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Explain Hedonistic Imperative's forfeit?

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 5 post(s)
Imperator Jora'h	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:15:00 - [1] I heard the explanation on EVE TV but still....what?
Patch86 Di-Tron Heavy Industries Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:16:00 - [2] So if I heard right- they opened fire too early and popped a ship? ------ Originally by: CCP Prism X There's no such thing as playing too much EvE! You all obviously need more accounts!
Ishina Fel Caldari Synergy. Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:16:00 - [3] Brought more points than they were allowed to field?
Weeka Amarr Imperial Shipment	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:16:00 - [4] They apparently attacked MC and killed at least one ship long before the game was started. While it may be hedonistic its not imperativ .. so forfeit
An Anarchyyt Gallente Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:17:00 - [5] Originally by: Patch86 So if I heard right- they opened fire too early and popped a ship? Yes. They thought the count down at the end of the last fight was the beginning of their fight. Opened Fire on an MC Maulus, popped it. The end. Originally by: CCP Wrangler Second, a gentile is a non jewish person

Deckard Bishop Forum Moderator Interstellar Services Department	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:17:00 - [6] they opened fire on MC and destroyed a ship forfeit as they did not follow the rules/GM directions.... forum rules \| [email protected] \| Our Website Contact Support - Report Bug - Join ISD - Watch EVE TV

Ishina Fel Caldari Synergy. Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:17:00 - [7] Ah, so that's what happened
Imperator Jora'h	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:18:00 - [8] Originally by: Patch86 So if I heard right- they opened fire too early and popped a ship? Yeah. And they said a GM said stop and they ignored it. Ignoring GMs is never a win. What were they thinking?
dalman Finite Horizon	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:18:00 - [9] Can we please have it announced what ships MC brought to the match? Getting 150 points without having to show off your tactic is quite an advantage... Am I forced to have any regret? I've become the lie, beautiful and free In my righteous own mind I adore and preach the insanity you gave to me
Danton Marcellus Nebula Rasa Holdings	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:18:00 - [10] Damn that's harsh. Countdown to end matches need to go, just a big ass repeat STOP! Also Known As
Big Al The Aftermath	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:19:00 - [11] So was this the first time there was a countdown til the end of a match?
Hubris Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:19:00 - [12] This is getting stupid, stop with the forfeits just get the guy another maulus and get on with the fighting. This is really dumb. 2 minutes of fitting another ship and a match would ensue. -
RogueWing Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:20:00 - [13] Sounded like they mistook the countdown for the previous match to end and thought it was the countdown to their matching beginning and popped a MC Maulus before the match started.
Imperator Jora'h	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:20:00 - [14] Originally by: dalman Can we please have it announced what ships MC brought to the match? Getting 150 points without having to show off your tactic is quite an advantage... Well you know MC had at least one Maulus.

CCP Sharkbait	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:21:00 - [15] they attacked a player early as stated and destroyed the ship. we then called the fight a forfeit. there was no countdown to start the match and shouldn't have been any fighting. after being told to stop the attack, they then attacked a camera man. as i have stated a few times, we will enforce the rules.

RogueWing Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:21:00 - [16] Originally by: Big Al So was this the first time there was a countdown til the end of a match? There is a time limit...and the previous match reached a stalemate with neither side able to break the other side's tank.
Imperator Jora'h	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:23:00 - [17] Originally by: CCP Sharkbait after being told to stop the attack, they then attacked a camera man. LMFAO...do we have Darwin Awards in EVE?
Flinx Evenstar Minmatar Spartan Industries Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:23:00 - [18] Originally by: CCP Sharkbait after being told to stop the attack, they then attacked a camera man. crazy mofo's Can you even lock a polaris frigate, or what are the camera guys flying? I, erm, like kill things and stuff
Big Al The Aftermath	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:23:00 - [19] Originally by: RogueWing Originally by: Big Al So was this the first time there was a countdown til the end of a match? There is a time limit...and the previous match reached a stalemate with neither side able to break the other side's tank. That isn't what I asked, I asked if this was the first match (as heard on evetv) where they ended a match with a 10, 9, 8... countdown.
An Anarchyyt Gallente Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:23:00 - [20] Originally by: Imperator Jora'h Originally by: CCP Sharkbait after being told to stop the attack, they then attacked a camera man. LMFAO...do we have Darwin Awards in EVE? I certainly hope so. Originally by: CCP Wrangler Second, a gentile is a non jewish person
Aeleva Caldari Hegemonic Core	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:24:00 - [21] they are not flying polaris ships, flying opus ships. Also yeah LOL at that, wonder if someone was drinking.
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:24:00 - [22] Edited by: Owi on 02/09/2007 19:26:19 - My EvE-Files.com folder !
Derrios Dirty Deeds Corp. Axiom Empire	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:24:00 - [23] gg -_-~ ----------------------------------------------- I got something to put in you. at the *** bar.
Holmes Four Caldari Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:25:00 - [24] There may have been illicit substances involved...
NeOnicuS Save our Souls	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:27:00 - [25] Originally by: Owi Edited by: Owi on 02/09/2007 19:24:26 [ 2007.09.02 18:55:34 ] GM Xamother > 5 Minutes left [ 2007.09.02 18:57:13 ] GM Xamother > 3 minutes left [ 2007.09.02 18:58:03 ] GM Xamother > 2 minutes [ 2007.09.02 18:59:01 ] GM Xamother > 1 minute [ 2007.09.02 18:59:31 ] GM Xamother > 30 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:36 ] Myndpyre Ryche > is that until match start for us or match end for them? [ 2007.09.02 18:59:52 ] GM Xamother > 10 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:54 ] GM Xamother > 9 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:55 ] GM Xamother > 8 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:56 ] GM Xamother > 7 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:57 ] GM Xamother > 6 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:59 ] GM Xamother > 5 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:00 ] GM Xamother > 4 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:01 ] GM Xamother > 3 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:02 ] GM Xamother > 2 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:03 ] GM Xamother > 1 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:05 ] GM Xamother > STOP! dont mess like that with us... this was a planed TRAP !!! thx to make it a "fair" fight ! Interesting. ----------- Yaarrr!!
Babel Utopian Research I.E.L. Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:27:00 - [26] hehe .... Down with The Man ! :P URIEL Recruiting
Xantia Gedur House of Gedur	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:29:00 - [27] Kind of spoils the tournament if there are too many forfeits
DamienUPB Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:30:00 - [28] Originally by: CCP Sharkbait they attacked a player early as stated and destroyed the ship. we then called the fight a forfeit. there was no countdown to start the match and shouldn't have been any fighting. after being told to stop the attack, they then attacked a camera man. as i have stated a few times, we will enforce the rules. I want the kill mail for that camera. I didn't fire on the camera till after you disqualified. Also the gm told us "good luck kill them all" in our gang chat. Then the count down occured was not precluded with this is the countdown for the other match or anything of the sort. MC was moving before the match. So instead of a quick respawn of the one ship we insta popped for your mistakes GM you disqualified. Thanks Sharkbait.
An Anarchyyt Gallente Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:31:00 - [29] So I see, it's all their fault. Originally by: CCP Wrangler Second, a gentile is a non jewish person
Yokan Daifuku Gallente The Flaming Sideburn's Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:33:00 - [30] Originally by: CCP Sharkbait they attacked a player early as stated and destroyed the ship. we then called the fight a forfeit. there was no countdown to start the match and shouldn't have been any fighting. after being told to stop the attack, they then attacked a camera man. as i have stated a few times, we will enforce the rules. Please note that: 1. Camera was killed after forfeit was called and appeals in chats to GM's 2. The countdown was EXACLY at the time where we were scheduled to BEGIN and we were already in the arena. Even MC was confused and asked about the timer. 3. No one was told this was a stopping timer until AFTER countdown. ---- Yo-con Die-foo-koo
RogueWing Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:33:00 - [31] Originally by: DamienUPB I didn't fire on the camera till after you disqualified. Hm....you attacked the camera man why?? Just ****ed because you forfeited your match?

CCP Sharkbait	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:33:00 - [32] the ships the camera men fly are targetable, but we make them so you can't target them. but 1 of the camera men crashed out and didn't tell us. he was then targetable again. but that has nothing to do with it.

Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:33:00 - [33] the first match there wasnt a countdown from the last match ... and if gm tells us to watch local for the countdown what you think we do ? The said jump into battlearena .. then the countdown starts... !!! Mean wtf ? last match ? there wasnt even 25 ppl in local ..so the last match allready ended ! My EvE-Files.com folder !
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:35:00 - [34] Edited by: Owi on 02/09/2007 19:36:19 btw MC moved at time they was in battlearena...they broke the rules first :P ow right i forgot that it was thyre "first match ever" in the tourney ..so they didnt know the rules ! My EvE-Files.com folder !
Omega Man The Geddy Foundation	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:36:00 - [35] STOP! not clue enough? - Happy user of CAOD troll cleaner http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=584345
Genwulf Caldari Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:36:00 - [36] Originally by: CCP Sharkbait *there was no countdown to start the match and shouldn't have been any fighting.* as i have stated a few times, we will enforce the rules. I disagree Sharkbait. There was a count down. Please review your procedures.
Imperator Jora'h	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:37:00 - [37] Originally by: Owi the first match there wasnt a countdown from the last match ... and if gm tells us to watch local for the countdown what you think we do ? The said jump into battlearena .. then the countdown starts... !!! Mean wtf ? last match ? there wasnt even 25 ppl in local ..so the last match allready ended ! From what you posted earlier: Edited by: Owi on 02/09/2007 19:24:26 [ 2007.09.02 18:55:34 ] GM Xamother > 5 Minutes left [ 2007.09.02 18:57:13 ] GM Xamother > 3 minutes left [ 2007.09.02 18:58:03 ] GM Xamother > 2 minutes [ 2007.09.02 18:59:01 ] GM Xamother > 1 minute [ 2007.09.02 18:59:31 ] GM Xamother > 30 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:36 ] Myndpyre Ryche > is that until match start for us or match end for them? [ 2007.09.02 18:59:52 ] GM Xamother > 10 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:54 ] GM Xamother > 9 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:55 ] GM Xamother > 8 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:56 ] GM Xamother > 7 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:57 ] GM Xamother > 6 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:59 ] GM Xamother > 5 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:00 ] GM Xamother > 4 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:01 ] GM Xamother > 3 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:02 ] GM Xamother > 2 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:03 ] GM Xamother > 1 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:05 ] GM Xamother > STOP! Which part of "STOP" was unclear?
Yokan Daifuku Gallente The Flaming Sideburn's Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:37:00 - [38] Originally by: Omega Man STOP! not clue enough? The only indication of stop was after the countdown ended. ---- Yo-con Die-foo-koo
NeOnicuS Save our Souls	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:38:00 - [39] Originally by: Imperator Jora'h Originally by: Owi the first match there wasnt a countdown from the last match ... and if gm tells us to watch local for the countdown what you think we do ? The said jump into battlearena .. then the countdown starts... !!! Mean wtf ? last match ? there wasnt even 25 ppl in local ..so the last match allready ended ! From what you posted earlier: Edited by: Owi on 02/09/2007 19:24:26 [ 2007.09.02 18:55:34 ] GM Xamother > 5 Minutes left [ 2007.09.02 18:57:13 ] GM Xamother > 3 minutes left [ 2007.09.02 18:58:03 ] GM Xamother > 2 minutes [ 2007.09.02 18:59:01 ] GM Xamother > 1 minute [ 2007.09.02 18:59:31 ] GM Xamother > 30 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:36 ] Myndpyre Ryche > is that until match start for us or match end for them? [ 2007.09.02 18:59:52 ] GM Xamother > 10 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:54 ] GM Xamother > 9 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:55 ] GM Xamother > 8 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:56 ] GM Xamother > 7 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:57 ] GM Xamother > 6 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:59 ] GM Xamother > 5 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:00 ] GM Xamother > 4 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:01 ] GM Xamother > 3 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:02 ] GM Xamother > 2 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:03 ] GM Xamother > 1 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:05 ] GM Xamother > STOP! Which part of "STOP" was unclear? Can't stop missiles can you? ----------- Yaarrr!!
Yokan Daifuku Gallente The Flaming Sideburn's Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:40:00 - [40] This kind of countdown was identical to the starting countdown in the previous match I was in. ---- Yo-con Die-foo-koo
Lyn Z Minmatar Ctrl Alt Elites	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:41:00 - [41] First Goonswarm DQ now MC wins a match by forfeit... Get 'em guys!
YChin Mei Hungarian Rangers The Sphere Confederation	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:41:00 - [42] Originally by: Owi [ 2007.09.02 18:59:52 ] GM Xamother > 10 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:54 ] GM Xamother > 9 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:55 ] GM Xamother > 8 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:56 ] GM Xamother > 7 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:57 ] GM Xamother > 6 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:59 ] GM Xamother > 5 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:00 ] GM Xamother > 4 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:01 ] GM Xamother > 3 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:02 ] GM Xamother > 2 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:03 ] GM Xamother > 1 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:05 ] GM Xamother > STOP! Well, if I would set a trap like you are talking about I wouldn't use "STOP!" but "START!" or "FIRE!" instead, don't you think?
Imperator Jora'h	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:42:00 - [43] Originally by: NeOnicuS Originally by: Imperator Jora'h Which part of "STOP" was unclear? Can't stop missiles can you? No but how does STOP mean START shooting your missiles to begin with?
Zorlag Minmatar GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:42:00 - [44] I'm with Hedonistic on this I mean sure they broke the rules but the GM's could've made **** a bit clearer eh?
RogueWing Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:43:00 - [45] I can understand making a mistake about the countdown. Understand completely. But then to turn around and kill the camera ship because you are upset is nothing more than sheer moronic stupidity. That's like watching a 2 year throw a temper tantrum because you take away their toy. Very mature of you.
Ja'Anarria	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:43:00 - [46] Here's a typical example of the kind of CCP mgmt or GM's tactics to squelch open conversation about the FACTS of situations that are contested. EVE System > Channel MOTD: <b><fontsize=36><color=0xff0000ff><br><fontsize=24><color=0xffb2b2b2><u>http://www.eve-online.tv<br></u><fontsize=18><color=0xff4c4c4c><br><fontsize=18><color=0xffffffff>Play it \| Live it \| <fontsize=18><color=0xffb2b2b2>Watch it<br><fontsize=18><color=0xffff0000><br><fontsize=18><color=0xffff0000><br><fontsize=18><color=0xffff0000>This weekend 1500GMT Alliance Tournament on FREEVIEW! <br><fontsize=18><color=0xffff0000><br><fontsize=18><color=0xffffffff>The Weekly News Series of EVE TV, Episode <fontsize=18><color=0xffff0000>8<fontsize=18><color=0xffffffff> now available, Including:<br><fontsize=14><color=0xffff0000>-<fontsize=14><color=0xffffffff> The latest news from the EVE universe.<br><fontsize=14><color=0xffff0000>- <fontsize=14><color=0xffffffff>A Report from i31, Newbury.<br><fontsize=14><color=0xffff0000>-<fontsize=14><color=0xffffffff> Hippoking joins us in the studio, and tells us about his life of internet crime.<br><fontsize=14><color=0xffff0000>-<fontsize=14><color=0xffffffff> Benilopax is back with his Market Report.<br><fontsize=14><color=0xffff0000>-<fontsize=14><color=0xffffffff> Gabe Knight profiles the Purifier as well as all stealth bombers.<br><fontsize=14><color=0xffffffff><br><fontsize=14><color=0xffffffff><br><fontsize=11><color=0xffb2b2b2>Please feel free to use this channel to contact any of the EVE TV Crew, ask questions about production, share ideas and discuss shows. </b> Eomar > change tactics? Ihki > that chatlog where there's allegedly a countdown with a "STOP" two seconds after it looks suspect CCP Sharkbait > was it an accident that you attacked a camera man after being told to stop. or maybe when you all warped off to random locations in the solarSystem. nope, i think now CCP Sharkbait > not Ihki > jesus christ i don't think it's the players who have a persecution complex Ja'Anarria > that was asfter you DQ'd us for an invalid reason Papa Boats > we did that 5 mins after you DQ us so what we gonna lose at that point CCP Sharkbait > i will not discuss this anymore in this channel Crucifier > all the 1v20 mevsfix went well for me tho Phoenix7982 > lol Eomar > dont try to argue sharkbait, you know the saying Ihki > i'd at least try to run a tournament instead of using disqualification as the first measure Eomar > hell drag you donw to his level and beat you with experience Ja'Anarria > OBEY! Crucifier > because ppl have so much reason to trust ccp now Phoenix7982 > yea they are dqing way to much Freelanc3r > MC ARE BOB PETS ARE CCP AND YOU VIOLENCED OUR TOURNY CHANCES SHARK ! Eomar > oh noes! Jevus > ihki if you ran the tournament then goons would win by default EVE System > Channel Password cleared by CCP Sharkbait. EVE System > Channel default access set to Moderated by CCP Sharkbait. This channel is now effectively running in moderated mode. CCP Sharkbait > silence is golden i believe the saying is Ja'Anarria > You are not able to speak on this channel<br>Reason: Not Specified<br>Until: Not Specified<br>admin: Not Specified<br> Ja'Anarria > LOL - so squelch the opposition.
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:44:00 - [47] http://www.google.de/search?q=define:Countdown&hl=de&oi=definel&defl=en A countdown is the backward counting to indicate the seconds, days, etc. remaining before an event. Typical events for which a countdown is used include the launch of a space rocket, the explosion of a bomb, the start of a race or New Year. well sometimes a countdown stops in middle of it ..but not at zero.. it wasnt 0.8 or 0.5 or 0.2 sec it was 1 sec to 0 .. it was 2 sec to 0 .. [ 2007.09.02 19:00:03 ] GM Xamother > 1 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:05 ] GM Xamother > STOP! are you all dont know your own f** english language and what it means ? thats pur bull** My EvE-Files.com folder !
Danton Marcellus Nebula Rasa Holdings	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:45:00 - [48] It's not really an as big a deal when a match ends as it is when it starts, just spam STOP FIGHTING in local as to not confuse the two. Also Known As
Lyn Z Minmatar Ctrl Alt Elites	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:48:00 - [49] Sharkbait admits that MC moved from their positions before the start. CCP Sharkbait > i said drop the subject. MC will be delt with for moving before the start But MC was not disqualified for that blatant breaking of the rules. Following a few more moments of discussion Sharkbait muted the whole channel again, followed by: CCP Sharkbait > afk for an hour
Milena Rage The Aftermath	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:49:00 - [50] KM please.

CCP Sharkbait	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:51:00 - [51] Originally by: Lyn Z Sharkbait admits that MC moved from their positions before the start. CCP Sharkbait > i said drop the subject. MC will be delt with for moving before the start But MC was not disqualified for that blatant breaking of the rules. Following a few more moments of discussion Sharkbait muted the whole channel again, followed by: CCP Sharkbait > afk for an hour MC are not the only people that have moved early. there has been many other teams but they stop once being told to stop.

Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:51:00 - [52] our match was sheduled for 19 EvE time...what you do if a countdown typed at this time ? the match befor was sheduled for 18.30 .. that means it ends on 18.50 ! If the match was delayd ... why not letting us know ? Lag of Information or known trap !? Mean everythink is very nice planned at this tourney and even eve so every team gets ready ...and if we in the battlearena and the countdown starts .. well its just human that you hit the button on 0 sec... this was a mess with us !! My EvE-Files.com folder !
An Anarchyyt Gallente Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:51:00 - [53] Originally by: Owi http://www.google.de/search?q=define:Countdown&hl=de&oi=definel&defl=en A countdown is the backward counting to indicate the seconds, days, etc. remaining before an event. Typical events for which a countdown is used include the launch of a space rocket, the explosion of a bomb, the start of a race or New Year. well sometimes a countdown stops in middle of it ..but not at zero.. it wasnt 0.8 or 0.5 or 0.2 sec it was 1 sec to 0 .. it was 2 sec to 0 .. [ 2007.09.02 19:00:03 ] GM Xamother > 1 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:05 ] GM Xamother > STOP! are you all dont know your own f** english language and what it means ? thats pur bull Well it doesn't count tenths of a second. So, maybe it was at 3.8 and then people aren't machines. Originally by:** CCP Wrangler Second, a gentile is a non jewish person
Cabre	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:52:00 - [54] The punishment was not harsh enough imo both you and Goons should have been banned the entire tournament. You failed next time don't shoot at MC after the countdown?
Danton Marcellus Nebula Rasa Holdings	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:52:00 - [55] Originally by: CCP Sharkbait Originally by: Lyn Z Sharkbait admits that MC moved from their positions before the start. CCP Sharkbait > i said drop the subject. MC will be delt with for moving before the start But MC was not disqualified for that blatant breaking of the rules. Following a few more moments of discussion Sharkbait muted the whole channel again, followed by: CCP Sharkbait > afk for an hour MC are not the only people that have moved early. there has been many other teams but they stop once being told to stop. Also I hear they got deducted points in the standings. Can we get a clarification on what teams has gotten points deductions and why? As it stands now the points are quite confusing. Also Known As
Cabre	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:54:00 - [56] MC beat u guys end of story.
DamienUPB Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:55:00 - [57] Sharkbait said I didn't pop it oh well atleast I got a few vollies off. Thanks for the mismanagement yet again sharky.
ElCoCo KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:55:00 - [58] Shooting the cameraman? Any sympathy you could have gained was lost there...
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:55:00 - [59] Originally by: YChin Mei Originally by: Owi [ 2007.09.02 18:59:52 ] GM Xamother > 10 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:54 ] GM Xamother > 9 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:55 ] GM Xamother > 8 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:56 ] GM Xamother > 7 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:57 ] GM Xamother > 6 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:59 ] GM Xamother > 5 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:00 ] GM Xamother > 4 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:01 ] GM Xamother > 3 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:02 ] GM Xamother > 2 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:03 ] GM Xamother > 1 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:05 ] GM Xamother > STOP! Well, if I would set a trap like you are talking about I wouldn't use "STOP!" but "START!" or "FIRE!" instead, don't you think? a start or fire wouldt be a regular rule start ... so what ? My EvE-Files.com folder !

CCP Sharkbait	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:55:00 - [60] Originally by: Danton Marcellus Originally by: CCP Sharkbait Originally by: Lyn Z Sharkbait admits that MC moved from their positions before the start. CCP Sharkbait > i said drop the subject. MC will be delt with for moving before the start But MC was not disqualified for that blatant breaking of the rules. Following a few more moments of discussion Sharkbait muted the whole channel again, followed by: CCP Sharkbait > afk for an hour MC are not the only people that have moved early. there has been many other teams but they stop once being told to stop. Also I hear they got deducted points in the standings. Can we get a clarification on what teams has gotten points deductions and why? As it stands now the points are quite confusing. i think we are going to list the point deductions, hopefully tomorrow for this weekends actions. i will find out for sure about this now.

Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:56:00 - [61] Originally by: Cabre MC beat u guys end of story. thats why..they had loose this fight :P so they need different tactic My EvE-Files.com folder !
Cabre	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:57:00 - [62] Don't punish MC Sharkbait you know they did nothing wrong
pastafarianist	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:57:00 - [63] o snap its mc, quick, to the devmobile
DamienUPB Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:57:00 - [64] Originally by: Cabre MC beat u guys end of story. MC was scared we had the perfect compliment to go after your ships. We got very lucky and you made a mess in your pants and the gm's bailed you out.
Turix Interstellar eXodus R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:59:00 - [65] Originally by: CCP Sharkbait they attacked a player early as stated and destroyed the ship. we then called the fight a forfeit. there was no countdown to start the match and shouldn't have been any fighting. after being told to stop the attack, they then attacked a camera man. as i have stated a few times, we will enforce the rules. So far both forfeigts have been your fault, so urm? Corrupt GMs. First one your GM warped too many ships when told not too. Second your GMs sounded down in local and didnt make it clear, as if it was a countdown to start. Mistakes by GM's should not be punshing the players. Sorry my faith in CCP has never been good. \| Image Hosting \| My Movies \|
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 19:59:00 - [66] Edited by: Owi on 02/09/2007 20:01:21 Waz the point of a tourney if rules are not used ? 11. Moving ships to improve positions before the match starts is NOT allowed. everyone knowed the rules !! so waz point moving ships MC ? they didnt got any penalize for that My EvE-Files.com folder !
Wendat Huron Stellar Solutions	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:01:00 - [67] Regardless I think everyone is interested in what the MC fielded, why is this not disclosed?
Stefx Gallente Moons of Pluto	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:01:00 - [68] Originally by: ElCoCo Shooting the cameraman? Any sympathy you could have gained was lost there... Yep
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:03:00 - [69] Edited by: Owi on 02/09/2007 20:05:02 we dont need sympathi ..we need and want a fair fight for all .. he just fixed our scratched heart with that kill.. My EvE-Files.com folder !
Ed Anger	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:04:00 - [70] it would be nice if the GMs tried to make sure the matchs could proceed, rather then jumping to forfeits immediately. both of these forfeits were screwups that could have been easily fixed, and let fight determine the outcome.
TRYPTIC The Flaming Sideburn's Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:04:00 - [71] So, in other words, sharkbait, we were supposed to know that XAMOTHER was ending the match on the other field and not starting ours? I'm sorry but, when I was born, my parents had the bone in my head that makes me telepathic surgically removed. I'll see whether I can get it put back in, but I doubt that will happen.
Shiv Deviir Caldari	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:04:00 - [72] Pure BS, good job GM's way to mess up another match.
DonCare	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:05:00 - [73] 3 raven rest were all maulus. on the MC team.
TRYPTIC The Flaming Sideburn's Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:08:00 - [74] Oh, and Wendat, to answer your question, MC showed up with 3 Ravens and the rest were Maulus's. Our cruise volleys (2) insta-popped a Maulus. So maybe you understand why we're ****ed about the whole situation -- we had them figured out and couldn't fight them.
Sokratesz Paradox v2.0 Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:11:00 - [75] Way to go GM's.
Canine Fiend Minmatar Viper Squad Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:12:00 - [76] Alright, so you guys shot someone after watching a countdown get to 1. Why did you shoot before the "Go". I'm confused as to how you could possibly argue against this. If it goes 3 2 1 GO you shoot on go, not on one. Your desire to get an advantage cost you the game. Shooting the cameraman afterwards because you were upset that you screwed up is just poor form. I don't see how you can sit here and complain about dev favoritism when it's clear stupidity. -------------------
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:14:00 - [77] Originally by: Canine Fiend Alright, so you guys shot someone after watching a countdown get to 1. Why did you shoot before the "Go". I'm confused as to how you could possibly argue against this. If it goes 3 2 1 GO you shoot on go, not on one. Your desire to get an advantage cost you the game. Shooting the cameraman afterwards because you were upset that you screwed up is just poor form. I don't see how you can sit here and complain about dev favoritism when it's clear stupidity. well i cant hold my gang m8 remotly down to press a button.. sry about the cam .. realy was no need for it ! My EvE-Files.com folder !
Babel Utopian Research I.E.L. Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:15:00 - [78] Originally by: Canine Fiend Alright, so you guys shot someone after watching a countdown get to 1. Why did you shoot before the "Go". I'm confused as to how you could possibly argue against this. If it goes 3 2 1 GO you shoot on go, not on one. Your desire to get an advantage cost you the game. Shooting the cameraman afterwards because you were upset that you screwed up is just poor form. I don't see how you can sit here and complain about dev favoritism when it's clear stupidity. Being in charge, inconsistant and about as clear as mud is pretty poor form too imho :) URIEL Recruiting
Canine Fiend Minmatar Viper Squad Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:17:00 - [79] Originally by: Babel Originally by: Canine Fiend Alright, so you guys shot someone after watching a countdown get to 1. Why did you shoot before the "Go". I'm confused as to how you could possibly argue against this. If it goes 3 2 1 GO you shoot on go, not on one. Your desire to get an advantage cost you the game. Shooting the cameraman afterwards because you were upset that you screwed up is just poor form. I don't see how you can sit here and complain about dev favoritism when it's clear stupidity. Being in charge, inconsistant and about as clear as mud is pretty poor form too imho :) So you're not arguing my first point at all? Stop still means stop, there's nothing inconsistent about that. -------------------
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:19:00 - [80] Edited by: Owi on 02/09/2007 20:20:16 Originally by: Canine Fiend Alright, so you guys shot someone after watching a countdown get to 1. Why did you shoot before the "Go". I'm confused as to how you could possibly argue against this. If it goes 3 2 1 GO you shoot on go, not on one. Your desire to get an advantage cost you the game. he shot on stop .. not on 1 or 2 or 3 he shot on the trigger to 0 ... i had a lock also .. but you cant hold a fired missle ! it had to be start like the last day or every other match that was allready done and not stop .. it was a countdown to start the match not to stop it ! why stop it on 0 ? not on 2 or 3 ? tell me why stop it at 0 ? My EvE-Files.com folder !
Canine Fiend Minmatar Viper Squad Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:21:00 - [81] Originally by: Owi he shot on stop Period. -------------------
Babel Utopian Research I.E.L. Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:22:00 - [82] Originally by: Canine Fiend Originally by: Babel Originally by: Canine Fiend Alright, so you guys shot someone after watching a countdown get to 1. Why did you shoot before the "Go". I'm confused as to how you could possibly argue against this. If it goes 3 2 1 GO you shoot on go, not on one. Your desire to get an advantage cost you the game. Shooting the cameraman afterwards because you were upset that you screwed up is just poor form. I don't see how you can sit here and complain about dev favoritism when it's clear stupidity. Being in charge, inconsistant and about as clear as mud is pretty poor form too imho :) So you're not arguing my first point at all? Stop still means stop, there's nothing inconsistent about that. No, I'm not arguing yr point at all - just pointing out that the way the match was handled was open to confusion. As for attacking the cameraman - Hilarious :P - wish I'd been there ... URIEL Recruiting
Imperator Jora'h	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:25:00 - [83] Originally by: Owi well i cant hold my gang m8 remotly down to press a button.. sry about the cam .. realy was no need for it ! Sure. Just like in sports you cannot make your teammates work as they should but if they screw up the TEAM gets penalized. If your team is that out of control you have issues with the team then and should look at that. Assuming you were FC/Team Captain it is up to you in the end to see your teammates do what they are supposed to do.
Local Her0 Minmatar La Mancha Corp	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:26:00 - [84] i think both goons as well as the hedonistics broke the rules clearly enough to not only forfeigt the matches as the GMs did but also BAN them from EVE-online... or maybe BAN them from the INTERNETS!!!!oneone - booya
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:29:00 - [85] Originally by: Local Her0 i think both goons as well as the hedonistics broke the rules clearly enough to not only forfeigt the matches as the GMs did but also BAN them from EVE-online... or maybe BAN them from the INTERNETS!!!!oneone - booya yaa right you dont have the mind to watch over the border.. My EvE-Files.com folder !
Imperator Jora'h	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:29:00 - [86] Originally by: Owi Edited by: Owi on 02/09/2007 20:20:16 Originally by: Canine Fiend Alright, so you guys shot someone after watching a countdown get to 1. Why did you shoot before the "Go". I'm confused as to how you could possibly argue against this. If it goes 3 2 1 GO you shoot on go, not on one. Your desire to get an advantage cost you the game. he shot on stop .. not on 1 or 2 or 3 he shot on the trigger to 0 ... i had a lock also .. but you cant hold a fired missle ! it had to be start like the last day or every other match that was allready done and not stop .. it was a countdown to start the match not to stop it ! why stop it on 0 ? not on 2 or 3 ? tell me why stop it at 0 ? You shot on ZERO? I could be wrong but it is my understanding that there are to be no target locks prior to the start. Towards this end the Devs ECM burst the field and break all locks. Yet you managed to shoot immediately?
Thundercat Doom Minmatar Melissa Jumpclones INC	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:31:00 - [87] Originally by: Local Her0 i think both goons as well as the hedonistics broke the rules clearly enough to not only forfeigt the matches as the GMs did but also BAN them from EVE-online... or maybe BAN them from the INTERNETS!!!!oneone - booya Looks as if someone forgot to take their medicine. -------------------- -------------------- 0101001001101111011101110111001000100001
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:31:00 - [88] no i locked on stop / 0 ... 1 sensor boost II / 3 amplifier IIs.. on a Hounds.. lockin BS just 1 sec.. i didnt fired about the stop irritating comment... im fast thinker and just had the lock and hold myself to not trigger the highslots My EvE-Files.com folder !
Shamis Orzoz Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:32:00 - [89] Originally by: dalman Can we please have it announced what ships MC brought to the match? Getting 150 points without having to show off your tactic is quite an advantage... QFT
Imperator Jora'h	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:34:00 - [90] Originally by: Shamis Orzoz Originally by: dalman Can we please have it announced what ships MC brought to the match? Getting 150 points without having to show off your tactic is quite an advantage... QFT Read up. Was posted. IIRC 3 Ravens and the rest Maulus.
zykerx Lo0nEy To0nS R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:35:00 - [91] wow bad done by ccp that yust sucks . "MY COMMENTS IN NO WAY REFLECT MY CORP OR ALLIANCE"
Marmite Toast	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:36:00 - [92] CCP Alts cheating again
Canine Fiend Minmatar Viper Squad Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:37:00 - [93] Originally by: Owi no i locked on stop You guys are fantastic at following directions. -------------------
Lakedaimon Relic Defense Initiative The OSS	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:46:00 - [94] Edited by: Lakedaimon on 02/09/2007 20:46:27 Originally by: Owi no i locked on stop I honestly don't understand which part of "stop" seems to imply that you are to lock, shoot, begin maneuvering or generally do anything other than stop whatever the hell it is you're doing. "Stop" does not mean "go". "Stop" does not mean "well if I'm trigger-happy it means go if posted after a countdown". "Stop" does not mean "start locking". "Stop" does not mean "start firing missiles". "Stop" means "stop and don't do anything". How can you possibly even try to debate the fact that you were explicitly told to knock it off?
Patch86 Di-Tron Heavy Industries Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:46:00 - [95] Originally by: Owi no i locked on stop / 0 ... 1 sensor boost II / 3 amplifier IIs.. on a Hounds.. lockin BS just 1 sec.. i didnt fired about the stop irritating comment... im fast thinker and just had the lock and hold myself to not trigger the highslots You LOCKED him when the GM said "STOP", and then fired your weapons several seconds later? ... K then... ------ Originally by: CCP Prism X There's no such thing as playing too much EvE! You all obviously need more accounts!
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:49:00 - [96] Edited by: Owi on 02/09/2007 20:50:39 Originally by: Patch86 Originally by: Owi no i locked on stop / 0 ... 1 sensor boost II / 3 amplifier IIs.. on a Hounds.. lockin BS just 1 sec.. i didnt fired about the stop irritating comment... im fast thinker and just had the lock and hold myself to not trigger the highslots You LOCKED him when the GM said "STOP", and then fired your weapons several seconds later? ... K then... i wasnt the one that shot the 2 cruise missles ... oh yaa its easy to arrgument with a stop command that ends on 0 countdown to start a battle gang chat [ 2007.09.02 18:50:23 ] GM xxx > REMEMBER: When you get to the arena, do not move around at all, you do so under threat of point penalties. ... [ 2007.09.02 18:54:39 ] GM xxx > REMEMBER: When you get to the arena, do not move around at all, you do so under threat of point penalties. waz point that MC got 150 points ? they moved My EvE-Files.com folder !
Becky Ash Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:50:00 - [97] Another clear example that GMs are idiots.
William DeMeo Gallente Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:51:00 - [98] oh ffs grow up, the tinfoil hattery has reached ******** levels. Yarr
Imperator Jora'h	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:52:00 - [99] Originally by: Owi Edited by: Owi on 02/09/2007 20:50:39 Originally by: Patch86 Originally by: Owi no i locked on stop / 0 ... 1 sensor boost II / 3 amplifier IIs.. on a Hounds.. lockin BS just 1 sec.. i didnt fired about the stop irritating comment... im fast thinker and just had the lock and hold myself to not trigger the highslots You LOCKED him when the GM said "STOP", and then fired your weapons several seconds later? ... K then... i wasnt the one that shot the 2 cruise missles ... oh yaa its easy to arrgument with a stop command that ends on 0 countdown to start a battle gang chat [ 2007.09.02 18:50:23 ] GM xxx > REMEMBER: When you get to the arena, do not move around at all, you do so under threat of point penalties. ... [ 2007.09.02 18:54:39 ] GM xxx > REMEMBER: When you get to the arena, do not move around at all, you do so under threat of point penalties. waz point that MC got 150 points ? they moved Somewhere in here CCP Sharkbait (I think) hinted that MC would get a point deduction. Not 100% on that. They said they would post the points (including deductions) tomorrow so you can make up your mind then.
Nice B00BS	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:56:00 - [100] Don't start at STOP. Don't ferfeit the guys, replace the damn frig and take some points away from them.
Ogul Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.09.02 20:56:00 - [101] Go ahead and continue to disqualify one team after the other, surely that will hurt the tournament less than not meeting your tight schedule. Seriously, how hard can it be to spawn a new frigate for the guy who lost it? Go ask t20 how it's done. --- This is a war declaration, issued from your alt corp. It is used to gank people in high sec.
Eskona Runningstar Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:05:00 - [102] Last time I checked nobody was to have a lock on the opponents at the beginning of a fight. Thats why GMs fire an ECM burst on the go command. Looking at the times in the posted chatlog, Hedonistic Imperative acquired a lock on the Maulus even during the countdown - I dont see 2 seconds being enough for a ship to lock a Maulus, fire off a volley of cruise missiles, and leave still enough time for the GM to type "STOP" in local.
Yosarian Minmatar Hand Of The Tahiri	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:07:00 - [103] Stop means stop. Tomorrows lesson will be 'no means no' (advanced class)
Ronins Shadow Bungee Muff Diving Association	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:12:00 - [104] I'm behind HI on this one. MC asked if the countdown was for the start or the end. There was no responce from any GMs in local, just continued the countdown. A 2 second gap between 1 and Stop is enough time to F1 to F6, easily. DQ is a big over-reaction, to either let MC replace the ship and hold the match up for a couple of minites or to hold back a percentage of points from HI for the match would have been a much better option.
Masu'di Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:12:00 - [105] Originally by: Eskona Runningstar Last time I checked nobody was to have a lock on the opponents at the beginning of a fight. Thats why GMs fire an ECM burst on the go command. Looking at the times in the posted chatlog, Hedonistic Imperative acquired a lock on the Maulus even during the countdown - I dont see 2 seconds being enough for a ship to lock a Maulus, fire off a volley of cruise missiles, and leave still enough time for the GM to type "STOP" in local. two sensor boosters, we knew MC would field those mauluses. nobody was locked until after the countdown. Es and Whizz is recruiting
Cpt Fina Insult to Injury	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:12:00 - [106] Originally by: Owi Edited by: Owi on 02/09/2007 20:50:39 Originally by: Patch86 Originally by: Owi no i locked on stop / 0 ... 1 sensor boost II / 3 amplifier IIs.. on a Hounds.. lockin BS just 1 sec.. i didnt fired about the stop irritating comment... im fast thinker and just had the lock and hold myself to not trigger the highslots You LOCKED him when the GM said "STOP", and then fired your weapons several seconds later? ... K then... i wasnt the one that shot the 2 cruise missles ... oh yaa its easy to arrgument with a stop command that ends on 0 countdown to start a battle gang chat [ 2007.09.02 18:50:23 ] GM xxx > REMEMBER: When you get to the arena, do not move around at all, you do so under threat of point penalties. ... [ 2007.09.02 18:54:39 ] GM xxx > REMEMBER: When you get to the arena, do not move around at all, you do so under threat of point penalties. waz point that MC got 150 points ? they moved "under threat of point penalties." Does not mean that you definitely WILL get a penalty if you move. Apparently MC did move and stopped when the GM told them to. Apparently other teams have moved without getting a penalty.
Mysdora	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:13:00 - [107] "X minutes left" and "STOP" usually indicate something is about to end. Furthermore (afaik) there was no ECM burst to signal the start of a fight, as defined in the rules: Quote: 6. When EVETV is ready, the host sets of a powerful ECM burst and warps off. This signals the start of the fight. So there was confusion and some triggerhappy person made a false assumption. It's unfortunate, but it's not CCP's fault. Raging here on the forums and trying to place the blame on someone else only makes you look bad.
Papa Boats The Flaming Sideburn's Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:16:00 - [108] I wonder how hard it is for people to understand that it was a Hound AKA Stealth Bomber. Which has really fast locking time to begin with with sensor booster 2s on and tracking enhancers to make it lock even faster. OK now after you have all gone in SiSi and fitted this try targeting a Raven from 67 km away. You will lock him in less than a second with tourny PVP skills. So when you get that 1 second what was supposed to be go and you click on your target you do not have tme to stop. Point blank it was bad comms from the GMs to the players in local and the entire EVE community missed out on what would have been a good fight. I will not claim we would have beaten MC thats what the match was going to prove but we did have a better than average chance of inflicting major damage and maybe even taking out all 3 ravens they feilded. I was the team captain and take the fall for one of my Squad shooting the camera man but he was highly mad just like BoB or MC or Goon would be if they were DQed in the areana and would have taken it out on someone.
Cpt Fina Insult to Injury	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:22:00 - [109] Originally by: Papa Boats I was the team captain and take the fall for one of my Squad shooting the camera man but he was highly mad just like BoB or MC or Goon would be if they were DQed in the areana and would have taken it out on someone. If MC or BoB pulled something like that I'd be really surprised tbh. I've heard very little about Hedonistic Imperative (probably got myself to blame for that) but this really makes a bad first impression.
Cabre	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:26:00 - [110] Agreed. MC/BoB are a very high calibre alliance (unlike many other alliances) and I doubt they would ever descend to something as low as this. I don't expect you or 95% of EVE to understand.
Mervsan Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:27:00 - [111] Just a random viewer, but these DQ's don't really seem necessary and they seem way too harsh whilst other easily remedied rule infractions are ignored and left until later to sort out. Besides, listening to what Stavros has to say for a few mins whilst things were replaced/restarted would be more entertaining than some of the fights anyway.
Stoned Celt Bloodnok Technologies	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:28:00 - [112] Whine away, but the strange thing is that is seems MC understood what the word STOP meant, as it would appear they didn't shoot anything. How come you guys had so much difficulty with it? Basically you f'ked up, just get over it.
Danton Marcellus Nebula Rasa Holdings	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:29:00 - [113] What did Hedonistic Imperative field? Also Known As
Imperator Jora'h	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:31:00 - [114] Originally by: Papa Boats I was the team captain and take the fall for one of my Squad shooting the camera man but he was highly mad just like BoB or MC or Goon would be if they were DQed in the areana and would have taken it out on someone. Apologies work better when you do not qualify them. "I am sorry BUT" is right in line with "I love you BUT". Prof of mine told me when anyone says "but" toss out what came before it and pay attention to the second bit. You're sorry or you aren't. One or the other. No excuses, no "buts", no caveats, no qualifiers. Anything else is not really an apology.
Cpt Fina Insult to Injury	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:32:00 - [115] Originally by: Cabre Agreed. MC/BoB are a very high calibre alliance (unlike many other alliances) and I doubt they would ever descend to something as low as this. I don't expect you or 95% of EVE to understand. CouldnÆt agree more! It takes a very high calibre alliance with years of training, fleet experience and inhuman discipline for a pilot not to jeopardize the alliances future in the alliance-tournament and reputation because he got irritated.
Paniq Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:34:00 - [116] Originally by: Danton Marcellus What did Hedonistic Imperative field? Apocalypse, Typhoon, Maulus, 2x Manticore and 5x Hound iirc.
Cabre	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:37:00 - [117] Mc would have won anyway, I don't think you needed to run the fight. You ruined your chances by forfeiting.
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:37:00 - [118] shooting the cam men was after we lost the match .. even it was bad i said it early: i cant hold my teammates down to press a button.. punish whole alliance for 1 men, is a easy open and close the box mind! And in that view you all not even better then the guy that shoot the camera. My EvE-Files.com folder !
Cpt Fina Insult to Injury	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:44:00 - [119] Originally by: Owi shooting the cam men was after we lost the match .. even it was bad i said it early: i cant hold my teammates down to press a button.. punish whole alliance for 1 men, is a easy open and close the box mind! And in that view you all not even better then the guy that shoot the camera. **** happens no matter how trained they are. There will always be some asshat destroying for the others. The thing is that you got some guy from Hedonistic Imperative trying to justify it and another apologizing for it.
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:49:00 - [120] for me it was simple information lag .. why gms cant explain the stop ? and why it was on the zero count and not way sec befor ? it wasnt the first match for them to figuere out if they had all set up to go with the next match .. but stopping it on 0 !!?? can you hold it down if you havein fun with your girlfriend if you allready on the top of the edge or 0.1 sec over it ? well it was just 2 missles not the full shot, it must hurt him badly to hold the rest :P My EvE-Files.com folder !
Tarron Sarek Gallente Endica Enterprises	Posted - 2007.09.02 21:52:00 - [121] Unambiguous announcements and communication ftw I'd say. _________________________________ - Balance is power, guard it well -
Sleepkevert Paradox v2.0 Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.09.02 22:02:00 - [122] Edited by: Sleepkevert on 02/09/2007 22:06:36 Originally by: Owi [ 2007.09.02 18:55:34 ] GM Xamother > 5 Minutes left [ 2007.09.02 18:57:13 ] GM Xamother > 3 minutes left [ 2007.09.02 18:58:03 ] GM Xamother > 2 minutes [ 2007.09.02 18:59:01 ] GM Xamother > 1 minute [ 2007.09.02 18:59:31 ] GM Xamother > 30 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:36 ] Myndpyre Ryche > is that until match start for us or match end for them? [ 2007.09.02 18:59:52 ] GM Xamother > 10 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:54 ] GM Xamother > 9 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:55 ] GM Xamother > 8 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:56 ] GM Xamother > 7 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:57 ] GM Xamother > 6 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:59 ] GM Xamother > 5 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:00 ] GM Xamother > 4 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:01 ] GM Xamother > 3 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:02 ] GM Xamother > 2 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:03 ] GM Xamother > 1 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:05 ] GM Xamother > STOP! Ok, check the timestamps. especially from the last one. If i was in the tourny (going purely hypothetical here), i would start locking as SOON as i think it was 0. So i start locking in mah raven at 00:04 (for as far as i know, this is my starting signal, nice on time too!) and the gm shouts stop in local. I read that at 00:06 because i'm way to tense of starting the fight. Now, i realize o-sht, and i start deactivating all my launchers which i had preactivated. But by the time i reach the last, they already fire because of the sensor booster i had fitted, and the fast locking time. Now, how am i faulty here? Ok, i read in the other thread it was actually 2 VOLIES of torps, that couldn't have happen this way... True, shooting an TV ship afterwards is over the top, i agree on that 100%. But that was AFTER the match was forfeited Sign my sig
RigelKentaurus Flying Reblochons Caldari Deep Space Industral	Posted - 2007.09.02 22:09:00 - [123] What I don't understand is that GMs don't run an ECM Burst with 0.1s duration to prevent this to happen... no one would be able to lock at all before the fight starts.
Ogul Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.09.02 22:13:00 - [124] Originally by: RigelKentaurus What I don't understand is that GMs don't run an ECM Burst with 0.1s duration to prevent this to happen... no one would be able to lock at all before the fight starts. Easier to forfeit the match. --- This is a war declaration, issued from your alt corp. It is used to gank people in high sec.
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 22:16:00 - [125] Originally by: Sleepkevert Edited by: Sleepkevert on 02/09/2007 22:06:36 Originally by: Owi [ 2007.09.02 18:55:34 ] GM Xamother > 5 Minutes left [ 2007.09.02 18:57:13 ] GM Xamother > 3 minutes left [ 2007.09.02 18:58:03 ] GM Xamother > 2 minutes [ 2007.09.02 18:59:01 ] GM Xamother > 1 minute [ 2007.09.02 18:59:31 ] GM Xamother > 30 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:36 ] Myndpyre Ryche > is that until match start for us or match end for them? [ 2007.09.02 18:59:52 ] GM Xamother > 10 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:54 ] GM Xamother > 9 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:55 ] GM Xamother > 8 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:56 ] GM Xamother > 7 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:57 ] GM Xamother > 6 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:59 ] GM Xamother > 5 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:00 ] GM Xamother > 4 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:01 ] GM Xamother > 3 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:02 ] GM Xamother > 2 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:03 ] GM Xamother > 1 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:05 ] GM Xamother > STOP! Ok, check the timestamps. especially from the last one. If i was in the tourny (going purely hypothetical here), i would start locking as SOON as i think it was 0. So i start locking in mah raven at 00:04 (for as far as i know, this is my starting signal, nice on time too!) and the gm shouts stop in local. I read that at 00:06 because i'm way to tense of starting the fight. Now, i realize o-sht, and i start deactivating all my launchers which i had preactivated. But by the time i reach the last, they already fire because of the sensor booster i had fitted, and the fast locking time. Now, how am i faulty here? Ok, i read in the other thread it was actually 2 VOLIES of torps, that couldn't have happen this way... True, shooting an TV ship afterwards is over the top, i agree on that 100%. But that was AFTER the match was forfeited it was 1 volley of cruisemissles .. not 2 My EvE-Files.com folder !
Imperator Jora'h	Posted - 2007.09.02 22:16:00 - [126] Originally by: RigelKentaurus What I don't understand is that GMs don't run an ECM Burst with 0.1s duration to prevent this to happen... no one would be able to lock at all before the fight starts. Huh? They do. The start of each match is signaled by an ECM Burst (particularly powerful) by the GM which wipes all target locks. He warps out and fighting commences. This is why people in the tourney are seeing GM names on their kill mails (the ECM burst makes the game see them as an aggressor I guess).
Masu'di Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 22:19:00 - [127] Originally by: Owi Originally by: Sleepkevert Edited by: Sleepkevert on 02/09/2007 22:06:36 Originally by: Owi [ 2007.09.02 18:55:34 ] GM Xamother > 5 Minutes left [ 2007.09.02 18:57:13 ] GM Xamother > 3 minutes left [ 2007.09.02 18:58:03 ] GM Xamother > 2 minutes [ 2007.09.02 18:59:01 ] GM Xamother > 1 minute [ 2007.09.02 18:59:31 ] GM Xamother > 30 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:36 ] Myndpyre Ryche > is that until match start for us or match end for them? [ 2007.09.02 18:59:52 ] GM Xamother > 10 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:54 ] GM Xamother > 9 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:55 ] GM Xamother > 8 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:56 ] GM Xamother > 7 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:57 ] GM Xamother > 6 [ 2007.09.02 18:59:59 ] GM Xamother > 5 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:00 ] GM Xamother > 4 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:01 ] GM Xamother > 3 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:02 ] GM Xamother > 2 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:03 ] GM Xamother > 1 [ 2007.09.02 19:00:05 ] GM Xamother > STOP! Ok, check the timestamps. especially from the last one. If i was in the tourny (going purely hypothetical here), i would start locking as SOON as i think it was 0. So i start locking in mah raven at 00:04 (for as far as i know, this is my starting signal, nice on time too!) and the gm shouts stop in local. I read that at 00:06 because i'm way to tense of starting the fight. Now, i realize o-sht, and i start deactivating all my launchers which i had preactivated. But by the time i reach the last, they already fire because of the sensor booster i had fitted, and the fast locking time. Now, how am i faulty here? Ok, i read in the other thread it was actually 2 VOLIES of torps, that couldn't have happen this way... True, shooting an TV ship afterwards is over the top, i agree on that 100%. But that was AFTER the match was forfeited it was 1 volley of cruisemissles .. not 2 I was told it was two, but just leave it please Owi, there is no point in beating this thing to death. Es and Whizz is recruiting
Elmicker The Phoenix Rising FreeFall Securities	Posted - 2007.09.02 22:22:00 - [128] Originally by: Yosarian Stop means stop. However, running a "stop" countdown when the only people on the field are those waiting to start a match is nothing short of moronic. This is especially considering that the people concerned had already asked as to what the countdown was for. This is honestly worse than the GM conduct after the r0nin vs. goon match, tbpfh.
The Socialworker Minmatar The Socialworkers	Posted - 2007.09.02 22:23:00 - [129] I only read the first page of this thread (:0), But just from watchng the tourny that looked like bad refereeing. I'f misstakes happen make room later or another day. We want to see it and they want to do their stuff.
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.02 22:24:00 - [130] ah you know im just sitting here and repley to comments and do what i allways do .. RELAX ^^ My EvE-Files.com folder !
Ranger 1 Amarr Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.09.02 23:06:00 - [131] I have noticed that the rules are being more strictly adhered to this tourney, most like because any time the GM's have cut someone a break in a case like this in previous years they were accused of favoritism. You can't have it both ways, either they stick to the rules or they give "breaks" to people and open that can of worms. I'd prefer they stick as closely as possible to the rules. All contestants know they can begin "AFTER" the ECM burst, presumably following a countdown. I'm assuming this was forgotten by your team in the heat of the moment... still 3,2,1,STOP is rather hard to confuse. You didn't wait for the starting ECM burst, you were trying to get an edge... which ironically would have cost you time had the match actually been starting. While I am sympathetic to your screw up, it was still YOUR screw up. You broke the rules (presumably with 2 volleys depending on who we believe) and it cost you the match... just as the Goons honest mistake cost them the match. Harsh, but just. By the way people, it's true... Tinfoil hats really DO make you look like an idiot.
silken mouth	Posted - 2007.09.03 00:18:00 - [132] The Perp: the GMs, for using a countdown to stop and more importantly for not clarifying after being asked to do so by the players. The Victim: The EVE Comunity, that missed (yet) another interesting and exciting match. But at least CCP can now prove that their internal affairs department is working properly.
Paniq Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.09.03 01:01:00 - [133] Originally by: Masu'di Originally by: Owi it was 1 volley of cruisemissles .. not 2 I was told it was two, but just leave it please Owi, there is no point in beating this thing to death. Having been sitting in the Maulus on the receiving end I can confirm that it were two (2) volleys, not one. First volley took the ship to ~35-40% armor, second volley finished it off.
Hllaxiu Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.09.03 01:31:00 - [134] Originally by: Ranger 1 All contestants know they can begin "AFTER" the ECM burst, presumably following a countdown. I'm assuming this was forgotten by your team in the heat of the moment... still 3,2,1,STOP is rather hard to confuse. You didn't wait for the starting ECM burst, you were trying to get an edge... My client showed no indication of an ECM burst being fired at the beginning of the Morsus Mihi - Aftermath battle. I recall no graphical effect and nothing was logged. If you will look on our killboard, Cividari and I both posted the loss mails of our Mauluses - neither has a GM ECM burst on them. The mails for the two destroyed Aftermath Caracals also have no ECM burst on them. I am led to the conclusion that there was no ecm burst at the beginning of this match. However it may be that they did it, but it was not logged by the client/killmail system - I did not have any locks at the time so have no idea. --- Our greatest glory is not in never failing, but in rising up every time we fail. - Emerson
Spyra Gryra Enough is Enough	Posted - 2007.09.03 02:00:00 - [135] Why is everyone getting so **ed off over them popping the cameramans ship? I mean it can be respawned, so why give a **, it's not like the broke something real. The countdown was very vague and no one answered the MC's guys question, why not? It was very pertaint given the circumstances.
Farscape Hw Black Omega Security Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.09.03 02:17:00 - [136] ya know im glad that ccp actually give us this official alliance tournament and ive really enjoyed being in it. its not like they have to or anything. so thank you ccp. ive recently experienced a GM doing something against the rules at the benifit of one alliance but i also watched another GM overturn what the first one did and set it right. i wasnt there and didnt see what happened, but i would like an explination from sharkbait as to why he said this: "there was no countdown to start the match and shouldn't have been any fighting." but from that chatlog of local, he was clearly either mistaken or lying. i sure hope he was mistaken or its just me missing something alltogather.
Ki Tarra Caldari Ki Tech Industries	Posted - 2007.09.03 02:20:00 - [137] Edited by: Ki Tarra on 03/09/2007 02:23:07 My opinion on this from what I have read in this thread is that it was a bad call on the part of the GM's. Yes, shooting at the camerma man was a bad call on the part of the players, but it would never have happened if the GMs had done a good job of setting up the match. Running overtime or not, niether team should have been told to warp to the arena until the previous match was finished. That was the first mistake of the GMs. Looking at the schedule there should have been atleast 5 minutes between the end of the last match and the start of the next. Second was not announcing what the count down was counting to. Unless that announcement was not included in the posted transcript. But it should have been posted in between the transition from minutes to seconds, so that everyone was clear as to what was going on. Looking at the time stamps on the chat log, it the timing was just about spot on for the start of the match. They have a count down less than 5 seconds off of the scheduled start time, and no comment stating that they would be starting late! If the transcript is wrong, lets see the official version. Yes, the count down ended with the word "Stop", but with the expected adrielene I don't think that it matters what comes after "3... 2... 1..." weapons will be activated. With GoonSwarm it should have been GoonSwarm's responsiblity, not the GM's, to make sure that they have the correct players with the correct ships in their gang. With this, it sounds like the GM's did a crappy job setting up the match. I don't know what to do about it at this point, but I certainly hope that the GMs are not putting the responsiblity for this mess up completely on the part of Hedonistic Imperative. Normally I back GM desisions, but in this case I would atleast like to hear from the GMs What will they do in future matches to make sure that their instructions are understood? ************************** Ki Tech Industries - Bond Offer
Dream	Posted - 2007.09.03 02:35:00 - [138] Originally by: Farscape Hw ya know im glad that ccp actually give us this official alliance tournament and ive really enjoyed being in it. its not like they have to or anything. so thank you ccp. ive recently experienced a GM doing something against the rules at the benifit of one alliance but i also watched another GM overturn what the first one did and set it right. i wasnt there and didnt see what happened, but i would like an explination from sharkbait as to why he said this: "there was no countdown to start the match and shouldn't have been any fighting." but from that chatlog of local, he was clearly either mistaken or lying. i sure hope he was mistaken or its just me missing something alltogather. There was a countdown, but it was for a match to -end- not to -begin-.
Farscape Hw Black Omega Security Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.09.03 02:39:00 - [139] Edited by: Farscape Hw on 03/09/2007 02:40:58 Originally by: Dream Originally by: Farscape Hw ya know im glad that ccp actually give us this official alliance tournament and ive really enjoyed being in it. its not like they have to or anything. so thank you ccp. ive recently experienced a GM doing something against the rules at the benifit of one alliance but i also watched another GM overturn what the first one did and set it right. i wasnt there and didnt see what happened, but i would like an explination from sharkbait as to why he said this: "there was no countdown to start the match and shouldn't have been any fighting." but from that chatlog of local, he was clearly either mistaken or lying. i sure hope he was mistaken or its just me missing something alltogather. There was a countdown, but it was for a match to -end- not to -begin-. wow that is confusing... that sucks they were disqualified for something so unclear. some kind of clarification between these two lines would have prevented it. [ 2007.09.02 18:59:36 ] Myndpyre Ryche > is that until match start for us or match end for them? [ 2007.09.02 18:59:52 ] GM Xamother > 10 seconds
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.03 02:43:00 - [140] Edited by: Owi on 03/09/2007 02:44:26 Originally by: Paniq Originally by: Masu'di Originally by: Owi it was 1 volley of cruisemissles .. not 2 I was told it was two, but just leave it please Owi, there is no point in beating this thing to death. Having been sitting in the Maulus on the receiving end I can confirm that it were two (2) volleys, not one. First volley took the ship to ~35-40% armor, second volley finished it off. well yes ok .. it was two .. our pilot confirmed that ..but it was a missunderstood not our plan take you out befor the regular match starts. He was way irritated by all this and didnt turn the mods off quick enough. Also MC woulndt had got the full 150 points that givs them now almost the groupwin for nothin ... *coughs My EvE-Files.com folder !
Paniq Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.09.03 02:54:00 - [141] Originally by: Owi Edited by: Owi on 03/09/2007 02:44:26 Originally by: Paniq Originally by: Masu'di Originally by: Owi it was 1 volley of cruisemissles .. not 2 I was told it was two, but just leave it please Owi, there is no point in beating this thing to death. Having been sitting in the Maulus on the receiving end I can confirm that it were two (2) volleys, not one. First volley took the ship to ~35-40% armor, second volley finished it off. well yes ok .. it was two .. our pilot confirmed that ..but it was a missunderstood not our plan take you out befor the regular match starts. He was way irritated by all this and didnt turn the mods off quick enough. Don't get me wrong, I was not implying that there had been any deliberate foul play on your behalf - I was merely clarifying. I think everyone can see that this is just a case of a simple human error which unfortunately had harsh consequences. Personally I would have loved to see the match fought to the end, and I'm sure the other participants would say the same. Regardless, what's done is done and it's no use beating dead horses. I wish you luck in your upcoming matches, I know we're looking forward to ours.
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.03 02:57:00 - [142] Edited by: Owi on 03/09/2007 02:57:02 how can we look into the furture tourney thats allready lost for us .. :( about information lag My EvE-Files.com folder !
Faith Rose Amarr Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.09.03 03:06:00 - [143] Edited by: Faith Rose on 03/09/2007 03:07:36 After reading this thread in full, i most conclude the mistakes easly could have been avoided in several differant ways. i'll list 2...... 1. GM's could have made sure no one was on the field while one match was active. This will prevent, said kind of event from happening in the first place. Simple question Do ya have the option of warping in at differant ranges? (At start of match or r u at pre-set range.) 2.If count down was set, then you warp to combat area that whole mess could have been avoided in a differant way. No real point here-- camara man if he's lockable he is far game- As said by gm he failed to report and ended up geting nailed. Simple mistake....Live and Learn CCP ---The End--- "How do you kill... that which has no life?"
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.03 03:18:00 - [144] Originally by: Faith Rose Edited by: Faith Rose on 03/09/2007 03:07:36 After reading this thread in full, i most conclude the mistakes easly could have been avoided in several differant ways. i'll list 2...... 1. GM's could have made sure no one was on the field while one match was active. This will prevent, said kind of event from happening in the first place. Simple question Do ya have the option of warping in at differant ranges? (At start of match or r u at pre-set range.) 2.If count down was set, then you warp to combat area that whole mess could have been avoided in a differant way. No real point here-- camara man if he's lockable he is far game- As said by gm he failed to report and ended up geting nailed. Simple mistake....Live and Learn CCP ---The End--- recording to my logs from first match there wasnt such countdown to end the match befor ours, even there was on running .. wonder if any other team saw a countdown like this befor yours match !? Like faith said.. CCP shouldt make clear orders to the gms and they make it to the players. My EvE-Files.com folder !
Zyta Eke Bombshell Cartel	Posted - 2007.09.03 03:23:00 - [145] GMs: please don't be so trigger-happy with the disqualifications. Both incidents were obvious misunderstandings and both were easily fixed. Is there no room for compassion?
Dark 0men Minmatar Heimatar Exploration Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.03 03:35:00 - [146] I'd like to state that I don't give a damn about HI's and Sharkbait's temper tantrums. You are not a bunch of antisocial 9 year olds in a sandbox. I want a good match, not interweb drama. In case it's not clear at CCP HQ, I'm paying you for entertainment. I wouldn't care if HI's CEO called Oveur's mother a ***** -- get over your important selves and find a way to make this work.
uoY delliK	Posted - 2007.09.03 04:02:00 - [147] Not sure if anyone here has actually played this game... But if you had mods hot, and you see "0" and start lock, with a couple sensor boosters: A) nobody can stop that lock from happening, B) unless your hovering over f1-f8 (which I highly doubt, with mods hot) you're never stopping your volley.. I think its a BS DQ, but I honestly dont care, cause BE will take the tourney.
Aeaus Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.09.03 04:47:00 - [148] Great going there GMs, being unresponsive when asked a question but somehow expecting an instant reaction from the player side after they let their missiles fly. This kind of stuff happened to SF in the last alliance, in our first match our enemy opened up on us by accident, we killed their flycatcher, both sides apologized in local and another flycatcher was built with exact fittings, the fight was delayed for maybe five minutes. We lost that fight, but at least it was because they bought a better setup then a one-off mistake getting them DQed. This situation is worse because the GMs were extremely confusing with their countdown in local, no player foul except for being ready to fight as far as I see. --
Conan Valkov Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.03 05:16:00 - [149] Originally by: Paniq Don't get me wrong, I was not implying that there had been any deliberate foul play on your behalf - I was merely clarifying. I think everyone can see that this is just a case of a simple human error which unfortunately had harsh consequences. And just a quick note: we all have great appreciation for MC's pilots and none of us considered the possibility of foul play (at least not seriously). I apologise if any of our alliance members have appeared dis-respectful of your pilots -- that's not on. It was indeed just an unfortunate accident. However, considering the mis-communication leading to the accident we were truly surprised when a DQ was called. The chatlog represents essentially all the information pilots are given. Until you fly in the tournament you don't know if there is a "Go" or a "0" or a "Fire!" and given that the stop command was a second late I'm surprised others didn't fire too. (I couldn't even remember what the last command was in our earlier fight.) Nobody was trying to cheat, just follow our orders. So I was expecting the GMs, during the time we were waiting for an explanation of why we were told to "Stop!", to be rebuilding your ship. From the killmail and wreck they can determine the exact fitting, rebuild it in a GM station and transport it back for you to climb in. The GM even said "Don't touch the Wreck". Even without GM tools I think it could be done quite effectively. Would this set a precedent? Not at all. All the GM had to do was see your (MC's) question in local and make sure the count-down was clear. That particular accident was their fault. I didn't actually see that question so I had no idea that another team was fighting. Anyway I just wanted to add that we were looking forward to the fight and although you may well have won, I think we had in enough planning and preparation to put on a good show this time. And who knows... maybe we'd have surprised you Everyone lost out here. Best of luck in your remaining fights.
Faith Rose Amarr Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.09.03 05:43:00 - [150] Originally by: Owi Like faith said.. CCP should make clear orders to the gms and they make it to the players. edited above i don't remmeber typing that but i'll agree I'm not trying to bash on you gm's. Take a step back breath a little, communicate clearly or emo things will start happening. "How do you kill... that which has no life?"
w0rmy M. Corp M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.09.03 06:12:00 - [151] Originally by: Farscape Hw wow that is confusing... that sucks they were disqualified for something so unclear. some kind of clarification between these two lines would have prevented it. [ 2007.09.02 18:59:36 ] Myndpyre Ryche > is that until match start for us or match end for them? [ 2007.09.02 18:59:52 ] GM Xamother > 10 seconds Completely agree with you here. The question was asked, no answer was given. A countdown then started, in time with when their match was due to start. Honestly, I would have fired too. And for those saying "Stop means stop" Due to queued up weapons, and looking at your overview instead of local, you should know its far easier to start firing than it is to stop. You switch into pvp mode, you focus on your task ahead, and switch off from reading local. Harsh call by the by the tourny organisers, when clearly the question was asked, and the GM failed to answer. Originally by: CCP Oveur I'm very sorry w0rmy, I beg your forgiveness. Originally by: Dianabolic I was never sworn to secrecy, w0rmy, sorry to dissappoint you.
Ramblin Man Empyreum	Posted - 2007.09.03 06:35:00 - [152] votes to have the next Alliance Tournament on the forums Each alliance picks their ten best legal professionals, then last one standing after the disqualifications wins. Simple.
pator gurl	Posted - 2007.09.03 07:00:00 - [153] Originally by: w0rmy Completely agree with you here. The question was asked, no answer was given. A countdown then started, in time with when their match was due to start. Honestly, I would have fired too. And for those saying "Stop means stop" Due to queued up weapons, and looking at your overview instead of local, you should know its far easier to start firing than it is to stop. You switch into pvp mode, you focus on your task ahead, and switch off from reading local. Harsh call by the by the tourny organisers, when clearly the question was asked, and the GM failed to answer. You need just a reason to disagree with CCP. Its the players fault for not watching local. This isn't PVP mode its "Alliance tournament" mode, where you have to watch local too. It isn't a harsh call, people screwed up, they paid the price. GM Xamother can't interrupt an existing countdown to write an answer, otherwise the countdown would break.
pator gurl	Posted - 2007.09.03 07:03:00 - [154] Originally by: Farscape Hw i wasnt there and didnt see what happened, but i would like an explination from sharkbait as to why he said this: "there was no countdown to start the match and shouldn't have been any fighting." but from that chatlog of local, he was clearly either mistaken or lying. i sure hope he was mistaken or its just me missing something alltogather. That was the countdown to end the previous match. Rather than the countdown to the start the hedonistic/MC match.
FireFoxx80 Caldari E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.09.03 07:32:00 - [155] I agree with the mis-communication guys here. A countdown from 10, when queried, was not clarified by GMs. By the time the counter got to 0, I suspect everyone was in MDK mode and just started spamming the primaries. What I do the rest of the time - Vote for a Jita bypass!
w0rmy M. Corp M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.09.03 07:37:00 - [156] Originally by: pator gurl That was the countdown to end the previous match. Rather than the countdown to the start the hedonistic/MC match. Which you didnt know and they didnt know untill AFTER all this had happened. You can sit here with 20/20 hindsight, but at the time, according to that chat log, the communication from the GM was NOT clear. Originally by: CCP Oveur I'm very sorry w0rmy, I beg your forgiveness. Originally by: Dianabolic I was never sworn to secrecy, w0rmy, sorry to dissappoint you.
Glengrant Minmatar TOHA Heavy Industries	Posted - 2007.09.03 07:54:00 - [157] 1) Sying this was a trap is plain silly - take off the tinfoil hats 2) I can see how that countdown was confusing 3) Of course right after fight starts people are busy with their controls and don't watch local that much 4) Yet - the rules clearly state that the fight starts with a ECM pulse and host leaving the arena. So that's what should have been looked at - not local Certainly a sad situation I can understand that the hedonists are disapointed.
Owi Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.03 08:18:00 - [158] Edited by: Owi on 03/09/2007 08:27:02 Edited by: Owi on 03/09/2007 08:22:09 Originally by: pator gurl Edited by: pator gurl on 03/09/2007 07:22:09 Originally by: w0rmy Completely agree with you here. The question was asked, no answer was given. A countdown then started, in time with when their match was due to start. Honestly, I would have fired too. And for those saying "Stop means stop" Due to queued up weapons, and looking at your overview instead of local, you should know its far easier to start firing than it is to stop. You switch into pvp mode, you focus on your task ahead, and switch off from reading local. Harsh call by the by the tourny organisers, when clearly the question was asked, and the GM failed to answer. Its the players fault for not watching local. This isn't PVP mode its "Alliance tournament" mode, where you have to watch local too. It isn't a harsh call, people screwed up, they paid the price. GM Xamother can't interrupt an existing countdown to write an answer, otherwise the countdown would break. read everythink befor you try to talk about something you know a f* of .. [ 2007.09.02 18:59:31 ] GM Xamother > 30 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:36 ] Myndpyre Ryche > is that until match start for us or match end for them? [ 2007.09.02 18:59:52 ] GM Xamother > 10 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:54 ] GM Xamother > 9 simpley 16 sec to answer .. 12 to write .. 1 to press enter.. 3 to prepare for the countdown.. i dont want to pull this out again..only want to giv pator a answer.. to Glengrant . i wouldt like there was or is a thing like a ecm burst but never saw one in the 2 matches we made..this question was answered also in this thread allready sooo GM Zhainius > and you do not move at all once you've warped in untill xamother starts the fight in local GM Zhainius > Alright remember not to move and keep an eye on local :) to all, READ f** full thread befor make a comment ! * yawns My EvE-Files.com folder !
Unaralas Save our Souls	Posted - 2007.09.03 09:51:00 - [159] Originally by: Papa Boats I wonder how hard it is for people to understand that it was a Hound AKA Stealth Bomber. Which has really fast locking time to begin with with sensor booster 2s on and tracking enhancers to make it lock even faster. Wait, hold on...tracking enhancers? On a Bomber? Hahahaha.... well done HI. We are [505]
IttoRyu	Posted - 2007.09.03 09:55:00 - [160] Originally by: Faith Rose communicate clearly or emo things will start happening. Gm's devs and everyone else take said quote to heart.
Masu'di Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.03 11:07:00 - [161] Originally by: Unaralas Originally by: Papa Boats I wonder how hard it is for people to understand that it was a Hound AKA Stealth Bomber. Which has really fast locking time to begin with with sensor booster 2s on and tracking enhancers to make it lock even faster. Wait, hold on...tracking enhancers? On a Bomber? Hahahaha.... well done HI. yeh i saw that too, well i hope he didn't fit those, i think he meant the signal amplifiers, he was probably a little stressed when he wrote that post. Es and Whizz is recruiting
Kagura Nikon Minmatar Guardians of the Dawn Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.09.03 11:52:00 - [162] If someone should be disqualified form championship, those should be the GMs, 100% their fault If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough
Frug Zenithal Harvest	Posted - 2007.09.03 12:04:00 - [163] Very poorly handled by the GMs and Sharkbait. I'm disappointed. If MC moved they should be penalized for it, but apparently they weren't. Forfeiting -another- match because of some lame confusion is just that, lame. Shooting a camera man is irrelevant and mildly amusing. If they are so eager to enforce their rules with the harshest penalties they can, perhaps they should be more organized with everything. I have to say that if I was in that tourney, and the dude started counting down like that, I would have let loose a volley of missiles as soon as I thought he'd say go. I wouldn't read STOP and not shoot. I'd see something and shoot. That's like playing a trick on them. And then to fall back on this cameraman thing? "yeah well, you shot a camera man!" That's weak. - - - - - - - - - Do not use dotted lines - - - - - - - If you think I'm awesome, say BOOO BOOO!! - Ductoris Neat look what I found - Kreul Hey, my marbles
Redbad Minmatar Tempered Steel Legion	Posted - 2007.09.03 12:05:00 - [164] Originally by: Imperator Jora'h Originally by: NeOnicuS Originally by: Imperator Jora'h Which part of "STOP" was unclear? Can't stop missiles can you? No but how does STOP mean START shooting your missiles to begin with? I have to press "start" to stop my computer ... I understand the confuzzlement. Rb join us today!
Xthril Ranger hirr Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.09.03 12:36:00 - [165] good thing I am not in our tournament team, I would have fired too. . you'll never jump alone
Trek Minmatar N.A.G.A Corporation	Posted - 2007.09.03 12:38:00 - [166] I can definetley see how someone would fire after that countdown, I probably would have too. Adrenaline flowing and just waiting for the command to go, weapons hot, looking at the overview ready to click your primary... In the corner of your eye you see the text ST-something and start locking and your weapons fire one second later. START and STOP can look pretty similar in the heat of the moment you know. I think this is yet another bad ruling from the GMs. Just spawn a new ship for the guy! Wouldnt be the first time stuff is spawned out of nowhere... --- My other ship is a Reaper
Yosarian Minmatar Hand Of The Tahiri	Posted - 2007.09.03 13:13:00 - [167] Nice example of bandwagoning in this thread. Trial by forum is only one step up from a medieval witch-burning. Instead consider this: the question asked in local was unanswered. Given your uncertainty about what was going on it would have been prudent to: - Ask your gang in TS/ vent. No one else fired, so one assumes the rest of the team realized this wasn't the start of the match. Either the whole HI team should have started fighting, or no one. The fact that they didn't shows poor team coordination and leadership. Which is being blamed on the GMs (unreasonably and incorrectly). Put simply: this should and could have been solved by the HI team in their voicecomms during the 25 or so seconds left between the question and the countdown. - Wait a second or so after the end of the countdown to see what's going on. If the lack of an answer made it unclear for you, wait 2 seconds and see. Especially when there is so much at stake. - The excuse of being amped-up is no good. Everyone in that tournament is wired on adrenalin at the start of a match, including most likely the GMs: if it was a reasonable excuse then others would need to use it too. But they don't. Looking at the local chat log it is also clear that HI reacted with obnoxious and disrespectful treatment towards the GMs once the false-start occurred. Just because your corp chat is full of over the top rudeness doesn't mean it's ok to treat the match organisers like that. You blew any chance of them repealing their decision with your reaction.
Paskel Caldari Carthum Research	Posted - 2007.09.03 13:17:00 - [168] Personally I wouldn't have been trying to read local after the "2". Knowing it was one second to the start I would have the mouse pointer on top of my target in overview and I'd just be watching local out of the corner of my eye. As soon as I saw the text shift as the end of the countdown was reached I'd be clicking away / getting the ship moving. Completely understandable mistake. However, killing the camera man was not. Repeatedly people have come out with the "we were angry and frustrated" excuse. Too bad. Things aren't always fair and taking it out on an innocent is BS. If for no other reason this makes the DQ fine with me. I'm somewhat surprised HI will be allowed to carry on in the tournament at all. At least CCP and the GMs are showing some restraint in not DQing you for the rest of the tourney.
Admiral Nova Strike Team Nova	Posted - 2007.09.03 13:23:00 - [169] Originally by: Owi [ 2007.09.02 18:59:31 ] GM Xamother > 30 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:36 ] Myndpyre Ryche > is that until match start for us or match end for them? [ 2007.09.02 18:59:52 ] GM Xamother > 10 seconds [ 2007.09.02 18:59:54 ] GM Xamother > 9 Ok, so there were 26 seconds between when the question was asked and the stop command was given. Now, why have a count down ? Why not just say 'go' in local. Well you see, it's probably so people can get their mouse over the right spot on the overview, fingers ready to fire etc. When it hits 0, that's when you'd be shooting, not looking at local. I'm truely amazed that both teams at that point didn't open up on each other, perhaps one team was out of range ? Quote: GM Xamother can't interrupt an existing countdown to write an answer, otherwise the countdown would break. I'm pretty sure it's a script, and I'm pretty sure the answer could have been given, I don't think the GM was looking in local :o Throw some GM shield extenders on the camera's. I know it's maybe abit to ask for an event only but surely it wouldn't be too hard to program in a 100% web 10000 strength ecm battery to be active before the match started ? There are WAY WAY too many things in this game that are reliant on GMs and humans etc. Eg, you can't post in COAD without a ticker, but a mod has to come along manually to do that modding. Surely someone could write a script for that. :o Why must everything be done the simple but hard way when for slightly more effort you could make it foolproof. And lets face it, there are alot of fools here, on every side of the fence.
Polinus	Posted - 2007.09.03 13:35:00 - [170] Last tournament, i remember a certain ship in the final was moved out of field to et charges and re online some modules" then brought back.. on my point of view a MUCH MUCH bigger infraction of RULES than any of those on BOTH forfeits! I am really sad with this VERY low level of GM performance.
Danton Marcellus Nebula Rasa Holdings	Posted - 2007.09.03 13:48:00 - [171] In the last tournament false starts were just reset and matches were resumed. I know this 'cause we had that trouble twice. Why the change in the rules and the leathercoat overkill? Disqualifications is way harsh and a deterant to the teams getting them from returning to the next tournament, I know we wouldn't, being disqualified seconds into what is the highlight of some of the pilots EVE experience. Also Known As
ParCan angels of darkness LTD Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.09.03 14:38:00 - [172] I seldom poke my head above the parapet in here. As the next team to fight MC (The ISS Team) we really do think that at the very least we have a right to know the Ship Types that MC brought to the field. This intel is valuable to any combatants, and with the points positions so close in our group for 2nd and 3rd....... Maybe even MC would be kind enough to disclose this info. ParCan PP ISS Tourney Team
Masu'di Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2007.09.03 14:53:00 - [173] Originally by: ParCan I seldom poke my head above the parapet in here. As the next team to fight MC (The ISS Team) we really do think that at the very least we have a right to know the Ship Types that MC brought to the field. This intel is valuable to any combatants, and with the points positions so close in our group for 2nd and 3rd....... Maybe even MC would be kind enough to disclose this info. ParCan PP ISS Tourney Team I posted here in our official statement along with our ships too, if you want to take a look. Es and Whizz is recruiting
Myndpyre Ryche Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.09.03 15:00:00 - [174] There was no change in our ship selection from the first round to the second round.

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