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Is Kali VOIP worth $10/yr?

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Hurgrin Kanso	Posted - 2006.11.13 19:04:00 - [91] Just as a thought to those who say 'I got Voice Chat for free, i host it on my spare PC/whatever'.. if you take the cost for electricity etc you actualy pay ALOT more then $10/year or then just renting a TS Server. Just as an example.. in Oklahoma, the price per Kilowatt ranges from 3 - 5 cent per Kwh (Kilowatt/hour). If you have TS/Ventrilo running on a spare PC (350W PSU), for 18h/Day and 350 Days/Year (just an estimate for Downtime, Network failure, Power outages, Vacations, etc) you still pay $88 per Year. Taking a Kwh price of $0.04 (4 cent/kwh). This doesnt incluce the Monitor (not realy needed for running a Server anyways).
Joshua Foiritain Gallente Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2006.11.13 19:06:00 - [92] Edited by: Joshua Foiritain on 13/11/2006 19:07:18 Originally by: Hurgrin Kanso Just as a thought to those who say 'I got Voice Chat for free, i host it on my spare PC/whatever'.. if you take the cost for electricity etc you actualy pay ALOT more then $10/year or then just renting a TS Server. Just as an example.. in Oklahoma, the price per Kilowatt ranges from 3 - 5 cent per Kwh (Kilowatt/hour). If you have TS/Ventrilo running on a spare PC (350W PSU), for 18h/Day and 350 Days/Year (just an estimate for Downtime, Network failure, Power outages, Vacations, etc) you still pay $88 per Year. Taking a Kwh price of $0.04 (4 cent/kwh). This doesnt incluce the Monitor (not realy needed for running a Server anyways). So 88 / 100 = more then 10? Nice Math ----- [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
Dee Ellis	Posted - 2006.11.13 19:11:00 - [93] Originally by: Laythun WOW somply amazing. You guys are *****ing about 10 dollars a year?? how tha hell do u pay for eve?? $10 is almost nothing. It's extra on top of the already rather hefty bill (Hefty for a game that is obviously) And very much so as it's WAY more than other programs with the same function charges. The issues I can see is 1) New people without it.. 2) Corps can't function properly if everyone doesn't have it, leading to issues over such stupid things. 3) Casuals in corps with it will feel cheated.. Personally I say that they should lower the price a bit, for the sake of integrating it into the monthly fee instead. Lower is to bring away the 33333333's. If not for anything else only for the sake of casuals and those who quit. Who seriously want to pay 12months worth of usage if they're going to play for 2... Same goes with those who have odd works and can't play every month.. Would you want to pay for 12 when you can use 3? Or if you want to take a break? And. So. Forth.
Hydraxian Gallente Momentum.	Posted - 2006.11.13 19:15:00 - [94] $10... meh thats only just over ú5, less than a couple of pints of good beer......
Hurgrin Kanso	Posted - 2006.11.13 19:23:00 - [95] Of course, if you have a 100 Slot Server running, probably 99 of your user will get it for free. Who is going to bother to send a check for a couple of cent every month?
Taram Caldar Caldari Acheron Vanguard Armada The Shadow Ascension	Posted - 2006.11.13 19:24:00 - [96] Originally by: Hurgrin Kanso Just as a thought to those who say 'I got Voice Chat for free, i host it on my spare PC/whatever'.. if you take the cost for electricity etc you actualy pay ALOT more then $10/year or then just renting a TS Server. Just as an example.. in Oklahoma, the price per Kilowatt ranges from 3 - 5 cent per Kwh (Kilowatt/hour). If you have TS/Ventrilo running on a spare PC (350W PSU), for 18h/Day and 350 Days/Year (just an estimate for Downtime, Network failure, Power outages, Vacations, etc) you still pay $88 per Year. Taking a Kwh price of $0.04 (4 cent/kwh). This doesnt incluce the Monitor (not realy needed for running a Server anyways). And that 1 server hosts up to 1,000 other people Or that 1,000 other people can pay $10/year each $10,000/year Not that I care... $10/year is, as you said, not a big price. But I do have an issue with CCP deliberately running a service scam. They're charging over 1,000% more for their service than the competition. And it just isn't that much better. Like I said, that's not my major issue though Major issues: 1) Not everyone will get it, thus it becomes less useful the fewer people who use it in the alliance the less useful it is. 2) It cannot be used outside the game (yes it's a "future" feature... for 2008... sorry then don't release it till 2008. If I CTD I do NOT want to lose comms) 3) It adds overhead to the CLIENT... it won't affect SERVER lag but you can bet your tukas that slower systems will feel it client-side. Those are my 3 big gripes with it. And until I'm convinced enough people in my alliance are using it to bother then I won't be forking out $10/year for it. Sure it's not a lot. But I already get nickle and dimed to death enough out here in the real world where some of us pay bills, mortgages, car payments, etc. Bottom line isn't the price it's the fact that Vent is more useful right now. I don't care if I can see where some dude is on the map. How often are you flying around with the friggen map open in combat?
Syril Mert Dawn of a new Empire Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.11.13 19:25:00 - [97] For me living in 0.0 space with lots of people from different alliances an integrated VOIP will be very usefull. Imagine jumping into a system, seeing one friendly and a couple of hostiles in local. With TS or ventrillo you will have to spend a lot of time login in/finding each others channel/typing info in a convo. With the new system you can have voice coms in a matter of seconds. If people use this it's going to be a life(ship) saver :) I realise 10$ is a lot of money to some people, but for me it wouldn't even be worth my time calculating and comparing the cost to TS. :)
Hurgrin Kanso	Posted - 2006.11.13 19:35:00 - [98] Originally by: Taram Caldar Originally by: Hurgrin Kanso Just as a thought to those who say 'I got Voice Chat for free, i host it on my spare PC/whatever'.. if you take the cost for electricity etc you actualy pay ALOT more then $10/year or then just renting a TS Server. Just as an example.. in Oklahoma, the price per Kilowatt ranges from 3 - 5 cent per Kwh (Kilowatt/hour). If you have TS/Ventrilo running on a spare PC (350W PSU), for 18h/Day and 350 Days/Year (just an estimate for Downtime, Network failure, Power outages, Vacations, etc) you still pay $88 per Year. Taking a Kwh price of $0.04 (4 cent/kwh). This doesnt incluce the Monitor (not realy needed for running a Server anyways). And that 1 server hosts up to 1,000 other people Or that 1,000 other people can pay $10/year each $10,000/year Not that I care... $10/year is, as you said, not a big price. But I do have an issue with CCP deliberately running a service scam. They're charging over 1,000% more for their service than the competition. And it just isn't that much better. Like I said, that's not my major issue though Major issues: 1) Not everyone will get it, thus it becomes less useful the fewer people who use it in the alliance the less useful it is. 2) It cannot be used outside the game (yes it's a "future" feature... for 2008... sorry then don't release it till 2008. If I CTD I do NOT want to lose comms) 3) It adds overhead to the CLIENT... it won't affect SERVER lag but you can bet your tukas that slower systems will feel it client-side. Those are my 3 big gripes with it. And until I'm convinced enough people in my alliance are using it to bother then I won't be forking out $10/year for it. Sure it's not a lot. But I already get nickle and dimed to death enough out here in the real world where some of us pay bills, mortgages, car payments, etc. Bottom line isn't the price it's the fact that Vent is more useful right now. I don't care if I can see where some dude is on the map. How often are you flying around with the friggen map open in combat? I deliberatly didnt put any figures about the individual cost per user in. The end result would still the same.. whoever runs the Server, still pays for it. Personaly, i m curious whats going to happen with the 3 issues you noted. Especialy 'out of game' communication will be.. erm.. difficult. As you said, and i agree, older Systems will probably have a hard time.
Harisdrop Gallente ClanKillers Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2006.11.13 19:40:00 - [99] Soo to host 25,000 players would cost how much? Hmmm I would think that owner of that would want what $10 a year to pay cost. Hey why not allow it to integrate with the game that would be cool. I think if you started your own TS service and offer you IP across the world and allow everyone on then there would be no problems. You guys are whining cause your select group of players might want to be part of Vivox Then you wont be able to tell if players in the alliance are on then you have to be on TS and vent soo we can control them. Originally by: Dwight Hammerhead . Just because Kali is already in testing. If CCP were actually concerned about what ppl think they would of opened it up for discussion.
Fi T'Zeh Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.11.13 19:54:00 - [100] Please link me to the part where it says I can talk on this VoIP when my client has crashed. I'm geniunely interested in this because apart from this enourmous flaw, i do like the look of the system. .... Real men use blasters
Lienzo	Posted - 2006.11.13 20:14:00 - [101] No Vent/TS host I have ever known has let me donate money to offset expenses before. =( I will still rely on oog comms for corp things, but I will buy this for no other reason than to talk like a cheesy mobster to people in channels. I think it will be good for EVE. I may have to buy a better mouse for more ptt keys.
Harisdrop Gallente ClanKillers Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2006.11.13 20:17:00 - [102] Originally by: Syril Mert For me living in 0.0 space with lots of people from different alliances an integrated VOIP will be very usefull. Imagine jumping into a system, seeing one friendly and a couple of hostiles in local. With TS or ventrillo you will have to spend a lot of time login in/finding each others channel/typing info in a convo. With the new system you can have voice coms in a matter of seconds. If people use this it's going to be a life(ship) saver :) I realise 10$ is a lot of money to some people, but for me it wouldn't even be worth my time calculating and comparing the cost to TS. :) What happens if your alliance says you must be on TS and not Vivox? Will you have Vivox and TS up? Why does it matter if you dont have voice comms if your characters are not ingame again. If you want to play WOW why are you worried about EVE except to keep in touch. Use TS. I am not saying that vivox will replace every aspect of your RL comms. I know guys that have 5 external chat program windows open while playing EVE. What would be different is that now there will be easy access to intergame communication. If you are in a system with a war target and you open a chat and you talk to him. You guys can actually converse not with any restrictions. Consider the next gate is a bunch of gate campers. You chat with one and say you will pay to pass or ask why. I think EVE becomes real inter comss.. Welcome to reality of mass player comms. Wooot Originally by: Dwight Hammerhead . Just because Kali is already in testing. If CCP were actually concerned about what ppl think they would of opened it up for discussion.
Gariuys Evil Strangers Inc.	Posted - 2006.11.13 20:42:00 - [103] If they do the integration right. And I'm betting they will. This will completely block your socks off. Coupled with the new gang system etc. OMG, and besides 10$ a year is nothing. And I really don't care that that is 1.5mil a year if everybody starts using it... hmmm.
Ed Gein Dark Blade Incorporated Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2006.11.13 20:45:00 - [104] Originally by: Skraelingz The voice quality on TS makes me want to punch babies. lol -------------------------------------------------------------- What do you call the person that brings a gun to a knife fight? The Winner.
Miki Fin Gallente Independant Union of Rangers	Posted - 2006.11.13 20:47:00 - [105] Originally by: Nate D Originally by: Miki Fin What I want to know is how the voice chat will be billed? Will it be a one off $10 charge that will cover all of your accounts or will it be restricted to only one, so you have to pay $10 per account? You will pay for 1 voice account and you can use that voice account with any eve char/account. -NateÖ So how does it differentiate which character, when your using multiple charcters?
Saladin Minmatar V I R I I Center for Disease Creation	Posted - 2006.11.13 20:49:00 - [106] I think Harisdrop more or less hit the nail on the head. Alliances will still require TS/Vent participation because people can use it while they are afk or another game and can still be summoned. It will also let people communicate when they are on an alt that is not in the alliance. Things like "Sugar Daddy" alts are very private and most would not want to be in alliance voice coms as one. In addition, as the server drops or fails, TS/Vent will remain unaffected and people will be able to trade information on whethere they can enter the game again. In other words TS/Vent provides many features, has been around for a long time, and is independent of EvE and any performance/downtime. This makes TS/Vent a must for alliances. Now as for Vivox, it has advantages too, it allows quick voice coms with people not in your alliance. It could be mates from a corp or alliance you were in long ago, it could be pirates, or it could be a potential trade partner. I know I would enjoy talking to other Egyptians in EvE without worrying about what the server admin for the alliance server will say. Finding a server that would take all of us (we have very divergent allegiances in game) can sometimes be a chore. So in short, for alliances TS/Vent will remain the standard and Vivox will be with people not in your alliance. ----
Niccolado Starwalker Syncore Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.11.13 21:49:00 - [107] I am for sure going to get it, and I am going to take full advantage of its features. I predict whinings coming up that those with EVE voice have an unfavorably advantage over the ones who dont Honesly, I almost dont get a chocolate for 0.85 dollar here in Norway!
Nate D Priory of Saints	Posted - 2006.11.13 22:16:00 - [108] Originally by: Miki Fin Originally by: Nate D Originally by: Miki Fin What I want to know is how the voice chat will be billed? Will it be a one off $10 charge that will cover all of your accounts or will it be restricted to only one, so you have to pay $10 per account? You will pay for 1 voice account and you can use that voice account with any eve char/account. -NateÖ So how does it differentiate which character, when your using multiple charcters? It doesn't have to know which character you're using because it's whatever character is currently logged into the voice account. -NateÖ --- Voice Chat/Vivox Post-Fanfest Update Still waiting for CCP to hire me...! Don't worry... SoonÖ
Nelix Trist Caldari Nostromo Industries	Posted - 2006.11.13 22:18:00 - [109] I'm buying it! End of! - You cant beat it! Its just amasing. Emm?"Cant touch this" den der der dum, der dum der dum KILLING THE BUG'S, BEFORE THEY KILL YOU Un-nerfing you sig is bad mmmmkay - Xorus RAWRRR!111 - Immy-Poos
Skraelingz Gallente Gallente Federal Bank Ratel Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.13 23:09:00 - [110] Edited by: Skraelingz on 13/11/2006 23:10:58 Originally by: Hurgrin Kanso Just as a thought to those who say 'I got Voice Chat for free, i host it on my spare PC/whatever'.. if you take the cost for electricity etc you actualy pay ALOT more then $10/year or then just renting a TS Server. Just as an example.. in Oklahoma, the price per Kilowatt ranges from 3 - 5 cent per Kwh (Kilowatt/hour). If you have TS/Ventrilo running on a spare PC (350W PSU), for 18h/Day and 350 Days/Year (just an estimate for Downtime, Network failure, Power outages, Vacations, etc) you still pay $88 per Year. Taking a Kwh price of $0.04 (4 cent/kwh). This doesnt incluce the Monitor (not realy needed for running a Server anyways). your computer isnt using the whole 350W ALL the time, heck if your maxing out your psu just running ts/vent you have bigger problems. -----------------------------------------------
Miv333 Caldari Dark-Rising	Posted - 2006.11.13 23:28:00 - [111] Originally by: evistin Edited by: evistin on 13/11/2006 15:45:15 This is really expensive, honsetly. Costing for both TS and vent are less then $3 per year per person on the very large setups. Thats about $7 more. Now I admit I said I would consider paying $1 a month, but I do not see anything currently that makes it worth that $1 to a $0.30 cent. Yes there are some nice features, but voice stops when the client is closed. That means I can't talk to friends during DT, or when I can't log into Eve. Granted this is the problem of every ingame voip system. But honsetly, I have only seen just a few features that really make it stand out. Maybe the voice quality is low for testing purposes, but I think Vent does better. What do you guys think? I personally will get it still. as a CEO I might need to talk to other CEO who use it. i dont like it i'd rather they put the hardware towards servers being less laggy etc
Alexi Borizkova Caldari New Age Solutions	Posted - 2006.11.13 23:31:00 - [112] As a CEO the call to use the new ingame voice or not is a hard one for me. On one hand, it's functionality is interesting, but it puts me in the position of having to dictate which voice comms we use. The call to use TS not ventrilo was easy, but having to tell people they HAVE to log onto teamspeak to participate in official corp events, or HAVE to use the ingame both bother me. On the other hand, it isn't fair for me to have to tell my people to either spend their real life money on a service they might not want to participate with us, or to waste much of the value of the service they are already paying for and want to use. I am hoping for some corporate rate option, or similiar affair of SOME sort, that lets me find a way to provide the ingame benefits of the voice comm without having to tell my people how to do things in the real world. Admittedly it is just 10$ but the principal is what bothers me, and there WILL have to be a decision made on what system to stick with and use, and we have to abandon for the most part the other to maintain unity and communication. I don't know what could be done to remedy this, really, except adding some limited functionality for members of a corp with subscribing members (like using only channels that are official corp/alliance ones, or in corp started gangs). All in all, it just puts me in a position I don't care for, and makes me resent the system being p2p. Quite frankly, I wouldn't have been sad at all if they had scrapped the project. Especially since it being tied ot the client's stability means we will probably have ot maintain a TS server as well, regardless. In Corporate Caldari, taxes pay YOU.
G'Kar Nomad	Posted - 2006.11.13 23:33:00 - [113] Not worth any additional monthly fee at all, especially when you consider you could use Ventrillo or Teamspeak for free!
Royaldo KVA Noble Inc. THE H0RDE	Posted - 2006.11.13 23:36:00 - [114] why would i ever pay for something i get for free? with better quality?
Ender Wiggens VentureCorp	Posted - 2006.11.14 00:59:00 - [115] If $10 a year is too much to afford for an awesome in game voice service that will help expand the world of eve, and make fleet battles even better, you really need to a. get a new job. or b. stop being so cheap. Come on....
Cmdr Sp0ck Gallente Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed	Posted - 2006.11.14 01:14:00 - [116] Edited by: Cmdr Sp0ck on 14/11/2006 01:15:19 In the end it all depends on the funcionality CCP puts in to it. ATM as i have seen it, it's not very practical tbh. I'd rather see a seperate "control window" for voice communications where you could control the channel you are in, control speech rights, have a "channel commander" option like in TS where you can have commanders talking to each other only... Stuff like that and more which, at first glance, the current system lacks. As is, it's just a added "start voice convo" option to an existing written chat channel. And that isn't much of an advantage in itself, for the obvious reasons already stated in other posts. Taking fleet battles as an example: You have a fleet of 3x gangs. Each gang has a voice channel which corresponds to the gang chat channel as well. How do the commanders of the 3 gangs + Fleet commander communicate among themselves? If CCP fails on funcionality as well as voice quality, their VOIP system will fail miserably as noone will really use it. IMHO.
Allantia Caldari FW Inc	Posted - 2006.11.14 01:22:00 - [117] If they deliver all of the promised functionality (being able to use it OOG, mainly) at good voice quality and without adding to much client-side overhead, yeah, it would be worth it. I don't like the way it's being implemented though. It should be all or nothing - just increase the monthly rate by 50 cents and let everybody have it. If only half or 3/4 of your gang/corp/alliance has it, then it's worthless. It would be one thing if the people who choose not to get it could at least listen (AFAIK that isn't planned?), but since they can't basically any op involving someone without it forces you to go to TS/Vent.
evistin Multiverse Corporation	Posted - 2006.11.14 01:52:00 - [118] After reading everything, its clear we hard no hard proof. As a CEO, I can'r order my guys to spend their RL money. This fact alone means My guys will be spilt between Vent or Viox. I know people are complaining its $10/yr not a lot of cash. Why don't you give $5 a year to the man who pays for the 1,000 man server for your alliance instead? Won't you rather see a RL friend benfit verus a company who you do not know? quality is on the test server, so we will need to wait till we are on the vioix system to see that. ----------- Management and Leadership
Cerui Tarshiel Minmatar Blind Dumb Deafened	Posted - 2006.11.14 02:23:00 - [119] Am I the only one who heard the guy from Vivox answearing the question someone put forth (think it was Seleene, not sure though) about being able to pay for corp the whole corp instead of individual? As for the TS/Vent of Vivox argument I honestly think they will coexist as from what I've seen it only works for player created channels and gangs and you need something for a backup. Having said that it looks, if it indeed works well, that using the integrated voice coms will be the way forward in gangs, especially with the integration into the new gang system. P.s. for the big brother esque option to see on the map where the person speaking is it's already in the kali code possible for ceo's (and I assume directors) to see where corp members are and in what ships they are.
Thor Xian Vertigo One E.A.R.T.H. Federation	Posted - 2006.11.14 03:20:00 - [120] If you can obtain it at the corp/alliance level, there is no reason not to use it. If it is only available on an individual basis...worthless. ~Thor Xian, Material Defender What is your opinion?

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