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Is Kali VOIP worth $10/yr?

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Dee Ellis	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:16:00 - [31] Originally by: Nate D This feature DOES NOT AFFECT LAG!... It is run on separate servers... Trust me... you can be completely lagged out in eve and still send and recieve voice comms just as if you were in the same room with the people... -Nate™ amd obviously the other way around too...
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:16:00 - [32] I would like to try it for a month, if thats possible? Otherwise yeah, ill pay $10. :) --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate

Xorus Forum Moderator Interstellar Services Department	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:17:00 - [33] The kali VOIP will easily be worth the $10 fee, the reason the quality is bad at present is because its running off the test server instead of a Vivox server just so they can work on client integration so ignore it if its bad :) --- Wanna Buy a Goat??- Tirg Member of the 'Kaemonn is My Hero' club Member of the "Immy's Bald Head Appreciation Society" Xorus is currenly off duty counting trees in Siberia. -Ivan K How much is that goaty in the window, baaa baaaa - Cortes (Secretary, Bald Head Appreciation Society) All your sig are belong to me - Tanis

Hllaxiu Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:20:00 - [34] Originally by: Nate D Originally by: Norris Neophitus Ok poor quality TS and ventrilo is generally due to poor hardware or poor setups. The price is cheap though im not certain on exact costs $10 a year is it? will be interesting to see if there is an option with GTC's considering the number of people using them lately. I'd personally prefer to have VoIP bandled in rather than a seperate client for it but unless you get like a 90%+ take up on it i think it will be crap and less fleixble than other options. Also isn't this a crazy idea considering the issues we have with lag right now and this will be just another thing to tie up the cycles and bandwith of our precious new servers. This feature DOES NOT AFFECT LAG!... It is run on separate servers... Trust me... you can be completely lagged out in eve and still send and recieve voice comms just as if you were in the same room with the people... -NateÖ And what happens then when your eve client is lagged because its single thread is too busy trying in futility to load a POS grid? --- Our greatest glory is not in never failing, but in rising up every time we fail. - Emerson
ZelRox Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:20:00 - [35] Originally by: Ethidium Bromide $10... where i live i get 7 litres of gas for that, that means my car goes for about 80km. so $10 for a year, even if it's a totally wasted purchase, is nothing. Get a better car :D I can drive 100-120km on the same amount :P ---------------------- BiH 4tw
Saladin Minmatar V I R I I Center for Disease Creation	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:21:00 - [36] Well if its $10 per account then I will pass. I am not bothered by quality issues on TS and I do use Ventrillo ocassionally. I also like to be able to be doing some logistics duties on my alts while still being in TS in case I am needed. Its not about the additional cost, but I dont see a reason to pay for something I will seldom use.
Nate D Priory of Saints	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:22:00 - [37] Originally by: Dee Ellis Originally by: Nate D This feature DOES NOT AFFECT LAG!... It is run on separate servers... Trust me... you can be completely lagged out in eve and still send and recieve voice comms just as if you were in the same room with the people... -NateÖ amd obviously the other way around too... Yeah sure... but going back to the TS/Vent stuff... Voice lag is more likely to happen on a personal comp that powers TS/Vent rather than occuring on Vivox's dedicated super servers... I win, -NateÖ --- Voice Chat/Vivox Post-Fanfest Update Still waiting for CCP to hire me...! Don't worry... SoonÖ
Hertford Ars Caelestis Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:24:00 - [38] Can the VoIP be told to use a USB headset for recording and playback, whilst the main client continues to use the main soundcard?
Harisdrop Gallente ClanKillers Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:24:00 - [39] The best part is that most players will get it and those that dont wont be in the new EVE. We all make choices. Adapt. Originally by: Dwight Hammerhead . Just because Kali is already in testing. If CCP were actually concerned about what ppl think they would of opened it up for discussion.
Xelios Minmatar Rampage Eternal Ka-Tet	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:25:00 - [40] Yeah I'd spend $10 a year. Even if I only end up using it once a month I'd spend $10 a year. Hell I spend more on wax for my skiis and I only go skiing a half dozen times...

Nate D Priory of Saints	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:25:00 - [41] Originally by: Hllaxiu And what happens then when your eve client is lagged because its single thread is too busy trying in futility to load a POS grid? That's your own (crappy) comps fault ... there will be NO server lag. -NateÖ Originally by: Saladin Well if its $10 per account then I will pass. I am not bothered by quality issues on TS and I do use Ventrillo ocassionally. I also like to be able to be doing some logistics duties on my alts while still being in TS in case I am needed. Its not about the additional cost, but I dont see a reason to pay for something I will seldom use. You will have 1 voice account that you can use on any char/account. -NateÖ --- Voice Chat/Vivox Post-Fanfest Update Still waiting for CCP to hire me...! Don't worry... SoonÖ
Nate D Priory of Saints	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:26:00 - [42] Originally by: Hertford Can the VoIP be told to use a USB headset for recording and playback, whilst the main client continues to use the main soundcard? Not currently... This must be changed for even me to subscribe to it... but as it is a pretty important feature I'm sure it will be added before the release. -NateÖ --- Voice Chat/Vivox Post-Fanfest Update Still waiting for CCP to hire me...! Don't worry... SoonÖ
Hertford Ars Caelestis Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:28:00 - [43] Originally by: Nate D Originally by: Hertford Can the VoIP be told to use a USB headset for recording and playback, whilst the main client continues to use the main soundcard? Not currently... This must be changed for even me to subscribe to it... but as it is a pretty important feature I'm sure it will be added before the release. -NateÖ At least it's a known issue then, because it will be a dealbreaker for me. The whole reason I spent on a USB headset was to pipe voice comms, and only voice comms to it, which is a doddle to setup for Vent and TS.
Twilight Moon Minmatar Malicious Intentions	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:31:00 - [44] Originally by: Jim McGregor I would like to try it for a month, if thats possible? Otherwise yeah, ill pay $10. :) Mm. A trial would be nice. If it is indeed good quality, well presented and laid out, and with a decent amount of extra options (like TS does) then, yeah, I'd pay $10 a year. Just don't shaft us UK people with a ú10 charge. If its $10 for one group of people, it should be $10 for all. (Empty Space - Thinking)
Takigama Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:32:00 - [45] The are a couple of things that bother me about the whole thing, yes its great cause its integrated but... The thing that bothers me alot about the whole external subscription based thing is the way eve has worked to date. One of the things that did really draw me to it originally was the fact it was always just a one-off (monthly) fee. 10$ a year is practically 0 so the cost doesnt bother me, but looking at other mmo's i've been in one thing that always hurt was published (and not-for-free) expansions. They always tended to hurt the guild you were in cause you could guarantee that someone wouldnt get it and they'd leave due to not having anyone to "play with" cause everyone was playing with the "new stuff". The point i was trying to make though is that up until now having an eve account meant you had all the tools at your disposal (from a ccp/eve-onoline perspective) that everyone else in game had. Which is quite a big (attractive) bonus really. The second thing is there are not a small number of people out there who are using GTC's (either cause they dont have a credit card, or they earn enough in-game that it covers them). Lastly there's those players out there that dont have access to TS/ventrillo/etc, dont really get why people use it and giving them access to it would probably change their entire perspective of the game really (something they may not pay for cause they thing "i'd never use that"). I dont fall into any of the above categories, and i dont think it'd hurt the game at all if it was implemented as a yearly fee, but the one-payment-covers-all deal is just such an attractive part of the eve landscape. As for how does it compare to TS/Ventrillo in terms of performance and cost? well, i dont know why people keep saying it sounds better because i dont think it does personally, but $10 vs $3 (2.7c/day vs 0.8c/day), well no matter how you look at, $7 a year difference is hard to care about
Allen Deckard Gallente WTB Supplies	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:34:00 - [46] Edited by: Allen Deckard on 13/11/2006 16:36:42 Originally by: Skraelingz The voice quality on TS makes me want to punch babies. The voice quality on ts is usually determined by the quality settings of the server it's put on and the up/down load speeds how many are on it and the up/down speeds of the clients. Our ts is as good as a land line telephone. Then again it's on t1 along with most all that are using it. Like to add that the only problem that I see with it is that if EVERYONE doesnt have it it's worthless. Or at a min if everyone that is in your circle of friends.
Dee Ellis	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:34:00 - [47] Originally by: Nate D amd obviously the other way around too... Yeah sure... but going back to the TS/Vent stuff... Voice lag is more likely to happen on a personal comp that powers TS/Vent rather than occuring on Vivox's dedicated super servers... I win, -Nate™ Indeed, my 100/100 line often has problems with lag . COUGH

Xorus Forum Moderator Interstellar Services Department	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:36:00 - [48] Originally by: Twilight Moon If it is indeed good quality, well presented and laid out, and with a decent amount of extra options (like TS does) Its feature list will be larger than any other VOIP app can claim, full EVE integration means no more having to remember IP's and passwords for servers ever again, no longer will you get people hopping in to your channel unannounced unless its a public channel as if you're in gang only gang members can join the channel, integration with the map means you'll be able to see where the person who's talking is, i have faith in this and i will be paying to use it to my advantage in kali :) --- Wanna Buy a Goat??- Tirg Member of the 'Kaemonn is My Hero' club Member of the "Immy's Bald Head Appreciation Society" Xorus is currenly off duty counting trees in Siberia. -Ivan K How much is that goaty in the window, baaa baaaa - Cortes (Secretary, Bald Head Appreciation Society) All your sig are belong to me - Tanis

Takigama Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:37:00 - [49] Originally by: Nate D Originally by: Hertford Can the VoIP be told to use a USB headset for recording and playback, whilst the main client continues to use the main soundcard? Not currently... This must be changed for even me to subscribe to it... but as it is a pretty important feature I'm sure it will be added before the release. -NateÖ Personally, i'll get it either way, but that and the vox-only (i.e. no push-to-talk) are the only things it really absolutely must have.
Taram Caldar Caldari Acheron Vanguard Armada The Shadow Ascension	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:38:00 - [50] Edited by: Taram Caldar on 13/11/2006 16:40:18 I won't pay for this service. Bottom line: It won't be useful to our alliance as we already have a dedicated Ventrillo (and a separate TS Server as well) Server. We have no need for a system that people can't connect to when they're not in the game. We use Vent/TS not just because it's voice comms, and not just because it's free (relatively speaking) but also because it allows people to connect and keep up on what's going on even when not in game or while in an entirely different game so that if we're needed we can be asked to hop back in game. It just doesn't seem to me that this VOIP solution offers me anything that we don't already have with Vent/TS. We already have unit/task/org specific channels and means to switch between them easily. So what exactly do we gain for $10 a year? Nothing. there's no added value to this service over what we already get (for free for alliance members) from our Vent / TS servers. One of the things I've been curious about is how does CCP justify, in their minds, charging extra for a VOIP system when two other games already offer the same service free of charge to their subscribers (PlanetSide and DDO). And DDO uses the same 'expansions are free' methodology as EVE as well. EVE is far superior to those titles but I still don't see what justifies asking us for $10 a year for a service that isn't as useful as what we already get for less from a Ventrillo or TS server.

Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:38:00 - [51] Originally by: Takigama I dont fall into any of the above categories, and i dont think it'd hurt the game at all if it was implemented as a yearly fee, but the one-payment-covers-all deal is just such an attractive part of the eve landscape. Or better yet, as a part of the subscription. But we rabbled quite a lot about that before with no results. But I still think its a good idea. Raise the monthly from $15 to $16 and be done with it... --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Nate D Priory of Saints	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:38:00 - [52] Originally by: Takigama As for how does it compare to TS/Ventrillo in terms of performance and cost? well, i dont know why people keep saying it sounds better because i dont think it does personally... The reason it doesn't sound better is because it's running of the test server and not the vivox servers... When it comes down to it... your opinion of the sound quality is... wrong... because factually it will be better. -NateÖ --- Voice Chat/Vivox Post-Fanfest Update Still waiting for CCP to hire me...! Don't worry... SoonÖ
Dee Ellis	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:39:00 - [53] Originally by: Xorus Its feature list will be larger than any other VOIP app can claim, full EVE integration means no more having to remember IP's and passwords for servers ever again, no longer will you get people hopping in to your channel unannounced unless its a public channel as if you're in gang only gang members can join the channel, integration with the map means you'll be able to see where the person who's talking is, i have faith in this and i will be paying to use it to my advantage in kali :) You do know we have the ability to save IPs and such, right? Also, a good leader holds the channels clean, and also use passwords ( which can be saved ) Aaand, inally, to save $10 / year, I can ASK where people are, just like I have until now. Cooome on, someone merit $10 for something I already have free..
Horsefly Alcatraz Inc. Tactical Narcotics Team	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:50:00 - [54] Heres the Good points about the in-game voice thingy, 1. Dont have to ask several times for the vent/TS IP address. 2. Dont have to register for other corps/alliance servers. 3. All fancy with the muting and commander channels Things bad with the in-game voice thingy, 1. New people to the whole VoIP thing will shy away and have no real way of "testing" out the stuff to see if its worth it to them, before buying. That is the major problem. How do you convince somone that has never used it before that this is essential for combat and such operations. 2. Cant use this for other games such as I use TS to while taking a break from eve and if someone in eve needs something they always know where to find me. No long available. Thats about all I can think of right now. I am really for this but its the whole question of is everyone gonna go? And if not then its back to the TS server cause you cant have mixed communications. Doesnt work.
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:50:00 - [55] Originally by: Twilight Moon Originally by: Xorus integration with the map means you'll be able to see where the person who's talking is, i have faith in this and i will be paying to use it to my advantage in kali :) Map integration and all....hmm...I can see alliances liking that. No more joining a TS channel and gang and announcing you're in a fleet op, when you're really 32 jumps jumps away happily mining Arkanor, like 1/2 the wastrels in ASCN did...not that I'm bitter. Yeah, I didnt think of that, but this actually comes with a Big Brother alert... --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Khajit Smitty Minmatar MisFunk Inc.	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:51:00 - [56] Edited by: Khajit Smitty on 13/11/2006 16:52:32 Edited by: Khajit Smitty on 13/11/2006 16:51:47 Originally by: Nate D Future Features OOG Communication Taken from your thread Nate D, so do tell when is this future feature slated for release ?? Personally i will subscribe to this service as the charge is fairly insignificant HOWEVER during ops i will continue to use vent, Ouf of game comms is vital considering the number of CTD's,LAG crashes, node crashes etc etc that occur when travelling around in a gang. Im not referring to myself just with what i have seen in my time in eve. I still cannot fathom how Out of Game comms was left out of this release, surely they want they community to adopt this feature and a great way would be to provide a replacement to ts/vent aswell as all the new nify kewl gang features. To often i hop onto vent to find out whats going on or just chat in general, and what about those long extended ops where everyone logs for an hour to grab food ?? am i going to have to resort to using MSN to communicate with my gang mates so we can co-ordinate and get going again without leaving people behind. The idea is great, however it still lacks that grab factor!!! And talking like a minmatar slave dog is not a grab factor for me.
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:53:00 - [57] Originally by: Horsefly That is the major problem. How do you convince somone that has never used it before that this is essential for combat and such operations. One solution would be if one hour was included in the subscription every month. Would allow people to try it and see how it works before buying. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Crumplecorn Gallente Aerial Boundaries Inc. Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:56:00 - [58] To summarise the 'anti' side: "The voice chat is bad because I don't know what it will offer, think it will have limitations which it actually won't, and refuse to pay the bank-breaking figure of $10 a year for something I won't be using 24/7." ---------- IBTL \o/
Harisdrop Gallente ClanKillers Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:57:00 - [59] Vivox will change EVE just like ingame Alliances did. We all needed it but did not realize what it will do to us. As this time approaches: we will be able to recruit better. converse with people that we need to discuss business dealings with meet people that we normally wont not have a chance with. a solar system with 70 in it might actually become very small and friendships will become the norm you wont be in an alliance because of what you can do for yourself but the idea of what the alliance is you wont be in a corp you disagree with on principle and practice. We all will migrate to people that we can stand. Originally by: Dwight Hammerhead . Just because Kali is already in testing. If CCP were actually concerned about what ppl think they would of opened it up for discussion.
Taram Caldar Caldari Acheron Vanguard Armada The Shadow Ascension	Posted - 2006.11.13 16:59:00 - [60] Edited by: Taram Caldar on 13/11/2006 17:03:16 Originally by: Crumplecorn To summarise the 'anti' side: "The voice chat is bad because I don't know what it will offer, think it will have limitations which it actually won't, and refuse to pay the bank-breaking figure of $10 a year for something I won't be using 24/7." Nope My summary: The $10/month option is 'bad' because not everyone in my alliance will use it. Matter of fact even fewer will use it than use the Ventrillo option (which is free to them) now. Because not only do they not like using voice they don't want to pay to use it either. For every 1 fewer person on voice that's one person that it's harder to communicate with. No matter how AWESOME the features are you can't tell me that alliances will have an easy time convincing all their members to pony up an additional $10 a year to pay for VOIP when they already get it free from alliance TS/Vent servers. Not to mention that they have already stated that you cannot use the VOIP when the game client is off. Which means you have to be in game to use it. dunno about you but our members connect even when not in EVE to keep up on what's going on. I personally hop on it even if I'm just playing VTM or some other single player so if something pops I can hop on to help out. I'm not against in game VOIP... I just don't see where it's worth an extra $0.85 a month for the game. It offers some nice features but it also takes away a few as well. It also means that fewer (not more) alliance members will be using it. I just don't see enough players opting to pay around $1 a month extra for a feature that most of them just don't need 90%+ of the time to make it worth having. If our leaders decide to turn off the Vent servers and use this I'll probably pick it up. But I know a lot of people that just won't use voice if that happens.



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