Originally by: Phrixus Zephyr

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So wheres the man with the violin?

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Originally by: Shin Ra

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but in WWI they may have played footie on Xmas for a while, but they also continually lined up and mowed eachother down with machine guns - much like modern day eve fleet fights.

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Originally by: Shin Ra

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but in WWI they may have played footie on Xmas for a while, but they also continually lined up and mowed eachother down with machine guns - much like modern day eve fleet fights.

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Originally by: Ysabelle nKataros

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What have you got if you ain't got no respect?

This is a thread for the respect that seems to have fallen out of the bottom of every other thread where trolling, flaming or paranoia have overwhelmed its presence. I went into this war with a very high opinion of ASCN's dedication and achievements and for the majority of its membership I still hold that opinion. ASCN, you have dared to bring the fight to us, you have battled tooth and nail where other alliances have crumbled and faded. No matter that the war has proceeded largely along the lines expected, I doubt any other would have taken half the beating you have and yet still be throwing themselves into the fray. To you, the pilots of the line who have given your ships and pods and your time to the defense of your lands, I salute you.

Throughout the (many) pages of discussion this war has spawned, I have seen snippets and flashes of the respect each side has for the other. For those pilots that are unable to respond mutually, I ask that you leave this thread to those that do; despite the minority who may have offended your principles or acted in a manner you condemn, there are many that would still kick the ball between the trenches on Christmas day, and shake the hand of the man they have been shooting at.

And so to you my comrades in BoB I offer thanks for starting this marvellous little scrap for my entertainment, and to ASCN for fighting the good fight.

See you in space.

---

Originally by: Nez Perces

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Originally by: Shin Ra

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but in WWI they may have played footie on Xmas for a while, but they also continually lined up and mowed eachother down with machine guns - much like modern day eve fleet fights.

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My grandfather was in the trenches in WW1.. keep RL out of this game pls.

To compare EVE in any way to the horror those men went through for our sake ... is banal to the extreme.

Sometime you people need to remember .. that what we are actually doing is sitting infront of a bleeding computer shooting at pixels .....thats it .. nothing more nothing less.

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Originally by: Shin Ra

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I suggest you keep your personal issues you have with me from prompting you to make such ludicrous allegations that what I'm saying is in some way trivial. Your entitled to your opinion, but insulting or even implying an insult another poster IS against the forums rules.

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Originally by: ShinRa

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but in WWI they may have played footie on Xmas for a while, but they also continually lined up and mowed eachother down with machine guns - much like modern day eve fleet fights

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Originally by: Nez Perces

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Get it through your head that I don't care about you... just keep RL out of it.. talk about military strategy till the sun comes down.....

Originally by: ShinRa

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but in WWI they may have played footie on Xmas for a while, but they also continually lined up and mowed eachother down with machine guns - much like modern day eve fleet fights

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that isnt military strategy within the context of the game... now is it?

Thats just a gratuitous, morose comparison.

i.e unnecessary

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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Originally by: Vily

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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Well said to be honest.

it is in real life as it is in eve.

you want my respect, expect to work for it.

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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Originally by: Verite Rendition

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Respect should be given. To claim that someone must earn it is just an excuse to dehumanize them by denying them respect.

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Quote:

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- Numbers alone do not win a battle
- No, but I bet they help.

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Originally by: Sadist

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Originally by: Verite Rendition

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Respect should be given. To claim that someone must earn it is just an excuse to dehumanize them by denying them respect.

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If you give everyone respect, what point is there in competition? If you accept that people must earn respect first, only the strong will actually do so. Also depends on what particular achievements you grow to respect, etc.

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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Originally by: Beringe

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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But courtesy is given. And lack of courtesy leads to lack of respect.

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Originally by: Ysabelle nKataros

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What have you got if you ain't got no respect?

This is a thread for the respect that seems to have fallen out of the bottom of every other thread where trolling, flaming or paranoia have overwhelmed its presence. I went into this war with a very high opinion of ASCN's dedication and achievements and for the majority of its membership I still hold that opinion. ASCN, you have dared to bring the fight to us, you have battled tooth and nail where other alliances have crumbled and faded. No matter that the war has proceeded largely along the lines expected, I doubt any other would have taken half the beating you have and yet still be throwing themselves into the fray. To you, the pilots of the line who have given your ships and pods and your time to the defense of your lands, I salute you.

Throughout the (many) pages of discussion this war has spawned, I have seen snippets and flashes of the respect each side has for the other. For those pilots that are unable to respond mutually, I ask that you leave this thread to those that do; despite the minority who may have offended your principles or acted in a manner you condemn, there are many that would still kick the ball between the trenches on Christmas day, and shake the hand of the man they have been shooting at.

And so to you my comrades in BoB I offer thanks for starting this marvellous little scrap for my entertainment, and to ASCN for fighting the good fight.

See you in space.

---

Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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Originally by: Cmd Woodlouse

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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The only real unnecessity in this thread is your reply, Mrs. Molly.

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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Originally by: elbenito

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The problem with large fleet engagements is that the hamsters stop to watch.

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Originally by: Ysabelle nKataros

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What have you got if you ain't got no respect?

This is a thread for the respect that seems to have fallen out of the bottom of every other thread where trolling, flaming or paranoia have overwhelmed its presence. I went into this war with a very high opinion of ASCN's dedication and achievements and for the majority of its membership I still hold that opinion. ASCN, you have dared to bring the fight to us, you have battled tooth and nail where other alliances have crumbled and faded. No matter that the war has proceeded largely along the lines expected, I doubt any other would have taken half the beating you have and yet still be throwing themselves into the fray. To you, the pilots of the line who have given your ships and pods and your time to the defense of your lands, I salute you.

Throughout the (many) pages of discussion this war has spawned, I have seen snippets and flashes of the respect each side has for the other. For those pilots that are unable to respond mutually, I ask that you leave this thread to those that do; despite the minority who may have offended your principles or acted in a manner you condemn, there are many that would still kick the ball between the trenches on Christmas day, and shake the hand of the man they have been shooting at.

And so to you my comrades in BoB I offer thanks for starting this marvellous little scrap for my entertainment, and to ASCN for fighting the good fight.

See you in space.

---

Originally by: Tiuwaz

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for caldari perception weapons that hit up to 100km are short range weapons

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Originally by: Ysabelle nKataros

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What have you got if you ain't got no respect?

This is a thread for the respect that seems to have fallen out of the bottom of every other thread where trolling, flaming or paranoia have overwhelmed its presence. I went into this war with a very high opinion of ASCN's dedication and achievements and for the majority of its membership I still hold that opinion. ASCN, you have dared to bring the fight to us, you have battled tooth and nail where other alliances have crumbled and faded. No matter that the war has proceeded largely along the lines expected, I doubt any other would have taken half the beating you have and yet still be throwing themselves into the fray. To you, the pilots of the line who have given your ships and pods and your time to the defense of your lands, I salute you.

---

Originally by: Cmd Woodlouse

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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The only real unnecessity in this thread is your reply, Mrs. Molly.

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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Originally by: Darko1107

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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Er no. Respect is given to every fellow human being. Whether they chose to live up to the level of respect given to them in order to keep it is up to them. If they dont manage that then they would have to earn it back.

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Originally by: CRYVOK

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Others, like BoB, they play the game in a meaningless fasition, concerned with nothing but winning. We care about our friends.

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Originally by: Dianabolic

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Originally by: Darko1107

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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Er no. Respect is given to every fellow human being. Whether they chose to live up to the level of respect given to them in order to keep it is up to them. If they dont manage that then they would have to earn it back.

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Respect as a human, sure.

Respect in a game? In a competition?

Hell no. In the latter it surely does have to be earnt.

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Originally by: Slowboat

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So what you and Molle are saying is that you have absolutely no respect for the ASCN members that bring it every day and every major attack? Niiiiiiicee...

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Originally by: CRYVOK

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Others, like BoB, they play the game in a meaningless fasition, concerned with nothing but winning. We care about our friends.

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Originally by: Nikolai Tesla

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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You know how people make posts that they think will make them look like a badass, but they just end up looking like a tool?

Yeah...

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Originally by: BoB forum PR

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Toxic sludge is good for you.

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Originally by: Dianabolic

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Originally by: Slowboat

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So what you and Molle are saying is that you have absolutely no respect for the ASCN members that bring it every day and every major attack? Niiiiiiicee...

---

Yes, that's absolutely what I mean. Hell, those people have done NOTHING to earn their respect, have they?

Not like they fight, or anything...

Try reading the post next time. People say that others automatically get respect, we call bull****, especially in a competetive environment.

Don't hurt yourself trying to comprehend it.

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Originally by: BobGhengisKhan

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Your a bigger ******* tool than molle is.

Go blindly follow some other morale high ground, like say... being a*****sucker.

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Originally by: CRYVOK

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Others, like BoB, they play the game in a meaningless fasition, concerned with nothing but winning. We care about our friends.

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Originally by: Slowboat

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Respect is always deserved in competition as long as your opponent is trying their best each time they face you. You may outclass them in skills or what have you but if they are honestly throwing their best effort at you? It is definitely deserved and earned.

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Originally by: CRYVOK

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Others, like BoB, they play the game in a meaningless fasition, concerned with nothing but winning. We care about our friends.

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Originally by: Plim

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lol, exactly. BoB are a well led, determined, successful organisation, but they get no respect from a lot of people because of 'tools' like molle who give them a bad rep.

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Quote:

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ProphetGuru > It was a Wasp!

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

---

Originally by: Dianabolic

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So, you agree that those who sit by the sidelines and do not EARN IT, deserve no respect?

Glad we got that cleared up, because thats' what we've been saying.

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Originally by: Dianabolic

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Originally by: Darko1107

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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Er no. Respect is given to every fellow human being. Whether they chose to live up to the level of respect given to them in order to keep it is up to them. If they dont manage that then they would have to earn it back.

---

Respect as a human, sure.

Respect in a game? In a competition?

---

Originally by: Beringe

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Edited by: Beringe on 25/11/2006 20:05:40

Originally by: Dianabolic

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So, you agree that those who sit by the sidelines and do not EARN IT, deserve no respect?

Glad we got that cleared up, because thats' what we've been saying.

---

All I've seen is two prominent members of BOB flaming a thread made by one of their own members, in order to deny respect to those the OP thought deserved it.

Backpedal faster.

---

Originally by: CRYVOK

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Others, like BoB, they play the game in a meaningless fasition, concerned with nothing but winning. We care about our friends.

---

Originally by: Darko1107

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Why the hell not? In the olyimpics im pretty much 100% sure every athlete respects every other athlete.

In a game, why shouldnt you respect everyone? I dont care if they dont give YOU a fight, i dont care if they do. They should be respected for playing the game how THEY want to and now how you want them to play it. If some1 fails at a game, they should be given any respect? Seems a bit shallow.$.

---

Originally by: CRYVOK

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Others, like BoB, they play the game in a meaningless fasition, concerned with nothing but winning. We care about our friends.

---

Originally by: Dianabolic

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Originally by: Darko1107

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Why the hell not? In the olyimpics im pretty much 100% sure every athlete respects every other athlete.

In a game, why shouldnt you respect everyone? I dont care if they dont give YOU a fight, i dont care if they do. They should be respected for playing the game how THEY want to and now how you want them to play it. If some1 fails at a game, they should be given any respect? Seems a bit shallow.$.

---

Darko, if you're at the olympics (rl analogies ftl) do you really think people have just "turned up" out of nowhere and been given respect? Have they heck. You turn up to any football ground and demand that the players there respect your ABILITY and you'll get laughed at. Then turn them inside out whilst blindfolded or hopping on one leg, THEN you will get respect.

The notion that people think they should be respected for their ability WHEN IT HAS NOT BEEN PROVEN is laughable, at best.

No one, least of all BoB, dis-respects people for failing, we have no respect for those that do not TRY.

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Originally by: Dianabolic

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Darko, if you're at the olympics (rl analogies ftl) do you really think people have just "turned up" out of nowhere and been given respect?

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Originally by: Serathu

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Thread cleaned.

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Originally by: Shamis Orzoz

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Most people in eve would rather win than have a good fight

---

Originally by: eleuthereus

---

Edited by: eleuthereus on 25/11/2006 21:42:56
Many years ago, I remember seeing an Olympic swimming event that included a swimmer from an extremely poor country in Africa. He barely had qualified to be in the Olympics, and in fact, had never even partcipated in a swimming event that was as long as the one he was going to swim in competition, on TV, before the entire world. The starting gun sounded, and the swimmers took off. He IMMEDIATELY started falling behind - more, and more and more.

Finally, the winner touched the wall, second place, and third, then the rest of the field, all of whom got out of the pool -- all except the lone swimmer from Africa who was two full pool lengths behind. He kept swimming, and swimming, so exhausted that it looked like he was almost flailing in the water, hardly moving at all. No one else was even in the pool, the other swimmers, in fcat, were already drying off with their towels. He was still swimming. No one could believe he was so far behind. But he kept going, suddenly pulling the notice of the commentators and the crowd who started cheering and chering and cheeering -- until atlast he finished, utterly spent, barely able to even climb out of the pool.

Was he a good swimmer? No. Could he have ever beat anyone? No. Did he deserve respect? Yes - without a doubt, yes. He showed integrity, fortitude, courage, perseverance, and true spirit of competition. In fact, I respected him EVEN MORE than the winners because of the odds against him that he had to face.

So, this is all my way of saying, there are all kinds of respect -- both earned (as in when a person performs well, or as in when a person shows fortitude), as well as unearned (as in the respect every person/player should receive by the sheer fact that they are fellow human beings and fellow players).

When dealing with such issues, we muct avoid mixing categories and nuanced definitions of certain concepts like respect. My two cents

eleuthereus

---

Originally by: Kryztal

---

lol, i think Molle's answer summed it up nicely. Earn it and youll have it.

---

Originally by: eleuthereus

---

Originally by: Kryztal

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lol, i think Molle's answer summed it up nicely. Earn it and youll have it.

---

Not quite sure what is worthy of a "lol," but whatever.

What seemed ill-conceived to me about Molle's post was it's all-encompassing tone -- a classic painting with a broad brush. His comment SEEMED to indicate that in his opinion no pilots in ASCN, or ASCN as a whole, has in no way earned any respect. That was the apparent implication. A view I would vehemently disagree with.

Of course, I may be wrong, and if Molle did not mean this, and he was only referring to some pilots, or simply pilots in general who have not proved themselves to be competant PvPrs, then that is a different story and it is a fair enough comment. However, it still implies that ALL respect, in its varied forms, must be earned, which is clearly not the case if we are talking the level of human respect for others and their abilities however advanced or basic they may be.

eleuthereus

---

Originally by: SirMolle

---

I'm not going to respect you if i see you in space. I'm not going to give my respect to anyone, who i don't know, i never have flown with, never dealt with. I'm not going to trust you. I'm not going to friends with you.

I will however, dance on your corpse.

---

Originally by: SirMolle - I'm not going to respect you if i see you in space. I'm not going to give my respect to anyone, who i don't know, i never have flown with, never dealth with. I'm not going to trust you. I'm not going to friends with you.I will however, dance on your corpse.
[/quote

---

Dear SirMolle,

With all due respect (note the oft-used phrase in formal as well as informal communications), I have no idea what I said in my post that would elicit such a heated response.

First, it is odd that you would have no respect for me from the get-go, not knowing anything about me, either as a player or a person. I assume, then, that you respect no one whom you do not personally know. This is an interesting position to take, I must say. But a very sad one, too, in my opinion.

Second, as you say, you have never flown with me, nor dealt with me. Again, I find it odd that you would instantly assume that I am not worthy of respect. You apparently take a sort of guilty until proven innocent, rather than innocent until proven guilty stance. Again, kind of sad, but that is your opinion. So, very well.

Third, as for trusting me. I never asked you to trust me. Anyway, it is a valid point that you would not trust me. We are enemies. But it is odd that you would even mention "trust, because very much unlike respect, trust is indeed something that MUST be earned. To instantly trust someone leaves one open to scammers and others. Moreover, this thread is about respect -- not trust. Please stay on topic.

Finally, as for you not going to be friends with me, once more, you comment on something I have not even mentioned. I didn't ask you to be my friend. So, why bother mentioning it, unless it was intended as deliberate attempt to get a rise out of me. The same could be said for your dancing on my "corpse" comment. Interesting.

This thread was started by one of your own alliance members, intended to focus on the concept of respect, its merits, and its place in the game. Try to stay on topic, remain civil, and commmunicate a bit more intelligently. Everyone will be much better off and discussins will go further.

respectfully,
eleuthereus

Originally by: Rikeka

---

No need of respect from a 300 bytes avatar.
No need to respect a 300 bytes avatar.
And you don`t need Molle`s respect to enjoy the game, nor his respect will pay the EvE bill.

In a way, what Molle says is right.

Just think it like that, and that this is a game, and all will be fine.

---

Originally by: eleuthereus

---

Dear SirMolle,

With all due respect (note the oft-used phrase in formal as well as informal communications), I have no idea what I said in my post that would elicit such a heated response.

First, it is odd that you would have no respect for me from the get-go, not knowing anything about me, either as a player or a person. I assume, then, that you respect no one whom you do not personally know. This is an interesting position to take, I must say. But a very sad one, too, in my opinion.

Second, as you say, you have never flown with me, nor dealt with me. Again, I find it odd that you would instantly assume that I am not worthy of respect. You apparently take a sort of guilty until proven innocent, rather than innocent until proven guilty stance. Again, kind of sad, but that is your opinion. So, very well.

Third, as for trusting me. I never asked you to trust me. Anyway, it is a valid point that you would not trust me. We are enemies. But it is odd that you would even mention "trust, because very much unlike respect, trust is indeed something that MUST be earned. To instantly trust someone leaves one open to scammers and others. Moreover, this thread is about respect -- not trust. Please stay on topic.

Finally, as for you not going to be friends with me, once more, you comment on something I have not even mentioned. I didn't ask you to be my friend. So, why bother mentioning it, unless it was intended as deliberate attempt to get a rise out of me. The same could be said for your dancing on my "corpse" comment. Interesting.

This thread was started by one of your own alliance members, intended to focus on the concept of respect, its merits, and its place in the game. Try to stay on topic, remain civil, and commmunicate a bit more intelligently. Everyone will be much better off and discussins will go further.

respectfully,
eleuthereus

---

Originally by: SirMolle

---

Originally by: eleuthereus

---

I'm not discussing. You do not deserve my respect. I am better then you. We are better then you. You deserve no respect from me, or us. If you want it, earn it. I don't want your respect, I want your space. I will dance on your corpse, I will laugh when your pod explodes, I will grin when I remove your last ship.What you think of me, or us, is totally moot. We're better then you.

---

Dear S-

Well, when someone says they are unwillingto discuss anything, then that is the end of the discussion. Fair enough. You clearly are entrenched in your views just as many rabid extremist fundamentalists or cultists are entrenched in their ideas -- unwilling (or unable) to even hear contrary opinions, thoughts, and ideas. Very well.

In conclusion, then, on the topic of respect, what is most interesting is how people can actually say and do things that will detract respect once held for them by others (hint hint).

less respectfully,

eleuthereus

Originally by: SirMolle

---

I'm not discussing. You do not deserve my respect. I am better then you. We are better then you. You deserve no respect from me, or us. If you want it, earn it. I don't want your respect, I want your space.

I will dance on your corpse, I will laugh when your pod explodes, I will grin when I remove your last ship.

What you think of me, or us, is totally moot. We're better then you.

---

Originally by: Maysta PhaCade

---

To the charities and aid organizations that go into 3rd world countries to provide food and medical assistance, that is showing respect. Have those poor starving kids done ANYTHING to earn the respect of people thousands of miles away? I doubt it.

For the SPCA, WWF etc, do the animals they help have to earn the their respect before they can be "respected" and helped? I DON'T THINK SO.

And yes, this is just a "game," and you don't see the people you're playing against, but thats no reason to disrespect others.

Respect says a lot more about the person giving it than the person receiving.


And yes this is my main.

---

Originally by: Dictionary.com

---

com‧pas‧sion 
ûnoun
1.a feeling of deep sympathy and sorrow for another who is stricken by misfortune, accompanied by a strong desire to alleviate the suffering.

---

Originally by: SirMolle

---

Originally by: eleuthereus

---

Dear SirMolle,

With all due respect (note the oft-used phrase in formal as well as informal communications), I have no idea what I said in my post that would elicit such a heated response.

First, it is odd that you would have no respect for me from the get-go, not knowing anything about me, either as a player or a person. I assume, then, that you respect no one whom you do not personally know. This is an interesting position to take, I must say. But a very sad one, too, in my opinion.

Second, as you say, you have never flown with me, nor dealt with me. Again, I find it odd that you would instantly assume that I am not worthy of respect. You apparently take a sort of guilty until proven innocent, rather than innocent until proven guilty stance. Again, kind of sad, but that is your opinion. So, very well.

Third, as for trusting me. I never asked you to trust me. Anyway, it is a valid point that you would not trust me. We are enemies. But it is odd that you would even mention "trust, because very much unlike respect, trust is indeed something that MUST be earned. To instantly trust someone leaves one open to scammers and others. Moreover, this thread is about respect -- not trust. Please stay on topic.

Finally, as for you not going to be friends with me, once more, you comment on something I have not even mentioned. I didn't ask you to be my friend. So, why bother mentioning it, unless it was intended as deliberate attempt to get a rise out of me. The same could be said for your dancing on my "corpse" comment. Interesting.

This thread was started by one of your own alliance members, intended to focus on the concept of respect, its merits, and its place in the game. Try to stay on topic, remain civil, and commmunicate a bit more intelligently. Everyone will be much better off and discussins will go further.

respectfully,
eleuthereus

---

I'm not discussing. You do not deserve my respect. I am better then you. We are better then you. You deserve no respect from me, or us. If you want it, earn it. I don't want your respect, I want your space.

I will dance on your corpse, I will laugh when your pod explodes, I will grin when I remove your last ship.

What you think of me, or us, is totally moot. We're better then you.

---

Originally by: SirMolle

---

Originally by: eleuthereus

---

Dear SirMolle,

With all due respect (note the oft-used phrase in formal as well as informal communications), I have no idea what I said in my post that would elicit such a heated response.

First, it is odd that you would have no respect for me from the get-go, not knowing anything about me, either as a player or a person. I assume, then, that you respect no one whom you do not personally know. This is an interesting position to take, I must say. But a very sad one, too, in my opinion.

Second, as you say, you have never flown with me, nor dealt with me. Again, I find it odd that you would instantly assume that I am not worthy of respect. You apparently take a sort of guilty until proven innocent, rather than innocent until proven guilty stance. Again, kind of sad, but that is your opinion. So, very well.

Third, as for trusting me. I never asked you to trust me. Anyway, it is a valid point that you would not trust me. We are enemies. But it is odd that you would even mention "trust, because very much unlike respect, trust is indeed something that MUST be earned. To instantly trust someone leaves one open to scammers and others. Moreover, this thread is about respect -- not trust. Please stay on topic.

Finally, as for you not going to be friends with me, once more, you comment on something I have not even mentioned. I didn't ask you to be my friend. So, why bother mentioning it, unless it was intended as deliberate attempt to get a rise out of me. The same could be said for your dancing on my "corpse" comment. Interesting.

This thread was started by one of your own alliance members, intended to focus on the concept of respect, its merits, and its place in the game. Try to stay on topic, remain civil, and commmunicate a bit more intelligently. Everyone will be much better off and discussins will go further.

respectfully,
eleuthereus

---

I'm not discussing. You do not deserve my respect. I am better then you. We are better then you. You deserve no respect from me, or us. If you want it, earn it. I don't want your respect, I want your space.

I will dance on your corpse, I will laugh when your pod explodes, I will grin when I remove your last ship.

What you think of me, or us, is totally moot. We're better then you.

---

Originally by: Darko1107

---

lol.

You really are so fulla **** arent you?

Im definatly better than you.

Oh look we are in the playground!

---

Originally by: SirMolle

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You do not deserve my respect. I am better then you. We are better then you. You deserve no respect from me, or us. If you want it, earn it. I don't want your respect, I want your space.

I will dance on your corpse, I will laugh when your pod explodes, I will grin when I remove your last ship.

What you think of me, or us, is totally moot. We're better then you.

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Originally by: SirMolle

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If you want it, earn it.

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Originally by: Shamis Orzoz

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Most people in eve would rather win than have a good fight

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Originally by: eleuthereus

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Dear SirMolle,

With all due respect (note the oft-used phrase in formal as well as informal communications), I have no idea what I said in my post that would elicit such a heated response.

First, it is odd that you would have no respect for me from the get-go, not knowing anything about me, either as a player or a person. I assume, then, that you respect no one whom you do not personally know. This is an interesting position to take, I must say. But a very sad one, too, in my opinion.

Second, as you say, you have never flown with me, nor dealt with me. Again, I find it odd that you would instantly assume that I am not worthy of respect. You apparently take a sort of guilty until proven innocent, rather than innocent until proven guilty stance. Again, kind of sad, but that is your opinion. So, very well.

Third, as for trusting me. I never asked you to trust me. Anyway, it is a valid point that you would not trust me. We are enemies. But it is odd that you would even mention "trust, because very much unlike respect, trust is indeed something that MUST be earned. To instantly trust someone leaves one open to scammers and others. Moreover, this thread is about respect -- not trust. Please stay on topic.

Finally, as for you not going to be friends with me, once more, you comment on something I have not even mentioned. I didn't ask you to be my friend. So, why bother mentioning it, unless it was intended as deliberate attempt to get a rise out of me. The same could be said for your dancing on my "corpse" comment. Interesting.

This thread was started by one of your own alliance members, intended to focus on the concept of respect, its merits, and its place in the game. Try to stay on topic, remain civil, and commmunicate a bit more intelligently. Everyone will be much better off and discussins will go further.

respectfully,
eleuthereus

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I'm not discussing. You do not deserve my respect. I am better then you. We are better then you. You deserve no respect from me, or us. If you want it, earn it. I don't want your respect, I want your space.

I will dance on your corpse, I will laugh when your pod explodes, I will grin when I remove your last ship.

What you think of me, or us, is totally moot. We're better then you.

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Originally by: XoPhyte

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Seriously, how old are you?

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Originally by: SirMolle

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So far, everyone totally fails to see the obvious, with very few exceptions.

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Originally by: Samirol

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Edited by: Samirol on 26/11/2006 01:15:29

Originally by: SirMolle

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So far, everyone totally fails to see the obvious, with very few exceptions.

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that you are a complete ass hole?

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Originally by: CRYVOK

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Others, like BoB, they play the game in a meaningless fasition, concerned with nothing but winning. We care about our friends.

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Originally by: MrRogerz

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The only place you can gain respect is in this video game. No one could give a rat's ass about you in the real world.

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Originally by: Nick Curso

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Edited by: Nick Curso on 26/11/2006 01:23:54
my dad will beat up all your dads put together

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Originally by: Shamis Orzoz

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Most people in eve would rather win than have a good fight

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Originally by: Dianabolic

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Originally by: Samirol

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Edited by: Samirol on 26/11/2006 01:15:29

Originally by: SirMolle

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So far, everyone totally fails to see the obvious, with very few exceptions.

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that you are a complete ass hole?

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An ass hole that kicks your ass day in, day out.

How does it feel, to be an ass hole kick bag?

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Originally by: Rebellion

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I can respect you even as I do unspeakable things to your corpse.

However, after that, we can go for a beer, assuming I know you, and you are not a child molester.

How hard is it to understand that?

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Originally by: XoPhyte

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Seriously, how old are you?

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It's very easy to find out, the information can be found on my character sheet, and it will tell you, that I came into this life at the 6th of may, 2003.

So far, everyone totally fails to see the obvious, with very few exceptions.

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Originally by: Christopher Multsanti

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Play the game any way you want, give respect or not it's up to.

It's funny how molle tells his corp member off for making the thread when they were clearly giving their own opinion, it's also funny that although BOB leaders will say you earn respect, you will never earn the respect of BOB no matter what you do.

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Originally by: Dianabolic

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An ass hole that kicks your ass day in, day out.

How does it feel, to be an ass hole kick bag?

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Originally by: Beringe

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No, if gaining respect is a goal of the game...

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Originally by: CRYVOK

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Others, like BoB, they play the game in a meaningless fasition, concerned with nothing but winning. We care about our friends.

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Originally by: Braxmate

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Originally by: XoPhyte

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Seriously, how old are you?

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It's very easy to find out, the information can be found on my character sheet, and it will tell you, that I came into this life at the 6th of may, 2003.

So far, everyone totally fails to see the obvious, with very few exceptions.

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Molle is a Roleplayer (with a certain agenda ofc)!!! And obviously pretty good at it.

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Originally by: Gungankllr

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If anyone didn't notice, a BoB member started a thread that wasn't quite in line with the current BoB policy of "You all suck".

To remedy this, Molle and a few others are just stirring you all around, highjacking the thread to get everyone arguing and bickering again.

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Originally by: Dianabolic

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Nope, the goal in this game, for me, is to have fun.

And I thank you, Beringe, for right now I am laughing out loud.

Whether it is AT you, or WITH you, I am not yet sure,

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Originally by: John McCreedy

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Very good post and you earnt my respect with it. It's just a shame that there are people on both sides that feel the need to be as disrespectful as they possibly can.

Take care and see you on the battlefield.

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Originally by: Beringe

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Edited by: Beringe on 26/11/2006 01:58:55

Originally by: Dianabolic

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Nope, the goal in this game, for me, is to have fun.

And I thank you, Beringe, for right now I am laughing out loud.

Whether it is AT you, or WITH you, I am not yet sure,

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We all have our way to have fun, I guess. I blame the internet syndrome, personally.

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Originally by: Kyguard

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Respect is given by default and removed when necessary.

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Originally by: Slowboat

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Simply put it doesn't serve his propoganda agenda to break ASCN's morale so they crumble from the inside. Though I have to say that, from the outside, it doesn't look to much like ASCN is co-operating and crumbling very fast.

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Quote:

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Having been involved in allience warfare, on both losing and winning sides for most of my eve life. I would have to whole heartly dissagree with you on this statement.

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Originally by: Farham

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With all due respect (thread title and all) I guess its good for us you that you aren't one of us.

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Quote:

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Otherwise, what is the default response to anyone you don't know well enough, or who hasn't sufficiently impressed you? Disrespect?

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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Originally by: Avon

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re: comments about Sir Molle's ego.

He doesn't have one.

If you take offence at his comments it may be worth putting your ego in check and viewing things entirely logically.

Sorry if you find that offensive (which is another weakness of ego).

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Originally by: eveceo1

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You can be offended without hurting your ego, its not a weakness of it.

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Originally by: Aneu

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As for Molle not having an ego, you are just plain lying sir.

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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Originally by: BurnYaBad

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Originally by: SirMolle

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Respect is earnt. This thread is unnecessary.

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You sir, are an *******.

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Originally by: Avon

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re: comments about Sir Molle's ego.

He doesn't have one.

If you take offence at his comments it may be worth putting your ego in check and viewing things entirely logically.

Sorry if you find that offensive (which is another weakness of ego).

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Originally by: BurnYaBad

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Originally by: Avon

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re: comments about Sir Molle's ego.

He doesn't have one.

If you take offence at his comments it may be worth putting your ego in check and viewing things entirely logically.

Sorry if you find that offensive (which is another weakness of ego).

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Check yourself at the door, the rest of us are wondering if you have half a brain.

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Originally by: Avon

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re: comments about Sir Molle's ego.

He doesn't have one.

If you take offence at his comments it may be worth putting your ego in check and viewing things entirely logically.

Sorry if you find that offensive (which is another weakness of ego).

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Originally by: Avon

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Originally by: BurnYaBad

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Originally by: Avon

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re: comments about Sir Molle's ego.

He doesn't have one.

If you take offence at his comments it may be worth putting your ego in check and viewing things entirely logically.

Sorry if you find that offensive (which is another weakness of ego).

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Check yourself at the door, the rest of us are wondering if you have half a brain.

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After your last post you expect me to care about your opinion?
If you think I am some sort of half-wit, then fine, I can live with that.
Whatever it takes to allow you to feel comfortable in my company.

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Originally by: Choralone

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That said, would you say that this outlook describes the majority of BoB pilots in general--or at least something that you strive for?

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Originally by: Fuglife

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Have you done a frakri and sold up?

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Originally by: Avon

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Originally by: Choralone

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That said, would you say that this outlook describes the majority of BoB pilots in general--or at least something that you strive for?

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I would say the vast majority of BoB respect people who have given reason to be respected, and disrespect those who act in such away that respect is impossible.
That is probably true for the vast majority of Eve players tbh.

What is really in question is the respect status of those who you have never interacted with.
Some people say everyone should have respect until they lose it.
Others that everyone should have to earn respect.

Now, no matter how much you try and draw me, there is no way I could answer as to the position of the majority of BoB, or Eve in general.

Personally, I only give respect to those who have shown some reason for it.
That doesn't mean I disrespect those who have not proven themselves.
No respect for someone is not the same as disrespect.

I tend to take people as I find them.

The amount of people I actually disrespect in Eve is tiny, and each of those people has earned that position in my eyes.
I have varying levels of respect for the people I have interacted with in Eve.
I have no respect for the people in Eve I haven't interacted with.
I don't disrespect them, I just choose to reserve judgement until I know what they are like.

Not respecting someone does not mean I would not show them common courtesy, and judge them with an open mind when I first meet them.

I hope you understand the distinction I am trying to make.

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Originally by: Samirol

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i think there is the biggest difference, between people who disrespect those who they dont respect (as in, havent made a judgment) and those who show disrespect until they feel a reason to show respect.

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Originally by: Avon

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Originally by: Fuglife

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Have you done a frakri and sold up?

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No Fuggles, it is still very much the same old me :)

Actually, hold still, you make a perfect example of something...

Fuggles here has my respect, even though they are a member of a Corp which is a big fat -10 to BoB.

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Originally by: Avon

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Now, no matter how much you try and draw me, there is no way I could answer as to the position of the majority of BoB, or Eve in general.

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Originally by: Avon

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I hope you understand the distinction I am trying to make.

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Originally by: Pehova Mindtriq

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Respect is an overused word in eve and holds little value in my opinion.

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Originally by: Rod Blaine

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omg Thug, that's *so* not samurai of you !

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Originally by: anonymous

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If you're being chased by a police dog, try not to go through a tunnel, then on to a little seesaw, then jump through a hoop of fire. They're trained for that.

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Quote:

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If you take offence at his comments it may be worth putting your ego in check and viewing things entirely logically.

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Originally by: elbenito

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The problem with large fleet engagements is that the hamsters stop to watch.

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Originally by: Rod Blaine

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omg Thug, that's *so* not samurai of you !

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Originally by: anonymous

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If you're being chased by a police dog, try not to go through a tunnel, then on to a little seesaw, then jump through a hoop of fire. They're trained for that.

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Originally by: Fuglife

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Aye lost count of the, GF respect you lost 200bs we lost none, gj thanks, do it again bbq lol threads.

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Originally by: welsh wizard

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Respect is garnered through aggressive relations but only when both parties are willing to be courteous, even in a game.

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Originally by: Avon

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Personally, I only give respect to those who have shown some reason for it.
That doesn't mean I disrespect those who have not proven themselves.No respect for someone is not the same as disrespect.I tend to take people as I find them. The amount of people I actually disrespect in Eve is tiny, and each of those people has earned that position in my eyes. I have varying levels of respect for the people I have interacted with in Eve. I have no respect for the people in Eve I haven't interacted with. I don't disrespect them, I just choose to reserve judgement until I know what they are like. Not respecting someone does not mean I would not show them common courtesy, and judge them with an open mind when I first meet them. I hope you understand the distinction I am trying to make.

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Originally by: eleuthereus

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Edited by: eleuthereus on 26/11/2006 15:06:42

Originally by: Avon

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Personally, I only give respect to those who have shown some reason for it.
That doesn't mean I disrespect those who have not proven themselves.No respect for someone is not the same as disrespect.I tend to take people as I find them. The amount of people I actually disrespect in Eve is tiny, and each of those people has earned that position in my eyes. I have varying levels of respect for the people I have interacted with in Eve. I have no respect for the people in Eve I haven't interacted with. I don't disrespect them, I just choose to reserve judgement until I know what they are like. Not respecting someone does not mean I would not show them common courtesy, and judge them with an open mind when I first meet them. I hope you understand the distinction I am trying to make.

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Now here we see a very thoughtful, middle-of-the-road sort of response that I, personnaly, can see and accept from a player. Avon is simply saying, "Hey, look, if I don't even know a pilot, how can I truly respect them in the same way that I respect others whom I have flown with and/or interacted with."

Yet at the same, Avon is indeed granted a certain degree of respectibility to the individuals as pilots/people, until that low-level of generalized objective resepectibility is shown to be unwarranted by their actions, at which time they move into the realm of being disrespected.

This makes sense, and the way he communicated it was in itself respectful. Well done, Avon.

As for SirMolle, I found the remark that he is "role-playing" to be a fascinating one. Herein may lie the problem. This thread was not, as far as I can see, a role-playing thread. It was a non-role-playing thread wherein a RL person expressed his personal views about how other RL people play the game. Then, Molle comes in and responds (perhaps) in a role playing mode, complete with a dancing on your "corpse" jab and "we're better than you" rant, which cut against the intended purpose/tone of the thread.

Whether or not SirMolle was indeed role playing or not remains unclear.

1. If he was role-playing, then at the very least he was not role-playing in a proper thread, and needs to know when a thread calls for a more RL response as opposed to a character response.

2. If he was NOT role-playing, well . . . . I think his words and attitude pretty much speak volumes about him, and I shall leave it to readers to make up their minds and form their own opinions.

Either way, his post clearly derailed what could have been a very thoughtful, philosophical discussion. It quickly turned into yet another BOB vs ASCN / we hate you, you hate us thread -- boring.

Another tinkling of two more cents,

eleuthereus

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Originally by: Snatchz

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Gee thanx for teaching us what Avon is saying and then allowing the rest of us to formulate our own opinions....how incredibly gracious of you. I only can speak for myself, but without your obvious genius input and explanations of what everyone else has typed i don't think i'd have been able to understand what anyone is talking about.

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Originally by: olyyy

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Respect for being a failed alliance right now of the same level of the previous alliance ASCN was in? Respect for failing your entire politics: allying with BoB to destroy a capital shipyard just because ASCN didn't want anybody else to have motherships? Respect for in fact alienating most of Eve universe so that anybody willing to help ASCN now would do it just because they hate BoB more than ASCN? So yeah, respect to ASCN for getting their asses kicked with a stick they helped to grow and even assisted sometimes. The fact that you deserve absolutly no respect at this time doesn't mean that you won't deserve some in the future. I hope you will, I don't like when things get too predictable.

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Originally by: Samirol

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Edited by: Samirol on 26/11/2006 01:15:29

Originally by: SirMolle

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So far, everyone totally fails to see the obvious, with very few exceptions.

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that you are a complete ass hole?

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Originally by: eleuthereus

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So, IMHO, if you do not respect ASCN as a whole, then given the tihngs you listed, who you REALLY don't respect in CYVOK and HC -- i.e., the decision-makers. But to use the corporate "YOU" unfairly brings all pilots in ASCN under your condemnation when in reality, very few of the pilots have had anything to do with what you mentioned: previous alliance, politics of game, deciding to ally with BOB.

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Originally by: Avon

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Personally I wouldn't have bothered writting so much in response to that guy.
Any sane person will judge the members of an alliance for who they are, not the flag they fly under. It makes no difference how much respect people have for an alliance, an alliance is not a person who can be offended or encouraged by respect, it is an organisation. Respect is for people, not for abstract concepts.

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Originally by: Pehova Mindtriq

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Respect is an overused word in eve and holds little value in my opinion.

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Originally by: Avon

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re: comments about Sir Molle's ego.

He doesn't have one.

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Originally by: Darcuese

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Edited by: Darcuese on 25/11/2006 11:11:41
To me, respect is not a word publicly shared. And ppl do have a tendency to throw many words on forums to sound ok.

Respect is between me and you....and not for commercial purpose

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Originally by: Darcuese

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Edited by: Darcuese on 25/11/2006 11:11:41
To me, respect is not a word publicly shared. And ppl do have a tendency to throw many words on forums to sound ok.

Respect is between me and you....and not for commercial purpose

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Originally by: VonKaplanek III

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Stop being so arrogant

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Originally by: eleuthereus

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Edited by: eleuthereus on 26/11/2006 16:34:23

Originally by: olyyy

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[...]

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[...]

So, IMHO, if you do not respect ASCN as a whole, then given the tihngs you listed, who you REALLY don't respect in CYVOK and HC -- i.e., the decision-makers. But to use the corporate "YOU" unfairly brings all pilots in ASCN under your condemnation when in reality, very few of the pilots have had anything to do with what you mentioned: previous alliance, politics of game, deciding to ally with BOB.

As for getting our a*** kicked, well, the war is not over yet. This does not mean we will win, it simply means the fight is still raging. You may yet be able to make that comment, but for now, the charge is premature. I do, however, agree with you one point -- I very much hope that in the future ASCN will deserve respect. Point well taken.

eleuthereus

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Originally by: Avon

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Personally I wouldn't have bothered writting so much in response to that guy.
Any sane person will judge the members of an alliance for who they are, not the flag they fly under.

It makes no difference how much respect people have for an alliance, an alliance is not a person who can be offended or encouraged by respect, it is an organisation.

Respect is for people, not for abstract concepts.

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Originally by: Evil Thug

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Edited by: Evil Thug on 26/11/2006 13:53:18

Originally by: Rod Blaine

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omg Thug, that's *so* not samurai of you !

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Look at our weekend in fix. Loads of "respect yada yada yada". Do you really think that they are respect my alliance, or our pvp abilities ? Of course they are not. They are just glad that they managed to build outpost. If we`d destroyed outpost - there would be loads of topics regarding how bad aAa is, how we are suck at eve, life etc.

Look at your conflict with ascn. Loads of "we respect you in the past, but now with all spying, blah blah blah - we lost all respect to you". Why ? Answer is simple, because ASCN is losing.

Simple, eh ?
Winning : I respect my enemy.
Losing : Enemy is cheater, hacker, spy, quake kiddie, droping conts with bms near pos.

I`ve seen loads of "respect" messages from my enemies. But it does not prevent them to write lies about us, when "respectfull guys" sure, that we cant see it.

So, I preffer not to play in "respect" game. Because definition for this word for me is distinct from other EVE players.

EDIT : Spelling.

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Originally by: Nez Perces

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Edited by: Nez Perces on 26/11/2006 17:50:44
Neither ASCN or BoB respect eachother really.. which is why this war is so fun to watch.. long may it continue.

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Originally by: killerco

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Originally by: Nez Perces

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Neither ASCN or BoB respect eachother really.. which is why this war is so fun to watch.. long may it continue.

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oh so you deside for me who i respect and don't respect
I'll make that own decision thank you very much

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Originally by: Nez Perces

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Originally by: killerco

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Originally by: Nez Perces

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Neither ASCN or BoB respect eachother really.. which is why this war is so fun to watch.. long may it continue.

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oh so you deside for me who i respect and don't respect
I'll make that own decision thank you very much

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Actually, I meant the organisations you belong to.... there isn't a whole lot of respect between the two alliances.. which goes both ways.

What individual pilots think .. is anybody's guess....

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Originally by: killerco

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you mean there isn't any respect amongst the alliance leaders there is a difference

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Originally by: Nez Perces

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Edited by: Nez Perces on 26/11/2006 21:23:05

Originally by: killerco

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you mean there isn't any respect amongst the alliance leaders there is a difference

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well... I think you are walking on thin ice when you distance yourself from what your leaders think... after all they are *leading* you .. and if you think they are wrong.... then there is a bigger problem than the 'respect' issue.

BoB leadership and ASCN leadership, represent their alliances respectively.....

E.g if Cyvok says BoB suck, then to all intense and purposes, as far as ASCN is concerned they *do* suck.

.. likewise for BoB.

If an alliance is not prepared to have its views represented by its leadership.. that alliance is in a whole lot of trouble.

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Originally by: killerco

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i'm not distance myself from my alliance leaders in any way.

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Originally by: Nez Perces

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well... I think you are walking on thin ice when you distance yourself from what your leaders think... after all they are *leading* you .. and if you think they are wrong.... then there is a bigger problem than the 'respect' issue. BoB leadership and ASCN leadership, represent their alliances respectively..... E.g if Cyvok says BoB suck, then to all intents and purposes, as far as ASCN is concerned they *do* suck... likewise for BoB. If an alliance is not prepared to have its views represented by its leadership.. that alliance is in a whole lot of trouble.

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Originally by: SirMolle

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What you think of me, or us, is totally moot. We're better then you.

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Originally by: Fuglife

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Aye lost count of the, GF respect you lost 200bs we lost none, gj thanks, do it again bbq lol threads.

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Originally by: Evil Thug

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Edited by: Evil Thug on 26/11/2006 13:53:18

Originally by: Rod Blaine

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omg Thug, that's *so* not samurai of you !

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Look at our weekend in fix. Loads of "respect yada yada yada". Do you really think that they are respect my alliance, or our pvp abilities ? Of course they are not. They are just glad that they managed to build outpost. If we`d destroyed outpost - there would be loads of topics regarding how bad aAa is, how we are suck at eve, life etc.

Look at your conflict with ascn. Loads of "we respect you in the past, but now with all spying, blah blah blah - we lost all respect to you". Why ? Answer is simple, because ASCN is losing.

Simple, eh ?
Winning : I respect my enemy.
Losing : Enemy is cheater, hacker, spy, quake kiddie, droping conts with bms near pos.

I`ve seen loads of "respect" messages from my enemies. But it does not prevent them to write lies about us, when "respectfull guys" sure, that we cant see it.

So, I preffer not to play in "respect" game. Because definition for this word for me is distinct from other EVE players.

EDIT : Spelling.

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Originally by: eleuthereus

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Originally by: Nez Perces

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well... I think you are walking on thin ice when you distance yourself from what your leaders think... after all they are *leading* you .. and if you think they are wrong.... then there is a bigger problem than the 'respect' issue.

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I disagree.

Soldiers do not always agree with what their leaders tell them to do, but they do it. They are following orders. Also, these same leaders often make comments that go beyond simple military/political views into expressions of personal beliefs about enemies. Again, not every soldier agrees with those comments, but they continue to follow orders.

Leadership may represent a corporate official view, but this does not negate personal, subjective views of those who make up the alliance.

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Originally by: Nez Perces

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well... I think you are walking on thin ice when you distance yourself from what your leaders think... after all they are *leading* you .. and if you think they are wrong.... then there is a bigger problem than the 'respect' issue.

BoB leadership and ASCN leadership, represent their alliances respectively.....

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Originally by: Beringe

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What follows is three pages of philosophical rambling on what respect is, and what it's worth. Could this get any more pedantic?

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Originally by: Nez Perces

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Originally by: Beringe

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What follows is three pages of philosophical rambling on what respect is, and what it's worth. Could this get any more pedantic?

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Well the thread kind of died with Molle's post.. I think its now just a case of kicking the corpse around.

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Originally by: Asylum Seaker

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Even forgetting the philosophy and rhetoric of this sitch... If you go into a fight with arrogance and no respect for your foe, some 'ard bastard is going to jump all over you one day and you won't be ready for it. Always respect those of unknown power.

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Originally by: Gungankllr

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Without wading too deeply into the quagmire this thread has become, I'll just say this.

The list of people that BoB respects is almost exactly as long as people they think are useful.

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