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WCS nerf is pretty heavy.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Jones Maloy Minmatar	Posted - 2006.10.25 03:21:00 - [121] Originally by: Rafein 2 stabs on a vagabond brought a Vagabond from 60 Km lock range to 16 KM. 2 stabs on a hulk brought a mining barge from 22 Km lock range to 6.5 KM. --- WCS Nerf boycott low-sec
Jones Maloy Minmatar	Posted - 2006.10.25 03:22:00 - [122] Owned --- WCS Nerf boycott low-sec
Siegis Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.25 03:31:00 - [123] Originally by: Alex Harumichi Originally by: Beef Hardslab Originally by: Popsikle It doesnt nerf your ability to run missions Yeah, it does. When the mission rats can have their way with you as far as warp scrambling goes, unless you fit WCS and take the associated negatives... seems like a nerf to "ability to run missions" to me. Funny, that. I don't recall ever fitting wcs's for missions (of any level). Hint: you're supposed to kill the npcs, not run away. It sounds like this only nerfs people who suck at missions. Not a tragedy, as such. Sometimes you have to run when they get you way down... Better to warp away and repair then lose your ship.
HankMurphy Pelennor Swarm Knights Of the Southerncross	Posted - 2006.10.25 03:38:00 - [124] think they will adjust NPC's warp scramming in light of this? i dont have strong feelings either way on this discussion. only way this effects me is the only ship i fly w/ a wcs (vaga) will just get another nano or damage mod instead
Secretary	Posted - 2006.10.25 03:39:00 - [125] Edited by: Secretary on 25/10/2006 03:40:36 Quote: I've been in the game less than two months, and have just over 1 mil SP - noob material, I'm sure. I've got multiple level 4 agents available, and I'm in a Raven. I haven't run any yet because to be honest I'm not sure I'm ready. You're not ready and WCS wouldn't save you. Making those pesky stabbabonds come in nice and close to lock me is a fine idea. My poor innocent ratting BS just wouldn't be able to cope with them.... When i were a nub you got scrambled in lvl 3 missions. All the frigates in 0.0 belts would scramble you. I died a lot... Unlikely that mission scramblers will get nerfed any more than they have already
Sakaki Karazawa Ixion Defence Systems The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2006.10.25 04:07:00 - [126] This nerf doesn't even affect me, since I don't use WCS! =D All it means is I'll be able to fight knowing that my enemy can't run away and go "HAHA U SUX >:V" anymore. =D <Pallantre> 'should i join snigg or veto'? <Pallantre> and i thought.. thats like arguing whether you should join bloods or crips
Elderberry Whine	Posted - 2006.10.25 04:51:00 - [127] Originally by: Zixxa It will alow to fit situationally one wcs, but definitely destroy stabsetups. Good, Low sec will now be completely empty of peeps... except for the hordes of pirates looking for that occasional ibis...
Lansfear Gallente Freelancing Corp Confederation of Independent Corporations	Posted - 2006.10.25 05:46:00 - [128] Dear CCP, From all of us here at CIC we would like to just say one thing about the WCS nerf. GOD ******* BLESS YOU ALL! Ehem. That is all.
Micheal Cassio	Posted - 2006.10.25 05:58:00 - [129] thank you ccp
Afonso Henriques Minmatar Low Grade Ore The SUdden Death Squad	Posted - 2006.10.25 06:39:00 - [130] Originally by: Jones Maloy Originally by: Tovarishch CCPs solution to the WCS problem is, to be honest, brilliant. Anyone interested in a fight should be smart enough to not fit them... while anyone who simply wants to get the Hell out is free to fit all the WCSs that they want. The problem was that combat ships were fitting them in order to reduce the risk of a loss... with no penalty whatsoever. This solution almost entirely eliminates that problem. if you think stabs don't have a penalty then i guess autocannons and mwd's don't either. it's called fitting requirements. 1pg, 30 cpu, 1 low-slot. if you want to lock me down use up one of your precious mids to fit another scram. 4 pts of scram must be countered by using 4 pg, 120 cpu, and 4 low-slots. to get 4 pts of scram you need to use up 2 pg, 60 cpu, 2 mids, and 2 cap/sec. that seems balanced to me. half the fitting requirements, 2 mids instead of 2 lows, and 2 cap/sec instead of using up another 2 lows. i'd trade take 2 cap/sec drain over using 2 low-slots any day of the week. i honestly don't see a debate here. there isn't much room for one Either you are the alt of one of the lamer corps being nerfed with this or you havent a clue about eve (probably both). Sacrificing a low for a wcs or 3, while reducing your ability to go 1:1 with a properly fitted similiar ship (which they run from ofc), is hardly a balance. Scams require precision to use (range/cap) wcs require lazyness. It's a long over due change and one of the best things CCP has done in a long time. next up, instajumps!

Afonso Henriques Minmatar Low Grade Ore The SUdden Death Squad	Posted - 2006.10.25 06:40:00 - [131] Originally by: Jones Maloy Originally by: Rafein 2 stabs on a vagabond brought a Vagabond from 60 Km lock range to 16 KM. 2 stabs on a hulk brought a mining barge from 22 Km lock range to 6.5 KM. use the cheaper coetor then ffs. If you drop 450M on a minign ship, only a dold would fit a wcs over minign laser upgrades.
Zixxa	Posted - 2006.10.25 06:55:00 - [132] Originally by: Afonso Henriques Originally by: Jones Maloy Originally by: Rafein 2 stabs on a vagabond brought a Vagabond from 60 Km lock range to 16 KM. 2 stabs on a hulk brought a mining barge from 22 Km lock range to 6.5 KM. use the cheaper coetor then ffs. If you drop 450M on a minign ship, only a dold would fit a wcs over minign laser upgrades. Great idea! CCP, do you know that now hulk is obsolete ship?
Alliaanna Dalaii Gallente Does Not Compute	Posted - 2006.10.25 06:57:00 - [133] OMFG ! Stabs nerfed I'm allmost tempted to come back and play the game ! Alliaanna DNC Treasure Hunt !!
Cethrie Celestial Fleet Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.10.25 07:05:00 - [134] Excellent compromise. To the mission runners. I understand what you are talking about, being in low sec and being scanned down by pirates. I understand having to travel around in low sec where missions are run. Pirates gravitate to these systems. But if you are careful, its almost impossible to be caught. Yes I agree, the reward isn't as high as the risk. Particularly in Placid. Here is two tactics to solve your problem, its very rare you need to do the mission in low sec that has no station in the system. So fit warp core stabs to travel to the system, then change your setup back to tank. When in the mission, ALWAYS move from the start point. If you are 30+km's away from the warp in point, they wont catch you before you leave. That and they wont enter until most if not all of the rats are dead (Should you escape and the rats target them they wont escape). So you should be well over 40kms from the warp in point. They will need to have fast ships to stop you escaping. Given you should always be aligned to a SS or station, you should always make it out. Hopefully they make the scanner easier to use so u can see when they are coming in, to compensate for the buff probes are supposed to recieve in Kali.
Skeltek Caldari Asgard Schiffswerften Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2006.10.25 07:06:00 - [135] the change will work great on players that do not want to get involved in PvP and give disadvantages to those who do WANT to risk their ship in PvP. You could argue about non-PvPers getting away that easy, since haulers are also somehow involved in 0.0-alliancewarfare, but it¦s ok I guess. I appreciate that ships get nerfed, which had the possibility of attacking others and still being on the safe side.
Alex Harumichi Gallente Gradient Namtz'aar k'in	Posted - 2006.10.25 07:25:00 - [136] Originally by: Grey Area And if you HAVEN'T had problems with pirates until now, then you've been very lucky, or you have dumb pirates. I was scanned with a CoV Ops ship and had a gank party warp in to my mission (yes, it was a long mission) and lock me down and ransom me. Cost me 150 million, which doesn't come back QUICK from mission rewards these days. I do apologise however for assuming that you had not much mission running experience. Ok, fair enough; maybe I just have been lucky -- I've never had a pirate warp in on me on a mission, though (as you found out) it is technically possible. And yeah, a well-organized pirate group like that, or one at a gate, can ruin your day. I still claim that pirates aren't a major risk when running missions, as long as you're careful, but I suppose that depends a lot on the region. Apologies here, too, for being a bit rude. In any case, fitting stabs on a combat mission isn't smart anymore, they gimp your setup too much. So look on the bright side: you can put lots of other fun stuff in those low slots, which both improves your mission performance and gives you some small chance vs. solo or unexperienced pirates.
Alex Harumichi Gallente Gradient Namtz'aar k'in	Posted - 2006.10.25 07:31:00 - [137] Edited by: Alex Harumichi on 25/10/2006 07:34:55 Originally by: Viktoria Maher Originally by: Alex Harumichi Know what? I've never had a single problem with player pirates while missioning. How are they supposed to catch you, in the first place? Lucky you. How do you overcome station-camping pirates, or gank-squads on the other side of gates? Station campers: instas. Gank-squads on other side of gate: haven't run into any serious ones yet, just 150km+ snipers -- which I can survive long enough to warp out. Maybe I've just been lucky, but I've run a lot of lowsec missions -- so I guess it's region-dependent or something. That, and I never use battleships to run missions, so my warp-out time is a lot faster than a bs. It helps. Maybe consider fitting a cloak on your mission bs? Yes, it takes a highslot and needs cpu, but on some ships you have a semi-useless high slot anyway, and loss of stabs frees up a nice bit of cpu. If you jump through a gate and see a gank squad, just do the move-in-random-direction-and-cloak trick. Unless they are paying attention closely, you have a very good chance of just slowly walking away quite safe.
Glarion Garnier Solar Wind	Posted - 2006.10.25 07:50:00 - [138] EXELENT Chainge. Make stabs use tiny winy amount of energy as well.
Plan Neun Caldari Ganja Unlimited	Posted - 2006.10.25 08:07:00 - [139] It doesnt seem like the Dev's in CCP think things through sometimes at all, what the heck is good with this. For miner's and haulers in low sec belts this is hell to put it mildy. This decision will increase empire traffic in high sec. I actually hoped that you in CCP worked for the opposite.
Alex Harumichi Gallente Gradient Namtz'aar k'in	Posted - 2006.10.25 08:25:00 - [140] Originally by: Plan Neun It doesnt seem like the Dev's in CCP think things through sometimes at all, what the heck is good with this. For miner's and haulers in low sec belts this is hell to put it mildy. Que? This won't have much effect at all on lowsec mining and hauling ops (and yes, we do those on a regular basis). In lowsec you want to mine in a battleship anyway. Taking a few bits longer to lock that asteroid isn't going to have any effect, and your target range will stay quite long enough. If you're worried, fit a sensor booster II. If you insist on using a barge, well, those have a medslot too. Sensor booster is your friend. As for haulers, those stabs will have zero effect. So it takes forever to lock something with your hauler? So?

Radeberger Caldari Eye of God Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.10.25 09:15:00 - [141] Edited by: Radeberger on 25/10/2006 09:15:35 Hmm i like this new change, now i just want to know if using a sensor damp against said vaga will apply the stacking penalty with the wcs's . If that ain't the case then i'll be fitting one on my alt's huginn I've been told i look like Oveur, however i disagree it is he that looks like me
Jurskjeld Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2006.10.25 09:44:00 - [142] Well... will the penalty exist as soon as I FIT the stuff, or as soon as it is ONLINE? Because if the latter is the case, mission-running won't suffer as much. -- Amarr scum be pushing gas, Caldari dogs are kissing their ***. Gallente and Minmatar together stand forever as the holy band.
Viscount Hood British Space Corporation	Posted - 2006.10.25 09:50:00 - [143] Edited by: Viscount Hood on 25/10/2006 09:51:51 You could still fit WCS but have them turned off. Fit 2 but have only 1 activated. Your pvp option is to stay and fight, or turn on the WCS, loose your cap and run. and on the reverse side, fit two WCS for travelling in lo sec areas. You want to pvp so you turn them off. ------------------------------------------------
Luke Pubcrawler	Posted - 2006.10.25 10:52:00 - [144] Originally by: Viscount Hood Edited by: Viscount Hood on 25/10/2006 09:51:51 You could still fit WCS but have them turned off. Fit 2 but have only 1 activated. Your pvp option is to stay and fight, or turn on the WCS, loose your cap and run. and on the reverse side, fit two WCS for travelling in lo sec areas. You want to pvp so you turn them off. You wont be able to switch them on - it takes 95% cap which excluding a monir miracle you don't have. For the reasonably inexperienced player lowsec missioning and ratting are now things of the past. As another poster has already said expect lowsec to get even emptier. Far from the being best nerf CCP have ever made this might well be a strong contestant for the lamest.
Zarch AlDain Friends of Everyone	Posted - 2006.10.25 15:20:00 - [145] Overall I like the change - but I do agree that something should be done for mission runners. Mind you the 50% boost to HP might be that something :) I fit 2 stabs to my raven, you know why? Because all it takes is for you to release drones at the wrong time, or shoot something in slightly the wrong order, or breathe in the wrong direction, and an entire level 4 stage aggros on you. I have good skills and setup, but even so I need to warp out more often than not in that situation - and I know for a fact that I have warped out with scramblers on me more times than I can count. Hardly ever these days but a lot when I started running level 4s. Reducing the number of scramblers in missions, or spreading out the spawns so its harder to aggro the lot, something along those lines would definately help. But maybe the 50% extra HP is enough as it gives you those few extra seconds to kill the tacklers. Zarch AlDain
Demonus Gallente	Posted - 2006.10.25 18:06:00 - [146] *waits for ginger magician to post in here. --------------------
Commander Nikolas Gallente Arcana Imperii Ltd.	Posted - 2006.10.25 20:02:00 - [147] The changes will be a step in the right direction for WCS. Hopefully more penalties will be added.
Grey Area Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.26 18:42:00 - [148] Originally by: Commander Nikolas The changes will be a step in the right direction for WCS. Hopefully more penalties will be added. Get back under your bridge, Troll. Or rather, back to your gatecamp. --- Monty Pythons spoof of the EVE Forums; Palin: "Is this the right room for an argument?" Cleese: "I've told you once."
Grey Area Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.26 18:42:00 - [149] Originally by: Zarch AlDain Overall I like the change - but I do agree that something should be done for mission runners. Mind you the 50% boost to HP might be that something :) Not really...since the problem with the WCS is LOW SEC missions, it's pirates we worry about, not NPC's...and said pirates will ALSO get that HP boost. Even if they didn't...normally a mission runner doesn't get the luxury of firing back at a pirate. you get ECM'd to death and are slaughtered like a lamb. Originally by: Zarch AlDain I fit 2 stabs to my raven, you know why? Because all it takes is for you to release drones at the wrong time, or shoot something in slightly the wrong order, or breathe in the wrong direction, and an entire level 4 stage aggros on you. You know that. I know that. Whingy pirates neither know nor care. --- Monty Pythons spoof of the EVE Forums; Palin: "Is this the right room for an argument?" Cleese: "I've told you once."
Weirda Minmatar Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2006.10.26 19:09:00 - [150] Edited by: Weirda on 26/10/2006 19:12:22 perhaps miners could request in kali forum that lock range be boost significantly on mining barge to compensate. it is pretty obvious from the change that they only intend it to affect combat setups (probably including mission runner). as for hauler, Weirda don't really understand what all these hauler need to lock onto anyways. battle badger and q ship don't need wcs... so that leaves what? EDIT: oh yeah - tractor beam... sorry. well no reason not to ask for boost to lock range and speed for those as well (though no need for anything other then bunch sensor booster in mid really - oodle of cpu on the industrial ship). it is good change IWHO, there are obviously thing like barge lock range and such that need to be addressed. Weirda doesn't do that, but the people who do should bring it up there (if not already). seriously though, just trying to be constructive. __ Weirda Join QOTSA Now Stealth Bomber Tweaks



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