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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 4 post(s) |
Herculite
Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:28:00 -
[61]
Just think.....
Someone could be doing RL jail time for trying to win at internet space ships.
Tax fraud and libel all over having the best pretend empire on the interweb!
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George Costanza
Ars ex Discordia GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:28:00 -
[62]
Not that you care but I have cancelled my account, you still have your head...in the sand
Just the spiteful tone in your 'reply' shows the level of contempt that you have for your customer base
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Taliesyn
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:28:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Namingway
Originally by: R0ot Edited by: R0ot on 30/05/2007 02:13:14 Goons are in bother!
Originally by: Taliesyn
No alliance - not Goonswarm, not Bob, not anyone else - should be in a position where they can have direct access to a dev regarding in-game issues, be they good or bad.
So you want to remove the petition and the convo system in game?
I think he wants a ule stating that devs aren't allowed to have friends who play their game.
Which is just as stupid.
What I'm stating is that friendships should NOT carry over into the player/developer relationship. I know for a FACT that the rules at Blizzard and EA-Mythic require termination of any employee acting as a developer for the personal benefit of any player outside of standard petition guidelines, and I feel safe in assuming that these rules apply to the vast majority of online games. They do not, however, appear to apply to CCP, resulting in situations like this weekend.
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Stoffer Ninjapirate
Amarr GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:29:00 -
[64]
Seems like a job well done by the IA department. I'm personally satisfied, except for the very good points made in this post, which have yet to be answered:
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=528604&page=1#24
Hopefully, the next time something like this arises, petitions and threads won't be deleted, and poor communication won't force the issue as far out as this one was. Much of this can be avoided if it takes less than a threadnaught to get IAs attention.
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Kuseka Adama
Gallente WOLFPACK DELTA
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:29:00 -
[65]
Originally by: R0ot Edited by: R0ot on 30/05/2007 02:13:14 Goons are in bother!
Originally by: Taliesyn
No alliance - not Goonswarm, not Bob, not anyone else - should be in a position where they can have direct access to a dev regarding in-game issues, be they good or bad.
So you want to remove the petition and the convo system in game?
How about not having the ability to call up a dev no matter the reason?
Quote: If a member of the EVE community finds he or she cannot accept our current level of transparency, we bid you good luck in finding a company that meets your needs.
I am afraid on this point he is right. This is an extremely difficult issue to address because quite frankly there are things the players never need to see..
Then there are cases when things go so far that if stuff is NOT made public it only perpetuates the perception
I was indirectly involved with quite frankly a case as bad as this over in another game. I have no NDA to prevent me from talking about it as my information came second hand. It lead to the resignation of the AO events director and quite frankly one hell of a coverup in the intrests of not tearing the entire Roleplay situation in that game into pieces.
It involved a simular situation to what has happened here. Player A bragged about director B being an RL friend. Various other events occured and when player C (Significant storyline player.) found out and tried to do something about it he got banned. Player C would not be denyed however going over A and B straight to D Senior ARK Director. C and D played a bit of phone tag got things organized and evidence was presented. At about this time player B attempted to enter said group. And messed up massively. The lynch pin was removed and all hell broke loose. The end result director B was forced to resign (would of been thrown out on his ass and worse for massive NDA violations from what i understand) This in general was covered up by the company because situations like this serve no purpose to those outside of it other than to disrupt and ruin many things in progress. The scale was not as grandiose as what has been alleged here but the point remains the same
Transparency can only go so far without resulting in permament and unnecessary damage for the players and the game.
This being said: I would like to see CCP adopt the following policy. Should a member of CCP be fired for misconduct in the game the termination and the general reason should be posted on the forums. Show players that house cleaning is happening and i think a lot of this calms down.
Though bad form CCP for launching the allegations you have. If you got evidence of it post it ASAP. This would have astounding affects in game if true.
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Liang Nuren
The Refugees
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:29:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Herculite
God that was a good read.
QFT
It was a great read - and I encourage CCP to pursue legal action against GS for their (proven to be) false accusations.
However, the real issue (for me), has nothing at all to do with the Goonie's accusations. The real issue (for me, and most everyone else I've talked to), is that a certain group calmly admits to having MSN access to the GM's and Devs about in-game material. They further admit to rushing and bypassing the petition system in the same manner.
This is simply unacceptable, and I have emailed IA letting them know that the investigation is not yet complete.
They did a bang-em up job against GS accusations though.
Liang
Liang
Originally by: Dianabolic, of BOB, referring to MSN
the fact that many of us speak to the devs / gm's / employees of CCP on a regular basis as friends is already common knoweldge?
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Iraf Thaiberd
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:29:00 -
[67]
Edited by: Iraf Thaiberd on 30/05/2007 02:30:53 Wow. This is basically exactly what I'd expected. Misdirection, half-answers, and completely ignoring the actual basal issues in order to present suspect evidence about particulars on the periphery.
Except for the bit about threatening us. That wasn't expected; that was a hysterical treat. By the way, we have more lawyers in GoonSwarm than you have employees.
Edit: Can we get a dev blog threatening to kick our dog next? I thought Pyrex was nuts for being afraid that pressing the Sharkbait issue (which this did NOT resolve) would get his corp deleted. Obviously I was wrong.
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George Costanza
Ars ex Discordia GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:31:00 -
[68]
Edited by: George Costanza on 30/05/2007 02:31:42 And also, all that WAHWAHWAH, I lost a long weekend because of work whining, it shows that most of you have no idea what a corporation is and how it should work. I have had to work straight over the weekend (which I am sure will be compensated) and would never show this disrespect to my customer.
CCP you better get your stuff together...
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Hcraes Er
Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:32:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Phoenus Edited by: Phoenus on 30/05/2007 02:27:19 *coughs*
I'm really sad I didn't catch this post in time to quote it because holy **** man.
Anyway, personally, I feel that while the second issue is still kind of fishy and I'm not too sure about the third, this does somewhat put my mind at ease. Besides, what with the Oveur and TomB posts about upcoming titan nerfs I'm happy with CCP anyway. So thanks Arkanon, sort of.
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Oliandra Friginia
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:32:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Louis DelaBlanche Agreed. until the mannor in which the isd character was dismissed is shown as either outright falsely presented in the open letter or merely part of a bigger story, it will not be simply dropped nor should it be.
Simularly dianabolic's statement, whether taken out of context/proportion or not, should still be investigated as it suggests that; even if they only use it for good; certain players are in a position to bypass the prescribed routes for adresssing issues, grievences & bugs.
& finally, as has been said above, even if it does seem as bright as day who were behind the forum attacks. Such suggestive allusions to it without providing concrete evidense in an official statement is a risky thing to do. & to simply ignore the claims that when the matter was origionally brought up in a controlled manner, only for those threads to be deleted, is not going to help combat the criticism & accusations.
This is the only reason I even started posting, Dianabolic stated out right that they are using outside game lines for contact. That according to your own EULA is a BIG BIG NO NO!! While I'm willing to go with most of the things, I'm am highlyconcerned by this open admital of outright cheating and would like an answer dealing with it please?
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Lakhthaar
Gallente STK Scientific Rule of Three
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:32:00 -
[71]
I held my judgement until the the response came back from CCP. I am please with how detailed the reply is.
After the T20 incident and CCP's initial response it was hard to dismiss the allegations outright.
However, I too would like a response on what seems to be fact that some players from the community, BoB or otherwise, have CCP staff only a click away on 3rd party software. I want GMs and Devs to play the game. I just think there should be guide lines to prevent conflict of interest scenarios from even happening. Or, even the appearance of it. That is how things are done in the real world.
CCP staff should maintain a professional relationship with ALL players in Eve. I am not certain that personal friends/paying customers having access to CCP staff via 3rd party chat constitutes a professional relationship.
Also, I think people would be less upset if next time you just locked the thread and moved it into an appropriate section. Deleting the thread, and handing out bans gives the appearance that you are trying to "sweep it under the rug". Because of the T20 incident there is and will be an element of mistrust. So, perception is everything at this point. Transperency, displayed in your reply, is the way to go. Not, deleting threads and silencing people. If you don't let them speak, it looks like you are covering something up.
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Mr Friendly
That it Should Come to This
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:33:00 -
[72]
I would like to have a CCP response to Dian's admission that some BoB members use msn to directly contact Dev's and the like. I would like an official policy explicitly stating the limits of this contact. The vaguely worded and indirect statement of 'we'd never jeopardize Eve blah blah blah' doesn't cut it on this issue.
thx
Originally by: Dark Shikari Edited by: Dark Shikari on 09/02/2007 23:20:58 But come on, at least give the devs a chance to fire t20.
Hmm, still waiting. |
Herculite
Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:33:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Iraf Thaiberd
Except for the bit about threatening us. That wasn't expected; that was a hysterical treat. By the way, we have more lawyers in GoonSwarm than you have employees.
Now THAT was a hysterical threat. I'm sure they cringe at what sort of legal excrement storm your host of law students will unleash upon them.
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Stoffer Ninjapirate
Amarr GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:34:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Herculite
Originally by: Iraf Thaiberd
Except for the bit about threatening us. That wasn't expected; that was a hysterical treat. By the way, we have more lawyers in GoonSwarm than you have employees.
Now THAT was a hysterical threat. I'm sure they cringe at what sort of legal excrement storm your host of law students will unleash upon them.
Jesus, learn to read.
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Ediz Daxx
FinFleet
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:40:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Desiderata Fabian MMO operator threatens to sue player guild for launching organized attacks against servers in hopes of crashing them.
That is sure to play well in the press.
Can we expect in game retribution too?
I fixed it for you.
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Phoenus
Caldari Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:40:00 -
[76]
Oh wtf, I'm past caring.
From my previous (edited) post:
Quote: Pardon me for posting, especially whilst semi-drunk... but.
GTFO my game, you disease.
Seriously, you've done nothing but troll. You've been proven wrong. Go play elsewhere.
You don't like the way this game is run. Leave. You sicken me.
Seriously, cry more - I mean it. You chose the perfect weekend to unleash a 150+ page thread upon CCP, and you just got shot in the foot. Epic FAIL.
I hope you leave... All of you. Sure, I'll end up loosing out on targets, but, hell, you don't deserve to be able to play this game. Go cry and attempt to ruin some other MMO.
[ 2006.08.16 20:49:06 ] (combat) Your Electron Blaster Cannon II barely scratches Dominix [NTEMS]<HELLH>(Dominix), causing |
Archilies
The Wild Hunt FATAL Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:40:00 -
[77]
Now a 2nd report on the msn issue and the manner in which the ISD member was treated.
There Was A Time When The World Asked Ordinary Men To Do Extraordinary Things |
Azerrad InExile
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:41:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Kirika Misono I hate to fan the flames of paranoia, but I'd say that , yes, that one cap is definatly in MS word, with the default grammer and spelling correction settings.
Heh... that is rather funny actually. Especially considering CCPs official stance on screen grabs in petitions is that they can not be used as evidence since they can be edited. -- t20: "So Let us play and enjoy the game you and I both love on the same level." |
Dalaakita Vendro
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:41:00 -
[79]
Edited by: Dalaakita Vendro on 30/05/2007 02:39:46 quoting from eve-search.com so you can't edit your insanity away
Originally by: Phoenus
Originally by: Astarte Nosferatu
Guess it's time for part two.
Pardon me for posting, especially whilst semi-drunk... but.
GTFO my game, you disease.
Seriously, you've done nothing but troll. You've been proved wrong. Go play elsewhere.
You don't like the way this game is run. Leave. You sicken me.
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Darkstar BP
Caldari eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:41:00 -
[80]
Originally by: Ediz Daxx
Originally by: Desiderata Fabian MMO operator threatens to sue player guild for launching organized attacks against servers in hopes of crashing them.
That is sure to play well in the press.
Can we expect in game retribution too?
I fixed it for you.
Nah, not proven, but nice try
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Kuseka Adama
Gallente WOLFPACK DELTA
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:41:00 -
[81]
Originally by: Flaming Lemming
Originally by: Sirius Problem Put on your tinfoil hat but:
3) Why does the first e-mail show the green and red grammar/spelling error squiggles that one usually only finds in a word processor (ie. MS Word) that is currently in edit mode?
Are these really the e-mails that were sent, or have they been "manufactured" to "prove" the allegations baseless?
Of course, all of the above could just be my over active imagination combined with an interest in conspiracy theories
See the highlighted bit, I'm sure it's something innocuous, but I can see how that could be seen a questionable...any comments? Something to satisfy the tinfoilers.
By the way, Bob, MSN, etc...how's that investigation going?
MS word can be used for emails in conjunction with the outlook program if that was the program used then it would look as you see it there. Just a theory here on why it would look like that. Not everyone uses hotmail and yahoo or gmail. Some prefer a more secure network.
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Etien Aldragoran
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:41:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Herculite Edited by: Herculite on 30/05/2007 02:37:37
Originally by: Stoffer Ninjapirate
Originally by: Herculite
Originally by: Iraf Thaiberd
Except for the bit about threatening us. That wasn't expected; that was a hysterical treat. By the way, we have more lawyers in GoonSwarm than you have employees.
Now THAT was a hysterical threat. I'm sure they cringe at what sort of legal excrement storm your host of law students will unleash upon them.
Jesus, learn to read.
I took the SAT in 7th grade due to my reading comprehension being off the chart, and it maintained this level through more years of schooling than a average goon morale blog uses the term 'c**kf*g'.
The implication of Iraf threat was obvious to anyone. Goons have lawyers in their alliance, more than CCP has employees! Oh dear!
I mean, lawyers would never do anything unetheical
More like Lawyers would never do anything unethical in a ******* game with enough proof they could be caught and sued, potentially losing their jobs, IF you want to play it out that way.
However, since with your genius IQ you seem to have missed the fact that all Iraf said was that we welcomed legal action because we seem to have more than our fair share of Lawyers in our player base to handle any bull**** claims CCP wants to throw around. ------------------------------------------------------ I am not a nice person, never have, never will be, its my burden to deal with the consequences of my actions. |
Stoffer Ninjapirate
Amarr GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:42:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Herculite Edited by: Herculite on 30/05/2007 02:37:37
Originally by: Stoffer Ninjapirate
Originally by: Herculite
Originally by: Iraf Thaiberd
Except for the bit about threatening us. That wasn't expected; that was a hysterical treat. By the way, we have more lawyers in GoonSwarm than you have employees.
Now THAT was a hysterical threat. I'm sure they cringe at what sort of legal excrement storm your host of law students will unleash upon them.
Jesus, learn to read.
I took the SAT in 7th grade due to my reading comprehension being off the chart, and it maintained this level through more years of schooling than a average goon morale blog uses the term 'c**kf*g'.
The implication of Iraf threat was obvious to anyone. Goons have lawyers in their alliance, more than CCP has employees! Oh dear!
I mean, lawyers would never do anything unetheical
It was a humorous responce to a threat. CCP have hinted that they might pursue legal action against us, not the other way around. Evemail me ingame if you need me to clear any other posts up, because you seem to have trouble understanding them.
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QwaarJet
Gallente hirr Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:42:00 -
[84]
Such a detailed blog.....which answers nothing. I seriously doubt this is going to be dropped anytime soon.
And I know you guys are constantly trying to undermine the dent your rep has taken, but you have to realise that regardless of how many accusations you deem as false, the damage was done long ago. The Community at large do not trust CCP now, nor will they ever.
The sooner you accept that, the better.
"Hobbes, she stepped into the Perimeter Of Wisdom.Run!" |
Apollyon X
Dark Knights of Deneb
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:43:00 -
[85]
Originally by: Edward Slain
Originally by: Mister Spanky
PS: What happened to the MSN issue? Is that just going to be ignored? Because it was like the most important one.
The only issue I saw really.
yup.
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Dalaakita Vendro
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:43:00 -
[86]
Originally by: Phoenus Oh wtf, I'm past caring.
From my previous (edited) post:
Quote: Pardon me for posting, especially whilst semi-drunk... but.
GTFO my game, you disease.
Seriously, you've done nothing but troll. You've been proven wrong. Go play elsewhere.
You don't like the way this game is run. Leave. You sicken me.
Seriously, cry more - I mean it. You chose the perfect weekend to unleash a 150+ page thread upon CCP, and you just got shot in the foot. Epic FAIL.
I hope you leave... All of you. Sure, I'll end up loosing out on targets, but, hell, you don't deserve to be able to play this game. Go cry and attempt to ruin some other MMO.
I'm just gonna quote you in this thread because ahahahahahaha holy crap man you must not realise how hilarious you are.
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Azerrad InExile
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:43:00 -
[87]
Originally by: Kuseka Adama MS word can be used for emails in conjunction with the outlook program if that was the program used then it would look as you see it there.
Pretty sure that only happens when you are editing or writing the e-mails though. If you are just looking at mail that has been sent it doesn't do the spelling/grammar check stuff shown in the screen shot. -- t20: "So Let us play and enjoy the game you and I both love on the same level." |
Flaming Lemming
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:44:00 -
[88]
Originally by: Kuseka Adama
Originally by: Flaming Lemming
Originally by: Sirius Problem Put on your tinfoil hat but:
3) Why does the first e-mail show the green and red grammar/spelling error squiggles that one usually only finds in a word processor (ie. MS Word) that is currently in edit mode?
Are these really the e-mails that were sent, or have they been "manufactured" to "prove" the allegations baseless?
Of course, all of the above could just be my over active imagination combined with an interest in conspiracy theories
See the highlighted bit, I'm sure it's something innocuous, but I can see how that could be seen a questionable...any comments? Something to satisfy the tinfoilers.
By the way, Bob, MSN, etc...how's that investigation going?
MS word can be used for emails in conjunction with the outlook program if that was the program used then it would look as you see it there. Just a theory here on why it would look like that. Not everyone uses hotmail and yahoo or gmail. Some prefer a more secure network.
Reasonable
there's no such thing as bad press |
Daveydweeb
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:44:00 -
[89]
Edited by: Daveydweeb on 30/05/2007 02:43:43
Originally by: Taliesyn
Originally by: Namingway
Originally by: R0ot Edited by: R0ot on 30/05/2007 02:13:14 Goons are in bother!
Originally by: Taliesyn
No alliance - not Goonswarm, not Bob, not anyone else - should be in a position where they can have direct access to a dev regarding in-game issues, be they good or bad.
So you want to remove the petition and the convo system in game?
I think he wants a ule stating that devs aren't allowed to have friends who play their game.
Which is just as stupid.
What I'm stating is that friendships should NOT carry over into the player/developer relationship. I know for a FACT that the rules at Blizzard and EA-Mythic require termination of any employee acting as a developer for the personal benefit of any player outside of standard petition guidelines, and I feel safe in assuming that these rules apply to the vast majority of online games. They do not, however, appear to apply to CCP, resulting in situations like this weekend.
Precisely the reason why I'm letting my subscription run out in six weeks. I'm not giving my money to a company that fails to see the need for the separation of friendship and work.
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Kuseka Adama
Gallente WOLFPACK DELTA
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Posted - 2007.05.30 02:45:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Azerrad InExile
Originally by: Kuseka Adama MS word can be used for emails in conjunction with the outlook program if that was the program used then it would look as you see it there.
Pretty sure that only happens when you are editing or writing the e-mails though. If you are just looking at mail that has been sent it doesn't do the spelling/grammar check stuff shown in the screen shot.
likely i dont use the system myself but if it was saved then called up (covering your ass is never a bad idea) it might look like that anyway. Also if it was a direct screenshot it would also look this way. Not saying they arent right or wrong. Just giving other explanations than omgconspiracy
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