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I N V E N T I O N my personel experience 1-3

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Effei Gloom Minmatar eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.02.03 23:25:00 - [1] 1. 1400mm Art I invention: (cheapest i could get) - 1400mm bpc me:100 300 runs 0.35 mill - 1400mm Howitzer Artillery 1.5 mill - Datacore mechanical engineering 3 60 mill - Datacore nuclear physics 3 75 mill - circuitry Schematics 2.5 mill - (Cryptic Data Interface 0 isk) Skills: MInmatar Encryption Methods III Mechanical Engineering IV Nuclear Physiks IV total: 139.35 mill isk "Sadly you were unable to produce anything of value in this job. Although you have a firm understanding of the baics of this job you were never close to a solution." loss: 139.35 mill isk ----------------------------------------- 2. 1400mm Art I invention:(best stuff from market) - 1400mm bpc me:100 300 runs 0.35 mill - 1400mm 'Scout' Artillery 18 mill - Datacore mechanical engineering 3 60 mill - Datacore nuclear physics 3 100 mill - Assembly Instructions 35 mill - (Cryptic Data Interface 0 isk) Skills: MInmatar Encryption Methods III Mechanical Engineering IV Nuclear Physiks IV total: 213.35 mill isk "Great news! You were successful in producing a new Tech II blueprint! This job was so easy you feel you could do it again in your sleep. Blueprint details: Blueprint Type: 1400mm Howitzer Artillery II Blueprint Number of Runs: 14 Material Level: -7 Productivity Level: -2" loss: 73.35 mill isk ---------------------------------------------- 3. 1400mm Art I invention: (medium stuff from market) - 1400mm bpc me:100 300 runs 0.35 mill - 1400mm Prototype I Siege Cannon 8 mill - Datacore mechanical engineering 3 45 mill - Datacore nuclear physics 3 45 mill - Operation Handbook 3 mill - (Cryptic Data Interface 0 isk) Skills: MInmatar Encryption Methods III Mechanical Engineering IV Nuclear Physiks IV total: 91 mill isk "Sadly you were unable to produce anything of value in this job. Despite valiant efforts you failed the job with success at your fingertips." loss: 91 mill isk --------------------------------------------- Three invention jobs (not counted the price of the interface!) total loss: 303.7 mill --------------------------------------------- S O L U T I O N : with current Datacore prices drop rates or buy price (500 R&D points). this is not going to work --------------------------------------------- Could a DEV explain why Datacore - Minmatar Starship Engineering cost 1500 R&D points (3R&D points for this research field) Datacore - Nuclear Physiks cost 500 R&D points (2R%D points for this research field) Datacore - High Energy Physiks 500 R&D points (1R&D points for this research field) I would call that unfair !!! all 1 should cost 500 all 2* ... 1000 all 3* ... 1500 ----------------------------------------------
Effei Gloom Minmatar eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.02.04 22:41:00 - [2] Anyone able to post their invention with listed skills, prices, ...? final output info?
Derrys Caldari Caldari Independent Navy Reserve	Posted - 2007.02.04 23:52:00 - [3] Originally by: Effei Gloom - Datacore mechanical engineering 3 60 mill - Datacore nuclear physics 3 75 mill - Datacore mechanical engineering 3 60 mill - Datacore nuclear physics 3 100 mill - Datacore mechanical engineering 3 45 mill - Datacore nuclear physics 3 45 mill There's your problem. You're paying way too much for datacores.
Petrothian Tong Gallente	Posted - 2007.02.05 06:17:00 - [4] get them off exploration sites... might take awhile though, but atm, invention is still not really worth it.... -- Today my drones attacked a brothel without even being told too. Either they objected to the establishment or they heard about the hot drinks machine in there... Yakumo
Effei Gloom Minmatar eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.02.05 09:59:00 - [5] Originally by: Derrys Originally by: Effei Gloom - Datacore mechanical engineering 3 60 mill - Datacore nuclear physics 3 75 mill - Datacore mechanical engineering 3 60 mill - Datacore nuclear physics 3 100 mill - Datacore mechanical engineering 3 45 mill - Datacore nuclear physics 3 45 mill There's your problem. You're paying way too much for datacores. maybe, recalculate with lower datacore prices, or even 1 hour per datacore found in exploration, think about a possibly win, let me know if there is any even then its a no go
Professor Pizi	Posted - 2007.02.05 10:40:00 - [6] Edited by: Professor Pizi on 05/02/2007 10:37:11 lol whoever sells ME dadacores for less then 25 mill is either an idiot or a friend of yours doin you a favor and even if you get them from exploration ,,,, they ARE NOT FREE get that into your head
Umbriele Gallente Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.02.05 13:13:00 - [7] example of my last invention: source: medium armor rep I BPC 300 runs ME 83 PE 0 amarr skill lvl3 science skills lvl3 decryptor: formation layout meta item: best one (accomodation) result: 10 runs BPC ME and PE negative
R'adeh Gallente Gekidoku Koroshiya Buntai	Posted - 2007.02.05 13:31:00 - [8] Yes, invention requires more work and input than a normal T2 BPO. Makes sense imo since otherwise they could have just drop T2 BPOs in exploration sites If you want the easy way of getting decryptors and datacores (aka fly to Jita and buy straight of market), don't expect to maximize your profit or even make a profit. Go do some exploration to get datacores, or censored (I thought about giving this tip, but if you can't figure it out by yourself, you're not ready for the T2 business). There's plenty of ways to get cheaper datacores than in Jita. I don't get why people complain after only a few days. The market will stabilize. People who are too lazy to do the work involved with invention will drop out of business, prices of invention material will go down, profits will go up. Let the market stabilize for a few weeks before whining... _______________________________________________ My views are my own and I don't represent my corp.
Ruffio Sepico Minmatar Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering	Posted - 2007.02.05 13:38:00 - [9] Originally by: R'adeh Yes, invention requires more work and input than a normal T2 BPO. Makes sense imo since otherwise they could have just drop T2 BPOs in exploration sites If you want the easy way of getting decryptors and datacores (aka fly to Jita and buy straight of market), don't expect to maximize your profit or even make a profit. Go do some exploration to get datacores, or censored (I thought about giving this tip, but if you can't figure it out by yourself, you're not ready for the T2 business). There's plenty of ways to get cheaper datacores than in Jita. I don't get why people complain after only a few days. The market will stabilize. People who are too lazy to do the work involved with invention will drop out of business, prices of invention material will go down, profits will go up. Let the market stabilize for a few weeks before whining... Do you do invention yourself? Just curious. You need to be involved in it to understand it imho. No one want to sell their datacores cheap, and even with multiple r&d agents it goes very slow to obtain datacores "working for it", beside it would pay off more to sell the datacores on the market than do the actual invention jobs as things are now. And you can explore all day if you want and still you get the datacores you need and the quantum you need, will be like playing roulette. Some of the decryptors they removed from where they used to drop as well, so even you "work of it" its not possible to find all you need. Home: http://www.hidden-agenda.co.uk
Professor Pizi	Posted - 2007.02.05 13:39:00 - [10] why oh why keep you repeating that if i can let say sell my exploration found datacores in Jita for 30 mill, they have a value of 30 mill or more because the wount pop if an invention process fails why use them for invention if its easyer and more profitable to just sell em ?
R'adeh Gallente Gekidoku Koroshiya Buntai	Posted - 2007.02.05 13:56:00 - [11] Just because you won't sell it for cheap doesn't mean no one else is stupid enough to do so _______________________________________________ My views are my own and I don't represent my corp.
maarud Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2007.02.05 15:59:00 - [12] Just do a little invention, I picked up 21 datacores from my last exploration radar site, the drop rate has def been increased for them. Maarud. Proudly a Ex-BYDI member
Shadowsword COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.02.05 19:02:00 - [13] 21 datacores from just one exploration site? Looks to me like the balance between exploration datacores and R&D datacores favor the first kind far too much. 5-8 datacores from one exploration site would have been far more sensible, imho. ------------------------------------------ Every ship has a base 60-70% resist against the primary damage type of the race that is the least able to vary it's damage types.
Demonikan Gallente The Weasels of Doom	Posted - 2007.02.05 19:49:00 - [14] Maruud, I take it that was a 0.0 exploration site? Low sec only yields 1-4 max, and radar sites are fast becoming less and less (lots of hidden belts/unknowns, but 1 radar site out of 30 systems scanned yesterday)
Furious Dude	Posted - 2007.02.05 20:06:00 - [15] Originally by: Demonikan Maruud, I take it that was a 0.0 exploration site? Low sec only yields 1-4 max, and radar sites are fast becoming less and less (lots of hidden belts/unknowns, but 1 radar site out of 30 systems scanned yesterday) Risk vs. reward...it's only fair that 0.0 earn you more datacores. As for the Radar sites in lowsec, yeah, they become less frequent it seams. However, I check some 0.0 regions and ever 3-4th scan is a radar site, so I really don't worry too much
Jita TradeAlt	Posted - 2007.02.05 21:09:00 - [16] I've thrown billions at invention now and I have finally found a way to make it profitable... ...sell datacores and components to other people that want to try it, it's the only way you'll ever make isk on it. I'm not kidding.
Christopher Dalran	Posted - 2007.02.05 21:22:00 - [17] Edited by: Christopher Dalran on 05/02/2007 21:22:30 I get mine through exploration, if you do it that way you can either sell your datacores or invent if you found a interface. Either way your going to make a ton since exploring is not one of those things many people can be bothered to do. Inventing is not realy a way to make money, they will alwayse have negative ME so you'll never be able to make them at the same prices as the BPO owners. However what you can do is invent a BPC for a Module that has a much lower supply than demand. HAC's and Cap recharger II's come to mind here. Seriously tho buying datacores from r&d agents is the most inefficient way to obtain them, its just the no brainer way that guarantees your going to get exactly what you want right when you need it. Even if you find 20 data cores that you dont need exploring you can alwayse sell one and buy the one you do. Oh and last time i checked the market the gallente starship data cores were 2 mill in oursulaert.
Effei Gloom Minmatar eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.02.05 22:02:00 - [18] i would be more interested to see actual invention jobs and not random brabble or whining about prices. Keep it simple, post your invention jobs with win/loss, so others can think about too. Datacores arent for free doesntmater which way you get them.
Jita TradeAlt	Posted - 2007.02.06 11:44:00 - [19] Originally by: Effei Gloom Keep it simple, post your invention jobs with win/loss, so others can think about too. Sure, I didn't take notes on the specifics, but all relevant skills to 4, 7 invention jobs on 1mn MWD, all used the assembly instructions decrypter, all used best named MWD, ME/PE100(i think both at 100) and 300 run BPC. Result: 2 successful out of 7, 1x 4 run BPC and a 7x run BPC, both negative ME/PE of course. I didn't even want to do the math on how many millions i lost on that.
Professor Pizi	Posted - 2007.02.06 12:28:00 - [20] wow now that sucks, thought with skills at 4 your on the save side
Mr Printman J Productions	Posted - 2007.02.06 12:39:00 - [21] Originally by: Jita TradeAlt Sure, I didn't take notes on the specifics, but all relevant skills to 4, 7 invention jobs on 1mn MWD, all used the assembly instructions decrypter, all used best named MWD, ME/PE100(i think both at 100) and 300 run BPC. Damn. What are the relevant skills that you're talking about? Eve-directory : J Productions
Professor Pizi	Posted - 2007.02.06 12:56:00 - [22] Edited by: Professor Pizi on 06/02/2007 12:54:12 to quote hunter ... So, if you wanted to invent a Vagabond BPC using a Stabber BPC, you see that required datacores are: ôDatacore - Minmatar Starship Engineeringö ôDatacore û Mechanical Engineeringö And the following Interface: ôCryptic Ship Data Interfaceö To get the best chance of a positive result you would have to have the following skills at level 5: ôMinmatar Starship Engineeringö ôMechanical Engineeringö ôMinmatar Encryption Methodsö
Jita TradeAlt	Posted - 2007.02.06 13:01:00 - [23] Edited by: Jita TradeAlt on 06/02/2007 12:57:55 Originally by: Mr Printman Damn. What are the relevant skills that you're talking about? Well honestly I don't know 100% which skills the game takes into account when inventing, but i have rocket science 4, molecular engineering 4 and minmatar encryption 4. All of which are needed to at least level 1 to even try inventing(minmatar book cost me another 200 mill btw.). I have science, lab op, and research to 5, but I don't think they matter on the success rate. Although with CCP I wouldn't be suprised if they did. :p Pizi, who is hunter?
Professor Pizi	Posted - 2007.02.06 13:05:00 - [24] Edited by: Professor Pizi on 06/02/2007 13:02:23 a dev http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=443643
Jita TradeAlt	Posted - 2007.02.06 13:16:00 - [25] Edited by: Jita TradeAlt on 06/02/2007 13:13:01 Originally by: Professor Pizi Edited by: Professor Pizi on 06/02/2007 13:02:23 a dev http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=443643 I was hoping there was something I was missing or doing wrong, but it looks like I did most things right and still got next to nothing. And ship invention has half the chance of success as mods? Glad I didn't go for vagabond invention as originally planned then. Time to recoup some of the loss: WTS Built cryptic interface. edit, ahh, now i realize why the sell forum is full of WTS interfaces.
Ruffio Sepico Minmatar Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering	Posted - 2007.02.06 15:03:00 - [26] Originally by: Jita TradeAlt Edited by: Jita TradeAlt on 06/02/2007 13:13:01 Originally by: Professor Pizi Edited by: Professor Pizi on 06/02/2007 13:02:23 a dev http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=443643 I was hoping there was something I was missing or doing wrong, but it looks like I did most things right and still got next to nothing. And ship invention has half the chance of success as mods? Glad I didn't go for vagabond invention as originally planned then. Time to recoup some of the loss: WTS Built cryptic interface. edit, ahh, now i realize why the sell forum is full of WTS interfaces. They drop like crazy in exploration now and the build cost is lowered drastic. You wont get back what you paid for it. Maybe you should send the bill to CCP -) Home: http://www.hidden-agenda.co.uk
Doctor Tycho Caldari Arutha loyals	Posted - 2007.02.06 18:13:00 - [27] ok so i tried to invent 6x300 run 425mm railgun bpcs, i used the decryptor thats supposed to give more runs, and prototype gaus guns. All failed. Did i just have bad luck or is the succesion rate this low?
Salvis Tallan Gallente Team Condor	Posted - 2007.02.06 18:36:00 - [28] remember that success chances are only around 50% (depending on item). Its possible that your just having bad luck. ------
Effei Gloom Minmatar eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.02.06 19:03:00 - [29] Edited by: Effei Gloom on 06/02/2007 19:02:43 Please make sure you read my : Invention DEV Block
CynoCyber	Posted - 2007.02.06 23:30:00 - [30] Edited by: CynoCyber on 06/02/2007 23:28:02 Guys did you actualy read information on decryptors??? there is like 6-7 of them. You start with 1 (basic) and make t2 bpc. after that you put in back in lab and incrase ME on it with other decryptor. same is with PE and production runs. 1st bpc will be not profiteble and defenetly not if skills not maxed. Invention must be done step by step to get profiteble bpc from it. Good luck with.

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