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Excuse me waiter... why are we nerfing torpedos again??

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Megadon Caldari Deathshead Inc.	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:18:00 - [1] So why are we nerfing torps again? Not so much interested in argueing against it, as I'm interested in discovering the logic behind it as CCP sees it. One of the roles I see disappearing from Caldari due to this is the role of the long range damage dealer to POS stuff and capital ships. Caldari are pretty much specialized for longer range combat so this seems a significant departure from past. I think the change is more of a range thing than a damage thing because tech 2 torp launchers with faction torps and some nice BCS's deal a boatload of damage. So it's not as if torps needed more buffing in the damage department. ... and lastly, is this because of the Electronic Arts influence we've been seeing at CCP? --------------
Reem Fairchild Minmatar Republic University	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:19:00 - [2] vastly incresed dps = 'nerf' ???
NoNah Unseen University	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:21:00 - [3] 1. It's a buff. 2. To bring Torpedoes in line with other missile types. 3. The whinesquad has made it clear that caldari was in need of more damage for pvp. 4. Cruise still hits further, and deals AWESOME damage at that range to pos's and capitals. 5. 30-40km IS long range for a short range weapon. 6. Electronic arts? NOOOoo! Last week it was Microsoft =( Postcount: 851813 [02:40:22] <elmickers> if you're caldari in a fleet fight, bring a corp
Megadon Caldari Deathshead Inc.	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:22:00 - [4] Originally by: Reem Fairchild vastly incresed dps = 'nerf' ??? Yep pretty much. If you can't hit the target, what does it matter if my torps do 10,000 hp in damage. --------------
NoNah Unseen University	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:24:00 - [5] Originally by: Megadon Originally by: Reem Fairchild vastly incresed dps = 'nerf' ??? Yep pretty much. If you can't hit the target, what does it matter if my torps do 10,000 hp in damage. Indeed, you'll actually have to log in to the game and undock to hit your target. I can see why the forum warriors find them nerfed. Postcount: 366502 [02:40:22] <elmickers> if you're caldari in a fleet fight, bring a corp
Megadon Caldari Deathshead Inc.	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:25:00 - [6] Originally by: NoNah 1. It's a buff. 2. To bring Torpedoes in line with other missile types. 3. The whinesquad has made it clear that caldari was in need of more damage for pvp. 4. Cruise still hits further, and deals AWESOME damage at that range to pos's and capitals. 5. 30-40km IS long range for a short range weapon. 6. Electronic arts? NOOOoo! Last week it was Microsoft =( 2. other missile types? what are you smoking? My heavy missiles can fly 85 km. HAMS are a minority. A specialized exception, not the rule when it comes to range. 3. irrelevant 4. again. What are you smoking. Torps do easily more dmg than cruises. 5. see #2 --------------
Megadon Caldari Deathshead Inc.	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:26:00 - [7] Originally by: NoNah Originally by: Megadon Originally by: Reem Fairchild vastly incresed dps = 'nerf' ??? Yep pretty much. If you can't hit the target, what does it matter if my torps do 10,000 hp in damage. Indeed, you'll actually have to log in to the game and undock to hit your target. I can see why the forum warriors find them nerfed. You really are a troll so take it somewhere else --------------
Reem Fairchild Minmatar Republic University	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:28:00 - [8] Originally by: Megadon Originally by: Reem Fairchild vastly incresed dps = 'nerf' ??? Yep pretty much. If you can't hit the target, what does it matter if my torps do 10,000 hp in damage. Well, 100s of whining Caldari players on this board have said in the past that they would happily trade their range for more damage. Now that you get the damage we have people who want the range back. Nevermind the fact that you still have cruise missiles that can reach as far as any ship can lock. I guess the Caldari will just continue to whine no matter what happens.
Reem Fairchild Minmatar Republic University	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:29:00 - [9] Originally by: Megadon 2. other missile types? what are you smoking? My heavy missiles can fly 85 km. HAMS are a minority. A specialized exception, not the rule when it comes to range. Heavy missiles are longrange weapons.
Vireti	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:32:00 - [10] Originally by: Reem Fairchild Originally by: Megadon 2. other missile types? what are you smoking? My heavy missiles can fly 85 km. HAMS are a minority. A specialized exception, not the rule when it comes to range. Heavy missiles are longrange weapons. Sshhh he's already confused. You're making it worse
NoNah Unseen University	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:35:00 - [11] Originally by: Megadon Originally by: NoNah 1. It's a buff. 2. To bring Torpedoes in line with other missile types. 3. The whinesquad has made it clear that caldari was in need of more damage for pvp. 4. Cruise still hits further, and deals AWESOME damage at that range to pos's and capitals. 5. 30-40km IS long range for a short range weapon. 6. Electronic arts? NOOOoo! Last week it was Microsoft =( 2. other missile types? what are you smoking? My heavy missiles can fly 85 km. HAMS are a minority. A specialized exception, not the rule when it comes to range. 3. irrelevant 4. again. What are you smoking. Torps do easily more dmg than cruises. 5. see #2 Rockets, Hams and torps are short range, high damage. Or intended to be. Standard, Heavy and Cruise are long range, less damage. Or intended to be. Whatever extent the missiles themselves are used, is irrelevant. 4. Cruises easily do more damage than Rails, Beams and Artilleries. Your argument here is like saying Blasters easily do more damage than rails. Completely irrelevant. 5. It actually IS the rule. Long range high damage never was a good combo, now you got short range and VERY high damage. Which is atleast in line. Postcount: 513739 [02:40:22] <elmickers> if you're caldari in a fleet fight, bring a corp
Megadon Caldari Deathshead Inc.	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:37:00 - [12] Originally by: Vireti Originally by: Reem Fairchild Originally by: Megadon 2. other missile types? what are you smoking? My heavy missiles can fly 85 km. HAMS are a minority. A specialized exception, not the rule when it comes to range. Heavy missiles are longrange weapons. Sshhh he's already confused. You're making it worse Hey, if you think caldari are the shortrange fighting race man, there's nothing much I have to say to you anyways. What a bunch of smacktards. --------------
o0TuNa0o	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:39:00 - [13] I can see it from both sides. But.. If you do missions, switch to cruise. They are meant to be the far reaching ammo. If you PvP, the raven sucked. Now it's decent. So pls stop moaning. Mission runners can still do what they do, the rest of us meanwhile now have a ship which (hopefully) can hold up in PvP. Much needed change.
NoNah Unseen University	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:39:00 - [14] Originally by: Megadon Originally by: Vireti Originally by: Reem Fairchild Originally by: Megadon 2. other missile types? what are you smoking? My heavy missiles can fly 85 km. HAMS are a minority. A specialized exception, not the rule when it comes to range. Heavy missiles are longrange weapons. Sshhh he's already confused. You're making it worse Hey, if you think caldari are the shortrange fighting race man, there's nothing much I have to say to you anyways. What a bunch of smacktards. No, they're not, but each and every race got two fields. Short range and long range. Caldari hybrids will always outrange Gallente Hybrids. And the missiles are no exception, have a look at all other races short range weapons, and see how many of those that reach 30-40km out? This is the short range alternative of a long range specialized faction. Postcount: 75007 [02:40:22] <elmickers> if you're caldari in a fleet fight, bring a corp
Tao Han Synthetic Frontiers	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:39:00 - [15] If you do NOT want to fight at close range, then DON'T fit close range weapons (torps in this case) ------ snip Your signature image is password-protected. -Rauth Kivaro([email protected]) I know, CEO was being a tard. -Tao
Megadon Caldari Deathshead Inc.	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:41:00 - [16] Originally by: NoNah Originally by: Megadon Originally by: Vireti Originally by: Reem Fairchild Originally by: Megadon 2. other missile types? what are you smoking? My heavy missiles can fly 85 km. HAMS are a minority. A specialized exception, not the rule when it comes to range. Heavy missiles are longrange weapons. Sshhh he's already confused. You're making it worse Hey, if you think caldari are the shortrange fighting race man, there's nothing much I have to say to you anyways. What a bunch of smacktards. No, they're not, but each and every race got two fields. Short range and long range. Caldari hybrids will always outrange Gallente Hybrids. And the missiles are no exception, have a look at all other races short range weapons, and see how many of those that reach 30-40km out? This is the short range alternative of a long range specialized faction. You win the forum ***** award and the trolling award. A very nice doubleheader! --------------
Megadon Caldari Deathshead Inc.	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:47:00 - [17] Originally by: o0TuNa0o I can see it from both sides. But.. If you do missions, switch to cruise. They are meant to be the far reaching ammo. If you PvP, the raven sucked. Now it's decent. So pls stop moaning. Mission runners can still do what they do, the rest of us meanwhile now have a ship which (hopefully) can hold up in PvP. Much needed change. I wasn't moaing as I specifically stated in my post but people can't read these days. I didn't realize it was such a freaking sensitive issue. Ironically, I use cruises most of the time. --------------
NoNah Unseen University	Posted - 2007.10.18 16:54:00 - [18] Originally by: Megadon I wasn't moaing as I specifically stated in my post but people can't read these days. I didn't realize it was such a freaking sensitive issue. Ironically, I use cruises most of the time. It's not touchy, quite the contrary, it's been done over and over again. If you look at the first page any time of the day since the change struck sisi, there's been several threads about it. And theres even a few monster 10+ page threads roaming about. Speaking of irony and not reading ey? About trolling, I suggest you have a look at your own threads mate, I'm not the one flaming any "smacktards". Oh, and I guess you're leaving topic? If the changes doesn't make the seperation of guided and unguided missiles more logical, please illustrate it to the rest of us. Or atleast tell me where I went wrong in what I said? Postcount: 289849 [02:40:22] <elmickers> if you're caldari in a fleet fight, bring a corp
Cadoes	Posted - 2007.10.18 17:02:00 - [19] points at javelin torps
Riho Magnificent Beavers Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2007.10.18 17:04:00 - [20] Originally by: Megadon So why are we nerfing torps again? Not so much interested in argueing against it, as I'm interested in discovering the logic behind it as CCP sees it. One of the roles I see disappearing from Caldari due to this is the role of the long range damage dealer to POS stuff and capital ships. Caldari are pretty much specialized for longer range combat so this seems a significant departure from past. I think the change is more of a range thing than a damage thing because tech 2 torp launchers with faction torps and some nice BCS's deal a boatload of damage. So it's not as if torps needed more buffing in the damage department. ... and lastly, is this because of the Electronic Arts influence we've been seeing at CCP? so a buff is a nerf now ?? lmao.. i have been waiting for this kind of boost for torps for a while now... torps are close range weapons and they are getting a dmg boost and allso a range nerf to balance it carebear scum has to adapt (for once) and use cruise
Amuko Amarr Happy Little Roid Huggers	Posted - 2007.10.18 17:11:00 - [21] When do you people finally understand that torps are suposed to be the shortrange weapon platform for Caldari? And tbh, 30km is still a ******* lot for a shortrange weapon system, and now it also does blaster like dps, this is no nerf, this is the best change for caldari pvpers in a while now. And before you say, what about people who pvp? Well, what about them? They can use cruise missiles instead, I can't do missions properly with blasters, why should you be able to choose between two types?
Ishina Fel Caldari Synergy. Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.10.18 17:12:00 - [22] I don't see anything wrong with changing torpedos, even after reading every single post by Megadon... Buff room for large link addresses in sigs plz :(
Greenbolt Minmatar Universal Exports	Posted - 2007.10.18 17:13:00 - [23] What we have here as always are 2 camps: The PVPers are drooling over the close range torpedo gankage. (I may use a phoon in PVP now stead of my autopest) The PVEers are whining about losing there long range I win torpedos for missions. (I use my phoon in PVE but ive been using cruise lately and Ill accept the slower PVE mission running for the PVP phoon) In general you cant please everyone... Some see it as a boost. some a nerf. Either way..we adapt and move on. Personally Ill take the mission nerf and love my new close range gank phoon. (Bout time my missile skills come in useful in pvp). --------------------------------------------------- Scordite -Who was it that said that flying minmatar is kinda like going down a flight of stairs on an office chair while firing an uzi?
Sevis	Posted - 2007.10.18 18:15:00 - [24] Torpedos get exactly the buff that pulse lasers need; Caldari pilots complain. More, as it develops. Stay tuned.
Dilsnik Celestial Horizon Corp.	Posted - 2007.10.18 18:15:00 - [25] Easy solution to save mission runners and please pvp types: increase damage to cruise missiles a bit. Problem solved.
Amuko Amarr Happy Little Roid Huggers	Posted - 2007.10.18 18:19:00 - [26] Originally by: Dilsnik Easy solution to save mission runners and please pvp types: increase damage to cruise missiles a bit. Problem solved. Because Caldari as it is with cruise missiles isn't already the best race to pve with right? Let us make that difference even bigger.
Byzan Zwyth Dark Centuri Inc. Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.10.18 18:43:00 - [27] small nerf to PvE in exchange for a PvP buff caldari have been crying for? Sounds like a good deal. Plus the PvE nerf cant be too bad the Raven is still the best PvE ship there is. I see this as a very good boost. God imagine if a change made the raven of par with everyone else for PvE? ---------------------- Rank: Tech 1 and a 1/2 cannon fodder Pointless forum slowing bandwidth hogging signature pic inc?
Liang Nuren The Avalon Foundation Knights Of Syndicate	Posted - 2007.10.18 19:00:00 - [28] TBH, if I cared to I could probably find 200 entirely different people using the search feature that had a quote very similar to the following: "I don't care if you give NPC's 100% resist to missiles, just boost Caldari PVP" Liang -- Retired forum *****. Plz tell me to STFU. Yarr?
Shereza	Posted - 2007.10.18 19:20:00 - [29] Personally, I don't see what the big problem is. Of course I don't use torpedos either, though I might after the change. Of course what I get a kick out of is how with guns long-range turrets have higher grid costs than short-range turrets while with missiles it's the other way around excepting for rockets in comparison to standard launchers. 425mm rail grid > neutron blaster tachyon laser > mega pulse 1400mm artillery > 800mm repeating artillery sige > cruise HAM > heavy assault > rocket < standard Interesting to note that really.
FT Diomedes Gallente Ductus Exemplo	Posted - 2007.10.18 19:32:00 - [30] This is probably wasted on the OP, and lots of other people who cannot adapt to any change, but this change makes perfect sense. Torps are the short, ranged, high-damage weapon system. The insane range they had before made no sense at all. I have three accounts - one Gallente, one Minmatar and one Caldari. Each of these races has a long range weapon system and a short range weapon system. I don't complain that my blasters or autocannons are hard to use in missions or fleet battles - I simply fit railguns and artillery - or I fit an afterburner to close range quickly. It's a simple change. I don't expect to simply copy down one setup and use it for every situation. I was having a hard time deciding between torps and cruise for PvE with my Caldari character's CNR. Now the decision is the same as deciding between blasters and rails for my Navy Mega. Oh, and I get to enjoy massive close range damage from my Typhoon... All in all, this is a much-needed adjustment to the game. ------------ Improvize. Adapt. Overcome.

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