EVE Search - So, what do you guys think about watch lists?

All Channels

Wormholes

So, what do you guys think about watch lists?

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 2 3 4 [5] 6 7 8 :: one page
Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Chibi Katana Nighthawk Exploration Anoikis Ronin 13	Posted - 2015.04.04 02:34:05 - [121] - Quote Andrew Jester wrote: keep it and it's cool? get rid of it and it's cooler for supers? About time you weighed in on this.
Insurance Agent Perkone Caldari State 1	Posted - 2015.04.04 04:29:56 - [122] - Quote Let's use some logic: AFK cloak was basically the counter to watch listing, in old eve. And local was counter to cloaks, or so they say in the relevant threads. AFK Cloaks are going to get a possible counter, local is possibly being altered. If those changes go trough there is no reason why watch listing shouldn't change. EvE will become less predictable and that means more random fun. I know this was brought up in relevance to WH but original watchlist was implemented when WH were not even imagined. This alone should be a good enough reason to remove it now, since it does alter gameplay in space were the unknown is the most important feature. ps: I would much rather see outside third party free Intel tools disappear before WL
Orange Aideron Blue-Fire Great Blue Balls of Fire 61	Posted - 2015.04.04 12:35:33 - [123] - Quote OP needs clarification, watch list is also the name of the mechanic that allows fleet members to see the health status of other fleet members ships/pods. So ... can we have a module that disrupts the fleet, like kill boosts, or drops the fleet watchlist? also supers in wormholes, discuss. Also DLC's for soundtracks when we kill someone in space, I want to hear "RAMPAGE" when i kill 5 people in a row.
Andrew Jester ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 1108	Posted - 2015.04.04 13:27:13 - [124] - Quote Chibi Katana wrote: Andrew Jester wrote: keep it and it's cool? get rid of it and it's cooler for supers? About time you weighed in on this. I think it's the dumbest issue tbh. Only worrisome for v small WH corps or bears, otherwise why does it matter if people know when you're logging in? vov people complain too much about it If thuggin' was a category I'd win a Grammy
Cara Forelli Green Skull LLC 1021	Posted - 2015.04.04 13:54:23 - [125] - Quote Watchlists OP? Um...no. Logging out is OP. So I'm watching someone in a POS in WH space. They warp out. I can quickly determine they didn't go to a planet/moon/WH/site because I have everything bookmarked. So did they log out, or did they go to a safe and cloak up? I have no way to know even though I am actively watching them. In the real world you can't just vanish from the universe. The game has to have some mechanic to let you know, so you can go play with people that are actually logged in. Watch listing supers is a separate problem which I'm not convinced is a problem. But if you were to try and fix it, I guess you could do a sort of "delayed watchlist" where pilots would only show as online if you had confirmed it in game (seen them in local, been on grid with them in WH, etc.) Then you could still see if they logged out, which solves the above problem but doesn't give you free intel on your enemy's supers or let you know when their whole t3 fleet is logging in. Even that idea is easily manipulated though. If you DC you would lose all your intel. Enemies could purposefully log out and back in to remove themselves from watchlists. Still, it's better than completely removing the watch list because it actually addresses both sides of the issue. Adventures New player with questions? Join my public channel in game: *House Forelli* Titan's Lament
Louis Catcher Haywire. 12	Posted - 2015.04.04 14:22:24 - [126] - Quote How about we just start to question everything in eve that works? What do you guys think about wormholes having different colours? Maybe sleepers shouldn't be named sleepers cause they are awake? Why not just get rid of wormholes all together? This op is seriously just trying to raise an issue without it being an issue, perhaps start participating in real wormhole life before trying to change it.
Tipa Riot Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 207	Posted - 2015.04.04 15:03:15 - [127] - Quote Chance Ravinne wrote: I love watch lists as much as the next guy, but sometimes it feels overpowered as an intelligence source. Especially in w space where the lack of local adds to the mystery and shroud, but watch lists kind of undermine that. Any thoughts? The watchlist is IMO one of the invaluable match-making tools in game, it shows me when a prey, hunter or buddy, FC is online and maybe creates an opportunity to play. Also immediate local in lowsec and nullsec is such a tool, why I oppose all ideas to change it. The game needs this meta to keep New Eden vital, not all of us are full time cloaky ninjas Didn't read all the replies, just my 2 cents. I'm my own NPC alt.
Lloyd Roses Artificial Memories 948	Posted - 2015.04.04 16:14:04 - [128] - Quote I really don't think that Its been like that forever is a valid reason. Instead, I question a me hanic without a counter. example: lowsec supers without HICs existing would be a bad idea. Like supers do things and you can't hold them. In a sense, watchlists are the same. Someone can wreck your playstyle simply by logging off when you log in, and continue farming once you logged out. If you think info should be that easily given to you, then I propose wormhole local to just make it right. Requiring visuals, wits and good scouting/scanning should be what tells you if a person is active or not. Monitoring their online status is **** easy, immersion breaking and overall an outdated mechanic. If you want to watchlist friends, please do and await their confirmation. Unlikely your prey will agree, but luckily right now they won't even be asked. I can't complain since I feel to sit on the side with benefits from the status quo, but facepalm over the underlying stupidity of that mechanic. Say no to free intel Say no to mechanics that can't be countered or evaded Say no to wormholes with a curate automated intel Say no to the easy mode
Neckbeard Nolyfe Zero Fun Allowed 41	Posted - 2015.04.04 17:57:01 - [129] - Quote Lloyd Roses wrote: Someone can wreck your playstyle simply by logging off when you log in, and continue farming once you logged out. What is neutral tackle? Lloyd Roses wrote: If you think info should be that easily given to you, then I propose wormhole local to just make it right. So a tool that shows you when someone is online is the same as a tool that shows you in which wormhole someone is located? Lloyd Roses wrote: Requiring visuals, wits and good scouting/scanning should be what tells you if a person is active or not. Monitoring their online status is ** easy, immersion breaking and overall an outdated mechanic. Watching poses/wh's is fun right? Lloyd Roses wrote: Say no to free intel Say no to mechanics that can't be countered or evaded Say no to wormholes with a curate automated intel Say no to the easy mode Say no to free locator check if someone is in k-space? ~lvl 60 paladin~**
umnikar Fishbone Industries 63	Posted - 2015.04.04 20:49:30 - [130] - Quote Should also keep in mind what changed since we have new the notification system with the audible bell. At current state it's pretty easy to track targets down. I suspect that the fairly increased death of supers has alot to do with this. And then listen to the latest wormhole podcast about log offs
Krops Vont Hard Knocks Inc. Hard Knocks Citizens 55	Posted - 2015.04.04 21:10:38 - [131] - Quote Andrew Jester wrote: keep it and it's cool? get rid of it and it's cooler for supers? Remove it and the gazelle running around in w-space will feel either very safe or never leave the pos As with any human, we must map out everything for the sake of living. So what happens when you put the same aspect in a game with random events? They go nuts trying to figure out how to predict and map out everything.
Delegate Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 79	Posted - 2015.04.04 21:47:15 - [132] - Quote Neckbeard Nolyfe wrote: So a tool that shows you when someone is online is the same as a tool that shows you in which wormhole someone is located? Speaking of w-space, a lot of times it's in fact the same tool. Because one main use for non-mutually agreed watchlists is watching players that camp your wormhole or watching corp that you camp. In these situations being online is hugely correlated with being in a specific system. And that both sides can mutually watchlist each other is even worse GÇô at that point we have a substitute for local. There is no balance in this mechanics, as the game give you no sound option to deny that intel.
Neckbeard Nolyfe Zero Fun Allowed 42	Posted - 2015.04.04 22:57:28 - [133] - Quote Delegate wrote: Neckbeard Nolyfe wrote: So a tool that shows you when someone is online is the same as a tool that shows you in which wormhole someone is located? Speaking of w-space, a lot of times it's in fact the same tool. Because one main use for non-mutually agreed watchlists is watching players that camp your wormhole or watching corp that you camp. In these situations being online is hugely correlated with being in a specific system. And that both sides can mutually watchlist each other is even worse GÇô at that point we have a substitute for local. There is no balance in this mechanics, as the game give you no sound option to deny that intel. Or you can use the watchlist as a tool to bait? You know giving your target a false sense of safety? Or use it as a scare tactic? There are so many ways to work around watchlists, and the fact that I have to type this so some people understand is just sad and shows how simple eve has become. From older players adapting and using game mechanics which are at their disposal, to new and inexperienced players wanting changes to make an easy game even easier. *~lvl 60 paladin~*
umnikar Fishbone Industries 64	Posted - 2015.04.04 23:34:30 - [134] - Quote Neckbeard Nolyfe wrote: From older players adapting and using game mechanics which are at their disposal, to new and inexperienced players wanting changes to make an easy game even easier. You can't call it a game mechanic at all and it does not reflect how well adapted(good) you are. Its a workaround newbies not knowing about and more important dont care about, because they are busy learning the real game mechanics and trying to play it actually - which is often prevented by similar "tricks".
Sleepaz Den Artificial Memories Vertical. 0	Posted - 2015.04.04 23:43:50 - [135] - Quote Neckbeard Nolyfe wrote: There are so many ways to work around watchlists, and the fact that I have to type this so some people understand is just sad and shows how simple eve has become. Go on, tell us your work around. I'm very interested in you being both online without that little green lamp shining. Your examples there were a fart in the wind, come on allmighty sensei, show us what you actually got.
Sleepaz Den Artificial Memories Vertical. 0	Posted - 2015.04.04 23:47:52 - [136] - Quote Neckbeard Nolyfe wrote: There are so many ways to work around watchlists, and the fact that I have to type this so some people understand is just sad and shows how simple eve has become. Go on, tell us your work around. All there is are big words and a lot of nothing.
Delegate Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 79	Posted - 2015.04.05 00:28:16 - [137] - Quote Neckbeard Nolyfe wrote: There are so many ways to work around watchlists, and the fact that I have to type this so some people understand is just sad and shows how simple eve has become. There is no way to deny watchlists except for afk camping. Neckbeard Nolyfe wrote: From older players adapting and using game mechanics which are at their disposal, to new and inexperienced players wanting changes to make an easy game even easier. Most of what I saw in this thread goes along these lines: - we need watchlists, because how would we know if they cloaked or logged off, - we need watchlists, because observing pos is tiresome, - we watchlisted a whole corp once we hauled some stuff, - there was a cloaked legion around but I had that pilot on a watchlist. Now tell me, who's looking for an easy game? I need d-scan, overview and patience. You need watchlist.
Andrew Jester ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 1110	Posted - 2015.04.05 03:19:16 - [138] - Quote Sleepaz Den wrote: Neckbeard Nolyfe wrote: There are so many ways to work around watchlists, and the fact that I have to type this so some people understand is just sad and shows how simple eve has become. Go on, tell us your work around. All there is are big words and a lot of nothing. pls no desperate If thuggin' was a category I'd win a Grammy
SwagYolo420 Lazerhawks 68	Posted - 2015.04.05 06:10:38 - [139] - Quote Andrew Jester ElitistOps Pandemic Legion Likes received: 1,111 checked
Mephiztopheleze Republic University Minmatar Republic 56	Posted - 2015.04.07 02:17:11 - [140] - Quote Kynric wrote: If it could be changed to require the consent of the watched it would retain its function for letting friends keep up with you while disabling its use as an intel tool. this. Occasional Resident Newbie Correspondent for TMC: http://themittani.com/search/site/mephiztopheleze
Axloth Okiah Future Corps Sleeper Social Club 632	Posted - 2015.04.07 07:33:37 - [141] - Quote Trinkets friend wrote: Sure, it's prone to abuse. Blood Union would invest billions of ISK in dreads, dread alts, etc, and seed hem into C5's inhabited by bears and pull logon traps partly informed by watchlists. But, and I'll educate you about what really happened because you weren't even playing the game when it happened, BU quit wormholes mostly when CCP removed API kill logging support and jump logging from wormhole systems, thereby invalidating BU's intel tool known as Siggy. BU didn't even need to WL their victims to pull logon traps. a WL pinging with sign-ons is handy but it wouldn't have stopped them without the removal of NPC kill logging and jump logging which just showed a nice red or yellow flag on the holes in Siggy. Uhm, ever heard of QEX? They re-learned how to do it even without the API feed. W-Space Realtor
YuuKnow Inner 5phere 936	Posted - 2015.04.07 11:14:25 - [142] - Quote Chance Ravinne wrote: I love watch lists as much as the next guy, but sometimes it feels overpowered as an intelligence source. Especially in w space where the lack of local adds to the mystery and shroud, but watch lists kind of undermine that. Any thoughts? I think its too powerful a meta and Eve would be more challenging and spontaneous (ie interesting) if if it didn't exist. I can think of two ways to upgrade it: Possible Upgrade #1: Make it a mutual decision that both players agree on. - player adds a contact to their contact list and sends the standard 'you have been added to my contact list' notice - receiving player receives the notice and clicks a box "allow online notification" that way only if the two players are friends will the 'player online' notification be available. Non-consenting players can't be watchlisted. Possible Upgrade #2: watchlisting players happens automatically when each has set the other individual player to blue. - a player gets a notice when any of his 'blue' bros comes on that also have him blue - doesn't apply to automatic blues such as corps/alliance blues as it would cause too many contacts I think the first upgrade is better. yk
Zechariah Bragg Jaded. The Natural Order 63	Posted - 2015.04.07 19:38:47 - [143] - Quote I've always found watch list to be kinda creepy. In the non-intel gathering sorta way.
Montgomery Black Awakened Ones 80	Posted - 2015.04.08 00:47:26 - [144] - Quote Obil Que wrote: Serendipity Lost wrote: Getting rid of the watch list allows the risk averse players to be more risk aversetical. Getting rid of it is bad. It removes a mechanism that enhances the ability to blow up another dudes space stuff. What is more risk averse then gathering intel on people without being outside their POS shield? Serendipity Lost wrote: I use the watch list to blow folks up. Folks that don't like fighting on my terms want to take my tools away. I'm ok w/ folks using the watch list the same way I do to exploit me and blow me up. That's part of the game. The drive to remove watch list functionality boils down directly to risk aversion. This whole attempt to get rid of the watch list is an attempt to make eve more risk averse. It's that simple. Any advantages w/ gimping or removing the current watch list stem soley from the desire of risk averse folks to be free of those who hunt them. I want people who gather intel to have to endure risk to do it. Be in space. Be at my POS. Don't gather intel on me from across New Eden with zero risk to yourself to know my patterns and activities. I see nothing but risk averse people wanting to have their perfect intel on my activities handed to them on a silver platter. I want those people to have to be in space directly and actively gathering intel at risk to themselves for doing it. Yes, I want to take your tool away. Your zero effort, zero risk tool to hunt with. Spoken like someone who has no idea the time it actually takes to actually hunt a target in wormhole space. In WHs there is no local and people are often in cloaked ships. Watchlists prevent hunters from spending hours watching a empty wormhole. They tell you if your target is online so you have a possibility of continuing the hunt. or if he is offline so you dont spend hours of wasted time while your target is logged off doing stuff in that horrible sunshine. watchlists enable pew in wh space and prevent hours of boredom. They don't hand you targets on a platter.
vccv 36	Posted - 2015.04.08 05:58:03 - [145] - Quote I think it should cost a certain amount per day or maybe month to place someone on a watch list. You'd really have to need it if it costs you enough. Protects those who wish they weren't on one by a little and doesn't change much other than slowing down the flow of free Intel a bit. Intel shouldn't be so easy to acquire in my opinion. Not that most folks would have a huge problem paying it.
Glathull Warlock Assassins 1005	Posted - 2015.04.08 07:41:57 - [146] - Quote Man, I get so sick of people standing up on pedestals and beating drums of ideological purity. You are like the special interest groups here in the U.S. who are always pointing at the racism of this policy or the sexism of that one or how this one idea is socialist(!!!)--all the while ignoring the other aspects of a situation that are the conceptually the same but benefit you. Abusing these appeals to conceptual authority is damaging to the very ideas you claim to be espousing. "No Free Intel!" sounds kind of great as a game design principle. But if what it actually means is no free intel except for the free intel that you find beneficial, then it's a crap design principle. If you're going to keep beating on that drum, you need to actually mean it. Otherwise the hypocrisy is painfully obvious, and you just look stupid. But you shouldn't mean it because it's ridiculous. We will never eliminate all sources of free intel in this game, and you would riot if anyone seriously tried to. Get off your soap-boxes and address the actual issue at hand. Try to make a real argument that amounts to something other than, "Whaaaaaaaa! The bad man made my ship go away, and then I poopied in my panties a little. Waaaaaaa!" You can dress that up however you want. But pretending that No Free Intel means anything other than that when you say it is just silly. I honestly feel like I just read fifty shades of dumb. --CCP Falcon
Sexy Cakes Have A Seat 918	Posted - 2015.04.08 14:22:03 - [147] - Quote You should not be able to see whether pilots are online or not unless they give you consent. Just my 2 cents. Not today spaghetti.
Dersen Lowery Drinking in Station 1518	Posted - 2015.04.08 17:37:46 - [148] - Quote If this question is being asked in the context of a general examination of in-game intel (Local, D-scan, probe scanning, locator agents, etc.) then +1 to requiring the consent of the watched. If there's a need, you can deal with edge cases as they come up, e.g.: making the emergency warp on disconnect easily distinguishable from a standard warp. Proud founder and member of the Belligerent Desirables. I voted in CSM X!
Ocid Unknown Crusade 1	Posted - 2015.04.08 18:33:36 - [149] - Quote While we're at it remove killboards as well. **** why not just remove the API so we can't gather any info. /sarcasm Watch lists are fine. People can add me and I don't know they're watching me. I can add people and they don't know I'm watching them.
Andrew Jester ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 1118	Posted - 2015.04.08 19:10:58 - [150] - Quote I don't need to ask for consent the way you're dressed implied it If thuggin' was a category I'd win a Grammy

Pages: 1 2 3 4 [5] 6 7 8 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page

Copyright © 2006-2025, Chribba - OMG Labs. All Rights Reserved. - perf 0,09s, ref 20250916/0111
EVE-Online™ and Eve imagery © CCP.

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.