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marakor Gallente Anti Lag Forum Smackers	Posted - 2007.08.20 01:01:00 - [121] Originally by: Avalloc Why do people keep leaving out the fact BoB got themselves into this bind. If you don't want multiple Alliances rallying to destroy you then maybe your Diplomats should work a little harder. Each and every pilot that plays the game pays to do so, and that means they deserve a fair shake whether they have a few million skill points or 50 million. Stop crying about 'low skilled blobs' because if you look closer there are TCF, Snigg, RA, AAA, IAC, KOS, and Goonswarm in there who have 30m+ skill points each in the fight. Why have goons hijacked this thread it was never my intention to piont a finger at either bob or goon as im not particularly enamoured of either of you. My intention was to point out that game is broken simply because it cannot handle the load a 200 vs 200 or larger fleet battle put upon it it cannot handle 50 vs 50 most days. Yes goons are gonna be pro titan nerf and pro blob lag because it suits your blob mentality and bob are gonna be against it for there own reasons. But the fact remains that without fixing the game before making changes that encourage low sp recruitment and blobing ccp are ruining the whole experiance for a lot of ppl including the new players who have to rat there asses off just to get in a ship look at a frozen screen for 20 mins, crash and wake up in a clone vat.
marakor Gallente Anti Lag Forum Smackers	Posted - 2007.08.20 01:11:00 - [122] Originally by: Jane Spondogolo The Titan wasn't nerfed because of OMG WHINING NUBS. ASCN where not "NUBS" , Neither where D2. Both of them where murdered by single player piloted Titans. It was nerfed because it was a danger to eves survival as a viable long term game. You only need to look at Star Wars Galaxies (Combat upgrade) to see what happens when you leave that sort of brokenness un fixed. The game dies. Im sure i read on this forum about more than one titan being popped before the nerf so perhaps i should ask a rep from these murdered aliances who's were killed?. Also im very sure eve has lost considerably more players to lag than it ever will to a titan and will proly continue to do so.
Bein Glorious GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.08.20 01:13:00 - [123] Edited by: Bein Glorious on 20/08/2007 01:14:36 Originally by: marakor My intention was to point out that game is broken simply because it cannot handle the load a 200 vs 200 or larger fleet battle put upon it it cannot handle 50 vs 50 most days. Yes goons are gonna be pro titan nerf and pro blob lag because it suits your blob mentality and bob are gonna be against it for there own reasons. But the fact remains that without fixing the game before making changes that encourage low sp recruitment and blobing ccp are ruining the whole experiance for a lot of ppl including the new players who have to rat there asses off just to get in a ship look at a frozen screen for 20 mins, crash and wake up in a clone vat. Think about what you are saying for one second here. There was lag well before the first titan or mothership was made. I know because I was playing back then. I am pretty sure there was crippling lag before goonfleet was created, though I was not playing back then. I am absolutely positive that there was a lot more "ratting your ass off just to get in a ship and get blown up before you can do anything" before titans got nerfed. And I'm pretty damn sure that titans didn't do a damn thing about blobs except make the owners feel satisfied with the notion of "oh, we blew up 200 ships in an instant. That'll teach them to blob. Thank god for those anti-blob weapons that enhance combat. okay now lets get our own blob in there". So yeah, don't take it too personally, but you really don't know what you're talking about. edit: grammar time DERRF
Wim'sei GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.08.20 04:47:00 - [124] Edited by: Wim''sei on 20/08/2007 04:51:08 Originally by: marakor Edited by: marakor on 20/08/2007 01:12:18 Why have goons hijacked this thread it was never my intention to point a finger at either bob or goon as im not particularly enamoured of either of you. My intention was to point out that game is broken simply because it cannot handle the load a 200 vs 200 or larger fleet battle put upon it it cannot handle 30 vs 30 most days. Yes goons are gonna be pro titan nerf and pro blob lag because it suits your blob mentality and bob are gonna be against it for there own reasons. But the fact remains that without fixing the game before making changes that encourage low sp recruitment and blobing ccp are ruining the whole experiance for a lot of ppl including the new players who have to rat there asses off just to get in a ship look at a frozen screen for 20 mins, crash and wake up in a clone vat. Marakor, You appear to be a pilot who sees a significant threat to universal balance from the newbie population. As a recent pilot I'd like help clear up some of the obfuscation that your year of experience seems to have elevated you into. Although my alliance is clear, I'll keep politics from it. There are two unique issues you identify; One is a Meta-newbie-economic issue, but I'd suggest that you work that out a bit more; your post starts by implying that newbies are joining up too quickly and lagging EVE, and then starts explaining that newbies have to rat a lot. I'd rather that like CCP to fix the physics of the issue. I'd like to discuss your idea which starts by demoting the Titan to being a "blob stopper". You assert that up to the point of the nerf that the Titan was used to drop in, wipe out massive numbers of ships, and hop out. When I joined, it was on the pretense that this was a strategic universe of fleet combat, where trade would have a direct impact on how the universe functioned, and where my ship could contribute to stemming the tide of war. Hypothetically this is a scenario which can apply to any newbie in any known part of the EVE Universe. I have faith that when Titans were decigned, it wasn't to resolve a metagame issue - that network and computational latency would be reduced because someone could pilot a remote control pointed at an atomic bomb. The role of the Titan actually seems to have been to either extend the duration of fleet combat by providing services to nearby friendly ships, supply their ejected pilots with even more ships, or to provide last-chance support and shorten the battle by wiping many classes of ships at the press of a button. Any of these are ultimately the decision of the pilot. Either members of the community or CCP itself identified that a caveat was missing from the Titan. Despite the immense bonuses that controlling such a beast had and the implications of the DDD, it was essentially unchecked. CCP fixed it, not by weakening any of it's structural statistics, nor by strengthening any other ships in response. It was decided that the pilot responsible for wielding this power, regardless of faction, corp or alliance, would require greater consideration of strategic planning prior to invoking the Doomsday Device. By making that decision, that pilot becomes accountable for the security and safety of the ship, and also of making sure that they have appropriate forces available to bail them out of any ensuing trouble that arrives. Newbies on their own will never own a Titan-class ship. It will remain a respectable class of ship owned by Corps with sophisticated internal logistics, and the pilots who fly Titans will either be brave, ignorant, or competent enough to know what they and their allies are doing - only the last of those three archetypes fortunate enough to be in such a corp will survive long beyond the "nerf". The problem is no longer with CCP, the Titan, or with newbies. The problem is with pilots who still live in a one button space ship. I'd say that it's time to develop new strategies
Kamen SRBI Circle 0f Two	Posted - 2007.08.20 09:40:00 - [125] Because this is not WoW where you achieve your goals by doing the following: - Chose X of your best equipped and longest playing players. - Complete the goal. This is EvE where you can choose to blob the hell out of your foes, or chose a tactic that works against your foes. You get to blob only if you can motivate, and to motivate you need to have actually done something -- not yell LFG or Leeroy ------------------------------------------------ (Recruiting ad) SRBI regrutuju! Dodjite na nas javni SRBI kanal.
Bastables Amarr The Aegis Militia Aegis Militia	Posted - 2007.08.20 10:35:00 - [126] Originally by: Ituralde Didn't CCP want BOB to win? Dear oh dear. Looks like its time to invest in yet another tinfoil hat. Pathetic Be reclaimed, and be loved
Angor The JORG Corporation FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.20 10:56:00 - [127] Originally by: Bein Glorious Edited by: Bein Glorious on 20/08/2007 01:14:36 Originally by: marakor My intention was to point out that game is broken simply because it cannot handle the load a 200 vs 200 or larger fleet battle put upon it it cannot handle 50 vs 50 most days. Yes goons are gonna be pro titan nerf and pro blob lag because it suits your blob mentality and bob are gonna be against it for there own reasons. But the fact remains that without fixing the game before making changes that encourage low sp recruitment and blobing ccp are ruining the whole experiance for a lot of ppl including the new players who have to rat there asses off just to get in a ship look at a frozen screen for 20 mins, crash and wake up in a clone vat. Think about what you are saying for one second here. There was lag well before the first titan or mothership was made. I know because I was playing back then. I am pretty sure there was crippling lag before goonfleet was created, though I was not playing back then. I am absolutely positive that there was a lot more "ratting your ass off just to get in a ship and get blown up before you can do anything" before titans got nerfed. And I'm pretty damn sure that titans didn't do a damn thing about blobs except make the owners feel satisfied with the notion of "oh, we blew up 200 ships in an instant. That'll teach them to blob. Thank god for those anti-blob weapons that enhance combat. okay now lets get our own blob in there". So yeah, don't take it too personally, but you really don't know what you're talking about. edit: grammar time DERRF I remember a time where you could have 300vs300, with lag yes, but it was playable. Today you can hardly have 50vs50 without some major issues (at least in the north). One battle i remember more than most was the battle for Maelstrom Prime down in Immensea, that POS war was around 400-600 people in local during prime hours, but the fights were still playable. I dont really know what CCP have done to totally screw up this game but i'd guess it has to do with new POS and Gang stuff adding extra processing load to the servers. I'd give up so much of the new additions of this game just to have decent sized playable fleet battles back, bring back RMR for instance. As for Titans, they were introduced as a way to combat blobs, but titan pilots started blowing their load even just for 10 ships sat on a gate. Now that they have to be used more responsibly, suddenly nobody wants to use them. The titan deterant seems to have all but gone these days. _______________________________ WTS 50m sp PvP Minmitar Character including Dread and Carrier
Cefte Gray Ivy GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.08.20 11:22:00 - [128] Originally by: Angor I remember a time where you could have 300vs300, with lag yes, but it was playable. Today you can hardly have 50vs50 without some major issues (at least in the north). One battle i remember more than most was the battle for Maelstrom Prime down in Immensea, that POS war was around 400-600 people in local during prime hours, but the fights were still playable. My memory of massive fleet fights, a year, a year and a half ago, was that either the server stayed up and everyone faced the same lag, or the node tanked and everyone went offline. Now the node stays up, but you can get a crippling server issue affecting only one fleet out of three in a system, and the playing field is randomly imbalanced. Which just ain't fun.
Martin Mckenna D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.08.20 11:26:00 - [129] Originally by: Dark Shikari EVE is the only MMORPG I know of where 10 "low-level" players can go and kill a "high-level" player. And this is a very, very good thing. Hes right.
marakor Gallente Anti Lag Forum Smackers	Posted - 2007.08.20 11:29:00 - [130] Originally by: Jane Spondogolo The Titan wasn't nerfed because of OMG WHINING NUBS. ASCN where not "NUBS" , Neither where D2. Both of them where murdered by single player piloted Titans. It was nerfed because it was a danger to eves survival as a viable long term game. You only need to look at Star Wars Galaxies (Combat upgrade) to see what happens when you leave that sort of brokenness un fixed. The game dies. As i have said im not a molle alt a pro bob or goon for that matter as i have mentioned im not particularly keen on either of you and im actualy in a alliance thats hostile to you both and the only reason goons keep calling me a fan of bob is because the blob and titan nerf have favored your alliance. And secondly its not like titans could'nt be killed before the nerf im sure if you ask both these "murdered alliances" as you call them they can tell you about it. And lets face it more new players and old will quit eve due to lag and the game being unplayable than to a titan.

Angor The JORG Corporation FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.20 12:15:00 - [131] Originally by: marakor Originally by: Jane Spondogolo The Titan wasn't nerfed because of OMG WHINING NUBS. ASCN where not "NUBS" , Neither where D2. Both of them where murdered by single player piloted Titans. It was nerfed because it was a danger to eves survival as a viable long term game. You only need to look at Star Wars Galaxies (Combat upgrade) to see what happens when you leave that sort of brokenness un fixed. The game dies. As i have said im not a molle alt a pro bob or goon for that matter as i have mentioned im not particularly keen on either of you and im actualy in a alliance thats hostile to you both and the only reason goons keep calling me a fan of bob is because the blob and titan nerf have favored your alliance. And secondly its not like titans could'nt be killed before the nerf im sure if you ask both these "murdered alliances" as you call them they can tell you about it. And lets face it more new players and old will quit eve due to lag and the game being unplayable than to a titan. Yup he's right, im on the verge of leaving because of unplayability, aka lag/desync. I'd rather get dd'd anytime and loose a ship without shooting someone than i would looking at a blank screen for 20 minutes only to be back in a station when the next "frame" apears. _______________________________ WTS 50m sp PvP Minmitar Character including Dread and Carrier
Cutie Chaser Gallente	Posted - 2007.08.20 15:27:00 - [132] Originally by: Martin Mckenna Originally by: Dark Shikari EVE is the only MMORPG I know of where 10 "low-level" players can go and kill a "high-level" player. And this is a very, very good thing. Hes right. On the "pack of rats can drag down a cat" thing yes, as to the pvp comment, no. Ultima Online, Ragnarok Online, Diablo2(if ya count it), and SWG come to mind. In fact, any game that is based on skills instead of levels usually falls into this category. *** Thats a Templar, the amarr fighter. Its a combat drone used by carriers.
Kaldaine GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.08.20 15:54:00 - [133] Originally by: marakor the only reason goons keep calling me a fan of bob is because the blob and titan nerf have favored your alliance. And secondly its not like titans could'nt be killed before the nerf im sure if you ask both these "murdered alliances" as you call them they can tell you about it. Neither of the titans killed pre-nerf would have been killed in the present game. While we bring more numbers then our opponents it hasnt always been so. They have lost allies to attrition and because those allies were meatshields. At different times our enemies have bragged about having the largest alliance in the game and fighting their enemies 10k v 1k. To believe that Goonswarm is the inventor of the blob is just ignorant. We do bring numbers because we constantly recruit. We bring large numbers of new people into the game, give them free tackling frigates and send them in to pvp. We do this because we think it is one of the best ways to get people hooked and playing this game. I dont think our recruiting drives would be nearly as effective if they consisted of "COME PLAY EVE WITH ONE OF THE AWESOMEST CORPS AROUND JUST SIGN UP AND wait six months before we let you pvp BUT ONCE YOU GET THERE ITS TOTALLY AWESOME FILLED WITH FLEET BATTLES AND PVP AND you just gotta wait". Of the people that I joined the game with, there are goons everywhere. From FATAL to Triumvirate, in their own corps doing their own thing. The only constant I see in all of them is that they are here for the pvp. While laggy pvp sucks, sitting in a station because a titan is smart-bombing the undock or you just jumped in to a large remote bubble doomsday trap sucks even more. I will play in lag but not if I dont even have a prayer of beating my opponent.
marakor Gallente Anti Lag Forum Smackers	Posted - 2007.08.20 16:39:00 - [134] Originally by: Kaldaine Neither of the titans killed pre-nerf would have been killed in the present game. Why not considering everybody says its a lot easier to kill titans now?. Originally by: Kaldaine To believe that Goonswarm is the inventor of the blob is just ignorant. Your right i would be ignorant if i did that so please show me where i claim goons to be the inventor of it and il change it with a full retraction. What you seem to be missing is that breaking the game and making it unplayable will lose more players than a DDD ever will. Maybe not you but how many new players want to look at a frozed screen unable to do anything until they crash or wake up in a clone vat. Personaly id rather try to out think and out manouver the titans DDD (even if its possable or not) and have that hope or even a spare ship while it recharges than know for a fact that the game is gonna break and id be stuck watching a frozen screen. Perhaps extending the DDD recharge to like every 12-24 hours as the clone jumps are?.
WT Snacks Anonymous Legionnaires	Posted - 2007.08.20 16:50:00 - [135] Titans are fine and anti-blob weapons do not break up blobs. They force the blob to warp off and then warp back in, causing more lag but not solving the problem.
SaKoil GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.08.20 16:58:00 - [136] Originally by: marakor What you seem to be missing is that breaking the game and making it unplayable will lose more players than a DDD ever will. The game was laggy in large fleet battles just the same before the titan nerf. The removal of broken DDD did not affect lag in any way. It just fixed one of the more obviously broken aspects from the game. What kind of experience do you have of large fleet battles from new players perspective? How about pre-nerf titans?
Selquita Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.08.20 17:35:00 - [137] Fleet warfare hasn't changed since the inception of the battleship. Pre-titan, it wasn't uncommon to hear the term blobbing. Curse Alliance and Fountain Alliance were both very apt to employ it against smaller alliances that operated where ever CA and FA cared to go. The creation of the Titan was not meant so much as the end-all be-all of war. If anything, it was simply meant as a frontline headquarters from which the staging of combat could be conducted efficiently. It was also given the ability to DD as, in my opinion, a defense mechanism against a counter-attack force sieging it. Unfortunately, as with most new toys of overwhelming strength, it became the unwavering symbol of complete might and power. An alliance who had one titan, left alone more than that, was seen as being a formidable force beyond reproach. Now they have been evened out. The owners of titans take greater care in their deployment. Instead of throwing them out in the middle of the fray with not but a DD and cyno-ship, they are kept back away from the front lines. Instead of taking out hundreds of attacking ships at the switch of a button, they're figureheads of economic prosperity. In the end, fleet warfare will never change. Fleets will grow larger, ship composition varied from engagement to engagement. But there will always be two things that every fleet will have. Experienced players in expensive ships meant to bring as much damage as possible, or fulfill specific tasks such as EWAR, and new pilots in throw-away frigs/cruisers racing into the thick of it at their FC's orders hoping to swing the tide of victory their way. ====================================
Sophie Garatonku Freedom Caps	Posted - 2007.08.22 00:47:00 - [138] As one of the 'vet' players, sitting on a lot of ISK, flying high SP ships, and dealing with a number of 'old school' players, corps and alliances, I respectfully disagree with the OP. The supercapital 'nerfs' were a much-needed fix, and the single best balancing move since the overhaul of T1 ships and the introduction of invention and higher-tier3 BC/BSes. For the past couple years, EVE had been catering to the old-school boys first and foremost, making this game more and more like any other MMOGs that reward you for the sole achievement of being there for a long time. EVE was even worse in this than any other game, as all you needed to do was to keep your sub on and switch skills every week/month. Giving new(er) players the means to access high end game, by breaking the T2 monopolies, releasing ships that can make a difference without 30+ million SP and bazillions of ISK, and now changing the yummy PvE from static camping to dynamic hunting (plexes changed to exploration) is a good way to finally allow people to compete based on smarts, merits, teamwork and dedication - as opposed to how much ISK, SP and faction gear one has hoarded over years of broken mechanics and insider intel. ...anything that fosters more competition should be welcomed by earnest players in a PvP-centric game. If you want to be safe in the knowledge your lvl70 toon and oober gear protects from pesky n00bs with teeth, I can point you to a game more suited to your tastes, marakor. Best regards, Sophie. PS: If you don't like MS and Titans as they are now, don't fly them, they're no fun and the server can't handle them, anyways. Safety Middleware Specialists
cal nereus Bounty Hunter - Dark Legion Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.22 01:11:00 - [139] I less than three Sophie. --- Grismar.net
marakor Gallente Anti Lag Forum Smackers	Posted - 2007.08.22 02:13:00 - [140] Originally by: Sophie Garatonku If you want to be safe in the knowledge your lvl70 toon and oober gear protects from pesky n00bs with teeth, I can point you to a game more suited to your tastes, marakor. Firstly you do not know my tastes. Its about the game being playable, with cyno blockers titan nerfs and all the other soverienty issues plus gang/fleet bonuses CCP have broken the game and they should fix it before adding more stupid ideas that cause more lag. And if you think this post is about turning eve into WOW your wrong. But id not like to see it turn into a game of who can recruit the largest fleet of ppl with barely enough skills to fly a cruiser so they can lag out players who have trained long and hard just to kill them. I do agree though that a high number should be able to beat a single player or it would be stupid. But at the moment we have already laggy battles being made worse because certain FC's are telling there fleets to drop cans so the desync gets even worse. That has nothing to do with the smarts, merits, team work and dedication you are saying. Im all for a good and fair balance but breaking the game is not a thing that should be seen as laudable and rewarded. If lag did not exist id say the titan nerf perhaps would be ok but because of the lag and ppls willingness to increase it for the sole perpose of destroying a huge asset it should be put the way it was back until CCP fix the game. Perhaps as i have said extending the remote DDD timer to a few hours or even a day before refire would be better than losing the ships to nothing but a deliberate lag bomb.

SpaceMoose GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.08.22 02:16:00 - [141] Edited by: SpaceMoose on 22/08/2007 02:16:38 Originally by: marakor Originally by: Sophie Garatonku If you want to be safe in the knowledge your lvl70 toon and oober gear protects from pesky n00bs with teeth, I can point you to a game more suited to your tastes, marakor. Firstly you do not know my tastes. Its about the game being playable, with cyno blockers titan nerfs and all the other soverienty issues plus gang/fleet bonuses CCP have broken the game and they should fix it before adding more stupid ideas that cause more lag. And if you think this post is about turning eve into WOW your wrong. But id not like to see it turn into a game of who can recruit the largest fleet of ppl with barely enough skills to fly a cruiser so they can lag out players who have trained long and hard just to kill them. I do agree though that a high number should be able to beat a single player or it would be stupid. But at the moment we have already laggy battles being made worse because certain FC's are telling there fleets to drop cans so the desync gets even worse. That has nothing to do with the smarts, merits, team work and dedication you are saying. Im all for a good and fair balance but breaking the game is not a thing that should be seen as laudable and rewarded. If lag did not exist id say the titan nerf perhaps would be ok but because of the lag and ppls willingness to increase it for the sole perpose of destroying a huge asset it should be put the way it was back until CCP fix the game. Perhaps as i have said extending the remote DDD timer to a few hours or even a day before refire would be better than losing the ships to nothing but a deliberate lag bomb. So essentially you want to play WoW? edit: while whining about lag
marakor Gallente Anti Lag Forum Smackers	Posted - 2007.08.22 02:20:00 - [142] Edited by: marakor on 22/08/2007 02:23:12 Originally by: SpaceMoose So essentially you want to play WoW? edit: while whining about lag Originally by: marakor And if you think this post is about turning eve into WOW your wrong. Learn how to read all of a post
SpaceMoose GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.08.22 02:34:00 - [143] Originally by: marakor Edited by: marakor on 22/08/2007 02:23:12 Originally by: SpaceMoose So essentially you want to play WoW? edit: while whining about lag Originally by: marakor And if you think this post is about turning eve into WOW your wrong. Learn how to read all of a post Saying that you don't want to turn eve into wow but then going on a massive tirade about doing exactly that has more to do with you suffering from cognitive dissonance rather than me not reading your posts.
Jacob Majestic GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.08.22 02:38:00 - [144] Originally by: marakor Originally by: Sophie Garatonku If you want to be safe in the knowledge your lvl70 toon and oober gear protects from pesky n00bs with teeth, I can point you to a game more suited to your tastes, marakor. Firstly you do not know my tastes. Its about the game being playable, with cyno blockers titan nerfs and all the other soverienty issues plus gang/fleet bonuses CCP have broken the game and they should fix it before adding more stupid ideas that cause more lag. And if you think this post is about turning eve into WOW your wrong. But id not like to see it turn into a game of who can recruit the largest fleet of ppl with barely enough skills to fly a cruiser so they can lag out players who have trained long and hard just to kill them. I do agree though that a high number should be able to beat a single player or it would be stupid. But at the moment we have already laggy battles being made worse because certain FC's are telling there fleets to drop cans so the desync gets even worse. That has nothing to do with the smarts, merits, team work and dedication you are saying. Im all for a good and fair balance but breaking the game is not a thing that should be seen as laudable and rewarded. If lag did not exist id say the titan nerf perhaps would be ok but because of the lag and ppls willingness to increase it for the sole perpose of destroying a huge asset it should be put the way it was back until CCP fix the game. Perhaps as i have said extending the remote DDD timer to a few hours or even a day before refire would be better than losing the ships to nothing but a deliberate lag bomb. So you fix lag by... restoring the ability of rich, old boy alliances to make hundreds of wrecks on demand using their invincible IWIN button? Look how stupid you are. ___ Originally by: steamy thank you Hippoking for doing a Jacob on the goons
Jin Steele Port Royal Independent Kontractors Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.08.22 02:50:00 - [145] Originally by: Angor I remember a time where you could have 300vs300, with lag yes, but it was playable. Today you can hardly have 50vs50 without some major issues (at least in the north). One battle i remember more than most was the battle for Maelstrom Prime down in Immensea, that POS war was around 400-600 people in local during prime hours, but the fights were still playable. I dont really know what CCP have done to totally screw up this game but i'd guess it has to do with new POS and Gang stuff adding extra processing load to the servers. I'd give up so much of the new additions of this game just to have decent sized playable fleet battles back, bring back RMR for instance. As for Titans, they were introduced as a way to combat blobs, but titan pilots started blowing their load even just for 10 ships sat on a gate. Now that they have to be used more responsibly, suddenly nobody wants to use them. The titan deterant seems to have all but gone these days. there was never a time that 300v300 wasnt laggy. the first time those numbers were seen were in EC-p8r, over a year ago, when the iron/g fleet died before loading. all of them. the second time was jv1v titan abortion, and well, i think you know how that goes. the third was f-t, and while the objective was completed, local was at 6-700 and you could not move at all. it has become somewhat more common now, but there has never been a time where you could play 300v300, so i dont know what you are talking about.
cal nereus Bounty Hunter - Dark Legion Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.22 04:44:00 - [146] Why do you want the people who've been playing the longest to win? That's my question. --- Grismar.net
Sophie Garatonku Freedom Caps	Posted - 2007.08.22 06:02:00 - [147] Originally by: marakor Firstly you do not know my tastes. I have a hunch... Quote: Its about the game being playable, with cyno blockers titan nerfs and all the other soverienty issues plus gang/fleet bonuses CCP have broken the game and they should fix it before adding more stupid ideas that cause more lag. Your rationale as to how preventing a titan from safely remote DD'ing would magically stop people from blobbing escapes me entirely, and I therefore can't comment on it. Cyno blockers are a very nice addition that finally slows down a bit the trend of EVE turning into (Super)Capitals-Online that has been making this game less and less diverse and fun over the past 2 years. The blob is no news, it has been there since I've started playing, and probably before, but yes, it has grown to unseen-before proportions, pretty much like the size of the user base... coincidence ? Is lag bad ? Yes. Is blobbing the best way to cope with it ? Probably not the most fun, or the most creative and tactically elegant, but it's the easiest way when you have the numbers, just like the IWin 1-button titans used to be the easiest way. In both cases, people chose the path of least resistance towards victory they can afford, regardless of how unfun it may be for the opposition or for themselves, simply because Win>Fun in the alliance game of EVE. There are ways to tackle some of the lag/blob problem, by game mechanics (support skirmish warfare, anti-blob weapons like bombers, etc.), code and server improvements, and probably by reworking POS/sov warfare into something worth playing, and there are causes for lag (core code limitations etc.) that can't be entirely solved short of rewriting EVE from the ground up (which won't happen). CCP fixed one extremely unfun and game-breaking misdesign with titans and MSes, and they are hopefully working on (partial) fixes to the blob and lag issues. I don't see how re-instating a badly broken feature (as you advocate) would help solve other broken bits of EVE (that you claim are your main concern). Quote: [...] id not like to see it turn into a game of who can recruit the largest fleet of ppl with barely enough skills to fly a cruiser so they can lag out players who have trained long and hard just to kill them. That's where I disagree with you: nobody trains 'hard' in EVE. Long, sure, but hard ? As long as you more or less keep your sub paid, all you got to do to be teh 00ber is to flip a skill every week/w month. Player skill takes practice, smarts and coordination, even more so when you fly T1 cruisers with few skillpoints against faction pimped T2 nanorides. I'm sorry you feel there's some sort of entitlement that comes with being a long time paying customer of CCP, but this is supposed to be a PvP game, not an airline or a retirement house minigolf. As it is now, the extra miles you gain from just hanging out long enough are still more of a curse than a bless for EVE, in my opinion. Quote: If lag did not exist id say the titan nerf perhaps would be ok but because of the lag and ppls willingness to increase it for the sole perpose of destroying a huge asset it should be put the way it was back until CCP fix the game. Well, here's how I look at the issue: An overpowered titan (as they were) breaks the game for hundreds and potentially thousands of players. The 'nerfed' titan only hurts that handful of players whose 'achievement' has been to sit through the completion of Energy Pulse Weapons lvl V, and who have been abusing a last-ditch defense tool to bomb stadiums until CCP fixed it. For all other purposes, the titans are still a formidable logistics and tactical advantage, as that part is left untouched. As for MSes, they're more powerful after the 'nerf', if anything, but indeed, they're not invulnerable anymore. Tough, some will have to actually play this game instead of raking killstats for free. Safety Middleware Specialists
Ejderdisi Caldari Dirty Deeds Corp. Axiom Empire	Posted - 2007.08.22 09:44:00 - [148] best part of eve is giving noobs to chance to attack and overpower a veteran player. Are u aware in some MMORPG u can't attack some players who are much higher and much lower than u to balance PvP :) Do u want a ibis flying happily into a 100man fleet and ur ship's computer didn't lock him because of some silly lvl restriction??? And give noobs a chance ofcourse. SO u can beat them with stick and take everything from them... And blobs are not consist of newbies but mostly from experienced players nowadays. Can u call a BoB fleet a noob blob? And with titan... Yeah titan is great. And it might be overpriced as some faction ships. But as u can see ppl still building them right. Soo :) Btw single ship destructing 10sec ROF beam is a better weapon for titans I guess... 10 X 100 = 1000 sec / 60 = 16.6min and a fleet of 100 is dead :) WOOT this is a good idea.
Milena Rage The Aftermath Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.22 10:07:00 - [149] blobs are fine, l2p. nerf lag.
WT Snacks Anonymous Legionnaires	Posted - 2007.08.22 10:07:00 - [150] I hope you enjoy getting a triple remote DD dropped on your fleet before you even see combat, because pretty much every power bloc will have a dozen of them eventually.



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