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Why do ccp want noobs to win ??

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 2 post(s)
Gungankllr Caldari STK Scientific M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.08.13 14:13:00 - [31] THIS IS MADNESS
Joshua Foiritain Gallente Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2007.08.13 14:15:00 - [32] Titan != Nukes. ----- [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
Bein Glorious GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.08.13 14:17:00 - [33] doomsdays stopped blobbing about as well as blowing up a shopping mall stops materialism
killerco Gallente Confederation of Red Moon Red Moon Federation	Posted - 2007.08.13 14:19:00 - [34] Originally by: jarack Lets go back to Tech1, Battleships, Cruisers and Frigates only. Where skill and tactics won the fight, not how many Supercapitals you can jump onto the field. The fights where Battleships are 30km from each other, not the panzy 250km+ fighting. i like that thought
Ander Gallente Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.08.13 14:27:00 - [35] Edited by: Ander on 13/08/2007 14:27:06 UO is nothing of its former glory. I've played UO since 1997 and it's just gone downhill since they implemented Trammel (safe facet) and Felluca (unsafe PVP facet)... EVE is the ONLY mmo with this kind of free PVP. EVE PIRATE ANDER! now posting in "orange"
Shadowsword COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.08.13 14:49:00 - [36] Originally by: marakor Unfortunatly that leads untimatly to a mega blob nap or alliance overpowering everybody and i hate that idea with a passion. Id say bring back the old DDD to stop that from happening cos its not like titans were unkillable before the nerf. Remind me how many titans Bob killed when it's pilot was logged on? You also seem to think that only low-sp players blob. That is completely wrong. You might want to look at EC-P8R's history. ------------------------------------------ What is Oomph? It the sound Amarr players makes when they get kicked in the ribs.
Zesuth Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.08.13 14:57:00 - [37] Originally by: Dark Shikari Originally by: Sorja Originally by: Dark Shikari EVE is the only MMORPG I know of where 10 "low-level" players can go and kill a "high-level" player. That's because you were grown with Evercrap. Those who have a clue about PvP remember about UO, for example. PvP in EVE, while fun at times, is not less a game of haves and have not than some other games posters like to bash on these boards Sorry, UO was before my time. And as far as I know, contrary to the implication of your post, I've never bashed UO, primarily because I've never played it. I would imagine the implication was that even Eve with all its fancy talk of risk and reward is still ultimately a game of timesinks. In WoW (and many other Everquest clones) one stacks the odds by collecting pretty little purples, in Eve one spends more ISK and keeps the subscription running. One of the things I liked about UO was that reaching the plateau of character power in terms of skills and equipment required significantly less timesinks, and the great bottomless resource sink didn't take its 50% toll on anyone's loot either. At glance it might seem terribly convoluted that the players themselves demand more timesinks, something very few find fun in itself. The feeling of achievement, however, is a strong motivator. The answer to "why do people play MMORPGs" probably looks much more like this than the seemingly obvious "it's fun".
marakor Gallente Anti Lag Forum Smackers	Posted - 2007.08.13 14:59:00 - [38] Edited by: marakor on 13/08/2007 15:00:13 Originally by: Shadowsword Originally by: marakor Unfortunatly that leads untimatly to a mega blob nap or alliance overpowering everybody and i hate that idea with a passion. Id say bring back the old DDD to stop that from happening cos its not like titans were unkillable before the nerf. Remind me how many titans Bob killed when it's pilot was logged on? You also seem to think that only low-sp players blob. That is completely wrong. You might want to look at EC-P8R's history. Seems to me that they had to have been logged on at one point for bob to have been able to get them so it comes down to planning and black ops to kill one instead of spamming blobs at them. There are always points for and points against and perhaps there is no perfect solution but i feel that a country/alliance without nuke capability should never be able to beat a country with nukes so it makes the lesser countries/alliances improve instead of just recruit.
Beshta New Balkan Mafia Circle 0f Two	Posted - 2007.08.13 15:23:00 - [39] Originally by: marakor After all 10 drunk skinheads kicking the hell out of a pro boxer by sheer weight of numbers is a easy to believe circumstance. skinheads arent noobs! and they cant kick the hell out of mikey tayson imo titans are still very usefull for defense where 1 party cant get cap blob in (cyno jammers) and as allready said they are good transport ships :P
Alexander Knott Ars ex Discordia GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.08.13 15:34:00 - [40] Originally by: Avery Cane titans still have a purpose that is true. as logistics ships? i mean who the hell wants a 65billion isk transport ship. Anyone with any sense. Logistics make and break alliances. ----- "I like to loot, especially going to the can of the battleship, sometimes there is a surprise inside, sometimes there is only carp..."

Markessa Hrethnor	Posted - 2007.08.13 15:42:00 - [41] pre-trammel UO and to an extent pre-cu SWG both had it where your character's skill (points) combined with the player's skill, are what determined how successful you'd be. they weren't the "good items = good player" type of games. both also had a limit on the max # of skill points your toon could have and at any time you could unlearn a skill (or partially unlearn) in order to learn something new. so, with a bit of work on your specific skills, you could be quite competitive in a short time with veteran players, without really having to "blob" anything.
darth solo Celestial Apocalypse Insurgency	Posted - 2007.08.13 15:54:00 - [42] Originally by: Dark Shikari EVE is the only MMORPG I know of where 10 "low-level" players can go and kill a "high-level" player. And this is a very, very good thing. 10?. try one. im a 60mill skillpoint pvper and a complete noob could take me down if fitted to counter. thats the beauty of EVE. doesnt matter how good u are or how many skill points u have their is a potential banana skin out there for us all. makes it interesting. d solo. RECRUITING... visit www.celesapoc.com ingame channel "celespublic" for recruitment or chat
Taurequis Waylander 01	Posted - 2007.08.13 16:00:00 - [43] Edited by: Taurequis on 13/08/2007 16:00:28 Originally by: darth solo Originally by: Dark Shikari EVE is the only MMORPG I know of where 10 "low-level" players can go and kill a "high-level" player. And this is a very, very good thing. 10?. try one. im a 60mill skillpoint pvper and a complete noob could take me down if fitted to counter. thats the beauty of EVE. doesnt matter how good u are or how many skill points u have their is a potential banana skin out there for us all. makes it interesting. d solo. Agreed, Beyond that i totally disagree with the OP. If his entire case is "Motherships and Titans got nerfed - CCP hate vets" do we even need to debate? Been here since beta and i'm still finding new stuff to do. Best Regards, Taur
Moonlight Express Amarr Moonlight Express Inc.	Posted - 2007.08.13 16:03:00 - [44] There's nothing wrong with giving newer players advantage to get in to the game and be useful in a short period of time. The problem is that the game encourages blobbing without a weapon to counter it. Remote dooms device was one, but certain faction whine and harassed CCP and eve community on a massive smear campaign, that CCP caved in and nurfed it without giving an alternative to discourage blobbing. It is now back to the whom can put up and keep up more POS towers. That's the problem. Capitals are not worth the coast of putting them up on the battlefield, because they die to a blob that the POS towers attract. Stealth bombers and bombs? Has anyone died to a bomb before? I can't say that I heard of any one, much less a fleet dyeing to a bomb. Anyone? So again, the problem is there needs to be something to discourage blobbing. It has nothing to do with newer or older players. The game canÆt handle the blob anyway, why encourage it by design?
Neena Valdi Art of War Cult of War	Posted - 2007.08.13 16:04:00 - [45] Originally by: Dark Shikari EVE is the only MMORPG I know of where 10 "low-level" players can go and kill a "high-level" player. And this is a very, very good thing. Huh? In majority of MMORPGs you can powerlevel to maximum level in like a week-two. In EVE 8-12 months old chars still can be considered 'noobs'...
Flow Befort GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.08.13 16:11:00 - [46] all my friends know the low rider
DarthJosh DEATHFUNK Chaos Incarnate.	Posted - 2007.08.13 16:18:00 - [47] Edited by: DarthJosh on 13/08/2007 16:21:27 Originally by: Dark Shikari EVE is the only MMORPG I know of where 10 "low-level" players can go and kill a "high-level" player. And this is a very, very good thing. Eve's not the only game. Runescape too has this. as a lvl 97, encountering 10 lvl 30s at the wilderness will end in nothing but death. (snare + firebolts = shudder)
Monkey Rat Caldari Simtech Productions Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.13 16:18:00 - [48] Originally by: marakor If you look at the patches that have been put in place and that they intend to bring in it seems to me that ccp seem to be against high SP and long term players having an advantage over a low sp players. The newest patches have even allowed the ultimate anti-blob ship the titan to be all but useless unless you wish to lose it after a single shot. Alliances with a titan should be considered like a country with nukes not every country has them but the way i see it is that a large alliance that has gone to a lot of effort to recruit good ppl with high sp and build these super capitals should have the advantages they bring. Eve has gone from a game that needed time and skill to actualy achieve somthing awsome like taking a system to a blob vs blob non-skill related laggy shoot em up. Adapt? - Sometimes its just not worth chewing through the leather straps in the morning.
Duskraven Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2007.08.13 16:21:00 - [49] Originally by: Moonlight Express Edited by: Moonlight Express on 13/08/2007 16:07:26 Stealth bombers and bombs? Has anyone died to a bomb before? I can't say that I heard of any one, much less a fleet dyeing to a bomb. Anyone? So again, the problem is there needs to be something to discourage blobbing. It has nothing to do with newer or older players. The game canÆt handle the blob anyway, why encourage it by design? I completely agree,the problem that I have seen with the Bombs is the high cost, I would love to use them in battles, but if its gonna cost me 20+million for ONE bomb, why bother when I can just blob with 50 Alliance mates and go shoot them for free? If CCP would make bombs easier to access, it would perhaps make it a more feasible countermeasure to blobs.
Svetlanna The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.08.13 16:25:00 - [50] Very simple to answer your orignal question marakor: This is the only way to recrute new players and increase their business for CCP. You can not tell to a potential customer: "well dude, sorry, you had to start playing 4 years ago to be able to survive in today's game". However, CCP effort to deliver LAG and make fleet battles impossible to play should be mentioned to those new accounts, no?

DeathGrip Amarr Dirty Deeds Corp. Axiom Empire	Posted - 2007.08.13 16:26:00 - [51] Originally by: Duskraven Originally by: Moonlight Express Edited by: Moonlight Express on 13/08/2007 16:07:26 Stealth bombers and bombs? Has anyone died to a bomb before? I can't say that I heard of any one, much less a fleet dyeing to a bomb. Anyone? So again, the problem is there needs to be something to discourage blobbing. It has nothing to do with newer or older players. The game canÆt handle the blob anyway, why encourage it by design? I completely agree,the problem that I have seen with the Bombs is the high cost, I would love to use them in battles, but if its gonna cost me 20+million for ONE bomb, why bother when I can just blob with 50 Alliance mates and go shoot them for free? If CCP would make bombs easier to access, it would perhaps make it a more feasible countermeasure to blobs. The cost of bombs does not bother me. Its how you ahve to use them. In order to properly use a bomb first off you need about 5-8 bombers. You all have to be at full speed, drop the bomb and never slow down. Well between lag, the fact you will be shot at soon as you cloak to hit full speed, and each bomber has to be doing same thing, plus you need a good bubble or dictor around the enemy fleet they are very very complicated to use effectivly. I tested bombs out for about 2 weeks with my alt. I went through aprox 17 covert opp ships, over 50 bombs, and killed 1 destroyer. Yes I know noob, bla bla bla. But bombs IMO are not effective at much atm after these tests.
SunglassesInSpace Minmatar GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.08.13 16:31:00 - [52] Originally by: marakor If you look at the patches that have been put in place and that they intend to bring in it seems to me that ccp seem to be against high SP and long term players having an advantage over a low sp players. The newest patches have even allowed the ultimate anti-blob ship the titan to be all but useless unless you wish to lose it after a single shot. Alliances with a titan should be considered like a country with nukes not every country has them but the way i see it is that a large alliance that has gone to a lot of effort to recruit good ppl with high sp and build these super capitals should have the advantages they bring. Eve has gone from a game that needed time and skill to actualy achieve somthing awsome like taking a system to a blob vs blob non-skill related laggy shoot em up. Why don't you go log in your lvl 70 character in WoW and gank some noobs to make yourself feel better
Avery Cane Contras	Posted - 2007.08.13 16:48:00 - [53] Originally by: Alexander Knott Originally by: Avery Cane titans still have a purpose that is true. as logistics ships? i mean who the hell wants a 65billion isk transport ship. Anyone with any sense. Logistics make and break alliances. yes but i dont think the current titan pilots in eve thought that is what they would be reduced to by getting into a titan. yes the logistics side is great but it is supposed to be the ulitmate weapon. also i have no problems with titans or any other capital other than the fact a body can keep it from warping. that doesnt even make since.
fightnkill Dark Blade Incorporated	Posted - 2007.08.13 16:49:00 - [54] Can't say that some alliances like GS are "New players" A lot of GS pilots are better skilled in terms of PVP compared to most BoB pilots. Anyways, it may seem that nowadays CCP is favoring new players because CCP isn't giving old schoolers the advantages they need to kill 10x their number lol. Titan for instance is still the anti-blobbing machine. It can kill mass-loads of newbs yup. But some alliances will be reluctant to use it against "Newbs" with a huge fleet of Capital ships.
Ather Ialeas Amarr Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United Cult of War	Posted - 2007.08.13 16:51:00 - [55] Originally by: Ander Edited by: Ander on 13/08/2007 14:27:06 UO is nothing of its former glory. I've played UO since 1997 and it's just gone downhill since they implemented Trammel (safe facet) and Felluca (unsafe PVP facet)... EVE is the ONLY mmo with this kind of free PVP. You can't deny pre-AoS UO wasn't completely, totally awesome though, a real "this is how this kind of game should be done" example. [ insert fancy sig here ]
stephane devaulx Gallente COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.08.13 16:56:00 - [56] this is one of the strengh of this game, it will let us have more and more people on eve.
marakor Gallente Anti Lag Forum Smackers	Posted - 2007.08.13 17:03:00 - [57] Originally by: fightnkill Can't say that some alliances like GS are "New players" A lot of GS pilots are better skilled in terms of PVP compared to most BoB pilots. Anyways, it may seem that nowadays CCP is favoring new players because CCP isn't giving old schoolers the advantages they need to kill 10x their number lol. Titan for instance is still the anti-blobbing machine. It can kill mass-loads of newbs yup. But some alliances will be reluctant to use it against "Newbs" with a huge fleet of Capital ships. I agree with you to a point but the fact is that stoping the titans remote DDD, adding the timer for jumping and making bombs that do not explode if you are not watching them/on grid have both made a huge contribution to the blob mentality that is now screwing with eve. I agree that depending on ship types that 10 or even fewer new players should be able to kill a older player or it would be to unrealistic but by screwing with the titan and making stupid bombs that miss you so much after you have dropped them that they do not blow up if they cannot see you has favored the blob way to much.
fightnkill Dark Blade Incorporated	Posted - 2007.08.13 17:06:00 - [58] Originally by: marakor Originally by: fightnkill Can't say that some alliances like GS are "New players" A lot of GS pilots are better skilled in terms of PVP compared to most BoB pilots. Anyways, it may seem that nowadays CCP is favoring new players because CCP isn't giving old schoolers the advantages they need to kill 10x their number lol. Titan for instance is still the anti-blobbing machine. It can kill mass-loads of newbs yup. But some alliances will be reluctant to use it against "Newbs" with a huge fleet of Capital ships. I agree with you to a point but the fact is that stoping the titans remote DDD, adding the timer for jumping and making bombs that do not explode if you are not watching them/on grid have both made a huge contribution to the blob mentality that is now screwing with eve. I agree that depending on ship types that 10 or even fewer new players should be able to kill a older player or it would be to unrealistic but by screwing with the titan and making stupid bombs that miss you so much after you have dropped them that they do not blow up if they cannot see you has favored the blob way to much. Only mass dreads, carriers and other ships are capable of destroying a Titan. I can't really say that someone who owns any Capital ship can be classified as a "newb"
Fitz Chivalry eXceed Inc.	Posted - 2007.08.13 17:07:00 - [59] Pre-nerf titans were an absolute joke and the worst thing to have ever happened to the game. And this includes POS. And even now a titan can fry an entire fleet (which I still think is ridiculous, titan's should be an uber dread, not a re-usable nuke) and is only really vulnerable afterwards to a large Dread fleet which is ready to cyno in at a moments notice, and such fleets are not piloted by noobs but by veteran pilots, so quite how ccp hates vets by giving vets an opportunity to take down is not all that clear tbh.
NATMav F.R.E.E. Explorer EVE Animal Control	Posted - 2007.08.13 17:11:00 - [60] Originally by: Moonlight Express Edited by: Moonlight Express on 13/08/2007 16:07:26 There's nothing wrong with giving newer players advantage to get in to the game and be useful in a short period of time. The problem is that the game encourages blobbing without a weapon to counter it. Remote dooms device was one, but certain faction whine and harassed CCP and eve community on a massive smear campaign, that CCP caved in and nurfed it without giving an alternative to discourage blobbing. It is now back to the whom can put up and keep up more POS towers. That's the problem. Capitals are not worth the cost of putting them up on the battlefield, because they die to a blob that the POS towers attract. Stealth bombers and bombs? Has anyone died to a bomb before? I can't say that I heard of any one, much less a fleet dyeing to a bomb. Anyone? So again, the problem is there needs to be something to discourage blobbing. It has nothing to do with newer or older players. The game canÆt handle the blob anyway, why encourage it by design? Umm...even the people flying the solo pwnmobiles admitted that they were seriously breaking game mechanics. There is nothing wrong with the way supercaps are now...the true problem lies in the lag/desynch issues which makes fielding them alot more risky. Bottom line is you must have a support fleet to help protect your multi-billion ISK superweapon after it blows its load, or it will be a sitting duck. I don't see a single thing wrong with that. The days of 1 vs. 200 and the 1 guy winning every time are over.



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