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Sen Goku
Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative
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Posted - 2007.03.21 16:49:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Megan Maynard Join a corp and have someone protect your butt. You're in a hauler, not a blockade runner. That would be a semi armed ship with more then typical cargo room. YOU ARE IN A HAULER, and non-combat, empire ship. 7 seconds is pretty damn good, but if you are flying alone thru low sec in a hauler you are BEGGING on some sort of sexual level to get popped. (As in you are IN to that sort of thing. WIERD.)
ignorance ftl
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zevex
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Posted - 2007.03.21 17:01:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Et alii Sorry u said what ?
"Blockade runner transports are the fastest type of industrial available. Utilizing sturdy but lightweight construction materials and sacrificing some cargo space, these haulers are able to reach speeds greater than those of a cruiser while withstanding heavy fire - factors which make them ideal for zipping through dangerous territories with valuable cargo."
It is a blockade runner but as it stands now it's no where near agile enough to be called that hence the complaint.
/signed
Originally by: R'adeh
Well, now that they take 7sec to align, ceptors will have plenty of time to lock 'em up. Before the patch, my Viator was unstoppable...I didn't even worry about bubbles because there was no way they could prevent me from going back to the gate, even with Huginns. I want the tanking bonus changed to an agility bonus. It's not like a blockade runner will survive if he really has to tank
My Prowler was similar. Its max velocity went from 2.9k down to 2.3km, and it easily takes an extra 2 sec. to get into warp. Interceptors could lock me before the patch (at least those with ultra alert pilots), but now I am guessing that all frigs, and some cruisers will have time to lock before I am aligned and warping.
If we cannot get an agility bonus, at least lower our sig rads by about 10% and then add ... "Spacial Distortion Technology lowers your signature radius by 17.5% per level."
With this, if you were to train the Transport skill to lvl 4, you would be as hard to lock as interceptors are.
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Larshus Magrus
Chosen Path Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2007.03.21 17:37:00 -
[33]
/agree
This situation is not good. When all the ships were boosted hp a few patches ago the t2 blockade runners received no hp boost. So in effect they were stealth nerfed a few patches ago. The ONLY reason to use the diminished cargo space of a blocakade runner was the REALLY fast warp time that gave you a chance of breaking through a camp with inties. IF they had a dictor or a bubble you still were looking at a situation where you had a good chance of not making it.
Now if there is a dictor, bubble, ect you WILL die... there is just no way around it.
Change the transport skill. Its useless anyways. Make it a 5% or 10% agility bonus per level. That will put the blockade runners in line with how they were.
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Hoshi
Blackguard Brigade
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Posted - 2007.03.21 18:48:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Flesh Eater Are you sure? Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't the new inertia stabilisers give more of an agility bonus than the nanofibers before this latest patch? (eg a local hull istab gives 20% bonus, while the old local hull nano gave only 15%?)
And I agree, transport ships could be a bit better....the shield/armor boost bonus they get is somewhat pointless....fitting shield extenders will almost always be better than a booster/repairer.
There are two thing there. First is the fact that since inertial stabs where unnerfed but before this patch they where mostly used not nanofibers as they had an effective 27.7% agility increase for the local hull version.
Second agility didn't use to be stacking penelized but is now. So fitting 5+ of the old nano fibers would give you more agility than the same number of current istabs. ---------------------------------------- A Guide to Scan Probing in Revelations |
Mudkest
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Posted - 2007.03.21 19:10:00 -
[35]
please fix my choo-choo :(
-Duct tape might hold the univurse together, but it's coffee that makes it tick |
Adelai Niska
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Posted - 2007.03.21 20:21:00 -
[36]
The exact same mechanics that made nano BS unstoppable also made blockade runners playable.
Transport ships have bonusses that do nothing to benefit 95% of their combat encounters, and nothing significant to benefit the rest.
Fix them.
A) DSTs: Double powergrid and CPU. They should be as armored as HACs, as actively repped/boosted as cruisers, but slow at BS, particularly when expanded. BRs:Make inertia only 50% of their t1 counterparts. Inside a bubble, these should be about as survivable (more armor, less speed) as an interdictor. B) Give us a reason to train Transport Ships to level 5, just as every skill should have a reason. Amarr DST: +10% to all armor resistances per level, +10% armor amount per level Amarr BR: +1 warp strength per level, -10% inertia per level Caldari DST: +10% to all shield resists per level, -10% to ECM Pulse duration, and cap usage per level Caldari BR: +1 warp strength per level, -10% to ECM Pulse duration and cap usage Gallente DST: +5% to all armor resistances per level, -10% to armor repairer duration and cap usage per level Gallente BR: +1 warp strength per level, -10% sig radius per level Minmatar DST: +10% to all shield resists per level, -10% to shield booster duration and cap usage Minmatar BR: +1 warp strength per level, +15% speed per level
These are serious boosts - but running blockades and surviving solo in 0.0 should at least be POSSIBLE for ships which are explicitly designed to do so. They will still die to large bubbles, larger gatecamps, and harder tackles.
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Imperil
Northern Intelligence Artificial Intelligence.
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Posted - 2007.03.21 20:48:00 -
[37]
A blockade runner is just as intended, it can run from small camps. What more can you ask for? If you really think t1 industrials are sooo better then use those and give your t2 to me.
Support POS Overhaul - Read it NOW! |
Et alii
The Syndicate.
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Posted - 2007.03.21 21:44:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Imperil A blockade runner is just as intended, it can run from small camps. What more can you ask for? If you really think t1 industrials are sooo better then use those and give your t2 to me.
Think u'r missing the point here, before patch a blockade runner warped in 2-3 seconds with nanos in low, now after patch it takes doubble that and this with full rack of local i-stabs ss yes it worked as intended but after patch it doesn't work anymore.
The blockade runners survivability before this patch was imo well balanced, u warped fast enough to avoid criusers, battleships and the ocational sleeping inty, and if u encountered several intys or a bubble camp u where fairly screwd.
The changes in this patch caused a undesired effect as it took away the strenght of the blockade runner making it on the same level as it's T1 counterpart and even it's big brother so an occator will get the same warp time with more cargo and still have spare lows thus removing the reason for the blockade runner beeing in game at all.
btw. would love to see u run from a small camp with 7 sec align time.
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BuyMyToasters
Caldari Insidious Existence Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.03.22 01:11:00 -
[39]
Edited by: BuyMyToasters on 22/03/2007 01:08:11 Heh, first T2 ship I train for gets nerfed. Such is life in Eve Honestly "improving" the Blockade Runner Class (I'm not sure that it is "broken") is as simple as changing the bonuses. Specifically the agility should be looked at first since its agility that has kept my Viator alive and not its ability to tank or its max speed. Reduced mass, increased agility, smaller sig, increased speed, more resists, or any number of bonuses could be applied. Seems like an easy change to me.
Fake Edit: BR's are the win for shopping in empire and bringing home the groceries to 0.0
el oh el sig |
Dynast
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Posted - 2007.03.22 01:37:00 -
[40]
Speaking as someone who has been slowly stocking a deep 0.0 market via 30+ jump trips in a blockade runner, I'm quite disappointed at the effect the nano-BS nerf has had on my Viator. It was sure as hell never safe making the trips, but I could at least feel semi-confident that as long as I didn't blunder into a huge bubble camp I'd probably make it.
Hopefully CCP will consider countering the negative impact these (necessary) changes have had on the Transport ships, by shifting some of their rather worthless bonuses to something more useful, such as agility increases, inertia decreases, speed increases, or signature radius decreases.
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General Meridus
ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.03.22 03:04:00 -
[41]
Anyone who says these ships are still useful does not fly them into 0.0. That is specifically what they were designed for. Large blockade runners were parked eons ago, with the introduction of bubbles and spheres. The ONLY thing that made the smaller ones viable was speed.
Any moderate gate camp can insta pop a hauler, regardless of how its fitted. Frankly any moderate gate camp can take down any solo ship that it can get a lock on. Don't talk about escorts. No corp can escort for 4000m3, of transport space. Traders in 0.0. did their business by busting camps.
Goods will now have to be jumped in by capital ships. Not quite what I believe they were designed for. Trade running was hazardous enough. This "fix" has wiped it out.
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Cmdr Delrox
Black Lance Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2007.03.22 03:34:00 -
[42]
I think not much work is needed. For example the Occulator is good as it can tank long enough if you have an escort. The Viator needs some work though. Get rid of the tanking bonus and change it to an inertia bonus and an additional speed bonus.
Alt Posting
Death to Dark Shikari |
Verite Rendition
Caldari AUS Corporation CORE.
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Posted - 2007.03.22 04:50:00 -
[43]
I know the devs don't liked /signed, but I have to do it. There's not a whole lot to add, Blockade Runners need some loving in order to be able to run through blockades again. ---- AUS Corp Lead Megalomanic |
Filthy Pierre
Gallente Laughing Fox Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.03.22 06:30:00 -
[44]
Dear oh dear.....
And to think I *was* going to buy a Viator as my next purchase - don't think I'll be bothering now.
Wonder if I can petition for the cost of the TS skill book back?
FP
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Et alii
The Syndicate.
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Posted - 2007.03.22 12:58:00 -
[45]
/me leaves a gift in this thread to lure Tux in to it
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MasaMan
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Posted - 2007.03.22 14:26:00 -
[46]
/singed I did a lot of good work in my BR and never trained it over lvl1 However they only cost about 20-30mill well under priced for the many 100s of Mill I have moved to and from deep 0.0 maybe this nerf brings them down to what the price tag is worth You could make a mockery of most camps thoà..good times
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Bodhisattvas
mUfFiN fAcToRy
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Posted - 2007.03.22 14:32:00 -
[47]
Hmmmmm More gate fodder Keep up the good work....
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Megabond
The Collective Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2007.03.22 14:36:00 -
[48]
/signed. Unless you're willing to introduce a covert-ops industrial, you need to fix this. There are plenty of ways to kill a blockade runner, but a 2-man gatecamp shouldn't be one of them.
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Aleria Angelis
Galactic Express Frontier Trade League
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Posted - 2007.03.22 14:38:00 -
[49]
And i used to love my shinny Prorator
Its not like they were overpowered in the first place, as mentioned in their description they have a massive sacrifice to their cargo space and fitting cargo expanders isnt an option as it negates the very thing tranpsort ships are meant to be good at.
In order to get large quantities of cargo from A to B you had to do more runs in a blockade runner to make up for its crap cargo space, thus putting your ship at greater risk. Risk = reward.
The blockade runner nerf is an unfortunate side effect of them fixing nanos BSs, but we're very much in the minority I doubt this will get much attention from the devs.
GEPT opens its doors! |
Kim Brennan
Minmatar
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Posted - 2007.03.23 00:24:00 -
[50]
What? No! Un-gimp my Prowler please!
I agree with the majority, an useful Transport Ship skill bonus for the BRs would be enough, so I might even train it higher than 1.
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Maeltstome
Minmatar Caldari Navy Raiders DeStInY.
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Posted - 2007.03.23 00:42:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Olea Avenger My prowler takes far to long to warp now. It used to be only the fastest of inties could lock me before I entered warp.
So how exactly are you supposed to be caught at all? If you could really warp that fast, and with the implimentation of warp to 0 (a MASSIVE mistake imo, it killed solo and small gang PVP) basically means you'd be untouchable.
Perhaps there's a reason blockade runners aren't that fast anymore.
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Maeltstome
Minmatar Caldari Navy Raiders DeStInY.
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Posted - 2007.03.23 00:54:00 -
[52]
Originally by: zevex "Spacial Distortion Technology lowers your signature radius by 17.5% per level."
With this, if you were to train the Transport skill to lvl 4, you would be as hard to lock as interceptors are.
I dread to think this will actually take place. Carebear's owning up eve ftl.
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Arn'taltsgreat
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Posted - 2007.03.23 02:09:00 -
[53]
funny, me and a friend was just talking about thsi today, though both of us came to the conclusion that bubbles should have a warp scram strength instead o just stopin gwarp altogether, viable since the expander nerf imo.
BR bonus's are useless atm, and has been stated training up past 1 makes no sense.
Trying to run a blockade ( since when is 2 men a blockade? ) in one right now is suicide, or damn near it, i wouldnt mind if it was changed to give at least a chance to get by, its the sole function of the class :)
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Tunajuice
Convergent Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.03.23 02:14:00 -
[54]
Quote:
B) Give us a reason to train Transport Ships to level 5, just as every skill should have a reason. Amarr DST: +10% to all armor resistances per level, +10% armor amount per level Amarr BR: +1 warp strength per level, -10% inertia per level Caldari DST: +10% to all shield resists per level, -10% to ECM Pulse duration, and cap usage per level Caldari BR: +1 warp strength per level, -10% to ECM Pulse duration and cap usage Gallente DST: +5% to all armor resistances per level, -10% to armor repairer duration and cap usage per level Gallente BR: +1 warp strength per level, -10% sig radius per level Minmatar DST: +10% to all shield resists per level, -10% to shield booster duration and cap usage Minmatar BR: +1 warp strength per level, +15% speed per level
Read this part again.. I really like this.
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Sun Win
Mutually Assured Distraction
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Posted - 2007.03.23 02:17:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Flesh Eater Are you sure? Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't the new inertia stabilisers give more of an agility bonus than the nanofibers before this latest patch? (eg a local hull istab gives 20% bonus, while the old local hull nano gave only 15%?)
Reduced mass was also improved agility though. So you actually got 2x agility bonuses. A flat out agility bonus and then a secret agility bonus thanks to the mass reduction.
New to Eve? Learn to Fly - join channel: "Eve University" or read here |
DiseL
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Posted - 2007.03.23 06:10:00 -
[56]
If only I could pull up the anchor on my Viator that that last patch dropped :(
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Ling Xiao
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Posted - 2007.03.23 07:50:00 -
[57]
Definitely agreed, these ships have been hit hard by the nerfs, and it was completely undeserved.
Please give them better agility to compensate, or an agility bonus with the Transport Ships skill. __________ If you think the game is rigged, why are you still playing? |
TerrorWOLF
J.H.E.N.R Pure.
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Posted - 2007.03.23 08:16:00 -
[58]
Sad but true blockade runners arent that anymore. The name belongs now to carriers now. And for empire move frigters, a fully expanded transport isnt faster then a frighter has lot less crgo space and can still be more easely killed then a frigher.
May Your Death Be Slow And Painful
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Aramendel
Amarr Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2007.03.23 15:30:00 -
[59]
Giving actually useful boni from the transport ships skill seems the best solution for that problem to me.
Although not as extreme ones as suggested.
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Megan Maynard
Minmatar RONA Deepspace
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Posted - 2007.03.23 15:35:00 -
[60]
Edited by: Megan Maynard on 23/03/2007 15:31:32 LOL, i'm just pointing out what REALLY happens, not what a description on a ship says. YES, in the advanced tier 3 "blockade runners" you can get thru NPC pirates, which is what the description meant. BLOCKADE RUNNING IN THE "EVE UNIVERSE" not in the pvp world. You can get thru .1-.4 pretty well i bet, but no one in their right mind heads out to 0.0 without a scout or in VERY friendly territory. "BLOCKADE RUNNERS" have to be faster, and nimble, and with some extra cargo room.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blockade_runner
Wiki, mentions the Millennium Falcon in it's text lol, but it is a PERFECT example. FAST and TOUGH as hell, but not the biggest cargo ship. And it was armed to the hilt. Get yourself a different ship if you want to get away from gate camps, a hauler is NOT, and I repeat, NOT, a blockade runner in the pvp world. (Just in the PvE world, like the description says, and you so nicely pointed out.)
So like i said earlier, and in the words of the kindergarten cop, "STOP WHINING!"
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