort seriously replying to you.)

I think the problem with the rook is it still only gets good ECM use inside of 30km, which incidentally is where it would be better to use a falcon as well.