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Tux mind having a look ? (Blockade runner issue)

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Et alii The Syndicate.	Posted - 2007.03.21 00:40:00 - [1] With the change to nanos i started to test new fittings for my viator and after trying alot of different fittings the best result i got was a 7 second align from standing still, now i don't have the time before this patch but im sure of that it warped alot faster before the change. 7 second aling and warp was with 3x local i-stabs , i tried all variations with local i-stabs/overdrives/nanos. 7 seconds is plenty time for a BS to lock u if it has 1x T2 sensor booster, a interceptor can lock u get in orbit and start shooting in that time even if he's slow in he's reactions. In my disapointment with this change i decided to try an IT V with the same fitting and to my suprise it warped in 7 seconds aswell. So my question and concern is, what makes the viator even deserve the attribute "blockade runner" after this change, the IT V has more lows, cargo, rig slots. The only thing u gain is +2 warp core strenght and some resists and the +2 is something u can get due to the extra lows.
Valandril Caldari Resurrection R i s e	Posted - 2007.03.21 00:46:00 - [2] +2 = u need 2 ceptors to scramble you (no one use 7,5km scram this days). + u still can fit wcses in low slots. --------
Et alii The Syndicate.	Posted - 2007.03.21 00:50:00 - [3] Yes +2 that i can get on the IT V and still get the same warp time. And if i fit stabs in low the warp time gets even higher so hardy an argument.
Hoshi Blackguard Brigade	Posted - 2007.03.21 00:53:00 - [4] Edited by: Hoshi on 21/03/2007 00:51:41 The Iterion V have 2 more low slots where it could put stabs so the built in bonus is worth nothing. It's not like the lock speed/range reduction matters to an indy. Blockad runners are the only t2 ships that have LESS slots than their t1 versions. Edit: Btw they have a completely useless bonus from the transport ship skill as well. Most people don't even bother training Transport ships above level 1. ---------------------------------------- A Guide to Scan Probing in Revelations
Olea Avenger Gallente GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.03.21 01:19:00 - [5] Edited by: Olea Avenger on 21/03/2007 01:17:09 My prowler is no longer the ship it used to be. It is true that for a while istabs where better then nano's, but now the use of these ships is pretty much pointless over some of the tech 1 ships. My prowler takes far to long to warp now. It used to be only the fastest of inties could lock me before I entered warp. Now pretty much even hacs and command ships can lock me and put points on me before I can get into warp. The blockade runners have become a lot less useful. The prowler does get a shield boost bonus, but it is almost useless as you can't fit both a MWD and Shield booster without sacrificing one of your lows to a PDU. The amount of shields is almost nothing if you actually start getting attacked. The ship also lacks the get up and go to say run a dictor bubble to the gate. Sign up for the campaign against Angel ratts today.
NIkis Minmatar Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering	Posted - 2007.03.21 01:20:00 - [6] Edited by: NIkis on 21/03/2007 01:24:30 "Blockade runners" are a joke as they are now, not true blockade runners, very far from it actually. The least CCP could do is give them one more lowslot across the board and bubble immunity. As it stands now, deep space transports got more cargo space, better resists, more shield and/or armour (even DOUBLE in some cases), more lows (even after fitting 2 lows with WCS to compensate for the so-called 'bonus' the runners got). Their disadvantage would be a slightly higher align time, slightly lower speed, and higher signature (which doesn't matter when we're talking of camps with inty,af's, and any SB ship as tacklers). So blockade runners are BROKEN. Fix them BEFORE adding new content please. But somehow I doubt that will happen Maybe nerf deep space transports instead ?
Elin	Posted - 2007.03.21 02:21:00 - [7] +1 For this... These ships not blockade runners anymore. Mine is fitted with 2 agility rigs and still have 6 seconds for warping out. With nerf of i-stabs reducing mass, ships became average industrial with with 3 slots moved to build-in WCS. + It lost ~900 m/s of MWD speed. Result: if you try to warp away you get scrambled by anyone who want. If you try to get back to gate you get webbed and killed. Originally by: Valandril +2 = u need 2 ceptors to scramble you (no one use 7,5km scram this days). + u still can fit wcses in low slots. Who uses intis this day ?? Arazu / lachesis with 2 +2 at 20km and you need nothing more.
Lithalnas Amarr Hadean Drive Yards Archaean Cooperative	Posted - 2007.03.21 03:14:00 - [8] 2x WCS II that gives you a warp strength of +6 which means people will have to have 7 scams on you. ------------- Hadean Drive Yards The EvE inflation, 80 Macro miners, 1.5b isk/day
Tunajuice Convergent Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.03.21 03:20:00 - [9] used to be 2 seconds or so.. blockade runners really do need looked at. warp core stab IIs do not exist in game unless they were added in the patch today (well like 5 existed but none for sale)
Elin	Posted - 2007.03.21 04:26:00 - [10] Originally by: Lithalnas 2x WCS II that gives you a warp strength of +6 which means people will have to have 7 scams on you. Lol! You die before you reach half of warp speed. Or ger bumped by someone and die aniway.

BravoFox	Posted - 2007.03.21 04:59:00 - [11] Originally by: Lithalnas 2x WCS II that gives you a warp strength of +6 which means people will have to have 7 scams on you. Since the implementing of Invention (or maybe earlier) WCS II's no longer give a +2 Warp Strength Bonus. They are +1 just like every other WCS. The only difference is the amount it effects your max range and scan resolution. So you'll end up with +4 Warp Strength. You may get through some camps but there are plenty of camps with at least 5 people out there and with a 7+ second align & warp time... likely all 5 people will get their lock before you warp Now Taking Freighter Service Contracts
Riho Gallente Magnificent Beavers Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2007.03.21 07:26:00 - [12] man.. my prorator is slow... i used 2x istabs and 2x expanders on it. lost about 300+ mwd speed (can deal whit it) but allso lost ALOT of agility... even tho those damn things give more bonus to it now. when i get back home ill experiment whit istabs and nanos.. mybe some combination will get me to warp faster Sig killed by MODs.... reworking it Great being Gallente... aint it ? ----------------- YARRRR, sig hijack! -HornFrog -----------------
NIkis Minmatar Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering	Posted - 2007.03.21 08:24:00 - [13] Edited by: NIkis on 21/03/2007 08:25:50 Originally by: BravoFox Originally by: Lithalnas 2x WCS II that gives you a warp strength of +6 which means people will have to have 7 scams on you. Since the implementing of Invention (or maybe earlier) WCS II's no longer give a +2 Warp Strength Bonus. They are +1 just like every other WCS. The only difference is the amount it effects your max range and scan resolution. So you'll end up with +4 Warp Strength. You may get through some camps but there are plenty of camps with at least 5 people out there and with a 7+ second align & warp time... likely all 5 people will get their lock before you warp Looks like someone been away from eve since the WCS been nerfed into oblivion. I always thought and said the WCS II should remain +2 but oh well. Now its time to reap the results. Who cares actually since probably only a handful (read rich b*s) would use them. Oh and if you fit a couple WCS on any industrial as they are now, align time would allow even another industrial to lock and scram you by the time you can warp away. Way broken especially for 'blockade runners' (mock term as it is now) with their lows shortage. Oh and blockade runners were broken even before the nano nerf (read the part about what a real blockade runner would be, above), it just taken this little bit to draw them over the edge so people would notice, THEY SUCK NOW.
Theron Gyrow Gradient Namtz'aar k'in	Posted - 2007.03.21 09:10:00 - [14] How to use a Viator: Fit an improved cloak and MWD. Hope that you won't be within 2km of anything after a jump. Align manually towards your destination (or if within 2km of something, towards some warpable object away from it). Activate MWD, activate cloak. Wait until MWD turns off, deactivate cloak, warp instantly. No Iteron can do that without using low slots for grid boosters. That said, they could use some agility boosting. And yeah, the Gallente/Amarr bonuses are useless. -- NMTZ forum
Martin Adeupname	Posted - 2007.03.21 09:18:00 - [15] Before the nano-nerf my blockade runner aligned and warped in 4-5 seconds, with a top speed of ~3300 m/s. It beat gate camps for fun. I tested lots of setups on the test server before the patch. Now my top speed is 2900 m/s and I align and warp in 5 seconds. Considering that my big fear of being bumped by a nanophoon as I aligned is now substantially reduced, I'm happy enough.
Sen Goku Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.03.21 09:37:00 - [16] Yeah this isn't ideal. My prowler warps like a granny in a supermarket since yesterday, and that's with all nav skills at 4 and i-stabs. Great. The only thing that sets them apart now is the warp speed, but I bet that'll be next. Guess we just have to wait and see what the pitchfork wielding mob go for next eh?
Riho Gallente Magnificent Beavers Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2007.03.21 11:34:00 - [17] Originally by: Martin Adeupname Before the nano-nerf my blockade runner aligned and warped in 4-5 seconds, with a top speed of ~3300 m/s. It beat gate camps for fun. I tested lots of setups on the test server before the patch. Now my top speed is 2900 m/s and I align and warp in 5 seconds. Considering that my big fear of being bumped by a nanophoon as I aligned is now substantially reduced, I'm happy enough. what ship and setups :) i dont mind the low sepeed i have atm (1,3km/s)but id like to aligne faster :) i can use caldari and amarr transporsts :) Sig killed by MODs.... reworking it Great being Gallente... aint it ? ----------------- YARRRR, sig hijack! -HornFrog -----------------
Venkhar Krard	Posted - 2007.03.21 11:44:00 - [18] Oh well, why not. Pls boost the base speed and lower the mass of blockade runners. There. Maybe they will change it now.
Martin Adeupname	Posted - 2007.03.21 12:09:00 - [19] Edited by: Martin Adeupname on 21/03/2007 12:09:45 Edited by: Martin Adeupname on 21/03/2007 12:08:41 Originally by: Riho what ship and setups :) Prowler - lowest mass and highest base speed of a blockade runner. The downside is only only two low slots, but I'm not going to spend 20 days training for a viator just to compare setups! Relevent skills: Navigation V, Acceleration Control IV, Evasive Maneuvering IV, Spaceship Command IV Implants: 3% speed, 3% MWD/AB speed boost and 3% agility implants - these are all relatively cheap YT-8 10 MN microwarpdrive 2 Local Hull Inertial Stabilisers 2 Polycarbon Engine Housing I rigs I played around with all kinds of nanofibre/inertia/rig setups on the test server. Some were awful - 11 seconds to align and warp! It seems that reducing inertia and mass is better than boosting agility, at least for the module layout of the Prowler. I might try removing the MWD altogether, that adds 50% to the base mass of the Prowler (5000 tonnes on to 10000 tonnes), at least for low-sec work anyway, and see how that mass reduction affects the align and warp time. Time-to-warp is always better than speed or tanking, and the ECM bursts might save me where a MWD wouldn't...
smallgreenblur Minmatar Wreckless Abandon	Posted - 2007.03.21 12:27:00 - [20] mwd only affects mass when in use afaik. sgb

Nyxus GALAXIAN Rule of Three	Posted - 2007.03.21 12:57:00 - [21] Help for Blockade runners: + speed - a bit of mass make warp bubbles not effect them Suddenly they have a very specific, useful bonus worth training the training time. It also gives ceptor tacklers something to do. Nyxus The Gallente ideals of Freedom, Liberty and Equality will be met by the Amarr realities of Lasers, Armor and Battleships.
eXtas Kemono. Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.21 13:19:00 - [22] weee finaly we got rid of instawarping ships \o/ u know your hauler shouldnt be unkillable
zevex	Posted - 2007.03.21 14:50:00 - [23] Originally by: eXtas weee finaly we got rid of instawarping ships \o/ u know your hauler shouldnt be unkillable ...but they should be able to get into warp before anything larger than a frig can lock them. They *are* "Blockade Runners" after all.
R'adeh Gallente Gekidoku Koroshiya Buntai	Posted - 2007.03.21 15:07:00 - [24] I don't fly them often, but I think it would be cool to give 'em some better bonus. Making them resistant to warp bubbles would be a good solution imo. _______________________________________________ My views are my own and I don't represent my corp.
Megan Maynard Minmatar RONA Deepspace	Posted - 2007.03.21 15:09:00 - [25] Join a corp and have someone protect your butt. You're in a hauler, not a blockade runner. That would be a semi armed ship with more then typical cargo room. YOU ARE IN A HAULER, and non-combat, empire ship. 7 seconds is pretty damn good, but if you are flying alone thru low sec in a hauler you are BEGGING on some sort of sexual level to get popped. (As in you are IN to that sort of thing. WIERD.)
eXtas Kemono. Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.21 15:11:00 - [26] Originally by: R'adeh I don't fly them often, but I think it would be cool to give 'em some better bonus. Making them resistant to warp bubbles would be a good solution imo. no that would make them overpowered! like all damn ships was with 2+ istabs fitted and its a hauler after all and they are still hard to catch unless its a bigger camp
Et alii The Syndicate.	Posted - 2007.03.21 15:32:00 - [27] Edited by: Et alii on 21/03/2007 15:28:39 Originally by: Megan Maynard Join a corp and have someone protect your butt. You're in a hauler, not a blockade runner. That would be a semi armed ship with more then typical cargo room. YOU ARE IN A HAULER, and non-combat, empire ship. 7 seconds is pretty damn good, but if you are flying alone thru low sec in a hauler you are BEGGING on some sort of sexual level to get popped. (As in you are IN to that sort of thing. WIERD.) Sorry u said what ? "Blockade runner transports are the fastest type of industrial available. Utilizing sturdy but lightweight construction materials and sacrificing some cargo space, these haulers are able to reach speeds greater than those of a cruiser while withstanding heavy fire - factors which make them ideal for zipping through dangerous territories with valuable cargo." It is a blockade runner but as it stands now it's no where near agile enough to be called that hence the complaint.
R'adeh Gallente Gekidoku Koroshiya Buntai	Posted - 2007.03.21 15:44:00 - [28] Originally by: eXtas Originally by: R'adeh I don't fly them often, but I think it would be cool to give 'em some better bonus. Making them resistant to warp bubbles would be a good solution imo. no that would make them overpowered! like all damn ships was with 2+ istabs fitted and its a hauler after all and they are still hard to catch unless its a bigger camp Well, now that they take 7sec to align, ceptors will have plenty of time to lock 'em up. Before the patch, my Viator was unstoppable...I didn't even worry about bubbles because there was no way they could prevent me from going back to the gate, even with Huginns. I want the tanking bonus changed to an agility bonus. It's not like a blockade runner will survive if he really has to tank _______________________________________________ My views are my own and I don't represent my corp.
eXtas Kemono. Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.21 15:46:00 - [29] Originally by: Et alii Edited by: Et alii on 21/03/2007 15:28:39 Originally by: Megan Maynard Join a corp and have someone protect your butt. You're in a hauler, not a blockade runner. That would be a semi armed ship with more then typical cargo room. YOU ARE IN A HAULER, and non-combat, empire ship. 7 seconds is pretty damn good, but if you are flying alone thru low sec in a hauler you are BEGGING on some sort of sexual level to get popped. (As in you are IN to that sort of thing. WIERD.) Sorry u said what ? "Blockade runner transports are the fastest type of industrial available. Utilizing sturdy but lightweight construction materials and sacrificing some cargo space, these haulers are able to reach speeds greater than those of a cruiser while withstanding heavy fire - factors which make them ideal for zipping through dangerous territories with valuable cargo." It is a blockade runner but as it stands now it's no where near agile enough to be called that hence the complaint. u tried to check how fast a deimos is or how fast it warps? now compare that to a viator
Et alii The Syndicate.	Posted - 2007.03.21 16:45:00 - [30] Originally by: Flesh Eater Are you sure? Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't the new inertia stabilisers give more of an agility bonus than the nanofibers before this latest patch? (eg a local hull istab gives 20% bonus, while the old local hull nano gave only 15%?) And I agree, transport ships could be a bit better....the shield/armor boost bonus they get is somewhat pointless....fitting shield extenders will almost always be better than a booster/repairer. Yes they give more but the ship still takes about twice as long to warp from before, something got broken with this patch hence the topic.



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