ECCM?
Losing mid > losing gun
Also helps vs the falcon :P

hyperion

i know you're trolling, i'm onto you

Isnt actually a mod but drones.

ECM drones need to have a major look at. When every single one of my rohk / hyperion / maelstrom fits drops a turret for a smartbomb we have a problem!

Yes the smartbomb kills the drones fast if its a "large" smartbomb. Meaning smaller class ships that cannot fit a large smartbomb are in serious peril. 20 Seconds is too long to be taken out of a fight. Too much happens in that time period.

Also how the hell do "light" ecm drones jam a battleship nearly 70% of their cycles?

I can understand a falcon being able to do this, but when a hurricane can throw several light ecm drones at you with NO ecm or drone bonus to the ship, the drones should not be able to jam so well. This has been a long time comming for the most overpowered item in this game.

Discuss and have fun 8)

Hey wildcat, its not the drones, its never been the drones.

Its ecm and its "fubar for 20 second effect" the idea to combine that type of chance basied but yet not a ecm burst style but the full 20 seconds to light drones, utterly stupid and totally unballenced.

we are restricted to heavy web drones, yet if we had light versions they would suck anyway because they have stacking penelties - ecm drones get MORE effective *exponentially* the more you have.

That does not make sense, they are overpowered and always have been - thats why EVERYONE with 25 drone space spare always packs some ec-300s. fact.

EDIT: do you think ecm drones would get used at all if they were only available in large?

This.

The other EW drones are subpar since they are stacking penalised. ECM drones aren't.

Giving them a stacking penalty would probably mean that they become as useless as other ECM drones.
IMO they should be able to burst only, not jam.

Also how the hell do "light" ecm drones jam a battleship nearly 70% of their cycles?

If ECCM worked... that would be an option. I've tested a vindi with an ECCM mod and grail implants. Get jammed by falcons about 30% of the time, ecm drones 60%. ECCM doesnt work 8(

I think the counter mods need to be more effective.

The problem with ecm drones is that they didn't feel the recall->relaunch nerf. When your ecm drone misses a cycle simply recall it and launch it again and it'll immediately attempt abother jam cycle. This is why lights seem to punch above their weight and ecm drones all seem op. Fix that and they'll suck. It'll be a stealth nerf to gallente though because outside of the hurricane it's mostly gallente who fight close enough to use that trick.

ECM drones jam at the end of their cycle, not hte beginning.

I don't know who started this rumor, but it is wrong

Would you accept Fraps as proof?

ECM is really good against a solo player but really bad against almost anything bigger. Always makes me wonder what kind of people are defending it.

A good option to rebalance ecm would be to rework it into an anti-logistics weapon (disrupt transfers or slow them down) and rebalancing ecm ships around it. This way ECM could be used in all sizes of warfare plus it would nerf mass logistics a bit. Gangs would have to think how much logistics and anti-logistics to bring.

I use to be against ECM drones (hated them, because they're worse than falcons). Then I started using them. So, now I'm just against ecm drones being used against me. Kinda like my thoughts on logistics, neutraliser's, tracking disruptor's Falcons and Ecm in general.

Also, I'm against solo pilots using alternative characters in engagements and calling it solo.With that said. I've used alternative characters. Ever since I started playing this game. Maybe not solo, which it's not, but for moving ships trading and whatever else I could not do because I had very low security status. I have used characters to scout before, provide gang-links and logistics. BUT!

In my opinion. Using T3 ships with gang-links is as lame as using falcons, and scouting alternative characters while claiming to be solo.

In this game full of fa@660ts! Who use ships and modules in annoying ways. Why are something's considered ok (alt in t3 gang-links) and others lame (falcon alt)? Those who lack skill. Tend to find ways to make up for it. Be it alternative characters that use ecm, logistics, or gang-links. Fleets that use logistics, falcons and rely on them. Believing themselves good because of it. Stop complaining.

I lose ships because of myriad of things. I get angry sometimes and I rage. I get over it and move on. I wish I could ask A GOD (CCP) in real life to change all the things that are unfair. Certain things most would consider imbalanced or immoral. You know, stupid sh!t. Deal with it.

How many more things are people going to complain about being overpowered? Seems that any ship, module or ammo used in game by the majority of pilots is considered overpowered.


-proxyyyy

IMO they should change so that the ECM drones reduce the targets sensor strength instead of jamming it. .

This may be the best idea I have ever heard!

I love it. Make ECM an anti logistics weapon. It would actually make ECM dedicated ships more effective and desireable, all while not completely dominating a small gang fight with 1 ship or 1 flight of drones.

Make force mulitpliers counter force multipliers! I love it, great idea!

CCP pls make this happen!

If ECM would just break the lock instead of keeping someone jammed for the complete cycle small ships (with low sensor strength, but good scanres) would be able to relock, before the next cycle breaks their lock again.

Would as a sideeffekt boost dampeners attractivity.

Problem with that solution is that ECM boats would die to all high-dps frigates .. takes less than a second to lock an LSE cruiser with most frigs so he'd have to be aligned and warp the second the jam hits --> Unnecessary nerf to ECM boats.
Plus it makes ECM largely ineffective as a counter SeBo fits, or in other words we would see ECCM replaced by SeBo's across the board as they have utility beyond countering ECM.

Never really thought about it like that.

However, lock breaking seems the best course though. It may reduce the usefulness of ecm ships, but range is also a form of defence. Frigates being on grid will make things difficult, but once the ecm ship breaks a frigates lock and is pre-align. Then warp out.

ECCM will be effectively useless if this change was to occur. Sensor boosters would be more useful. Maybe the duration of ecm should be limited to the time a ship takes to lock. So if a battleship takes 5 seconds to lock a falcon. The ecm module will effect the a battleship for 5 seconds. Plus the time it takes the ship to lock a falcon again.

I dunno.

Likewise. I, of course, tested this on Sisi before making my statement. Did you?

I did, but apparently it was light ECM drones failing to jam my 7 sensor strength Rifter three times in a row

I fit up an archon with around 250 sensor strength once.

A flight of 5 light ECM drones managed to jam me about 3 times in the span of 5 minutes. :|

Isnt actually a mod but drones.

Most op item in Eve: The Suitcase. Damage Controls are easy to fit, easy to train for and has marginal operational costs all in exchange for a staggering bonus to ones tank.

Maybe tracking disrupting yourself would have helped

I see what you did there.

I LOLed :P

I fit up an archon with around 250 sensor strength once.

A flight of 5 light ECM drones managed to jam me about 3 times in the span of 5 minutes. :|

Never go to Vegas.

They don't.
They jam 20% of the time, or 10% with one ECCM module.
Whereas a flight of light drones will add 100dps against you for 100% of the time.

Nerf damage drones! ZOMG!

But seriously. The people in this thread need to take a look at what "probability" and "confirmation bias" are.

ok after reading through most of this thread, GOD MOST OF YOU ARE FRAKING WHINERS!!! Your butthurt cause there is a counter to your gank. YOU GUYS ALWAYS WHINE WHEN YOU DONT GET YOUR WAY, STFU ALREADY!!! So tired of reading threads in here and its a bunch of whiny 2 yr olds that cant always have their way.

Now on topic of ecm drones. I rely on them heavily and most of you over exagerate way too much. The probelm doesnt lie in the drones as much as the ships, Ive used oth lights and mediums on all 4 race of ships, and minmatar is hard as hell to jam out with ecm drones, Caldari ships arent as hard but still takes time. Gallente and Amarr on the other hand a flight of EC600s damn near perma-jams them UNLESS ECCM fitted, takes notcicably more time and less successful jams.

ECCM DOES WORK, use the right one for your race and have some decent skills. Wont save you from a falcon dumping all its jams on you but it does help.

Also Jam duration on ecm drones is a bit much, 30 secs on mediums.... for example. Smalls themselves might be a bit overpowered in comparison to meds and heavies, but not too badly.

CCP needs to look at why races are different difficulties to jam, and even with as much as i love ecm drones when i get caught with my pants down, they need to have their cycle times decreased, thats about it there.

If they are so great and OP, just use them yourself. They effectively increase the length of the battle if both sides use them. Do you really like short battles? Use more Ewar... Everybody.

So did I. ;-)

-Liang

FALSE

Most OP module in the game is Damage Control II

Of course you would also restrict other races to only being able to use their modules against logistics ships to balance this right? Right!

It's a great idea! I mean why would anyone want to apply long range neuts, scramblers, webs, painters or damps on anything other than a logi ship. Not sure how they should change tracking disrupters to fit this new ideology, but I am sure you have thought this all through.

Careful now, I made a thread over a year ago saying the same thing and that they needed a change, all I got for my troubles was the pleasure of being called quite a few nasty things.

Always thought you should be able to "manually target" if jammed. If the target is within a certain degree of the middle of your screen (based on sig radius, distance) when your guns fire, then you hit it with your turrets (missiles should use FoF). Probably a coding nightmare.