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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Crumplecorn
Gallente
Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.03.21 01:09:00 -
[31]
 Originally by: Vabjekf
You have obviously never played a game that had intigrated free voice communication.
That is true. What am I missing?
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If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine. |
Dark Flare
Caldari
Corpus PCG
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Posted - 2007.03.21 01:13:00 -
[32]
Well, I don't care what you nay-sayers think. I like it.
Used it most of tonight on a "Gang" window, worked brilliantly, hardly ANY breakup at all, and absolutely no issues with it. Top notch stuff if you ask me.
Good job CCP, and I'll probably be paying for this Vivox stuff when the 30day trial of it runs out :)
Dark Flare - Corpus PCG |
Vabjekf
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.03.21 01:15:00 -
[33]
You become required to use it at all times everywhere. And you get to listen to random people laughing at themselves or freaking out or paniking or generaly being idiots and asses and whatnot. Little kids or high strung wierdos.
Its kind of funny at times. But the problem is that you are never able to turn it off or else you basicaly just may aswell turn the whole game off because nobody will play with you.
The fact that this has a required pay means that everyone can not expect everyone to have it, and therefore it will not become the default means of communication. This is a gigantic blessing. Because games like DDO which had intigrated voice where just terrible to play sometimes because you had to listen to play but listening was so painful=p
Voice is good for situations where it actualy helps. But all the time? Dont people ever like to listen to music anymore? Or just sit in silence sometimes?
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Crumplecorn
Gallente
Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.03.21 01:19:00 -
[34]
Edited by: Crumplecorn on 21/03/2007 01:16:16
Originally by: Vabjekf
You become required to use it at all times everywhere. And you get to listen to random people laughing at themselves or freaking out or paniking or generaly being idiots and asses and whatnot. Little kids or high strung wierdos.
Its kind of funny at times. But the problem is that you are never able to turn it off or else you basicaly just may aswell turn the whole game off because nobody will play with you.
The fact that this has a required pay means that everyone can not expect everyone to have it, and therefore it will not become the default means of communication. This is a gigantic blessing. Because games like DDO which had intigrated voice where just terrible to play sometimes because you had to listen to play but listening was so painful=p
Voice is good for situations where it actualy helps. But all the time? Dont people ever like to listen to music anymore? Or just sit in silence sometimes?
I don't know exactly how the systems you are referring to are implemented, but in Vivox each channel is essentially its own voice server. This problem will occur no more with Vivox than it did with TS/Vent.
For those for whom VOIP will be required, it already is required. For the rest of us, it will always be optional.
Plus in Eve you can shoot people who act the maggot.
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If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine. |
Lygos
Finis Actum
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Posted - 2007.03.21 01:25:00 -
[35]
Edited by: Lygos on 21/03/2007 01:23:46
The only area in which Vivox might be truly useful is in talking to people with whom you might not habitually talk. Otherwise, 3rd party clients are a more efficient use of hardware resources.
For example, in a ransom situation, it might be as useful as T2 Hatemail. If this is not possible, then it's not worth it. If it's just going to get a lot of regular civil extortionists banned, then it's silly.
If people only used Vivox in a lighter capacity, as in adhoc communications or trading, then I could see the bandwidth reqs dropping, and perhaps a discounted service. It won't be around if it doesn't pay the bills, and there's also the concern that the EVE community is still quite small for an online service.
Hopefully Vivox will have some success in EVE, and then other games, and the pricing and options will become more competitive.
---
T2 Risk | Corp Divisions |
Daelin Blackleaf
No Joy Corp
Pride - Honor - Duty
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Posted - 2007.03.21 01:40:00 -
[36]
More competitive?
I'm poor... heck I'm poorer than poor. I eats my Tesco Value and drinks my Traitors Gate (1ltr of Vodka for less than a packet of cigarettes... if you can bring yourself to drink it) so I can afford to give the little un's walkers crisps and Bernard Matthews turkey dinosaurs.
I'm as poor as all that, I gots no job, my government taxes me to the hilt, I lives in a cruddy over-priced little village, can't afford a car, and the benefits for parents never seem to go up with the prices and you know what... I can afford Vivox.
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Fuujin
hirr
Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.03.21 01:47:00 -
[37]
$10 for a year? Sign me up!
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Armin Novastorm
Gallente
I-Omniscient-I
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Posted - 2007.03.21 01:48:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Crumplecorn
Edited by: Crumplecorn on 21/03/2007 01:16:16
Originally by: Vabjekf
You become required to use it at all times everywhere. And you get to listen to random people laughing at themselves or freaking out or paniking or generaly being idiots and asses and whatnot. Little kids or high strung wierdos.
Its kind of funny at times. But the problem is that you are never able to turn it off or else you basicaly just may aswell turn the whole game off because nobody will play with you.
The fact that this has a required pay means that everyone can not expect everyone to have it, and therefore it will not become the default means of communication. This is a gigantic blessing. Because games like DDO which had intigrated voice where just terrible to play sometimes because you had to listen to play but listening was so painful=p
Voice is good for situations where it actualy helps. But all the time? Dont people ever like to listen to music anymore? Or just sit in silence sometimes?
I don't know exactly how the systems you are referring to are implemented, but in Vivox each channel is essentially its own voice server. This problem will occur no more with Vivox than it did with TS/Vent.
For those for whom VOIP will be required, it already is required. For the rest of us, it will always be optional.
Plus in Eve you can shoot people who act the maggot.
Not in high sec, but im guessin you almost never go there.
P.S. Cant find the difficulty slider, can you help me locate it?
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Salusa VC
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Posted - 2007.03.21 01:53:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Smagd
Originally by: Geldorf Drakar
As well I am supprised at CCPs naivety, thinking that Users would turn to an integrated voice client which they have to pay for, when nearly everyone has a TS or Vent server available for use, free I might add.
You have someone who provides free TS servers? As in noone has to pay their bandwidth? Sign me up please, I'll bring 400 alliance mates.
You miss the point. If each and every one of your alliance mates pay up for IVC thats $4k.
I reckon you can get some dedicated TS/Vent bandwith for a fraction of that, dont you?
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Crumplecorn
Gallente
Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.03.21 02:02:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Armin Novastorm
Originally by: Crumplecorn
Edited by: Crumplecorn on 21/03/2007 01:16:16
Originally by: Vabjekf
You become required to use it at all times everywhere. And you get to listen to random people laughing at themselves or freaking out or paniking or generaly being idiots and asses and whatnot. Little kids or high strung wierdos.
Its kind of funny at times. But the problem is that you are never able to turn it off or else you basicaly just may aswell turn the whole game off because nobody will play with you.
The fact that this has a required pay means that everyone can not expect everyone to have it, and therefore it will not become the default means of communication. This is a gigantic blessing. Because games like DDO which had intigrated voice where just terrible to play sometimes because you had to listen to play but listening was so painful=p
Voice is good for situations where it actualy helps. But all the time? Dont people ever like to listen to music anymore? Or just sit in silence sometimes?
I don't know exactly how the systems you are referring to are implemented, but in Vivox each channel is essentially its own voice server. This problem will occur no more with Vivox than it did with TS/Vent.
For those for whom VOIP will be required, it already is required. For the rest of us, it will always be optional.
Plus in Eve you can shoot people who act the maggot.
Not in high sec, but im guessin you almost never go there.
P.S. Cant find the difficulty slider, can you help me locate it?
I'm in highsec quite often, and am willing to accept the limitations 
Ask Frug about the slider :p
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If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine. |
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Crumplecorn
Gallente
Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.03.21 02:02:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Armin Novastorm
Originally by: Crumplecorn
Edited by: Crumplecorn on 21/03/2007 01:16:16
Originally by: Vabjekf
You become required to use it at all times everywhere. And you get to listen to random people laughing at themselves or freaking out or paniking or generaly being idiots and asses and whatnot. Little kids or high strung wierdos.
Its kind of funny at times. But the problem is that you are never able to turn it off or else you basicaly just may aswell turn the whole game off because nobody will play with you.
The fact that this has a required pay means that everyone can not expect everyone to have it, and therefore it will not become the default means of communication. This is a gigantic blessing. Because games like DDO which had intigrated voice where just terrible to play sometimes because you had to listen to play but listening was so painful=p
Voice is good for situations where it actualy helps. But all the time? Dont people ever like to listen to music anymore? Or just sit in silence sometimes?
I don't know exactly how the systems you are referring to are implemented, but in Vivox each channel is essentially its own voice server. This problem will occur no more with Vivox than it did with TS/Vent.
For those for whom VOIP will be required, it already is required. For the rest of us, it will always be optional.
Plus in Eve you can shoot people who act the maggot.
Not in high sec, but im guessin you almost never go there.
P.S. Cant find the difficulty slider, can you help me locate it?
I'm in highsec quite often, and am willing to accept the limitations
Ask Frug about the slider :p
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If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine. |
Soulita
Gallente
Inner Core
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Posted - 2007.03.21 02:08:00 -
[42]
Edited by: Soulita on 21/03/2007 02:05:25
Originally by: Phrixus Zephyr
Do you really think there is any corp or alliance out there, which relies on voice communication that is going to have even close to the majority of its members buying this feature? No? So what's the point of anyone buying it if your corperation/alliance isn't going to use it because a large portion of your member base can't afford it?
I'm half expecting to see threads in recruitment asking for 'VOIP Only' but to be honest, it'll be their loss when they limit their recruitment pool to such an extent.
Exactly.
Voip is anti-social because it costs extra, and because it splits the community. Fairly bad for a piece of software that is meant for communication. 
Also fairly bad to introduce anti-social software into an mmorpg. Sort of counter-productive.
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Soulita
Gallente
Inner Core
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Posted - 2007.03.21 02:08:00 -
[43]
Edited by: Soulita on 21/03/2007 02:14:10
Edited by: Soulita on 21/03/2007 02:05:25
Originally by: Phrixus Zephyr
Do you really think there is any corp or alliance out there, which relies on voice communication that is going to have even close to the majority of its members buying this feature? No? So what's the point of anyone buying it if your corperation/alliance isn't going to use it because a large portion of your member base can't afford it?
I'm half expecting to see threads in recruitment asking for 'VOIP Only' but to be honest, it'll be their loss when they limit their recruitment pool to such an extent.
Exactly.
Voip is anti-social because it costs extra, and because it splits the community. Fairly bad for a piece of software that is meant for communication.
Also fairly bad to introduce anti-social software into an mmorpg. Sort of counter-productive.
If Voip was free, like voice com is in many other games, it might make sense.
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Devious
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Posted - 2007.03.21 02:13:00 -
[44]
its got techhi issues i know my corp wont use it, ventrillo has much more features and yes if we crash or the game crashes we have a 3rd party ap to continue speaking on..vivox has a ton of bugs....i did the sisi test with it when they first released it ..it sounded a lot better then than it does now....also the options are a bit fubar should just let the Windows Xp/vista Deal with the audio/mic settings having a 2nd EQ in game doesnt help, as if your playing music speech gets drowned out by it...in game sounds have to be turned off to even understand what a fellow player is talking about...something has to be done with the audio output levels of this eve voice...i have to shout into my mic...not a good thing in a busy household late at night...Ventrillo can stream my whispers why cant vivox?
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Xetu Noi
DKP
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Posted - 2007.03.21 02:17:00 -
[45]
I think you folks are missing the REAL benefit to an in game voice system: security. TS & Vent are a security nightmare, both out of game by making you vulnerable personally to identification and attack by hackers and in game by revealing your identity across multiple characters and allowing for meta gaming attacks and intel gathering....
It amazes me in this day and age the people still log onto TS/Vent servers they don't control. Its the IRC nightmare of the MMO world.
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Crumplecorn
Gallente
Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.03.21 02:23:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Soulita
Edited by: Soulita on 21/03/2007 02:14:10
Edited by: Soulita on 21/03/2007 02:05:25
Originally by: Phrixus Zephyr
Do you really think there is any corp or alliance out there, which relies on voice communication that is going to have even close to the majority of its members buying this feature? No? So what's the point of anyone buying it if your corperation/alliance isn't going to use it because a large portion of your member base can't afford it?
I'm half expecting to see threads in recruitment asking for 'VOIP Only' but to be honest, it'll be their loss when they limit their recruitment pool to such an extent.
Exactly.
Voip is anti-social because it costs extra, and because it splits the community. Fairly bad for a piece of software that is meant for communication.
Also fairly bad to introduce anti-social software into an mmorpg. Sort of counter-productive.
If Voip was free, like voice com is in many other games, it might make sense.
To find out why this argument is crap, read up.
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If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine. |
Soulita
Gallente
Inner Core
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Posted - 2007.03.21 02:26:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Crumplecorn
Originally by: Soulita
Edited by: Soulita on 21/03/2007 02:14:10
Edited by: Soulita on 21/03/2007 02:05:25
Originally by: Phrixus Zephyr
Do you really think there is any corp or alliance out there, which relies on voice communication that is going to have even close to the majority of its members buying this feature? No? So what's the point of anyone buying it if your corperation/alliance isn't going to use it because a large portion of your member base can't afford it?
I'm half expecting to see threads in recruitment asking for 'VOIP Only' but to be honest, it'll be their loss when they limit their recruitment pool to such an extent.
Exactly.
Voip is anti-social because it costs extra, and because it splits the community. Fairly bad for a piece of software that is meant for communication.
Also fairly bad to introduce anti-social software into an mmorpg. Sort of counter-productive.
If Voip was free, like voice com is in many other games, it might make sense.
To find out why this argument is crap, read up.
Bull. You read up. Dont get me started.
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Cmdr Delrox
Black Lance
Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2007.03.21 02:32:00 -
[48]
I like the new addition of the voice to game.
TS for alliance, ventrillo for corp and Vivox for random groups of people to talk to.
Alt Posting
Death to Dark Shikari |
Flinx Evenstar
Minmatar
Momentum.
Dusk and Dawn
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Posted - 2007.03.21 02:48:00 -
[49]
The biggest problem I see with integrated Voice.
It means that when you crash, or lose connection to server...you also lose voice comms.
Not great in a fleet battle, when you have no idea what is going on as you try to log back in.
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heheheh
Singularity.
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Posted - 2007.03.21 02:48:00 -
[50]
Sounds alright if you like that sort of thing,
personally i wont be using it, My alliance have vent for ops and other than that i dont feel the need to talk to people, i go out to the pub or something if i wanna do that.
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Depp Knight
Evolution
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.03.21 03:43:00 -
[51]
If the voice client crashes when the game is down then that would just suck, period. DoesnĘt matter what other features it has, thatĘs a huge flaw. I honestly believe if that was the case that most large alliance would continue to use their 3rd party program for voice communication. Also the price is a bit steep. TS is not free but for a large corp/alliance to pay 15 dollars/euros or whatever it is per person, is expensive. Think about it, a 200 player alliance decides they want to use it, it will cost 3 grand total. Now what I do know that TS does not cost 3 grand to use every year. Also what if you leave a corp that use this eve speak and join one that doesnĘt. You have just pretty much wasted your cash for a feature that you will rarely use.
IMO itĘs just an up sell for a product. Just a way to get more money to CCP but unless the price drops down and the voice com doesnĘt crash and the maintenance of it is only used in large patch days then I donĘt see a reason for one to use it. Of course to have the ability to chat to anyone in the world of eve is great however would you pay for that plus eve subscription to chat to strangers?
From what I read it has some great features but the 2 major flaws, Price, and crashing is a step in the wrong direction.
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Verite Rendition
Caldari
AUS Corporation
CORE.
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Posted - 2007.03.21 05:51:00 -
[52]
Edited by: Verite Rendition on 21/03/2007 05:49:33
Originally by: Depp Knight
If the voice client crashes when the game is down then that would just suck, period. DoesnĘt matter what other features it has, thatĘs a huge flaw. I honestly believe if that was the case that most large alliance would continue to use their 3rd party program for voice communication. Also the price is a bit steep. TS is not free but for a large corp/alliance to pay 15 dollars/euros or whatever it is per person, is expensive. Think about it, a 200 player alliance decides they want to use it, it will cost 3 grand total. Now what I do know that TS does not cost 3 grand to use every year. Also what if you leave a corp that use this eve speak and join one that doesnĘt. You have just pretty much wasted your cash for a feature that you will rarely use.
IMO itĘs just an up sell for a product. Just a way to get more money to CCP but unless the price drops down and the voice com doesnĘt crash and the maintenance of it is only used in large patch days then I donĘt see a reason for one to use it. Of course to have the ability to chat to anyone in the world of eve is great however would you pay for that plus eve subscription to chat to strangers?
From what I read it has some great features but the 2 major flaws, Price, and crashing is a step in the wrong direction.
I've actually run the math on the costs and it isn't in CCP's favor. I can get a TS or Vent server from one of the major gaming-service provider for what comes out to $.21/month/slot once we're talking about more than a couple dozen slots. That's a whole $2.52 a year/slot versus the $10 CCP is charging now and $15 they'll charge in the future, for a cost of 1/4th and 1/6th the CCP service. And this isn't taking in to consideration the fact that you only need to pay for the max amount of slots you'll use instead of activating every EVE account(a peak server capacity would be what? 1/2 the total of most alliances at any given point) which pushes the cost of a dedicated server to under 10% of the cost of the EVE service*. Certainly CCP has costs to pay including bandwidth and development, but given the numbers it strikes me as steep.
And yes, the fact that it crashes with the game makes it unacceptable in the current form for any sort of 0.0 fleet combat use.
* Given the half-full rule, you'd spend an average of $1.26/year per account versus $15/year for the EVE service
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AUS Corp
Lead Megalomanic |
Anthal
Order's Chaos
FREGE Alliance
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Posted - 2007.03.21 05:54:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Salusa VC
You miss the point. If each and every one of your alliance mates pay up for IVC thats $4k.
I reckon you can get some dedicated TS/Vent bandwith for a fraction of that, dont you?
400 man Vent server, same place I rent from, is $150 a month.
12 * 150 = $1800 per year.
If your alliance is only 400 people strong, you can knock that down to a 200 man easily (because, honestly, what are the chances that more than that will be on vent at the same time?). A 200 man is $60 a month, or $720 per year.
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Latex Sandals
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Posted - 2007.03.21 06:08:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Crumplecorn
I mean, 1000 person alliance times $1 a month can buy a lot of server.
So you can have one TS server which is tied to your alliance, or all have voice coms which work with anyone else in the game?
That's a tough choice.
That's an easy choice. I'll take the non-integrated server that is running on a second computer so that it doesn't lag out the main one.
I'll take the free option that has superior sound quality and that doesn't crash when the game client does.
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Crumplecorn
Gallente
Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.03.21 07:41:00 -
[55]
Edited by: Crumplecorn on 21/03/2007 07:39:03
Originally by: Latex Sandals
That's an easy choice. I'll take the non-integrated server that is running on a second computer so that it doesn't lag out the main one.
This could refer to either, since it is the client which is integrated,
Originally by: Latex Sandals
I'll take the free option that has superior sound quality and that doesn't crash when the game client does.
This can't refer to either, since neither are free.
Try again.
And looking at the other responses, people are still comparing a service which lets you talk with anyone via in-game channels vs. a server which is tied to your own corp/alliance as if they are the same thing.
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If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine. |
Varrakk
Chosen Path
Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2007.03.21 08:50:00 -
[56]
Would I have to buy Vivox access on every account, or is it once per person?
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Juwi Kotch
Gallente
VIRTUAL LIFE VANGUARD
Galactic-Federation
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Posted - 2007.03.21 08:52:00 -
[57]
Edited by: Juwi Kotch on 21/03/2007 08:49:40
The voice-chat function is in fact splitting the Eve community into those who have, and those who don't. Plus, we have the language issue, for many it is much easier to read and write then to listen and talk (ever talked to a Louisiana guy, or someone from northern Scotland?).
Having said that, voice-chat is a natural development step of MMOGs. In 10 years from now that will be a standard function of any MMOG which wants to be regarded serious, probably even in 5 years already. It will be an integral part then, and not just an option you can volunteer to pay for or not. So we just better get used to it.
I personally will order it, but I doubt I will use it much. I have sound switched off very often, and even no radio running in the background, I enjoy silence. But I think it is a good option to have, and it will have its uses and advantages.
Juwi Kotch
JOIN NOW, KLICK SIG! |
w0rmy
Intensive CareBearz
TALIONIS ALLIANCE
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Posted - 2007.03.21 09:00:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Baleorg
in fact when you DONT subscribe you wont even notice its there since it wont
Oh you mean like not noticing local appear?
The bug he wont have to experience because hes not using Vivox?
It has already caused bugs, the same thing CCP swore black and blue it wouldnt.
Whether we use it or not, we all get the bugs that come with it.
Your signature is inappropriate. Please read the forum rules before reposting- Tirg |
Garia666
Amarr
adeptus gattacus
O X I D E
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Posted - 2007.03.21 09:22:00 -
[59]
I agree a 100% with Geldorf.
CCp should actualy pay alliances to use it instead of the otherway around.
->My Vids<- CCP= More skilz more moneh! |
Karim alRashid
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Posted - 2007.03.21 09:48:00 -
[60]
I'd like to know what measures are taken to prevent devs, GMs, etc. from eavesdropping on enemy alliance/corp channels (where applicable).
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