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xxxTRUSTxxx
Galactic Rangers
268
|
Posted - 2015.06.05 17:33:44 -
[1381] - Quote
Nevil Oscillator wrote:xxxTRUSTxxx wrote:Nevil Oscillator wrote:xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: but the defender is as commited as the aggressor. they have no choice, 2 day decs would encourage logging off for the timer. like it's not a long time to be offline don't ya think ? but hey,, if it worked and encouraged better content and lolz i'd be all for it. i just don;t think it would work.
I don't think so, if you want a 8 day wardec just run it consecutively 4 times, how would that be any different from what we have now ? i've already explained why i think it's different. sure the current system would let you dec for 2 days then retract.. what you'd really like is a cheaper war dec. am i right? No , at 20mil a pop, 8 days would be more expensive than currently.
ok.but still doesn't make sense when the current system allows for a 2 day dec if the aggressor choses so. or maybe i'm just not getting why you think it would be better. or is it not that it's better just more options ?
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The Slayer
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
225
|
Posted - 2015.06.05 17:56:06 -
[1382] - Quote
Whats the difference between keeping players in an NPC corp or forcing everyone into a 1 man corporation with their alts which will be left the second a war is declared against them. |

Nevil Oscillator
200
|
Posted - 2015.06.05 19:25:18 -
[1383] - Quote
xxxTRUSTxxx wrote:
ok.but still doesn't make sense when the current system allows for a 2 day dec if the aggressor choses so. or maybe i'm just not getting why you think it would be better. or is it not that it's better just more options ?
Yeah I guess it is just a pricing issue, a lot of people don't PVP in expensive ships, at 50 mil you could already be down more than anyone intends to put on the battlefield. |

Sloppy Podfarts
Hedion University Amarr Empire
33
|
Posted - 2015.06.05 19:28:38 -
[1384] - Quote
Demerius Xenocratus wrote:Wardecs - ruinous to newbie corps, minor inconvenience and generally irrelevant to everyone else.

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Iphigeneia
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2015.06.05 22:10:03 -
[1385] - Quote
Hi, I'm Iphi, and I'm in CAS.
I joined EVE at the behest of a good friend of mine. He is in a player corp. He threw isk at me and told me to read the tutorials and have a good time learning how to play -- he owns an orca and an alt with boost skills so he gave me a small fleet to mine in and earn isk while in highsec -- he also introduced me to another friend who is a manager/leader/recruiter in his player corp who has told me all about the exciting life I could lead in null.
Player Corp Manager Friend loves to glorify how much isk I can make in his nullsec corp by afk mining while my alt sits on their gate with several other corpies stomping neutrals who stray into system. He has also been known to complain about members who don't show up at specific times to do specific corp-mandated things -- mining operations to fit US, EU, AU timezones, where all the yield + all the rat bounties go 100% to the corp, for example -- and I realise what it sounds like.
I have a real world job that dictates my playing time. I'm required to follow rules at this job, and I'm okay with that because that's part of what a job means. I give them 42-45 hours of my time every week and do what they tell me to do when they want me to do it and I get paid for it.
Being in a player corp with these types of activities sounds an awful lot like my job. And said friends' corp's system is in the backend of some backwater null system where they rent space from their alliance, so it continues to sound like my job as I'd be in the same seat day after day, week after week, doing nothing but pulling in money and following a boss's command.
I have a damn job. Said job earns me money for siting in the same damn seat day after day for doing what my boss tells me to. When a game feels like a job, I stop playing.
I'm in CAS, like I said, and I quite like it here. In CAS I have access to a lot of friendly people, noobs and veterans alike, to chat with when I'm feeling sociable. These people won't complain if I don't do so for days at a time. I also have access to mission fleets, incursion fleets, mining fleets, and null-sec roaming fleets, should I choose to/have the ability to join in. Not only that, but when I have questions, I can find an answer. Plus, if I show off my new awesome ship that I just fitted with modules that I recently finished training for, my corpmates won't wait for me to undock so they can blow it to pieces (another friend recently had that lovely experience within his first day of joining his first corp back in EVE after years away).
I'm not sure that being in a player-run corp in null-sec following sovereignty rules is going to provide me the kind of experience I want and currently can get out of CAS. However, I have a feeling that joining a player corp is an inevitability if only because I still like playing with my friends and if they continue to be active I may need to join up just to continue playing with them. I'm mostly a carebear, I like blowing things up but I'm more of a honourable-battlefield pvper -- the kind who will fight you in a group no-holds barred, with everyone all out balls to the wall -- but I've never been any good at 1v1, and I'm certainly not up for 1vtrololol.
TL;DR: Player corps too often sound like work when I already have a job. My NPC corp provides a large part of the EVE experience and I'm having lots of fun this way. Might change in future, might not. |

Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
37820
|
Posted - 2015.06.05 23:06:49 -
[1386] - Quote
Iphigeneia wrote: My NPC corp provides a large part of the EVE experience and I'm having lots of fun this way. Might change in future, might not. Welcome to the game and the forum; and congrats on finding the play that works well for you.
Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
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Elaniera
Shiptoasters
254
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 02:14:26 -
[1387] - Quote
Mayhaw Morgan wrote:Sybyyl wrote:People don't survive in nullsec?
No. They don't. I don't know whether to laugh or cry at the stupidity of that reply. Possibly the dumbest comment I've seen in the forum. |

Sibyyl
Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective
25422
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 03:01:48 -
[1388] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:And yes, there's a justification, they choose to play in that way without the same tool as other players get in player corps and without being able to deploy in-space assets and in return they get to be immune to wardecs. It's a playstyle choice. One you obviously hate, but it's a valid choice nonetheless. Quite honestly, I don't see why people should be force out of that just so a handful of groups can wardec even more players who have no interest in fighting. This is a game. People play it for entertainment. Force players into being fodder for a minority group of what can only be described as griefers, and they will leave. it's really that simple.
I disagree with you, but we are arguing something completely subjective at this point.
We would only hold on to let go
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Sibyyl
Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective
25423
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 03:08:14 -
[1389] - Quote
Mayhaw Morgan wrote:No. They don't. Your alliance's killboard is a clear illustration of that. Now, just imagine if, instead of losing Atrons and Talwars, you were losing mission battlecruisers and battleships.
Good thing you went for the low effort option in your response. The preemptive smacktalk doesn't lend itself very well to a discussion.
We would only hold on to let go
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Mayhaw Morgan
State War Academy Caldari State
259
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 04:30:38 -
[1390] - Quote
Sibyyl wrote:Mayhaw Morgan wrote:No. They don't. Your alliance's killboard is a clear illustration of that. Now, just imagine if, instead of losing Atrons and Talwars, you were losing mission battlecruisers and battleships. Good thing you went for the low effort option in your response. The preemptive smacktalk doesn't lend itself very well to a discussion.
I'm sorry, but the truth hurts. No one likes an good underdog story more than me. I saw a story recently about a fisherman that got stabbed in the upper torso by a swordfish. The fisherman died and my response was: "Hurray!"
I'm not pointing it out because I need to feel superior. I'm pointing it out because the Brave Newbies are a clear example of what happens when you throw people into the deep end when they aren't ready. And, contrary to what they might tell you in corp or alliance chat, they aren't all having a blast getting massacred. Some people have fun by sincerely trying to improve and win.
Another good example of what happens is that of myself. I'd like to think I was a brave newbie once, too, and my experience of dying repeatedly in null is what primarily informs my answer to your question. I also died to war dec'ers in high sec. I also died to pirates in low sec. My conclusion: I should have stayed in the damn noob-corp.
Can noobs, solo players, carebears, etc. survive a war dec? Sure. Can noobs, solo players, carebears, etc. survive in null? Sure. Do they? Probably not. |

Omar Alharazaad
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
1837
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 04:34:14 -
[1391] - Quote
Had a nice chat with a member of CAS the other morning. She and many others are very happy with that corp for reasons already covered in depth earlier. I get that. I also understand the need/desire to have a place for hauler/scout/indy alts to live without being under the gun, especially when the main character happens to live in a 'target rich environment'. There are plenty of reasons for living in one of these corps that are plenty valid.
Fear of war as a driving motivator for staying in them is one that kind of saddens me though. Don't get me wrong, I generally have plenty of targets to chase after (so many that I often find myself befuddled as to whom to pursue), so I'm not really looking for more. No, what bothers me is this pervasive notion that wars are horrible things that ruin the game, make it unplayable, drive people away etc... and get branded with the word 'Grief'. I loathe that word, as we're not playing on a public Minecraft server here. We all know what EVE is, or at least we should. We signed up for this. Most of us LOVE this. It's fun because it's kind of scary, kind of like a roller coaster. Facing that fear and conquering it is part of the joy of the game, and because of this skewed perspective many are preemptively robbing themselves of that. Hiding under the bunk and wrapping yourself in foam isn't going to enhance the game for you or anyone else. *shrug*
Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.
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Elaniera
Shiptoasters
256
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 05:12:52 -
[1392] - Quote
Mayhaw Morgan wrote:Sybyyl wrote: People don't survive in nullsec?
No. They don't.
Mayhaw Morgan wrote:Can noobs, solo players, carebears, etc. survive a war dec? Sure. Can noobs, solo players, carebears, etc. survive in null? Sure. Do they? Probably not. Lol. Your personal fail is the basis for your total judgement (by your own words).
Laughing is definitely the right response to this rubbish. |

Mayhaw Morgan
State War Academy Caldari State
259
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 05:35:28 -
[1393] - Quote
Elaniera wrote:Lol. Your personal fail is the basis for your total judgement (by your own words).
Laughing is definitely the right response to this rubbish.
Laughing would be one response to what I said. I don't know if it would be the "right" response. Instead of laughing, though, you made a cryptic and vitriolic post in an internet spaceships forum. I wonder . . . why so serious? |

Elaniera
Shiptoasters
257
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 06:47:12 -
[1394] - Quote
Mayhaw Morgan wrote:I wonder . . . why so serious? Coz, Eve is so serious of course.
That's got to be why you recommend people stay in NPC Corps right. Because otherwise their precious space pixels might splode. Oh no. How terrible, even if they might find fun in other ways that you expect.
Also. Internet forum. Making posts, in whatever form people choose, is kind of part of the point. |

Nevil Oscillator
200
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 07:03:34 -
[1395] - Quote
Low Sec, Null Sec , Wormhole space, is all by definition more dangerous than High Sec, if you are going there to fight it is a good idea to have a plan to replace your ship when you lose it. If you are going there to have a look around because you have not been there before then the same is even more so true. If you are part of alliance that dominates the territory so much that it is no longer dangerous for you that doesn't change the fact that it's natural state is more dangerous and probably still is for people that are not part of that alliance. |

Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
37829
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 07:19:27 -
[1396] - Quote
Nevil Oscillator wrote:Low Sec, Null Sec , Wormhole space, is all by definition more dangerous than High Sec, if you are going there to fight it is a good idea to have a plan to replace your ship when you lose it. If you are going there to have a look around because you have not been there before then the same is even more so true. If you are part of alliance that dominates the territory so much that it is no longer dangerous for you that doesn't change the fact that it's natural state is more dangerous and probably still is for people that are not part of that alliance. Yeah sure, though I wouldn't say danger equates to an inability to survive.
People survive in nullsec all the time, even while losing ships.
Different people, Corps, Alliances and Coalitions have differing abilities to manage risk and many in nullsec provide ship replacement programs that minimize the impact of loss on the wallets of their members. Others don't have SRPs and yet their members thrive in the community they have.
I'd personally almost recommend that all highsec Corps take a trip to nullsec and learn how to survive there. That will make them instantly more prepared to survive against wardecs that visit them when they go back to highsec. A war turns highsec into nullsec without bubbles. Learning to survive in null provide great tools to survive in the face of a wardec aggressor.
Nullsec certainly doesn't need to be feared and never visited because of the risk of loss. Survival there happens every day.
Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
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Aza Ebanu
Old Spice Syndicate Intrepid Crossing
79
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 07:33:10 -
[1397] - Quote
Elaniera wrote:Mayhaw Morgan wrote:I wonder . . . why so serious? Coz, Eve is so serious of course. That's got to be why you recommend people stay in NPC Corps right. Because otherwise their precious space pixels might splode. Oh no. How terrible, even if they might find fun in other ways that you expect. Also. Internet forum. Making posts, in whatever form people choose, is kind of part of the point. Post like these get so stupid sometimes. Whats your point? There are plenty of people in player corps. If there aren't enough for you to get your jollies, too bad. |

Elaniera
Shiptoasters
258
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 07:44:44 -
[1398] - Quote
Aza Ebanu wrote:If there aren't enough for you to get your jollies, too bad. How do I get my jollies? |

Nevil Oscillator
200
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 07:52:22 -
[1399] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:
I'd personally almost recommend that all highsec Corps take a trip to nullsec and learn how to survive there.
Dunno, I would say it depends on the corp, some corps are never going to be wardeced.. ever.. OK In Null you have no gate guns and station guns but if you are a high sec corp you might not even know what they do anyway.
|

Aza Ebanu
Old Spice Syndicate Intrepid Crossing
79
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 08:03:02 -
[1400] - Quote
Elaniera wrote:Aza Ebanu wrote:If there aren't enough for you to get your jollies, too bad. How do I get my jollies? That's a good question. Please share. But you sound like you aren't getting enough and it has something to do with NPC corps.  |

Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
37829
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 08:03:26 -
[1401] - Quote
Nevil Oscillator wrote:Dunno, I would say it depends on the corp, some corps are never going to be wardeced.. ever.. OK In Null you have no gate guns and station guns but if you are a high sec corp you might not even know what they do anyway.
Sure. If it's not a specific risk for a corp then they don't need to worry about it. For most, the risk of wardecs is a thing.
Sentry guns do nothing against war targets.
Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
|

Mayhaw Morgan
State War Academy Caldari State
261
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 08:13:56 -
[1402] - Quote
Elaniera wrote:Coz, Eve is so serious of course.
That's got to be why you recommend people stay in NPC Corps right. Because otherwise their precious space pixels might splode. Oh no. How terrible, even if they might find fun in other ways that you expect.
Also. Internet forum. Making posts, in whatever form people choose, is kind of part of the point.
I'm in an NPC corp. My pixels explode. Would you care to rephrase what you said?
As for recommending NPC corp membership, I really just recommend that people play the game THEIR way, rather than be someone else's goon. People come up with new and interesting solutions to problems when their minds are left alone to operate free of dogma and bias. Internet space safety isn't really one of the reasons I recommend staying out of a player corp.
If it upsets you that I generally recommend NPC corp membership, maybe that is because you want to influence others with your dogma and bias and have trouble doing so in a setting like an NPC corp channel, where no one has any obligation to heed or obey your words. That must suck. :-(
Do I take the game seriously? lol, my main and only character is still in the State War Academy after over 3 years. That's a pretty serious statement about my attitude towards the game. On the other hand, you take the game so seriously, you feel the need to create an alt to post your real opinions about the game, so let me ask again . . . why so serious?
As if there was even anything wrong with taking EVE seriously. Some people play poker during their lunchbreak and call every hand. Some people play poker as their career and win millions of dollars and write books about it and become famous for doing it. Is either of them doing it wrong? |

Nevil Oscillator
200
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 08:22:21 -
[1403] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:Nevil Oscillator wrote:Dunno, I would say it depends on the corp, some corps are never going to be wardeced.. ever.. OK In Null you have no gate guns and station guns but if you are a high sec corp you might not even know what they do anyway.
Sure. If it's not a specific risk for a corp then they don't need to worry about it. For most, the risk of wardecs is a thing. Sentry guns do nothing against war targets.
People only wardec me because I post on the forum. don't post here and you are probably completely safe |

Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
37829
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 08:36:39 -
[1404] - Quote
Nevil Oscillator wrote:People only wardec me because I post on the forum. don't post here and you are probably completely safe Yeah we get wardecced occasionally because of posts I make on the forum. The most recent a couple of months back over a thread on the use of links.
But it's not the only reason wardecs happen. New industrial corps, pilots auto piloting bong ships that can't be ganked at the time, people moving product to markets, mercs hired on contract, operating in a certain area, etc. there's lots of reasons wardecs happen.
Being prepared for them is not a bad thing.
Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
|

Elaniera
Shiptoasters
258
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 08:50:56 -
[1405] - Quote
Aza Ebanu wrote:Elaniera wrote:Aza Ebanu wrote:If there aren't enough for you to get your jollies, too bad. How do I get my jollies? That's a good question. Please share. You sound like you aren't getting enough and it has something to do with NPC corps.  I thought you already knew. I eat babies for breakfast. Grind their bones into flour and bake bread out of it for my supper. Just like everyone in nullsec.
As for NPC Corps, please quote anywhere that I have said anything bad about them.
My only comments have been about the ridiculous statement saying that it isn't possible to survive in nullsec, when it very much is possible, no matter NPC Corp or player corp. |

xxxTRUSTxxx
Galactic Rangers
268
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 10:51:11 -
[1406] - Quote
Mayhaw Morgan wrote:
why so serious?
As if there was even anything wrong with taking EVE seriously. Some people play poker during their lunchbreak and call every hand. Some people play poker as their career and win millions of dollars and write books about it and become famous for doing it. Is either of them doing it wrong?
because some want to be all serious and No you are dead right, neither are doing it wrong.
|

Sibyyl
Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective
25426
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 15:35:41 -
[1407] - Quote
Aza Ebanu wrote:There are plenty of people in player corps. If there aren't enough for you to get your jollies, too bad.
People should not have automatic immunity to a combat mechanism when they are in space. Wardec immunity for NPC corps should be removed. Decc dodging should be removed. The fact that you're arguing someone gets "jollies" is a strawman. Please don't put words in our mouth, or associate emotions or motivations that we actually haven't explicitly stated.
Non-consensual PVP is an essential part of the game. Whether or not a group of players don't want to PVP or are terrible at PVP is beside the point. It's fine if you don't believe that and we can chalk it up to a disagreement. I'm not sure why my or anyone else's "jollies" enters the discussion.
We would only hold on to let go
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Lucy Lopez
Low Frequency
39
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 16:12:28 -
[1408] - Quote
Sibyyl wrote:People should not have automatic immunity to a combat mechanism when they are in space. Wardec immunity for NPC corps should be removed. Decc dodging should be removed. The fact that you're arguing someone gets "jollies" is a strawman. Please don't put words in our mouth, or associate emotions or motivations that we actually haven't explicitly stated.
Non-consensual PVP is an essential part of the game. Whether or not a group of players don't want to PVP or are terrible at PVP is beside the point. It's fine if you don't believe that and we can chalk it up to a disagreement. I'm not sure why my or anyone else's "jollies" enters the discussion.
Wardeccing isn't a combat mechanism, it's a strategy. If you want to explode NPC corp members in highsec then the sandbox already offers you various strategies for that. What you want is access to the easiest strategy of them all. |

Sibyyl
Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective
25427
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 16:14:56 -
[1409] - Quote
Lucy Lopez wrote:Wardeccing isn't a combat mechanism, it's a strategy. If you want to explode NPC corp members in highsec then the sandbox already offers you various strategies for that. What you want is access to the easiest strategy of them all.
The equivalent of saying nullsec is easy because two parties can shoot each other freely.
Easy peasy!
We would only hold on to let go
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Tipa Riot
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
475
|
Posted - 2015.06.06 17:14:55 -
[1410] - Quote
Sibyyl wrote:Lucy Lopez wrote:Wardeccing isn't a combat mechanism, it's a strategy. If you want to explode NPC corp members in highsec then the sandbox already offers you various strategies for that. What you want is access to the easiest strategy of them all. The equivalent of saying nullsec is easy because two parties can shoot each other freely. Easy peasy! A bit more precision please, in non-highsec everybody can shoot everybody without noticeable consequences. In a highsec war only the involved corps can initially shoot each other without Concord involvement, which is a huge difference.
Personally I'm all against arranged fights, and wardecs are from that kind. If they wouldn't be needed today to attack corp structures in highsec, I would like to see them scrapped and replaced by a more implicit way of initiation a fight by just shooting. Shoot first, talk later - this is EvE. 
I'm my own NPC alt.
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