Originally by: Blacklight

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Very very difficult to post in this thread from my point of view. Not because I feel either myself or my mates that I play Eve with are cheats but because one man, an employee of CCP no less has let us all down, most of all he's let all of BoB down.
We play hard but I firmly believe we play fair and to have the rug pulled out from beneath us like this is a very bitter pill to swallow.
I'll blog about the issue from my perspective when I am done moving house and stuff so could be a week or so.
Not much more I can say really except that I am sickened and saddened to learn that a CCP employee in my alliance cheated.

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Originally by: Lone Bear

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"Nice to see some Witch Hunt going on, nice to see a rebellion for pixels in an online computer game.Sad to see you dont follow the same conduct about modern slavery, mutilations, human rights being forgotten, your liberty being gone. Nice to see some enslaved minds going wild for some kilo bites.
Flame me away if that can make your small ego feel greater, you're making me sick, lot of you should go see a shrink and look at what's going on around you so precious "eve character".

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Originally by: Sir JoJo

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"Ok i know this is probaly gonna be nice Bait for all the BOB haters out there but i will try my best.
First of al i havent been ingame since i saw this Post and my first reaction was OMG ******* hell, does T20 actually know that he might just have ruined the game for an entire alliance and made the rest of the community even more suspicius towards said allaince.. this will hang over BOB for the rest of its excistens I am in shock that there was truth in this thing whit BPO spawning

I am in Shock that CCP have devs that does this and i fully agree on the part of him beeing FIRED he should right away..
i love this game and iwe always been "OMG ppl are calling us haxors cheater all the time FFS come one get a grib".

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Originally by: Avon

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"......
Firstly, am am honestly shocked that there was any truth to these allegations, and disappointed.You lot probably won't believe me, but frankly I could care less.Secondly, I trust CCP have taken whatever action they think appropriate.
It may not be enough for some, but calling for more isn't really going to change anything. IMHO T20 should have been sacked when this was orginally discovered, but that didn't happen for whatever reason. I can live with that.Any BoB characters who knowingly took advantage of T20 should be punished as appropriate.
.....

I feel for CCP, I feel for BoB, and I feel for the community.This whole affair could have been handled in a much better way, but alas we are where we are.What now?
Do we, as CCP suggest, try to put this behind us and move on; or do we do all we can to risk the future of this game?I have invested a lot in Eve, and I really don't want to see it die, so what now?
The ultimate future of Eve is in the hands of the community, you, me, everyone.It is time to act like the mature individuals we all are, and not the mob we have become.

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Originally by: Exelsior

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Edited by: Exelsior on 11/02/2007 13:08:29
I'm actually quite certain that most BoB had no idea about what was happening, and that only a select few were involved, and it's a shame that a whole alliance is tainted by that, but such is Eve.

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Originally by: Matrix Aran

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Personaly I'm getting tired of all this, "OMG BoB haxorz!" crap. BoB is the big bad alliance of the moment and everyone believes they're cheating because they're on top. Same things were said of Curse Alliance back at it's peak. Its been made worse due to the news about T20 but to be honest, if someone believes that BoB have dominated the universe thanks to a Saber BPO, they need their head checked.

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Originally by: V0idz

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Originally by: Exelsior

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Edited by: Exelsior on 11/02/2007 13:08:29
I'm actually quite certain that most BoB had no idea about what was happening, and that only a select few were involved, and it's a shame that a whole alliance is tainted by that, but such is Eve.

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involved maybe... but the whole aliance have had benefits of this "relationship"..

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Originally by: Iva Soreass

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Damm do you guys eat,drink,****,sleep,think,**** about BoB all time ? seriously grow the **** up, get over it NO ONE CARES.

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Originally by: Dekiri

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If you think it is about a sabre BPO then you really need a reality check. It is about more then that and it is not only about T20. Noone really believes this was all BoB got fed.

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Originally by: Lone Bear

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"Nice to see some Witch Hunt going on, nice to see a rebellion for pixels in an online computer game.Sad to see you dont follow the same conduct about modern slavery, mutilations, human rights being forgotten, your liberty being gone. Nice to see some enslaved minds going wild for some kilo bites.
Flame me away if that can make your small ego feel greater, you're making me sick, lot of you should go see a shrink and look at what's going on around you so precious "eve character".

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Originally by: Darkstar BP

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1. BoB pilots have been flying with "[DEV]" tags in the last few days.

2. The Executor corp of BoB is now named "Tin Foil"

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Originally by: NereSky

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isnt impersonating a Dev against the rules?

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Originally by: Epic voice

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Originally by: Darkstar BP

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1. BoB pilots have been flying with "[DEV]" tags in the last few days.

2. The Executor corp of BoB is now named "Tin Foil"

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It has boiled over.

BOB members are even getting blamed for cheating on the Test server at the moment.
In my honest opinion BOB got the right to show some parts of this community the "finger" right now.

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Originally by: Kozak

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Originally by: Epic voice

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Originally by: Darkstar BP

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1. BoB pilots have been flying with "[DEV]" tags in the last few days.

2. The Executor corp of BoB is now named "Tin Foil"

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It has boiled over.

BOB members are even getting blamed for cheating on the Test server at the moment.
In my honest opinion BOB got the right to show some parts of this community the "finger" right now.

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So you are saying that BOB have the right to mock the community for getting an unfair advantage in a game that we all pay for equally? I think flying with [DEV] is actually against the EULA, and early in the game people were banned for impersonating CCP staff in game.

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Originally by: Darkstar BP

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Edited by: Darkstar BP on 11/02/2007 13:06:35
Two days ago it became clear there was a Dev high up in BoB, actively supporting BoB, with CCP not fixing it for 6 months

Now,how does BoB respond?

1. BoB pilots have been flying with "[DEV]" tags in the last few days.

2. The Executor corp of BoB is now named "Tin Foil"

3. BoB members have been reacting very very differently from one-another

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Originally by: Kozak

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Originally by: Epic voice

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Originally by: Darkstar BP

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1. BoB pilots have been flying with "[DEV]" tags in the last few days.

2. The Executor corp of BoB is now named "Tin Foil"

---

It has boiled over.

BOB members are even getting blamed for cheating on the Test server at the moment.
In my honest opinion BOB got the right to show some parts of this community the "finger" right now.

---

So you are saying that BOB have the right to mock the community for getting an unfair advantage in a game that we all pay for equally? I think flying with [DEV] is actually against the EULA, and early in the game people were banned for impersonating CCP staff in game.

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Originally by: Liu Kaskakka

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...

If the whole community is after you for something you had very little control over, how do you react?

1. You disband your alliance and quit the game out of shame?

2. You quiver in a little corner of the galaxy sending 'forgive us' pleas?

3. You make a mockery out of it by flaunting the dev-thing everywhere you go?

Personally I would choose option number three.

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Originally by: Liu Kaskakka

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Now, lets address the actual issues the op brings us:[/b]

If the whole community is after you for something you had very little control over, how do you react?

1. You disband your alliance and quit the game out of shame?

2. You quiver in a little corner of the galaxy sending 'forgive us' pleas?

3. You make a mockery out of it by flaunting the dev-thing everywhere you go?

Personally I would choose option number three.

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Originally by: Iva Soreass

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NO ONE CARES.

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Originally by: Cipher7

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Its like if the Imperial Star Destroyers flew past the X-Wing fighters and started flying circles around them, it would turn Star Wars into a slapstick comedy a-la Benny Hill instead

Originally by: Kozak

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Why do people focus on what we dont know? We know that there was cheating, we dont' know what other alliance cheated. To speculate is stupid. All I know is that I'm in an alliance that has not cheated and the enemy is known to have. You expect me or anyone else to be "OK, No Biggie".

These are things that I know and can react to.

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Originally by: August Personage

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1.people have been calling them BoD for the past few days, and quite a lot of new anti-bob sigs sporting BoD. laugh it up, and then cry when BoB decide they want to get in on the joke, they're not impersonating CCP, they are laughing at your paranoia.

2.the bob holding corp has been tin foil for quite a while now.

3. there are a lot of different people in bob, of course they're going to react differently

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Originally by: Kozak

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Originally by: Epic voice

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Originally by: Darkstar BP

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1. BoB pilots have been flying with "[DEV]" tags in the last few days.

2. The Executor corp of BoB is now named "Tin Foil"

---

It has boiled over.

BOB members are even getting blamed for cheating on the Test server at the moment.
In my honest opinion BOB got the right to show some parts of this community the "finger" right now.

---

So you are saying that BOB have the right to mock the community for getting an unfair advantage in a game that we all pay for equally? I think flying with [DEV] is actually against the EULA, and early in the game people were banned for impersonating CCP staff in game.

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Originally by: Kozak

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Why do people focus on what we dont know? We know that there was cheating, we dont' know what other alliance cheated. To speculate is stupid. All I know is that I'm in an alliance that has not cheated and the enemy is known to have. You expect me or anyone else to be "OK, No Biggie".

These are things that I know and can react to.

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Originally by: Kcel Chim

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Originally by: Kozak

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Originally by: Epic voice

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Originally by: Darkstar BP

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1. BoB pilots have been flying with "[DEV]" tags in the last few days.

2. The Executor corp of BoB is now named "Tin Foil"

---

It has boiled over.

BOB members are even getting blamed for cheating on the Test server at the moment.
In my honest opinion BOB got the right to show some parts of this community the "finger" right now.

---

So you are saying that BOB have the right to mock the community for getting an unfair advantage in a game that we all pay for equally? I think flying with [DEV] is actually against the EULA, and early in the game people were banned for impersonating CCP staff in game.

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The executioner corp was found long before the whole incident at the end of last year (december if memory serves right).
The tags can be appointed by anyone so chances are high if you see a bob with a dev tag one of YOUR gangm8s set it this way.
Tho reading your other posts on this topic i guess ure not interested in logic.

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Originally by: Sinlare

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Originally by: Kozak

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Why do people focus on what we dont know? We know that there was cheating, we dont' know what other alliance cheated. To speculate is stupid. All I know is that I'm in an alliance that has not cheated and the enemy is known to have. You expect me or anyone else to be "OK, No Biggie".

These are things that I know and can react to.

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Did you even read your own text? What you are saying is: We know 1 dev cheated inside RKK member of the bob alliance. You Don't know who else cheated in bob. to quote yourself; 'to speculate is stupid'.
And then you still go on blaming the rest of bob, you're a funny man.

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Originally by: Kozak

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Why do people focus on what we dont know? We know that there was cheating, we dont' know what other alliance cheated. To speculate is stupid. All I know is that I'm in an alliance that has not cheated and the enemy is known to have. You expect me or anyone else to be "OK, No Biggie".

These are things that I know and can react to.

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Originally by: Frogzuk

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I just want the whole issue resolved and equality across the board in all aspects of the game, so that we can continue to play on a even and fair 'playing field'.

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Originally by: Dekiri

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Noone really believes this was all BoB got fed.

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Originally by: killerco

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Originally by: Dekiri

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Noone really believes this was all BoB got fed.

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Unless you can support that accusation with proof(or anyone else for that matter) we(as the eve community) should not start that discussion.

With regards

Killerco

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Originally by: Royaldo

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Originally by: killerco

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Originally by: Dekiri

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Noone really believes this was all BoB got fed.

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Unless you can support that accusation with proof(or anyone else for that matter) we(as the eve community) should not start that discussion.

With regards

Killerco

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you know the "proof or stfu" doesnt really work atm...

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Originally by: Zeveron

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Edited by: Zeveron on 11/02/2007 14:20:16
You cannot blame BoB about actions of a dev to improve his gaming "expirience" (even if he donated the bpos to the corp)

You could blame BoB if SirMolle accepted the blackmail, bcs then they had tried to cover the things up. But they didnt.

If you wana go shoot BoB, go shoot them.
But dont pretend to be the holly crusader vs the game plague

Period

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Originally by: killerco

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Originally by: Dekiri

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Noone really believes this was all BoB got fed.

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Unless you can support that accusation with proof(or anyone else for that matter) we(as the eve community) should not start that discussion.

With regards

Killerco

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Originally by: Djerin

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Edited by: Djerin on 11/02/2007 13:51:28

Originally by: Iva Soreass

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NO ONE CARES.

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No, actually it's only you and a few of your doomed allies who don't care. But i didn't expect you to be any better. The day they leave you to your destiny you'll care too.

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Originally by: HellsRazor

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I find it funny that BOB and friends think they did not need a DEV to cheat for them.

I guess the DEV(T20), (afaik a director of RKK and capital fleet commander) thought RKK and BOB needed to CHEAT.

p.s. I demand a refund from BOB for my Tinfoil hat.

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Originally by: Zeveron

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Edited by: Zeveron on 11/02/2007 14:20:16
You cannot blame BoB about actions of a dev to improve his gaming "expirience" (even if he donated the bpos to the corp)

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Originally by: Iva Soreass

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Originally by: Djerin

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Edited by: Djerin on 11/02/2007 13:51:28

Originally by: Iva Soreass

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NO ONE CARES.

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No, actually it's only you and a few of your doomed allies who don't care. But i didn't expect you to be any better. The day they leave you to your destiny you'll care too.

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No actuley its just you and a handfull of other kids who seem to care , the REST of the server have accepted it was t20 and NOT bob. T20 said it was JUST him and has appoligised. Grow up , get a life and stop whining like a little 10 year old (unless you are 10years old then you are excused).

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Originally by: Darkstar BP

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Originally by: Lone Bear

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"Nice to see some Witch Hunt going on, nice to see a rebellion for pixels in an online computer game.Sad to see you dont follow the same conduct about modern slavery, mutilations, human rights being forgotten, your liberty being gone. Nice to see some enslaved minds going wild for some kilo bites.
Flame me away if that can make your small ego feel greater, you're making me sick, lot of you should go see a shrink and look at what's going on around you so precious "eve character".

---

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Originally by: Iva Soreass

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Originally by: Djerin

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Edited by: Djerin on 11/02/2007 13:51:28

Originally by: Iva Soreass

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NO ONE CARES.

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No, actually it's only you and a few of your doomed allies who don't care. But i didn't expect you to be any better. The day they leave you to your destiny you'll care too.

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No actuley its just you and a handfull of other kids who seem to care...

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Originally by: Cipher7

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Its like if the Imperial Star Destroyers flew past the X-Wing fighters and started flying circles around them, it would turn Star Wars into a slapstick comedy a-la Benny Hill instead

Originally by: Spenz

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Edited by: Spenz on 11/02/2007 15:14:02
After the denials from CCP, the thread locks, the bans, the thread deletions, the BoB forum brigade telling everyone that its all in their heads, and the tinfoil jokes, only for it to be true AFTER a HACKER of all people had to forcefully get the info CCP had for 6 months, Im not willing to believe ANYTHING CCP, BoB, or their pet alliances say.

An apology is not enough at this point. It WOULD have been enough 6 months ago, and if people didnt get banned, and if threads werent locked and deleted, and if said accused alliance didnt deny everything, but at this point its far too little far too late.

I dont believe CCP has come clean, nor do I believe BoB's directors knew nothing about what happened. Only one person got banned out of this whole mess, and he was the one who GAVE us the proverbial Watergate memo. At the moment I dont care if he got banned for hacking. I dont PAY him, I PAY CCP. A company that games their own game. Arent they suppose to ***** down on cheaters?

What an upsidedown situation.

Edit: since when is c-rack a bad word?

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Originally by: Avernus

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To doubt that this hasn't been given the highest level of attention by CCP is to name yourself a fool; name one other incident in the long history of incidents in Eve that has ever garnered a public response by the CEO of CCP himself.

Find some self respect so that you can figure out how to show some respect to others; people used to say that the greatest thing about Eve is its community, that high watermark is shamefully sinking fast.

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Originally by: Fracking Beach

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Why was BOB allowed to keep the spawned BPO's until this week if the incident was discovered in June 2006?

How many blueprint copies does BOB have of these BPOs that were now returned?

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Originally by: Zeveron

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Originally by: Spenz

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Edited by: Spenz on 11/02/2007 15:14:02
After the denials from CCP, the thread locks, the bans, the thread deletions, the BoB forum brigade telling everyone that its all in their heads, and the tinfoil jokes, only for it to be true AFTER a HACKER of all people had to forcefully get the info CCP had for 6 months, Im not willing to believe ANYTHING CCP, BoB, or their pet alliances say.

An apology is not enough at this point. It WOULD have been enough 6 months ago, and if people didnt get banned, and if threads werent locked and deleted, and if said accused alliance didnt deny everything, but at this point its far too little far too late.

I dont believe CCP has come clean, nor do I believe BoB's directors knew nothing about what happened. Only one person got banned out of this whole mess, and he was the one who GAVE us the proverbial Watergate memo. At the moment I dont care if he got banned for hacking. I dont PAY him, I PAY CCP. A company that games their own game. Arent they suppose to ***** down on cheaters?

What an upsidedown situation.

Edit: since when is c-rack a bad word?

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That hacker blackmailed SirMolle to cover the holle thing up.
SirMolle didnt accepted.
After violating the EULA that hacker/blackmailer got all his 5 accs banned by CCP.
Then he start accusing BoB more, with unprooved accusations.
Just think a little more about it :-)
And btw if CCP wanted to cover the holle thing up, she could have done that easy, offering that person what he needed to "improove" his gaming expirience.
Insteed of that, CCP banned him and all of his 5 accs.

And btw, I am not a BoB pet, I ve fought vs them, I got poded by them and 4 days ago I got DDDed by the Titan of their new allies (LV).

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Originally by: Darkstar BP

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I must say I never saw you so indignant about smearfest that was the BoB propaganda war against the ASCN leadership. This is actually an improvement over that.

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Originally by: Luthien Firefoot

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I've already said this in another thread, but will say it again, in response to all the BOB t-shirt brigade:

1) This cheating is only the tip of the iceberg, we will probably never know the full extent. If the dev in question was prepared to illegally spawn and give bpos to BOB, would he just spawn and give the ones we have been told about. Obviously not ffs, it's as clear as the BOB emblem on your t-shirts.

Do i think the whole of BOB were cheating ? ofc not
Do i think most of BOB were cheating ? ofc not
Did some of BOB cheat and know about this and whatever else the dev did, ofc they did, it's not debateable it's common bloody sense. It's utterly senseless to believe he never discussed this with someone, probably even bragging about his achievement. What's the next question that would be asked ?

What others can you get?
Can you do this, can you do that?

Get real people, if you go into an off license with a sawn off and a balaclava you're not gonna buy a goddamn scratchcard are ya.

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Originally by: Zeveron

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Then he start accusing BoB more, with unprooved accusations.

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Originally by: Zeveron

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but RKK surely got no feedback that the BPOs were illegal.
So they just didn't know.

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Originally by: Avernus

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Originally by: Darkstar BP

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I must say I never saw you so indignant about smearfest that was the BoB propaganda war against the ASCN leadership. This is actually an improvement over that.

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The BoB-ASCN propaganda went in two directions, there are numberous examples to be had. I have no reason to feel indignant as you put it, over two sides that both fired their share of broadsides at one another. The base behaviour displayed in these forums over this matter is a very different beast.

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Originally by: Zeveron

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Then he start accusing BoB more, with unprooved accusations.

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Originally by: Zeveron

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but RKK surely got no feedback that the BPOs were illegal.
So they just didn't know.

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Originally by: Zeveron

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Originally by: Luthien Firefoot

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I've already said this in another thread, but will say it again, in response to all the BOB t-shirt brigade:

1) This cheating is only the tip of the iceberg, we will probably never know the full extent. If the dev in question was prepared to illegally spawn and give bpos to BOB, would he just spawn and give the ones we have been told about. Obviously not ffs, it's as clear as the BOB emblem on your t-shirts.

Do i think the whole of BOB were cheating ? ofc not
Do i think most of BOB were cheating ? ofc not
Did some of BOB cheat and know about this and whatever else the dev did, ofc they did, it's not debateable it's common bloody sense. It's utterly senseless to believe he never discussed this with someone, probably even bragging about his achievement. What's the next question that would be asked ?

What others can you get?
Can you do this, can you do that?

Get real people, if you go into an off license with a sawn off and a balaclava you're not gonna buy a goddamn scratchcard are ya.

---

No prooves, just your sense and not common.
If that blackmailer is correct then T20 and 5 more devs are/were BoB members.
Thats 6% of the devs stuff.

I say the rest 94% of the devs are IRON members and helping IRON atm.
Is that true, is that false? Who knows?
Can you proove me wrong? Can you proove me right? No.

Period

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Originally by: Luthien Firefoot

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Do i think the whole of BOB were cheating ? ofc not
Do i think most of BOB were cheating ? ofc not
Did some of BOB cheat and know about this and whatever else the dev did, ofc they did, it's not debateable it's common bloody sense. It's utterly senseless to believe he never discussed this with someone, probably even bragging about his achievement. What's the next question that would be asked ?

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Originally by: August Personage

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1.people have been calling them BoD for the past few days, and quite a lot of new anti-bob sigs sporting BoD. laugh it up, and then cry when BoB decide they want to get in on the joke, they're not impersonating CCP, they are laughing at your paranoia.

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Originally by: Itzena

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Just a thought for all the "Most of BoB didn't know about this! Stop picking on them!" people - if these innocent members of BoB were as upset as people seem to be thinking, why don't they just quit their corps and reform under a new, untarnished banner?

Leave the cheats behind in BoB, and get on with the game.

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Originally by: Evil D4rk

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CPP get out in front of the power plant. It is better for all of us.

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Originally by: Evil D4rk

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CPP get out in front of the power plant. It is better for all of us.

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Originally by: Darkstar BP

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Edited by: Darkstar BP on 11/02/2007 14:10:30


I know there is a separate thread, but that has to do with CCP and its response. This thread has to do with BoB's response. So Mod's don't lock this thread please. It should not be mingled with the CCP discussion.

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Originally by: Kam SingDu'k

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Edited by: Kam SingDu''k on 11/02/2007 15:54:25

TBH What I don't think the community wants is to blame every Bob grunt, who afaik 99% did not know this was going on. What the community wants to see is a proper and thorough investigation into this mess that a select few DEVS and high ranking Bods have spawned. They were the cause of the abuse, and therefore proper action via bannings etc should be exercised to these members. At the moment, only 1 of the Devs have been ratted out (albeit for only a fraction of the abuse he did) so there are still people who have gotten away scott free.

First of all there is the high ranking member of bob who apparently posted the contact details of the person who implicated them in the first place. As said person has been banned for doing the same to the Bob member, it should only be consistent of CCP to ban the Bob member for committing the same act.

Secondly, there's the other high ranking rkk member who apparently used rl money to buy a toon off another person. This again is against CCP rules and should merit punishment. As I mentioned previously if CCP were consistent and indiscriminate to all players, then it would only be normal for CCP to punish this player. However, nothing has happened as of yet, and from reports by CCP who atm seem to find said player innocent, I ask for proof that would undermine that of Kugut's.

Therefore, rather than the community being unhappy for all of Bob and CCP, I would think they were more unhappy due to the fact that the investigation that took place was, frankly poor. Also, actions taken have been inconsistent with that of normal investigations, the only factor here is that they were Bob players. Finally, the fact that CCP seem to have acted inconsistently could give rise to discrimination, which afaik, even though it is their game, is still against the constitution (Whether it been the Human Rights Act) or whatever.

I myself am not blaming all of CCP or Bob for cheating, I'm sure most Devs have been able to play the game without having to resort to such low methods in order to further their 'game experience'. I am only after those responsible, and assisted in such help, from all alliances and corps, not just bob. Although they have been implicated, it may only be the tip of the iceberg and other alliances could have the same benefit.

Therefore, in order to restore community confidence, and trust for the average bob grunt, CCP should have dealt with the allegations more seriously, and without discrimination, against the accused Bob HC and CCP Devs, rather than make a , frankly crappy scapegoat over T20.

Nuff ranting

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Originally by: Darknesss

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This wont make me end my subscription, i love this game too much, i am disgusted, and what is making all of eve community so mad is that no one can know if anything else was given, or who exactly did know.

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Originally by: Darknesss

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One of my members was perma-banned for deploying cans, later we managed to get this revoked, but people seem to be getting away with ridiculous things in comparison.

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Originally by: Luthien Firefoot

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Do i think the whole of BOB were cheating ? ofc not
Do i think most of BOB were cheating ? ofc not
Did some of BOB cheat and know about this and whatever else the dev did, ofc they did, it's not debateable it's common bloody sense. It's utterly senseless to believe he never discussed this with someone, probably even bragging about his achievement. What's the next question that would be asked ?

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Quote:

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NO ONE CARES

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Originally by: Avernus

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Originally by: Itzena

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Just a thought for all the "Most of BoB didn't know about this! Stop picking on them!" people - if these innocent members of BoB were as upset as people seem to be thinking, why don't they just quit their corps and reform under a new, untarnished banner?

Leave the cheats behind in BoB, and get on with the game.

---

Yes... let's leave behind all what... 2 of them, perhaps 3, god forbid... 5? Sure, that makes sense, let's have the other 1795 people pack their stuff, move on and reform elsewhere. While they are at it, forget everything that they accomplished, nevermind the POS or the outposts and stations, never mind the effort and work they put in to bring themselves to the top of the game; never mind the ties and friendships they have within their corps and alliance, or the history they've created together...

Honestly, do you think that is even a slightly viable option that wouldn't hurt the very people that had nothing to do with this? I've seen other people calling for their alliance to be completely dissolved by CCP; do you think that wouldn't also adversely effect not just the members of BoB, but also several other alliances, and have the potential to completely upset the landscape of Eve in ways that can't be predicted? I'm not talking about subjective opinions on which alliances can stand on their own or make new arrangements or whatever; kneejerk reactions on 'how it should be fixed' aren't normally thought through, and this particular reaction/suggestion seems to be the least thought out of them all.

---

Originally by: Frogzuk

---

One wonders if the lack of response in form of statement from the usual bob forum warriors means one of the following things

1) they are eating humble pie

2) they have been banned and cant actually respond

seriously tho, my dislike of bob is no secret, i haven't liked them from the early days starting in eve, but as i have stated another forum posting, the members of bob have nothing to blame but for them selves as they are in the position to restore their tarnished reputation by kicking out those members that are apart of the whole farce otherwise they are just as guilty as the ones responsible.

I just want the whole issue resolved and equality across the board in all aspects of the game, so that we can continue to play on a even and fair 'playing field'.

froggy

---

Originally by: Kaeten

---

One thing I find still abit funny, when people said BOB were cheating, they were actully cheating. Not that BOB knew of this still makes a little giggle inside.

Tbh BOB (SirMolle) Should make an official BOB post saying sorry or whatever. I'm glad BlackLight and other bobbits admit the facts and have moved on.

If I was t20's boss he'd of been fired too.

---

Quote:

---

ok, so tell us all, exactly and with proof. Which guys in BoB "cheated" . To the letter, to the name, to every little detail, and give me all the proof needed to back this up. Oh, and try not using Kuguts and his forum hacking abilities?

---

Originally by: SPQRMocton

---

We would love to have a bunch of teenage pimple boys with no real pvp ability to fil our corpse yards

---

Originally by: Eloryan Persago, Goonfleet

---

I welcome you to the coalition of people with user access to EvE

---

Originally by: Extra Minty

---

Its all good and well everyone having a go at BoB but the fact remains that it was a select few that were in on this. Your going to hold the whole alliance at the end of a gun barrell because of this?

---

Originally by: Avernus

---

My first and only response in any of these related threads;

How long are people going to drag BoB over the coals on this? I highly doubt anyone here of sound mind believes for a moment that more than a fraction of a fraction of all of the BoB members had any inkling what was going on. My personal beliefs don't come into it, the tag under my name is susceptible to flame simply for my alliance standings with BoB.

The level of spite displayed here towards a group of players, the utterly vast majority of whom bear zero responsibility whatsoever in this matter, is frankly sickening. The will displayed to punish people who have no guilt is fueled by alternating motives of envy, hatred, cowardice, political aspirations and propaganda based bull. Did you recently cut them off yourselves or did you choose to create your characters to be eunuchs?

To doubt that this hasn't been given the highest level of attention by CCP is to name yourself a fool; name one other incident in the long history of incidents in Eve that has ever garnered a public response by the CEO of CCP himself.

Find some self respect so that you can figure out how to show some respect to others; people used to say that the greatest thing about Eve is its community, that high watermark is shamefully sinking fast.

---

Originally by: Liu Kaskakka

---

Originally by: Darkstar BP

---

Edited by: Darkstar BP on 11/02/2007 13:06:35
Two days ago it became clear there was a Dev high up in BoB, actively supporting BoB, with CCP not fixing it for 6 months

Now,how does BoB respond?

1. BoB pilots have been flying with "[DEV]" tags in the last few days.

2. The Executor corp of BoB is now named "Tin Foil"

3. BoB members have been reacting very very differently from one-another

---

Okies, lets think with our brainz for a bit!

Everyone knew bob had devs in their alliance, other alliances have devs too you know! They like their game, doh!

Did bob guys know the identity of a dev/devs? Probably a few did. Should they have ruined the devs gaming experience by exposing him to public/kicking him out of the alliance? If I knew my boss was a dev, so what? I'd play the game with the dev boss just the same.

---

Originally by: Ice Conch

---

In soviet russia, soap drops you!

---

Originally by: Qu'ut Nez

---

Originally by: Extra Minty

---

Its all good and well everyone having a go at BoB but the fact remains that it was a select few that were in on this. Your going to hold the whole alliance at the end of a gun barrell because of this?

---

Yes yes, hell yes.

Everything they have ever achieved in-game is now worthless, because it was helped by cheating. Their credibility is gone, they are led by cheaters and liars and they have gotten off very very lightly, to the point of increasing suspicion.

I'm thrilled about seeing most of Eve bandwagon against them, I hope they crumble and I hope most of them quit playing this game as they have done as much as they could to ruin it.

---

Originally by: BlackDog Rackh'am

---

Furthermore, nothing has stopped their public figures from broadly generalising whenever they went against somebody, they have no ground to stand on to resist the same treatment applied to them.

I do believe the average BoB guy is just another player like everyone of us...problem is their vocal ones could never apply the same logic when dealing with their enemies.

Just to use the most recent example, weren't the ASCN members just another group of players out to have fun? Of course they were. Where they all crap at PvP? Of course not, statistically speaking it's as impossible as saying that 100% of BoB cheat. Then why did they demonise the whole lot of them for their leaders mistakes, with the main aim to crush their will to play? Because attacking the enemy's fun factor is what wins wars first and foremost.

---

Originally by: Sinlare

---

Originally by: Qu'ut Nez

---

Originally by: Extra Minty

---

Its all good and well everyone having a go at BoB but the fact remains that it was a select few that were in on this. Your going to hold the whole alliance at the end of a gun barrell because of this?

---

Yes yes, hell yes.

Everything they have ever achieved in-game is now worthless, because it was helped by cheating. Their credibility is gone, they are led by cheaters and liars and they have gotten off very very lightly, to the point of increasing suspicion.

I'm thrilled about seeing most of Eve bandwagon against them, I hope they crumble and I hope most of them quit playing this game as they have done as much as they could to ruin it.

---

You should have your head checked out irl. Something is wrong with you and it is nothing good.

---

Originally by: Mark Twain

---

"sometimes It's better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid, than to open it and remove all doubt"

---

Originally by: Wrangler

---

That is an outright lie! We don't want to discriminate anyone! We want *both* anti-social *and* social players to grief each other!

---

Originally by: Qu'ut Nez

---

Originally by: Extra Minty

---

Its all good and well everyone having a go at BoB but the fact remains that it was a select few that were in on this. Your going to hold the whole alliance at the end of a gun barrell because of this?

---

Yes yes, hell yes.

Everything they have ever achieved in-game is now worthless, because it was helped by cheating. Their credibility is gone, they are led by cheaters and liars and they have gotten off very very lightly, to the point of increasing suspicion.

I'm thrilled about seeing most of Eve bandwagon against them, I hope they crumble and I hope most of them quit playing this game as they have done as much as they could to ruin it.

---

Originally by: Calenth

---

Yeah, exactly. It ain't like BoB doesn't have a history of widely villifying whole alliances for the actions of a few members. In fact, that's pretty much been their entire history from day one ("one of your guys killed one of our frigates, so we're taking your whole region.")

---

Originally by: Dark Shikari

---

Originally by: Calenth

---

Yeah, exactly. It ain't like BoB doesn't have a history of widely villifying whole alliances for the actions of a few members. In fact, that's pretty much been their entire history from day one ("one of your guys killed one of our frigates, so we're taking your whole region.")

---

So using that logic, we should be flaming your whole alliance for the actions of Firstname Lastname about a year ago?

You should be the last alliance to promote villifying thousands of people for the actions of one.

---

Originally by: Del369

---

Edited by: Del369 on 11/02/2007 18:33:58

Originally by: Sinlare

---

Originally by: Qu'ut Nez

---

Originally by: Extra Minty

---

Its all good and well everyone having a go at BoB but the fact remains that it was a select few that were in on this. Your going to hold the whole alliance at the end of a gun barrell because of this?

---

Yes yes, hell yes.

Everything they have ever achieved in-game is now worthless, because it was helped by cheating. Their credibility is gone, they are led by cheaters and liars and they have gotten off very very lightly, to the point of increasing suspicion.

I'm thrilled about seeing most of Eve bandwagon against them, I hope they crumble and I hope most of them quit playing this game as they have done as much as they could to ruin it.

---

You should have your head checked out irl. Something is wrong with you and it is nothing good.

---

When you have to resort to personal insults you've already lost the argument

---

Originally by: Exelsior

---

Most of what BoB achieved was through superiod co-ordination and dedication/time spent, not through cheating.

---

Originally by: Qu'ut Nez

---

Originally by: Exelsior

---

Most of what BoB achieved was through superiod co-ordination and dedication/time spent, not through cheating.

---

When an athlete wins a competition by using illegal substances, 99% of the achievement is his honest efforts in training. The susbtances only give him that last 1% needed to win. But he's still a 100% cheater.

BoB are great at playing Eve, but they are cheaters. There are no ifs or buts about it.

Oh, and that self imposed forum ban applies to alts as well doesn't it?

---

Originally by: Kin Hanyerec

---

Originally by: Kaeten

---

One thing I find still abit funny, when people said BOB were cheating, they were actully cheating. Not that BOB knew of this still makes a little giggle inside.

Tbh BOB (SirMolle) Should make an official BOB post saying sorry or whatever. I'm glad BlackLight and other bobbits admit the facts and have moved on.

If I was t20's boss he'd of been fired too.

---

then you should say sorry too, as you were in rkk once right ?

---

Originally by: Calenth

---

Edited by: Calenth on 11/02/2007 18:40:37

Originally by: Dark Shikari

---

Originally by: Calenth

---

Yeah, exactly. It ain't like BoB doesn't have a history of widely villifying whole alliances for the actions of a few members. In fact, that's pretty much been their entire history from day one ("one of your guys killed one of our frigates, so we're taking your whole region.")

---

So using that logic, we should be flaming your whole alliance for the actions of Firstname Lastname about a year ago?

You should be the last alliance to promote villifying thousands of people for the actions of one.

---

:rolleyes:

I should've known better than to try to make a subtle point on this forum. I didn't say flaming whole alliances for the actions of a few was justified.

I said it was amusing that BoB members are suddenly discovering that, given their past history. Maybe one of the positive results of all this will be that the BoB membership finally learns a little humility.

---

Originally by: Qu'ut Nez

---

Originally by: Extra Minty

---

Its all good and well everyone having a go at BoB but the fact remains that it was a select few that were in on this. Your going to hold the whole alliance at the end of a gun barrell because of this?

---

Yes yes, hell yes.

Everything they have ever achieved in-game is now worthless, because it was helped by cheating. Their credibility is gone, they are led by cheaters and liars and they have gotten off very very lightly, to the point of increasing suspicion.

I'm thrilled about seeing most of Eve bandwagon against them, I hope they crumble and I hope most of them quit playing this game as they have done as much as they could to ruin it.

---

Originally by: Kaeten

---

Originally by: Kin Hanyerec

---

Originally by: Kaeten

---

One thing I find still abit funny, when people said BOB were cheating, they were actully cheating. Not that BOB knew of this still makes a little giggle inside.

Tbh BOB (SirMolle) Should make an official BOB post saying sorry or whatever. I'm glad BlackLight and other bobbits admit the facts and have moved on.

If I was t20's boss he'd of been fired too.

---

then you should say sorry too, as you were in rkk once right ?

---

Yes I was for a very nice 6months. Great bunch of people. My post is abit messed though. even though I was in RKK I had no idea of this. However as a leader and representive of the entire alliance (I'm not a repsentive am I?), I think SirMolle should apologize on the actions that his alliance took. It's not fair to say all of BOB knwe of it because they didn't. It's like your son behaving badly in a public place filled with people. You apologize on his behalf.

O even better. T20 should apologize himself ot the EVE community as he has already apologized to BOB and CCP for his out of tune behaviour.

I wonder how mush ISK BOB made out of it, and if all the isk was taken back?

---

Originally by: Dark Shikari

---

I understand your point, and its sadly all too true. BoB's propaganda is almost solely based on mocking leaders like McCreedy and Cyvok; and now they're going to get it right back at them.

---

Originally by: Exelsior

---

By the way, your logic is flawed and applies only in situations where that 1% helps to win, such as athletic situations. Please don't tell me that BoB won the ASCN war by a 1% advantage, it was more like 2-3 times advantage. Same with many other BoB wars.

---

Originally by: Dark Shikari

---

Originally by: Calenth

---

Yeah, exactly. It ain't like BoB doesn't have a history of widely villifying whole alliances for the actions of a few members. In fact, that's pretty much been their entire history from day one ("one of your guys killed one of our frigates, so we're taking your whole region.")

---

So using that logic, we should be flaming your whole alliance for the actions of Firstname Lastname about a year ago?

You should be the last alliance to promote villifying thousands of people for the actions of one.

---

Originally by: Frogzuk

---

One wonders if the lack of response in form of statement from the usual bob forum warriors means one of the following things

1) they are eating humble pie

2) they have been banned and cant actually respond

---

Originally by: Dinamita Tona

---

Why have we let our hate and rage and blind anger toward someone that plays better than me blind me from seeing my own mistakes and letting ebil BoB exploit situation?

---

Originally by: Kaeten

---

Tbh BOB (SirMolle) Should make an official BOB post saying sorry or whatever. I'm glad BlackLight and other bobbits admit the facts and have moved on.

---

Originally by: Qu'ut Nez

---

Originally by: Dinamita Tona

---

Why have we let our hate and rage and blind anger toward someone that plays better than me blind me from seeing my own mistakes and letting ebil BoB exploit situation?

---

Because they are cheaters and liars, have you not been following the news?

---

Originally by: Dinamita Tona

---

would a hug help?

---

Originally by: Extra Minty

---

Are you forgetting that D2 illegally used forum IP addressess to ban people? Whats worse? Imo D2, dont see anyone with torches and stakes burning down their doors.

---

Originally by: Dinamita Tona

---

Originally by: Qu'ut Nez

---

Originally by: Dinamita Tona

---

Why have we let our hate and rage and blind anger toward someone that plays better than me blind me from seeing my own mistakes and letting ebil BoB exploit situation?

---

Because they are cheaters and liars, have you not been following the news?

---

no they aren't. you are attention seeking little poor man that is in corporation that achieved nothing and that is jaleus to BoB successes so now that happened that one of CCP employees that have right to play this game same as you or me cheated and that it happened to be BoB now you marked whole alliance as cheaters.

imho that only shows how poor and little and bitter you are?

would a hug help?

---

Originally by: merc999

---

Should Sir Molle make an apology on behalf of the the boB alliance?

It depends on wether you think that the leadership of BoB had any idea that T20 was a dev, that the BPO's were illegally (in game terms) aquirred, and wether they knew about the Cynonet account sharing.
I think there is ample proof enough that Sir Molle knew about ALL of the above.

Also there is the question of wether Sir Molle account should be suspended for revealing the real life identity of the whistleblower on these forums, albeit briefly before he edited the post. If the whistleblower had is account banned for exactly this "crime" why is Sir Molles account still active?.

BoB are failing to take any responsibilty for thesse events/actions and CCP are taking a one sided approach to dealing with these EULA breaches.

Either Sir Molle should be banned or Kugutsemen's accoumnts should be re-instated.

---

Originally by: Allen Deckard

---

d2 didn't have the people that write the code of the game doing it for them.

---

Originally by: Dinamita Tona

---

You don't like BoB? Its simple take ship and go shoot them, vent your frustration.

---

Originally by: Avernus

---

My first and only response in any of these related threads;

How long are people going to drag BoB over the coals on this? I highly doubt anyone here of sound mind believes for a moment that more than a fraction of a fraction of all of the BoB members had any inkling what was going on. My personal beliefs don't come into it, the tag under my name is susceptible to flame simply for my alliance standings with BoB.

The level of spite displayed here towards a group of players, the utterly vast majority of whom bear zero responsibility whatsoever in this matter, is frankly sickening. The will displayed to punish people who have no guilt is fueled by alternating motives of envy, hatred, cowardice, political aspirations and propaganda based bull. Did you recently cut them off yourselves or did you choose to create your characters to be eunuchs?

To doubt that this hasn't been given the highest level of attention by CCP is to name yourself a fool; name one other incident in the long history of incidents in Eve that has ever garnered a public response by the CEO of CCP himself.

Find some self respect so that you can figure out how to show some respect to others; people used to say that the greatest thing about Eve is its community, that high watermark is shamefully sinking fast.

---

Originally by: Allen Deckard

---

d2 didn't have the people that write the code of the game doing it for them.

---

Quote:

---

Another bitter small BoB hater that cant do anything against them instead spamming forums with ****load of crap. You don't like BoB? Its simple take ship and go shoot them, vent your frustration.

---

Originally by: Qu'ut Nez

---

Originally by: Exelsior

---

By the way, your logic is flawed and applies only in situations where that 1% helps to win, such as athletic situations. Please don't tell me that BoB won the ASCN war by a 1% advantage, it was more like 2-3 times advantage. Same with many other BoB wars.

---

I love it when then morally corrupt justify themselves with semantics and technicalities.

BoB would probably have won the ASCN war without cheating. They would probably have succeeded in the same things and enjoyed the same reputation and status.

But those are ifs and buts, and as I mentioned above there are no ifs or buts about this. They are cheaters. Whatever glories of the past went by without the help of the actual cheating, those glories were won by cheaters.

The cheaters and liars who beat their own chest loudest, remember? The ones, knowing full well what they were doing, that would proudly announce their superiority over the other players.

CCP will only deal with symbolic wrist slaps and damage control. So what the players can do, besides quitting the game, is set eachother +10 and bandwagon against BoB for punishment.

Just don't shoot the Sabres first, no real financial loss anyway.

---

Originally by: Qu'ut Nez

---

Originally by: Dinamita Tona

---

You don't like BoB? Its simple take ship and go shoot them, vent your frustration.

---

Guess what most of Eve is about to do.

---

Originally by: merc999

---

Quote:

---

Another bitter small BoB hater that cant do anything against them instead spamming forums with ****load of crap. You don't like BoB? Its simple take ship and go shoot them, vent your frustration.

---

I do.. and I die and go get another one and go out again, and will continue to do so.

However unlike you my post is not full of meaningless vitriol but contains facts and questions that are pertinent.

---

Originally by: Kaeten

---

Originally by: Kin Hanyerec

---

Originally by: Kaeten

---

One thing I find still abit funny, when people said BOB were cheating, they were actully cheating. Not that BOB knew of this still makes a little giggle inside.

Tbh BOB (SirMolle) Should make an official BOB post saying sorry or whatever. I'm glad BlackLight and other bobbits admit the facts and have moved on.

If I was t20's boss he'd of been fired too.

---

then you should say sorry too, as you were in rkk once right ?

---

Yes I was for a very nice 6months. Great bunch of people. My post is abit messed though. even though I was in RKK I had no idea of this. However as a leader and representive of the entire alliance (I'm not a repsentive am I?), I think SirMolle should apologize on the actions that his alliance took. It's not fair to say all of BOB knwe of it because they didn't. It's like your son behaving badly in a public place filled with people. You apologize on his behalf.

O even better. T20 should apologize himself ot the EVE community as he has already apologized to BOB and CCP for his out of tune behaviour.

I wonder how mush ISK BOB made out of it, and if all the isk was taken back?

---

Originally by: Qu'ut Nez

---

Originally by: Exelsior

---

By the way, your logic is flawed and applies only in situations where that 1% helps to win, such as athletic situations. Please don't tell me that BoB won the ASCN war by a 1% advantage, it was more like 2-3 times advantage. Same with many other BoB wars.

---

I love it when then morally corrupt justify themselves with semantics and technicalities.

BoB would probably have won the ASCN war without cheating. They would probably have succeeded in the same things and enjoyed the same reputation and status.

But those are ifs and buts, and as I mentioned above there are no ifs or buts about this. They are cheaters. Whatever glories of the past went by without the help of the actual cheating, those glories were won by cheaters.

The cheaters and liars who beat their own chest loudest, remember? The ones, knowing full well what they were doing, that would proudly announce their superiority over the other players.

CCP will only deal with symbolic wrist slaps and damage control. So what the players can do, besides quitting the game, is set eachother +10 and bandwagon against BoB for punishment.

Just don't shoot the Sabres first, no real financial loss anyway.

---

Originally by: SPQRMocton

---

We would love to have a bunch of teenage pimple boys with no real pvp ability to fil our corpse yards

---

Quote:

---

1 dev gave himself Bpo's

---

Originally by: Sinlare

---

Originally by: merc999

---

Quote:

---

Another bitter small BoB hater that cant do anything against them instead spamming forums with ****load of crap. You don't like BoB? Its simple take ship and go shoot them, vent your frustration.

---

I do.. and I die and go get another one and go out again, and will continue to do so.

However unlike you my post is not full of meaningless vitriol but contains facts and questions that are pertinent.

---

Fact: S n i g g e r d l y supports hackers. Everyone knows it is no coincidence your members just happen to host his site.

---

Originally by: Sinlare

---

S n i g g e r d l y supports hackers. Everyone knows it is no coincidence your members just happen to host his site.

---

Originally by: merc999

---

Actualy we have to come clean here, S******dly is actually made up of WoW dev's who are ****ed at losing out at this years awards to Eve and have decided to bring the game down from within..

This is all our fault T20 and the BoB leadership have in fact done nothing wrong at all,. and any confessions by T20 and the CCP CEO were forced out of them on pain of being hit with a big magic sword

---

Quote:

---

You guys just admitted siding with a hacker and condoning illegal actions out of game for in game gain, you can step down from your high horse now.

---

Quote:

---

This is a matter that CCP needed to sort out

---

Originally by: merc999

---

Quote:

---

You guys just admitted siding with a hacker and condoning illegal actions out of game for in game gain, you can step down from your high horse now.

---

try reading comprension 101 again, you clearly failed first time.

I havent condemned or condoned the methods used to gain any information.

I have only stated the known facts about BoB's leaderships abuse of the EULA and T20's admission about the BPO's.

Your posts would be noticed far more if you tried at least to address the issues.

---

Originally by: merc999

---

Reading comprension again..

I have made it very clear that it is BoBs leadership who knew about this EULA transgressions that should take responsibilty for them.

---

Originally by: invaderzim

---

It's possible that we've not seen an official bob response because they've been asked not to.

---

Originally by: merc999

---

Edited by: merc999 on 11/02/2007 19:56:36
BoB ran a cynonet allowing sharing of accounts in breach of the EULA
Sir Molle revealed RL information on another player on the forums a breach of the EULA

---

Originally by: kieron

---

If anyone has evidence of account sharing in a cynonet network on the part of players, submit a petition. The GM team will investigage the evidence in the petition and take appropriate action.

---

Originally by: merc999

---

No
because I went to a website that I had no knowledge about until all this started, and read the proof.

Unlike you I make my mind up, not out of loyalty, or freindship but by reading the evidence presented and making my own judgement.

Are you really niave enough to believe that if the whistleblower hadnt bought this out in to the open we would ever know about T20's illegal activities, about how the BoB leadership have breached the EULA, and how CCP have refused to take action over those EULA breaches?

---

Originally by: Adril Alatar

---

Originally by: merc999

---

Edited by: merc999 on 11/02/2007 19:56:36
BoB ran a cynonet allowing sharing of accounts in breach of the EULA
Sir Molle revealed RL information on another player on the forums a breach of the EULA

---

Can i point you to this thread?

http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=473490

Originally by: kieron

---

If anyone has evidence of account sharing in a cynonet network on the part of players, submit a petition. The GM team will investigage the evidence in the petition and take appropriate action.

---

---

Originally by: invaderzim

---

It's possible that we've not seen an official bob response because they've been asked not to.

---

Originally by: Darkstar BP

---

Two days ago it became clear there was a Dev high up in BoB, actively supporting BoB, with CCP not fixing it for 6 months

---

Originally by: Kieron

---

Internally, this incident was discovered over the summer (...) T20 was punished at the time for his misconduct. To terminate t20's employment now would appease some of the more emotional members of the community, but it would also be unfair to punish someone twice for the same misconduct.

---

Originally by: Ben Derindar

---

It *was* dealt with at the time, therefore the current witchhunt lies somewhere between "unnecessary" and "misdirected".

/Ben

---

Originally by: Dungar Loghoth

---

Originally by: invaderzim

---

It's possible that we've not seen an official bob response because they've been asked not to.

---

They've ordered a forum black-out, so many of their members have resorted to alts, like Sinclare and Kcel Chim. They're hoping this blows over and everyone forgets, which is fairly obvious by the sad attempts by said alts to try and deflect attention away from the core issues (because logging is a lot like getting a heads-up from your developer friends about upcoming events and gratis sabre BPOs right?).

Or maybe what Dianabolic was talking about when he said "i even told you about the t20 secrets ffs" referred to something else? Not like it matters though, anything they ever say again is likely to be written off as a lie anyway.

On a side note, I was saddened when the .5. announced they were disbanding and putting the alliance to bed. Resorting to using it as a shell-corporation to alt-post with is a disgrace to everything they accomplished.

---

Originally by: Dungar Loghoth

---

Kcel Chim

---

Originally by: Dungar Loghoth

---

Originally by: Ben Derindar

---

It *was* dealt with at the time, therefore the current witchhunt lies somewhere between "unnecessary" and "misdirected".

/Ben

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By dealt with, do you mean the part where they let t20 keep his character in BoB, even though all of the upper-management knew he was a dev, or the part where they let BoB keep all the spawned BPOs, that they knew he spawned for BoB?

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Originally by: Dark Shikari

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a) At the time BoB management did not know he was a dev.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dianabolic
dimensionZ wrote:
...hell even t20 secret infos i had in the past, i trusted u all with those.


Except you didn't, did you? You knew his character (or said you did) and you said "I can't tell you, I promised".

Tue Nov 29, 2005 10:09 pm

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Originally by: Dungar Loghoth

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Originally by: Ben Derindar

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It *was* dealt with at the time, therefore the current witchhunt lies somewhere between "unnecessary" and "misdirected".

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By dealt with, do you mean the part where they let t20 keep his character in BoB, even though all of the upper-management knew he was a dev, or the part where they let BoB keep all the spawned BPOs, that they knew he spawned for BoB?

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Originally by: Ben Derindar

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As for BoB being aware of any wrongdoing, it's pretty clear from the quotes posted at the beginning of this very thread that they're as shocked and surprised by all this as the rest of us.

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Originally by: Dungar Loghoth

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dianabolic
dimensionZ wrote:
...hell even t20 secret infos i had in the past, i trusted u all with those.


Except you didn't, did you? You knew his character (or said you did) and you said "I can't tell you, I promised".

Tue Nov 29, 2005 10:09 pm

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Originally by: Dungar Loghoth

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dianabolic
dimensionZ wrote:
...hell even t20 secret infos i had in the past, i trusted u all with those.


Except you didn't, did you? You knew his character (or said you did) and you said "I can't tell you, I promised".

Tue Nov 29, 2005 10:09 pm

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Originally by: Ben Derindar

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That only proves that some of the higher-ups knew who he was, and not that they knew he had abused his position. It's called confidentiality, something that your friend Kug knows all about how not to violate.

/Ben

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Originally by: Dungar Loghoth

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The fact that they knew who he was means he was abusing his position, as it is against CCP's own rules to disclose developer status to anyone.

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Originally by: Dinamita Tona

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whole lotta stuff

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